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Belkar Bitterleaf

mbauers's page

Pathfinder Society Member. 596 posts (5,379 including aliases). No reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 3 Pathfinder Society characters. 23 aliases.


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There are several threads on this, but I was wondering if there has been any clarification on it for PFS--if I want to buy barding made of a special material (medium sized animal) what gets doubled in the cost? Let's use mitral chain shirt, for example. The 100 base cost becomes 200. Does the 1000 for mithral get doubled to 2000? For darkleaf cloth, does 750 get doubled to 1.5k? If I just get masterwork armor for barding, does the 150 MW cost get doubled?

Also, suppose I have armor for my AC when he's medium sized and I hit level 7, making him large sized? Is there anything I can do to change it to large armor, or would I have to sign it and buy new armor?


What about spells like Frostbite--can I cast Frostbite on my AC so she can deliver the charges with her natural attacks?


Ok, so while I was driving home I thought of another example that might help. You think I’m being wishy washy about changing when something is or isn’t a weapon,and I see how you could interpret that from what I’ve said. Allow me to clarify--something’s use defines what it is. If a crowbar is in my backpack, it is not a weapon. If I’m using it to open a door, it’s not a weapon. If I club someone with it, it is a weapon at that moment and benefits from the skald’s song.

I think this should always be the case if you consider certain examples.

Suppose I buy a steak knife. The maker of the knife is creating the knife for the intent of me to cut my meat with it. If I take the steak knife and stab someone with it, is it a weapon? I say yes.

Suppose I am a baseball player with a baseball bat. The maker designed it to be a tool in a game. If I smack someone with it, is it a weapon at that moment? I say yes.

Now consider that in pathfinder terms. I can have someone make me a masterwork club. The wood carver makes it with the purpose of me bashing skulls with it. That’s a weapon, right? Of course. What if I take a chair and break off one of the chair legs. Now I’m holding the chair leg. Was its intended use as a weapon? No. But when I hold it in my hand with the intent to bash someone with it, it is a weapon.

What distinguishes a chair leg from a club? They both are blunt wooden objects that are being used to harm someone. The only difference is the intent with which they were created, which I don’t think matters.

As far as appearing on the weapon chart, consider this:

Suppose I create a dart board and fashion some darts to use as a game in a tavern in Riddleport. If someone takes one of those darts and throws it at someone, is it a weapon? I say yes, even though it was intended to be a game piece.

So, doesn’t an item’s use define what it is?


If an improvised weapon doesn't exist, why do feats an traits that apply to improvised weapons exist?

You can't have someone craft an improvised weapon for you. The minute you use something as an improvised weapon, that's what it is.

An improvised weapon is a weapon, yes. When I'm using it as such and the skald starts singing, it is granted an enhancement bonus. Why? Because it is a weapon.

If the song turned the crowbar into a magic spear that I used as a club, I would agree with you. But it doesnt. Im not using an already encounter weapon as an improvised weapon. I'm using an improvised weapon, which is a weapon, so it gains an enhancement bonus.

If we can't even agree about what we are disagreeing about, there's not much point in you and I continuing this further, right?


No, I hold that the crowbar is an improvised weapon in all cases and should benefit as such.

I understand your point, I just disagree with how you are interpreting the FAQ. Either you don't understand my point, or you are just deliberately ignoring it. I can't tell, so I'll try again to explain where we differ.

"Using the longspear in this way (as an improvised weapon) would not allow you to benefit from any magical enhancements it may possess"

Your interpretation: An improvised weapon can NEVER benefit from magical enhancements.

My interpretation: If a magical weapon (spear, sword, etc) is used as an improvised weapon, it doesn't gain the magical enhancements. The enhancement$ Were placed on the weapon as a spear or a sword.

In the case we are debating, I'm not using a sword as a club or something. I'm using an improvised weapon as an improvised weapon. I'm using a weapon, which gains an enhancement from the song.

You first said you believe that an improvised weapon is not a weapon. I flat out disagree with that, but nothing I can say will sway you.

If you concede that point, or at least don't pursue it further, then our main disagreement is with the differing interpretations of the FAQ. I'm taking it for what it is, you're extrapolating it to say something it is not (in my opinion).


