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Well said, it is particularly galling when after developing a character one is told that they are almost useless because of a non-standard rule interpretation.
There is nothing wrong with the mysterious stranger but they miss out on the level 5 bonus to damage of some other archetypes because they don't get musket or pistol training which provide a similar effect to 'focused aim' for every shot without needing grit.* And now we come to grit, grit is simultaneously the most annoying and powerful part of gunslinging - you need to keep one point of grit for some deeds, and you can never regain a point of grit when you need it, but using grit makes you shots much more powerful; my Rules For Grit Use are don't assume you will have grit, never spend the last point even for a 'sure' kill which will recover a point, spend one point ASAP so it can be recovered on a crit (which only seem to happen when you have full grit) and spend the middle points when you have a decent chance of a kill shot or need the extra damage.
rapid shot is pretty powerful, allowing the gunslinger to make an extra attack on a full attack action for -2 to hit on all attacks. Since without this feat a level 1-5 gunslinger usually only gets 1 attack (and a level 20 only gets 4) the advantage is obvious. The feat has a requirement that the point blank shot feat be taken first, and it isn't a bad feat. +1 to hit & damage within 30' when almost all your attacks will be within 30' is not to be sneered at.
precise shot is an iffy one for me. A major point of gunslingers is that they have a really good chance to hit, and precise shot only improves hit chance. but it is a big improvement to hit chance, effectively +4 because the vast majority of time you will be firing into melee.
At level 11 signature deed becomes available and should be taken - it is that powerful. A mysterious stranger can take focused fire as their signature deed and add CHR to every shot for free.
Do not forget that gunslingers get bonus feats at level 4,8,12,16&20.
*stranger's fortune has been rewritten so that mysterious strangers get gun training 2 at level 9 (they never got it before), but this is still DEX to damage while the archetype is CHR focused. this rewrite allows higher level mysterious strangers to remain competitive and tells why the mysterious stranger was considered weak.
the David wrote:
All of that will go away pretty quick once he falls though. I mean come on, an Infiltrator following a Lawful deity? That's setting yourself up to fall.
does it not say of inquisitors that "they are above many of the normal rules and conventions of the church. They answer to their deity and their own sense of justice alone?" Unlike a paladin who falls if they fail to obey a specific set of rules, an inquisitor falls if they "slip into corruption". Further, an inquisitor who falls loses spells and judgements, the other class abilities remain.
---edit: now I'm thinking of how to exploit a fallen inquisitor. spells & judgements are a part of the class, but bane, inquisition/domain powers, initiative, stern gaze, solo tactics and so on are a bigger part of the class.
Ephemeral versus Eternal. Side names are not 100% literal but on one side are the races with a lifespan longer than humans who think and plan on the scale of centuries and the other side are those with a lifespan shorter than humans who need to get stuff done now before death claims them. In theory the eternals are more powerful since they can plan more effectively, in practice the ephererals keep up by not having to live with the long term effects of their actions.
Marcus Robert Hosler wrote:
I actually find the opposite correlation to generally be more true. It tends to be the unoptimised characters that are the worst RPers because they generally care less about the game or have mistaken philosophies about what constitutes good RPing.
I've seen the same correlation but I find the cause to be different. The problem I have encountered is that players create a character intending the character to function some way and the character is mechanically deficient at functioning that way. This too often results in spending inordinate amounts of time explaining to the player why the mechanics keep the character from doing what the players wants them to do. There are many game systems out there, many with forgiving mechanics (see Paranoia's dramatic-tactical combat resolution mechanism), but PF is a mechanics heavy gaming system compared to such games as Fiasco.
Yeah, what you're asking to do is basically Flurry. Do it with a Temple Sword, or a Nine-Section Whip if you're one of the Kool Kids (there is no weapon radder than a chain whip).
When did the urumi become non-kool?
TWF cannot BUT monks can effectively use TWFing with one weapon not switching hands when flurrying and the wording of the class ability for the brawler class implies strongly that this applies to brawlers flurry too.
