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voska66's page

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Roleplaying Game Subscriber. 2,701 posts. No reviews. No lists. 1 wishlist.


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Arachnofiend wrote:
Invulnerable Rager is popular because you're getting a strong defensive bonus basically for free. Uncanny Dodge is a really pointless ability for most barbarians; your dexterity is going to be low so the difference between flat-footed and not flat-footed is negligible. The only category of Barbarian that falls under "can, but maybe won't" for IR is the Urban Barbarian because that's the only time your dex will be high enough to get value out of Uncanny Dodge.

The value of uncanny dodge is getting improved uncanny dodge at level 5, then those pesky sneak attacks stop working unless the bad guy is 4 levels higher than you which rarely if ever happens. Basic uncanny dodge is largely useless though.


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swoosh wrote:
Quote:


The feat to allow Bravery to apply to most Will saves has the same issue- you're charging the Fighter feats to actually get a "real" class feature equivalent to what everyone else got for free

Well, worse than that really. They're not just feats, they're limited access, heavily level gated feats.

You can almost get a good will save, but not until 5 and if you do get it at 5 you delay your extra skills or other bonuses until 9 or 10 or 13.

Which in a way is almost even worse, because instead of just fixing the problems with the fighter, the game makes you choose which problem you want to fix.

Why do you have to wait till 5th level. You can get the feat at 2nd level unless there is some important feat your fighter needs at 2nd I don't see reason to wait till 5th.

You are right though about having to burn feat for this, it should be class feature. I'd go further allowing the fighter to choose a bonus to reflex or will save instead of bravery. I'd give the fighter 4 skill points. I'd change how weapon focus feats work. Allowing them to scale by fighter level at level 4 and ever 4 after the fighter's weapon focus feat applies to another weapon. This would apply to specialization, greater weapon focus and great weapon specialization.


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Blackwaltzomega wrote:
Joey Cote wrote:

Play a fighter with a higher intel instead of huge strength. Now you have the skill points to do other things. Take the plus to skill point instead of whateverelse for favorite class. Use your regular feats to buy feats not associated with combat.

It perfectly possible to build a fighter that can do things other then combat, it just means you cannot also optimize them for combat. And so many people optimize for combat, because it tends to happen more then other actions, generally.

It would be nice if fighters could take a list of feats that bonused some skills instead of pure fighting feats as the extra fighter feats, but its not that big a deal.

Clerics, on the other hand, get completely shafted when it comes to skills and doing anything other then casting or bashing.

Fighter: Has a terrible skill list and 2+int skills. STR, CON, WIS and DEX are key abilities for the fighter, in roughly that order. Point buy is thin, and this class's purpose is to be strong, quick, and tough but not easy to mentally dominate. INT is a luxury, CHA doubly so.

People on the Forums: Why are you dumping INT and CHA? Just get worse at the thing you picked this class to be good at so you can get a few more skill ranks.

Wizard: 2+int skills, but its skill list is focused heavily around the class being staggeringly intelligent. Its class features key off intelligence. No level of intelligence is too intelligent for a wizard, and the more that stat gets pumped the more skillful and magical the wizard retroactively becomes. DEX and CON have some importance to keep the class moving about and upright, but STR, WIS, and CHA can be safely ignored or dumped at the wizard's leisure; wisdom has little part in their game plan, strength is easily compensated for with magic, and charisma can be neatly bypassed by the unscrupulous with mind control or by the crafty using one of the many, many options that allow the wizard to port charisma-based skills to their intelligence score.

"Well, you...

The fighter is STR, DEX, WIS, CON in my opinion. The fighter is about tanking. High AC requires a high dex, armor training make you dex count in Full Plate. You need strength for damage output.

The Weapon and Armor Mastery guides solve the skill problem. You can use BAB as you skill rank on many skills. You can turn bravery into bonus on most all will saves with feat.


