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Demogorgon

memorax's page

Pathfinder Society Member. 3,133 posts. No reviews. 1 list. 1 wishlist. 1 alias.


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Liberty's Edge

Thank you for the feedback. Always good to hear it from those who read the books. Interesting that Aaron feedback mirtos almot exacty the same i heard from a friend today over lunch. The editing left much to be desired. He enjoyed thr Dwarven Depths book but not the rest of the trilogy. .

Liberty's Edge

I bought the latest Dragonlance trilogy from both authors awhile back the one thay begins witn Dragons of the Dwarven Depths and ends with Dragons of a Hourglass Magr. I hsve held off reading it. As i want yo read the War of Souls trilogy first. As well o heard from many a reviewer thst the ladtest trilogy no longer has the magic of the previous Dragonlance series as well as being badly written. As in the quality of the writing is written by someone who is just starting out. Not veteran writers.

Another recommendation from my above post about the Lovecraft anthologies The Long Last Night by Brian Lumley. Its the stiry of two surviors in London England. After Cthulhu has risen and everythong associated with his return.

Liberty's Edge

In tbe oceans and seas my vote would be Sahuagin.

Liberty's Edge

Hello all I want to start reading the Camulod Chronicles From Jack Whyte and interested in hearing any feedback from those who have. Both positive and negative.

Liberty's Edge

Currently reading Weirder Shadows over Innsmouth. If your a fan of H.P. Lovecraft and the Deep Ones I highly recommend the first and second anthologies. Shadows and Weird shadows over Innsmouth. I enjoyed all the stories I read so far. Though my favorite so far is Innsmouth Bane by John Glasby. Its a prequel to Lovecraft Shadows Over Innsmouth. Where we get to see how Innsmouth begins its road to hell and damnation.

Any Jack Whyte fans? Im interested in reading his books and would like to hear some feedback first.

Liberty's Edge

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Agreed and seconded. i usually do something as well when I can't sleep. Otherwise I end up feeling more tired than just tossing and turning.

Liberty's Edge

Werthead wrote:


The books have sold about 650,000 copies to date in the States, which equates to about 108,000 per book. Being very generous, call it a quarter of a million readers. THE EXPANSE gets 2-3 million viewers (accounting for all methods of watching) in the States and considerably more worldwide, where the show is on Netflix. The book readers are a small percentage of the viewers, which is unsurprising since the books are so new (for context, the first novel was released in mid-2011).

Good to know about the number of books sold. I enjoyed the first three books. I have heard mixed reviews about books 4-6. I'm still going to read them anyway as I enjoy both the show and the books and Science Fiction in general

Werthead wrote:


This is pretty much the same for all adaptations of pre-existing media. You can use the book readers as a springboard to help launch the show and build up word-of-mouth, but you have to appeal far beyond the fanbase and look out to new viewers as well.

Totally agree and seconded. The thing about trying something new is that it may work and bring in new viewers. As it may not and lose viewers. Beyond good writing I don't think there is a perfect formula to get more viewers. Than and focusing on what the majority of the fanbase wants. I'm not saying don't try anything new. Just don't put it into a show or any kind of medium like a book or comic. Without making sure a large amount of the fans wants it.

Marvel comics not only tried putting more politics and social issues in their comics. They did it so poorly imo that it felt like they were forcing it on the readers. The end result was causal reader like myself either stopped buying or in my case started picking and choosing what titles I wanted to read. While also finding out the hard way those that do want those stories are either not a large enough demographic or don't buy comics. Going forward your still going to see more politics and social awareness and issues in their stories. They won't force it on the reader. If you don't believe me look it up.

Though I do wish Martin would finish his series.

Liberty's Edge

Bill Dunn wrote:


$34 for a $60 book? That is cheaper. You expect game companies to not be able to pay for the development and art costs or have some profit to invest in their company because you want cheaper RPGs?

I see your point but I save a decent amount only if I live in the United States. For someone like me that 34$ in US funds costs me about 45$ Canadian. I'm not saying sell them cheap but a benchmark imo should be half of retail. Sometimes it ends up being more. To be fair it's still better than what on Amazon.ca for the book 261 or was 262$. Yesterday their was a glitch I think and it had it listed at 1261$.

