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As a GM, I have absolutely NO PROBLEM allowing a "shuffling" of spots. A dex ring is not an issue... I mean, in theory ioun stones are slotless, and pfs allows you to carry one or more in your wayfinder safe and sound, so why not a ring instead of gauntlets or belts? Meh, immaterial in the end, to be honest. If you can make them, you can make them weird. But that is me. Other GMs don't even like giving players +1 weapons, so ya know...
I use the Tarrasque version of regen in PF. The Tarrasque has Regen EX, and nothing suppresses it. It explains in the description what happens with death effects. Likewise, things with regen with suppressions work the same way (except they do it slower than 3 rounds). Unless you suppress the regen, the creature can't be killed. Roll a survival and build a fire. One HP of fire will do in most cases...
Am I - the Tarrasque's regen is EX as well... and its quite clear what that means for it (and it doesn't eat for centuries). Meaning that "it regenerates even if disintegrated or slain by a death effect. If the tarrasque fails a save against an effect that would kill it instantly, it rises from death 3 rounds later with 1 hit point if no further damage is inflicted upon its remains."
Seems pretty clear, when they say "nothing suppresses it" - that the "normal" regen has things that do, then ONLY when those things suppress it, the monster can be actually killed. The tarrasque is only a "special case" insomuch as nothing suppresses it.
Sounds like your GM needs an enema. It either does or doesn't conduct heat. I would say this: it is a force object which is immune to normal heat (as all magic force objects are). It would not cook a deer with a fire under it, but would hold 2 gallons of oil/wood/fuel and cook the deer fine without winking if you put the deer on say a 5 foot spit. If you can carry a fire elemental on it, you can carry a normal fire on it without winking.
As for the "floor travelling" - if the GM is that intent on burning up the whole party... well... maybe he shouldn't have sent a floor to do it? (I'd just endless drought it out, but that is me.)
(ps. carrying 2 gallons of oil on this and doing a move-by, cancelling it, can cause a huge area to be affected by a flaming pool of oil, even if the GM makes you light it afterwards)
Hendelbolaf: I disagree, a rogue can "study it carefully" and/or "interact with it in some fashion" to get a save, because they know IMMEDIATELY that it is an illusion (five identical guys standing in the same area doing the same things = cheap level 2 mage spell).
Or are you stating that no matter how long they do this, because there is no mention of a save, that nobody ever gets a save against this spell... ever... a cheap level 2 spell affords mages 50-80% cover (basically)... OK. I can roll with that in a fashion RAW. Doesn't state they get a save, so they don't, even if they A) know its an illusion, and B) interact with it. That is the nature of Mirror Image.
(Of course, my blindfighting rogue just closes his eyes and goes to town on the mage.... lolz... or starts throwing oil bombs... but that is another story).
"Figment: a figment spell creates a false sensation" - um... a false sensation is a mind-affecting thing isn't it? Further "Illusion Illusion spells deceive the senses or minds of others." OK. so it deceives the senses, not the mind...
"Saving Throws and Illusions (Disbelief): Creatures encountering an illusion usually do not receive saving throws to recognize it as illusory until they study it carefully or interact with it in some fashion.
A successful saving throw against an illusion reveals it to be false, but a figment or phantasm remains as a translucent outline.
A failed saving throw indicates that a character fails to notice something is amiss. A character faced with proof that an illusion isn't real needs no saving throw. If any viewer successfully disbelieves an illusion and communicates this fact to others, each such viewer gains a saving throw with a +4 bonus."
Seeing 2-7 of someone would be a dead giveaway that they created an illusion and allow a save, wouldn't it? So characters get a save if they have seen this before and / or think something is amis, anyway... seems to me.
The question, of course, is what does "study it carefully" and/or "interact with it in some fashion" mean? Say "hello, nice spell."?
"Regenerating creatures can regrow lost portions of their bodies and can reattach severed limbs or body parts if they are brought together within 1 hour of severing. Severed parts that are not reattached wither and die normally."