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taks wrote:
voska66 wrote:
They still have Magus Arcana as well. I don't see anything in the text saying HexArcana replace Magus Arcana.
It doesn't have to replace magus arcana, merely adding to it counts per this part: adding an additional bonus feat to the list of bonus feats you can select. Adding a hex arcana to your list is equivalent to adding a feat to your bonus feat list in terms of "altering." I got tripped up on this at first, too.

But it doesn't add to magus arcana. Hex Arcana allows you to select Hex when you get a magus arcana.


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Imbicatus wrote:
taks wrote:
Gisher wrote:
Bladebound replaces the third level Magus Arcana, and Hexcrafter alters the entire Magus Arcana ability by adding Accursed Strike to the list. I don't know if that matters to your GM, of course.

I don't think it's fair to say that adding a hex to the list "alters the way the parent class feature works" (quoted from the PRD). Even allowing hexes in place of arcana doesn't really change "how it works," though I agree, the whole thing is pushing the boundary. Strangely, I haven't seen this discussed much.

Either way, I'm in the DEX camp, and not surprisingly, I prefer the bladebound hexcrafter, too. My magus did not take many hexes, but flight is indispensable. I did the standard dervish dancer build and had a lot of fun with it. So much so my current investigator is DEX to damage, too (with fencing grace, however).

EDIT: formatting fixed.

Fair or not, per the FAQ it's not legal.

FAQ wrote:
However, if something alters the way the parent class feature works, such as a mime archetype that makes all bardic performances completely silent, with only visual components instead of auditory, you can’t take that archetype with an archetype that alters or replaces any of the sub-features. This even applies for something as small as adding 1 extra round of bardic performance each day, adding an additional bonus feat to the list of bonus feats you can select, or adding an additional class skill to the class.

That's correct only I don't see it applying to the Hexcrafter. The Hexcrafter gain a class feature HexArcana. They still have Magus Arcana as well. I don't see anything in the text saying HexArcana replace Magus Arcana.


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depends on the situation.

For example, party see a brown bear and walk around it. No exp for that. But say the party spot a marauding band of ogres. They are wounded and don't think they can take the fight so choose to hide. The ogres come looking around. A clear risk is present, the stealth rolls are high enough and the ogres leave. Then XP would be granted. It's that risk that must exist for XP to be granted, if there is no risk such as a party of stealth masters, no XP for hiding from encounters that could never find them in first place.

I also don't give XP for encounter that can not harm the PCs. So no XP for killing 1/2 CR commoners when you are 12th level.


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I'd consider TWF if the game was mythic. You get the stat boost to pull it off and mythic abilities to make it worth while.


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Porridge wrote:
(P.s.: Shouldn't this be in the "Rules Questions" section? I think I'll suggest that this be moved there, so that it'll catch the attention of the those best positioned to answer these kinds of questions.)

Why? The rules aren't in question. This thread is to discuss the feat and how it's ability to block a T-Rex (monster with a single attack) is the same problem people had with crane wing.

Personally I think using tower shield to block a T-Rex makes more sense than naked monk slapping the teeth away.


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The Barbarian was simple to use. Not as simple as fighter but a thousand times more simple than full caster.

I'd say the Barbarian was the weakest class after the monk and rogue. As more books came out and with some system master you could optimize a powerful barbarian. This created a small handful of complex barbarian builds while all other builds were weak and ineffective

Now with the Uchained barbarian I can't make those super optimized builds but all other builds now work well. You are almost as good a fighter now with Barbarian. I say that counting the Weapon Master and Armor Master books along with the goodies from Ultimate intrigue.


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The only downside is the prices for Staves is ridiculously high. Like so high you'd never buy one and if you find one you'll want to sell it. Only time I've seen staves in use is when the party can't find a settlement that pay the full price.


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This authority is something comes from role playing. You can start off with a good background story for a character and role play the connections. Then you can use that authority or earn it and have it given to you.


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You should ask you GM to implement influence from the Ultimate intrigue book. Then the party gets involved with the NPC interaction. You're face skills will be awesome and the knowledgeable character just as awesome. You'll both work together that way.