Liberty's Edge

Rpg companies that sell PDfs at full or close to full retail. I thought the PDf format was going to make rpgs cheaper. Not slightly less or just as expensive. Their is no one that needs to be paid to print, make or transport the finished product. Yet some companies insist on sellign them more than 20-25$. I wanted to purchase the L5R 4E PDf since the print is very hard to find and existing copies on places like Amazon are too highly priced. It cost 34$ on Drivethrurpg. In US not Canadian funds. I might as well either wait for the second hand copies to go down in price or a sale on Drivethrurpg. Imo 34$ for the PDF is a bit much .

Liberty's Edge

I guess I should had said some fans as some here assume I meant all.

Some fans are not bothered by the lack of female characters. Some fans want the source material to be true to the books and not have to include certain genders simply because of social pressure. I hope that clarifies my point. I even bolded it just in case.

It's the same way that Game of Thrones kills off characters left and right. Even favored characters by the majority of the fans. It's true to the books and to Martin vision. I was glad their was no last minute save at a special occasion. It was a powerful, in your face "did this just happen" in the book and in the TV show. Anything else may have made those who know the series only by the TV show happy. It would have angered some who read the books by cheapening the scene imo.

Liberty's Edge

Fans of a TV show based on books prefer the show to be as close as possible to the source material. I would still watch it if their was or was not a equal amount of male or female characters. I also don't want either or be put into a show due to social pressure. Especially if it deviates from the source material.

If anything the the main complaints i hear about the books is the swearing and profanity. Im not bothered in the least by it. But apparently some are to the point where they wont read the books or watch show.

Liberty's Edge

I always thought him more of a Sword Saint Samurai myself.

Liberty's Edge

I think it all depends on how smart a npc or monster is. In the same way a pc will finish off a weaker creature or npc. So should a intelligent creature or npc. As well the type of creature also is a factor. I can see zombies and ghouls attack a unconscious pc. As i could see a hobgoblin coup de grace the same pc. As the poster above me pointed out a badly placed Fireball or Alchemical bomb can also take out a pc. If a general agreement was made that no matter what unconscious oc dont die. Expect pc death while not a common occurrence can happen. Adventuring is not a safe pastime imo.

Liberty's Edge

I have to disagree about Emma villian turn being a good thing. It was forced, cliche and more importantly a writer wanted the character a villian. Even if meant throwing away years of character development. The only thing that can make what amounts to character assassination easier to swallow is if they portray her like Magneto in his solo series. The death of her boyfriend is enough to drive her to the dark side. Yet the death of her students who were tortured and murdered in horrible ways does not. Yeah...no its out of character imo. Not to mention it looks like on her way from escaping the X-men she knocked a porn actress and stole her costume.

Liberty's Edge

Jose Hernandez 622 wrote:


I guess if everyone in that group trained inside a cave with no world interaction, I would agree that they should not know.

It does depend on the campaign world and how common that knowledge is. If the DM decides no one in his homebrew world knows about a Trolls weakness to fire without at least making a decent skill roll and some research then imo your out of luck.

Jose Hernandez 622 wrote:


When you are being trained to be a fighter, a wizard, a monk, or a normal living being in a world where dragons, trolls and so on exist, I bet that they would know that information 95% of the time. That is the kind of information that save lives and towns. Well, that is if you think that the world in which your character lives is a realistic one.

Good point. I still think some research needs to be done The information could be from a guy who talked to a guy who shot another guy. As I said above it also depends on the game world. Some DMs may make it that common weakness are not known. Not without actually having fought and defeated the creature. I don't agree with that kind of design philosophy but I'm sure it happens. I don't make players roll for everything as a DM as well. For a Rogue after a certain level they don't need to roll to open a lock that has DC of between 5 and 10. Now if they insist on wanting to roll I let them. Otherwise having players roll for everything slows the game down imo.

Liberty's Edge

1 person marked this as a favorite.

To be fair they never said it was. If parents are too lazy to look up the rating of a movie the blame is on them. Not the movie imo.

Liberty's Edge

It was a good movie imo. Not as bleak as Old Man Logan but a enjoyable movie all the same. While I get the complaint about showing children attacking and murdering adults is a bad thing. It's also a theme of the movie of innocence lost imo.