The body regrows a head within an hour (or the head a body, depending on the GM). It says that non-attached parts wither and die, but it also says they regrow lost portions (the head) within an hour. EX is a physical ability of all the cells of the body... basically.
"Pasting" a Troll, in games I run is enough to kill them without fire. Basically, if you spend a few minutes pounding the remains into pulp (helpless, coup de gras every strike) I let it slip. Why? Because everyone in the game can roll a SURVIVAL roll to start a fire (difficulty 10 or 15) and make a fire, thus killing it in one round after putting a torch to it. I just let it go if they paste it to -500 HP. Close enough to starting a fire and tapping it out with a torch for me, as a GM.
I'd rule that you could, but that is just because of action films. Basically, if you can "pommel" someone for non-lethal damage, you can punch them with the cestus holding the sword. This is just opinion, of course. RAW means you have to pretty well declare what weapon you are using / have equipped. A cestus, of course, is always equipped, though. So the "free action" would be to swap hands with the sword and then make the cestus attack (seems more intelligent just to allow it) and then swap back... Lot to go through just to worry about bludgeon versus slashing damage... if you are a GM that is... (unless the cestus were a +5 flaming burst defender or something uber like that I wouldn't worry much about this - if it were some sort of uber weapon, then I'd try to work it out with the player. The free actions would still allow a hand switch with the sword and attack with the cestus though, so in the end I really couldn't see much different ruling).
"a move action will only provoke one attack of opportunity from an opponent, regardless of how many threatened squares they move through"
Opponent moves into Barbs area and provokes an AoO. All other squares moved THROUGH (into, out of, past, by, etc...) do NOT provoke. Barb only gets one AoO. But it triggers when they come INTO range, not when they move out of range.
IMHO, the Barb would ONLY get AoO's when this feat gives it to them, and unless they start a combat round with someone closer than the trigger that move away, would not ever get a normal AoO for moving out of a threatened square (ie. they only get ONE AoO per move action, as stated and highlighted above)
But, couldn't he threaten the 5' range with the cestus, and the 10' range with the horse chopper (taking a one handed use penalty)? Just saying... I don't see any problem, so long as he executes the AoO with the appropriate weapon when the time comes (he can't get a cestus hit in at 10' for instance). Also note with this, that each enemy only gets one AoO when you move out of a threatened square (for that enemy) so if the player chooses not to attack with the cestus when they move to 10 feet, and the enemy decides to not move any more (which would basically be a 5 foot step I guess) then they wouldn't get a mulligan on the AoO skipped (waiting and hoping they moved out of the 10 foot range so they could horse chop 'em).
Overall, I would say you were under the correct impression, and the GM was wrong in this instance. You can free action drop one hand, cestus punch (or unarmed strike), then re-grip for a free action (if you want to or not).
(and just out of curiosity, does someone who uses a whip and a dagger threaten two ranges as well? just saying)
Right in the description of the tools it tells you what happens: If you don't have the right tools to make something, you improvise (read "use your war mattock as an anvil and sword pommel as hammer") and get a -2 on craft checks. You can pound the "nail" (broken piece of armor?) into the end of the wooden stick you picked up, which holds the axe head, and make a hand-ax for 1/3 the price of a normal hand-ax. You might even have used your dagger (instead of a proper tool) to make the stick smooth.
However, keep in mind that scrolls are magic items and immune to normal fire, right? So an elemental's fire wouldn't harm it... Wind form would be fine - and water could just hold the edges (and scrolls found in underwater chests don't get "wet" either). So I would say absolutely plausible to do this.
Does "Hard Minded (Ex): A rogue with this talent is hard to fool with mind-affecting effects. At the start of her turn, if she is still subject to any mind-affecting spells or effects, she can make a Will saving throw with a standard DC for the effect's level, and if she succeeds at the check, she is no longer subject to the mind-affecting effect. She can make this saving throw even against mind-affecting effects that normally don't allow a saving throw. In those cases, generate the saving throw as if the spell or effect did allow a saving throw."