That's one of things I really liked about Ultimate Intrigue. It allow the party to be a part of social interactions. It's no longer just one die roll for the party face but the party face gets to really shine in spots.

It's bit of work for the GM at first as you figure it out but it works great with Adventure paths. You have the NPC detailed out with skills and stats in most cases. So it's trivial to select skills they can be influenced with.

I'm trying now to figure a way to stream line the process as GM for prep time and for times when players just take the game a direction I didn't expect.


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Brf wrote:
Gilfalas wrote:
Brf wrote:
ckdragons wrote:

Every city has a Max Spell Level description, so a small town like Ravengro has a max spell level of 4th (no one in town sells spellcasting or scrolls with spells above 4th level), or a large city as Caliphas has max spell level of 7th.

Settlements

That limit is for buying spells from spellcasters, not for scrolls.

Scrolls should be limited only by the price of the scroll itself.

Read what you just quoted. It specifically says scrolls as well.

Nope. If you follow the link, it says:

Quote:
Spellcasting Unlike magic items, spellcasting for hire is listed separately from the town's base value, since spellcasting is limited by the level of the available spellcasters in town. This line lists the highest-level spell available for purchase from spellcasters in town. A town's base spellcasting level depends on its type.
It says the limit is for spellcasting, not for scrolls.

That is correct, scrolls are determined by magic items. A 1D6 magic item could scrolls. As well is 75% chance that scroll you are looking for may be available if the price is under the Base Value of the settlement.


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They have rules for spells, getting new spells has cost but not an expensive cost. It requires a couple spell craft skill checks as well as hour per spell level.

So one 1st level spell would take 1 hour, cost 15 GP, and require DC 21 Spell Craft to read the spell and DC 16 to write the spell in your spell book. That spell will use up 1 page, a spell book as 100 pages. The cost is 10 GP to write and 5 GP get it from another wizard. A rare spell can be 2 or 3 times that price or more.

So as GM you can control. Buying scrolls is expensive and risky as you might fail the check and not get the spell. Either way the scroll is used up. You can use other wizards as plot devices to get access to their spells. Allow the capturing of enemy spell books. That's part of the fun in playing wizard or magus in my opinion.

For spell availability that's up to you based on guidelines in the Game Mastery Guide under settlements. You can use the Ultimate Equipment book to generate random scrolls.

So take a Hamlet of 25 people. It could have 1D6 minor items, mostly potions and scrolls on the minor magic treasure chart in the Core Rule Book at 68%. There might be 1 arcane caster with 2nd level spells who at best would indifferent to the PCs so Diplomacy or Intimate involved her. Maybe you could use Ultimate Intrigue here for more of social encounter.


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Fuzzy-Wuzzy wrote:
Only magical healing stops bleed. Fast healing is extraordinary (as are feats).

A DC 15 heal check also stops bleed and that's non magical.


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I don't see why this wouldn't work. It's just like swapping out Bard Performance with one archetype and adding 2 additional performances for the cost losing bardic knowledge and well versed. Seems to that would work. Still in the end it's really up to the GM to allow if you want to stack two archetypes that have grey areas like this.


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Aelryinth wrote:

The low level impact would be too huge.

The dif xp advances didn't really have that much impact at the low levels. It was when you got into Name level, and wizards took almost twice the xp to advance as Rogues did, that you started to see level difference.

I think I ran the math once, and a Fighter/20, Rogue/22, and Wizard/17 ended up around the same xp totals.

Slow vs fast is probably too big a gap. But medium vs Fast? Probably well doable. The problem is that they are still supposed to be 'equal', so what's the standard for gold and gear?

Just ugh. The system is too invested in levels now for calculating balance in the party. Your only alternative is to mess with the classes to restore equilibrium.

==Aelryinth

You could do effective level and actual level. Effective level for fighters is fast progression and actual level is medium. Wealth by level and APL is based actual level but effective level is what your class is based on. Going slow/medium or medium/slow the class that use the faster XP chart would be 1 level high at 5th level.