Liberty's Edge

We have given you answers. You keep ignoring them becaude the answers given are not to your liking.

All im seeing from you is not logic. You want to be able to meta game 24/7 at every table you play at. No tactics should be able to counter that. Not because they are not because their not good tactics. You think they are useless even if on some situations they are not imo

- Diguise its a lousy tactic it never works us it might get in the way of metagsming

-Decoys whose going to waste money on that its a lousy tactic us it gets on the wzay of meta gaming

-magic or magic items same as the above

Im mot saying my tactics are perfect and won't work more than once or twice. Especially on a experienced group. Neither are they doomed to failure.

Sorry for the double post

Liberty's Edge

We have given you answers. You keep ignoring them becaude the answers given are not to your liking.

All im seeing from you is not logic. You want to be able to meta game 24/7 at every table you play at. No tactics should be able to counter that. Not because they are not because their not good tactics. You think they are useless even if on some situations they are not imo

- Diguise its a crap tactic it never works us it might get in the wsy of metagsming

-Decoys c

Liberty's Edge

That's your opinion and it might be wrong. Just like my use of decoys may not work. You might get your point across in a better manner if you were not so stuck on proving that your way and yours alone is the right way and everyone else is garbage.

Or are we know supposed to ask forum members permission on what we can or cannor allow at our own tables.

Liberty's Edge

Why is it being a poor tactician. I think some here confuse what they know as a player to what their character actually knows. If the group encoumters a Troll for the very first time should they all know thry have a weakness to fire. No they should not imo. Not unless the group either makes the right Knowledge check. Or the group has someone who is lucky enough to have someone whosr character background is either to be a dedicated Troll slayer or something along those lines.

Otherwise its meta gaming pure and simple imo. You can make up all the excuses and reasons to hide that your metagaming but imo it is. No to mention people in this hobby plsy the game differently. Calling them or whatever tactics they want to use is rude and limely to grt you booted out at many tables.

Liberty's Edge

Chengar Qordath wrote:


I think the viability of decoy tactics also depends a lot on stuff like party composition. If the group has a dedicated archer, a couple decoy CR 1/3 guys in the back row just means that his first couple arrows kill them instead of knocking some HP off one of the frontliners. Even worse if the group has someone like an evoker who'll just AoE damage everyone regardless of shenanigans.

The archer is still wasting his actions taking out the decoys. Granted easily but it's less attacks on the primary target. I agree about someone with AOE style spells. Decoy or not they are still getting affected.

Chengar Qordath wrote:


By the same token, there are definitely times when the tradeoff for decoy tactics is pretty small. If someone's running a monk, having the guy wear robes and a wizard hat instead of monk robes isn't exactly a huge problem.

Agreed and seconded.

_Ozy_ wrote:

Well sure. The flipside is the DM always making sure that the players are fooled, no matter how smart or tactical they try to be. That's no good either.

It's not a good thing I agree and as you said a good balance needs to be found.

Liberty's Edge

_Ozy_ wrote:


Seems to me the tactic only sucks if the players are always 'in the know', somehow, and act accordingly.

It seems some want their characters to always be "in the know". Which to me is the definition of metagaming imo. I think players forget that what they know their character should not in some cases. I had players who knew I ran the Rise of the Runelords AP then was a player. Some at the table get trying to get information about the AP. As the DM I knew what to expect. I refused to metagame. Even if it meant costing the lives of my character and others.

At the same time I'm not saying players should be cluesless either. Espcially if they took the time to roll Knowledge Checks and roleplay by studying the enemy. Or if they fight the same enemy over and over they get to know what a band of Orcs can do and who are the Bards etc..

Liberty's Edge

I see it as a differences in styles. One person msy think decoys are a waste of time. Some like myself dont think its a waste of time. Either position i think is valid.

Liberty's Edge

I guess we will have to agree to disagree. Magic being versatile a caster can either use illusion or a disguise to himself. Someone using magic can be a Cleric, Bard, Druid, or any other casting class. I tend to buy a wand of Silent Image so that i can confuse enemies. While using a decoy might not be the best or cost effective option is a option. I guess my characters and npcs tend do do more than advertise their presence to the players.

