paizo.com Recent Posts by Zarathospaizo.com Recent Posts by Zarathos2022-11-08T13:58:13Z2022-11-08T13:58:13ZRe: Forums: Pathfinder Playtest General Discussion: Core System/Bestiary IssuesShadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2v9qw?Core-System-Bestiary-Issues#52018-08-02T20:55:02Z2018-08-02T20:49:00Z<p>I don't understand the Bestiary math. Paizo has to be adding in a proficiency bonus with the ability modifier. So, would the Halfling Footpad be Master proficient with a dagger in the above example?</p>I don't understand the Bestiary math. Paizo has to be adding in a proficiency bonus with the ability modifier. So, would the Halfling Footpad be Master proficient with a dagger in the above example?Shadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)2018-08-02T20:49:00ZRe: Forums: 5th Edition (And Beyond): D&D 5th Edition OGLShadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2t8sr&page=4?DD-5th-Edition-OGL#1892016-01-21T23:55:36Z2016-01-21T23:55:36Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Norman Osborne wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Shadow Demon wrote:</div><blockquote>Yes, I actually meant to state "You can't copy the entire SRD as a published work for sale either because this would be in violation of its copyright." </blockquote>Quite a few companies have done just that. Creative Mountain Games have a very nice extensively hyperlinked set of PDFs of the 3.5 SRD. </blockquote><p>Yes, this is value-added hyperlinked multitude of pdfs of about 3500 pages. Instead, I should have said "You shouldn't copy the entire SRD as a published work for sale without adding any value to it."Norman Osborne wrote:Shadow Demon wrote:Yes, I actually meant to state "You can't copy the entire SRD as a published work for sale either because this would be in violation of its copyright."
Quite a few companies have done just that. Creative Mountain Games have a very nice extensively hyperlinked set of PDFs of the 3.5 SRD. Yes, this is value-added hyperlinked multitude of pdfs of about 3500 pages. Instead, I should have said "You shouldn't copy the entire SRD as a published work for sale...Shadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)2016-01-21T23:55:36ZRe: Forums: 5th Edition (And Beyond): D&D 5th Edition OGLShadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2t8sr&page=4?DD-5th-Edition-OGL#1872016-01-21T23:11:08Z2016-01-21T23:11:08Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Steve Geddes wrote:</div><blockquote><br />
<br />
Nonetheless, it is relatively common to hear people implicitly claim that what's Open Content "isn't copyright" and it's worth correcting that. The distinction between Open Content and Product Identity has nothing to do with copyright really - those are just terms used in the OGL.
<br />
</blockquote><p>All I am saying is that ignoring the OGL, copyright protection is not available for names, titles, or short phases. This also includes ideas and concepts. A "beholder" under copyright means the "whole body of work" not just the name, the concept or idea, or even a single simple sentence of description. There is even a certain amount that could be used under Fair Use. The same is true for OGL open monsters which are also still under copyright. The use of "beholder" under Product Identity is enough for most to steer way clear which I agree with in principle of actual implementation but not not necessarily in the case of hypothetical theory.
<p>If I have won the last PowerBall jackpot, I would have solely tempted to put it to the test.</p>Steve Geddes wrote:Nonetheless, it is relatively common to hear people implicitly claim that what's Open Content "isn't copyright" and it's worth correcting that. The distinction between Open Content and Product Identity has nothing to do with copyright really - those are just terms used in the OGL.
All I am saying is that ignoring the OGL, copyright protection is not available for names, titles, or short phases. This also includes ideas and concepts. A "beholder" under copyright means the...Shadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)2016-01-21T23:11:08ZRe: Forums: 5th Edition (And Beyond): D&D 5th Edition OGLShadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2t8sr&page=4?DD-5th-Edition-OGL#1862016-01-21T22:55:23Z2016-01-21T22:55:23Z<p>@Vic
<br />
There is nothing here that I disagree which why I would personally steer clear of the beholder especially in a work that is essentially in competition. It is an example of how far some have taken it. The most of I could imagine is using the name "sphere of many eyes" along with short-stat block with no other description. Even then, I wouldn't do it with a printed work. Pdf only so that I would have 30 days to change per OGL Section 13 in case of C&D. </p>
<p>Joe likely doesn't have enough visibility for it to really matter.</p>@Vic
There is nothing here that I disagree which why I would personally steer clear of the beholder especially in a work that is essentially in competition. It is an example of how far some have taken it. The most of I could imagine is using the name "sphere of many eyes" along with short-stat block with no other description. Even then, I wouldn't do it with a printed work. Pdf only so that I would have 30 days to change per OGL Section 13 in case of C&D.
Joe likely doesn't have enough...Shadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)2016-01-21T22:55:23ZRe: Forums: 5th Edition (And Beyond): D&D 5th Edition OGLShadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2t8sr&page=4?DD-5th-Edition-OGL#1822016-01-21T22:16:40Z2016-01-21T22:16:40Z<p>@Steve
<br />
Actually, even the copyright of the beholder concept is questionable under "certain minimum amount of authorship." . A concept described in a simple sentence can't really qualify. It really is about protecting the whole body of work from wholesale copying and resell. Art is easy since a single picture that is worth a thousand words is the whole body of work. A word, a sentence, a concept, an idea is not.</p>
<p>As example, I present you "the sphere of many eyes" from Adventures Dark and Deep Bestiary by Joseph Bloch of BRW Games. The stats are nearly identical to 1977 AD&D Monster Manual entry. The text is rewritten and the description eliminates "eyestalks" and put the eyes directly on the sphere. The overall feel of the monster is distinctly beholder with only slight physical differences. This bestiary has been on OneBookShelf since September 2013.</p>
<p>The question is when everything that individually makes up the description of a monster is open when does the conceptual sum of these parts somehow become closed. Ideas and concepts cannot be copyrighted. So, the idea of a spherical monster with toothy maw and magical eye rays can't be copyrighted.</p>
<p>On the other hand, some like Paizo will never do what Joe did for his OSR game for a political reason as much as anything else. However, I am referring to the possible discretion in the support of 5e only not to use in competition.</p>@Steve
Actually, even the copyright of the beholder concept is questionable under "certain minimum amount of authorship." . A concept described in a simple sentence can't really qualify. It really is about protecting the whole body of work from wholesale copying and resell. Art is easy since a single picture that is worth a thousand words is the whole body of work. A word, a sentence, a concept, an idea is not.
As example, I present you "the sphere of many eyes" from Adventures Dark and Deep...Shadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)2016-01-21T22:16:40ZRe: Forums: 5th Edition (And Beyond): D&D 5th Edition OGLShadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2t8sr&page=4?DD-5th-Edition-OGL#1752016-01-21T21:38:42Z2016-01-21T21:38:42Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">deinol wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Shadow Demon wrote:</div><blockquote> Also, you can't copy the entire SRD as a published work either because this would be in violation of its copyright.</blockquote><p>As long as you include the OGL you can reprint the entirety of the open content in the SRD, and the SRD is supposed to only contain open content.
<p>You'd have to reformat things a little, since you can't use the same trade dress (fonts, borders, etc), but you can indeed reprint the entire SRD. People did it for 3rd edition, and Pathfinder is basically built on that fact. </blockquote><p>Yes, I actually meant to state "You can't copy the entire SRD as a published work for sale either because this would be in violation of its copyright."deinol wrote:Shadow Demon wrote: Also, you can't copy the entire SRD as a published work either because this would be in violation of its copyright.
As long as you include the OGL you can reprint the entirety of the open content in the SRD, and the SRD is supposed to only contain open content. You'd have to reformat things a little, since you can't use the same trade dress (fonts, borders, etc), but you can indeed reprint the entire SRD. People did it for 3rd edition, and Pathfinder is...Shadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)2016-01-21T21:38:42ZRe: Forums: 5th Edition (And Beyond): D&D 5th Edition OGLShadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2t8sr&page=4?DD-5th-Edition-OGL#1722016-01-21T19:04:31Z2016-01-21T19:04:31Z<p>@Drejk</p>
<p>Yes not copyrightable but word is in Product Identity so can't be used even in sentence describing the gas spore which is open.</p>
<p>Even if a monster is open per the SRD, one simply can't copy a page out of the 5e MM to put in their own published monster book. Also, you can't copy the entire SRD as a published work either because this would be in violation of its copyright.</p>
<p>Let me give an example of what is possible. Take the "galeb duhr". This monster is on page 139. There is no question it would a copyright violation to copy the contents of this page. However, how about the following.</p>
<p>Galeb Duhr: AC 16; HP 85 (9d8+45); Spd 15ft,(30ft when
<br />
rolling, 60ft when rolling downhill); Melee slam (+8, 2d6+5
<br />
bludgeoning); SA animate boulders 1/day, rolling charge
<br />
(+2d6 bludgeoning DC 16 Str save or knocked prone);
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Immune poison; Resist normal weapons; Str +5, Dex +2,
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Con +5, Int +0, Wis +1, Cha +0; Senses darkvision 60ft,
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tremorsense 60ft; AL N; CR 6; XP 2300.</p>
<p>I don't believe the above meets the criteria of "a certain minimum amount of authorship". If WoTC had put the name in Product Identify section, it would be a no-go however, in that case it could be changed to "guleb dahr" instead. Plus, it would be used in a way that supports 5e not competes against it.</p>@Drejk
Yes not copyrightable but word is in Product Identity so can't be used even in sentence describing the gas spore which is open.
Even if a monster is open per the SRD, one simply can't copy a page out of the 5e MM to put in their own published monster book. Also, you can't copy the entire SRD as a published work either because this would be in violation of its copyright.
Let me give an example of what is possible. Take the "galeb duhr". This monster is on page 139. There is no...Shadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)2016-01-21T19:04:31ZRe: Forums: 5th Edition (And Beyond): D&D 5th Edition OGLShadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2t8sr&page=4?DD-5th-Edition-OGL#1692016-01-21T17:16:00Z2016-01-21T17:16:00Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Steve Geddes wrote:</div><blockquote><p> Product Identity and Open Content are special terms of the OGL, but all of it is still subject to Copyright law (check any page of the PRD, for example and you'll see that it's copyright Paizo despite being predominantly open content).</p>
<p>When you release something under the OGL, you have to specify what is Product Identity and what is Open Content. Those who produce subsequent works using the OGL are entitled to use the material you've declared open - however there are also conditions they have to comply with. One of those is that they agree not to use anything which has been declared Product Identity (without a further specific license/agreement with the owner of that PI).</p>
<p>So both beholders and the contents of the SRD are protected by copyright laws. If you choose to use the OGL, you are entitled to use the stuff in the SRD (provided you comply with the terms of the OGL) and are agreeing to not use beholders (unless you get permission from WotC to do so, via a separate license). </blockquote><p>Except "beholder" isn't copyrightable per the Circular 34 from the US Copyright Office. It can't be used because it is included in Product Identity. A product that uses it would invalidate their use of the OGL. Without the PI exclusion, the only legal protection would be possible trademark law.