Also depending how the GM awards XP you could have those classes a level ahead sooner too. That's how we used to do it in 2E. Rogues were and cleric were shooting up in power fast at the low levels.


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Water walking and water breathing. Both spells are 3rd level spells and you can cast them as 5th level cleric. Ring of water walking, potions of water breathing. A necklace of adaptation. That's about it really. There are more option if it's not CRB only. CRB seem strange for S&S as the AP uses option from the Ultimate Combat book.


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I'd say there is not equivalent to degree for skill. A degree is collection of learned skills. You would have a degree in stealth but stealth could be part of degree in subterfuge which would include stealth, sleight of hand, bluff, knowledges, appraisal, intimidate, diplomacy.

I mean there that saying about getting degree in basket weaving but that's just expression. No one learns just math in getting a degree for example.


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Sundakan wrote:
Lemmy wrote:
Sundakan wrote:

Well, even at double digits your Fighter's Will is going to suck. +6 by level 20?

There are other ways to raise it, but +2 for a Feat is pretty solid.

More like +11. Cloaks are cheap. You can easily have a +5 CoR by 10th level. Not to mention bonuses from Wisdom, spells, traits, class features, racial traits and other save-boosting gear.

It's really, really easy to boost saving throws.

+11 is still pretty bad when at that level DC 27+ saves aren't uncommon.

Boostig saves is only easy if you take the options to boost saves. This is like saying a Cloak of Resistance isn't worthwhile because there are so many other ways to boost them.

I running a game right now for level characters. I haven't see a save DC above 20 yet on of the encounters I've put them against. Some of the save are as low a 12. So +11 is automatic for the low but then it should be for a CR 9 encounter especially if you invested in that save. A dragon has 24 reflex but I haven't sent them up against a dragon yet.


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Chess Pwn wrote:

One of the things here is Min/Max here is being misused by many people in this discussion.

Min/Max means get the Max benefit with the minimum investment, it's a way of thinking. Whatever rules you set, "nothing below 8 or above 16 after racials" you can still Min/Max. Like if I had a rule like that and wanted to Min/Max, I'd play a druid or summoner cause the Animal/Eidolon will have very comparable stats to everyone, so I really would be twice as strong as anyone else. Normally you'd need buffs and stuff and the Animal/Eidolon still fall behind other PC's, but if you nerf PC's then it's a lot of reward for very little investment.

And if you do Min/Maxing right you also optimize so you don't have glaring weaknesses, especially not more so than those who aren't. So "targeting their weakness" more really means "target everyone's weakness"

Also, limiting the floor a stat can be only lowers the point buy available to them. There's basically no difference between a 7 and a 12 charisma for someone that has a bard playing face. The real effect of a "nothing below 8 after racials" is probably a -1 to AC or Will saves or HP per level as those are the places that the extra points go. There's a reason a guide to a wizard says, "with a 15pt buy get an 18 int, with a 25pt buy get an 18 int." cause all the other stats are just nice to have after setting your main stat to the right place.

I see min maxing as maxing out one thing and living with the minimum in others. Like maxing out offense and not worrying about defense. It works most of the time and when it doesn't no remembers. When it comes to party imbalance as GM I see more with tactics.


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In a group 4 out 5 love role playing and a neutral to combat then having the min/max character who loves combat is a good thing. The min/max character will enjoy the combat and end the combat quicker allow those the love role playing to get more of what they want.

As well to deal with a person that min maxes you target the minimums. By targeting their minimums the rest of the party is unaffected as they are not min maxed. Don't do this all the time, let min/max character shine from time to time just don't let them all the time.

Now if you are talking optimized that's not min maxed. That's just best combination of abilities that give you a very strong balanced character. The people that don't optimize generally have more weakness and few strengths but they do have strength so play them up.

The rule bending and twisting interpretation, you need set it that your ruling are the rule. Write down you ruling so the play doesn't forget.


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I see this as good act not evil. The cleric in this case can only exert influence with in their sphere of influence. In this negotiation the character was able move the slaver to a different position. Not the ideal position but baby step in the right direction. Nothing evil about not being successful as you'd wish.


