Gold Dragon

caith's page

Organized Play Member. 444 posts (672 including aliases). 1 review. No lists. 1 wishlist. 1 Organized Play character. 4 aliases.



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Familiars now only grant the wielder an additional cantrip or spell slot, or allow them to deliver touch spells. Considering it takes a class feat to take a familiar now, why would anyone ever do so? I am starting to worry about PF2.


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Trolling the rules, it seems there are some of the classic options for Necromancy School Wizards - fear, HP drain, death stuff - but no way of summoning Undead? What's that all about?


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Chest Rockwell wrote:
My critique is of the seemingly complicated, large numbers, fiddly design (that Trinkets preview was not pleasing to read). Lots of moving parts, and the obvious new shiny thing of this edition being the 4-tiers of success system.

This is a total tangent, but I agree that my players will end up getting lost on the degress of success system. There was a time I thought something like this would be pretty cool, but now I can see it will probably be overly complex for your average roleplayer.


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Is it just me, or is a meager +3 not that impressive? By fourth level it is the smallest part of your total bonus, after your level and skill ranks. That +3 is lost in the shuffle by 10th level.


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Skerek wrote:

Vote here

Vancian is confirmed at this stage, but what kind of casting did you want? Why did you want that type of casting, why not the other kind?

I'm seeing a lot of people wanting Arcanist / 5e style casting so I'm wondering if there are people that are quietly contempt with the Vancian style casting or do the people just want Arcanist / 5e style casting.

I would have liked to see the Arcanist / 5e style casting but I'm not sure what would happen in regards to the Bard's and Sorcerer's spell casting if this were the case.

I would definitely prefer they go with Arcanist style. Especially if we're only ever getting 3 spells per day of any given level. I think going another step into a magic point system is a bit too flexible.


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Planpanther wrote:


Problem with this is if you ever lose that +x weapon your martial just got gimped. I dont mind weapons having magical effects thats fun and cool, but when they become necessary to function its a potential disaster.

I had a GM who was obsessed with rust monsters/demons/mephits/horses. Every couple of sessions he was trying to churn magic items. It was truly obnoxious.


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My great hope for PF2E is the retirement of generic magic items such as +1 swords and +1 armor. These items are boring as hell and just create an arms race where you need to have a certain bonus level to keep up. I would prefer more interesting items, and remove the stacking of bonus abilities such as having a vorpal firey human bane sword. If you want multiple effects you have to carry multiple swords and change weapons to adapt to the situation. I think this would make the game much more dynamic and interesting. And don't get me wrong, I love having those things, but I think it's bad for the game. Magic items should feel rare, powerful, and unique, rather than a commodity. I'd still be fine with, say, a weaker version of weapon types, such as a Greater Firey sword and a Lesser Firey sword.


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On the opposite side of this, I hope this get rid of all 'generic' magic items aka +1 sword, +1 armor, generic AC bonus items. Boring 'must have' items that simply add numbers. I know that a +1 sword is the most classic item in D&D, but I think it's time to lay the concept to rest in favor of more interesting items.


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As the GM, you're always free to veto these items as you see fit. My group finds tracking food and water taxing and I have ceased to bother. I just tag them for upkeep(at the cost of whatever I feel like - that's the cost of laziness!) about once a session.


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Multiclassing has not been good, in my opinion, since 2e D&D. I would love to see more options open up for multiclassing characters. Although Pathfinder has many options for reflavoring a character via archetypes, they often feel tacked on - and are mechanically so much worse than other classes, or give up too many essential class functions, that they are nonviable.

Please, let me play a rogue/wizard that is actually good! Thanks.


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Literally just hand-wave everything you don't like/understand and you'll have a blasty-blast.

For example, I am not enforcing at all detailed charge tracking. I tell my players to fudge it and arbitrarily tell them when they are probably running out of ammo. They think it's a fine compromise in lieu of tracking every shot. However on a roll of a 1, the current cartridge always explodes. It works out decently well. We are easing into ship combat. We will probably never use the full rules.

I'll also state that starting Starfinder characters are more interesting, more durable, and have more customization than base PF characters, or even Level 1 characters with 5 years of fluff tacked on. It is unreasonable to expect a game that is less than a year old to stand up to a game that has been out for 5+.

It's your choice, but I feel like you're not giving it a fair shake. Which, granted, you're only primarily hurting yourself, but griping on the boards like this might turn people off the game for no good reason. And that hurts Paizo.


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pauljathome wrote:

I haven't read the entirety of this thread so I apologize if consensus has already been reached.

I'm GM'ing the Dead Suns adventure path (we're in book 2 right now). I think grenades are definitely too expensive and want to lower the cost.

My current WAG is 40% of book cost.

Does that seem a reasonable reduction? Or will they get enough grenades from their enemies so that it really doesn't matter much?