Liberty's Edge

I never said it wad a wrong answer. Just that imo the DC to identify a caster should vary depending on one being obvious at casting a spell. One that goes out of his way to remain hidden or subtle the DC should be much higher. Of course a player can metagame and insist both are casters. Even if one attacking from range and/or hidden

Given most fantasy rpg campaign they have tendancy to make caster obvious such as Forgotten Realms and Golarion. That is not the case in home brew campaigns. The payer might rwaluze its a caster. The chatacter being played at least for the first few levels should not know its a caster

Liberty's Edge

Good to know about the Spymasters handbook. I dont have the book. Though something like that should have been in Ultimate Intrigue imo.

Liberty's Edge

I never felt the combo I mentioned was overpowered. It just that if the Op thinks Inspire Courage and Discondant voice is overpowered. He or she may have a hard time running the game at later levels. Magic is powerful in Pathfinder imo. Many spells can end encounters. I like playing Bards and run them to the best of my ability. Same thing when i play casters of all kinds.

Liberty's Edge

It all depends on the situation at tbe time. Is the caster out in the open? Or hidden. Using a spell to remain hidden. What kind of conditions in the area such as fog or mist etc at the time. Are the casters robes plain or embroidered.

Liberty's Edge

1 person marked this as a favorite.

All good counterpoints. My take is that one should still make a Knowledge roll. Especially at low levels. Or after a few encounters with the same opponent. I would give a bonus to a Rogue trying to identify another being shifty. Not "its a Wizard because it wears a robe" not a first level imo. Knowing everything about a enemy ruins game immersion at least to my players and myself.

Liberty's Edge

Actually one can't thats like saying every person wearing a robe is Wizard. If the DM allows a player to metagame and assume every Rogue is simply going to act like a stereotypical Rogue. Then every shifty eyed noc is a Rogue. Usually as player its never that obvious. Not withour decent skill rolls. Or a healthy dose of metagaming. With the DM trying to disguise a Rogue being a Rogue imo.

Liberty's Edge

I'm not disagreeing with you Quentin. Just that it should take more battles or a very high Knowledge skill roll. One can't assume that the shifty person trying to be unnoticed is a Rogue. Chances are very good that it is. It could also be some average person given money by a npc to spy on the party. Now if the group send a Rogue to scout and sees a Orc and the other five orcs getting pumped up while the Orcish Bard is singing. Then the rogue can go back and tell the others. A high level Arcane duelist can easily be confused with a Fighter as they can wear medium than heavy armor.

With a Bard it's more his spells and less his inspire Courage which may cause problems imo. Wait until the Bard starts casting Communal Phantom Steed. Or Secure Shelter. Bards Escape is a Dimension Door for the entire group. Full Casters if the Op has any in his party will be doing so much more at high levels.

Liberty's Edge

Bard are the class that imo overcomes the weakness of some if not most members of a party. They can buff the ability of the group to hit and do damage. They can make sure party members usually succeed at skill checks with Inspire Competence. Even remove certain weakness of a class. If the Dm keeps targeting a Fighters with spells that require Will saves the Saving Finale spell is your friend. If one wanted both to be able to do Combat and still retain the best of the Bardic abilites. The Arcane Duelist archetype is the way to go.

Liberty's Edge

1 person marked this as a favorite.

For all we know it could just be a war chant that most orcs do. As a player one can't assume that the singing orc is a Bard. That's metagaming imo. I'm not sure which knowledge roll is used to figure it out. That's like saying every person wearing a robe and no armor might be a mage. It could very well be a Monk or Rogue. I see your point. Yet unless one fights Orcs on a regular basis. A one time encounter is not going to be enough for the group to point and say "that's a bard". A smart Dm could have all the regular orcs singing a different song. While the Orc Bard sings the one that Inspires Courage to hide himself.

Liberty's Edge

Well they would have to do some kind of research first at least. Not automatically know that a Bard is buffing his allies at least at first. Usually unless I'm playing a combat based Bard I stay behind the primary melee characters in a group. Which should make it hard for a enemy to figure out who is buffing the party. Mirror Image can help with this.

