Doug's Workshop wrote:
Axing the defense budget seems like kind of a good idea, doesn't it? We spent ourselves into a recession dumping money into Defense. The way we spend money is broken; those defense dollars aren't going to soldiers, they're going to defense contractors.
All of this angst over the "end of the filibuster" is overblown. The rules change doesn't apply to Supreme Court nominees, or legislation. All it does is prevent a minority party from obstructing perfunctory nominations out of sheer spite, which is why Republicans won't be undoing it when they get the Senate back (which, contrary to their belief, is unlikely to be in 2014...they kind of kneecapped themselves with that government shutdown silliness)
because fun is largely subjective. So ppl on the board give advice based on what is effective. if you're in it for fun alone, you don't need to go on msg boards and ask for advice for having fun.
I think the problem here is that people are asking for a specific type of advice ("how do I make this character better?") and they're getting a different kind of advice ("play this other character instead").
It's more challenging to find a way to make an unusual build viable, but it's also very rewarding.
If the DC is 17, they must have an 20 in their casting stat and spell focus in enchantment (or the equivalent psionic feat). That would make them pretty specialized...they should be able to sleep effectively. But it's impossible for sleep to affect anything with more than 4HD, and there are monsters who are flat-out immune to sleep effects. This doesn't sound like a huge deal.
Abraham spalding wrote:
i admit a curiousity at why someone would think that an oracle has to be some sort of damage dealer to justify wearing medium armor. i would think just wanting the protection would be enough.
I think I phrased that poorly. I was speculating about an Oracle without medium armor, with low strength. Typically there's a period between buffing at the start of combat and healing where you could/should be doing something else.
Abraham spalding wrote:
Yes, I understand that. What I'm wondering is how a low strength Oracle would handle themselves, since their spell list is light on ranged damage at low levels and they have poor synergy with archery.
So, I've been messing around with some level 1 PFS builds, and I've noticed that with a strength of 10, your light load limit (33 pounds) is less than that of many Medium armors. Does this mean that, for example, a STR 10 Oracle wearing Four Mirror (45 lbs.) would be at an encumbrance penalty? Would the same Oracle in Scale Mail (30 lbs.) only be able to carry another 3 lbs. of gear? Wouldn't that restrict their weapon choice pretty harshly?
The Shadow Caller is similarly ridiculously powerful (when at full strength). The energy drain (unless we're doing it wrong) has neutered his Eidolon pretty harshly, but his constant summoning of leopards/eagles/wolves with the Shadow template has made it bearable for him.
I'm impressed with your group's optimization though, taking down Black Magga in 2 rounds.
If you like Dragons, and don't mind shelling out a little bit of money, The Dragon's Demand is a great adventure that takes the group from 1-6, involves a dragon, and has some great sidequests as well. I'm running it with a group of very new players and they're loving it*.
*note: I strongly recommend having a rogue in the party if you run Dragon's Demand, as kobolds (and their numerous traps) figure in heavily during the early game.
Our group knows how negative levels work in Pathfinder; a Summoner who is treated as 3 levels lower, however, is in a pretty bad position and he's been grouching about it for weeks. I'm not surprised that the Paladin was able to make the saving throw (though still, a 27 is nothing to sneeze at), but how far away was the archer? DR15 applying to each attack is also pretty brutal. It sounds like they were fortunate to get the crits in when they did.
The Morphling wrote:
Is Racial Heritage PFS legal? I have some GMs to playfully annoy...
Mythic Evil Lincoln wrote:
Black Magga flees in four rounds regardless of HP, iirc. Otherwise the party I described would have been screwed. Only the ranger was capable of doing damage that was both cold iron AND magical.
I've been running a group through Rise of the Runelords for the past year or so, and we're in the middle of the Hook Mountain Massacre. The group was short one member when they met Black Magga during the Turtleback Ferry flood, so they consisted of:
8th level Catfolk Ranger
Both the cleric and the summoner have companions, a fighter and a wizard, respectively. The group was not getting anywhere near Black Magga, and tried to engage her from max range by having the ranger fire on her from about 450 feet away. Wanting to give them a bit of a break, I had her spend most of the 4 rounds closing with them (her swim speed is only 60 feet, so even a run is just 240) and then breath weapon them on the 4th round and leave. The group's attempts to deal damage to her failed miserably, and had the combat continued past the 4 rounds dictated in the module, they would have died. Nobody was able to make the DC 27 will save to resist the wisdom drain/confusion; only the Ranger escaped because he (wisely) bailed in the third round.
Now, the book actually has a contingency for giving the group extra XP if they manage to defeat Black Magga in those 4 rounds. How on earth is a 8-9th level party supposed to drop Black Magga in 4 rounds? Even with a bit of HP lost from falling down a waterfall, we're talking about a CR15 creature with DR 15 (cold iron AND magic, not OR), SR 26, Acid/Cold resist 20 (so the usual workaround for SR of using acid conjuration spells is nixed) and an AC of 30. With 5 attacks, at an average of +20 per attack (and a bite with a 2 level energy drain). I can't imagine a 9th level Fighter surviving more than 2 rounds of that kind of abuse, and that's with a pretty well optimized AC and HP pool. Add in the fact that if they'd engaged at close range as was intended, they'd have taken the breath weapon in round one and possibly spent the entire combat Confused.
Am I missing something here?
Touch attacks are not weapons; you simply count as being "armed" if you have a touch spell ready. It's not the same thing.
