mike smith 853's page

It worked itself out. Some sort of connection problem on my end. Thanks.

Say I just bought this and I can't get it to down load properly. Any ideas?

I thought I had problems with 7 players in my new group. Yeah I'm in agreement with everyone else. Ask if people have interest in splitting the groups into two 5 person games that run every other week, say on a Sunday. First group starts the adventure then the second group the following week. That sounds doable to me. Good luck with whatever you decide.

Hello all,

One of my players is making some extremely awesome paper minis of each character. He's only got four done thus far, and he's working on more. I love them and I wanted to share them with you. This is a link to my livejournal for the game. Please feel free to comment on anything you want, but please keep in mind my players do not know anything about this adventure. I told them I was posting thoughts on the game on a forum, but not even which one, so no hints or spoilers.

At any rate, Link

Take a look at the minis and print them out. We'll be adding more as Steven (Mannis) continues to make them.

If for some reason you can't get the images to work right in the printing, just leave your email and I'll send you the image directly.

50 xp per level is a really smart idea, I'll have to borrow that. I love the idea for art work and songs.

I'll think about an NPC journal. I don't have a single character that is involved with the party yet, but maybe I can do a bunch of different characters and how they viewed the events?

Thanks for the advice.

These are so great. I don't have the Stolen Lands book, but I love what you've done. Way to go.

I know what I'm printing out tonight.

So the next game with a full party is this Sunday, but I wanted to check in and update with some other thoughts on the game.

First off House rules I'm using that I highly suggest.

Racial Hit Points. I loved this in the Beta and was disappointed when it went away. An extra 4, 6, or 8 hit points for the heroes is not game breaking and has kept two characters from getting killed off. One of my goals is to challenge the players, but not destroy them. I'm really glad I did this.

Luck points: Wolfgang Baur wrote "The Book of Roguish Luck" for Malhavoc Press a few years ago and I really like the Luck rules. Every level you gain a die of luck points. D10 for Rogues, D4 for Fighter, and D2 for Wizards. There are a number of mechanics and Feats that can alter what you can do with these, but the main use is to burn a point to reroll a D20, keeping whatever you rolled next even if it was worse. Attack rolls and skill rolls cost 1 point, while Saving Throws cost 2. Once burned the points are gone forever. I had to use tokens to remind people of the points, but once I did the players really are enjoying ignoring the occasional bad roll.

Critical Fumble and Hit Decks. These are universally well loved. Great addition to any game.

Extra XP for doing neat stuff. 200XP for a write up on the game. I think this adds so much for everyone. I'm also giving extra XP to people that create fun props or minis for the game. One of my guys is in the process of creating paper minis of the party. Once they are completed I'll post them up.

I'll post up some more info of the game in a few days if I get a chance.

I've never been that fond of this fight. I think putting Sandpoint in danger is great and all, but since we will return to Sandpiont in the next chapter I'm not sure how much this fight does for the story. It also informs the party of the army, but to me that doesn't have the impact that a fully formed army on the move would have. My plan right now is to really extend this section of the adventure using Red Hand of Doom as a template. I may or may not have this specific fight in my game, I haven't decided.

That said I always thought the idea is that M was trying to find Runeforge, which in my head is lost to everyone. So he isn't there to destroy the area, but to clear it out and research. In addition to htis group there are also three other groups out there seeking for information. I understand that might be me interjecting something that was never there, but that makes more sense to me. Hope that helps.

Just off of the top of my head. On the upper floors the house is completely normal. Underneath it is a madman's paradise. If mage's are involved, look up the Hall of the Rainbow Mage, an adventure with wilderness levels under his house and other stupid but fun stuff. Or you can go the Hostel movie way, just rooms everywhere devoted to torture and other nasty horror movie stuff. That would be something the cultist would like. The point being that once you get them away from the normal section you have free reign to do whatever you want with dungeon. Your players will love it.

By the way I agree that the sawmill is unnecessary, it could be just about anywhere. This could work really well. Tell us how it goes when you're finished.

Hey thanks for the response. Here's a few answers

1: PC death concerns me. I went ahead and used the Racial Hit Points option from the Beta, halflings/elves 4, humans 6 HP, half orcs/dwarves 8 which has already saved Mannis life twice. I'm also very fond of the neg Con equals death. So if someone is taken down most likely they are still alive. Hopefully that will lead to capture or out for a bit but not forever. Also when I get to to Red Hand I plan to keep the staff of life to help out. a bit lame yes, but killing off one of the main characters in this story would destroy the group. These guys have put so much into their characters already I don't want to get rid of them. Now if they do something that I have little choice but to kill them well...

2: Oh yes I want Magnimar, Korvosa, and Shoanti Barbarians involved. What I'm thinking is that Hook Mountain becomes Vraath Keep, with staff of life and map of the army. I will have to create a location that is like Cinder Hill that the party will travel to, somewhere near the Storval Steps. Drellin's Ferry will become a small town north of Ravenmoor. While Brindol becomes Ravenmoor. With that being the hometown of one of my players I had to do it. Most likely the Ruins of Rhest can be exactly what it is except that instead of dragonspawn I'll need something else, perhaps Sinspawn of Greed? I'm thinking it will be north of Churlwood. The Ghostlord's Lair will most likely be in the Iron Peaks. And the Fane of Tiamat becomes Jorgenfist. Definitely I want big huge armies on both sides. Mostly likely there will be a gargantuan statue (my take on the Rune Giants) that I'll hopefully be able to show before and after it comes to life. One of my favorite games is Shadows of the Colossus. I'd love to see that in a game. I would not have the attack on Sandpoint. It never made sense to me how the giants sneaked all the way down there and how the party got there in time. I don't think it really adds to anything. As far as XP goes. I've always told my players that I'm starting on the fast XP track and then switching to the medium. This is one of the reasons why. Besides I give out XP honestly, but I'm aware of the effects, if I have to gimp on XP so that the story doesn't get off track the players will understand. As long as I let them know that's what I'm doing. With most of my players the story comes first and we've all been in the games where the characters got too powerful too fast. That said I know I'm going to have to increase some of the threats power levels latter on. Hopefully it won't be too hard to do.

