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Argith

houstonderek's page

Pathfinder Society Member. 9,359 posts (9,665 including aliases). No reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 1 Pathfinder Society character. 9 aliases.


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Liberty's Edge

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thenovalord wrote:

You need to play it to see how smooth it is. It is great for dungeons and for dragons.you can get through a dozen fights in a 4 hour session if you wish

Levelling up is quick and doesn't need herolab

Most of all it is built on game theory one year ago, not 15 years ago.if u start now you are getting in on the ground floor. If u joined a long term PF group it may all seem overwhelming!

The chassis for 5e, and one of the reasons it is popular with a lot of older gamers, is built on game theory from thirty-six years ago. It feels like a modernized version of the AD&D game, as if third were more closely tied to the style of play promoted by AD&D rather than a revamp based on the same nomenclature, but with a lot of Rolemaster and Magic:TG grafted to the class and level system.

3x really changed the way D&D was played in a lot of ways. Character creation is so involved that high fatality can make the game a chore. 5e's focus on "at the table" play and quick character creation allows for an older style of play (more fatalities, less focus on "story" driven death, more game than cooperative story telling) without taking away the more story driven, scripted style.

3x focuses on "positive rights" so to speak (skills and feats define what you can do, and hard character abilities almost define what you cannot do), whereas 5e focuses on "negative rights" (skills and feats enhance what you can do, but nothing really defines what you cannot do, outside of class limitations (e.g. fighters don't cast spells, wizards don't wear full plate, etc.)).

Different games for different purposes, and neither does what the other does best well at all, to be frank.

Liberty's Edge

Freehold DM wrote:
Lord Fyre wrote:
She certainly doesn't look 65!

damn.

I'll have what she's having.

It's called airbrushing with Photoshop. I believe it is inexpensive and available commercially.

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kyrt-ryder wrote:
Freehold DM wrote:
houstonderek wrote:
Freehold DM wrote:
TriOmegaZero wrote:
True facts. If you ain't willing to drive an hour, you ain't Texan.
guess I'm a Texan.
You know, there's plenty of room down here.
I'll just transport Brooklyn down there, forgotten realms 4th ed style.

See, this is the difference. Freehold is used to spending an hour to get a few miles, rather than an hour on the open road.

[Granted I've heard the Dallas-Fortworth area can get ridiculously congested as well.]

Yeah, I saw some show based in NY and one of the participants was b%&~~ing about a three hour commute over a distance that takes me twenty minutes to drive in Houston, non-peak time, and probably forty five minutes at rush hour.

Gary rides a bike, so I'm sure he can cover more ground faster than most, usually.

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Kirth Gersen wrote:
houstonderek wrote:
That's at 80mph, mind you.

Ha! I was gonna say, Google Maps says it's 45 minutes if you somehow can keep it at 60 the whole way. Last Saturday we took Cora to Discovery Green and it took over an hour, because we were lucky to average 30 mph.

"15 minutes" sounds like the way my friend from East Texas reckons travel times:
"How far is your house from the office?" "Five minutes."
"How far from Houston to Nacogdoches?" "Five minutes."
"How far from your bedroom to the bathroom?" "Five minutes."
Dude's like freaking Rain Man when it comes to numbers!

Last Saturday all of the freeways were under construction around downtown. The ramp from 45 to 59 was closed, I-10 was closed at the 45 overpass, and they have a ton of stuff going on east of downtown.

Driving home from HWY 6 and Bellaire to Wayside and 45 took twenty-five minutes yesterday, without construction.

Liberty's Edge

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Ah, um, well, they just closed the border…

;-)

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Freehold DM wrote:
TriOmegaZero wrote:
True facts. If you ain't willing to drive an hour, you ain't Texan.
guess I'm a Texan.

You know, there's plenty of room down here.

Liberty's Edge

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Just let me know, I'll lay in a supply of suds. :-)

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Shoot, an hour west and I'm just barely clearing Sealy.

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That's at 80mph, mind you.

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And Erik is exaggerating, I think. I take 1-10 east from Eldridge every weekend coming back from my mom's, and it takes me about fifteen minutes to get to Telephone and I-45.