Counter "Mirror Image
School illusion (figment); Level bard 2, sorcerer/wizard 2
Casting Time 1 standard action
Components V, S
Duration 1 min./level
This spell creates a number of illusory doubles of you that inhabit your square. These doubles make it difficult for enemies to precisely locate and attack you.
When mirror image is cast, 1d4 images plus one image per three caster levels (maximum eight images total) are created. These images remain in your space and move with you, mimicking your movements, sounds, and actions exactly. Whenever you are attacked or are the target of a spell that requires an attack roll, there is a possibility that the attack targets one of your images instead. If the attack is a hit, roll randomly to see whether the selected target is real or a figment. If it is a figment, the figment is destroyed. If the attack misses by 5 or less, one of your figments is destroyed by the near miss. Area spells affect you normally and do not destroy any of your figments. Spells and effects that do not require an attack roll affect you normally and do not destroy any of your figments. Spells that require a touch attack are harmlessly discharged if used to destroy a figment.
An attacker must be able to see the figments to be fooled. If you are invisible or the attacker is blind, the spell has no effect (although the normal miss chances still apply).
???? Since illusions are mind affecting spells, and this is clearly an illusion spell, is the Hard Minded Rogue allowed a save every round to ignore the duplicates, despite there being no save to the casting of the spell?
Long gone are my Melf the Elf characters who had four 18 base stats and a 16 and a 15... The point buy system is designed to make you actually think about character development I think. It intentionally (most days) throws an ODD stat at you (like a 13) so you think about 4th level when you get your first stat point... do you put it to 14, or start working that 18 to a 20?
That said, while I am a little nostalgic for the old die rolls, it often unbalanced parties quickly. But sometimes that was the most fun part too... meh, I guess point buy is fine, though it feels pretty cookie cutteresque to me (so did having an entire party of 3 18's etc...). Luckily, there is enough content to not make everyone the same despite similar stat choices.
I am currently running/playing in a campaign with three rogues. None of which are theives per se. We have a ranger wannabe, a intimidator, and a skill monkey. All based on a different primary stat. Similar things can be done with most other classes (a fighter is perhaps the most versatile combat stylist, having the most feats).
So honestly, it comes down to this: in PFS/20 point buy systems you are getting a total of +7 stat modifiers. Distribute them for the most effective use of what they modify and what you want to do. Skill monkeys? INT and then CHA, then DEX, WIS, with STR being the least number of skills affected. Melee? STR or DEX with feats (I suggest DEX with feats for the AC bonus, but if in a party with a healer I often just go damage). Ranged? Dex and Int (and feats). Mage? Int/Wis as needed. 16,16 10x4 is not horrible way to start a mage character. Put the +2 wherever you want (or as race decides)
Without Feats I would go monk. Simply for the pure number of attacks. And because I feel like saying something nobody else has yet.
for one Ki point: +18/+18/+18/+13/+13/+8/+8/+3 - 8 attacks at full str bonus in a one round: 16d10 + 8x Str damage. No feats used (though monk abilities mimic feats).
Immune to a TON of stuff and SR 30 at level 20. What is not to like?
Bonnie Nuetral - As long as the PCs are winning, the cleric doesn't have to lift a finger. Even if one dies, and they killed three or four monsters, the only fair thing to do would be to raise everyone, not just the players. The player just hates dead things, that is why they are a cleric after all.
(this is named after a dear old friend of mine who DID DO THIS SORT OF THING constantly for all the years I knew her)
Yeh, I have been temped to calculate what the lyre/perform skill could do if pushed to the point of exhaustion. Say you wanted to completely remodel a dungeon some evil queen Ileosa is hiding in...
I recently used Knowledge (engineering) and Perform (string instrument) to use a Lyre of Building on several 12 hour marches to build an entire highway through Bloodsworn Vale. Due to the speed of travel, the quality was increased. Very nice roadway through the Vale now! Then used it a while later to set up the mining camps for the Adamantine mines we found. I am considering getting a few of these and trying to rebuild the causeway across the Inner Sea, but don't want Cheliax to rise in power again... And materials are still needed to be within the audible range of the instrument (GM ruling), so I would need materials to do that that are hard to find these days.