<p>"Under section 102 of the Copyright Act (title 17 of the United States Code),
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copyright protection extends only to “original works of authorship.” The
<br />
statute states clearly that ideas and concepts cannot be protected by copyright.
<br />
To be protected by copyright, a work must contain a certain minimum
<br />
amount of authorship in the form of original literary, musical, pictorial, or
<br />
graphic expression. Names, titles, and other short phrases do not meet these
<br />
requirements."</p>
<p>"Some brand names, trade names, slogans, and phrases may
<br />
be entitled to protection under laws relating to unfair
<br />
competition, or they may be entitled to protection and
<br />
registration under the provisions of state or federal trademark
<br />
laws. The federal trademark statute covers trademarks and
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service marks—words, phrases, symbols, or designs that
<br />
distinguish the goods or services of one party from those of
<br />
another. The Copyright Office has no role in these matters."</p>
<p>The SRD defines what is open and what is Product Identify but there is gray content that is not included in either. For monsters, some of this gray becomes definitely open because of Tome of Horrors deal made by Clark Peterson. (i.e about 27 stat-blocks from 5e MM, 10 of which are included in 5e SRD). With SRD, SRD variants like bugbear chief, ToH, few others like the mythical cyclops, inclusion of "intellect devourer", "troglodyte", and pixie" which should be in SRD approximately 85% of the 434 5e MM stat-blocks are open. </p>
<p>The great irony is of the 15% (about 65 stat-blocks) left that are closed only 17 are included in Product Identity section. Names cannot be copyrighted per Circular 34 quote above nor would one be in violation of the OGL since that are not in the Product Identity section. Monsters such as "kuo-toa", "slaad", "modron", and "yugoloth" are not in the 17.</p>Steve Geddes wrote:Product Identity and Open Content are special terms of the OGL, but all of it is still subject to Copyright law (check any page of the PRD, for example and you'll see that it's copyright Paizo despite being predominantly open content).
When you release something under the OGL, you have to specify what is Product Identity and what is Open Content. Those who produce subsequent works using the OGL are entitled to use the material you've declared open - however there are also...Shadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)2016-01-21T17:16:00ZRe: Forums: 5th Edition (And Beyond): D&D 5th Edition OGLShadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2t8sr&page=3?DD-5th-Edition-OGL#1432016-01-20T01:58:52Z2016-01-19T18:37:50Z<p>Allow me to give an example of why the 5e SRD is not as limited as some may think.</p>
<p>Per Circular 34 from US Copyright Office: Copyright Protection not available for names, titles, or short phases. These have to be trademarked like Dungeons & Dragons or Forgotten Realms. The federal trademark statute covers trademarks and service marks—words, phrases, symbols, or designs that distinguish the goods or services of one party from those of another.</p>
<p>Per the OGL, if not trademarked, they have to be listed as Product Identity like beholder, mind flayer, or carrion crawler.</p>
<p>Here is example that is neither trademarked or listed as product identity. It is not in the 3e SRD or the 5e SRD.</p>
<p>It is the druid/sorcerer/warlock/wizard cantrip: poison spray. A cantrip name made up of two common words. Per Circular 34, I can definitely use it in a list for an NPC, monster, or character. In fact, since the format and terminology of the spell description is present in the 5e SRD, the spell could simply be rewritten and fall under Fair Use. There is no reason to do that because the 5e SRD is about writing new not trying to copy existing material.</p>
<p>What one can absolutely not do is take the 5e Player's Handbook and remove all the trademarks and Product Identify, slap the OGL in the back, and sell your very own version of the 5e PH. This is direct violation of Fair Use where one is attempting to profit by copying WoTC's original literary expression.</p>Allow me to give an example of why the 5e SRD is not as limited as some may think.
Per Circular 34 from US Copyright Office: Copyright Protection not available for names, titles, or short phases. These have to be trademarked like Dungeons & Dragons or Forgotten Realms. The federal trademark statute covers trademarks and service marks—words, phrases, symbols, or designs that distinguish the goods or services of one party from those of another.
Per the OGL, if not trademarked, they have to be...Shadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)2016-01-19T18:37:50ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: [Frog God Games] The Lost Lands: Borderland Provinces Kickstarter has Launched!!Shadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2t0d4&page=4?Frog-God-Games-The-Lost-Lands-Borderland#1712015-11-15T16:50:52Z2015-11-15T16:50:52Z<p>Last day!</p>
<p>We have hit 12 stretch goals, and the $95 Complete GM package is hugely discounted from retail, so you need to get it while it's cheap and while it comes with lots of free stuff. Don't miss out on what's going to be a popular and classic adventuring area for 3 editions simultaneously.</p>Last day!
We have hit 12 stretch goals, and the $95 Complete GM package is hugely discounted from retail, so you need to get it while it's cheap and while it comes with lots of free stuff. Don't miss out on what's going to be a popular and classic adventuring area for 3 editions simultaneously.Shadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)2015-11-15T16:50:52ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: [Frog God Games] The Lost Lands: Borderland Provinces Kickstarter has Launched!!Shadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2t0d4?Frog-God-Games-The-Lost-Lands-Borderland#382015-10-17T17:20:11Z2015-10-17T17:20:11Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Curmudgeonly wrote:</div><blockquote><p> Hi FGG, I want to back this but I'm not sure how I should be doing this.</p>
<p>I would like to get the two hardcovers of the 2 main books Borderland Provinces and Adventures in the Borderland Provinces, and get PDF versions of the Player Guide, the Player Gazeteer, the Journey Generator and Rogues in Remballo. </p>
<p>However, I'm not seeing this as an option. </p>
<p>Am I reading the various pledges and addons correctly? </blockquote><p>Let us revisit this for a moment:
<p>Choose $12 Player PDF set then add the 2 hardcovers for $70. This gives a total of $82. However, you still have to add the Journey Generator which will cost about $5 (from the consideration from the Player PDF set that guide is about $5 and the gazetteer is about $7). The total now comes to about $87 plus shipping. The free pdf of Rogues of Remballo is available now for backers.</p>
<p>Consider that you can get everything in print plus all of the pdfs for $95 including the special print of Rogues of Remballo. The shipping difference is going to be neligible between the two options. You will save about $8 with the first option. </p>
<p>$95 is the not only the better deal; it is a great value for what you are getting.</p>Curmudgeonly wrote:Hi FGG, I want to back this but I'm not sure how I should be doing this.
I would like to get the two hardcovers of the 2 main books Borderland Provinces and Adventures in the Borderland Provinces, and get PDF versions of the Player Guide, the Player Gazeteer, the Journey Generator and Rogues in Remballo.
However, I'm not seeing this as an option.
Am I reading the various pledges and addons correctly?
Let us revisit this for a moment: Choose $12 Player PDF set then add...Shadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)2015-10-17T17:20:11ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: [Frog God Games] The Lost Lands: Borderland Provinces Kickstarter has Launched!!Shadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2t0d4?Frog-God-Games-The-Lost-Lands-Borderland#362015-10-17T16:00:34Z2015-10-17T16:00:34Z<p>No one should choose either the four-book option or six book pledge levels which are more expensive by $9 and $4, respectively. </p>
<p>The best discount is at the $95 especially considering the softcovers come to $45 as add-ons.</p>
<p>Recommendation: Choose the $95 Complete GM Book Set and then add the appropriate number of $35 hardcovers in your chosen system.</p>
<p>@Curmudgeonly: You are correct there is no separate PDF price for the softcovers. The best guess is at approximately $6 based on $12 Player's Pledge. It should be easy to add the pdf price in parenthesis to the softcover add-ons on the main KS page. Otherwise, these prices should definitely be there at the BackerKit level.</p>No one should choose either the four-book option or six book pledge levels which are more expensive by $9 and $4, respectively.
The best discount is at the $95 especially considering the softcovers come to $45 as add-ons.
Recommendation: Choose the $95 Complete GM Book Set and then add the appropriate number of $35 hardcovers in your chosen system.
@Curmudgeonly: You are correct there is no separate PDF price for the softcovers. The best guess is at approximately $6 based on $12 Player's...Shadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)2015-10-17T16:00:34ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: [Frog God Games]Secrets Begin to UnravelShadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2szqd?Frog-God-GamesSecrets-Begin-to-Unravel#42015-10-09T07:16:09Z2015-10-08T17:56:52Z<p>The free adventure "Rogues in Remballo" is a preview to a campaign setting book for Rappan Athuk and Barakus (and other adventure sites as well) that is done in 3 systems: 5e, Pathfinder, and S&W.</p>
<p>Further, a companion book called "Adventures in the Borderland Provinces" written originally for 5e (also to be converted to Pathfinder and S&W) by team of authors led by Ari Marmell is also forthcoming.</p>
<p>It is exciting Lost Lands project that will be coming to a Kickstarter very soon.</p>The free adventure "Rogues in Remballo" is a preview to a campaign setting book for Rappan Athuk and Barakus (and other adventure sites as well) that is done in 3 systems: 5e, Pathfinder, and S&W.
Further, a companion book called "Adventures in the Borderland Provinces" written originally for 5e (also to be converted to Pathfinder and S&W) by team of authors led by Ari Marmell is also forthcoming.
It is exciting Lost Lands project that will be coming to a Kickstarter very soon.Shadow Demon (alias of Zarathos)2015-10-08T17:56:52ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Sword of Air Update! Book of Dirty Tricks!Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2r12c?Sword-of-Air-Update-Book-of-Dirty-Tricks#142014-05-20T19:49:29Z2014-05-20T19:49:29Z<p>The interesting thing about Bill's House Rules is that they represent OD&D using his own alternate combat system other than using Chainmail or one provided in Volume 1: Men & Magic.</p>
<p>Applying this to Swords & Wizardry, if you combine this with Matt Finch's approach to magic ("An Alternate Approach to High-Level Magic, S&W Complete, p. 50, basically no 7-9th MU, no 6-7th cleric), it is readily apparent that there is little point to going up above 14th level (practically about 10th for martial classes) Beyond, hit points gained are minimal and saving throws no longer improve. For all practical purposes, everyone one has maxed out on their abilities other than the advanced classed in S&W Complete like the monk and ranger.</p>
<p>Character survival would be higher because the most dangerous monsters with special abilities like level draining and swallow whole would have greatly reduced chance to hit.</p>
<p>It wasn't specifically mentioned but I am wondering if OD&D rule of only a single attack is used as well. Multi-attack monsters would have a great advantage in this system. With single attack, the one roll is a synthesis of all attacks i.e a ghoul still attacks with claw/claw/bite but is only single chance to hit and cause 1d6 points of damage (plus only 1 change to cause paralysis in a single round)</p>
<p>JR</p>The interesting thing about Bill's House Rules is that they represent OD&D using his own alternate combat system other than using Chainmail or one provided in Volume 1: Men & Magic.