Liberty's Edge

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Freehold, my county is bigger than Rhode Island.

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I thought you were just north of I-10, not halfway to Tomball! ;-)

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That's TBD. And, I used to trek to Westchase from Montrose, that place was way less highly accessible than my place. I'm fifteen-twenty minutes on 10 and 45 from the beltway ;-)

Liberty's Edge

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Freehold DM wrote:
houstonderek wrote:
LazarX wrote:
Up until Justice League:Gods and Monsters, The Martian Manhunter is the only superhero who's been in every incarnation of the Justice League?
He wasn't in the cartoon, so 99% of the movie going public probably has no idea who he is.
he was in the cartoon on Netflix... He was one of the main characters first season.

I mean the Saturday morning '70s show that even non-geeks watched. Space Monkey Gleek and all that ;-)

Liberty's Edge

I'm alive. :-)

Ok, this is just for people I know. If I don't know you, the answer is "no". No exceptions.

I'm trying to start a 5e game, and I have two or three players so far, so if you're interested, let me know.

Liberty's Edge

LazarX wrote:
Up until Justice League:Gods and Monsters, The Martian Manhunter is the only superhero who's been in every incarnation of the Justice League?

He wasn't in the cartoon, so 99% of the movie going public probably has no idea who he is.

Liberty's Edge

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Stefan Hill wrote:

If Hasbro wanted to sink D&D I'm not sure letting WotC produce the very well thought out (not perfect, but what is?) 5e D&D was the correct move. Unlike 4e, 5e seems to have cemented rather than polarized the D&D crowd. Or perhaps they just want us all in on place when Hasbro lets the hammer fall? Sneaky darn evil corporates.

4e killed my long time D&D group (fact), 5e brought it back together (fact).

S.

Yeah, funny how people actually like this edition better than 4th. And pretty much everyone who liked 3rd better has Pathfinder. Win win.

Liberty's Edge

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So, this thread basically, from what I can tell, considers the fact this isn't a skills based game, like, say, Pathfinder, a problem. That, by making a game that isn't some build-a-thon, 5e is "problematic". Play 3x. Problem solved.

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Kthulhu wrote:

Or people would just continue to call it D&D.

Just because a company tries to bury something, that doesn't mean it will stay buried.

Had a New Coke lately?

Seeing as the whole thing about "New Coke" was switching from cane sugar to HFCS, basically, I'd say most Coke drinkers probably have. ;-)

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Marc Radle wrote:
…and I believe YOU meant British gaming magazine White Dwarf, not White Wolf :)

I think when GW turned it into a house organ, I blocked the name from my memory. Thanks for the save. ;-)

Liberty's Edge

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He didn't "win the role", Pryor was frozen out (after writing half the movie) by the studio.

Liberty's Edge

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Distant Scholar wrote:
Silke wrote:
For D&D purists it’s annoying that Paizo have labelled Kenku as Tengu. I imagine it was done for intellectual property reasons.

Um ... Er ...

For mythology purists it's annoying that Wizards of the Coast had labelled (crow) Tengu as Kenku. I imagine it was done because they weren't exactly mimicking crow tengu, or so I hope.

You mean, Wizards of the Coast retained the name TSR used for the critter in the first edition Fiend Folio? The one submitted by a fan to White Wolf magazine in the Seventies? Just checking.

Liberty's Edge

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Logan1138 wrote:
houstonderek wrote:
Re: healing. Anything, even decent ideas, that even HINT at 4e influence, makes some people mad. I like it, personally, cuts down on the whining about misusing resources.
Yeah, I'm guilty on that score. I hated 4th edition (never even deigned to play it) and its "healing surges" and was not a fan of the "hit dice" healing mechanic of 5E until I actually played a few sessions and now I'm kinda, sorta, maybe...okay with it. That was a difficult admission for an old grognard like myself.

I didn't care much for 4e overall, but it did have some nice innovations. I'm glad a few of them made it into 5e.

First game in '79, o I am right there with you on the old school front. ;-)

Liberty's Edge

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Re: healing. Anything, even decent ideas, that even HINT at 4e influence, makes some people mad. I like it, personally, cuts down on the whining about misusing resources.