We dd up the size of the Fort in BSV, as well as change the walls to Stone, making it essentially a small Keep. And we have used the LoB twice to repair the Inn (the first time a Vampire (friend of the evil Wizard in the module) and our party's spellcaster blew it to kingdom come, the second time it was just a small hole by a fireball, courtesy of a Red Mantis Assassin/Mage).
12 hours of playing = 7200 man days of labor. Rougly 20 people working on something for 2 years. or 100 people working on something for 72 days. or 1000 for a week. Things can get built!
Another clever use by one of our party members: Intimidate on Lopo. He cooks for us now at the Inn. LOLZ!
Again, you don't need UMD if you know the command word on a command word activation device.... But otherwise, yep, even the casters can get spells before their level by spending gold. That is part of the discussion as to why casters aren't all that and a bag of chips too - anyone can copy their powers with a little coin. I am not saying they are not way way way powerful, they are. But anyone with coin and a loose GM can be as well.
One of the most destructive items in the game IMHO is the Lyre of Building... Imagine a CG character using it to subvert a city's ruler by entrenching the poorer district, walling it up and putting a moat around it so the LE overlord can't get to them... I don't know why I mention this, other than it is an example of magical force whooping manual labor's butt. I agree magic is very very powerful. (but then, almost anyone can use a Lyre of Building, see my point?)
50k is cheap for a level 17 wizard's entire 9th level spell list. I was pointing out that its the WBL of a 10th level character. For 17th level spells! So yeh, THAT is how it is cheap!
Also, I kinda messed up the formula anyway. The cost would end up being 10x that (additional modifier of /5/50 for these items), OR 1/240 days (defeats the purpose). Which would mean that the entire 24 spell list would have to wait until a 15th level character crafter it, and would otherwise only be available to a 18th level martial by WBL. So I would end up saying "pick a few spells you want (like 3)" and then you are back at a level 10 WBL price.
Command word activated only need know the command word. No UMD roll is needed unless you are activating blindly. I know of NO GMs that would allow players to have a wish every month (well, 24 days) for the rest of their lives... but the RAW are there to allow it pretty cheaply IMHO a 8th level character who only needs to roll 27 to craft a 9th level spell item is pretty cheap considering they would have: Master Craftsman (+2), 8 Ranks in Crafting (+8), the proper tools (+2 to +5), Class skill (+3), and stat modifier (+3 let's say). plus a trait or two if you want to add those = +21 (or more) to crafting. So they would only need to roll a 6 to make it, and it would only take 3 days to make each spell (or 1 1/2 days if you up the DC to 32 and require a 11+ roll). Adding in, of course, the material cost of the spells. (so Wish, for instance, would take 25,000 more GP, In any event, about 13-25 more days to craft)
"Benefit: As a standard action, you can make a single
Single attack is any attack type listed under attacks in the combat section. Normal damage for a trip is none, just knock them prone. Move on to the next foe if they are HIT (not damaged). In short, YES, absolutely.
A harder to explain one would be throwing a splash weapon and then hitting an adjacent foe... (it doesn't say "melee weapon attack") This is where we grey into the RAI versus RAW (rules as intended versus rules as written) realm.
Let's compare a lvl 17+ mage and someone who just decided to buy a device (and a very casual GM who allowed it) to simulate being a spell caster.
CL * SL * 1800 / 5/uses per day. Let's, for fun, say they want to cast an average of one 9th level the spell a day, and we are talking about the 24 9th level spells. So we put in a 1/24 days use limit on the device. That means the cost is:
And so we have any joe schmo at level 10 who can afford this, and at level 8 can afford to make it themselves. While the GM is sleeping of course. Contrast that to "buying" a martials' ability to deal damage and change the world?