3: Many people have befriended Foxglove. Both Bumpus and Mannis are on fine terms with him, Bumpus because he seems to honestly like him and Mannis because he thinks he can make money off him. Because of this I'm actually trying to make him likable, just a coward. Right now I'm considering (no I'm actually doing this, the consideration stage is over) taking a radical departure from the story and hiring Mannis to temporarily leave the party. While the rest of the party is in the Catacombs of Wrath, Foxglove will take him and Rogors Crasby (Foxglove's assistant) to Foxglove Manor. Then I can have Mannis use a pick to break into the subbasement. Give Crasby a torch and the three go down. A few undead giant spiders, have Crasby drop the torch, a little complete darkness in a cave with undead monsters and I think I can get Mannis out of there but have him and the rest get separated. And knowing his CN self, I have a hard time seeing him go back to save them. If that does happen when Mannis gets Foxglove, Aldren will go straight to Vorel's lab and I want to have undead on his tail and have Foxglove slam the door in his face. By the time Mannis has killed off the undead (assuming he can) he will hear the sounds of screams inside and the door will be locked. I'm thinking at this point Mannis has no choice but to leave or die. I've warned the player that if he takes me up on an away from the party side quest it will be awesome but super deadly. He's really excited for it. I'll skip from scene to scene, both so that player knowledge of Foxglove Manor is lessened, no detailed map, but also to prevent any of the other players to get bored during the fighting. That or I might let them play undead creatures. That's fun but without a lot of control of the creatures I might get Mannis killed.

4: I've already brought the idea of the Sandpoint Devil in, but used it as a joke. During the Festival I had Farmer Grump give his observations on the devil as, "You shouldn't mock the SANDPOINT DEVIL. A demon that runs off with yer poultry is nothing to be laughed at!" It got a big laugh. To try and turn it into a threat at this point would be difficult. If I had only thought of that before the first game...

My Rise of the Runelords campaign thus far.

I’ve got seven players, but thus far only six have attended sessions. As such I wanted to make certain that I had a challenge for each of them.

First off I altered character creation a tad bit. I asked people to first choose a background that would tie them in more to the story. This is what I gave the players before they made characters.

Character Origins

Character 1: This character is attached to a newly constructed temple in the city of Sandpoint. This character can be a cleric or paladin of one of six gods in the temple or a druid, or you could be a worker, any character that has taken Craft: Stone-masonry. You have only been in the city for less than a year, so there are a lot of mysteries that you are still uncertain of, including the exact reason for the destruction of the last temple. This character can be any class, but works best as any of the Divine classes.

The Temple has shrines and head clerics (no higher than 4th Level NPC's) for these gods: Desna, CG Goddess of Dreams, Stars, Travel, and Luck. This Goddess is extremely important to the native Varisians. Abadar LN God of Cities, Wealth, Merchants, and Law. Sarenrae NG Goddess of the Sun, Redemption, Honesty, and Healing. Shelyn NG Goddess of Beauty, Art, Love, and Music. Gozreh N Deity of Nature, Weather, and the Sea. Erastil LG God of Farming, Hunting, Trade, and Family.

Character 2: This character is a scholar. He must have Knowledge History. This character is from a larger city called Magnimar, second largest city in Varisia. This character comes from a very rich and politically powerful family. The expectation of the family was that their son/daughter would become an aristocrat and merchant, instead this character became fascinated with the monuments of the city and now seeks out ancient runes. The character has come to the town of Sandpoint both to explore the Old Light, a broken light house that was built in the time of the empires of old. This character should be a Bard, Monk, Cleric, or Wizard.

Character 3: This character is a traveler. This character comes from the very small town of Turtleback Ferry, located far from Sandpoint in the ogre and giant infested Hook Mountain Range. The character is a failed member a group of rangers and hunters known as the Black Arrows. The character spent their youth in Fort Rannick, the castle that houses the Black Arrows. For reason that we will have to figure out, the character is no longer connected to the Arrows and is now a traveler, perhaps a mercenary for hire, working as a caravan guard that has recently come to the town of Sandpoint, or something to that effect. This character needs to be willing to help others in need. This character works best as a Ranger or Fighter, but could also be a Rogue, Barbarian, or even a Sorcerer.

Character 4: This character has the most specific origin. A native Varisian human born into a member of a criminal organization known as the Sczarni, a mafia style crime family all over Varisia. This particular branch of the Sczarni were located in the city of Riddleport. This character's mother was the leader of her gang, and his/her father was one of her many lovers, the exact father is unknown. This character was raised within the organization and so has some amount of understanding of the criminal world. Five years ago something happened leaving most of the gang dead, the character scarred and missing one eye, and with the knowledge of who caused the destruction of his gang: his/her mother. Riddleport and most Sczani gangs do not treat the character very well, the stigma of what the mother has done follows him/her around where ever the character goes. The only exception is his cousin Jubrayl, who runs a gang in the small town of Sandpoint.

Character 5: This character has grown up in Sandpoint their whole life. Family is most likely made up of fishermen or farmers. You would know most of the semi secrets of the town, but not all of them. You still have memories/nightmares about Chopper, the serial killer that haunted the town in your youth. Now you crave adventure and to do something important with your life. You have considered joining the town militia, but you haven't done so yet. Any Class is fine with this origin.

Character 6: Something interesting that ends with you going to Sandpoint, if for no other reason than a festival.

I posted the group in the rooster thread, but here they are again:

Option 1: Kelvin Mason, Human Cleric of Nomus (God created by player) Nomus is an ancient god from Varisian past. A God of Strength and Craft. His designs will appear all through out the game in ancient Thassilon ruins. Kelvin was born in the town of Ravenmoor. His god exists and travels on the Material plane and Kelvin spent years as his apprentice. I plan to use flashbacks of this time with him to show areas of Varisa that are difficult to show off. Definitely I want to have at least two moments at Rimeskull to better set up Runeforge later on. A riddle with no way for a player to solve always seemed lame to me, by showing the location a few times he might be able to get the riddle without rolling a knowledge check. That’s my hope at least.