Liberty's Edge

Yep, spell casting is much more intuitive and useful, without completely making martial classes worthless. Flattening the power curve is a nice touch, too. Lots to like about 5e.

Liberty's Edge

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The 3x OGL will never happen again, outside of Paizo keeping an iteration alive, since it would be a bad move not to, considering. Just be thankful that Dancey pushed for that the week the entire Hasbro legal team was in a coma, otherwise gaming would look a lot different right now.

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I'll be working the vendor area Saturday morning/afternoon if anyone wants to stop by. I'll be at one of the tee shirt tables.

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Pretty hard to assume Paizo came up with the idea independently, seeing as the idea has been discussed on this thread, on their site, for quite some time now.

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I have the core set (plus a, for you pointless, DM screen), so I'm ready for some 5e. I'm pretty much burned out on all things 3e based right now, to be honest, and even less interested in anything based off of Pathfinder.

Liberty's Edge

Freehold DM wrote:

points wildly

HD?!?!

:-)

Liberty's Edge

TheRavyn wrote:
Dustin Ashe wrote:

On second thought, as soon as my Jade Regent campaign wraps, I'm switching to 5e rules but staying with Pathfinder APs. I'll start Rise of the Runelords next.

Why not have the best of both worlds?

You're gonna like it. Converting RotRL to 5E is a breeze and we're having a blast. We just wrapped book 4 last week, and are now officially entering "high level" 5E.

That's kind of the beauty of 5e, really. If it was D&D (or PF), it's relatively easy to convert, since you're mostly stripping stuff away.

Liberty's Edge

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Vic Wertz wrote:
GreyWolfLord wrote:
I think Paizo has a fallibility that they believe their own stories a little too much. They talk about splitting the lines weakening the brand, but to tell the truth, ONE major reason I think TSR's D&D was dominate for soooo long was because the SPLIT the line directly between D&D and AD&D.

This isn't just some "story." When Wizards bought TSR, Lisa was assigned the task of figuring out why TSR was in in such dire straits that they *needed* to be bought. She collected sales data on pretty much every significant product TSR ever published, interviewed former and then-current employees and distributors, and Wizards did the largest survey of gamers ever done in the industry. She managed to pull together data that even TSR execs didn't have access to when they were running the company. And all this data showed that every new campaign setting split the market more than it grew the market.

And this wasn't just historical—we saw it happen in front of our eyes while we published three adventures in every issue of Dungeon magazine. If we published a Forgotten Realms adventure, Greyhawk players would complain they couldn't use a third of the magazine, and vice versa. And, as I've mentioned before, there was one particular campaign setting (which I won't name) that, if we put its name on the cover of the magazine, it would guarantee that we'd sell fewer copies of that issue that the issues before or after it, even when more than 2/3 of the magazine had nothing to do with that setting.

Spelljammer? ;-)

Liberty's Edge

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Sissyl wrote:
Well then, do Elfshadow. It has it all, and is magnitudes better than Salvatore's books. Or Azure bonds.

My five year old daughter took a Salvatore novel last night. Couldn't go into the bathroom for an hour afterward.

Liberty's Edge

GreyWolfLord wrote:
houstonderek wrote:
In 2015, Hasbro still sells more Ouija Boards and Battleship games than D&D.

ACTUALLY...moneywise...boardgames has made less than WotC over the past few years, and D&D actually HAS made more money than any of the games you've listed just recently in their most recent reports. At least that's what I've gathered from others (Such as their quarterly statements).

Saying their boardgames are individually outselling D&D is a misnomer.

The only real counterpoint is that they have sunk a LOT more money into D&D development than those boardgames, but I don't think the boardgames you've listed are actually selling as well as you think they are recently.

So, what you're saying is, core rule books for D&D outsold Battleship. Not money generated by D&D was higher than money generated by Battleship, that the Player's Handbook for Fifth Edition outsold Battleship in units sold.

Liberty's Edge

MMCJawa wrote:
Forever Slayer wrote:

The title says it all.

Lord of the Rings, Harry Potter, and a lot of other movies have been there done that. I remember something about that Seventh Son movie that came out. Looked very much like a D&D type of movie but it looks like it got bad reviews.