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This sounds like player who don't know what to name their character yet and therefore won't give a name they don't have. They don't want you giving them a name. Maybe they will figure out a name but I've seen a game where player never came up with name.


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What wishlist do you wish existed and why?


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TriOmegaZero wrote:
Cures are way better than channel because they get a flat bonus that is more likely to overcome the haunts HP total than a bunch of random d6 rolls. Overall, haunts are just s+@+ty mechanics, traps that rogues can't disable because f+#$ rogues.

I rarely see haunts in games. The odd time you do. I use them in my game as creepy factor not something to really hinder the party.


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I went through rise of the Rune Lords and we didn't have a cleric in the party. We did fine though. Sure there was few times when cleric would have been handy.

My character I took Oracle of Metal for 4 level to with Lame to get the immunity to fatigue. So I stocked up on wands of CLW, piles of potions and scrolls. We did pretty good. Definitely a challenge. No player character deaths but we were close many times. I think it made the game more fun.


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Being the GM is fun for me because I get to be creative when not gaming. As player my creativity ends with my Character. Once I have my character there is nothing but waiting for the next game session. As GM I can spend my time building the game. This may be enriching an Adventure Path, this most typical or building my own world and the adventures set in it.


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Gargs454 wrote:
randomwalker wrote:

Back in AD&D days, secondary skills were in addition to class skills.

With the transition to 3E, the vague profession (and craft) skills were included because not doing so would send the message that RP is less important than game mechanics.

Personally, i could easily houserule that certain background traits gave free profession skill points.

For one-shot intrigue campaigns, profession skills could also be used to find clues, infiltrate enemy cities etc. But that is extremely circumstantial.

Yeah, its kind of funny when you think about one of the bigger criticisms of 4ed was that there was no roleplaying in it (which I personally disagree with, but that's beside the point for this thread). One of the things people have pointed to in that argument is that the Rules don't do much to facilitate roleplaying. Personally, I don't think the rules in earlier editions did much of that either, unless you consider some of the broader skill choices that were there.

Back to the OP, personally I would disagree with the contention that Acrobatics, Climb and Geography can replace Profession Sailor. Sure, they can help you climb the rigging, keep from falling, and figure out just where in the sam heck you are, but they don't really teach you how to actually control the ship. Plus, you are still investing in three skills to replace one.

Skills don't add to role playing in my opinion. I'd say skills take role playing out of the game by allowing a dice roll. You can still role play and roll the skill but it's easier to roll the dice and beat the DC to say you intimate the person. No role playing required.


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MeanMutton wrote:
Neriathale wrote:

Survival skill, DC5 to butcher a dead animal

Survival skill DC10 to know that eating carnivores is generally not a good idea, and you are better off trapping a rabbit or two.

There's nothing inherently unhealthy about eating the meat of carnivores. Aligator, snake, dog, frogs, and other carnivores are eaten by humans safely. Omnivores like pigs and chickens are very common in American diet, too. Hunted bear isn't uncommon in areas of North America.

As long as you cook the meat well-done, there's no issue at all.

You don't need to cook to well done. You just need to cook to the right temperature which varies depending on the cut. So if unsure cook the crap out of it.


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Charon's Little Helper wrote:
justaworm wrote:

Try

1. Max HP on monsters
2. Adding extra monsters, no single monster encounters unless high above APL, or party is significantly out of resources
3. Ditching XP and leveling them as you feel appropriate
4. Challenging environment to encounters

These are just a few general ways to address this issue

While I agree that 2-4 can be useful, #1 is a bad idea. It only widens caster/martial issues, because it's martials who have to chew through HP, while casters generally use save vs suck/death which ignore HP.

If you really want to tweak the current monsters, you're better off adding the advanced template which also improves their saves by 2 each.

In all the game I play save vs suck/death rarely get used at higher levels. First lower level spells the save DC is too low so those don't get used. The higher level spells are much more limited resource. You might have 1 save or suck spell that works maybe 1 in 3 castings of it. I find higher level is better for battle field control, buff/debuff, utilities, and direct damage.

