Nocticula's already got the beginnings of a writeup, along with most of Golarion's other demon lords, in Pathfinder #18.The book will also talk a bit about Lamashtu's beastmen, but I'm not sure yet if they'll get stats or some other rules mechanic like a simple template.
That sounds good to me. The alternative I came up with for now is to use the Bipedal Creature template from the Advanced Bestiary with the animals in the Pathfinder Bestiary. Therefore, I am also looking forward to the animal statistics in the Pathfinder Bestiary II - especially the goat.
Since our campaign recently shifted to a more necromantic/undead theme and priests of Nerull are having a big impact in the game, I would definitely like to see how Demodands are handled, since they're the servants of the god of Death (and winter, and darkness etc.).
Besides, a single Kelubar was quite a nasty encounter for a 10th level party last week, I used the ToH version with some small tweaking for system conversion.
The book will also talk a bit about Lamashtu's beastmen, but I'm not sure yet if they'll get stats or some other rules mechanic like a simple template.
Lamashtu's basement sounds like it might even be a worse place than the regular Abyss. We talking Darkbad levels of bad, or even worse like Scarytown bad?
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The book will also talk a bit about Lamashtu's beastmen, but I'm not sure yet if they'll get stats or some other rules mechanic like a simple template.Lamashtu's basement sounds like it might even be a worse place than the regular Abyss. We talking Darkbad levels of bad, or even worse like Scarytown bad?
Asgetrion bad. My infamous naked beard dance makes even Pit Fiends shiver.
+1
Oni (evil spirits bound into the flesh of a humanoid form)
PLEASE make a book on Oni in the near future
The big question is...will there be a Volume 3?
I'm kind of skeptical there will be a volume 3. Daemon (Yugoloth) have never been particularly interested in the affairs of mortals, at least in former editions. Since yugoloth aren't formed from the souls of mortals, they have no reason to corrupt them to bolster their numbers.
Creative Director
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The big question is...will there be a Volume 3?I'm kind of skeptical there will be a volume 3. Daemon (Yugoloth) have never been particularly interested in the affairs of mortals, at least in former editions. Since yugoloth aren't formed from the souls of mortals, they have no reason to corrupt them to bolster their numbers.
In Golarion, daemons are VERY interested in mortals. Because they eat mortal souls. That's their food.
And because daemons form from the interactions of evil souls that suffered particularly horrible and grisly deaths and then went on to Abaddon... there's no shortage of them.
I would LOVE to do more books in this line, in other words. Daemons are a very logical next choice, but beyond that I could see doing an oni book, a rakshasa book, a qlippoth book, an asura book, a div book, etc.
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Qlippoth book /drool.
And what James says, the Golarion Yugo...daemons are very different from the "mercenaries without a clue" D&D vibe. Pathfinder daemons just want to eat your soul. Nothing personal, no strings attached, no obtuse philosophical ramblings on nature of evil. Just nom nom nom yum yum. Next.
The big question is...will there be a Volume 3?I'm kind of skeptical there will be a volume 3. Daemon (Yugoloth) have never been particularly interested in the affairs of mortals, at least in former editions. Since yugoloth aren't formed from the souls of mortals, they have no reason to corrupt them to bolster their numbers.
As much as I adore yugoloths and 'loth politics, I tried to define Golarion's daemons in such a way that they have a reason to pay attention to mortals. As James said, they eat mortal souls. They require mortal souls to create more of themselves. Some of them actively enjoy the act and elevate it to religious ritual or high secular feast.
Some of them -hate- mortals for any number of reasons either innate or constructed by daemonic society. All sorts of things to explore. :)
And if you happen to enjoy old-school yugoloths, especially the upper caste arcanaloths who tended to be the public face of their kind and thus always had a hand dipped into mortal society on the planes, or some of the baernaloths whose particularly twisted madness had them interacting with lesser beings at times - well, I paid a little homage to that as well elsewhere. You'll find some of the same atmosphere and vibe from Tegresin the Laughing Fiend. What type of fiend he happens to be isn't stated (I do so love open questions), he has a mercurial attitude waxing and waning between boredom and amusement, but there's always an undercurrent of absolute malice there even if you don't fall afoul of it yourself. He doesn't fit the devil/demon/daemon dynamic easily, and at least in my home games, I'd go old-school late-2e 'loth with him (at least in terms of attitude and atmosphere).