Is that party of 6 characters?
A pack of wererats. Maybe they were normal rats which entered the dungeon and were mutated by some residual magic effect, maybe they are the descendants of experimental subjects, or maybe they are just wererats which found the dungeon and made a lair there (best not to have an answer to this). Regardless of how they got there, they now have a system of warrens too small for most humanoids which has secret entrances in various dungeon rooms and a significant number of rat-type allies they use to swarm invaders - while a wererat or rat swarm is only CR2, a wererat with 4 dire rats and 4 rat swarms appearing in the middle of the party should cause tactical confusion and present a challenge even though it is a nominally underlevel encounter.
In defense of the class description defining the character it is true for paladins. While there is a lot of diversity in how to paladins can be played, in the end a paladin is locked into being, well a paladin.
Kain Darkwind wrote:
. Personally, I like to see evil people being evil. I want to see them torturing, raping, murdering, bringing forth demons and devils, etc. I don't like bumbling caricatures of villainy. LE deserves to break a few people on the rack so that the rest of the rabble stays in line.
Not me, I like my evil of the primrose path variety. I find the dedicated to being evil types boring (although not realistic, see Alister Crowley). I much prefer to have my evil come from corruption, start with torturing one person to save hundreds of lives and twenty years later it's time to throw people into the ovens. Corrupting evil just makes such a better story line.
----edit: realistic should be unrealistic
Korada is legal as he shows up in the inner sea world guide, I don't believe Lythertida is legal for PFS as she appears to only show up in the Chronicles which have been replaced by the guide.
obviously you have the tentacled ape perform magic tricks (or a tentacle porn show if your audience is elves) and then unleash a pack of monkey pickpockets on the crowd while they are distracted watching the show.
H.P. Makelovecraft wrote:
One level of warpriest gives weapon focus rock. Unless of course the argument is now that ricks aren't weapons.
It's always been the problem with the build, the rock isn't on any the weapon charts, so while a GM could houserule the creation of the rock weapon, it would still only be a houserule. I thought with the introduction of the Tech Guide that finally the rock weapon would be introduced, but it seems that while the Androff have developed nanotech and lasars they have not reached the tech level needed to use the rock as a weapon. How much sophistication does it take to use a rock as a weapon instead of an improvised weapon?
Deaths Adorable Apprentice wrote:
phantom ship and phantom warship are not listed spells, I was about to go to sleep when I posted this list and forgot that. If the level 3 spells cover 1 person, and the level 4 spells cover 6 people than a level 5 spell should cover 36 people and a level 6 spell should cover 216 people.
Well since a peasant/commoner is unlikely to be able to afford a 2,000g+ amulet of natural armor, I would count most such magic items as 'jewelry' for noble & courtier's outfits. While you might not look like a fop who cares only about your appearance, you also wouldn't look like someone who doesn't have two coppers to rub together. As for the extremely fashionable trait, I'm not so sure, but if anyone can make a fashion trend out of a patch of xorn hide hanging from a leather throng it would be someone with that trait.
The phantom spells listed multiple the number of people affected by 6 per level so:
level 3 phantom steed for 1 person
it was a rhetorical question to lead to the next level of adventure after the expedition against the land pirates and conquering the pirate grove.
If I were running this idea the druid is not sending out the liveoaks for land piracy, he is sending them out looking for something. An embittered community of halfling ex-slaves is taking advantage of these liveoaks by building treeships in the trees he is using and engaging in piracy, believing that the druid will protect them if anyone finds the pirate grove.
Argh, now my mind is stuck on the concept of a druid using gangs of halfling & gnome pirates to raid the countryside from treehouses built into oak trees he casts liveoak on. Why is the druid doing this?
A shallow draft ship and an uppowered slipstream spell would be an interesting effect, why restrict your piracy to the oceans when you can bring the ocean with you?
Put legs on a ship and the have a magic user make it a permanent animated object. Alternatively an arcane caster could cast possess object and take control of the ship with legs.