Nothing happened; touch attacks are still viable for casters...a strength of 6 is the strength of a small child. If you dump a stat that hard, you should be reaping some consequences.
Call me crazy, but I think Obama should veto this. Putting the fight off until January is pointless, and just keeps this silliness as a valid negotiation tactic, which is something he claimed he was trying to prevent.
If these nutbags are willing to drive us over a cliff unless they get their way, somebody is going to have to call their bluff. Better to do it now, since the stakes only get higher as times goes on.
Matthew Downie wrote:
There is a barbarian archetype that gets bonuses for not wearing armor. Standard fighters get reduced penalties while wearing full plate, and the ACP penalties aren't that bad. (You should have enough strength that you can survive in water with a single rank of Swim.)
Have you seen the AC bonuses for that archetype? It's pretty awful.
Doug's Workshop wrote:
The pain isn't going to come from government cuts - which, by the way, are more along the lines of "sorry about your grandma, Jimmy, but the subsidy for her meds doesn't exist anymore..." - the real problem will be the damage to the markets.
Just *talking* about not raising the debt ceiling does damage to the international markets, and we already know this from the *last* time these same lunatics pulled this. Actually going through with it will be catastrophic.
Divine casters don't really count; they wear armor and are usually in melee; I consider them hybrids. I've been in plenty of games where casters aren't using the armors from Ultimate Combat...besides, isn't that what Bracers of Armor are for? :)
And if you really wanted to, you could make an argument for putting armor on a Monk...go with Master of Many Styles, which replaces your flurry, and suddenly you don't have much to lose from wearing armor.
So...for the ideal PFS build, I guess we're looking at:
Human Oracle of Wind
- Take Hunter's Eye PFS trait, gain Longbow proficiency
Charisma > Dex > Con > Wis > Int > Str
Revelation: Air Barrier
At this point, the feat tax for archery is paid sufficiently that our hero can hang in the back and drop buffs on the party while still contributing to combat.
At low levels, you can invest that money elsewhere, though. And like you said, it'd be fun to try. You'd probably want to focus on either buffing or ranged combat rather than melee, though.
Has anyone really tried to play an armor-less Oracle? Many of the Mysteries (all of the elemental ones, plus Bones and Ancestor, to name a few), and I would say they tend to become semi-competitive with worn medium armor options after about 13th level when most of them give you some form of free DR.
What I'm curious about is a build that relies on this armor at an earlier level, possibly even level 1. At low levels, the Armor revelations are essentially equivalent to Mage Armor/Light Armor. Why bother doing this?
- Flavor-wise, it gives your Oracle more of a caster feel, differentiating you from a Cleric more than you would be otherwise.
- You're safe in situations where you're captured and stripped of gear, or attacked by a Rust Monster
- You're free of the burden of Armor Check Penalties
That last one is probably the most compelling mechanical reason to do this. Many of the Mysteries with an armor revelation also give you a class skill that is affected by armor. For example Bones gives you Stealth, Waves gives you Acrobatics, and Wind gives you both. This opens up the possibility of a more scout/skirmish-type Oracle, which sounds like it could be kind of fun. Has anyone tried this? Just from a cursory look, it would appear that Wind is probably the best option for this, while Heavens (giving no class skills affected by armor) is arguably the worst. Winter seems highly situational, as the armor ability loses effectiveness outside of a cold environment.
Adult Swim would like a word with you...
Regarding cast size, I think 5 would be perfect. It's a good number, and it's worked for lots of shows before (e.g. every sentai show ever, even TMNT usually had a fifth support character in the episode like April, Casey Jones, or Splinter). The iconics are already pretty well defined. Valeros, Seoni, Merisiel, Kyra, and Ezren would be an ideal starting group. Over time they could swap out with other characters as necessary (Seoni stays behind with a Varisian clan to help them rebuild, Ezren has to stay in Absolom for his PFS exam, etc.) to give characters like Lini, Lem, and Amiri a chance to shine.
Rise of the Runelords would make a great TV show, and then at about season 2 have a Jade Regent spin-off.
I'm not sure you could fit all of Rise of the Runelords into a single season. I'm even less sure that you could make a kid-appropriate cartoon out of the Hook Mountain Massacre.
Which AP are you looking at? None of the APs I own (Shattered Star, Reign of Winter, Serpent's Skull, Rise of the Runelords) suggests a 15 point build, and many of them have been approved for PFS play, which would suggest that PFS build standards are appropriate.
John Pryor wrote:
Only some of the Mysteries give an armor revelation, and they're usually the ones that give you a class skill with an armor check penalty (like Stealth). I can totally imagine playing a sneaky Wind Oracle who doesn't wear armor, and just uses the ability when necessary (particularly since the armor revelations scale over time, and eventually give you DR).
The melee-focused mysteries, like Battle and Metal, don't give you an armor revelation because they're clearly designed for armor-wearing Oracles.
The Rot Grub wrote:
IIRC, Paizo APs use a 20-point build standard for PCs, not 15.
Uh....Shadorun Returns has no connection whatsoever to 5th edition game mechanics. You're thinking of Shadowrun Online, which is supposed to have similar game mechanics.
5th edition is essentially another revision of 4th. They tried to rebalance the game a bit by introducing Accuracy on firearms, and nerfing a few spells, but I don't think they learned their lesson and the same armor-stacking cheese tactics that used to work will return in full force as soon as they release the gear sourcebook.
It's nice that they simplified Armor, though.