Max hit points on monster isn't a problem. It just burns through caster resource faster. More battle field control and between combat healing.


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Also if you play an elf or half you can take Sharp Sense for an additional +2 to perception on top of you Keen Senses.

Also you don't need to roll perception to see your target unless they are trying to hide or you are looking for fine detail on your target. Like for example you were trying to identify the target with bird shaped tattoo on their arm. You would need perception the check to identify that. You still see the target at 2400 range but unless you succeed in DC 120 check you won't know for sure but you could put an bullet in them regardless.

Just to point out at that range even the a person a -7 stealth in full plate can hide from you.


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Deadmanwalking wrote:
HWalsh wrote:
Actually they've walked back on the 15 point buy. They built them for 20.

I'm pretty sure they didn't, since the last time I saw them say it was 15 was pretty recent. Citation, please?

You might be confusing APs with PFS. PFS is built on the assumption of 20 point-buy. APs (and other modules) on the assumption of 15.

It's 20 PT according James Jacobs for NPC in Adventure paths. Maybe that's what people remember incorrectly? I think 15 pt buy is the default though James said he prefers 20 pt buy.

http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2nrby?Do-adventure-paths-assume-20-point-buy#1

What I see in this party is some really good synergies.

I've seen Bards and Paladins do really well together. And an Inquisitor who has really good self buffs that stack with smite and inspire courage. Haven't seen a war priest or investigator in play but they look to have some good self buffs too. This party looks very offense heavy.


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Paladins are LG. So that means they need to follow that law. They don't just kill any evil they find as that would be evil and in most case unlawful. If killing a witch is legal and that witch is doing evil then apprehending the witch first for trial would what the paladin does but killing witch in self defense is fine too.

It's like police officer with warrant kicking the door to crack house down. The shooting starts and bullets fly killing drug dealers or maiming them. That's expected so shoot to kill in that threat level. Paladin is no different storming he dragon's lair.


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I'm just basic NPC so I used the basic stat array.

13, 12, 11, 10, 9, and 8.

Str 9
Dex 11
Con 13
Int 12
Wis 10
Chr 8

My con is highest due to my fast healing. I recover from injury much faster than others. So much so my co-worker have started calling me Wolverine.

I put Chr lowest as I'm not Charismatic at all.


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If you want to challenge the player, Half-elf Barbarians and Blood Ragers. Toss a higher level Inquisitor bad guy into the mix with Stawart, then even negative effects from a save have no effect.


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Vaellen wrote:

I played a witch in Kingmaker and I felt your pain. I either shut the encounter down in a couple rounds or I stood around twiddling my thumbs since everything was immune to mind-affecting.

My advice is pick spells or use magic items to round out your hexes. In fights where my hexes didn't work well, I'd buff my party.

I found the witch a rather boring character to play because as you say you pretty much do the same thing every combat.

Also, if the DM is getting a 34 on a low roll he is screwing you over. I hope that's a boss encounter. Those saves are way too high otherwise, nobody is going to beat those very often unless you are mythic.

You don't need to be mythic. You just need to be a Barbarian. A 20th Barbarian could get 34 on a low roll easy. A 20th level Barbarian is CR19 so right in the top range for challenging fight for APL 16 party. The Barbarian might even last 2 rounds.


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I'd think the reason is due the lack of races with a bonus to Str in general. Not one core race has +2 strength with +2 and -2 to another stat. That's why any strength base character is human or half-elf in almost all cases.

So the question is no where are the Strength + Int but where is the Str in general. In the Advanced Race Guide you have Orcs, Oreads, Nagji, Sulis. So with so few Str racial stats it's reasonable that the combination with Int would be next to non-existent.


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I don't see traps as free XP. It's no different than a Fighter taking out a mook with out scratch, free XP there too. Or better yet a wizard taking out 50 mooks with single spell, sure it used a resource but it's 50 mooks.