Seems to me like it would be good to limit it by availability and make the cost scale as a % of WBL equal to the WBL % of a Level 1 grenade.

Either way, I built a spreadsheet to look at costing for SF grenades. There's a weird spike mid-level.

Starfinder Grenades, Analyzed


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Sex Tape.


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Science = Magic = Science

Job's done.


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A few things:

1. Everyone is not cut out to DM. Period.

2. Everyone is definitely not cut out to DM in every style.

3. A good DM plays to their strengths.

If you're past the hurdle of 1, make sure you are careful about 2, and paying close attention to 3. Maybe big battles just aren't your style. I know that prepared adventures are not mine. So I don't. I prep my own way and wing most of it and I do well. Even when running large Con games, I take the prepared material, find out what's important - and what I can improvise - and throw away the rest. If big epic battles aren't your thing, find another way to create a satisfying conclusion.

The final thing to consider is every game session is not going to be perfect. Sometimes the players are tired - or the DM is worn out. So everything could go perfect, and player engagement is low 'just because'.

Because of 2, it is very difficult to have an intensive, one-size-fits-all approach to "DM Training". There is lots of fairly low level advice spread throughout the Paizo library to get someone who has what it takes to DM up to snuff. The larger Internet DM advice consortium covers literally every other issue a DM could ever have. The best DM advice usually comes across laterally, from other DMs - not from above.


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Detoxifier wrote:

Wage a war of attrition.

If its a dungeon, have it set on some kind of timer, it is slowly filling up with water or sand, etc, that way they have to keep moving and cannot stop to rest and recover hit points or spells, and have to push from one encounter to the next with debuffs from previous fights/traps still active.

Yes, this. Or have it filling with something very dangerous, like poisonous fog, or a negative energy cloud that drains levels. Or have it filling with a cloud of darkness that is filled with swarms of very hazardous creatures that only attack when you enter.


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Buri Reborn wrote:
Rynjin wrote:
I've never seen the point in investing in Fortification armor. I've found that usually a Jingasa is plenty enough crit protection.
Then you have my Rise GM who crits on you with giants seemingly multiple times per combat or once per combat. This seems to happen with frequency.

Whenever I make a character, I always factor in that my GM will pass every save, and crit me with a high degree of frequency. He uses my dice, and sits right next to me. He does not cheat, ever; he is incredibly lucky.


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Kill the Rogue. Take the flack. Use the moment to teach a lesson about PvP. If the Rogue wants to try and pull some frankly ludicrous actions such as this, he has to be willing to pay the piper.

If that doesn't go well, find a new group. Try Meetup.com.

That said, every group I have ever played with has had a strict no-pvp policy that includes theft. Unless you have a very specific type of group, it is, IMO, the best way to ensure that everyone stays happy.


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Bjørn Røyrvik wrote:

Have a serious talk with the player. Tell him to stop being a jerk and metagame like he's doing. Don't accept 'but I'm just playing my character' because that's an excuse to continue acting like a jerk.

If he insists on playing a jerk, show him the door.

I think the metagame is a real person not being horrified by an undead creature and wanting to see it destroyed. I think metagame is investigating creatures that seem like obvious threats when you have the power to destroy them - saving your life and the lives of others.


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DM Controlling PCs - No
DM Determining World Details - Yes
DM Restricting Player Options - Yes
DM Restricting/Providing Input on Player Backstory - Depends, see above

Fluff - Fluff is basically the entire game. Without Fluff this is a Tactical Board Game. If you don't want fluff play PFS. Otherwise the DM is the arbiter of the rules - that is actually one of the rules; it's in the book. In the book, it states the DM is the judge and jury when it comes to rules decisions. However, the DM should apprise their group of all major rules changes BEFORE the game begins - and definitely before characters are created and finalized.

The DM is not a mouse and keyboard with buttons for you to press so that your video game plays out the way you want it. The DM is the storyteller, rules-arbiter, world-builder, and plays all of the world's characters. You play a single character that you create - respecting the DM's rules choices - which exists in the DM's world. That is the reality of this game. If you don't like that, play a board game or a video game.

P.S. Another rule of the game is 'fun'. All of that - the rules and whatever - is the backdrop which is essentially a contract between Player and DM to respect each other, and make the game fun. However, in order for that to happen, the rules must be respected so everyone is on a level playing field, so a simulation is created in which we can all exist and understand the imaginary world, and we can get down to just telling stories.


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The LG Zombie thing is definitely a miss. I had a DM that would play these kinds of mind games with us all the time - present an obvious enemy that isn't an enemy at all, even going so far as to play the character as threatening, then suddenly turn on the players about how they killed a good guy, they're evil now, bla bla bla. Moral grey areas are one thing, but playing silly mind games is another. It's a poor way to try and create tension or a plot twist. IMO ditch the LG Zombie as quick as narratively possible and move on. Don't go into this territory again.


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"WRONGBADFUN". It's like "ASAP" or "Been there, done that".