Option 2: Bumpus Windsong, Halfling Bard. Pretty much exactly what the option stated. His father, Waylan Windsong is a rich merchant and member of the Council of Ushers in Magnimar. Waylan will become more important in the second book. I haven’t decided what I’ll do quite yet. At least a kidnapping if not more.

Option 3: Fletcher Greene, Human Ranger. This player’s rolls were some of the best I’ve ever seen. Two 13’s and the rest were 17 and 18’s. Amazing. Sadly his poor d20 rolls have shown that high stats aren’t always enough to be effective at level 1. His background is really neat and I’m really looking forward to how it will play out. The idea he had was that he committed some crime (perhaps he did it or maybe framed) and now he’s on the run. He’s left the details up to me. I’ll have to use a lot of flashbacks to make this work. Right now I’m thinking that he discovers part of the truth of the Paradise. Maybe he discovers that the owner is evil and tries to kill her. Not sure but something like this. I definitely want to have a trial. I’m thinking it will happen in Turtleback Ferry and that’s what brings them into Book 3.

Option 4: Mannis Malocci, Human Fighter. This character is based on a NPC in Book 6. I want the Champion of Shalast to have a much bigger part. Some of my ideas include a trip after Book 2 to Kaga Maer to track down rumors of the swords of sin. He’ll find out in Magnimar that it was there that his mother found her golden sword. Later on in my major change to Book 4 (the weak link in the story for me) she will be a leader in the Army of Jorgenfist.

Option 5: Pad Pelton, Human Rogue. Young farm boy turned adventurer. He really wanted to be a victim of Chopper, someone who was supposed to get killed but somehow survived. We’ve already had one creepy flashback moment. His story is going to hopefully really add to all the horror aspects to the campaign. In my third session I had a ghost story involving his dead brother and a trickster spirit that was feeding off all the negative energy.

Option 6: Alister Wise, Human Sorcerer. A spy and bodyguard hired by Waylan Windsong to watch over his son. Don’t know much more about this character. The player and I have to get together and talk more.

The game thus far:

First major change was that I added some games and festival moments before the attack. We spent most of the first game just role playing, which was a lot of fun. One of the best roll playing sections was an arena style cage match between Pad and his two NPC best friends and three NPC ‘bad guys’ named the Bugun Brothers. I had each of the players play an NPC. All six going at it with crappy warrior stats. No tactics just fighting. Very silly and a lot of fun. It was a really effective first fight. One of my players is playing d20 for the first time so this game had an aspect of training to it.

During the festival I introduced Aldren Foxglove, the young boy Aeron and his dog Petal, and even a moment with Orik. Admittedly Orik was unnamed. A giant tower shield in the shape of a face is pretty noticeable.

One big change I made to the game is that I had an NPC cleric named Sister Lynn that has a small shrine dedicated to Father Tobyn and his daughter. In my mind she was in love with him. During the fight with the goblins the human villains (Orik, Naulia, and Lyrie) travel to Sister Lynn’s and kill her to gain the artifacts of Tobyn. As fate would have it the only person to both make his perception roll and be close enough to hear the disturbance in the temple’s residence house was Mannis, who had seen Orik earlier. The two almost killed each other in a small hallway before they decided that neither of them would gain anything from each other’s death. Great little moment.

Due to the high numbers and power levels of the characters I had to increase the numbers of goblins significantly. They still destroyed them fairly easily. I increase the number of normal goblins by two and added a couple of better than normal goblins, including a smart Goblin Fighter/Rogue, consistently annoyed by his stupid cousins. As it turned out the rest of the goblins got killed off so fast he fled the battle. The players thought he added a lot to the fight. Highlights of the fight included the bard summoning a pony on top of the goblin warchanter. The player (the one that has never played dnd before) had no clue as to the goblin’s insane fear of horses and I had them all panic and lose an action. I admit that did make the fight much easier, but I think it was worth it. I tried to add Bruthazmus in a significant way by placing him and a goblin archer on a rooftop during Die Dog Die, but the party killed off all the goblins and goblin dogs so quickly I had him take the better part of valor. (I added two more dogs and an extra warchanter to the fight). Now he’s pissed and wants revenge.

The next two games focused on the town and some character development. I did these games because I wasn’t going to have a full party for them and people still wanted to get together.

Session 2
Mannis gets hired by Jubrayl to get rid of some thugs from Magnimar that are using the chaos after the attack to muscle in on his territory. The group is known as the Pale Dogs, and for those who know Ptolus they are based on Toridan Cran’s low level gang in the mini adventures in the back of the book. My Fighter, Ranger, Cleric, and Bard destroyed the gang with ease. I need to really pull out the nasty on these PCs, they’re really difficult to harm. But even still I almost killed the Fighter twice.

I also included the first of many mysteries. I had the party find out that two graves had been disturbed in the attack, Father Toybn’s and his adopted daughter’s. I also let them know that Goblins had been seen coming out of wagons placed around town. I put sand and different types of minerals such as tin and cobalt in the wagons as well.

I also started to have the party hear rumors of an army of monsters in the Storval Plateau. As the game continues I really want to play up Jorgenfist and their leader known as the Rune Master. My players already know the name of the adventure, I figure why not use some subterfuge and misdirection.

Session 3
Only had the rogue and the ranger for this one. I started the game with a flashback of the Ranger, Fletcher Greene’s life. I’m going to do my best to flashback on each game giving more details on past events. I figure there is so much concern in this game on the past, it only makes sense. I had Fletcher and his best friend, Elon on the shore of the Claybottom Lake looking over at Paradise. Elon convinces Fletcher to enter the boat and to help him find evidence of wrong doing. The two move towards the boat and we flash to the present. I focused the main plot of the night on the rogue, a local boy who’s sister has been unwell for a while now. He notices that his bed ridden sister has dirty feet and asks her if she’s been outside to which she says no. He spends the next day training with the ranger, learning skills on how to fight. During the first session he purposely played the character like a commoner, very few combat skills and knowledge. The two continue to look into the mystery of how the goblins got into town and I make sure they know that Sheriff Hemlock has sent out for assistance from Magnimar.

