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Forest Drake

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2.0 and later Realms is one giant smash event after the other. The Time of Troubles, the aquatic war around Waterdeep, the destruction of Thay, the elimination of Elistraee and the Seven, it goes on and on. Mystra dies AGAIN, Shar turns Sembia into New Netheril ruled over by the archiwizards of Shade, several of the outlying areas go poof, and the the Spellplague rearranges the planar realities and Aberil Toril into a new planet. Then the conjunction of both worlds starts to fail and magic changes yet again so we have 5th Ed.


OOH! Will there be rules for gnarfing on other vampires to get their power? And will vamps be able to empower themselves to take abilities via a racial paragon class or feats to appear more human, ignore sunlight, have Leadership variants where you can have a renfield or a heavy metal band? Could you play an angry French vampire that is the lead singer of the heavy metal band? Will you be able to get more powers by taking vulnerabilities to black roses or wolvesbane?


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Snark mode on: Now what's really overpowered are daggers. They have such a high crit range and are easily concealable. And then you can use them when you get swallowed hole! And you can throw them! Plus they do piercing or slashing damage! We should nerf daggers before they get out of control!


There is also the exceptionally old Palladium game Valley of the Pharaohs. Hard as hell to get. Also, the only other dungeon that tops Tomb and Return to the Tomb of Horrors, Necropolis from Necromancer Games. These screams out for a Pathfindering.... Also currently the home of OSTOG THE UNSLAIN BARBARIAN WITH NO ARMOR, the grand hero of Erik Mona in Paizo's own campaign of this.

http://paizo.com/products/btpy8ypj?Gary-Gygaxs-Necropolis


By the definitions I see here, a lot of 1st through 2nd Ed modules make the PCs instant murderhobos. And a lot of 3.5, Pathfinder, 4.0 and I suspect 5.0 as well.

A)Most adventures or campaigns use TWO hooks to motivate players to care about the problem that needs to be solved. One is financial gain (ie reward money, magic items, land and title, stronghold) and the other is a philosophical or emotional appeal to the players as a roleplaying hook. Save the princess from the evil dragon, explore the dungeon in which monsters can boil up and devour everything, reassemble the magic crystals that allow you to free the great evil from its slumber to fight it in person, etc.

B) There is nothing wrong with a group that fights and defeats evil via sword and spell. That's the core of the D&D experience and has been since 1st Ed. The other side of that core is how you character interacts with other parts of the world that aren't evil, whether using skills, combat talents, magic, or special twinkling bird songs.

C)If the gamemaster doesn't have a problem with morally gray or evil play (such as murder, arson, slavery, etc) or the AP calls for it (Way of the Wicked, most drow house games, etc), then you are playing the game as you two enjoy it. Now if other players object to your acts because they have different moral codes, then you eventually come to a solution, or the gamemaster should step you aside and say we need to come to a solution so we can continue playing and no one has any major hangups. I have found the best way to take care of this issue is to mandate what alignments are available at the start. If you are running a lawful good game, then don't allow chaotic evil or evil characters period, and cut down on the neutral or chaotic neutral.

D)Chaotic neutral alignment is not an excuse for amorality or sociopathic behavior. I have seen happen all to often, especially amongst younger players, who think that CN is a get out of alignment free card. It's not an excuse for bad roleplaying or pouting.

E) The mostly trumped up battle you are seeing (kind of like the Emu War in Australia) is between roleplayers and combat gamers. One side thinks that people specced for the other are going to destroy their game fun, when in fact neither side is bad. Optimization gets to be a bit tiresome, I agree, but everyone will manipulate a system to give them an edge, especially if they can find a good hook to justify it.


And going way WAY back, the Desert of Desolation series by TSR.


Actually wielding two medium sized two-handed weapons at the same time is pretty cool. It may not give you the best optimization for DPS output, but thematically it's an awesome sight as your barbarian whips a greataxe and a two hander around. You do get the extra damage dice for the two handed weapons, which helps make up slightly for the loss of 1.5 your strength bonus. Plus enlarge person becomes your best friend with larger size weapons.... The rage ability at 14th and lots of potions will help out immensely. Then you can use your Large sized greatsword and great axe in one hand each, or a Huge size one handed weapon in two hands to get that nice smashy/smashy damage. Dual mauls, anyone?


For the gold dragon, what if the gold dragon casts multiple antimagic fields to cover other parts of its body? It would cost multiple castings, but then it could take care of the entire anti-magic field not sizing to your body thing.