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48. Goblin Centipede


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Nebulae wrote:

We had a GM pull this one...

44. Each party member takes one baby and does what he wishes.
a: the paladin sent the baby to a orphanage run by his church
b: the barbarian/inquisitor used the baby as an improvised flail when we ran into the goblin parents
c: the "I'm not evil, I'm chaotic" bard took three, cast light on them and dropped them down pits to check depth
d: the rogue used the baby to blackmail/bribe the tribe's alchemist into taking the baby and fleeing before the rest of the party saw her

How does the paladin exist in this party!? Pretty questionable morality.


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35. Lawful Good - Take them to an orphanage for 'trouble children' and hope for the best.
36. Lawful Neutral - Administer swift future justice and collect the bounty on goblin ears
37. Lawful Evil - Train them to be efficient, diligent assistance(using shock collars and the like), and get going on that personal army you've always wanted!
38. Neutral Good - Take them in, but once they start getting bitey, hand them off to the town guard - pretend you don't know that it's a 'kill shelter'.
39. Neutral - Drop them off a cliff. Meh.
40. Neutral Evil - Free kills? Huzzah. Enjoy yourself - it's your lucky day!
41. Chaotic Good - Teach them to dance and sing - you're sure you can turn them into happy wonderful flowers!
42. Chaotic Neutral - See how far you can throw them.
43. Chaotic Evil - BABY STEW MWA HAHAHAHAHAHA! WE'RE EATIN GOOD TONIGHT MOTHER!!!!!!


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Secretly create fake trouble far outside of town, with rewards for quelling it. Drop hints amongst the adventerous.


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I'm glad for this. It destroys a lot of terribly cheesy builds.


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Some of the things that I see DMs decry as 'unrealistic' is often simply a misunderstanding of real world analogues. Another problem is looking at 2015, instead of 1000, for your analogues. This is a game about a medieval/post medieval society. This is not a game about Earth 2015. Set your perspective. Some modern analogues help, but most do not.

Magic Item Economy? Look at guns, or yachts. The average person can either feed their family for a month or will never see the inside of one, respectively.

Common? Many times over, the world has come close to speaking a single language. Greek was widespread, Latin, English, and now Spanish and Chinese are massively widespread in places that to which they are not indigenous.

Bounty Hunters Are Poor: In real life 2015, yes. In real life, before it was easy to track stolen possessions, probably not. If you could loot the home and stash of every bounty you came upon, you could end up with a hoard of your very own. The problem today is that the profession of bail bondsman is so heavily regulated that you cannot afford to jack the stash.

Pan: That is more of your gripes with level-based games. This thread is about portions of the game that don't seem realistic, but are accepted.


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Rhedyn wrote:

I allow Ultimate Psionics, some of my homebrew, and the PRD in my games. Everything else has to be ran by me.

I am very close to out-right banning the Summoner and the rogue.

Quick! Everybody make fun of the guy that doesn't get it!


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Damn I was hoping this was a super serious thread that I could bomb with "Everything but the Commoner class, Daggers, and Wands of Magic Missile(1 Charge). COMMONER DEATH ARENA!!!"

The second I saw weapon spec I knew my plan to be foiled.


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I didn't read all 145 posts of this thread, but in what I did read, the OP is being cagey about his intentions. Not sure what you are trying to do or why, but my guess is that he wants to get all of the Shield feats, and get weapon focus shield and all of the Shield-specific feats, and have the option of TWF with two buffed up shields. It seems, however, that the best way to do this would be to enhance just one shield +10/+10, and have the other shield just a +10 weapon. Again, I am not sure what it is you really want to do, but two +10/+10 shields doesn't seem to great. One +10/+10 shield and one +10 weapon with the option of either using one defensively while using one offensively OR using both to TWF seems like it could be pretty decent. The only reason I can think of to get both shields at +10/+10 would be to maintain your AC in the event you are disarmed.


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Regarding fudging...the majority of DMs I know use a fudged roll/stats to either Increase Drama or Save the Story. A fudged roll can put the players in more danger, and increase the dramatic content of the encounter. A fudged roll can also save a PC from a stupid death, so the story can continue without the interruption of replacing the character. This is good, because you are telling a story, not playing a board game.

Which also relates to the unique snowflake concept. To me, playing D&D is more like reading a book that is being written in real time. It is different than, say, an improv show. An improv show is about what's happening in the moment. The best part of D&D is building on the story of this character you're playing. It is also different from playing a board game, because you're really not competing for anything but the best story you can tell.

If that story is about a group of 5 people that really don't matter or do anything interesting or novel, ever - and one of them dies every couple of days and is replaced by another stranger they randomly met...that's boring. No D&D game is like that. So just by the very nature of your group meeting at this table and spending the time developing this story, your characters are important and story-worthy. They are somehow unique and important, because otherwise why the hell are you telling a story about them?