The next day the rogue Pad discovers mud on his sister’s feet and so he decides to watch her on the next night. While he’s waiting he returns to town and I had the two players do the Monster in the Closet. Very effective and gross. They didn’t kill this goblin and so they took him to the Turandarok Academy. I really played up the mad scientist role for Isoari. During the course of this game we jumped around in time, getting to a week after the Festival by this point in the story. So the night that Pad wants to watch his sister’s activities the Magnimar forces come to town. But it’s not what the Sheriff was thinking of, the reinforcements are thirty Order of the Nail Hellknights. I know that their presence in Magnimar is supposed to be small, but I wanted them in the story. At any rate that night Pad’s sister is possessed by some strange force to travel back to Sandpoint (as a farmer I had Pad house two miles from town). Pad tries to stop her but can’t and figures that since she’s following main road maybe he can get to town first and get aid. The Hellknight at the gate will not let him pass. Now Pad has to sneak into town and get past Hellknight patrols to get aid. By the time that he and Fletcher get back to the main gate, Pad’s sister has already killed a guard and knocked another unconscious. The ranger is able to find her tracks and they follow her to Chopper’s Isle.

The two of them enter a spooky underground lair where I have Pad revisit the location from his flashback, showing him a few glimpses of what he went through in the past. Since the player doesn’t know everything that happened to him this scene was foreshadowing future flashbacks, which is very strange and I love it. I decided that Chopper had at least eight other victims that were never found, including Pad’s little brother. Pad and Fletcher discover a secret passage that leads to an ancient cavern. Lot of collapsed sections of buildings and an old nearly broken runewell. Lots of undead fights and a variant version on the Attic Whisper with Pad’s brothers voice. Very creepy, very fun. I ended it with the runewell waking up and having the two see a strange communication between a black skinned creature (Erylium) and a figure in a fox mask (Nualia in a priest’s mask). The two were speaking Abyssal, a language that neither player can understand. I’m really trying to play up the communication aspect of the runewell. Also I feel that it introduces two villains early without harming the plot or the characters.

That it for now, I’ll post up more as well go.

Here are some Ideas for the future:
-the Boar Hunt. Highly extended. Bruthazmus and a group of Goblin Rangers stick outside the town waiting to find the PC’s. They follow them to Tickwood and ambush them. I’m going to try my best to play up the fear factor of the bugbear.

-The Jorgenfist Army. I want to combine Part 4 with the Red Hand of Doom. I think the Red Hand is the best dnd war story I’ve ever read and I really think that Jorgenfist needs to leave the fortress. My idea is that the army is here to pave the way for the new regime. They will concur Varisa for their lord and master. That just makes more sense to me than just sitting around waiting to be killed.

-a few others not worth posting right now.

Thoughts and suggestions are welcome. Thanks.

Played the first session last night. Much fun was had by all. For the record I worked with the players to come up with origins that would tie into the story as best I could. Note players of my game or any other shouldn't read the spoilers, I give stuff away.

Kelvin Mason, CG Human Cleric of Nomus
Nomus is a homebrew god that the player created. Pretty much he's an old God that hasn't had many followers since the fall of the Thassilon Empire. The idea is that his God is more of a minor deity focused on crafting and strength. Nomus isn't as powerful as a major deity, but he's more involved in his followers lives. Kelvin comes to Sandpoint to help build the Temple.

Bumpus Windsong, CG Halfling Bard
This extremely likable performer is the son of a rich merchant from Magnimar. His interest in ancient history leads him to Sandpoint and Brodert Quink. His father is a member of the Council of Ushers.

"Pad" Pelton NG Human Rogue
Farm boy with a heart of gold. Raised in Sandpoint and one of the few people that survived Chopper. In my version of Chopper he kidnapped people and then killed them and placed body parts in the town. Pad was supposed to be his last victim.

Fletcher Greene NG Human Ranger
A traveler from Turtleback Ferry. He grew up idolizing the Black Arrows, but was unable to join them. He was simply wandering from place to place and found himself in Sandpoint on the day of the Shallowtail Festival.

Alister Wise LN Half Elf Sorcerer
An agent of the Council of Ushers in Magnimar. He has been sent by Waylan Windsong to watch over and protect Waylan's son, Bumpus. Pretty much he's a spy and a bodyguard.

Mannis Malocci CN Human Fighter
Originally from Riddleport, Mannis is a traveler who spent a few years in the Storval Plateau and is now staying with his cousin Jubrayl in Sandpoint. Most people don't know that his mother was the leader of the Sczani gang in Riddleport until she went crazy and killed most of the gang. Mannis lost an eye and gained a large scar down the side of his face that night.

???? Half Orc Monk
Hasn't played yet. No idea on back story.

It is almost as if you knew somehow that I am starting a Rise of the Runelords game next Sunday. I had actually started work on my own paper minis, much of which looked terrible, but I had fun doing them. I'm glad to see you guys are producing minis again. The HellKnights pack is really awesome.

I really like the Sinspawn and Bruthazmus minis on this one. Very nice. I have to admit I wanted a Tsuto, but Lyrie's cat made it all worth it.

Please keep doing the Runelords AP. It seems like enough people are still playing it to make it a worth while endeavor.

What about something from the Adventure Paths, like a Rune Giant?

Awesome.

Thanks Hank. I plan to buy it as soon as it gets to my RPG store.

I have to admit that I haven't been as excited over the release of an RPG in a long time. I have EarthDawn Players Compendium on PDF but I really want to get the 3rd Edition.

Questions and Concerns for anyone who can answer. One of things I've loved about the EPC is the amount of customization that wasn't really available back when I played 1st Edition. And the amount of detail on each discipline. And I understand that in 3rd Ed they will be splitting up the Compendium into two books, so something might be coming later.

Will all the options currently available make it to 3rd Ed? By that I mean Talent Knacks, Blood Magic, Questors, Extra Skills at creation, and so forth? I know that the Talent Option concept is in the main book, which sounds great. Anything else?