FLite wrote:

I read the FAQ as a weapon like a long spear is (effectively) a combo weapon, like a dagger pistol, it is a long spear + improvised quarterstaff combo. And like a dagger pistol, enhancements that apply to one part of the weapon do not apply to the other. (I also don't see anything wrong with masterworking a tool as an improvised weapon, but it wouldn't make it masterwork for whatever it's original purpose was. And it would cost like masterworking a weapon, not like masterworking a tool.)

Would you allow someone to arcane strike their ale stein?

Me? Absolutely.

Arcane strike makes your weapons get bonus damage and act as magical. If I use the stein as an improvised weapon, it is a weapon, so arcane strike applies. I also get brownie points with Cayden Cailean, which is always a plus. ;-)


No, that's not what I'm saying.

I'm saying they are both weapons, so they both benefit from Enhance Weapons.

We are simply interpreting the FAQ differently. I think the FAQ is saying that when something is enchanted as one type of weapon and used as another, you don't get the benefits of the original enchantment. If you had a flaming whip and strangled someone with it, you wouldn't do fire damage while you strangled them.

I think that is the limit of what the faq is saying. You seem to think that the faq states that Improvised weapons can never be enchanted, or benefit from enchantment.

When I am using a crowbar as a weapon, it is a weapon. Do you agree? If someone was murdered with a crowbar, would the police say: "Where is the murder implement-used-as-a-weapon?" No, they would say: "Where is the murder weapon?".

Something used as a weapon is a weapon. It even has the word weapon in its name: Improvised Weapon.

I am not taking an enchanted spear and using it as a different type of weapon. I am using the crowbar as an improvised weapon, so it is a weapon. I am fighting with it. The skald starts his song, which makes the weapons of all of his allies gain an enhancement bonus. Is the crowbar that I'm hitting someone with a weapon? Yes. Then it gains an enhancement bonus from the song.

I think you're stuck on someone trying to buy a masterwork crowbar that gets an enhancement bonus to attack or something, but I'm not arguing that. I'm saying if you use something as a weapon, it's a weapon. If you are using a weapon when the skald's song goes off, you get the bonus.

So which of my premises do you disagree with? You stated that an improvised weapon is not a weapon. If that is the case then, yes, the skald's song wouldn't work. But I strongly disagree with the view that an "improvised weapon" is not a "weapon".


GM Bold Strider wrote:

In my opinion, improvised weapons aren't weapons. They are just mundane items that you are making attacks with despite their non-weaponness. This is supported by the fact that you cannot have masterwork (+1 to hit) or magical versions of the items crafted. If they aren't weapons, then they wouldn't classify for magi or SW skalds.

An improvised weapon is a weapon. Just because you can't buy a flaming crowbar doesn't mean you can't use it to kill someone. Something that you use to attack someone is a weapon, in every sense of the word. Do you add IC to improvised weapons? If you do, you are acknowledging that it is a weapon, because IC adds to Weapon damage.

GM Bold Strider wrote:

If we consider improvised weapons to be weapons, then we follow the FAQ. 1) Is your magical frying pan weapon magical? Yes. 2) Are you making an improvised weapon attack? Yes. 3) Then, you do not "benefit from any magical enhancements it may possess, nor would you add benefits that apply when attacking with" said weapon. Thus, they qualify for the ability to apply, but you don't actually gain the benefits because improvised attacks with magical weapons don't get the bonuses of the magical properties.In my opinion, improvised weapons aren't weapons. They are just mundane items that you are making attacks with despite their non-weaponness. This is supported by the fact that you cannot have masterwork (+1 to hit) or magical versions of the items crafted. If they aren't weapons, then they wouldn't classify for magi or SW skalds.

I agree we should follow the faq, but I have a much stricter interpretation of that faq than you do. The faq says if something is enchanted as one type of weapon and you use it as another, you don't gain the benefits of the first type of weapon it is. So a +1 spear used as an improvised weapon doesn't get the +1 from the enchanted spearpoint.

I take the faq just as that. You seem to think the faq means that an improvised weapon can never be enchanted or, at the very least, that it can never benefit from an enchantment. But that is not what the faq says.