Tegresin appear in TGB and also appears in CTR.
Qlippoth book /drool.
are very different from the "mercenaries without a clue" D&D vibe.
I'll drool to that one too!
And as for the 'mercenaries without a clue' that was sadly the fault of how WotC tended to treat them in 3e. It was utterly rare when they would touch upon their 2e era history and details, and unless someone knew where to look they were only presented with that version which was unfortunate.
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I would LOVE to do more books in this line, in other words. Daemons are a very logical next choice, but beyond that I could see doing an oni book, a rakshasa book, a qlippoth book, an asura book, a div book, etc.
I would *very much* like to see an angel book, an archon book, an agathion book, and an azata book, too.
I would *very much* like to see an angel book, an archon book, an agathion book, and an azata book, too.
I would LOVE to do more books in this line, in other words. Daemons are a very logical next choice, but beyond that I could see doing an oni book, a rakshasa book, a qlippoth book, an asura book, a div book, etc.
Yes, please. Though I'm not sure how the market would bear individual books for all the celestial races. As much as I would love to see that, it might make sense to combine some of those together.
A qlippoth book would be beyond cool. But 1st things first. Volume 2, and then Volume 3 on the Daemons.
I want to write a celestial book. ;)
*orbital mind-control lasers*
I want to write a celestial book. ;)
*orbital mind-control lasers*
Sorry, dude, I call Paizo-dibs on that, seeing as I wrote a 3E book about that already. ;)
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Creative Director
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Quick questions for James Jacobs: Which demon lord is best compatible, in your opinion, with the old D&D Fraz-Urb'lu? If there is any one that can be so considered, is that character in this book?
Well... Fraz-Urb'luu is actaully open content, thanks to the fact that he's in the Tome of Horrors. We actually decided to not include him among Golarion's demon lords because he's SO associated with the world of Greyhawk, though; he was made up entirely for that world (he wasn't really based on a real-world myth), and he's so tied into Greyhawk lore that having him also be tied up in Golarion lore diminishes him. So we left him alone. You don't have to though, of course!
That said, if you're looking for a demon lord that matches Fraz-Urb'luu's niche as a demon lord of deception and wrath, your best bet is probably Mestama (who's the demon lord of hags, deception, and cruelty). If you're more interested in Fraz-Urb'luu's role as a demon lord of wrath, a better bet would probably be Orcus, or maybe Kostchtchie.
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Well... Fraz-Urb'luu is actaully open content, thanks to the fact that he's in the Tome of Horrors. We actually decided to not include him among Golarion's demon lords because he's SO associated with the world of Greyhawk, though; he was made up entirely for that world (he wasn't really based on a real-world myth), and he's so tied into Greyhawk lore that having him also be tied up in Golarion lore diminishes him. So we left him alone. You don't have to though, of course!
That said, if you're looking for a demon lord that matches Fraz-Urb'luu's niche as a demon lord of deception and wrath, your best bet is probably Mestama (who's the demon lord of hags, deception, and cruelty). If you're more interested in Fraz-Urb'luu's role as a demon lord of wrath, a better bet would probably be Orcus, or maybe Kostchtchie.
Thanks for the response James. I may just use old Fraz - I always did like him. However, Mestama sounds...interesting. Pray tell, will there be more info on her in the forthcoming Lords of Chaos?
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I want to write a celestial book. ;)
*orbital mind-control lasers*Sorry, dude, I call Paizo-dibs on that, seeing as I wrote a 3E book about that already. ;)
Girls, girls, you're both pretty! There's enough celestial goodness for everyone. Azatas and Angels and Agathions and Archons!
Oh my.
I want to write a celestial book. ;)
*orbital mind-control lasers*Sorry, dude, I call Paizo-dibs on that, seeing as I wrote a 3E book about that already. ;)
I did not know about that book. So I just bought it from Noble Knight. I can't wait to read it!