(and also note that while the delay rate on each individual spell is 24 days, all the spells could be cast in the same day, perhaps making it more powerful than any known spellcaster on a single day. And yes, I do realize that any spellcaster could buy/make one of these too! and I also realize that when I say "one" of these, I mean a series of items which allow the spells to be cast, as one item skipping 24 spells would be a +120 mod on the craft DR)
start in the middle where I say "spell casters are way way way powerful"... then redact your indignant tone and retry?
Well, the real problem is you have to see them first. A 10+ level rogue should be taking 10 continuously on stealth. IMHO. Can't cast on a person you can't see. AOE spells are all that are left.
Ps. I did mention that mages are way way way versatile and powerful, right? I was just pointing out that in some cases they become useless (like when you are in a PFS GOOD campaign and the "bad guys" have captives you fear harming with area of effect (AOE) spells).
UMD also allows Rogues the same versatility as mages, just at a higher gold cost. I can get something enchanted 1/day for CL*SL*360 gold. 7th level spells for 22k basically. Some night when I am bored I will do the math per level for gold cost versus being an actual spell caster. :)
Just doesn't seem that important of a rule. What is the benefit? The players do more than 50 to a monster with a +12 fort save (because if it has over 100 HP it usually has something like this, if it has between 50-100 and you do 50+ to it you are probably gonna kill it next round anyway). So they have a 15% chance of killing a monster with massive damage... or less if they have higher Fort saves, saving them a round. Whoopity doo. Or your monster kills a player (and again, if the monster is dishing out 50+ shots the players aren't lasting many more rounds anyway). No real benefit to it, IMHO.
All I know is that since they removed Critical Hit immunity from a host of monsters the rogue has become way more powerful. Oozes, Elementals and swarms are now the only challenge to flanking Rogues with HiPS.
A rogue with advanced evasion laughs at most area of effect spell casters, and ranged rogues with a very cheap pair of magical glasses snipe mobs from 200 feet for precision damage... I mean, honestly, spell casters are way way way powerful in that they can hit everything in an area with 10-20d6 at once (except the rogues who take half or none of that).
Recently at a PFS game, with the template character rogue my son tumbled and set up four or five flanking manuevers (lvl 7 rogue with a +20 acrobatics... wow!). All the "usual" PFS players kept telling him "don't try to tumble past, you will never manage it." The Sea Hag made him roll 4x. But the other option was to sit there and die instead. Once he got past her, the Knight did it's 5 step/full round attack and he did a full round flanking "sneak attack" (2x basically). I mean, honestly, it was impressive for a 7th level rogue IMHO.
Meanwhile, I played the spellcaster, who came in handy ONCE (well his magic anyway) in the entire adventure (when I DDoored folks past a wall of flame). If I had let loose with Fireball or anything else that would have ended the combat I would have either hit my friends or allies we were trying to rescue. So basically, made entirely useless simply due to bad positioning. The exact same complaint that people have against Rogues and other martials.
Yeh, I agree, its way easy right up until that Nightwing (huge monster with a 80 foot wingspan) is stuck in a 60' diameter star tower... with columns in it for support of the roof. Did we mention: familiarize yourself with the module before you run it? Hope so.
One finds players... and runs a game for them. And no. It is not fun. It is hard work. Or I should say, it is more work than showing up with a single piece of paper and playing. It is still fun to GM.
You can try local gaming shops, or other places geeks like us like to hang out. Most have a board to post on for attracting new players, or you can bring your own friends. PFS organized play sessions also look for GMs at conventions and will break you in softly/but that requires there to be a Con near you.
Kazaan: Your "Parsing A" thought is completely wrong. A FIST (singular) is not parsed that way later in the description. I would state that parsing B is completely right. A fist is NOT a claw attack, and it is ONE unarmed strike/specific area of the body which would be enhanced. If they meant it enhanced the whole body they would have put that in the desciption. They did not, but instead chose very specific SINGULAR areas of the body one can do a US with. I don't know why it doesn't appear clear to you.