The difference in this case is that I am not using a spear as an improvised weapon. I am using an improvised weapon as an improvised weapon. So when I'm using it to fight and the song enchants it, it is a +1 improvised weapon. It gains the benefits, just as if you had used a +1 spear as a spear.


Right, so my interpretation of that same faq is that when something is enchanted as one weapon (say a spear) and it is used as an improvised weapon, the enchantment doesn't apply (as it was enchanted as a spear, not as an improvised weapon).

I think this is a separate issue, because the song enchants all weapons. The skald ability enchants any weapon that is used by allies. If you use a natural weapon, it is enchanted. If you use a spear, it is enchanted. If you use an improvised weapon, it is enchanted.

My argument is that an improvised weapon is a weapon. Inspire Courage (which applies to weapon damage) applies to improvised weapons, which proves that it is a "weapon". Since it is a weapon, it gets enchanted by the skald's song.

The FAQ is a corner case because the spear was enchanted, but is not being used as a spear. For the skald's song, all weapons are enchanted.


Oh, right. I thought you were emphasizing "your ally" but you were emphasizing wielding. Yeah, I agree.


I believe you count as your own ally, if that's what you are referring to...


I've asked this question and have been receiving various responses, so I figured I'd pose it here in the rules forum.

At 1st level, the spell warrior can grant a +1 enhancement bonus to the weapons (including ammunition) of allies within 60 feet.

So, does it affect improvised weapons?


Gregory Connolly wrote:

The Exchange faction card will also let you raise the day job limit if you can check enough boxes to get the Chairperson boon.

The exchange also has the Master of Trade vanity that lets you buy things at a discount.

In general though there isn't all that much you can do to avoid having roughly the same wealth at the same level as everyone else other than not die (an obvious goal that you are trying for anyway.)

What book has the master of trade vanity in it?


Ok, gotcha. That makes sense


BigNorseWolf wrote:

Getting lucky and playing up at a table is your biggest income booster.

PFS is well aware that cash equals power, and is more than a little paranoid about ways to increase it.

So if I'm level 3 and play up in a 4-5 tier, I get 4-5 tier gold? And if I play down in a 1-2, I get 1-2 gold?

So the out-of-subtier gold is only for GM credits?


Hasshin Sshok wrote:


so um you have your pet so you wont be alone ^_^

:-)

GM, what are the chances we finish this by Friday morning/early afternoon? Not trying to rush, but I'm signed up for an online game Friday night in the APcon and I need to send in what character I'm using. Just wanted to know if I need to use a pregen or if Magrim will have a shot.


Yep, that's me. And unless I finish the PbP I'm in I wouldn't be level 5 yet, so that would work out. But thanks for clearing that up! I don't want to make any mistakes and invalidate my character.


DM Beckett wrote:

All Pregens are Grand Lodge Faction, so you would get the Boon, but if the real character you apply it to is not Grand Lodge, it's lost. I believe this is also true for Faction Cards.

Really? That would be great! I signed up for some games for the APcon and I dont know if my character will be done with the PbP in time. But he's Grand Lodge so hopefully you're right in case i need to use a pregen.


Ok, so I know if my characters are all tied up I can use a pregen and apply the credit to a character when the character is done with their PBP. My question is, suppose I complete a faction mission (boon on the chronicle, not faction card) with the pregen. Now Lem doesn't have a faction, but the character to which I am applying the credit does have that faction (and successfully completed enough to gain the boon as Lem).

Does the character receive those faction-specific boons on the chronicle sheet when the credit is applied? Or are they crossed off because Lem doesn't belong to a faction?


I think you just put the character in when you report and as soon as he's available the credit applies. I did that when my character was tied up in a PbP and the gane I was GMing finished first. It's the same if you GM a game for which your character is not yet high enough level. I hope that's right, otherwise I messed up.


Rory wrote:
mbauers wrote:

"You must hold the flag in one hand in order to grant this bonus...

Carrying a flag in combat requires a free hand."

Arachnofiend wrote:
I'm pretty sure the free hand clause is referring to the hand you need to carry the flag. Keeps people from storing it on their back and using the feat hands-free.
GM Lamplighter wrote:

Rory, I think you are misreading the text. Using a flag doesn't require holding it in one hand *and* having a free hand - only one hand is required. It's a reminder as someone else pointed out) that you can't fly it from your backpack and gain the benefit.