Do you think that older edition material, NPC's, Magic items, skills, Talents, so forth could be used in this edition?

Also it seems based on some of the things I've read that there might be a push to make the system more like dnd, more maps, simpler item creation, and so forth. If this is so, would you say it is more like 2nd Ed, 3rd Ed, or 4th Ed? In other words, how much of a board game is it looking like?

That's about all for now.

Thanks in advance.

A set of Rayhan's Villa sounds like a great first step.

From most important to least (In my opinion)

Last Option: Make two sets. One for the first half and going into Rayhan's Villa, one that covers the last half of the story. Bigger story, more minis. Seems fair and would maybe work on later even bigger chapters to come.

Hmm.

L5R (and the new Legends of the Burning Sands, which I might like better)

7th Seas Specific Time period and setting, but so much fun it doesn't matter. This is one of my favorite games ever.

Fantasy Hero (Hero System) Perhaps too complicated.

Palladium Fantasy

Exalted

The new Fire and Ice looks interesting, but I haven't played it yet.

Mouse Guard! But mainly because who doesn't want to play bad ass mice?

Burning Wheel

Note: someone asked for a description of this system not too long ago, here's the quick sum up. Uses D6 dice pools where 1-3 is a failure and 4-6 is a success. Magic weapons and supernatural creatures might roll 1-2 Failure and 3-6 Success. Great (but complex) fighting rules and one of the greatest character creation systems out there. My complaints on the system is that it might be too complex for my group of players.

The PDQ system games like Swashbucklers of the Seven Skies. Simple but effective.

Talislanta is really neat.

Houses of the Blooded. It's really different and maybe too complex for some people's taste, but it's awesome. Lots of group storytelling where the players get involved with the running of the game. Combat is fairly deadly, and you should never get into a large battle, only one on one duels. But the game is one of a kind. The PDF was only $5 not too long ago, check it out. It's worth just reading even if you never play it.

My only complaint on Earthdawn is that I really like skills and rogues, but in this game everything comes down to magic. My thief doesn't move silently, he use magic to hover off the ground just enough to move silently. This really bothered me whenever we played it. I've been playing Exalted enough that it might not bother me now. I am interested in this 3rd Edition though. hmm.

That's all I can think of for now.

Artesia is really interesting and balanced. The system is based on the Fusion system, so if you look at games like Sengoku (awesome Samurai game) or Cyberpunk you might find some interesting system information. The only major difference is in the damage and experience points. For the story world, just read the comic. It's really great.

Oh and by the way, Mouse Guard is published by the same comic company, but uses a very different system. It uses the Burning Wheel.

I think if more people had bought the book a few years ago, maybe more product support would have come out, they certainly wanted to make more books. But at this point I'd be shocked to see another Artesia book.

I don't have a major problem with Prestige Classes, but I find they work best when they show specialized knowledge but don't radically change the character.

For example my favorite Prestige Classes include just about every thing in Swashbuckling Adventures, Spycraft, and D20 Modern. The base classes are fine in these games, but they're designed to be very generic. The Prestige classes in these books are fairly easy to get, aren't that powerful, and give definition to the characters.

In swashbuckling adventures there are some prestige classes that are actually fighting styles. So instead of being a fighter, you're a fighter with 3 levels of Aldana fighting style.

And I agree that there are too many prestige classes out there, but so many of them are so specific that I'm not sure if it matters.

The only problem I had with Prestige classes were for Clerics and Wizards in 3 Ed. Mainly because those classes don't really change after level 1. Sure more spells and a bonus feat every so often, but deep down no change. So the only disadvantage of taking a Prestige Class was the loss of maybe one level of spells. And most of the time the classes were really random, Blood Mage I'm looking at you.

But Pathfinder, by working on the Base classes has I think fixed that. Now you have more reasons to stay with the Base Class and every time you take a level of a Prestige you have to weigh the pros and cons.

Just my 2 pennies

I just got this, and I haven't even printed anything out, but I can tell you what it comes with and maybe it'll be enough for you to make your decision.

Three forms of currency, Dwarven, Elven, Human

Dwarven: 1 CP, 1 SP, 1 GP, 1PP

Elven: Interesting coinage, one coin worth 8 SP and and one worth 8 GP that can be split into 8 pieces.

Human: 1CP, 2CP 3CP, 5CP, 1SP, 5SP, 1GP, 5GP, 1PP, 5PP, 10PP
And fake versions as well.

And a treasure chest to hold everything.

Each page has a different amount of coins on it, but the small amounts, such as copper have about 20 coins per sheet, some of the larger amounts such gold coins have about 8-10 per sheet.

So yeah to get say 10000 gold it would be a lot of printing, but I don't think anyone would ever want to do that. Having enough coinage to represent different cultures seems good enough to me. Personally I plan to make maybe thirty of each type, so one sheet of copper, and maybe three sheets of gold. And if I feel I need more, I'll print them out later.

Hope this helps

I spent part of my day off working on these minis. So much fun. Between this and World works games, I'm getting pretty good at paper crafting, something I never thought I'd say.

Another success. Ghartok, The Carrion King looks freaking awesome.

You know I was thinking, an idea you could do if you had interest is making minis of the NPC's that are in the books but not part of the plot, such as Fayar on page 63 of House of the Beast. Or characters that show up in Dark Markets (like the awesome looking half orc on page 16) or the Guide to Korvosa.

That way players could use them for their characters and DM's would have more reason to bring these NPC's into the plots somehow.

At any rate, great job on this one. Hope PaizoCon was fun. Maybe I'll come next year when I'm less busy and more wealthy.

That is really great. I'm hoping to run this story sometime after summer, and I'll find a way to get these in there somewhere. You do the others and I'll try to use them as well.

Great job. They sound awesome.

Personally speaking I think the idea of paper minis for PC's is a good one, but ultimately you will never be able to create the exact look a PC will want. I do think doing a series based on the Pathfinder line would be really smart.

Pathfinder Adventure Paths are the obvious place to start and I know you've already thinking about that with Varisans, but creating a random set of generic heroes for Legacy of Fire would be really helpful, both for PC's and NPC's.