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Creative Director
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Thanks for the response James. I may just use old Fraz - I always did like him. However, Mestama sounds...interesting. Pray tell, will there be more info on her in the forthcoming Lords of Chaos?Well... Fraz-Urb'luu is actaully open content, thanks to the fact that he's in the Tome of Horrors. We actually decided to not include him among Golarion's demon lords because he's SO associated with the world of Greyhawk, though; he was made up entirely for that world (he wasn't really based on a real-world myth), and he's so tied into Greyhawk lore that having him also be tied up in Golarion lore diminishes him. So we left him alone. You don't have to though, of course!
That said, if you're looking for a demon lord that matches Fraz-Urb'luu's niche as a demon lord of deception and wrath, your best bet is probably Mestama (who's the demon lord of hags, deception, and cruelty). If you're more interested in Fraz-Urb'luu's role as a demon lord of wrath, a better bet would probably be Orcus, or maybe Kostchtchie.
Yes. All of the demon lords get at least a half page of information, with some getting a little bit more. Pathfinder #18 has an article about the demon lords of Golarion as well; this article's actually a great 10-page preview of the 64-page book.
I did not know about that book. So I just bought it from Noble Knight. I can't wait to read it!I want to write a celestial book. ;)
*orbital mind-control lasers*Sorry, dude, I call Paizo-dibs on that, seeing as I wrote a 3E book about that already. ;)
I refused to buy it because it didn't have a Sean K. Reynolds cover, despite having his name on it.
:D
;)
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I did not know about that book. So I just bought it from Noble Knight. I can't wait to read it!I want to write a celestial book. ;)
*orbital mind-control lasers*Sorry, dude, I call Paizo-dibs on that, seeing as I wrote a 3E book about that already. ;)
I for one could wait longer. A lot longer.
Honestly, if Anger of Angels is the prototype of what the Paizo celestials book is going to be like, then to be completely honest I may drop my subscription for that month. When I think a rival to the Solar, I want a high CR (17+) base monster stat block, not a CR 4 creature suitable for low-level PCs that then has 25 class levels added onto it. (It's got the same problem as Monster Manual IV.)
I'd much rather see Todd do it, in short. Keep Sean doing what he does best, ie, articles on the various gods.
Edit: Or working on the 256 page hardback compilation of all the articles from the APs on the gods. 6 pages per article, 20 main gods, maybe 12-24 pages on the lesser deities, then a 2-page monster entry for each herald, that's 184 pages right there. I'm sure you can come up with another 72 pages worth of material to pad it out.
I did not know about that book. So I just bought it from Noble Knight. I can't wait to read it!I want to write a celestial book. ;)
*orbital mind-control lasers*Sorry, dude, I call Paizo-dibs on that, seeing as I wrote a 3E book about that already. ;)
I for one could wait longer. A lot longer.
Honestly, if Anger of Angels is the prototype of what the Paizo celestials book is going to be like, then to be completely honest I may drop my subscription for that month.
So it's pretty bad huh? I didn't look up reviews before buying it. I was just surprised that there was an actual book about angels. Usually it's all demons and devils books only.
So when I read that Sean had written one, I jumped on the chance to read it. Well mechanic concerns aside, I'm more interested in the fluff.
So it's pretty bad huh? I didn't look up reviews before buying it. I was just surprised that there was an actual book about angels. Usually it's all demons and devils books only.
So when I read that Sean had written one, I jumped on the chance to read it. Well mechanic concerns aside, I'm more interested in the fluff.
I would not call it bad. It just has a different take on celestials (angels). The angels in the book are lower HD than typical for a celestial, but that is because each celestial is considered an individual and typically had class levels to match his role. There are even a few angelic prestige classes. In all, the book is meant to mimic a more biblical take on angels. For example, The Archangel Michael is a LG Malakite Paladin 15/Fighter 15/Angle of Death 5 (which would make im a CR 35). Gabriel is a LG Ophanite Ranger 10/Cleric 13/Angel of Death 5 (CR 30)
All-in-all, it offers a different take on celestials and some cool templates (such as the fallen angel), angelic feats, and lower level angels that can be adapted for for lower level summoned monsters.