Applying this to Swords & Wizardry, if you combine this with Matt Finch's approach to magic ("An Alternate Approach to High-Level Magic, S&W Complete, p. 50, basically no 7-9th MU, no 6-7th cleric), it is readily apparent that there is little point to going up above 14th level (practically about 10th for martial...Zarathos2014-05-20T19:49:29ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Can the OGL and the "rules cannot be copyrighted" mechanic used by OSR systems work side by side?Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qwpa&page=4?Can-the-OGL-and-the-rules-cannot-be#1632014-04-22T20:48:04Z2014-04-22T20:44:27Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Matt Thomason wrote:</div><blockquote><br />
<br />
The PDF thing is why I vaguely alluded earlier to it not being a good idea to rip off a currently-available product (even if just via PDF). Anything that harms sales of earlier versions of D&D could be seen as a threat. Things like OSRIC have probably existed too long now to take action, but I wouldn't be surprised if they were hit with C&Ds (or 30-day OGL noncompliance warnings where applicable) if they were released today. </blockquote><p>I think you are right about the above, although I think WOTC would like to kill the current OSR retroclones by competition instead of litigation. Why bother with Labyrinth Lord when D&D B/X is available? Why with OSRIC with 1e & 2e reprints (likely in pdf when it goes out of print)? What if the basic form of D&D Next is also fairly close?
<p>Of course, some like Castles & Crusades and Adventurer-Conqueror-King System are really well done according to your focus and preferences.</p>
<p>I would still bother with Swords & Wizardry because OD&D is really badly written and edited. EGG freely admitted it was more like alpha/beta run, yet there are still people happily playing it.</p>
<p>Many are simply dying because there is so little support with adventures. 3e/PF is really the major elephant in the room with lion's share of the RPG gaming market with Paizo creating the perfect storm of support in combination with other 3PPs.</p>Matt Thomason wrote:The PDF thing is why I vaguely alluded earlier to it not being a good idea to rip off a currently-available product (even if just via PDF). Anything that harms sales of earlier versions of D&D could be seen as a threat. Things like OSRIC have probably existed too long now to take action, but I wouldn't be surprised if they were hit with C&Ds (or 30-day OGL noncompliance warnings where applicable) if they were released today.
I think you are right about the above, although...Zarathos2014-04-22T20:44:27ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Can the OGL and the "rules cannot be copyrighted" mechanic used by OSR systems work side by side?Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qwpa&page=4?Can-the-OGL-and-the-rules-cannot-be#1592014-04-22T22:37:37Z2014-04-22T20:02:29Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Matt Thomason wrote:</div><blockquote> There's an important clause in the OGL, however, when dealing with other OGL products. It's that 30 day time limit to fix infringement, which means you're far more likely to receive a harshly-worded warning letter to change your infringing product than you are a court summons. I actually think the OGL is worth using for that clause alone, just to ensure you've got that additional buffer between you and legal action.</blockquote><p>I was unaware of the above, the OGL just becomes more awesome the more you dig into it. It really is an exceptional piece of work. Thank you, Ryan Darcey and early WOTC employees.
<p>With above in mind, if you publish as LLC and pdf only, your risk goes way down. In 30 days, you could change any pdf and wouldn't have dead tree inventory that you couldn't sell.</p>Matt Thomason wrote:There's an important clause in the OGL, however, when dealing with other OGL products. It's that 30 day time limit to fix infringement, which means you're far more likely to receive a harshly-worded warning letter to change your infringing product than you are a court summons. I actually think the OGL is worth using for that clause alone, just to ensure you've got that additional buffer between you and legal action.
I was unaware of the above, the OGL just becomes more...Zarathos2014-04-22T20:02:29ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Can the OGL and the "rules cannot be copyrighted" mechanic used by OSR systems work side by side?Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qwpa&page=4?Can-the-OGL-and-the-rules-cannot-be#1572014-04-22T20:50:26Z2014-04-22T19:29:29Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">richard develyn wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">LazarX wrote:</div><blockquote> Given the relatively smaller size of the gaming industry, there is absolutely no excuse not do the same legwork yourself. Any proper noun you're thinking of using, you should look it up, just to make sure TSR didn't TM it in Marvel Superheroes. :) </blockquote><p>Unless I've •completely• misunderstood Product Identity, it isn't just the proper nouns, is it?
<p>Richard </blockquote><p>It is pretty much anything in your quoted definition ever published by TSR/WOTC that is not in the SRD. Interestedly, publishing under the OGL according to the letter of the law appears more restrictive than copyright law which you agree to by using the license. WOTC has shown unwillingness to follow the exact letter of their own license.
<p>As has been shown, WOTC can be fairly inconsistent but you shouldn't bet any real money on their continuing inconsistency.</p>richard develyn wrote:LazarX wrote: Given the relatively smaller size of the gaming industry, there is absolutely no excuse not do the same legwork yourself. Any proper noun you're thinking of using, you should look it up, just to make sure TSR didn't TM it in Marvel Superheroes. :)
Unless I've *completely* misunderstood Product Identity, it isn't just the proper nouns, is it? Richard It is pretty much anything in your quoted definition ever published by TSR/WOTC that is not in the SRD....Zarathos2014-04-22T19:29:29ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Can the OGL and the "rules cannot be copyrighted" mechanic used by OSR systems work side by side?Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qwpa&page=3?Can-the-OGL-and-the-rules-cannot-be#1492014-04-22T18:59:04Z2014-04-22T17:01:02Z<p>I think it all goes back to what is considered Product Identity by WOTC. If you use "Lolth" in your product, it is considered so and they have sent out cease and desist in the past.</p>
<p>In the case of the spell "Firewater" from 1e AD&D Unearthed Arcana, I don't think this name is under copyright or trademark, however it could be considered Product Identity under the OGL even though Necromancer Games got away with considering it open in their product Eldritch Sorcery. If you try to name a monster "beholder", they will consider it Product Identity and revolve your license under OGL.</p>
<p>In 2006, when OSRIC was released this was the true test for OSR. Technically, "thief" and "magic-user" could be considered Product Identity from 0e, 1e, B/X, etc. WOTC should have required OSR clones to only use "rogue" or "wizard" per SRD; however, they let it go and decided to not pursue it. From this point on, the line has become blurred, in "Adventures Dark and Deep", they do not use "beholder" in the Bestiary, but it contains a spherical monster of multiple eyes on the sphere (no eyestalks) called a "sphere of many eyes" with same mechanics.</p>
<p>I don't think WOTC would consider "bonerattle" any more important than "firewater". However, if you change it and rewrite the description, you protect yourself from WOTC ever be able to consider it Product Identity.</p>I think it all goes back to what is considered Product Identity by WOTC. If you use "Lolth" in your product, it is considered so and they have sent out cease and desist in the past.
In the case of the spell "Firewater" from 1e AD&D Unearthed Arcana, I don't think this name is under copyright or trademark, however it could be considered Product Identity under the OGL even though Necromancer Games got away with considering it open in their product Eldritch Sorcery. If you try to name a monster...Zarathos2014-04-22T17:01:02ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Can the OGL and the "rules cannot be copyrighted" mechanic used by OSR systems work side by side?Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qwpa?Can-the-OGL-and-the-rules-cannot-be#472014-04-19T21:01:26Z2014-04-19T21:01:26Z<p>Agree and think that is exactly what is happening. Products are either free or too small to be considered. My examples are stuff that shouldn't be happening but are because WOTC can be bothered. I think they are copyright violations but it is up to WOTC to try enforce it.</p>
<p>I guess I saying that taking an obscure spell from a now obscure product then renaming it and rewriting the description from the building blocks of open content is very unlikely to be a problem. Although you used the obscure product for inspiration, it is possible using SRD elements that you could have created it independently. Not likely, but possible.</p>Agree and think that is exactly what is happening. Products are either free or too small to be considered. My examples are stuff that shouldn't be happening but are because WOTC can be bothered. I think they are copyright violations but it is up to WOTC to try enforce it.
I guess I saying that taking an obscure spell from a now obscure product then renaming it and rewriting the description from the building blocks of open content is very unlikely to be a problem. Although you used the...Zarathos2014-04-19T21:01:26ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Can the OGL and the "rules cannot be copyrighted" mechanic used by OSR systems work side by side?Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qwpa?Can-the-OGL-and-the-rules-cannot-be#422014-04-19T20:55:33Z2014-04-19T20:32:27Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Kthulhu wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Zarathos wrote:</div><blockquote> There is a lot of fear of the possibility of litigation but there hasn't been any appreciable action on WOTC's part.</blockquote><p>Tell that to Fast Forward Entertainment.
<p>Oh, wait, you can't, they don't exist any more. </blockquote><p>Hmm, had to look this up.
<p>Apparently in their product, they referenced Gruumsh, Pelor, Merrshaulk and Hieroneous, Lolth, and Drawmij. Referencing proper names part of D&D IP is a big no-no.</p>
<p>That me restate the quoted part above:</p>
<p>"There is a lot of fear of the possibility of litigation but there hasn't been any appreciable action on WOTC's part that doesn't include a significant trademark or important iconic IP."</p>Kthulhu wrote:Zarathos wrote: There is a lot of fear of the possibility of litigation but there hasn't been any appreciable action on WOTC's part.
Tell that to Fast Forward Entertainment. Oh, wait, you can't, they don't exist any more. Hmm, had to look this up. Apparently in their product, they referenced Gruumsh, Pelor, Merrshaulk and Hieroneous, Lolth, and Drawmij. Referencing proper names part of D&D IP is a big no-no.