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For me the problem is more players to GMs, and me as a GM having to constantly 'keep up' with new material. I have to read it, or read about it and trust the opinions of random strangers, and then make a rather arbitrary judgement on whether or not the book is ridiculous or not. For the first couple books, it wasn't a problem. But things have just been getting more and more crazy.

Sure, I could just ban all but the CRB, but players don't typically like that. They want options, even if they don't understand - or care - how those options will effect the game at large. It basically just makes my game harder.

If they were to continue to create content that was balanced against the CRB, I would have no problem. They are not doing that.

P.S.: If there is a bloat in bloat threads, it is because the bloat is getting worse. Duh!


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Cuuniyevo wrote:

I disagree about high magic being an essential conceit, but the first part is good and people absolutely should know what they're getting in to.

Another one I'd add to the list would be that everyone should know going in that reality is going to be bent, if not absolutely broken. Some may want more realism, but perfect realism on paper will never happen and really shouldn't. These stories are supposed to be our homes away from home — not more of the same that we experience all the time. Get loose, be free and be immersed. =]

CR, and subsequently Wealth by Level, assumes a certain level of magical gear. While this magical gear could be the absolute only piece of its type in the whole wide world, the APs, Ultimate Campaign, and overall power level of the PCs make it very clear that Pathfinder is meant to be a high magic setting. It is definitely not Low Magic. You could argue that it is Moderate Magic and I wouldn't fight you much. But magic is everywhere. Magic is abundant in Golarion, and relatively simple to acquire according to the game rules. Even a peasant can afford to have a healing potion in the drawer for emergencies.


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wraithstrike wrote:

If your area is a place where gaming is hard due to lack of players then let them leave. They will come back. If not then you are probably better off without them. Play online.

If your area has an abundance of players then you have nothing to worry about because it is still easier to find new players, than it is to find a GM so just recruit more players, and going online is an option.

The problem occurs when you have a close knit group of friends. Then you have to make compromises. And when Paizo keeps releasing gonzo first party stuff these discussions get more and more difficult.


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1 The players are unique and beautiful snowflakes - there is a reason we are telling this story about your characters. DMs would do well to remember the players should be story-worthy - unless your campaign specifies otherwise.

1a Players would do well to remember that sometimes, the reason no-one else is helping them or lifting a finger to help them is because there IS no one else, or everyone else is busy.

1b Pursuant to 1a, if you as the player have been pretty clearly briefed on what the story will be, and you haven't made a character that has a clear and ongoing investment in that story - THAT'S YOUR FAULT! YOU need to bring yourself into the story as much as the DM. If you aren't interested in the story "because your character wouldn't be" that's your problem

1c As the DM, if you had the players design their characters around a specific motivation, and then change it - it is your fault your players don't care anymore!

2 Golarion, and any basic Pathfinder setting is assumed to be a High Magic world with massive wealth disparity. Magic is everywhere. Money is easy to get if you're powerful. If you as the DM don't think any group of 5 or more people isn't going to have at least 1 magic item among them - you're doing it wrong. If you're playing it differently, you need to apprise the players. Respect Wealth by Level, or make it known that you aren't.

2a Giving out wealth and magic is an exercise in creativity. It is the DM's job to figure out how stuff gets into the hands of the players - so they can have fun with it! Remember fun? The whole reason we play this game? Have some!

What other essential conceits do many players and DMs forget when playing this game?


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Everyone has their limit. I think Mythic is the limit for our group. Although I hit my limit on spells pretty much after APG. Most of the spells that have come out are either uninteresting, weird, overpowered, or just plain awful. I rarely even check the full spell list when playing a caster, but rather just the Core spells. Pathfinder is still the best option, just not by as much ;D


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They won't nuke them, they will just fund a populist uprising which will ultimately blow up in their face.


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RJGrady wrote:
I wish I were a rapper so I could use "FAQing the 'but'" in a sweet rhyme.

We got nothin left yo

It's all used up so
Our time is ending
With the time we're spending
Arguments neverending
FAQ'in the but

I'm not a rapper either D:


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And we, as a community(and by we I mean you), have sunk to a new low. We have FAQ'ed the word 'but'. We are truly approaching the Idiocracy.


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You are screwed. Screwed screwed screwed.

Also there is no society that is not Neutral or Chaotic Evil that you acted within the boundaries of.

Also you are so screwed.

I would assume that since you overreacted a bit, his reaction is going to be somewhat like Mickey's in Snatch. Look forward to a long, painful death scene :D


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M Human Inquisitor 1 [] HP: 10/10 [] AC: 15 FF: 13 T: 12 [] Fort: +3 Ref: +2 Will: +4 [] Melee: +0 Ranged: +2 [] Init +2 [] CMB: +1 CMD: 14 [] Speed: 40ft [] Perception: +6 Sense Motive: +6 Stealth: +6 [] Status: Just dandy

Hey all, I collected and collated all of the relationships that were presented in the recruitment thread, so they are all in one place for easy reference.