Honestly, if Anger of Angels is the prototype of what the Paizo celestials book is going to be like
I assure you, it wouldn't be. AOA was intended as a way to have angel PCs, not a treatise on the standard RPG-fantasy celestials.
I want to write a celestial book. ;)
*orbital mind-control lasers*Sorry, dude, I call Paizo-dibs on that, seeing as I wrote a 3E book about that already. ;)
First you draw keketar graffiti all over my arm at GenCon and now you shatter my dreams. *despair*
... ;)
Next you'll tell me that my forthcoming pitch of "Tegresin the Laughing Fiend's Bedtime Stories For Mortals" to you guys at GenCon this year won't fly either because it's too small a target audience demographic or something, or because it's planned at 526,000 words. *double plus despair*
Why do you hate me so?! *wail*
The big question is...will there be a Volume 3?
By Volume 3 would you be anticipating then a book covering the Neutral Evil Daemons?
If so, I second that notion. Daemons have always been my favorite of the three.
But after you cover demons, devils, and daemons, who's left?
Plenty!
Asuras (evil outsiders that rise from the mistakes of the gods)
Daemons (physical manifestations of death)
Demodands (perhaps the mercenaries of chaos and evil or something like that)
Demons (the result of sinful mortal souls exposed to the raw nature of the Abyss)
Devils (fallen angels and heretics of faith)
Divs (corrupted genies)
Kytons (shadow-plane dwelling masochists who have been infused with some strange outer evil)
Oni (evil spirits bound into the flesh of a humanoid form)
Qlippoth (the original evil outsider race, perhaps the first source of evil)
Rakshasas (fiends who have abandoned links to the gods and the outer planes in order to try to rule the Material Plane)
Now, there'll certainly be some crossover here and there (expect to see a fair amount of talk about qlippoth and maybe a little about demodands in Lords of Chaos), but I could certainly see a book about all ten of these fiend races eventually!
I certainly hope we get to see them. They all sound like great ideas. And I'm guessing that we'll get some stats on races like the daemons, demodands, divs, oni, and qlippoth in the next Bestiary?
BTW, will arcanaloths like Shemeska ever show up in Golarion, or are they unavailable?
I want to write a celestial book. ;)
*orbital mind-control lasers*
If you include the "furry angels"* from the NG outer planes that showed up in 3/3.5, I would so buy it.
* -- Sorry but I'm blanking on their proper name.
Yes. All of the demon lords get at least a half page of information, with some getting a little bit more. Pathfinder #18 has an article about the demon lords of Golarion as well; this article's actually a great 10-page preview of the 64-page book.
This book sounds pretty awesome!
By the way, I noticed that Demogorgon is nowhere to be found in that article's write-up of demon lords.. Is he closed content?
I assure you, it wouldn't be. AOA was intended as a way to have angel PCs, not a treatise on the standard RPG-fantasy celestials.
For what its worth, I really liked the whole book, and I thought it was pretty clear that one of its stated goals was to provide some celestials that were more suitable for PCs than the existing, very powerful ones already detailed.
However, beyond the new, low CR celestials, there was a ton of interesting information on how celestials interact, feats for outsiders, politics between outsiders, ways to use celestials in campaigns other than just a god's go to guy in the outer planes.
Honestly, it was more than worth the price for me.
If you include the "furry angels"* from the NG outer planes that showed up in 3/3.5, I would so buy it.
* -- Sorry but I'm blanking on their proper name.
Gaurdinals, but Paizo couldn't use that name. Kind of like Inevitables, though, I think there were already some NG "animal" celestials in existence before a grouping that they were all collected under was finally created.
BTW, will arcanaloths like Shemeska ever show up in Golarion, or are they unavailable?