Liberty's Edge

Create Mr. Pitt wrote:

Bards are awesome force multipliers. This is nothing. Wait until the bard can start given people new saves, bonuses, or the arcane caster a second turn in the round.

Bards are awesome in large parties. You just kind of have to deal with it. The best way to do so is up the action economy on the other side and give the party a ton of enemies to deal with.

A party of 6-7 players is nearly unmanageable. In order to have a good, interesting combat with that kind of party, the encounter will either be super deadly or filled with so many combatants that every combat will take a super long time to resolve.

There's no great solution to this, but I rarely recommend running a game with more than 4-5 PCs.

Agreed and seconded on all of the above

To the Op no it's not imo. Wait until the full casters if you have any in your party starting casting higher level spell. That can be broken imo.

If the Bard really wants to liven the mood at higher levels he can use this http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/h/heroic-finale or and this http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/g/good-hope/ while then casting this http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/m/moment-of-greatness/

Did I mention that Bards and only Bards can cast this http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/a/arcane-concordance/ as well as this http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/s/shadowbard/ and this http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/v/virtuoso-performance/.

So again it's not broken imo.

Liberty's Edge

If tje Dm allows tbe use of Pathfinder Unchained. I would go the Unchained Rogue. Better all around than the core Rogue imo.

Liberty's Edge

I do wish we would get a FAQ response on Ghost Sound it supposed to enhance the effectiveness of Silent Image but if does not say who it does it.

Liberty's Edge

I just finished reading a Stitch in Time by Andrew J. Robinson. If your a fan of Deep Space 9 and Garak. It's a novel on the character written by the actor who played the character.

Liberty's Edge

1 person marked this as a favorite.

I have seen kneejerk reactions to 3PP from some Dms. It's either Paizo and official and only that kind or material. Without even looking at 3PP. Or using the excuse that someone told them it was broken. So that means beyond any shadow of doubt that 3pp is broken. I'm all fine with a DM not wanting to use 3pp. At the very least familiarize oneself with 3pp before just saying no to it. If I listened to every instance of something being "broken" in the hobby I would never have bought anything beyond the core.

As for 3.5 being better I found that Wotc devs more than willing to to introduce new and interesting mechanics. The execution may not have always been good. At least they tried. i find that Paizo is too conservative. CRaft Ooze. Usually with Wotc either you could control it. Or it was loyal to the creator with Paizo it's neither and a waste of a feat imo.

That being said when Wotc amde mistakes they made them imo. I remember taking I think it was a Techsmith prestige class. One gets a Gondman as a construct. Think a really horrible terrible mcuh version of a Gearsman. It's bad enough one needs to be a decent level and need certain requirements for the class. Except they nerf the living daylights out of the Gondsman. The first pit trap it fell into it was destroyed.

To me at least both Paizo and Wotc both have good and bad material imo.

Liberty's Edge

SmiloDan wrote:

Reincarnated gnome?

That's one Fugly Gnome. Or one that dumped Charisma in favor of Intelligence. Which may explain why he not only likes books he can read them. Next he will be riding a horse for all we know.

Liberty's Edge

If the DM allows 3pp and this book you can be Sir Bearington. Complete with Human Cohort if one takes Leadership. Otherwise I'm in agreement with the others. Many Druid spells can't be cast on the Fighter.

http://paizo.com/products/btpy8d08?The-Noble-Wild-An-Animal-Player-s-Handbo ok-for-Fantasy-RolePlaying-Games

Liberty's Edge

Jeff you don't have to convince me. As I'm in favor of the bundles. It just that some retailers may not be happy with Paizo doing the bundles. Many business owners don't take a long term view of their business and only take the short term view. To some it might be viewed as Paizo taking away some of their sales. That being said neither should Paizo be held accountable for those lost sales. Humble Bundles are the future to me at least of the hobby. It's a quick, cheaper way to get their products across to a much larger audience.

Liberty's Edge

Wait not only do we have a goblin who is seems to be communist. But one who is not afraid of the written road. Will wonders on this board never cease ;)

Liberty's Edge

Very good points OG. All I'm saying is they don't need to appologize for doing Humble Bundles. By them offering those bundles it's going to hurt retailers in one form or another. Offering them then kind of also regret offering them sends mixed messages to the fanbase imo. I'm not saying ignore hobby retailers. The truth of the matter is most consumers by online. This is from personal experience of having worked in retail for 15 years.