I think you could also take a look at what kind of characters might show up in Riddleport or Korvosa and create a set based on them.

Then you could look towards the Companion and Chronicle books, the Pathfinder Elves, Darkmoon Vale, Osirian, Katapesh, Cheliax (HellKnights!!) and so forth.

I only say this because you could have a class based set, but a fighter playing Rise of the Runelords would look very different than one playing Legacy of Fire.

Ultimately you have a lot of options to choose from, so have fun and keep us posted.

Also I'm sending you a friend request because I love facebook.

These products are the best. I check in every few days just to see if you've got any new ones. Simple to make, make as many as you want, and they look great. Much better than metal minis. Way to go.

Another successful product. You guys are great. I can't wait to get a chance to use these.

Keep making em, I'll keep buying em.

Eh, I think the pricing is fine. It's really not that much and the added value of what these products could bring to a game is too much to pass up. Only problem I can see is my players wanting a paper mini of their specific character as well.

And look at it this way. Buy one mini in the store, that's going to cost around $7.00. And you still have to paint them. Here I can get my entire Gnoll needs in a fun and unique way with out having to track down a ton of Gnoll minis that would end up costing me way more than I ever wanted to pay.

Keep it up. We'll be there for you.

Better than I was expecting. These are going to blow my players away. Between this and Worldworks games, it's a lot of printing, but man this is going to be worth it. Great job.

Wow. Those are great. Awesome. Make more, I'll give you more money.

I've been silently watching this for some time now. Your work is really awesome.

This is just another reason why Paizo is by far my favorite company right now. Can you imagine a place like Wizards discovering a forum member and working on paper minis with them?

Way to go everyone involved. Just let us know when we can give you our money.

Well, there's about 20-30 page that detail the Noble Houses and Lands, with game effects. And certainly the concept is that everyone play a member of the noble house, to help tell the story.

There could be more details on exactly how you can center the plots of your adventures on a noble house. I'm thinking futer books might go into more details. This book focuses more on the system and how the rules work: combat, weapon damage, poison, warfare, social combat, ect. And for what it is, it's pretty darn good.

If you're really interested in your character playing nobles, you might want to check out Houses of the Blooded. I will admit that it's a strange game. Lots of dark fantasy. But there is a mechanic that handles land management and retainers that is really neat. It even takes into account other nobles turning your retainers into traitous spies.

Check it out. Pretty cool.

The PDF is still only $5

Houses of the Blooded

I just got this book the other day. It's interesting. At first I was put off by the amount of pure crunch in the book. Most of the book is just the system, and I just felt at first that there was no personality to the book and game itself.

However, upon further reading I found that the system does a really good job of creating a situations that could and do appear in the books. Combat is highly dangerous, yet there are safety nets that allow you to avoid certain death. So one hit good hit could kill you. And you could also survive a drop from a very high building. I won't give away the mechanics, but I will say it's really clever. And the focus on creating and managing your Noble House is really neat and very much part of the book.

Thus far, I'm enjoying reading this. Now to see if I can get a chance to actually play the system.

Well I guess the most important thing would be to give them reasons to be at the Swallowtail Festival and then feel the need to stick around and protect the city.

I haven't put too much thought into it. Just think it might be a cool idea.

After reading the beginnings of Second Darkness, it made me wonder if there wasn't some way to bring the Character Traits idea into Runelords. Six or so traits that force players to get involved in the plot. Maybe one that has something to do with the Late Unpleasantness, another with the newly formed church.

Has anyone done any work on this?

Thanks.

My problem with always came down to I stab you, then punch you, then stab you. So now you have both lethal and non lethal damage. If you go into negatives, are you dead, or do you only get knocked out, do I have to additional damage equal to the non lethal damage to kill you? What happens? It's probably in a rule book somewhere, but I've never really took the time to look it up.

I liked a rule I read somewhere, maybe Spycraft 2, where non lethal damage caused a fort save and could knock you out, but never adjusted your hit points.

Laters,

Mike

The problemis that the system is so connected to the game. Other magic systems, such as Rifts or Shadowrun, tend to have fewer spells and the major differences between two spell casters isn't the number of spells they cast, but what spells they can choose and the other abilities they have.

Changing the way the Vancian system works also changes the relationship between the Wizard and the Sorcerer, so any ideas we have have to address this as well. That is going to take space and details.

So if this could be something that got an entire page or two, it has merit. If not then it might be a waste of time.

One option that is still the Vancian system that might work is to change the rules as such: First the Spells per Day and Spells Known charts do not change. A Sorcerer cast exactly the same way as always. A Wizard can cast any spell he knows in his Spell book, just like a Sorcerer. So they can cast the exact same way, but the Wizard has fewer per day, but more choices. To balance things out, the wizard takes a Full Round Action to cast any spell, this is so he can flip though pages and find the right spell or some such. If this isn't enough of a drawback, it could always take longer, say two rounds to cast a spell. Maybe a Specialist casts his Schools spells faster, I don't know.

The advantage would be not having to memorize spells in the morning and could always pull out the right spell at the right time. However, the increase in options could slow down combat, as every round the wizard might have twenty spells to think about before casting a spell. That's another reason to make the wizard take 2 rounds to cast a spell, gives the player time to figure out what to do.

Now I'm going to say this as well, I actually never had a problem with the Vancian system, but I like trying to figure out alternate ideas.

I'm all for giving the Druid the option of a Healing Domain, but I'd make it part of the list and let the player choose. And personally, I'd keep the Druid's ability to cast summon spells. We have to remember, it's not that the Druid's job should be the healer of the party, his job is to be the Pets guy. Summons, Shape Change, Companions. We just want him to be more effective as a healer. That way you could have a Druid and a Cleric in the same party and not feel like you were stepping on each others toes.

My suggestion would be to create a new ability Called Nature's Touch or some such. A number of times per day equal to the Druid's Wis Mod he gains the ability to heal D6 points of healing to any creature he touches. This healing increases an additional D6 every 2 Druid levels he takes. So 2d6 at 3rd level, 3D6 at 5th, and so on.