Hasbro is so focused on a movie that I believe they aren't really worried about the D&D TTRPG game itself, but what exactly could a D&D movie bring that other movies have not? I mean we already have those other god awful movies that people haven't forgotten.

Do you think they could pull off a blockbuster?

I didn't realize their was a only a specific number of big screen fantasy movies that were allowed to be made.

To make a similar point, why do we need more comic book movies? Don't we have enough? Yet in 2016 we are, from my superficial glance, getting 6 new superhero movies from 3 studios (Deadpool, Gambit, Age of Apocalypse, Suicide Squad, Batman vs Superman, Dr Strange, and Civil War).

The LotRs, Harry Potter, and Game of Thrones have all been super successful, which shows there is money to be made in the epic fantasy genre, as long as you take the material seriously and don't run afoul of any of the typical big budget movie problems.

Look at it this way: Hasbro has made billions (yes, billions) on Transformers, a property about robots that fight each and turn into trucks. Hell they turned Battleship and the Ouija Board into (bad) movies. Compared to those properties, producing a big budget DnD movie should be a cinch, since you have numerous settings, adventures, novels, and rule books to pull from.

Also, the relative merit of the older movies really isn't a factor that needs much consideration. The average movie watcher at this point has forgotten those movies exist, and there are far far more visible franchise properties that have been rebooted in even less time. Also, Hasbro can provide a far better budget and better talent than anything sweet pea can produce.

So yeah, Hasbro can make a...

In 2015, Hasbro still sells more Ouija Boards and Battleship games than D&D.

Liberty's Edge

Make Drizz't more popular, and, therefore, more annoying.

Liberty's Edge

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Juda de Kerioth wrote:
Forever Slayer wrote:

Big corporations are the bane of RPG's and Hasbro is no exception.

I believe D&D would be better off in the hands of a smaller company who does not see D&D as a mega money maker but as a table top game that may not earn you billions, will earn you a nice profit while giving gamers the game they want. I see Hasbro as the kind of company that would break that antique piggy bank in order to get to the money inside. I could see them getting frustrated because D&D didn't meet their crazy goals and shelving it.

What get's me is a company like Hasbro and WoTC can't seem to walk and chew gum at the same time.

Paizo is a big company now and act like one. Sell nearly 15 items per month... at least wotc doesn´t sell too much things at the same time.

Love the game, hate the money farming tool that we have become for them

Paizo is a pretty small company, actually. WotC is a subsidiary of a big company that sells tens (if not hundreds, considering all of their subsidiaries and licensees) of thousands of distinct products a month. Fifteen items a month, a few of which aren't anything but maps and accessory stuff, is hardly an overwhelming product release schedule.

Edit, just because: And, yeah, it's sad the talent actually wants to eat. If you don't want to be a money farming tool, make your own rules up and get your friends to play with you.

Liberty's Edge

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thejefff, D&D is a fantasy game. Make a good fantasy movie with the fighter/rogue/wizard/cleric combo working as a group to overthrow evil. Throw in some recognizable D&D monsters. That's it, all you need to slap "D&D" on it and make it a D&D movie. The general non-nerd raging public doesn't care how "accurately" any movie portrays any source material, and they're the ones that make movies profitable. Let's look at some other Hasbro owned properties that made a ton of money at the movies, GI Joe and Transformers. The only people crying about those two movies (all of which made lot of money, by the way) were people upset that the movies deviated from the Hasbro licensed thirty minute commercials they produced to sell action figures like hotcakes. Complaining about the accuracy of something based on a cartoon used to sell toys. The general public doesn't CARE.

See, the ONLY issue is what's good advice for a studio, as Hasbro will make all of their money on the licensing of the brand name. Hasbro does't sell movies. They sell toys. A movie isn't going to instantly revive the gaming hobby, there is a current edition that Hasbro is selling, so I guess I don't understand your perspective.

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davrion wrote:
houstonderek wrote:
captain yesterday wrote:
I loved the choose your own adventure books they put out for dungeons and dragons, can't tell you how many times I tried to kill off the hero in those by making obviously stupid choices. ah, good times
I loved those also! My favorite had an elf protagonist and a bugbear with a good one liner when he did you in if you chose wrong. Can't remember the name, but it might have been the second or third in the series?
Was it Return to Brookmere?