There is a phantom steed spell and a phantom chariot spell, why not a phantom longship spell?
A treehouse in a liveoak or treant would make an interesting pirate ship.
Not realistic but I like the idea - the sonic glider. A well padded platform with hanging skirts (think hovercraft) forms the hull of the ship which moves along by a bard casting a movable wall of sound underneath it. For something which is more realistic and doesn't require a new spell there is the oread spell raging rubble, multiple oreads cast the spell and move the rubble which carries the ship.
I haven't seen anything in the ACG that obviously breaks the game or ratchets the game up to a higher power level. However humans are devious little buggers and I have complete faith in their ability to break any system, thus I am sure that in short order someone will come up with a way to abuse some corner case in the new rules and create an uber-character.
If you are thinking in terms of the mythical balanced classes and archetypes then yes, some parts of the ACG are 'too good' - but this is true for the entire system. For example if a player wants to do melee sneak attacks then the beastmorph-vivisectionist alchemist is so much better than the rogue that it is 'too good'. And that brings out the heart of the matter, can the ACG hybrids build all the characters a player might want better than the other classes, and the answer is no. An arcanist is not going to make a fast-talking arcane caster superior to a sorcerer, for example. What the ACG classes do is provide ways to better make characters which preciously were built from other classes.
Someone is just upset because bards have dervish dancer, dervish of the dawn & dawnflower dervish archetypes. Some people might even confuse the bard archetype dervish dancer with the feat dervish dance or the dervish of the dawn bard archetype with the dervish of the dawn fighter archetype.
really complaining about reusing names in the ACG is silly, just be glad there isn't another dervish in there.
you can wield a one handed weapon with both hands, if it is a light weapon it has not effect but if it is a one-handed weapon (and not using flurry) it receives 1+1/2 STR bonus to damage. The flurry ability can be used to apply flurry to a two-handed weapon and instead of getting 1+1/2 STR bonus it would only get STR damage. this is in accord with the way monks flurry with a 2H weapon per the CRB "A monk applies his full Strength bonus to his damage rolls for all successful attacks made with f lurry of blows, whether the attacks are made with an off-hand or with a weapon wielded in both hands."
I cannot figure out the purpose of inexplicable reload. When IR becomes available by BAB the character will have 3 attacks if full attacking, but IR only allows 2 attacks per round for light and hand crossbows without rapid reload and all other crossbows with rapid reload. but hand and light crossbows get free action reloading already with rapid reload and are the only ones which permit a full attack with or without inexplicable reload.
I don't think it is an issue.
Deadshot says: At 7th level, as a full-round action ... When she does this, she shoots the firearm at a single target, but makes as many attack rolls as she can, based on her base attack bonus...
There are two points here
thus deadshot makes 2 attack rolls when used by a character with a BAB of 7-10, 3 attack rolls when used by a character with a BAB of 11-15 and 4 attack rolls when used a character with a BAB of 16-20. It isn't gamebreaking to allow rapid shot or haste to increase the number of attack rolls by 1 each, but it is against RAW. With automatic weapons it seems like it could easily be gamebreaking so use RAW and avoid the issue.
---edit: should have written 'has to be an issue' not "is an issue"
Grippi can use their tongue to hold a pistol while reloading (might want to wipe it off though).
Glove of storing works because switching hands is a free action per a FAQ, although I cannot remember which one.
Monkey belt costs 9K+ but gives +2 DEX in addition to a tail so isn't all that bad (a +4 DEX belt costs 16k and you might miss out on that but a +6 DEX belt costs 36K and you are getting near pistol of infinite sky territory when you can afford a 36K belt).
At that point, just get Pistols of the Infinite Sky. :)
I wish I could say you were wrong, but we are looking at the level where Pistols of the Infinite Sky are affordable before TWFing pistols using gun twirling pays off. A human gunslinger could get all the feats to TWF using base TWfing at level 9, but level 11 is signature deed and level 12 would be improved (not greater) TWFing.
Not terrible but enough to confine TWFing with pistols to high levels.