Pick wrote:

Arturus:
Arturrus was the first that really jumped out at me, if he's in a 'sheriff'-like position in Sandpoint. Perhaps he's noticed some of the small-scale filching of food and minor goods going on, and kept an eye out for the thief-- and, just perhaps, his experience caught him a stray duergar! Of course, it really depends on whether Arturrus is the sort to shoot first, but if he was willing to give Pick a chance-- something along the lines of 'if you behave, I won't have you hauled before the guards and executed'-- then Pick would feel a strong sense of loyalty towards him and would view him as his 'boss' in a sense.

Loruk:
I can see some sort-of-similar possibilities with Loruk. Loruk with his watching the town from the rooftop would see things others would not-- things floating along at night then vanishing into the belt pouch of an invisible critter, etc-- and as a ranger he could track Pick and confront him. Since Loruk is someone who's already got a history of working with traditionally 'evil' creatures and trying to show them there may be a better way, he might be a natural to take that route with Pick. Like Arturrus, he's got experience with being Authority-- which Pick responds well to.

Kyra:
...it seems all of these are tying into the 'authority' thing. Kyra comes from a worldview that Pick would acclimate to easier than others-- she expects to give orders and to use people, and, frankly, Pick expects to be given orders and to be used. His society was very cog-like, serve the tribe, which meant, serve the elders giving you orders. And Kyra would likely not have any hang-ups over his race, but would instead just assess him for his usefulness.

Rhanloi:
I can see Rhanloi, with his thirst for knowledge, being quite fascinated by Pick-- how often do you get to talk to someone who is FROM the Underdark, after all? And in his turn, Pick's curiosity would be well-suited to asking lots and lots of hesitant, confused questions about the surface world to someone as well-traveled and overall educated as Rhanloi. This one interests me especially since it's less based on the boss-->soldier dynamic, and more on an exchange of information, a little closer to 'friendship' maybe. Albeit of a strange, grudging, and wary type, at least on Pick's end.

Loruk wrote:

Pick:
Loruk had seen much in his life, always watching - always learning. He had seen men come and go, brawl - tossed out of the Fatman's Fleabag for not having a coin to their name. He had seen much, but never anything quite like a Duergar.

Loruk had worked as a trapper for quite some time, a skill he put to good use while with the Bileworths - gathering food to keep the goblins sated - trying to discern if a hungry goblin was more dangerous than a well-fed one.

As he was gathering a few unlucky rabbits about a half-mile from the Bileworth's make-shift camp - he noticed something, someone, watching him. Loruk, not one to make poor decisions without thinking, gathered the game as he always did - before disappearing into the woods.

In fact, he had not gone long in his stride. Keeping close to the natural shadows in the wood, he had turned the roles and the prey was now the hunter. Towering behind the dwarf, he spoke in a soft voice as he left the shadows - though he sought the goodness in all creatures - he was no fool, and had one hand on his long sword's hilt as he spoke.

"You. You are not from around here, are you?"

Though startled, the Duergar did not flee - but instead responded with soft words in kind. The two talked for hours and exchanged names and stories. Pick told him of his subterranean tribe - but withheld information one does not share with surface-dwellers. Loruk did not feel pity for the dwarf, but sought to understand him - to *know* him - to learn.

As the two 'outsiders' parted ways, they shook hands and exchanged words of respect to one-another. They did not encounter each other again after that day, until the Swallowtail Festival.

Arturus:
If there was one man Loruk had spent a lot of time with in Sandpoint, it was Arturus Caeldhon. The old man was way past his prime when they first met, but if someone asked him who could teach a man the skill of trapping - his answer would be "Arturus".

The two did not see eye to eye immediately, as Arturus never understood why Loruk spent so much of his time simply watching others, especially goblins - the young half-orc's talent for trapping eventually made them found friends.

Perhaps his stories was what drew Loruk to Arturus in the first place, or perhaps it was simply his take on the trade - Loruk respected the man. He gladly listened to what he had to say, to his stories from journeying with the Civilizers - to heated arguments concerning the goblins at Junker's Edge. When Loruk left Sandpoint, the two had argued so harshly most people thought they would come to blows.

After Loruk returned, some time after the 'Chopper' had committed his crimes - Arturus was the first to greet the Half-Orc; saying the words that would haunt him for years to come: "You should have been here."

Khalbar:
Khalbar seems to be quite powerful, perhaps in similar terms to the 'Chopper' - seeing as how he has slain an entire tribal camp by himself. As a player, I don't mean any offence in this - but I do not like characters that have 'super-powers' in their background stories - if not explained in great detail why he is not as powerful anymore. Sure, a player could kill maybe one or two Shoanti barbarians on his lonesome - but an entire tribal camp, I just can't relate. Such power is not something Loruk assimilates with strength and respect, but rather fear and worry. As such, I do not think the two have formed a relationship prior.