And most likely, Asmodeus would probably command the anti-paladin there to kill Thorne anyway as the direct agent. Whether the graveknights would follow his lead is another story. An interesting solution for the players is to convince the anti-paladin to help defeat Thorn by claiming it is Asmodeus's will that Thorne fall. He may far more loyal to Thorn then Grigori, but good enough roleplaying should deserve a chance then just a straight Diplomacy roll.


Ok we managed to get you guys out of your cell and partially explore the prison. A good start so far. I have another player joining named Noel who will be an aasimar clever godling from Rogue Genius/Super Genius games. It's a rogu(ish) class with a variety of special abilities dependent on what Noel takes.

Our next game is on the 3rd at 6:30 pm.


I prefer to look at it this way. Asmodeus is checking whether Thorn or the Knot are the souls most worthy to take up the mantle of his crusade against Talingarde. Otherwise, Asmodeus would just pull his support from Thorn completely and he would a 18th level cleric lich with no spellcasting ability. The Knot would run over him or Grigori would engineer his defeat and then take over the plan or negotiate with the Knot as they arrived.


The gloves are from the Magic Item Compendium.


Greater Planar Ally, Planar Ally, and Lesser Planar Ally are calling spells. Those bring the real deal to help you out for a minute, a day, or a week per level. Thus those devils can use their summon powers without any restriction.


The easiest way to run Thorn is to have the graveknight patrols split into two or three groups of 4 man to 6 man squads, or add more so they have 3 6 man squads. 1 group patrols the upper temple, 1 group patrols the lower temple, and the other 6 man crew stays with Thorn. Then have Thorn use greater planar ally to summon in a Deimavigga devil, a Puragaus Devil, a heresy devil, and then cast gate to get a Pit Fiend online when the PCs arrive in the throne room. Have the lesser devils each summon up the max number they can (the heresy devil adds +25% to each devil's summon percentage) before the PCs arrive, and then send out the minions to drain the PCs' resources. Let the greater devils stay in place, and then have Thorn cast his 10 min buff spells before the party gets there. Once they arrive, have Thorn cast time stop, then greater spell immunity and gate for the Pit Fiend to arrive onsite. If he gets more time with the time stop, then cast a couple of more defensive magics with 1 round or 1 min/duration.

Arrange for a cot for Wolfgam to sleep in the same area that Thorn does, and beef up his hit points to 8 per die (Thorn should probably have the same if not more, max HP frankly.) Thus when the PCs arrive, they are facing the anti-paladin, 6 graveknights, the three greatest devils you can get without casting gate, and an 18th level lich who doesn't sit and wait for his allies to get picked off one by one. As for the necromancer and the undead dragons, have Grigori be in the same area as the dragons along with a variety of newly created undead (devourers, mohrgs, etc) with the most powerful protected against electricity. As for the giant, he's there to weaken the group, so have Thorn cast mind blank on him so he gets immunity to things like charm, hold monster, etc. Have the giant guards drink up low level buff potions, and then start chucking rocks at the same character that the Ice Axe is in melee with.


I am afraid we are full, Dustin. I'm still waiting to hear back from our sixth, and I have another who would like that spot. I am sorry that you can't find a game at the present time. I know what that is like all too well.


http://www.firemountaingames.com/Players_Guide.pdf

For those who want to read up on Talingarde. In my version of Golarion, Talingarde lies in the chain of islands near the remnants of Azlant.


https://app.roll20.net/join/663817/_U5soQ


Hence why you get mithril breastplate barding. That extra 3 points of AC with Full Plate doesn't mean a whole lot given high end monsters or full on NPC attack murder hobos carrying potions of bull's strength and true strike. And those are just cheap potions.


Heh. I had to grant my PCs about 10,000 gp more since that way they would have gear at the standard WBL, but I wasn't real worried about it, given that a new character joined up with 16,000 gp and made some of his items using Master Craftsman. Item Creation can and will overgear you, but you can always add more monsters to make up for it. I have found that swarming an enemy with ghouls doesn't work if the group has AOE healing bursts and sound burst spells, or if the ghouls arrive in waves, like they do in the fields of book 2. I did manage to kill the eidolon of the 3 cleric/3 summoner, but they cut the rest of the ghouls down via arrow fire and well illuminated fields of harvested crops (it was October, so not much raising crops and having the undead attack you as you go up and down the rows).