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I don't see much of difference between Vigilante the class and any other class having a dual life. Rogues for example and the problems they can bring to party when their goals go against the party. The Vigilante is just another class with more tools to keep their dual life separate. So it's all how you play the character that decides if the character can work together and class doesn't really impact that.


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Coming from GM point of view who runs fighters as bad guys, I rarely if ever have fighters full attack. I have the move lots, it keeps them alive longer and they do more damage to the party. Now that's NPC fighters who don't do as much damage so they really can not trade full attacks with the party melee specialists. That just means a dead bad guy fighter in round.

Playing fighter though I find I full attack a lot more as I have the resources to survive better than an NPC fighter with NPC stats and wealth. As well I have a party backing me up. So healing and my AC will be higher too. So full attack and less mobility works better even though I can move full speed in Full Plate.


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I3igAl wrote:

Talk to the GM. It seems he is scared you guys tear through his precious encounters too fast. A lot of GMs have this issue.

I have encountered orcs with rings of fire immunity in AD&D so the players could not clear the rooms wioth a single fireball.
I myself am guilty of cheating on saving throws in 3rd edition making save or suck spells basically unusable for PCs.

The GM has to understand, that for the players sucessfully using their abilities is part of the fun. Sometimes enemies with certain immunities to counter the PCs strength can be a unique challenge for a change, but if done all the time the game becomes pretty much a chore.

The easiest way to deal with novaish abillities like smite and challenge as a GM is more daily encounters. Either the PCs waste their precious smites to plow througth a bunch of minions and will miss them for the boss battle or they will enter the fight with the BBEG already injured.

Anyway the decision is up to the players and they will be able to use everthing they have.

The easiest way to deal with novaish abilities is to not be predictable. If you always build the dungeon with easy at the start and slowly get tougher you players will get used to it and prepare for it. Surprise them, through a tough encounter off the start. They will be reluctant to use those abilities because they think the next encounter will be harder. I'm all over the place that and players are never sure expend resource in nova. I don't consider smite a nova ability though as you get higher level you have enough smites to cover every combat. By 13th level you smite 5 per day, you'll be lucky to have 5 encounters where you can use smite.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I played in a game where that happened. Magic still existed, you could play a Wizard but with spells no higher in level that level 2. If you cast a 3rd level spell the wizard kings detected it and sent an army of mutated monster on you. There was no surviving that. It literally was cast 3rd level spell and monsters were gated in right on top of you.

The big bad wizards also cut off access to the gods so divine spells.

In the group we had rogue, fighter, and two rangers. We be shifted to the world by crazy wizard during a teleport gone really wrong. The wizard ended up calling down the wrath and fled so we got to see just how bad it was. Being all mundane they left us alone to chase the wizard.

Later we discovered a cleric who was given a vision on restoring divine power to the world, she a cleric with 2nd level spell only and that was our quest. Turned out to be one of the best games we've ever played.


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Alzrius wrote:

So one of the rotating pool of GMs in my group has decided that he wants to run a mini-campaign when it's his turn again. For this, he's asked us all to make 18th-level characters. As soon as I heard this, I jumped on playing the wizard.

While he hasn't set out our ability score point-buy (I think it'll be 25, though), he has said that we'll have our standard WBL values, and that all first-party materials (e.g. anything published by Paizo) will be allowed.

So what I want to do is use this as a chance to run the sort of wizard that's always talked about in whenever the caster-martial disparity comes up as a topic. To that end, I wanted to ask what the best - or at least, most classic - options are out there for this. Off the top of my head, I recall the following:

Traits: Magical Lineage seems to be obvious here (though what metamagic feats are worthwhile is another matter). I'm less sold on Wayang Spellhunter, simply because I'm not at all sure what specific 3rd-level-or-below spell to pick.

Feats: Using two or more item creation feats seems like a no-brainer, what with the whole adjust their WBL upwards by 50% if they have two or more item creation feats guideline.