Yeah, this is how I read it as well. Not that it requires an extra free hand. Hold it in one hand during combat and it works.

Whereas I happen to actually agree with that interpretation, others in the PFS world may not. Do be aware that "free hand" has certain meaning and just be prepared for table variations.

I've likewise seen people say if you attach a flag to a quarterstaff or longspear, they no longer act as weapons. You have to attack as if they were impromptu weapons and so lose the magical bonuses with them. That is equally crazy to me, but I digress.

The feat needs better wording to clear up these issues. There has been lots and lots of threads going over Flagbearer.

I see your point. I think, though, that a point in my favor is that the flagbearer feat does not use the term "free hand". The feat just says "you must hold the flag in one hand to grant the bonus".

The whole "carrying the flag in combat requires a free hand" actually appears in the description of the flag item on a separate page. Not sure how much that would matter to a PFS GM, but who knows?


"You must hold the flag in one hand in order to grant this bonus...

Carrying a flag in combat requires a free hand."

Arachnofiend wrote:
I'm pretty sure the free hand clause is referring to the hand you need to carry the flag. Keeps people from storing it on their back and using the feat hands-free.
GM Lamplighter wrote:

Rory, I think you are misreading the text. Using a flag doesn't require holding it in one hand *and* having a free hand - only one hand is required. It's a reminder as someone else pointed out) that you can't fly it from your backpack and gain the benefit.

Yeah, this is how I read it as well. Not that it requires an extra free hand. Hold it in one hand during combat and it works.


Thanks for all of your responses!

Rory wrote:

Yes, you can swap hands for like you are suggesting. There is no difference doing this than any other weapon.

However, you don't have a free hand when you are attacking with the flag using a buckler. Hence, you wouldn't meet the Flagbearer feat requirements to get or give the bonus.

Instead, you can just hold the flag in the buckler hand (as Chess Pwn mentioned). This gives you the free hand required. Put a Spiked Gauntlet on that free hand (or use armor spikes, boot blade, improved unarmed striked, natural attack etc.) And then attack someone with that. Not only do you get the Flagbearer bonus, but your allies will get it too.

I think you are mistaken. Flagbearer says: "You must hold the flag in one hand in order to grant this bonus."

If I am holding the flag in one hand and beating you with it as an improvised weapon, I'm still holding it in one hand.

Then I transfer it to my buckler hand to cast a spell and I'm still holding it. Then I transfer it back to use it as a weapon again.

I'm always holding it in a hand, whether casting or fighting. That's the benefit to using it as a weapon (that, and the Surprise Weapon trait gives me a +2 to my attack rolls).

I think I'm right about this, I was just unsure about the action required to switch hands.

But this is also good for if I want to use a ranged weapon. Put the flag in my buckler hand. Draw a chakram and throw it. Put the flag back.


Chess Pwn wrote:
Couldn't you just hold the flag in the buckler hand the entire time?

I could, but not if I want to beat people with it :-)


I know there are tons of threads on this similar thing over the years, but I want to be sure this is allowed as it's for a PFS character.

The character is a Skald with the Flagbearer and Catch off Guard feats. He has a buckler in one hand and a flag in the other and he beats people with the flag as an improvised weapon.

So, let's say buckler left hand, flag right hand. Is it a free action to switch hands? So can I put the flag in the buckler hand (left hand), cast a spell with somatic components using my (now empty) right hand, then switch the flag back to my right hand all in one turn?

I need to hold the flag to grant the flagbearer bonus, and if I use the buckler hand to cast I lose the AC bonus for a round.

So, is this PFS legal?

Thanks!


You can take 10, just not 20.

My question is, does a masterwork musical instrument bonus apply when you use perform for a day job check?


I'm making a Skald right now but, as a rule, I name the character last. Not sure why. Anyway, he'll be ready to go tonight so I signed up, that's why the character is "unnamed".


It says that if the PCs recoup the money from Mahdi: "If they are successful, Sovereign Court PCs earn the Budding Friendship Boon
on the Chronicle Sheet."

But on the Chronicle Sheet it doesn't say "Sovereign Court" next to the boon. Is this an error in the text of the scenario, or on the chronicle sheet?


Thanks!