That's the one. :-)

Liberty's Edge

Funny, every con I go to, the crowd is the same, with fewer and fewer new young faces every year. Some people who used to play might be coming back here and there, but it's an aging hobby. And, if you look past the frustrating parts of the 5e release and think like a bean counter, you know companies do not leave free money on the table. Hasbro knows the market, there's a reason the 5e release wasn't huge, with all kinds of bells and whistles. The 3x/4e thing proved one thing, D&D (whether you call it Pathfinder now or not) is the only game in town. Pretty much every other game that "competes" against Paizo is so niche as to be insignificant in the market.

Plus, you live near the birthplace of TTRPGs, and have long winters. Trust me, in Houston, gaming isn't nearly as big as it was when I moved here. The RPG shelf space in most stores is a small fraction of what it was in the late Eighties, with six or seven systems, not scores, represented on the shelf. The only TTRPG selling in any numbers that would make an MBA notice is Pathfinder.

The hobby is only truly supporting one system, with a few others being a labor of love for the publishers. That is a death knell.

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bugleyman wrote:

I don't doubt for a minute that D&D is barely on Hasbro's radar, especially resource-wise. However, what I see as the problems with 5E aren't resource related:

1. Lack of PDFs. These already exist as part of the production process. At most they require some work to lock down permissions, etc. No way this is a resource issue; Hasbro simply fears digital distribution (and have said as much).

2. No OGL. Again, likely not a resource issue, as they could simply release 5E under the existing OGL. Clearly the people at Wizards want to do something with a license, but Hasbro with it's very limited understanding of the RPG market, likely forbids it. They just know that "the OGL created Pathfinder, our greatest competitor," completely missing the fact that the genie is out of the bottle, so all they're accomplishing at this point is discouraging the sort of support they *do* want (modules, etc.) out of fear of someone forking 5E (which they could already do, if determined enough).

3. No character generator. Quit trying to write software and give Herolab the license. Again, not a resource constraint. This one I really don't get, unless Hasbro thinks they should be making all that money themselves and somehow still haven't figured out that they can't do software.

In short, the mishandling of 5E is related to Hasbro's lack of understanding of the market. What they *should* is allow D&D to operate autonomously, or nearly so, but we know that isn't the case because you have Hasbro execs making statements about piracy, etc.

Will Hasbro kill D&D? I dunno. But they certainly aren't doing it any favors, at least not as an RPG. They may be great for the value of the brand.

1. This seems to be important to a lot of people. So I'll grant it is a "mistake".

2. Get over the OGL. It was a WotC thing that Hasbro wanted nothing to do with. It saved gaming a few years of decline, and created a scenario where the company lost market share TO THEIR OWN GAME. The OGL is a good thing for people who want all gaming to be resolved by a d20, but it was a poor business decision if just based on unintended consequences.

3. When they get the license stuff right, I'm sure HeroLabs (or whomever) will have one. It's obvious that Hasbro isn't really interested in 5e as anything but a placeholder, and are in no rush to develop much beyond the core. Paizo is carrying the torch now, the hobby is niche, and it doesn't need a strong D&D to survive, as it isn't a growth hobby by any stretch.

I think Hasbro probably understands the actual MARKET just fine, even if they don't understand the TTRPG market customers, as in, they know how small it is, they know that trying to grow it is a waste of money in the face of consoles and PC gaming (but the license for the video games is pure gold), and they know the name is bigger than the game by a long shot. That you dislike what they're doing is immaterial, they know exactly what they're doing, and are probably maximizing the profit they can get out of the flagship NAME in a shrinking market.

TTRPG had its moment in the sun, don't expect Hasbro to chase the nostalgia dollar.

Liberty's Edge

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Forever Slayer wrote:
captain yesterday wrote:
Forever Slayer wrote:
Steve Geddes wrote:

You think Hasbro know about making RPGs?

I'm a little confused as to what your point is (other than being disappointed they're releasing expansions so slowly - which is probably WotC's decision, based on their recent experiences making RPGs, rather than anything mandated by hasbro).

What makes you think Hasbro aren't calling the shots this time?