That me restate the quoted part above:
"There is a lot of fear of...Zarathos2014-04-19T20:32:27ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Can the OGL and the "rules cannot be copyrighted" mechanic used by OSR systems work side by side?Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qwpa?Can-the-OGL-and-the-rules-cannot-be#392014-04-19T19:20:03Z2014-04-19T19:20:03Z<p>I agree, Steve. So, I looked up the d20 System Trademark License and their is nothing in there that gives special permission. The text for version 6 is easily found with Google.</p>
<p>It appears very fishy that WOTC just didn't enforce their own Product Identity in this instance.</p>
<p>I would think like the case of ToH monsters where it was required to give a line item for each monster in the legal appendix that we would see something similar.</p>
<p>Under the FAQ for the Open Game License, it also states that Product Identify must be clearly identified. I don't see how as written in the legal appendix that not all spells including the ones in question are not considered open content.</p>
<p>Also in FAQ, I read the following: "Product Identity is material, otherwise clearly identified as Open Game Content, that is excluded from the License terms that apply to Open Game Content. Product Identity usually includes trademarks and other Intellectual Property (characters, settings, etc.)"</p>
<p>The above may answer the question. There may simply be some cases where if there isn't a significant trademark or important iconic IP that Wizards just won't defend it as Product Identity. I guess old defunct spells from Unearthed Arcana may well fit in this category.</p>I agree, Steve. So, I looked up the d20 System Trademark License and their is nothing in there that gives special permission. The text for version 6 is easily found with Google.
It appears very fishy that WOTC just didn't enforce their own Product Identity in this instance.
I would think like the case of ToH monsters where it was required to give a line item for each monster in the legal appendix that we would see something similar.
Under the FAQ for the Open Game License, it also states...Zarathos2014-04-19T19:20:03ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Can the OGL and the "rules cannot be copyrighted" mechanic used by OSR systems work side by side?Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qwpa?Can-the-OGL-and-the-rules-cannot-be#362014-04-19T18:44:11Z2014-04-19T18:44:11Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Steve Geddes wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Zarathos wrote:</div><blockquote> In the Necromancer product, Eldritch Sorcery this product copied the name and description of spells from 1e AD&D Unearthed Arcana with little revision other adding d20 mechanics. These were spells discarded by 2e and therefore didn't make it into 3e. Why did they let it go? Probably because of the statement on the back cover "Requires the use of Dungeon and Dragons Player's Handbook, published by Wizards of the Coast" Would they be so forgiving if this book is converted to Pathfinder? Who knows? I would consider this an example of taking the OGL with regard to copyright too far. </blockquote>I don't know that book, but I'd check if it was released under the d20 license (which, as i understand things, was separate and additional to the OGL) before drawing any conclusions as to precedent. It's possible that you were allowed more "access" if you operated under the additional license. </blockquote><p>Yeah, I guess it is possible that WOTC allowed greater access in similar fashion like it did with Tome of Horrors monsters.
<p>Yes, you are correct there is a d20 System logo. The following is in the Legal Appendix</p>
<p>This printing of Eldritch Sorcery is done under version 1.0a of the of the Open Game License, below, and version 6.0 of the d20 System Trademark License and version 5.0 of the d20 System Trademark Logo Guide.</p>
<p>However, the only thing under Product Identify relates to Necromancer Games only. I don't see how the d20 trademark and logo relate to those spells. They are included without differentiation along with the others.</p>Steve Geddes wrote:Zarathos wrote: In the Necromancer product, Eldritch Sorcery this product copied the name and description of spells from 1e AD&D Unearthed Arcana with little revision other adding d20 mechanics. These were spells discarded by 2e and therefore didn't make it into 3e. Why did they let it go? Probably because of the statement on the back cover "Requires the use of Dungeon and Dragons Player's Handbook, published by Wizards of the Coast" Would they be so forgiving if this book...Zarathos2014-04-19T18:44:11ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Can the OGL and the "rules cannot be copyrighted" mechanic used by OSR systems work side by side?Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qwpa?Can-the-OGL-and-the-rules-cannot-be#332014-04-19T18:03:25Z2014-04-19T17:54:57Z<p>The OGL has made copyright issues for the D&D game murky.</p>
<p>I believe the original intent of copyright was the following:</p>
<p>As an author, you can write a novel about vampires. However, you can't take the existing work "Salem's Lot" by Stephen King and change the title, rename the characters, and rearrange the temporal order keeping most of existing syntax and story and call it your own.</p>The OGL has made copyright issues for the D&D game murky.
I believe the original intent of copyright was the following:
As an author, you can write a novel about vampires. However, you can't take the existing work "Salem's Lot" by Stephen King and change the title, rename the characters, and rearrange the temporal order keeping most of existing syntax and story and call it your own.Zarathos2014-04-19T17:54:57ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Can the OGL and the "rules cannot be copyrighted" mechanic used by OSR systems work side by side?Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qwpa?Can-the-OGL-and-the-rules-cannot-be#312014-04-19T17:35:01Z2014-04-19T17:35:01Z<p>Carlos, you made excellent points.</p>
<p>However, my question, is the following: What changes are required to break Product Identity?</p>
<p>I would say the changing the name and not copying the description verbatim is sufficient except in cases that WOTC is willing to defend further that are directly related to trademark and iconic IP i.e no scimitar-welding drow with a large black cat.</p>
<p>Here is another example from OSRIC: As all of your know, "carrion crawler' is closed content; however WOTC has shown that the name is really the only part they are willing to defend. It is perfectly legal to have subterranean worm-like creature with eight 2ft long tentacles that paralyze their prey. The OSRIC entry is identical in mechanics to 1e AD&D Monster Manual entry. The differences in description are only very slight; in MM, "a cross between a giant green cutworm and a huge cephalopod" and in OSRIC, "the magical hybrid of a cutworm and a squid".
<br />
Finally, the name change in OSRIC using the same initials is "carcass creeper".</p>Carlos, you made excellent points.
However, my question, is the following: What changes are required to break Product Identity?
I would say the changing the name and not copying the description verbatim is sufficient except in cases that WOTC is willing to defend further that are directly related to trademark and iconic IP i.e no scimitar-welding drow with a large black cat.
Here is another example from OSRIC: As all of your know, "carrion crawler' is closed content; however WOTC has shown...Zarathos2014-04-19T17:35:01ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Can the OGL and the "rules cannot be copyrighted" mechanic used by OSR systems work side by side?Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qwpa?Can-the-OGL-and-the-rules-cannot-be#292014-04-19T16:18:38Z2014-04-19T16:18:38Z<p>Here is another example and how just far you can go without the dreaded cease and desist.</p>
<p>There is OSR game called Adventures Dark and Deep which is a "what-if" 2e if Gary remained with the game. Game is by Joseph Bloch of BRW Games, used a KS to pay for artwork, uses print on demand. Easy to change if he actually got a cease and desist letter.</p>
<p>In the Bestiary which is for sale on RPGNow, there is a monster called "Demoniarch" which other the name is nearly identical in mechanics and description with artwork to the 1e AD&D Monster Manual entry "Demogorgon"</p>Here is another example and how just far you can go without the dreaded cease and desist.
There is OSR game called Adventures Dark and Deep which is a "what-if" 2e if Gary remained with the game. Game is by Joseph Bloch of BRW Games, used a KS to pay for artwork, uses print on demand. Easy to change if he actually got a cease and desist letter.
In the Bestiary which is for sale on RPGNow, there is a monster called "Demoniarch" which other the name is nearly identical in mechanics and...Zarathos2014-04-19T16:18:38ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Can the OGL and the "rules cannot be copyrighted" mechanic used by OSR systems work side by side?Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qwpa?Can-the-OGL-and-the-rules-cannot-be#272014-04-19T15:45:41Z2014-04-19T15:45:41Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Nathanael Love wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Zarathos wrote:</div><blockquote><p> There is a lot of fear of the possibility of litigation but there hasn't been any appreciable action on WOTC's part. If you did cross a line, the first action would be a cease and desist letter. The OGL has really weakened the concept of copyright within D&D. At this point, avoiding the name and a rewriting the description is sufficient without worry. The most important part is really the TradeMark. "D&D, Dungeon & Dragons, Greyhawk, Forgotten Realms, Ravenloft, etc."</p>
<p>Here is an example of what I would think is a blatant copyright violation but WOTC pretty much hand-waved it.</p>
<p>In the Necromancer product, Eldritch Sorcery this product copied the name and description of spells from 1e AD&D Unearthed Arcana with little revision other adding d20 mechanics. These were spells discarded by 2e and therefore didn't make it into 3e. Why did they let it go? Probably because of the statement on the back cover "Requires the use of Dungeon and Dragons Player's Handbook, published by Wizards of the Coast" Would they be so forgiving if this book is converted to Pathfinder? Who knows? I would consider this an example of taking the OGL with regard to copyright too far. </blockquote><p>Might be— there are definitely things that WoTC is very protective of though— anything Forgotten Realms, any of the monsters or spells that were in the 3.5 PH or MM that are not in the SRD, anything that gets into their novel line's characters (the real profit driver for D&D). . .
<p>I bet if someone published a character who was a reformed CG Drow name Miz't Modrane with dual scimitars and a cat companion they would be hit hard and fast. </blockquote><p>Absolutely and totally agree. There are certain proper names that Wizards has decided are iconic to their business.
<p>Another example of a product that comes right up to the line is OSRIC (1e retroclone). There are few spells that don't have a direct mapping in the SRD. For example, 3e uses the skill and feat system for creation of magic items but OSRIC includes the spell enchant an item. This is name and description right out of AD&D Player's Handbook.</p>Nathanael Love wrote:Zarathos wrote:There is a lot of fear of the possibility of litigation but there hasn't been any appreciable action on WOTC's part. If you did cross a line, the first action would be a cease and desist letter. The OGL has really weakened the concept of copyright within D&D. At this point, avoiding the name and a rewriting the description is sufficient without worry. The most important part is really the TradeMark. "D&D, Dungeon & Dragons, Greyhawk, Forgotten Realms,...Zarathos2014-04-19T15:45:41ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Can the OGL and the "rules cannot be copyrighted" mechanic used by OSR systems work side by side?Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qwpa?Can-the-OGL-and-the-rules-cannot-be#252014-04-19T15:19:05Z2014-04-19T15:19:05Z<p>There is a lot of fear of the possibility of litigation but there hasn't been any appreciable action on WOTC's part. If you did cross a line, the first action would be a cease and desist letter. The OGL has really weakened the concept of copyright within D&D. At this point, avoiding the name and a rewriting the description is sufficient without worry. The most important part is really the TradeMark. "D&D, Dungeon & Dragons, Greyhawk, Forgotten Realms, Ravenloft, etc."</p>
<p>Here is an example of what I would think is a blatant copyright violation but WOTC pretty much hand-waved it.</p>
<p>In the Necromancer product, Eldritch Sorcery this product copied the name and description of spells from 1e AD&D Unearthed Arcana with little revision other adding d20 mechanics. These were spells discarded by 2e and therefore didn't make it into 3e. Why did they let it go? Probably because of the statement on the back cover "Requires the use of Dungeon and Dragons Player's Handbook, published by Wizards of the Coast" Would they be so forgiving if this book is converted to Pathfinder? Who knows? I would consider this an example of taking the OGL with regard to copyright too far.</p>There is a lot of fear of the possibility of litigation but there hasn't been any appreciable action on WOTC's part. If you did cross a line, the first action would be a cease and desist letter. The OGL has really weakened the concept of copyright within D&D. At this point, avoiding the name and a rewriting the description is sufficient without worry. The most important part is really the TradeMark. "D&D, Dungeon & Dragons, Greyhawk, Forgotten Realms, Ravenloft, etc."