It says it provides a +10 to lie and a +5 to feint, but a -5 to pass a hidden message.

Because it is that specifically spelled out, I'm leaning towards no (and was going to rule that), but I figured I'd ask to see if I'm dead wrong and it's been ruled differently.


So I've looked up a couple threads on this but thought I'd get all of the PFS veterans' input since this is a PFS-specific question.

If you get a Caravan to be able to use Bluff for Day Job rolls, does the Mask of Stony Demeanor apply to that?

I'm a novice at GMing for PFS and am still learning some of the PFS-specific rules.


Ok, cool, thanks!


Wow, that was fast. Thanks guys.

Now a follow up question: When you say "burn a GM star", if I run 10 tables and get a GM star, I can use it to replay something? Does the star go away and then I need another 10 tables to get it back?


Ok, another reporting question since you guys were so quick to respond last time. ;-)

I know (other than evergreens) you can't replay scenarios. But, if I GM a scenario for Character A, can I later play that scenario for credit as a player with Character B?

What about the reverse? If I play a scenario as a player with Character A, can I then GM that scenario and apply credit to Character B?

Thanks guys!

Next--I have a few different scenarios and I'm thinking of running one. Now I'm leaning towards running the Slave Ships of Absalom. Is there any interest in that, starting in a few days?

I'll take posts of interest here first and if I don't get enough interest I'll make a proper recruitment thread.


Cool, thanks!


Saw this thread and wanted to add a similar question--I get that the FAQ will clarify number of uses per day, but how does the timing of these tricks work?

Consider these two:

Aiding Attack (Ex): The Ranger can use this trick as a free action when he hits a creature with an attack. The next ally who makes an attack against the target creature before the start of the Ranger’s next turn gains a +2 circumstance bonus on that attack roll.

Tangling Attack (Ex): The Ranger can use this attack as a free action when he makes an attack. If the attack hits, the target is entangled for 1 round.

Does the hunter have to use a free action on his own turn to handle animal to get the AC to do this? So would I have to use an action to issue the attack command, then another to get it to use Aiding Attack or Tangling Attack? Or can I use the free action on the AC's turn?

What about:

Surprise Shift (Ex): The Ranger can move 5 feet as a swift action. This movement does not provoke attacks of opportunity and does not count as a 5-foot step.


Ok, just as long as I can still use the credit I dont mind.


Ok, just double checked. It's weird, though. Instead of the 2 PP, it has a slash and says: "Player has already run scenario at session # 1 of event # 60091 The Confirmation PbP on April 15, 2015"

Is this a glitch? I know it should count for both of my characters.


Ok, great, thanks!


dbauers wrote:
dotting, what's up brother?

What up? ;-)

Sorry for all the rules questions, but one more. When I report these events and I want to apply the GM credit, do I list my character as one of the players with the others, or just put the number in as the GM?


Awesome, thanks!


I'm not allowed to do a day job check when I apply GM credit for a scenario, right?

But I can apply credit for The Confirmation to a 1st level character if I've already done so for a second level character, because it's an evergreen scenario?


I'm still in the middle of another PbP with Zuriel, so I'll have to bow out unless this doesn't start for a few days and the other one finishes by then. Probably best to give someone else a shot. :-(


That was me, btw


Do I have to have knowledge of the Dragonlance trilogy to make a believable character in this?I've never read it, but I'd really like to play the giantslayer AP.


DM - Voice of the Voiceless wrote:
** spoiler omitted **

Can I reword this: "+2 on Will save vs mind-affecting spells / abilities that are attempting to compel you to do something"

to this: "+2 on Will save vs compulsions"

More succinct, and more concrete what the bonus is. Good?

Profile created, still updating the info...


DM - Voice of the Voiceless wrote:
** spoiler omitted **

That looks great--i have most decisions made, just need to make the profile.


Just wanted to say that I want to keep my backstory, but I've actually decided on a swashbuckler (possibly with archetype) instead of a cavalier. Never tried a swashbuckler and I don't want to wait until level 4 for panache.

I'll try to post crunch tonight.


Hmm, how about this? My previous captain wanted to sell the slaves and I undermined him and freed them instead, would that work?

I'm leaning towards Order of the Flame.


Oh, and Immigrant (Andoran)

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