To TWF with pistols at all effectively using gun twirling a character needs the following 5 feats:
rapid reload (pistol)
And with those 5 feats you are less effective with two pistols than a single pistol user with these 3 feats:
rapid reload (pistol)
The worm in the apple is that once a gunslinger has those 3 feats then adding TWF with gun twirling is an excellent option.
Eric Hinkle wrote:
Investigators do that now.
---edit: oh, and it is also a slayer talent if you prefer slayer to investigator.
You forgot that it only works for martial artists (Calistra is a CN Goddess). Of course Lissala (LE) also has whip as a favored weapon, is LE and theologically accords nicely with monks. As far as I know it would take a GM custom deity for a LG monk (cleric 1) access to a flurrying whip. Note that as a cleric of Lissala or Calistra you get weapon proficiency (whip) for free at level 1.
Also, although I do not own the adventure to be sure, last spring it seems that a deity (Selket?) who has the scorpion whip (not whip) as a favored weapon was published. This implies that only the regular whip, and not the scorpion whip, would qualify as the favored weapon of Lissala or Calistra so the whip mastery feat is almost mandatory.
Was thinking about greater grappling and vital strike, and it could be fairly useful, a quick concept build.
Random Name (Randy) The Wrestler
Barbarian Brutal Pugilist
Level 1: fast movement, rage, improved unarmed strike (feat), +1 rage round (FC)
magic items: anaconda coils as soon as possible.
With anaconda's coils the barbarian would enter a rage, move to an enemy, grapple and make an IUS strike and a constrict attack for from the belt. After grappling the barbarian would bite (animal fury), maintain grapple as a move action, inflict damage with grapple, constrict attack from belt, vital strike as a standard action.
Just an idea, but if you are going to be a gunslinger, you have a significant misfire chance with each attack, which can result in your DPR not being as impressive as you'd expect when firing against touch AC. However there are guns that do a bunch of dice, but they usually take extra time to reload and have weird requirements like rolling them around in a cart or standing them up against a wall (which may require move actions) For some gunslinger's, you may see higher DPR when using vital strike then full attacking. I'm going to run the numbers through a spreadsheet and see what I can come up with.
gunslingers get deadshot deed without investing feats.
Advice #1 don't screw with power sources and generators, the limit of them is what keeps Tech from becoming universal.
ideas for pleasure pad functions
biological status monitor : duplicates the deathwatch spell and detect poison
truestar navigation system : never get lost again, this system allows the setting of up to 15 waypoints and the user can always find their position in terms of direction and distance on a map relative to any of those waypoint. note that maps themselves are completely inaccurate and terrain in the world does not match the terrain on the maps.
Friend of the Dork wrote:
Not quite, you cannot retrain a feat which is prerequisite for another feat, prestige class or other class ability. For instance you could not retrain dimensional agility to dimensional dervish because dimensional agility is a prerequisite for dimensional assault.
It is a niche feat-line and not appropriate for many builds but there must be some. My last PF character got quit a bit of use out of vital strike, but that was because his schtick was sniping (and still he did more damage when he had to fight toe-to-toe and full attacked) so a sniping combatant is one build which benefits from vital strike. A grappling build with vital strike could conceivably, once they had greater grapple, use a move action to maintain the grapple and a standard action to vital strike.
Friend of the Dork wrote:
At level 10 bards gain access to level 4 spells including the spell Dimension Door. With the ability to cast dimension door a bard can select the feat dimensional agility, which allows the selection of dimensional assault leading to dimensional dervish. With dimensional dervish a bard can cast dimension door as a swift action to combat and then make a full action attack. So just get to level 15 (or level 10 if the GM allows feat retraining from Ultimate combat) & spend 3 feats so that your bard can pounce by using a level 4 spell.
Gwen Smith wrote:
well a barbarian with only 12 STR and no magic weapon at level 12 is in pretty tough shape to begin with and it is a good thing that the player found a way to make the character effective. A level 12 barbarian should have at least a +15 bonus to damage from STR, feats, weapon & so on in most games.