Here is an example of...Zarathos2014-04-19T15:19:05ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: [Frog God Games] The Lost Lands: Sword of Air Kickstarter has gone live!Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2q7uz&page=7?Frog-God-Games-The-Lost-Lands-Sword-of-Air#3072013-11-12T20:15:14Z2013-11-11T02:53:53Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Kthulhu wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Zarathos wrote:</div><blockquote>stuff about which came first, the adventures or the setting</blockquote><p>I guess I misunderstood you. I was assuming you meant published works, where adventures to tend to come well before a formalized setting book.
<p>However, if we're going to include unpublished setting notes, then I still don't really see the difference. You talk about Gygax's setting notes on Greyhawk predating the adventures...I'd wager that Bill Webb has setting notes that predate Necromancer Games. As far as I can tell, the only real difference seems to be that the name of the setting "The Lost Lands", has only recently been decided upon.</p>
<p>By the way, there have been several purely setting materials released for the setting, even if at the time the name "The Lost Lands" was not used. <i>Bard's Gate</i> and <i>Glades of Death</i>, for example. </blockquote><p>As an example, the I3-I5 Desert of Desolation series when it was first published was generic and gave little campaign info. In 1987, a compilation was published with details added for use in the Forgotten Realms. The Forgotten Realms was the perfect example of the setting first and adventures second with a few adventures redone and reimagined as above.
<p>All of the Necromancer material is generic and written by multiple authors. The city of Bard's Gate could be in any setting at any time. Bill has some notes but they are not nearly as richly detailed as Gygax's Greyhawk. His primary campaign setting since the 70s is the Judges Guild Wilderlands of High Fantasy. That is why it is important for Greg the story guy to unify it with his imagination. Notice the detail in Slumbering Tsar. Also not only the name "Lost Lands" is new, but the complete map of the setting. As shown in Stoneheart Valley foreword, there is a simple map created as an educated guess by The Lone Goldfish during Necromancer's time. This starting map, Greg reading all of the old Necromancer material, and incorporating the new Frog God material is the true genesis of a future marketable setting.</p>Kthulhu wrote:Zarathos wrote:stuff about which came first, the adventures or the setting
I guess I misunderstood you. I was assuming you meant published works, where adventures to tend to come well before a formalized setting book. However, if we're going to include unpublished setting notes, then I still don't really see the difference. You talk about Gygax's setting notes on Greyhawk predating the adventures...I'd wager that Bill Webb has setting notes that predate Necromancer Games. As...Zarathos2013-11-11T02:53:53ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: [Frog God Games] The Lost Lands: Sword of Air Kickstarter has gone live!Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2q7uz&page=6?Frog-God-Games-The-Lost-Lands-Sword-of-Air#2872013-11-06T13:25:21Z2013-11-05T20:09:12Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Kthulhu wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Zarathos wrote:</div><blockquote> What is strange is that the standard is the campaign setting is released first and then adventures support it. Necromancer and Frog God have a rich history of adventures that are tied and can be tied together but no campaign setting.</blockquote><p>I don't know that that's really true. There was a ton of Greyhawk modules produced even before the 32-page folio came (while there was Supplement I: Greyhawk, it was a rules supplement with no setting information). The same is true of Dragonlance and the best-Forgotten Realms. Ravenloft was a generic-setting module that TSR decided to turn into it's own setting.
<p>More recently, the Midgard setting had been going strong for years before it got a campaign setting book. And even Golarion had a bunch of APs and modules out of the gate before the 3.5 campaign setting book came out.</p>
<p>If anything, putting out the campaign setting first is the lesser used approach. </blockquote><p>This is an interesting chicken-egg debate. Greyhawk existed first as Gygax's campaign world before it first saw print in 1980 (0e supplement was little more than a name). His creative period of module writing which included Hommlet, Giants series and Descent series was published first in late 70s but it wasn't created first.
<p>Forgotten Realms was created first as replacement for Greyhawk in 1987 before any significant adventures were released. One of earliest 1e modules was N5: Under Illefarn in 1987 as a original publication and the first to carry the Forgotten Realms logo.</p>
<p>Dragonlance started as series of modules in 1984 that was almost a self-contained campaign setting with different feel than Greyhawk with diminished divine power. A consolidation and expansion of that material first occurred in Dragonlance Adventures in 1987. The DL series of modules practically built the campaign setting.</p>
<p>1e I6: Ravenloft (1983) was significantly different that the campaign setting with rule sub-system that was created in 1990 during 2e. Castle Ravenloft, Strahd, and land of Barovia were the primary points of overlap.</p>
<p>As to other systems created after Y2K like Golarion, I have little doubt there was detailed unpublished notes on these settings before any adventures were published.</p>
<p>In contrast, both the name "Lost Lands" , the map, and the organization of its lands are brand new compared to the age of the adventures preceding them. The greatest amount of background material is given in Slumbering Tsar, Stoneheart Valley, and Rappan Athuk. It will not a trivial task to bring together the disparate material from the other adventures. However, I have great confidence because of Greg's meticulous nature for consistency.</p>Kthulhu wrote:Zarathos wrote: What is strange is that the standard is the campaign setting is released first and then adventures support it. Necromancer and Frog God have a rich history of adventures that are tied and can be tied together but no campaign setting.
I don't know that that's really true. There was a ton of Greyhawk modules produced even before the 32-page folio came (while there was Supplement I: Greyhawk, it was a rules supplement with no setting information). The same is true...Zarathos2013-11-05T20:09:12ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: [Frog God Games] The Lost Lands: Sword of Air Kickstarter has gone live!Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2q7uz&page=6?Frog-God-Games-The-Lost-Lands-Sword-of-Air#2732013-11-04T19:07:16Z2013-11-04T19:07:16Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">TriOmegaZero wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Zarathos wrote:</div><blockquote> I know the history and it was workable when Necromancer had permissive rights to Wilderlands and the Scarred Lands, both of which are out of print with no foreseeable print future; </blockquote><a href="http://theonyxpath.com/scarred-lands-finds-new-home-with-onyx-path-publishing-and-nocturnal-media/" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">You might want to reconsider that statement.</a> :) </blockquote><p>Well, will wonders never cease! No matter how dead something appears, there is always hope of resurrection. Also, pdfs can still be obtained from DriveThruRPG. Let me edit my original statement.TriOmegaZero wrote:Zarathos wrote: I know the history and it was workable when Necromancer had permissive rights to Wilderlands and the Scarred Lands, both of which are out of print with no foreseeable print future;
You might want to reconsider that statement. :) Well, will wonders never cease! No matter how dead something appears, there is always hope of resurrection. Also, pdfs can still be obtained from DriveThruRPG. Let me edit my original statement.Zarathos2013-11-04T19:07:16ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: [Frog God Games] The Lost Lands: Sword of Air Kickstarter has gone live!Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2q7uz&page=6?Frog-God-Games-The-Lost-Lands-Sword-of-Air#2712013-11-04T18:29:52Z2013-11-04T18:29:52Z<p>I know the history and it was workable when Necromancer had permissive rights to Wilderlands and the Scarred Lands; it is now backward with Frog God Games which is why it is going to take some time to write with both clarity and consistency. Some products will not move with the setting; the excellent foreword to Stoneheart Valley gives an explanation. Even without the IP problems, the Lost Lands setting is the superior solution.</p>I know the history and it was workable when Necromancer had permissive rights to Wilderlands and the Scarred Lands; it is now backward with Frog God Games which is why it is going to take some time to write with both clarity and consistency. Some products will not move with the setting; the excellent foreword to Stoneheart Valley gives an explanation. Even without the IP problems, the Lost Lands setting is the superior solution.Zarathos2013-11-04T18:29:52ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: [Frog God Games] The Lost Lands: Sword of Air Kickstarter has gone live!Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2q7uz&page=6?Frog-God-Games-The-Lost-Lands-Sword-of-Air#2692013-11-04T14:01:15Z2013-11-04T14:01:15Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">wraithstrike wrote:</div><blockquote> Is this a campaign setting, something similar to an adventure path, or a combination of the two? </blockquote><p>Since no one has responded, I shall try to clarify.
<p>Primarily, this is an adventure that is part of the Lost Lands like Rappan Athuk, Slumbering Tsar, and Razor Coast. SoA has a logo on it for the Lost Lands as the run is made for the campaign setting release. It is part of a world which at this time has a map that is sight unseen; however, each of these mega-adventures has campaign setting material in it.</p>
<p>What is strange is that the standard is the campaign setting is released first and then adventures support it. Necromancer and Frog God have a rich history of adventures that are tied and can be tied together but no campaign setting. </p>
<p>Since this is being done in reverse, Greg• is going to have the momental task of making sure everything is consistent. After the Lost Lands campaign setting release, future adventures will be written to maintain canon consistency with the setting.</p>
<p>It almost goes without saying this is not ideal which is why the campaign setting is written first. However, the great advantage is that is the campaign setting would have direct links and ties to the adventures themselves that other campaign settings do not have until a second revision or later.</p>
<p>•Somehow I guess this will accomplished as he goes to medical school. He is currently in his second year and then will be entering rotations.</p>wraithstrike wrote:Is this a campaign setting, something similar to an adventure path, or a combination of the two?
Since no one has responded, I shall try to clarify. Primarily, this is an adventure that is part of the Lost Lands like Rappan Athuk, Slumbering Tsar, and Razor Coast. SoA has a logo on it for the Lost Lands as the run is made for the campaign setting release. It is part of a world which at this time has a map that is sight unseen; however, each of these mega-adventures has...Zarathos2013-11-04T14:01:15ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: [Frog God Games] The Lost Lands: Sword of Air Kickstarter has gone live!Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2q7uz&page=6?Frog-God-Games-The-Lost-Lands-Sword-of-Air#2672013-11-03T21:34:16Z2013-11-03T21:34:16Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Grimmy wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Bill Webb wrote:</div><blockquote> Ps. The free sw rules thing is more community building focused than a "reward" per se </blockquote>That is exactly how I perceived it. </blockquote><p>Same here, I rarely post here because my interests are with S&W community. However, I still consider Pathfinder community to be a kindred spirit that wish continuing growth and success. For me personally, Pathfinder is more of a mathematical exercise in tinkering.