Gobo Horde: I don't disagree with you on any particular point regarding the "argument" for invulnerability through no weapon break rules. I, again, was being facecious when making this argument. It was 4 am and I was being silly because the entire "your body is a single weapon" idea is so obviously wrong IMHO. Taken to another extreme it means one could NEVER be rendered helpless while conscious because they could always do 1d3 damage to their bindings. Just by breathing/using their chest as a weapon!
Maose, you're not contributing anything to the discussion at this point. You cannot use natural weapons with Spell Combat. In your home games you may feel free to rule however you wish, but in this forum, since ppl come here for legitimate answers to legitimate questions, I must ask you to move on.
I'm failing to see how what I have said is not a legitimate answer to the question, thus the whole "can't move on" part I guess. Nefreet, are you a Paizo dev? Just curious. Is anything quoted as being "RAW" by me incorrect? Is anything quoted as being RAW by others (such as "manufactured") actually in any books anywhere (it is not in the core rulebook)? I legitimately throw out page numbers and books and get this? Thanks for the honest discussion. I guess I will just move on because nobody actually wants one here.
Actually, Weapon Finesse states that natural weapons are considered light weapons for the purpose of the feat. You're reading too much into it.
...and if my normal melee attacks include using this feat then they are considered light weapons, right? Or are we now saying we cannot use two feats at the same time?
Yeh, I have a batter... er I mean better example:
We have 4 party members get attacked by 4 monsters.
So the surprise round stars with the highest init, which just happens to be the Mage. As a standard action, he casts a redied fast fireball.
Now, at this point, wouldn't EVERYONE know something is going down?
To put it another way; the fireball now attacks two mobs who go in the surprise round and two that don't.
I had a similar incident with a mob casting a ray attack in a surprise round, where it aimed at a unaware person, but was a 30' cone so it hit everyone... because the unaware person was easier to hit flat-footed.
dems the rules, surprise rounds are always a little harry, IMHO.
Diego Rossi wrote:
Yep. Starting right on page 136 where it says you can use light weapons in your offhand, and, oh, by the way, in case you are unsure, unarmed combat strikes are always light weapons (not sometimes, and only when in your main hand and holding something else).
I mean: You have a dagger in your main hand, you make an US with offhand. You swap, and make a US with your main hand, and dagger attack with your offhand. What changes between your right and left hands' ability to make US when you drop the dagger? Not a damn thing.
Hitting the person does not break their unarmed attack ability. I can do 99% of their HP and they can still use an unarmed attack on me. Tell me what weapon gets that ability other than this? In some (rage) instances I can do over 100% of the damage needed to destroy the weapon and it remains useful.... truly, Unarmed strike is a globally magic weapon! (not. I hope you realize that I was being facecious, of course you can break people's (even monk's) unarmed strikes. Just watch "Enter the Dragon", the classic fight between Bruce Lee and Chuck Norris solves this discussion - without RAW, because it involves Chuch Norris and Bruce Lee!)
regarding the lvl 20 fighter: BAB +20 = 20 + d20 = 40 sunder attempt, which, in theory, can probably break any weapon in the game. (esp when you add in sundering abilities, I didn't go into detail because I thought we could all figure out that I meant "a properly designed sundering fighter level 20 could... etc..")
As for breaking arms - why don't we do this more in combat in the game? Because ok.... you broke his hand/arm. He has another, and two feet. Why don't you break his "head butt" first and just kill him outright. That makes the most sense. I completely agree, these rules are NOT in the game for a reason (people would exploit them). But you do have to admit I came up with a pretty good defense with the whole "you have to try a sunder on me to hit me because I am a weapon, but you can't sunder unarmed strikes by RAW so I am immune to your attacks" defense! (if my whole body is a single weapon, as some claim, this makes perfect sense RAW)
note: I completely disagree with this "body is one weapon" approach (it is not RAW anyway), as I outlined above - namely that any PART of your body can be used as a weapon (FIST, singular), but that doesn't make the whole a single weapon (I throw a punch with all my FISTS, LEGS, ELBOWS, HEAD, in a single Unarmed Strike attack)
no. it's a secret. lol
I actually was just conceptualizing a ranged poisoner. Perhaps even a gunslinger (or just a gun user, ranged touch with poison bullets?). I was definately going for bleeding attack at 4th level, though. Obviously some fast stealth eventually and a dip into Shadowdancer for HiPS.