It's already been stated that building the brand through movies, video games, mugs, tshirts,etc is what's important. That sounds more in line with how Hasbro thinks and not WoTc.

yeah certainly a small company like Paizo has no interest in expanding into video games or T-shirts or adorably cute plush goblins so why would WotC :-) that's all basics of brand building, like taught in elementary school basics :-)

Certainly WotC didn't need Hasbro to tell them to do that :-)

Thing is, Paizo has shown they can do all this and still keep Pathfinder in the spotlight with no slowing down.

Wizards can't seem to grasp that concept.

Wizards was fine until they made mistakes with 4e and let Paizo take control of the market. Apparently someone at Hasbro doesn't think it is worth the fight to try to take that market back, and is happy going minimalist with a well received, well put together placeholder they can give some (if not nearly enough for the typical gamer) support for over time. It's a good core game they have in 5e, it just came out at a time when most of the fantasy RPG money is going to another company, and the market is too small for two huge systems that essentially cover the exact same ground (just one without mind flayers and displacer beasts).

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captain yesterday wrote:
I loved the choose your own adventure books they put out for dungeons and dragons, can't tell you how many times I tried to kill off the hero in those by making obviously stupid choices. ah, good times

I loved those also! My favorite had an elf protagonist and a bugbear with a good one liner when he did you in if you chose wrong. Can't remember the name, but it might have been the second or third in the series?

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Spook205 wrote:
Forever Slayer wrote:
Steve Geddes wrote:

You think Hasbro know about making RPGs?

I'm a little confused as to what your point is (other than being disappointed they're releasing expansions so slowly - which is probably WotC's decision, based on their recent experiences making RPGs, rather than anything mandated by hasbro).

What makes you think Hasbro aren't calling the shots this time?

It's already been stated that building the brand through movies, video games, mugs, tshirts,etc is what's important. That sounds more in line with how Hasbro thinks and not WoTc.

Or how TSR thought.

Dragonstrike, a Candyland style D&D Board Game (My Grandmother had one!), Dragon Dice, the old cartoon show, the action figures. I remember as a kid there were even little storybooks on tape (one involved some knight having to get a cure for his wizard friend).

Let's not get into the Evil Corporations What Corporate stuff here.

Hasbro only differs from TSR in that they're more competent, more risk adverse, and more demanding that their products actually make a profit.

Don't forget they're actually run by business people and not hobbyists.

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Matrix Dragon wrote:
houstonderek wrote:

Here's one place Hasbro is winning. To the vast majority of the population, if they see a bunch of people gaming, they assume "Dungeons and Dragons". Outside of our bubble, no one knows what the hell "Paizo" or "Pathfinder" are.

Well, people used to think that all video game systems were "nintendos". These sorts of things don't last forever, though it will probably take longer in a smaller market like this one.

Unfortunately, video games blew up. Role playing games have been on a slow slide into irrelevance (market wise) since the Eighties. TTRPG isn't "building up" to anything. It's shrinking.

Liberty's Edge

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Vic Wertz wrote:
houstonderek wrote:
Yep. Petey wanted to cash out. Blame him for Hasbro.
While Peter was certainly instrumental in the Hasbro purchase of Wizards, it took the majority of Wizards of the Coast shareholders to actually make it happen. Lisa and I both voted to sell, and we have no regrets about that. (For that matter, I don't know a single Wizards shareholder who does regret it.) So if you're passing around "blame," put some right here.

The statement was simplistic. I should have said "blame", I guess, as I don't "blame" Peter, you, Lisa, or anyone for turning down a bunch of money (some of which probably resulted in the start up needed to get Paizo off the ground). I was responding to the piling on Hasbro, a game and toy company that doesn't pay a ton of attention to a very niche market, and makes decisions accordingly.

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Bill Dunn wrote:
houstonderek wrote:


Yep. Petey wanted to cash out. Blame him for Hasbro. But, had he not started WotC (and published M:TG) and made a ton of money, TSR was over. WotC pretty much kept TTRPGs relevant. Just be thankful Lisa and her crew, Pramas, Wolfgang, and a gang of others who were rejuvenated by the popularity of 3x, were there to carry the torch when WotC sold out and bean counters took over the decision making from the talent.
Let's not simply blame Peter for wanting to "cash out". Selling to Hasbro enabled quite a few people who invested a lot into WotC to get the payback they deserved.