Party
6 level halfing bard no archetype
3 level forester (Pathfinder Database web class with 3/4 BAB, skirmish as scout, plus bard style spellcasting orienting on a mix of arcane and divine)/3rd level elf wizard
3rd level human cleric/3rd level summoner (no archetypes)
6th level dwarven fighter specializing in dual wielding dorn-degar, has Master Craftsman and uses a Large Sized Adamntine +1 Dorn-Degar in one hand (has the feat that allows him to do so, plus the gloves that allow to use weapons one size larger) and a masterwork one in the other. Combat reflexes and the other feat that allows you to shorten the weapon as a move action. Nasty for approach fights. Wears stone plate.


You could as long as each point of the serpentine is anchored. It's the same style as wall of iron, wall of fire, force, etc. Unlike wall of iron, which gets set in a vertical position only, this one can be oriented any way you want the wall to form, as long as it is supported. Good for caging people.


I have everyone's character other than Aero Gracchus. We have the following

Meeko-Human Necromancer
Will Pratt-Oni Spawn Tiefling Bloodrager
Ashe-Aasimar or Human Anti-Paladin of Asmodeus
Peter Stewart-Samasaran Shaman
Grand Moff Vixen-Jotun Paragon (stone giant tribe)

So you have arcane and divine spellcasting covered, and 2 spellcastery fighter types plus a big pissed off giant that can smash things with acid or rocks. I created the Roll 20 campaign as well. I just need to set up sheets and macros, etc so we can use it. Maps are going to be a royal pain, but I will do what I can to provide them.. We should be set for Tuesday, and if I can't get maps up in time, then I can present them in other ways so you guys can see what's going on.


Heh. I meant the post of Cthulu as a joke, not as a serious contender for CR. I'm finding haunts are a royal pain in the ass for groups that don't recognize them, like the group I just ran for today. They were investigating the haunted house of the Foxgloves in Rise of the Runelords (2012 Pathfinder Anniversary Edition), and got hit by at least two haunts. If you don't make your perception check, then boom, the haunt goes off and you get hit by the effect. Or even if you do, you may not realize what it is. The group left after one character thought he was the mother of the halfing bard due to failing a will save from a suggestion spell, and grappled him and carried him out through the door, running into the swarms of carrionstorms (ghoul tainted undead ravens). Fortunately the cleric in the group managed to destroy 4 storms, and the other 4 storms were entangled in a web spell, which I just now found out wouldn't have worked since you can't grapple a swarm. But it was a good idea at the time. They got so fed up at the house that they decided to go to Magnimar and try to search for Aldern Foxglove there, which should be hellaciously entertaining since he never goes back to Magninmar, but uses the haunted house as his main base. So he's started knocking off NPCs in Sandpoint and leaving some of them as ghouls to bring more terror to the town. It should be fun to see how many ghouls get created as the PCs take a wagon owned by the dwarf fighter and driven by giant goats to Magnimar, and if there are even anyone left after the PCs come back.


D20 Modern, Cyberpunk and Future are stupid easy to convert. Also the anime d20 book of mecha allows you to build ANY (and I do mean ANY) giant robot, tank, aircraft, robot vacuum cleaner, and angst ridden cyborg giant superhuman human piloted angels that you want.


2nd Ed Palladium has them at 6 to 10 feet tall. The conversion book has them from 7 to 9 feat tall. Wolven in Phase World are 7 to 9 feat tall as well. In Palladium fantasy, their size depends on the tribe, as featured in the Wolfen Empire and the Northern Wilderness books. So really if you want to do them up, create the various tribes and their background, and then you have wolven from medium to large. The only thing the wolven get from being large is a higher dice damage on a weapon and the +4 to CMB, and they get the -1 to attack rolls. The same thing for trolls and ogres. Higher strength with more penalty to mental stats. As for kobolds, they're just dwarves with farther dark vision and light sensitivity.


Works for me Grand Moff Vixen.


Definitely this guy. http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/aberrations/great-old-one s/great-old-one-cthulhu


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The reason why we haven't see a massive influx of celestials is that all of the above threats have been contained. The World wound is locked behind the warding stones or its main creator killed, Earth fall allowed the current regime of gods to rise, and Tar-Baphon was put down by direct deific intervention before Aroden got killed in a horrible boating accident. But if any of those powers became a world threatening issue or you had a full scale planar invasion, then you can bet the planes of good are coming in to clean house.


Just allowing what you can take. The jotun paragons' special abilities are their elemental powers, natural armor, size, and physical prowess. Colossal rock throwing will get stupid wicked high damage, since it is double your slam damage plus 1 and 1/2 times your strength mod. So that's a base of 8d6 + 150% your strength bonus, and you should be able to throw 3 rocks at that point. Plus there is a feat that allows you to use your strength bonus for attack rolls on thrown weapons as well.