Aletta:
"She came from the north, tall as a mountain - and broad like you had never seen a woman before." The youngest goblins laughed heartily, not quite familiar with how to act during a story just yet. "I met her a few times, tracked and showed her the lay of the land. But this woman was no ordinary woman - no. She knew things men and women should not know."

Glitters, standing up on his feet - boasted heartily: "Like Glitters know how to make fire burn !" His eyes reflecting the fire under the starlit sky.

"Yes, Glitters - almost. Well thought." Loruk smiled to the other goblins, he could see how their eyes and small bodies ached to grab blades and run off into the wilds - but they did not. He had made progress with them. They listened.

"We came across something in the wilds, not too many moons ago - something new. Something frightened, angry and alone. We approached it carefully - I had unsheathed my longswo-"

The Goblins break out into laughter and cheer, making stabbing motions to eachother as they giggle. "HA-HA-HA! Yes, you stabbed and gutted it! Stabbing makes everything better, Boss!"

Loruk sighed, perhaps he had made progress - but it would still take many more years to make them understand that stabbing someone isn't the best way to solve every encounter.

"Not exactly, Bog. The creature we encountered was cloaked, hooded even - and not aware of our approach. Or well, seemingly not. A'letta, the Shoanti woman I traveled with, stood a few feet off to my side as I came within arms-length of the creature. As I placed my hand on his shoulder, he turned - and as my spine shivered and froze - the face I gazed upon was mine. That is when I awoke to her words: "Now, do you see?"

The goblins burst into laughter once more, obviously unable to comprehend what Loruk had just told them - and instead deemed it humorous.

Loruk smiled. My dear children.


Rhanloi wrote:

Pick:
I concur with Dien's idea - Rhanloi would definitely take Pick 'under his wing' and try to gain as much information about the underworld as he could for his 'research' and potential adventures. But Rhanloi is a good soul and would develop more of a friendship with this shy dwarf (deurgar...whatever =) This could happen before or during the adventure.

Khalbar:

Rhanloi and Khalbar met on the road late one evening. Rhanloi had set up camp earlier and was preparing his meal when Khalbar came by. Being a friendly sort, Rhanloi offered a place by the fire and to share his dinner with the traveler. As the evening goes on, they trade stories - and find out they are both Seekers. Rhanloi is seeking knowledge; Khalbar is seeking his family. Rhanloi knows that knowledge, and valuable texts and magical items, may be found in surprising areas, so he offers to help Khalbar, using his magical talents and knowledge. Rhanloi also realizes the advantages of travelling with someone trained to deter, and defeat, brigands and bandits. The unlikely pair now travel Varisia, searching for clues to Khalbar's family, and picking up unique items along the way. They have stopped in Sandpoint to resupply and follow-up on the latest clues Khalbar has uncovered.


Khalbar wrote:

Rhanloi:
I am good with that. To develop it a bit further. Khalbar would be very skeptical of wizardry and book-learning and he likely adopted you as he felt you were not suitable to travel alone in the wildnerness. However, over time, Khal has a growing respect for the insight and intelligence of the wizard and fears his magicks a little less. With Khal's mission to Sandpoint's new cathedral from his dreams, Rhanloi can tag along, knowing a good library exists there.

Aletta:
I suggest tribes or even kinsmen. Your blind father is my uncle or some such. You know I lost my family to slavers and have hitched on following your omens. Khal's recent conversion to follow Desna the Dreamer is a source of friction as it appears A'letta follows the Old Ways.

Arturus:
would be someone Khalbar would respect as an elder and a hunter.

Kyra:
your alignment is exact opposite of Khal's. She was raised in the city among nobles; he in the wilderness of the Storval. I can't imagine two more unlikely companions. They'll probably fall in love...

Arturus wrote:

Loruk:
"You should have been here." Arturus didn't have much use for Loruk, at first. But after Loruk helped solve a few petty crimes, Arturus grudgingly accepted Loruk's perspective on things. Loruk knew everything that happened in town, and was useful in keeping the peace. When he went galavanting off with the goblins - and the Chopper struck - Arturus, perhaps wrongly, held Loruk partially to blame. Loruk kept an eye on everyone...he should have noticed the strange man stalking about at night. He could have stopped the murders early...he could have saved Arturus' poor sister. Relations between Loruk and Arturus have cooled considerably since his return - where once Arturus would have bought Loruk a drink and chatted, he is now more demanding, less polite. "Seen anything, Loruk?"

Aletta:
A fetching young lass with a wild spirit, Aletta has the attention of the Guild. She is on the list of folk to see when strange happenings strike the forests near Sandpoint, and has proved an asset in keeping the area safe from strange beasts and woeful magic.