<p>I think of game style as a two-axis continuum which make up play for all role-playing games. One axis is the abstract-simulation and the other is gamist-narrative. Going to any extreme on any one axis and you no longer have a RPG. For example, pure gamist is a board game while pure narrative is group storytelling. Pure abstract would have no sense of realism and pure simulation would bog a game down in minute details for the sake of perceived realism. This leaves a lot of open interpretation to create multiple play styles with any given RPG ruleset. </p>
<p>S&W (as well TSR era D&D) is the best for personal GM play style while still open to play other styles as the opportunity presents itself.</p>Grimmy wrote:Bill Webb wrote: Ps. The free sw rules thing is more community building focused than a "reward" per se
That is exactly how I perceived it. Same here, I rarely post here because my interests are with S&W community. However, I still consider Pathfinder community to be a kindred spirit that wish continuing growth and success. For me personally, Pathfinder is more of a mathematical exercise in tinkering. I think of game style as a two-axis continuum which make up play for all...Zarathos2013-11-03T21:34:16ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: [Frog God Games] The Lost Lands: Sword of Air Kickstarter has gone live!Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2q7uz&page=6?Frog-God-Games-The-Lost-Lands-Sword-of-Air#2512013-11-01T19:13:07Z2013-11-01T19:13:07Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">brvheart wrote:</div><blockquote> Sounds like it is worth getting both then. Still, I want the map however I have to get it. SoA won't be out until around then either. </blockquote><p>Although Chuck said late 2014, I personally think it is more likely to be early 2015. In any case, SoA has to be released first. If it slips for any reason, so does the campaign setting.
<p>I really excited about the Lost Lands setting. This is really the one and prime that brings together Rappan Athuk, Slumbering Tsar, Stoneheart Valley, Razor Coast, and Sword of Air.</p>
<p>I was speaking with Greg Vaughan at NTRPG Con last June. The idea is the campaign setting ties into the adventures. Greyhawk was a skeleton with no direct ties to the adventures in the product itself. However, the level of detail would never be as great as the Forgotten Realms or Golarion.</p>
<p>The other element is that the Lost Lands would become the official setting for Swords & Wizardry, an essential element for any fully supported RPG. This setting in combination with free rules pdf should help generate more interest for this system.</p>brvheart wrote:Sounds like it is worth getting both then. Still, I want the map however I have to get it. SoA won't be out until around then either.
Although Chuck said late 2014, I personally think it is more likely to be early 2015. In any case, SoA has to be released first. If it slips for any reason, so does the campaign setting. I really excited about the Lost Lands setting. This is really the one and prime that brings together Rappan Athuk, Slumbering Tsar, Stoneheart Valley, Razor...Zarathos2013-11-01T19:13:07ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: [Frog God Games] The Lost Lands: Sword of Air Kickstarter has gone live!Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2q7uz&page=5?Frog-God-Games-The-Lost-Lands-Sword-of-Air#2482013-11-01T17:25:19Z2013-11-01T17:25:19Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Orthos wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Zarathos wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">brvheart wrote:</div><blockquote> Not me, the map is 90% of what I want this for! </blockquote>Hmmm, that doesn't make any sense to me considering the same map is going to be in the Lost Lands campaign setting product. The adventure should be your primary reason for wanting SoA. </blockquote>Unless he's not getting the Lost Land setting book. </blockquote><p>If one has Rappan Athuk, Stoneheart Valley, Razor Coast, and Sword of Air, I find that to be an unlikely scenario; however, this is a possibility that I have overlooked.
<p>Unless the KS starts making an average of about $2500 over the next 14 days, then it may be the only option. </p>
<p>The last timeline I heard was from Chuck Wright for late 2014; the only duplication would be the full map.</p>Orthos wrote:Zarathos wrote: brvheart wrote: Not me, the map is 90% of what I want this for!
Hmmm, that doesn't make any sense to me considering the same map is going to be in the Lost Lands campaign setting product. The adventure should be your primary reason for wanting SoA. Unless he's not getting the Lost Land setting book. If one has Rappan Athuk, Stoneheart Valley, Razor Coast, and Sword of Air, I find that to be an unlikely scenario; however, this is a possibility that I have...Zarathos2013-11-01T17:25:19ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: [Frog God Games] The Lost Lands: Sword of Air Kickstarter has gone live!Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2q7uz&page=5?Frog-God-Games-The-Lost-Lands-Sword-of-Air#2442013-11-01T16:55:47Z2013-11-01T16:55:47Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">brvheart wrote:</div><blockquote> Not me, the map is 90% of what I want this for! </blockquote><p>Hmmm, that doesn't make any sense to me considering the same map is going to be in the Lost Lands campaign setting product. The adventure should be your primary reason for wanting SoA.brvheart wrote:Not me, the map is 90% of what I want this for!
Hmmm, that doesn't make any sense to me considering the same map is going to be in the Lost Lands campaign setting product. The adventure should be your primary reason for wanting SoA.Zarathos2013-11-01T16:55:47ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: [Frog God Games] The Lost Lands: Sword of Air Kickstarter has gone live!Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2q7uz&page=5?Frog-God-Games-The-Lost-Lands-Sword-of-Air#2412013-11-01T14:34:28Z2013-11-01T14:34:28Z<p>Honestly, I would prefer that you have to go with B&W artists. I greatly prefer the art direction in Rappan Athuk ( I echo Grimmy that is the one finest dungeon crawls of all), Stoneheart Valley and the previous Necromancer works compared to Razor Coast and Paizo's work. I think SoA in color would be a disconnect from previous B&W works.</p>
<p>Sadly, I hoping this KS only makes about $99,000; not making the map is not too much of a disappointment because it is coming with Lost Land campaign setting anyway. The extra wilderness areas and player's guide are cool but not vital.</p>
<p>The most important goal beyond funding is the 400-backer goal to give S&W Complete away as a free-for-all. I am confident this will be made, without making extra accounts as Kthulhu suggested.</p>
<p>My opinion, color did make sense for Razor Coast and it was ok for for ToH4 but not for this.</p>
<p>P.S. Plus color PDF just bogs my iPad down, although I have successfully optimized Razor Coast to improve this. If it is done in color, a optimized light version like Paizo does should be in order.</p>Honestly, I would prefer that you have to go with B&W artists. I greatly prefer the art direction in Rappan Athuk ( I echo Grimmy that is the one finest dungeon crawls of all), Stoneheart Valley and the previous Necromancer works compared to Razor Coast and Paizo's work. I think SoA in color would be a disconnect from previous B&W works.
Sadly, I hoping this KS only makes about $99,000; not making the map is not too much of a disappointment because it is coming with Lost Land campaign...Zarathos2013-11-01T14:34:28ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: [Frog God Games] The Lost Lands: Sword of Air Kickstarter has gone live!Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2q7uz?Frog-God-Games-The-Lost-Lands-Sword-of-Air#192013-10-02T14:56:21Z2013-10-02T14:56:21Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Senjen wrote:</div><blockquote> Maybe send out an update to the Rappan Athuk Kickstarter (or any of the others) letting people know this is live. I will admit that I expected it to have funded by now, but may be that was just optimism. </blockquote><p>Yep, should send an update to Rappan Athuk, Swords & Wizardry, and Razor Coast KS. Everyone who pledged in those should be made aware.
<p>Also, maybe update the blog and place a linked banner on the FGG website. Also, send an email from Rana Reader database.</p>
<p>Hmmm, some advertising and marketing could actually help. However, FGG were caught by surprise on the quick approval so I am hopeful they will implement some of the above soon.</p>Senjen wrote:Maybe send out an update to the Rappan Athuk Kickstarter (or any of the others) letting people know this is live. I will admit that I expected it to have funded by now, but may be that was just optimism.
Yep, should send an update to Rappan Athuk, Swords & Wizardry, and Razor Coast KS. Everyone who pledged in those should be made aware. Also, maybe update the blog and place a linked banner on the FGG website. Also, send an email from Rana Reader database.
Hmmm, some advertising...Zarathos2013-10-02T14:56:21ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Finally, after 14 yearsZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2q307&page=3?Finally-after-14-years#1132013-09-20T23:37:12Z2013-09-20T23:37:12Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Feros wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">brvheart wrote:</div><blockquote> Only one problem with that idea Feros, Blonde Frog doesn't work there anymore. </blockquote>Wow! When did that happen? Just curious now. </blockquote><p>August 25th. Now, works for Legendary Games. Maybe the main reason for the difference in Bill's announcement on August 23th and start of KS on October 1st.Feros wrote:brvheart wrote: Only one problem with that idea Feros, Blonde Frog doesn't work there anymore.
Wow! When did that happen? Just curious now. August 25th. Now, works for Legendary Games. Maybe the main reason for the difference in Bill's announcement on August 23th and start of KS on October 1st.Zarathos2013-09-20T23:37:12ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Finally, after 14 yearsZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2q307&page=3?Finally-after-14-years#1082013-09-20T21:56:46Z2013-09-20T21:56:46Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Steve Geddes wrote:</div><blockquote> Who's Haskins? </blockquote><p>Greg Haskins, creator of Worra Realms card game (see more info, under About Us on Frog God website). I met him at the NTRPG Con 2013 and talked with him about plans to create S&W card game. He has experience with web design and has previously run a KS for Worra Realms. With Rachel gone, he will be great help in getting this Kickstarter up & running. Maybe, he will also help in redesigning the Frog God website.Steve Geddes wrote:Who's Haskins?
Greg Haskins, creator of Worra Realms card game (see more info, under About Us on Frog God website). I met him at the NTRPG Con 2013 and talked with him about plans to create S&W card game. He has experience with web design and has previously run a KS for Worra Realms. With Rachel gone, he will be great help in getting this Kickstarter up & running. Maybe, he will also help in redesigning the Frog God website.Zarathos2013-09-20T21:56:46ZRe: Forums: Customer Service: Unable to select Lottery events for PaizoConZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2ptyk?Unable-to-select-Lottery-events-for-PaizoCon#32013-06-05T21:31:25Z2013-06-05T21:31:25Z<p>I am new to this, bit it doesn't appear that I can select Lottery events either.</p>I am new to this, bit it doesn't appear that I can select Lottery events either.Zarathos2013-06-05T21:31:25ZRe: Forums: 4th Edition: Some Questions About First Edition AD&DZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2pp8y?Some-Questions-About-First-Edition-ADD#332013-04-25T17:32:32Z2013-04-25T17:32:32Z<p>Then check out pdfs of classic D&D materials at http://www.dndclassics.com.</p>Then check out pdfs of classic D&D materials at http://www.dndclassics.com.Zarathos2013-04-25T17:32:32ZRe: Forums: 4th Edition: Some Questions About First Edition AD&DZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2pp8y?Some-Questions-About-First-Edition-ADD#312013-04-26T20:39:51Z2013-04-25T17:12:10Z<p>Classic D&D is the same game from 1974-1999 (0e - 2e). Each edition had ever expanding options and different organization. However, it is all easily compatible and modular with no wrong way to play. It really didn't become a different game (although still easily convertible for spells & magic items) until 3e. The major differences really come down to tone, organization, and the options presented. </p>
<p>As for monster replacement, most are still the same. For example, whether you playing 0e-2e, D&D B/X, D&D BECMI, the basilisk HD are 6+1, the bite is still 1d10 and the gaze reguires a save vs. petrification. Although for 0e, D&D B/X, D&B BECMI, the base AC 9 vs AC 10 for AD&D, Gygax didn't bother to adjust the AC, most ACs remain the same.</p>
<p>As Kthulhu said, any conversions are not that complicated. So, whatever module you have from this classic era will work and if you wish to try anything recent may I suggest any of the Swords & Wizardry material from Frog God Games.</p>Classic D&D is the same game from 1974-1999 (0e - 2e). Each edition had ever expanding options and different organization. However, it is all easily compatible and modular with no wrong way to play. It really didn't become a different game (although still easily convertible for spells & magic items) until 3e. The major differences really come down to tone, organization, and the options presented.