Heh. Also fyi for people, the campaign trait is in addition to your two normal ones. I forgot to post that, and that was my mistake. Also remember that you get 2 extra skill points per level.

@Ashe Full plate, yes, cool sword, not really unless you pervert one to evil. There are rules for that which are a reversal of the rules in Book of Exalted Deeds for redeeming items. Also don't forget you will have a necromancer who may take feats in item creation, and that comes in handy (I did it with my cleric and made potions and wondrous items for our group).

@Grand Moff Vixen, Craft: Stonemasonry will come in handy, especially if you are taking the various manipulate stone powers for your elemental powers. There is one that allows you to use stone shape equal to your level for 1 round equal to your level + your con score, I think. Also checkout the stone tell and transmute rock to mud powers, and the various capabilities you can get with offensive elemental powers, like elemental burst. I also will allow you take a feat to get an extra elemental power, since it's the same thing as extra spell or judgement, etc for your class.

Aero Gracchus, are you still in?


http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/f/familiar-figment

50% miss change on familiar

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/f/familiar-double
for witches as project image

And there is a magic item that converts your familiar, animal companion, etc into a statuette and then can be command to make it whole again. I just can't remember where it is.


Heh. There are plenty of magic items that help with the sunlight, and they present a number of them in the AP. One is a magiCal adamantine coffin that seals with an arcanelock and an alarm spell,plus it covers the coffin with a mage's sanctum so you can't be scryed upon either. Another one allows you to take your heart out of your chest and makes you immune to being staked. Another allows you to move arounder in daylight but you act as you have light sensitivity while under the cloak, and you still have to sleep in your coffin at some point.


Works for me. Mitran celestials mingle with the population all the time.

Sweet! A Jotun! That will make for some nice brute force down the line! You will probably want some feats or magic items that will allow you to shift size down the road, but a giant can go most places in this AP pretty well. All giants come from beyond the Watch Wall, and you have most of the normal tribes in that location.


Awesome book. Unfortunately it may not see use in my Way of The Wicked game, but thisIn the Company of Fey and the Company of Dragons are some of my favorite 3rd party material.


Cool. I have Will's character, Meeko's character, Peter's character, and Ashe's character.

Will=Tiefling (Oni-Spawn) Bloodrager
Meeko=Human Necromancer
Peter=Samsaran shaman
Ashe-Human anti-paladin

So we have arcane and divine spellcasting done, plus two specialized combat characters. No psionics or rogues or secondary spellcasters of either role at present. Play what you want, not what you think the party will need.


Just make them large without any of the bonuses. Same thing with the Troll and the Ogre. All they get is the higher weapon damage, and they get the size penalty to attack. That should cost a lot less then giving them powerful build or all of the full bonuses with large.


An angelic invasion of an evil nation could easily happen. If Cheliax were to become too dominant or gather enough strength that the forces of Hell can take over a good portion of the Inner Sea, you can bet dollars to doughnuts that the goodly powers are going to open up a portal to Heaven, Elysium, and Nirvana to let the angels aid the forces of good. The Contract of Creation may prevent the deities from directly intervening in mortal affairs, but priests calling upon the power of their gods to summon the heavenly host is no different then the Asmodean priesthood calling forth the Legions of Hell to conquer Cheliax's enemies. And since we have ample evidence of gods sending avatars or directly intervening in mortal affairs, it's obvious that contract goes out the window in some case. Aroden raising the Starstone from the depths or Zon-Kuthon shielding the Nidalese from Earthfall are two examples.

The key is all of this is response. Good outsiders are going to be guided via the priests as local commanders and guides on the ground, not running amuck killing every person that detects as evil. As for numbers, are you putting a limit on the powers of gods to create angels? They don't have to appear from mortal souls, and I am sure Earthfall caused a large amount of martyrs and brave souls of good to ascend into the heavenly ranks, as much as the evil planes took for evil people. PCs can serve as the heroes leading the angels as they assault massive gatherings of devils, command mortal armies, or are simply people caught up in a massive tumult of good vs evil and try to survive. Epic campaign stuff right there.