This is the same mechanic as Channel Postive, but can only effect one target. This way it will mean he can free up some spell slots and still heal, but never as effectively as the Cleric.

Just a thought.

And for the record, I've never like Non-Lethal damage mechanic in this game, I find it mildly confusing and would suggest not increasing it's presense. Outside of that, it's not a bad idea and if others liked it, I'd not object.

Monte Cook did something in Arcana Evolved, which is one of my most favorite systems, but that's not the point. It was a Vancian system, sort of. First off he created a lesser powered and a higher powered version of each spell so that you could cast the 2nd level spell as 1st, 2nd, or 3rd level of effect. To me it made all the spells seem a little more useful. But sadly that would require too much change. What wouldn't is that he also made a list of Spells Readied and Spells per day. In this he made all spell casters both Wizards, Sorcerers and Clerics in the way they worked.

You choose a list of spells that are your Spells Readied, much like the Spells Known list for a Bard or Sorcerer. However you can choose any spell available to you, like the Cleric. Once you have your Spell Ready List, you can cast them a number of times per day based on your level, just like a Sorcerer. However, the big difference is that as long as you have an hour of time and spell books on hand, you can always change your Spells Readied List, much like a Wizard.

I'm not sure how we could use this idea, or even if this is anywhere close to what other people are looking for, but the ability to change the wizards spells mid day is really nice.

Another option would be to take a look at Arc Magicus or Talislanta, both of which do not use a Vancian system at all, but could be replaced entirely with the current system without affecting the rest of gameplay that much. Such a radical change Could never be just a sidebar, it might require at least a chapter. Or maybe a book of magic or something.

I don't know, hope this helps.

I have to admit that I like the idea of not having to depend on the Cleric for healing, but I would like to focus only on the Druid. I like the Bard as is.

First thing I would do for the Druid is give him a choice of the nature based Domains, and include Healing. But I would allow him to also have his companion, since that's a part of being a Druid to me. Maybe take a look at the Arcane Evolved Greenbond, who could cast Cure Light Wounds a number of times equal to his WIS mod per day as a class ability. Less impressive than Channel Positive, but would help.

They all sound like good characters, ones that are based in the world and had some thought behind them, my concerns just from reading posts from a couple of DM's on this site is that Runelords has moments where the only real motivation is to stop evil and help the innocent.

Your paladin should eat this up, but the two neutral characters might have to be given something else to work with. I straight up told my players that only one of them could be Neutral, and that the game is designed for heroes, for the sake of having fun, make characters that are, or if push comes to shove, can become heroes. They had no problem with this.

The big problem moments that effected other games seem to be in the Skinsaw Murders (when the party leaves town) and the entire set up of Hook Mountain. There have been a number of thread that mention ways to deal with them, but mostly it comes down to what you think will motivate your players. Money? a friend in need? Revenge? Whatever.

The only other thing I can think of is to give them all good reasons for coming to Sandpoint to begin with. Maybe giving them a couple of ideas and asking them why they are showing up for the festival.

According to Pathfinder, Spell Like Abilities work just like normal spells except they have no Verbal, Somatic, Material, or Focus. So it's more like psionics.

I don't know if that's how it works in 3.5 or not, but that's the way my group always thought it was supposed to work.

Have fun playing and certainly tell us how it goes.

Sorry if I offended anyone. Jeez. I was trying to be helpful. I might regret sending this post, but oh well. I go back to work full time next week, so my ability to read and respond to these things is limited.

This long is a one, so I’m spoilering it for those who don’t care to read it. It’s mainly for the OP.

At any rate, I felt the need to react to the negativity created by my last post. It’s out of my system now. Sorry. Hopefully this one won’t have the same effect, but I’m fairly certain it will.

A couple of things to think about. Most everything you guys are talking about has already been done in 3.5, and since Pathfinder is backwards compatible there is no reason to not use these fixes. They aren’t perfect, but they will help. Most of these come from Feats, and the increase in feats per character will make getting some of these more doable.

Increase Smite Damage: Use the feat from Complete Divine, Improved Smiting. It increases damage +1d6 and ignores DR. Not insanely powerful, but at 1st level it would bring a longsword (with let’s say Str 16, Charisma 14) up to +6 to hit and doing 1d8+4 +1d6 damage minimum 6 points and maximum 18 points. Much better than d8 +4

Add to that the old Smite Evil/Power Attack Combo. Negate the Power Attack by your Charisma bonus each time you use it. Sure you get no increase to hit, but the increase in damage should help.

By 4th level you could do the Smite Evil/Power Attack/Divine Might combo: Additional -1 to hit but a +d6+9 to damage. And that’s with a 14 Charisma and a one handed weapon.

Extra Smiting (Complete Warrior) increases the number of times per day you can Smite by 2. You can’t take this one until 4th level.

Increase Healing: Extra Lay on Hands brings up the number of times you can use the ability but there isn’t anything I know to increase the amount. However, even without any feats, you can use this a goodly number of times per day anyways. And yeah at 2nd level it sort of sucks, but you aren’t a Cleric. End of story. You can still heal people 6 hit points a day (Chr 14), better than any fighter.

Once you get up a few levels you radically change though. At 4th level you get Channel Positive Energy (at least 2 times a day) and 1 spell (Cure Light D8+4). You can take Extra Turning to increase the number of times to use this. Not as impressive as a Cleric, but again you’re not a Cleric. And by this point your Lay on Hands is healing 4 points each use.

Working with a Cleric/Bard you can use Sacred Boost to maximize any healing spells cast with in a round.

By 5th Level you can take Sacred Healing (Complete Divine) Fast Healing 3 for the party for rounds equal to Chr bonus.

General Feats to increase the Paladin (all from Complete Warrior) There are others, but these are my favorites.

Divine Might: Chr bonus to damage
Divine Shield: Chr bonus to AC
Divine Vigor: +2 temp hit points per level and +10’ to speed
Sacred Vengeance: +2d6 damage to all attacks in one round to against undead.

Now none of these are perfect, but they do help.