Spells: Traditionally, using create demiplane and astral projection in conjunction get brought up a lot. There's also greater planar ally and simulacrum (though the latter never made much sense to me, since it's at one-half the creature's Hit Dice, so in this case it'd be a 9th-level wizard). Obviously blood money is on the list.

Those are the ones that immediately come to mind; what else should I be looking at?

Depends what your wealth is. If normal WBL level, wizard. If you are 18th level naked on deserted island, Cleric is by far better.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I don't use the nerf to Crane style. We didn't find it broken. Found bigger issue with Clustered Shot.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I've run into this in games. It usually happens when I have interesting character and the game goes in direction that invalidates my characters.

Like I had an inquisitor that with ties to the location. I took traits, feats and such for that exact purpose. It was great at first but then adventure took us on journey's far and distant. It felt like I left half my character in the first locale. I had a decent character just lost purpose with it.

I find this less of problem with APs due to the players guide but it still happens. What I do is allow the player to retire the character and work closely with the player to create a character that will fit the adventure better. Then they tend to care more.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Claxon wrote:

With the ability to avoid death via Raise Dead, Resurrection, and True Resurrection death is rarely permanent for members of an adventuring party and comes with little real penalty either.

Sure raise dead costs 5,000 gold and has two permanent negative levels. If you have access to Raise Dead you also have access to Restoration. Those negative levels are removed by 2 castings of Restoration and 2000 gp (and 8 days). So the price of death is 7000 gold.

But I don't like this system. I want something that makes death a bit more daunting and terrifying than just a gold sink. I also want it to be fair between martials and casters.

I've seen it suggested before that characters take a permanent (not in any way removable) penalty to con, reducing it by 1 for each death. But this penalizes melee characters more than anyone else as they are more likely to die (taking the hits all the time) and by reducing their con you make them even more likely to die.

And then there is a gold sink issue. With just gold you end up with disproportionate wealth between characters. In this game wealth is power, so I don't really care to create a wealth imbalance between characters. I also use Automatic Bonus Progression Rules to eliminate the Big Six, so it's not as bad. However the issue is still present.

What can be done to make a character death more terrifying without unfairly penalizing the characters that are more likely to die (melee).

I've thought about saying that you can only have Raised Dead, Resurrection, and True Resurrection used on you each 1 time. That way there is a hard limit on number of revivals. Though there is an increasing cost for each death that imbalances the wealth. Or possibly you can only be resurrected a number of times equal to your con modifier.

I've also considered maybe a method to encourage people to save others. For a party, having a party member die would impose a -1 penalty on all D20 rolls, all save DCs, and applies to all creatures control by the party (whether animal...

Martial characters are the least likely to die. The class I most often see die are rogues followed by wizard/sorcerers, then monks. I've never seen a fighter die in Pathfinder. Happened in 2nd edition with save or die spells though.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Drahliana Moonrunner wrote:
Rhedyn wrote:

As I was puzzling over how a high level fighter could be both high level and not too DBZ/Bleach/One-Piece/Naruto shounen anime, it occurred to me that high level wizards would fit very well in those universes, sometimes as the main character.

How many GM's out there have placed the party in dire situations only for the wizard to pull some mcguffin spell out of his hat that fixes everything? How many classical fantasy struggles are just ignored by wuxia reality bending Death Note Kira wannabes?

How would you make magic sufficiently mundane but functional enough to fit better in a genre that is supposedly dominated by sword swingers?

Which genre are you talking about? If you're talking about novels and movies, the answer is all in the writing.

If you're talking about D+D and Pathfinder, you're the first to suggest that martials dominate this game.

Martial classes do dominate the game. 99% of the time if you grab any NPC in the game they will be martial class. That doesn't mean a individual martial NPC is powerful, they are powerful due to numbers though. At least they are with those new troop rules. Suddenly a mob of 100 commoners with torches and pitch forks is real threat to a wizard.


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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Depends what the sun in the fantasy setting. There may be no gravity at all at the sun. Maybe it's just giant portal to the elemental plane of fire and void between planets and that portal. I don't think there is anything on what the sun is in Glorion other than it functions much like it does here.

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