The Return to White Plume Mountain made the blade Chaotic Evil. Given that you have artifacts in 10th level APs making appearances (Kingmaker comes to mind), I think that Blackrazor granting the temp HD of whatever you kill to you as hp makes sense, but it only grants you those HD for 1 turn (aka 10 minutes) per HD. It grants haste as a 10th level caster 1PD, makes you immune to all charm (not compulsion) and fear effects, speech and telepathy, lifesense+deathwatch(as per the undead or necromancer ability/spell 60 feet). Int 17, Ego 16, which increases by 1 per every three days the blade doesn't drain souls. All of the weapons from White Plume Mountain are artifacts for the most part, especially Wave and Whelm. The Arms and Equipment guide knocked them down to intelligent weapons, but that lessens their appeal and power in my eyes. If you are going to go for the Mcguffin style adventures like White Plume Mountain, then making the Mcguffin something that can't be duplicated with money (which is far easier to get then just about any artifact), then make the Mcguffin worth the effort.


Nope still failed, Will. Can you dump it into a word doc and then send it to me via PM? Thanks


@Meeko So am I. I am looking forward to running this game and having a sucessful campaign all the way to 20th level.

Thanks Will. I will take a look in a bit.


Heh Will, could you repost your sheet link? It keeps referring the thread or a link that doesn't exist. Thanks.


So we have an anti-paladin,a necromancer, a shaman, and a bloodrager so far. This should be interesting.


Sigh. Gold.


It would be best to have it next Tuesday, since not everyone has their character done. I don't want to force anyone to make a choice they later regret and thenjoy have to pay for the cost of retraining. And it does work better to forge the bonds of an evil organization at the start, since escaping Brandescar is the main glue that holds the group together. Of course, they can't brand someone with fire resistance, so instead they use a sharp knife to permanently scar the forsaken brand onto your arm, and then cool it down with dye so it stands out. Usually white or gokd dye, if you want to know.


This becomes a common issue with independent play. At higher levels or in an a party that has established lines of communication, solo scouting or recon is not as much of an issue, but if one PC goes off alone without anyone recognizing they are gone, then that PC better be set to deal with the consequences of being alone. It's hard to get a group to coordinate things, but they will learn. As for GMs not wanting to kill PCs, it happens. I had 23 dead PCs and one reincarnated 5 times due to either combat or stupid shenaningans that other players generated in a Kingmaker game. Eventually they will learn, or much like the dodo, natural selection will eliminate them from the gaming table.


No worries, Will. I just wanted to make sure how many players we had. I've worked that kind of shift several times and finding time for your loved ones and your own amusement gets hard.


Slings aren't bad. People have pointed out the following:

They cost nothing to make and ammunition is far cheaper (1 silver piece for 10 bullets). Great when you get stuck without any equipment (as some APs are prone to do), or run out of arrows.
They add strength bonus to damage without requiring a massive amount of gold expenditure, and they tick to any strength bonus as well (so if you have your +5 composite longbow with a +5 strength mod, and that nasty shadow drains your strength, suddenly it becomes impossible to pull the bow).
They are a classic Halfling weapon, and with one change the Halfling can rapid fire a sling at the same rate you can with an X-bow or a regular bow.

Also, back in 1st Edition (all hail the great and noble wizard Gygax, leader of the grand coalition of Vancian Gazebos!), slings did 1d6+1 to medium creatures and 1d4+1 to large. So following the article that one person posted, the fact that slings lasted amongst people even until the 1930s amongst shepherds, you could adjust slings to do 1d4 and 1d6 damage, which would alleviate part of the problem for base damage. The halfing war sling from 3.5 did 1d6 with skiprocks, and it could bounce from target to target. Adjust staff slings to do 1d8 and 1d10 damage for small and medium size respectively, and slings become far more competitive. They aren't quite as good as bows firing sheaf/war arrow heads, but with those adjustments it makes them pretty nasty. A Halfling fighter specializing in a sling could jack out some nasty damage, especially if you cast gravity bow on his sling. Tap in rapid shot, manyshot, point blank shot, etc, and with the exception of range (which isn't a real big deal, since most encounters happen in ranges of 300 feet or less), and the sling becomes competitive.


So is everyone still in? We are at 6 players at present.

Aero Gracchus
Ashe
Peter Stewart
Will Pratt
Grand Inquisitor Vixen
Meeko

I have Ashe's character sheet, and meeko's background and character choice. I am pinging interest so if everyone gets their character done by today I can create the roll20 page and get that setup, we can play today. But if not, then our next game will be the 27th around 6:30 pm EST based on the last series of PMs I had.


That's fine Meeko. People can also send me PMs with word or RTF or PDF docs as well. We just need the characters done so we have a list of what people are gping to play and then we can start. If we don't get them all by Tuesday then we can start next Tuesday.


Google Docs works fine for a character sheet. Or you can PM me with it as you see fit.


Nice background Meeko. They are going to burn you at the stake for sure.

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