Oh, here's one thing.

Well it's been mentioned in a few threads, some people moved Rannick closer to Sandpoint and loved it. I personally think that the travel is an interesting aspect to the story. A cool idea someone had was to use enchanted forests around turtleback to travel back to sandpoint area easily. If you did this you could alter the ending of Hook and have them rush to the aid of Sandpoint right at the end of the adventure.

First off, over the next little bit, use down time in the game to talk about the other areas in Varisa, make people think about life outside the town, it'll make people more willing to go if you already excited them about other places. Go ahead and mention the Ogres in Hook Mountain, it'll be many sessions before they ever have to go there.

What's the background of your players? Do you think you can come up with ideas on how to get them personally involved with any of the plots, such as family in Magnimar, or somesuch?

One of the things I want to do the next time I run Skinsaw is alter the events a little. Have less information for the party during the first murder, make it so they can't figure it out until a few murders in. Maybe a cool chase scene as they foul an attempted murder, something. It'll hopefully make tracking down the skinsaw man that much more important, and keeps you in Sandpoint a little longer. Also, I'm going to find a way to logically have the skinsaw man speak to the party while they're in the manor, some sort of disembodied voice where certain rooms get different personalities. It'll give you time to let slip any info about magnimar and makes the house more player involved, someone just wrote that they felt that it was just a bunch of traps and their players hated it.

I mentioned this to someone else who had troubles with this section, play up the connections between the murder victims, maybe the skinsaw man starts leaving a list of who he's killed behind or even tells you who his next victim is. The point is that Skinsaw is targeting people. And the players know this. But they don't know why he's going after these particular people. Then when they find the note (or alter it and leave a list of people to be killed off in the house) they will hopefully care that Skinsaw was sent by and working for someone else.

If this isn't enough to get them to go to Magnimar, don't force it. Let a few days go by and then send another killer out, this time just a skinsaw cultist. Or have someone come down and ask for help. The two cities are close enough that if they had similiar killings going on they might know about this. The Sheriff tells the party that this is just the tip of the iceburg as it were. If that's not enough, do a little side quest, something like Kobold King and jump to Hook Mountain.

You know your players better than anyone, what kind of stories do they like? If sending them to Tuttleback on official business isn't good enough, what about some NPC they like and trust asking them to help them make the trip to sell something or the like. You could use (female elven ranger, tired can't remember how to spell name) and play up her father, or cut that out entirely and just use a merchant. Or maybe if you have a ranger in the party, they once spent time with the Black Arrows, heck alter the story a bit and have one the PC's father stationed at Rannick. You've got the time to set that up.

If the players get into Skinsaw and you think you cna pull it off, how about trying to place evidence that the two Lamia Matriarchs are in communication somehow and the party finds out that the town is in danger. That way its a direct tie in and not two missions.

Once you've done that, the rest of the story goes pretty smoothly, except finding the runeforge, but that's a while down the line. I'm tired, can't think of anything else to say.

That's a really neat take on the Paladin. Good job.

I really like the Lay on Hands Points. I have no complaints with point based features.

My only thought was that with Smite taking the spells that the Paladin used to get, he loses out on the flexability of a large spell list. Maybe instead of gaining the ability to cast just Dispel Evil at a certain level, he can use Smite to cast any 4th spell in the paladin spell list.

Just a thought.

So here's the skinny on BOXM II

228 fighter themed feats.

Each one with a Bonus Fighter Upgrade, meaning if you used a Bonus Fighter Feat to gain the feat, it gets better after a certain level.

Each one with a Feat Boost ability. Fighters automatically get a certain number of Feat Boost Points (for lack of a better term) based on level, non-fighters can take a feat to get a boost point. Then you can use the Boost to gain a special ability from your feat. You can only do this on one particular feat once a day.

Double Feats: More impressive feats that require the fighter to use two feats at the same time to get (in BOXM every class gets a feat every level, so any level you get a Bonus Feat, you get two feats)

Uberfeats (silly name, maybe too powerful) High Level Feats that only the Fighter can get, requires you to lose a few older feats, but comes with lots of abilities and are really powerful.

Fighter Domains: I really loved the Domains in BOXM I, so it's not surprising I like these as well.

Fighters get a free domain at Level 1, and additional domains at higher levels. They represent your school of fighting, such as Agility, Dirty Fighting, Mounted Combat, Two Weapon Fighting, and Weapon and Shield.

Each one gives two abilities, one when you first get the Domain, and one after you've taken 8 feats that are related to the domain. So instead of nine specific abilities that the Arcane Schools give out, it's just a theme that your character has.

Then there is a list of anywhere from 14-20 feats for each Domain, one of which is considered the Key Feat. You don't have to take any of these feats if you don't want to and you don't gain any of them for free. However, in addition to gaining the second ability of the Domain for taking 8 of these feats, you can trade out any of them (except the Key feat, which often is a prerequisite for most of the feats anyways) you know for another feat in the Domain list. You must be able to meet all the requirements for the feat, and you must train for 1 full day to switch the feats. Once you've done this, you keep these feats until you decide to switch them again.

I will admit that some of the feats might be broken, but some of them are just plain awesome, such as feat that allows you to lower your AC to increase the AC of an ally next to you, or a feat that allows you to roll an attack to negate an incoming attack on you, or giving bonuses to allies based on level and Charisma as long they can hear/see you or following the predetermined plan you came up with earlier.

DEX/CHA and Rogue/Bard would be fine, and it would fit the Non spellcaster/spellcaster favored class idea as well.

I'm in the process of reading Monte Cook's Book of Experimental Might II, Bloody, Bold, and Resolute.

Link

Just at first glance: wow.

Fighting Styles Feat groups, allowing you to switch out any feat you know for another feat in that group that you could have.

40 pages of feats, most of them either Fighter only feats, or feats that increase in power after 9th level (or some other level) if and only if you got them as a Bonus Fighter Feat.

A few things for non-fighters, and a few things that will only work if your using BOXM I with them, such as the new hit point rules, or the increased Feats/level, but still I think this is going to be a really good read.