I worked for the biggest chain of bookstores in Canada. Once word of mouth and by going on their online site. That prices were cheaper online, sales in stores fell sharply. We had to tell customers that the online price was not going to be matched in store. We as booksellers were told to essentially tell customers what amounted to "rationlizations" as to why they could not get the online price. Can anyone here guess what happened more often not. A lost customer. They did not care why they can't get the cheaper price. If they can't get it they were going to go online. Even if it meant not supporting local bookstores. Or if they did support them it was the used bookstore. Over 15 years we went from full bookstores to the equivalent of retail ghost towns. Only inhabited by those who come in and spend a entire day reading but not buying books.

So even if Paizo goes out of their way to help hobby retailers the average customer will vote with their wallet first. Their loyalty to to the retailer comes second or even a distant third. Meaning they will check if Amazon has it cheaper first then buy in store. I'm not saying everyone will. From what I say in the book industry before i left. A huge amount of them go online.

Or as AdAstraGames has pointed out those that want to survive diversfy the products they carry. Carry only what sells. Sell snacks and other non-rpg related materials. Or stop stocking items and only order them in with the customer obligated to leave a deposit.

Liberty's Edge

The fact that Paizo is doing and will probably keep doing more Humble Bundles kind of is going against the wishes of retailers imo. One can't have it both ways as a company. Do their own thing and anger some hobby retailers while also trying to please them. One way or the other your not going to please everyone. I'm in favor of both more bundles and helping hobby retailers. Except out of the two offering more humble bundles is the way the hobby is moving forwards with. I can't go into a gaming store and get such a great deal.

Liberty's Edge

1 person marked this as a favorite.

As much as i maybe critical of Paizo. I will never ever criticize them for their Humble Bundles. Or any other method they use to get their product to their fans. Paizo needs to do what they need to do to make a profit and increase visibility of their products. While also trying to reach the maximum amount of fans as possible. Whether we like it or not Humble Bundles are the way to go imo. While it's good if they can help the local gaming stores they are under no obligation to do so imo.

Liberty's Edge

Damn autocorrect. I meant to say I don't use every part of the Paizo material.

Liberty's Edge

My usual response to these threads is no their is no bloat. Unless one is forced at gunpoint to use the material no one is forced to use everything. I have a majority of Paizo material and I don't use anything.

Liberty's Edge

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Sundakan wrote:


Problem there is it's ONLY mutants that prejudice is against, not "mutates" or aliens or dudes with powered armor. Except that one time they were, it was a big deal, and now it's not.

Mutants and only mutants facing prejudice makes sense if say 80-90% of humanity has no superpowers of any kind with 10-20% being mutants. In a world where 50%+ seems to have some kind of superpower or have the technology means to build and acquire them it makes no sense imo. The 10-12 ft tall orange talking rock (The Thing) gets a almost free pass on prejudice because he and the rest of the FF received their powers from cosmic radiation. If anything with the event that start the first Civil War. Their should have been a huge backlash against anyone and everyone with a superpower mutant and non-mutant. Instead mutants and only mutants get the short end of the stick. Asgardian and Skrull invading it's okay they can get a free pass on prejudice because one is alien the other magical.

It matters not the devastation both are responsible for. Damn those mutants and only them for being different and possible being the next step in human evolution. With so many people being different from the norm and nod not just mutants. With racism being so rarely selective the constant hatred on mutants by the writers not only make no sense. It's a obvious, clumsy, heavy handed, boring, stale, rehashed attempt at them using the racism card in the X-men. Don't get me started on the average person causal acceptance of giant killer anti-mutant robots casually going through their neighbourhoods. Ripping apart peoples homes and families. But hey it's okay because damn those mutants and only them for being different and possible being the next step in human evolution. Yeah I used to be a fan of anti-mutant part of the X-men not so much anymore as it never develops beyond humanity blaming mutants and only them for the worlds problems over and over.

Before anyone says it. Sure some characters face fear and prejudice other than mutants. Comparing to what the X-men go through it's not even remotely the same. Not by a long shot.

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