I've built more than a few vital strike characters (opponents no longer run up to the party to eat full attacks in my games) and the rule of thumb I use for vital strike versus full attack is that if the average weapon damage is higher than 3/4ths of the damage bonus then vital strike is a better choice. The 3/4ths is a fudge factor to account for the higher chance of missing with iterative attacks, DR, power attack, etc - it isn't an accurate value but is close enough and easy to use. If one were anal enough one could build a program to calculate if vital strike were a better option than full attack each round and use that.
There are slashing light weapons, wakizahi would probably be the best bet.
Well yes but, unless the feat has been fixed, slashing grace is limited to one-handed weapons and thus cannot be applied to light weapons.
Swashbuckler doesn't really obsolete any melee class that I can see, maybe the fighter going into duelist but that's about it. Now Slayer however, well the rogue was bad enough but I cannot see any reason to take a rogue when slayer is available.
Unless the Gm is being super nice and allowing the tail to reload, by RAW all it can do is retrieve things. The archetype does not suffer AoO while TWF with a pistol + weapon if the character limits itself to attacks with those two weapons in a given attack action.
The trick with tail reloading is to "retrieve" the weapon in your off-hand and reload while your off-hand is free. Abusive stretch of the rules, certainly, but it makes sword&gun or sword&pistol work. If the GM doesn't allow retrieving items from you hand, you take the grasping tail feat, make a point of free action dropping the weapon in your non-gun hand on the ground within 5', reloading and firing then swift action retrieving it from the ground.
Missed not getting the AoOs for firing bit on Sword & Gun. Character will still draw the AoOs on reloading though.
WRT to the build I assume gunsmithing feat at level 5 and PBS at 7 with precise shot at 9, but is slashing grace fixed so it includes light weapons or does it still have the no slashing weapons which are finessable problem?
Looking at the archetype in the Technology Guide, it seems you have two choices:
1. Assuming that an advanced firearm is not going to be available soon. Go tiefling (with tail to reload) and build as a gunslinger somewhat retarded in feats. Gunsmithing, rapid reload (weapon), point blank shot, rapid shot, deadly aim, precise shot.
2. Assume that an advanced firearm is going to be available soon. Go human and build as a gunslinger somewhat retarded in feats and switching out gunsmithing for rapid reload.
It would be nice if sword and gun were a viable option, but it isn't because the S&G Savage Technologist would be relying on DEX for AC without armor and snap shot takes too many feats, resulting in a poor unarmored barbarian taking AoOs when firing. If you intend to use a firearm as a barbarian then you should resign yourself to not being on the front line, consider TWFing pistols.
Rage powers are pretty open, you don't need to go beast for the pounce, elemental is useless and the spirit line would be more useful than for traditional melee focused barbarians.
Alternatively you could pretty much ignore firearms and go with a straight barbarian build. DEX instead of CON when raging isn't that bad, you could have more AC than a straight barbarian. Losing uncanny dodge/improved uncanny dodge and getting nothing in exchange might hurt but isn't crippling. Maybe grab a rifle for ranged combat if you want to use a firearm, but if STR focused you would be better off with an adaptive bow.
I dunno about thematically appropriate. Techslingers are gunslingers who trade in their primitive firearms for similar high tech weapons, but I don't think a rocket launcher functions enough like a blunderbuss to qualify as the same theme. If you wanted to apply Technic Training to a heavy weapon in my game, I would easily give you a vortex gun (described a 3 barreled shotgun) but never give you an atom gun (which probably looks more like a box with a lid than a firearm). The boost in damage that Technic Training provides is so small compared to the raw damage of heavy weapons that it would not cause a balance problem.
Dunno the designers intent but given the power of slow firing weapons and the fact that all except the id rifle are area-of-effect weapons I would say that AoOs from slow firing weapons is not allowed as it would be unbalancing.
I forgot the autograppel which has neither very high damage or an area-of effect but is strange enough in how it works to be a candidate for banning from AoOs.