As for monster replacement, most are still the same. For example, whether you playing 0e-2e, D&D...Zarathos2013-04-25T17:12:10ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: [FROG GOD GAMES] Three New Adventures from the FrogsZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p6hp?FROG-GOD-GAMES-Three-New-Adventures-from-the#62012-11-21T22:36:12Z2012-11-21T22:36:12Z<p>The Mires of Mourning is an excellent adventure, I got the wonderful opportunity to run thru it with Greg at NTRPG Con in June. It was first time I have gotten to play Pathfinder at a Con. Great fun, I am looking forward to what Greg is going to have at NTRPG Con 2013.</p>The Mires of Mourning is an excellent adventure, I got the wonderful opportunity to run thru it with Greg at NTRPG Con in June. It was first time I have gotten to play Pathfinder at a Con. Great fun, I am looking forward to what Greg is going to have at NTRPG Con 2013.Zarathos2012-11-21T22:36:12ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Rappan AthukZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2o1ko&page=39?Rappan-Athuk#19162012-11-20T03:47:16Z2012-11-20T03:47:16Z<p>@mach1.9pants - Under d20pro Menu Button: Downloads, the maps need to be imported. Once imported, the maps are under Library.</p>@mach1.9pants - Under d20pro Menu Button: Downloads, the maps need to be imported. Once imported, the maps are under Library.Zarathos2012-11-20T03:47:16ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Rappan AthukZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2o1ko&page=38?Rappan-Athuk#18832013-01-14T06:48:54Z2012-11-13T22:15:45Z<p>if there is a second printing, even if not, I think the pdf should be updated to include an appendix of player's maps made from d20pro maps. This would allow the option to export the maps into any virtual game space including Paizo's upcoming offering.</p>
<p>Right now, the d20pro maps are locked from export, which I understand. However, since I have a 30 inch monitor, I can screen grab it at fairly good resolution. Since I use d20pro, this isn't a problem but others (meaning future customers) may not wish to spend $30+the cost of Rappan Athuk d20pro maps.</p>
<p>Personally, I feel all adventures/modules in this modern age should be bundled with pdfs that include both a GM and a Player's Map. In fact for me, the usefulness of the printed copy has become greatly diminished. If I just had the RA printed copy without the pdf and d20pro maps, I don't think I could run it due to the complexity of the cartography. </p>
<p>While waiting for completion of d20pro maps (thank you so much for your work on this, Rachel), I am completely reworking the pdf for later printing for play. Removing the art, separating the maps, changing stat blocks, adding errata (S&W version has significantly more than the Pf version), adding art into a illustrations section like Tomb of Horrors, and renumbering the pages. The white space from the lack of art allows notes to be written during play; no one wants to write in their faux-leather hardcopy.</p>
<p>So, the printing copy looks good on my bookshelf and have enjoying reading it but it has limited use in actually playing my game.</p>if there is a second printing, even if not, I think the pdf should be updated to include an appendix of player's maps made from d20pro maps. This would allow the option to export the maps into any virtual game space including Paizo's upcoming offering.
Right now, the d20pro maps are locked from export, which I understand. However, since I have a 30 inch monitor, I can screen grab it at fairly good resolution. Since I use d20pro, this isn't a problem but others (meaning future customers) may...Zarathos2012-11-13T22:15:45ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Rappan AthukZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2o1ko&page=37?Rappan-Athuk#18062012-11-04T02:56:09Z2012-11-04T02:56:09Z<p>D20Pro downloads are fixed for me, hopefully for the others as well.</p>D20Pro downloads are fixed for me, hopefully for the others as well.Zarathos2012-11-04T02:56:09ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Rappan AthukZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2o1ko&page=37?Rappan-Athuk#18022012-11-03T00:18:19Z2012-11-03T00:18:19Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Elorebaen wrote:</div><blockquote><p> I can see the Rappan Athuk files in d20, but there is no option for me to download. I assume it has to do with my login. I filled out the survey with my d20 login when it came through. </p>
<p>I e-mailed d20 about the the issue. Should I also e-mail you guys? Thanks! </blockquote><p>I glad I not the only one that is having the same problem although it would obviously be better if it just worked. It is in the Marketplace but not linked into download for my login. I emailed Blonde Frog at kickstarter@talesofthefroggod.com.Elorebaen wrote:I can see the Rappan Athuk files in d20, but there is no option for me to download. I assume it has to do with my login. I filled out the survey with my d20 login when it came through.
I e-mailed d20 about the the issue. Should I also e-mail you guys? Thanks!
I glad I not the only one that is having the same problem although it would obviously be better if it just worked. It is in the Marketplace but not linked into download for my login. I emailed Blonde Frog at...Zarathos2012-11-03T00:18:19ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Rappan AthukZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2o1ko&page=36?Rappan-Athuk#17792012-10-30T21:50:11Z2012-10-30T21:50:11Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Kthulhu wrote:</div><blockquote> Of course, the big FGG Hero Lab project would be the Tome of Horrors Complete. When comes it? </blockquote><p>Most of the monsters in Tome of Horrors Complete are in the d20pfsrd Community Bestiary. It is still WIP but it looking good.
<p>On the d20pfsrd website, it is under Extras - HeroLab Community Repository; also at this specific site.</p>
<p>http://www.d20pfsrd.com/extras/community-creations/hero-lab</p>Kthulhu wrote:Of course, the big FGG Hero Lab project would be the Tome of Horrors Complete. When comes it?
Most of the monsters in Tome of Horrors Complete are in the d20pfsrd Community Bestiary. It is still WIP but it looking good. On the d20pfsrd website, it is under Extras - HeroLab Community Repository; also at this specific site.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/extras/community-creations/hero-labZarathos2012-10-30T21:50:11ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Rappan AthukZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2o1ko&page=35?Rappan-Athuk#17282012-10-29T01:02:42Z2012-10-29T01:02:42Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Steve Geddes wrote:</div><blockquote><p> Everything arrived safe and sound. Packaging was, as usual, top notch with not dings or damage at all. I have this peculiar thing of always expecting top quality from FGG and nonetheless being pleasantly surprised by just how good the books are when I finally get them. :)</p>
<p>One query - although it was signed by Bill, my leather PF book didnt get a number (which is no big deal) but I'm curious as to how many were printed. Was it 30 PF and 30 S&W or 30 total? (Or something else?) </blockquote><p>The leather PF book has a number; it isn't by Bill's signature; it is in faint ink in the corner of the cover page opposite the art. Bill used ink that was brighter when wet so it didn't work out like he hoped.
<p>You know on the golden ticket thing; I am started to wonder if a ticket is stuffed in one of the books. If so, I wonder how many were opened without the owner turning every page. It just seems strange that only one has ever been redeemed. Of course, maybe not; it could be in the front with the signature card and there really are many out there that are still shrink-wrapped.</p>Steve Geddes wrote:Everything arrived safe and sound. Packaging was, as usual, top notch with not dings or damage at all. I have this peculiar thing of always expecting top quality from FGG and nonetheless being pleasantly surprised by just how good the books are when I finally get them. :)
One query - although it was signed by Bill, my leather PF book didnt get a number (which is no big deal) but I'm curious as to how many were printed. Was it 30 PF and 30 S&W or 30 total? (Or something...Zarathos2012-10-29T01:02:42ZRe: Forums: Website Feedback: PDF Downloads to iPadZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p3lj?PDF-Downloads-to-iPad#282012-10-28T00:58:15Z2012-10-28T00:58:15Z<p>GoodReader is an excellent app that has worked well for me using many of the cloud services. iCloud, Dropbox, Skydrive, Box, SugarSync... I have pdfs on all of these cloud services connected to GoodReader. iCloud syncing works well with Mountain Lion on my laptop (for some reason Lion iCloud stopped working on my desktop). Under ~/Library/Mobile Documents is a folder for GoodReader, simply placing files in this folder will sync with iPad under GoodReader. The Library folder is invisible so if you don't use a utility to make it visible(or use Terminal), you have to use the Finder Go Menu and select Go to Folder ... and type in "~/Library" to locate it. Of course, you could also use iTunes as well especially if the syncing computer is Windows. For best results, use the cloud application on your computer(Mac or Windows) to upload your documents.</p>
<p>Personally, I have never used Safari on iPad for downloading documents. Everything goes thru my Mac first. Never ever a problem. I can download at will my many documents. Dropbox is my primary go-to service.</p>GoodReader is an excellent app that has worked well for me using many of the cloud services. iCloud, Dropbox, Skydrive, Box, SugarSync... I have pdfs on all of these cloud services connected to GoodReader. iCloud syncing works well with Mountain Lion on my laptop (for some reason Lion iCloud stopped working on my desktop). Under ~/Library/Mobile Documents is a folder for GoodReader, simply placing files in this folder will sync with iPad under GoodReader. The Library folder is invisible so if...Zarathos2012-10-28T00:58:15ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Rappan AthukZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2o1ko&page=34?Rappan-Athuk#16862012-10-25T01:56:47Z2012-10-25T01:56:47Z<p>I decided to open mine as well; No Golden Ticket for Killer DM#1000. Dragnmoon, Shem, and myself come up with nada. I believe there were two others that got a RA Reloaded. I wonder how many Bill has got left.</p>I decided to open mine as well; No Golden Ticket for Killer DM#1000. Dragnmoon, Shem, and myself come up with nada. I believe there were two others that got a RA Reloaded. I wonder how many Bill has got left.Zarathos2012-10-25T01:56:47ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Rappan AthukZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2o1ko&page=34?Rappan-Athuk#16582012-10-23T13:35:41Z2012-10-23T13:35:41Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Dragnmoon wrote:</div><blockquote></p>
<p>I need to decide what I am going to do with this<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/dragnmoon/8114236649/" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">"Killer GM #993"</a>. I already own #20 opened, should I sell it sealed? Or open it to see if there is a golden ticket in it then sell the box?</p>
<p>How many golden tickets are left that have not been turned in? </blockquote><p>Selfishly, I would like you to open your #993 so I can decide if I want to open #1000. Obviously, you would like me to do the same. There are still some golden tickets out there. I think "Free product for life" & "Free PDF for life" , "Attend RPG Con on Necromancer", I believe these are the ones Bill mentioned. If I could get the first one, it would be worth the entire pledge amount.Dragnmoon wrote:I need to decide what I am going to do with this"Killer GM #993". I already own #20 opened, should I sell it sealed? Or open it to see if there is a golden ticket in it then sell the box?