Arcanaloths are so very not open content. :)
I could see other outsiders filling the thematic niche however (maybe Abraxus's servitors, and Trelmarixian's servitors certainly - though they have some major differences compared to 'loths-)
Gaurdinals, but Paizo couldn't use that name. Kind of like Inevitables, though, I think there were already some NG "animal" celestials in existence before a grouping that they were all collected under was finally created.
If you include the "furry angels"* from the NG outer planes that showed up in 3/3.5, I would so buy it.
* -- Sorry but I'm blanking on their proper name.
Paizo calls them Agathions. I'm betting there will be more of them in Bestiary II (the Vulpinal is already in The Great Beyond).
BTW, will arcanaloths like Shemeska ever show up in Golarion, or are they unavailable?Arcanaloths are so very not open content. :)
I could see other outsiders filling the thematic niche however (maybe Abraxus's servitors, and Trelmarixian's servitors certainly - though they have some major differences compared to 'loths-)
Rats! I like the arcanaloths. Though I wonder, why exactly are they not open content? Didn't WoTC drop them from existence in 4th ed?
Gaurdinals, but Paizo couldn't use that name. Kind of like Inevitables, though, I think there were already some NG "animal" celestials in existence before a grouping that they were all collected under was finally created.
If you include the "furry angels"* from the NG outer planes that showed up in 3/3.5, I would so buy it.
* -- Sorry but I'm blanking on their proper name.
Paizo calls them Agathions. I'm betting there will be more of them in Bestiary II (the Vulpinal is already in The Great Beyond).
Thanks for the help and for the reminder about TGB. I still have to nail a copy.
Rats! I like the arcanaloths. Though I wonder, why exactly are they not open content? Didn't WoTC drop them from existence in 4th ed?BTW, will arcanaloths like Shemeska ever show up in Golarion, or are they unavailable?Arcanaloths are so very not open content. :)
I could see other outsiders filling the thematic niche however (maybe Abraxus's servitors, and Trelmarixian's servitors certainly - though they have some major differences compared to 'loths-)
Nah, they did the yugoloths even worse. They delegated them to being "demons". The huge retconned "demons are super evil elementals" in 4E has snagged yugoloths in as well, calling them "the more devil-like of the demons". Since, they got rid of the NE alignment. And their home plane. And practically every other piece of lore built up over 30 years in D&D mythology. They're not even called yugoloths anymore, I think, I think any demon with the suffix 'loth is now a devil-like demon.
Yes, sad. I know.
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Rats! I like the arcanaloths. Though I wonder, why exactly are they not open content? Didn't WoTC drop them from existence in 4th ed?
It doesn't really matter if Wizards of the Coast actually use a certain D&Dism. It's still owned by Wizards of the Coast. It's the same as mind flayers and beholders. They just didn't make it open content and as such, Paizo can't touch it.
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Creative Director
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A question for Mr. Jacobs: Will the demon lords have new demons types that serve them exclusively? I remember the old Demonomicon articles had that.
Nope. They'll have lots of demons that PREFER to serve them, but we aren't going to have any races that serve specific single demon lords exclusively. And even the Demonomicon articles didn't REALLY do that—they had demons that were very closely associated with specific lords, but you could certainly have an incubus working for someone other than Malcanthet, for example.
Same for this book. The shemazian demons and the xacabras don't solely work for Lamashtu and Abraxas.
Qlippoth (the original evil outsider race, perhaps the first source of evil)
So...qlippoths are the new baernoloths? I'm in! Go Todd go! What about draedens (or something like them)?
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Creative Director
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So...qlippoths are the new baernoloths? I'm in! Go Todd go! What about draedens (or something like them)?
Qlippoth (the original evil outsider race, perhaps the first source of evil)
I'm actually more or less the current qlippoth wrangler—we've got Todd more or less aimed at the daemons and proteans, really. ;-P
Draedens are closed content, so we won't be having any of them.
But if you're looking for impossibly huge monsters... Lords of Chaos might scratch that itch in the pages where it talks about how the Abyss is, after a fashion, alive...
Lords of Chaos might scratch that itch in the pages where it talks about how the Abyss is, after a fashion, alive...
So THAT's how it manages to stare into me so intensely.