I never blame. I'm just pointing out that it's a business, and gamers take it way too personally sometimes. Peter and his investors went with the best deal. Not for the TTRPG D&D, but for them.

Pathfinder pretty much pet 3.5 alive, and kept the hobby from completely falling into ruin. They're the top dog in the market now, and most of the smaller dogs support their product in one way or another, if not supporting Pathfinder being their entire business model. With the market realities what they are, Paizo would have to lose a lot of ground for Hasbro to see enough incentive to try and lap up the lost customers. Otherwise, fighting Paizo with a fantasy game based on D&D, using basically the same classes, races, monsters, etc. really isn't a smart use of marketing and branding budget. They put out a decent core for people that just have to have D&D on the book cover.

Liberty's Edge

The fact that the games are tied to the same setting as the one D&D branded print product (the novel line) that actually is fairly popular outside of the gaming realm makes selling the video games to casual PC and console gamers that much easier as well. Hasbro knows what they're doing, and what they're doing is making money.

I wish they let WotC have more autonomy in the TTRPG market, but I think the bean counters are just ceding that to Paizo. I really dig what the talent came out with this time, and I am a little sad it won't get full on Paizo level support. But, Hasbro isn't a gaming company, they're a game and toy company. If I like what they put out, I'll spend a few bucks (5e), if they don't, I won't (4e). Either way, I'm not going to lament the state of the hobby. It had a good run and let some people live a dream and get paid to game, but it's pretty much going to keep becoming more niche until the only people playing are future hipsters enjoying a "bespoke, hand crafted" gaming experience.

Liberty's Edge

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Here's one place Hasbro is winning. To the vast majority of the population, if they see a bunch of people gaming, they assume "Dungeons and Dragons". Outside of our bubble, no one knows what the hell "Paizo" or "Pathfinder" are.

Liberty's Edge

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LazarX wrote:
Forever Slayer wrote:

Big corporations are the bane of RPG's and Hasbro is no exception.

You should take a look at your history. TSR itself would have been the downfall of D+D if it had not been bought out by WOTC. Hasbro had no interest in D+D when they in turn bought out WOTC. They bought the company for Magic and D+D pretty much came along with the package.

Yep. Petey wanted to cash out. Blame him for Hasbro. But, had he not started WotC (and published M:TG) and made a ton of money, TSR was over. WotC pretty much kept TTRPGs relevant. Just be thankful Lisa and her crew, Pramas, Wolfgang, and a gang of others who were rejuvenated by the popularity of 3x, were there to carry the torch when WotC sold out and bean counters took over the decision making from the talent.

I can't say this enough. In the greater land, TTRPG is about as relevant as Nixon, other than as a source of imaginative people to make TV shows and stuff. It isn't a fad anymore. It's an aging hobby that gets smaller every generation. Not enough bells and whistles. Actually requires, to be done in its full glory, people to gather in one place and not look at their phones for four to six hours. It requires algebra homework level math to keep your character up to snuff. It's is full of opinionated a~&$!+&s with social issues. It has a lot going against it if you're looking for it to be what TSR had in the Eighties. Like, TSR competed with maybe fifteen channels and Atari, Paizo is a relatively small, but successful in its niche company that OWNS what is left of the TTRPG market, and thus can survive and expand. And they're competing against a company that doesn't really care about the TTRPG market (I'm sure the creative talent does, but the money men like money). Otherwise, their "competition" is either too unstable to matter (Shadowrun), niche (Traveller, whatever Hero edition they're on, GURPS), or not even playing the game (D&D). It looks like everything is hunky-dory if you're a Paizo fan, but, apparently you're too busy looking at the water gurgling from the ground to notice you're an oasis in a wasteland, market-wise.

Hasbro knows the name "Dungeons and Dragons" is FAR more valuable than the actual game. They don't give a crap about the game. They want to keep building the brand in the video game market. Any D&D video game will dwarf Paizo's sales. It's a video game. They don't need the game to carry the name and make money.

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