How many golden tickets are left that have not been turned in?
Selfishly, I would like you to open your #993 so I can decide if I want to open #1000. Obviously, you would like me to do the same. There are still some golden tickets out there. I think "Free product for life" & "Free PDF for...Zarathos2012-10-23T13:35:41ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Razor CoastZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p2c0?Razor-Coast#192012-10-19T19:26:53Z2012-10-19T19:26:53Z<p>I am curious if FGG plans to incorporate the Necromancer Games product "Dead's Man Chest" into Razor Coast. This allows both a new and update of popular older product.</p>
<p>Hmm, just thinking that would be awesome. Either way, I am in for the Kickstarter.</p>I am curious if FGG plans to incorporate the Necromancer Games product "Dead's Man Chest" into Razor Coast. This allows both a new and update of popular older product.
Hmm, just thinking that would be awesome. Either way, I am in for the Kickstarter.Zarathos2012-10-19T19:26:53ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: [Razor Coast] If I could get Razor Coast, what would YOU say...Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p0ry?Razor-Coast-If-I-could-get-Razor-Coast-what#202012-10-11T18:29:54Z2012-10-11T18:29:54Z<p>@Louis</p>
<p>I really like this product concept; so my gut reaction is no corners will have to be cut; but that is only because of what I know about this particular third-party publisher.</p>
<p>If I had to choose a corner that had to be cut; I would choose D because I like old school B&W.</p>@Louis
I really like this product concept; so my gut reaction is no corners will have to be cut; but that is only because of what I know about this particular third-party publisher.
If I had to choose a corner that had to be cut; I would choose D because I like old school B&W.Zarathos2012-10-11T18:29:54ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: [Razor Coast] If I could get Razor Coast, what would YOU say...Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p0ry?Razor-Coast-If-I-could-get-Razor-Coast-what#112012-10-11T17:23:36Z2012-10-11T17:23:36Z<p>I am somewhat confused about this initial post since I learned the following today and posted in another thread:</p>
<p>This project has been raised from the dead. More news is coming by October 20th. Let me say that has been picked up a great third-party publisher and will be going into Kickstarter in December.</p>
<p>Razor Coast will be a full-color hardcover as a sandbox-style, mini-campaign setting and toolkit that helps GMs create a rich, age of sail flavored adventure path. It will be complete experience for both Pathfinder and unnamed ruleset.</p>
<p>I think all of you will be very pleased with the company that Nick is now working with on this project.</p>
<p>Furthermore, here is quote from my source which I won't reveal at this time in the pending press release. "This is going to be a hardcover, full color extravaganza, complete with Player's Guide and enough swag to sink any pirate ship!"</p>
<p>Is this a red herring to gauge initial interest before the announcement?</p>I am somewhat confused about this initial post since I learned the following today and posted in another thread:
This project has been raised from the dead. More news is coming by October 20th. Let me say that has been picked up a great third-party publisher and will be going into Kickstarter in December.
Razor Coast will be a full-color hardcover as a sandbox-style, mini-campaign setting and toolkit that helps GMs create a rich, age of sail flavored adventure path. It will be complete...Zarathos2012-10-11T17:23:36ZRe: Forums: 3.5/d20/OGL: The Razor Coast; - Status and UpdateZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2il6s?The-Razor-Coast-Status-and-Update#322012-10-11T15:15:02Z2012-10-11T13:03:26Z<p>This project has been raised from the dead. More news is coming by October 20th. Let me say that has been picked up a great third-party publisher and will be going into Kickstarter in December. </p>
<p>Razor Coast will be a full-color hardcover as a sandbox-style, mini-campaign setting and toolkit that helps GMs create a rich, age of sail flavored adventure path. It will be complete experience for both Pathfinder and unnamed ruleset.</p>
<p>I think all of you will be very pleased with the company that Nick is now working with on this project.</p>This project has been raised from the dead. More news is coming by October 20th. Let me say that has been picked up a great third-party publisher and will be going into Kickstarter in December.
Razor Coast will be a full-color hardcover as a sandbox-style, mini-campaign setting and toolkit that helps GMs create a rich, age of sail flavored adventure path. It will be complete experience for both Pathfinder and unnamed ruleset.
I think all of you will be very pleased with the company that...Zarathos2012-10-11T13:03:26ZRe: Forums/Pathfinder First Edition: General Discussion: Fighter's can't Fly, and you can't melee what you can't reach.Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2oqjf&page=8?Fighters-cant-Fly-and-you-cant-melee-what-you#3892012-09-01T22:42:20Z2012-08-28T00:24:33Z<p>This is a entertaining thread because it is so obviously stupid, kinda like watching Monty Python. I believe William Senn's analysis should close the book on this thread.</p>This is a entertaining thread because it is so obviously stupid, kinda like watching Monty Python. I believe William Senn's analysis should close the book on this thread.Zarathos2012-08-28T00:24:33ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Rappan AthukZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2o1ko&page=24?Rappan-Athuk#11782012-08-15T01:27:30Z2012-08-15T01:27:30Z<p>@hellacious huni, if it is a RA subscription, there is no download yet.</p>
<p>@Death Knight Wolfthulhu, Rappan Athuk is not in Golarion unless you put it in there; later, Frog God Games is going to release a campaign setting which includes Rappan Athuk, Tsar, & Bard's Gate i.e the NecroWorld setting.</p>@hellacious huni, if it is a RA subscription, there is no download yet.
@Death Knight Wolfthulhu, Rappan Athuk is not in Golarion unless you put it in there; later, Frog God Games is going to release a campaign setting which includes Rappan Athuk, Tsar, & Bard's Gate i.e the NecroWorld setting.Zarathos2012-08-15T01:27:30ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Rappan AthukZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2o1ko&page=24?Rappan-Athuk#11752012-08-14T21:16:39Z2012-08-14T21:16:39Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Chuck Wright wrote:</div><blockquote><p> Another workaround is to download Adobe Reader for the iPad. :)</p>
<p>They've updated it since the start (and it was abysmal, to say the least) and it's right on par with Good Reader at the moment. </blockquote><p>Well, Chuck, that does indeed work! Thanks, I downloaded awhile back and didn't like it; however, it now seems to have improved.Chuck Wright wrote:Another workaround is to download Adobe Reader for the iPad. :)
They've updated it since the start (and it was abysmal, to say the least) and it's right on par with Good Reader at the moment.
Well, Chuck, that does indeed work! Thanks, I downloaded awhile back and didn't like it; however, it now seems to have improved.Zarathos2012-08-14T21:16:39ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Rappan AthukZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2o1ko&page=24?Rappan-Athuk#11712012-08-14T19:30:09Z2012-08-14T19:30:09Z<p>@Dark Sasha,</p>
<p>I have noticed that there are several illustrations that do not display when using Preview on Mac OS X and the iPad. For example, in the S&W version, art is missing on pages 156, 391, & 404 as well as the pre-gen characters on pages 436-440.</p>
<p>Since I have Adobe Acrobat, I was able to create a workaround to get this art to show up on my iPad. Others with an iPad may need an updated pdf.</p>@Dark Sasha,
I have noticed that there are several illustrations that do not display when using Preview on Mac OS X and the iPad. For example, in the S&W version, art is missing on pages 156, 391, & 404 as well as the pre-gen characters on pages 436-440.
Since I have Adobe Acrobat, I was able to create a workaround to get this art to show up on my iPad. Others with an iPad may need an updated pdf.Zarathos2012-08-14T19:30:09ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Ultimate Monsters?Zarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2ojn3&page=2?Ultimate-Monsters#632012-07-31T01:44:36Z2012-07-29T19:24:42Z<p>My two cents from the peanut gallery:</p>
<p>Both d20 and pre-d20 are GAMES with different rulesets with their own strengths and weaknesses. The only objective difference is the degree of rigidity with the rest coming down to subjective opinion. I will gladly and happily play in either with a creative and excellent GM and open and honest players without a munchkin, entitlement, or god complex. In the grand scheme of RPGs, it all comes down to the quality of the players, not the differences in the ruleset. Arguing about "a ruleset" as "the ruleset" is a pointless exercise that only leads to hurt feelings.</p>My two cents from the peanut gallery:
Both d20 and pre-d20 are GAMES with different rulesets with their own strengths and weaknesses. The only objective difference is the degree of rigidity with the rest coming down to subjective opinion. I will gladly and happily play in either with a creative and excellent GM and open and honest players without a munchkin, entitlement, or god complex. In the grand scheme of RPGs, it all comes down to the quality of the players, not the differences in the...Zarathos2012-07-29T19:24:42ZRe: Forums: Product Discussion: Rappan AthukZarathoshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2o1ko&page=21?Rappan-Athuk#10082012-07-24T18:32:12Z2012-07-24T18:32:12Z<p>@TriOmegaZero, I didn't feel you were being hostile. No need for apology.</p>
<p>@Chuck, I have full confidence that you know your business, you are a vital and essential part of the layout and distribution of the final product. Let me take this opportunity to tell what a fine and excellent job you are doing. </p>
<p>So, I was simply thinking out loud (in print) and bemusing in a whimsical sort of way. I will wait in a relaxed and zen-like state for any additional info on this greatly anticipated product.</p>@TriOmegaZero, I didn't feel you were being hostile. No need for apology.
@Chuck, I have full confidence that you know your business, you are a vital and essential part of the layout and distribution of the final product. Let me take this opportunity to tell what a fine and excellent job you are doing.
So, I was simply thinking out loud (in print) and bemusing in a whimsical sort of way. I will wait in a relaxed and zen-like state for any additional info on this greatly anticipated product.Zarathos2012-07-24T18:32:12Z