Su are not necessarily spells. Depends on GM a little here, most likely. Since technically nothing is stacking, I'd allow it to be used; reasoning being - the Su let's you take the form of a huge animal, it doesn't "grow you"; you are "essentially" just a "normal" huge animal, which can then be enhanced further.
Maouse, you can't sunder unarmed strikes as they are not an item carried or worn, likewise you cannot disarm an unarmed strike because it is not an item carried. (you can however if these unarmed strikes come from brass knuckles, etc, although brass knuckles, cestus, and gauntlet all say say they cannot be disarmed)
Right, because an Unarmed Strike being one's entire body obviously makes it completely immune to any weapon damage whatsoever. Nobody has EVER broken their arm, fist, leg, ribs, skull in a fight. EVER. (sarcasm)
I will admit, RAW, do not include rules for sundering limbs as weapons. But I hope and pray you see how silly this discussion is getting. Luckily, my Unarmed fighter will never have to worry about losing his weapon nor having it broken. Seems perfect!
Lvl 20 fighter - can Sunder any Artifact in the game, but can't harm a level 1 NPC farmer's hands or feet! WOOT! I should use that one next time I am trying to save a NPC - nope, in order to deal any HP damage, you have to try a sunder attack... oh, wait, you can't do that because the Unarmed strike, his entire body, is protected from sundering based on RAW! And unless you try to target his weapon (unarmed strike) you can't destroy it. IMMORTALITY HERE I COME!!! LOLZ!
To wit I would reply: does this mean that if I sunder weapon on someone's foot I destroy their weapon/entire body?
Or perhaps to put it another way: Any part of one's entire body can be used to make an unarmed strike, but one's entire body is not used to make a single unarmed strike. You don't throw your entire body at the enemy, hoping for a 20! You throw a fist their way. Or a foot. Or an elbow, head smash, etc... You don't do every move in the world hoping some stray part of your entire body hits them.
If you wish to make an offhand attack, you take a -4, -8 penalty for the first fist and the second fist, repsectively. It is not hard to imagine, comprehend, visualize, or even find on page 136.
Normal(as in, without the TWF feat): If you wield a second weapon in your off hand, you can get one extra attack per round with that weapon. When fighting in this way you suffer a –6 penalty with your regular attack or attacks with your primary hand and a –10 penalty to the attack with your off hand. If your offhand weapon is light, the penalties are reduced by 2 each. An unarmed strike is always considered light.
untrained fighters may also provoke AoO.
..again, unless you have the Weapon Finesse Feat which then treats them as LIGHT MELEE WEAPONS under it's SPECIAL note. (and not just for attacks, whatever... there is no limit placed on it... just that they are treated as LIGHT weapons now).
(ps. sorry, got this thread and the magic fang one mixed up a little)
Diego Rossi wrote:
As you aren't holding a unarmed strike or a natural attack, we have a key ability that don't work with them and speak about having a weapon in your hand and not your hand being the weapon.
And it says "holding" not "wielding." And I have NO PROBLEM with that NOT working with a monk's manufacturered (or not, doesn't really matter one wit at all) unarmed strikes. Though that might be interpreted as a semantic argument.
He can hold it, enchant it, and perhaps give it to another person to wield?
Completely not RAW.
p. 136 Defensive fighting:
Implies that NORMALLY you can WIELD Nat Weapons and Unarmed Strikes - this feat specifically excludes them, which is "not normally the case with wielding."
And again, we are talking about a MONK, right?
Though the word Manufactured only appears 5 or 6 times in the RAW Core RuleBook and essentially means NOTHING. RAW. Unless you'd like to quote me your source for what you say.