Xogar:
Xogar is a regular pillar of the community, and though many probably write him off for his appearance, Arturus respects him for a few reasons: He has proven to be an upstanding, kind citizen, to be counted on in times of trouble; Iomedae and Abadar are compatible, civilized faiths; and Arturus respects Xogar's dedication to those ideals of justice and honor

Kyra:
Whenever Kyra is in town, Arturus watches her with a wary eye. Though she is polite, her eyes hold a dangerous light. Violence is within her; her bearing announces assumption of ownership of whatever and whoever is nearby at that moment. She asks for favors of the militia and local government as though she were a council member. That said, she is, at this time, a law abiding citizen, and it was rumored that she provided information that allowed the militia to root out the growing influence of a Korvosan crime family in Sandpoint. Perhaps she's not so bad?

Kyra wrote:

Pick:
I actually thought the same thing for Kyra and Pick, but went even further with it. There's definitely a potential there for symbiosis, but it actually seems to me as well that they could very well become friends.

Every single other potential person in the party is of the Good alignment. Obviously I have no intention of any kind of PvP thing happening, but it's likely that the others and Kyra won't always see eye-to-eye. With the focus on order more than morality that Pick shares, he might be the only one who actually ever understands her, and she might become very attached to him for that. I think that would be rather interesting.

Loruk:
Loruk has shown in his past an interest in redeeming those that might seek to do evil. While the goblins he worked with before were certainly more extreme than Kyra, I think they might have things to learn from each other. Loruk seems like he could use some understanding of duty and responsibility. He is haunted by guilt from letting down the people he cares about, and Kyra would probably have that same fear, which makes her more likely to listen to him.

Khalbar:
That would be hilarious. I would definitely be all for that, haha. Actually, it's funny, because despite them being completely different, I think she'd like him right off the bat. He's strong, he's determined, he's wounded, and he can fly into a rage and cleave things in twain. WHAT MORE COULD A GIRL WANT.

Xogar:
A lot of the relationships with Kyra have focused on "We're different, but here's how we're the same". This one I like even more because it's "We're different, but we almost weren't."

Xogar's early life is based around being abused, but learning discipline and strength, not entirely unlike Kyra's. But when they reached the crossroad, they went in entirely different directions. He gave himself up to Iomedae to be something more. These two would very much carry out the law in every scenario, but in entirely different ways.

I keep thinking of them having this awesome relationship like Professor Xavier and Magneto where, yeah, they are/were friends, and they want the same things, but they see the world so differently that it's hard for them to agree on how to get there.

Arturus:
Oh man, I like that idea. Her sense of entitlement is sure to get her into trouble. I'm not sure what kind of relationship the two of them would have. She'd no doubt want to hear about him having slayed mighty beasts, but he doesn't seem very up to talking about it. She may very well see him as old and worn out, past his prime, which could be interesting.

Aletta wrote:

Khalbar:
Khalbar's loss punched a hole in her soul. To love and be loved was a blessing and to have that blessing taken away in such a manner .. she could not fathom the fires that must rage in the barren wastelands of his soul. She felt obliged to help the man as it was her duty and would try to do whatever she could to mend the wounds of his soul. And perhaps he'd see the wisdom and reason in the ways of the Spirits of Old.

Arturus:
She had stumbled upon Arturus while being out in the wilds with Loruk. The man explained to her the ways of his Spirit and how he must venture forth into the wild to claim safety for those at home. His sense of duty inspired her and he was just the right person to go to when she needed more information on these strange lands and its strange cultures. (I see this as a mentor-student relationship, because she respects age and wisdom and he has plenty of both!)

Loruk:
A'letta had needed someone who knew the land. She had come by people with maps, but she needed someone who truly knew it. After asking around, a trapper named Loruk seemed to be the man.
Her kindness and patience might've surprised the half-orc when he first met her. This masked giant of a woman knew nothing of the torment that raged like a storm under his skin. Instead of looking to the past, like the other townsfolk, she gave Loruk an opportunity to look towards the future by asking his aid in helping her with her divinations. A'letta valued his knowledge of the wilds highly and saw in him a man who tried to move forward, but who was held back by the chains of the past. For now.

Rhanloi:
I don't think they'd have a strong existing relationship just yet, but if they happen to travel together their thirst for knowledge would bring them closer together. Rhan's structured and academical approach would be an eye-opener for A'letta and she'd be most willing to learn from him and in return teach him about the ways of the Hawk Shoanti. Them both being good means they'll also have the same'ish outlook on life.

Kyra:
The same as Rhanloi, I don't think they'd have formed a proper relationship just yet. Their disciplined approach to life might help generate mutual respect, but she sees her pride as a flaw. They'll bump and A'letta will do her best to make Kyra see the light - and try to convert her to at least becoming a LN person. A ruler has to give to his people and in return they shall give him their support. No wicked person can do this. Right? *laughs*

Xogar:
Kindred spirits - to serve and to protect, to carry the burdens because we're blessed. No existing relationship, but they should get along just fine. Their different religions and cultures might be the reason for some distance at first, but that gap should be closed in no time.

Pick:
I, the player, LOVE duergar! I don't think they'd formed any meaningful relationship just yet, but their shared Lawful alignment should mean they should get along. Him needing guidance might help Pick being mentored by A'letta, Arturus and Xogar?


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There's no limit. Don't even try. The limit is that it costs 15gp every time he does it, and only heals 1d8+1. The other limit is a standard action, which takes 6 seconds. The actual dice rolling should take less than that. If the other players can't wait 30 seconds for the guy to heal himself so he can not die when they need him...I don't even know what to say about your group. CLW wands fine just the way they are.


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Byrdology wrote:
2hw fighter/ MoMS. Use a nodachi and unarmed strike as your two weapons and get x2 str with you nodachi, and 1.5 str (dragon style and dragon ferocity) with your unarmed strike. When you get enough iterations, pick up boar style and boar rend to do bleed dmg when you hit with 2 UAS' and take two weapon rend to just be silly with it. Use light armor with the brawling property to get an untyped +2 to hit and dmg, and an AoMF to kick it up even higher, and use weapon training to up your nodachi to hit and dmg and enchant that as you see fit. Then enter beast mode and laugh at all other TWFers who try to keep up with you. You want an 18 str and pump your dex after that, make sure you get a good con to stay alive. Your HP, saves, skills, skill selection, and dmg will be better than all other fighter builds, and you will have evasion... Have fun, and make people stare with their jaws dropped.

Welp unless anyone has a pretty serious rebuttal, I think Byrd just won this thread. Kudos sir, bloody kudos.


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I know I'd heard about the City of Tarrasque somewheres...but I'm sure the idea is as old as the Tarrasque itself.

Anyways, I want to play in that campaign. I like the added part about the Allips too...could be another addition to the setting.


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I love Words of Power. I'm totally sold on it, possibly forever(at least for spontaneous casters). However, the Words that exist are, IMO, inadequate. My DM has agreed to let in new Words of Power if they are balanced and interesting, and respect the system as intended. Please suggest new Words!

P.S. No arguing over suggested Words, please. This is a constructive thread! Only post your Word suggestions, or improvements to others words in the form of a Word suggestion of your own. Thank you!


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I don't mean to be judgemental but...it sounds like you game with goons/douchebags. This is not the group for you. Move on.


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PvP, if well implemented, can be the life-blood of a good MMO. Nothing will sustain a game longer than the presence of a never-ending battle. Content will wear thin after a time, but battle-lust will never fade.

That said, WoW's implementation of "loss-less" or "risk-less" PvP was an enormous mistake, especially after they herded the better PvP'ers into battlegrounds and arenas. World PvP is a great thing. Wars can pop up overnight and rage for days or weeks. If the concept was codified into the game, with something to be won or lost, the pull would be even greater. The idea is to channel griefing and ganking into a part of the game, turning them instead into assassins and berserkers that must be dealt with.

UO dealt with this by adding bounties and ousting murderers out of city life. And IMO, UO had one of the best PvP systems in gaming history. Turn the guilds into kingdoms, and allow war, politics, and trade to emerge between them.

One final note: If you aren't playing an MMO for large-scale social gaming, please find a single-player RPG more suited to you. UO was ruined by players who wanted a super-safe single player experience where they could farm and do basically nothing, while ignoring the largest portion of the game: other players. I pray PFO will not repeat the mistake of destroying PvP in favor of trying to capture those who want to play Recettear Online.


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I fully support the idea of making darkvision, torches, and magical light sources viable tools again. I sometimes wish the Faydark had been darker.

I also support avoiding fast travel. I very much enjoyed the feeling of distance and size created by the pre-PoK EQ continents. It was great exploring those huge spaces, not just running from point A to B to kill 10 of X monster. I remember how awesome being teleported for the first time was(it made me reroll druid!). There was little else to do in WoW, and the game itself was not compelling enough to encourage this sort of exploration outside of world PvP(which they promptly destroyed) or crafting.

The idea is to implement these challenges with an eye towards making them part of the experience, rather than an arbitrary time/money sink or difficulty increase.

Also Scott: I would like to see an increase in content-to-word ratio in your posts. We get that unfounded difficulty is a poor idea, but why does darkness fall into that category?


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NWN was tbh horrible, in hindsight. It was a poor 3-dimensional bastardization of the massively awesome Infinity Engine using the ugly larva of a ruleset that we can now understand was simply crafted to allow Pathfinder to bloom into a beautiful butterfly. If anything, I would base the game off Baldur's Gate and its ilk, add some physical action using Skills (Acrobatics, Climb, etc), figure out a way to make player-run(i.e. DM'ed) customizable instanced dungeons, and call it a day.