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White Dragon

Xexyz's page

Pathfinder Card Game, Class Deck Subscriber. 1,228 posts. No reviews. No lists. No wishlists.


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Derek Dalton wrote:
Have played the Vindicator all the way up just isn't really worth it honestly. The first couple of levels it gives you the nicer abilities of the class. Higher up they are not impressive enough to lose the spellcasting potential as a full cleric. The first level of it is nice enough. You add the number of dice of your channel to your AC until you are hit for one channel. So figure by the time you hit this class your channel die is at least four or five. That's 4 or 5 points to your AC a big step up for one channel a day well worth it. The nice thing about the ability is you don't have to be using the shield to get this boost. You could wear a buckler or just carry a shield on you back and you get this.

Yeah it's not a very good prestige class. In the RotRL campaign I'm playing in my character is a cleric 8/holy vindicator 6. I've felt the HV levels have mostly been worth it, but I built my character from the start to take levels in HV. I do think however taking some levels in it is a better alternative to taking levels in fighter if you can hold off having the weapon and armor proficiencies until 8th-9th level.


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If you can hold off I recommend taking some levels in Holy Vindicator instead of fighter. You get full BAB progression, martial weapon & heavy armor proficiency, channeling progression, 7/10 spellcasting progression, and some class abilities.


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We usually just add all the cards from a class deck if we're playing with a character with that class.


Pathfinder Card Game, Class Deck Subscriber

She's not overpowered in the slightest; in fact she's significantly less powerful than a lot of other characters such as Damiel or Lini. In addition to what MightJim said, consider her roles:

Her Fallen role would be mostly useless because there are no corrupted cards in S&S or RotR. The only power the role would offer is the ally acquisition ability.

Her Redeemed role has three main abilities: A cleric-type healing ability that many characters have as a basic power, the ability to give someone the gift every turn instead of only on your turn, and a ranger scouting ability that - like the healing ability - many characters get as a basic power.

@ferris - why does your friend think she's overpowered?


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When you're instructed to summon an encounter a ship, can you encounter (via luck of the draw) your own ship? And if you can't encounter your own ship, what happens when you seize a ship you're that's possible to encounter multiple times due to scenario or other rules, such as Abrogail's Fury during scenario 6-2?


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Welp, Vika and Olenjack's adventure through Skull and Shackles came to a sad end when Vika succumbed to the Curse of the Flesheaters in scenario 5-3. It was a tragic death caused by unlucky dice rolls, unlucky card draws, and bad decisions.

Just when the duo were starting to get rolling too; after struggling mightily through the first four adventures they had finally gotten enough healing to make their adventuring much less perilous.

I happened to have a CD Kyra who was on 5-2, so Olenjack gets a new partner to hopefully finish out the adventure with.


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Secret Wizard wrote:
Not sure you will.

Well, it's a chance I'm going to take. Honestly, you're all acting like having a poor Will save for the first few levels is a certain death sentence. Maybe Carrion Crown is super lethal, but I don't know of any Will-save based effects that are SoD that players can be reasonably expected to deal with between levels 1-3.


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Chess Pwn wrote:
Which bloodlines are you crossing? and is it really worth such a low will save?

Destined and Arcane. Taking the level 1, 4, 16, and 20 bloodline powers from Destined, levels 4 & 8 from the Arcane bloodline. And like I said above, when I take the level 4 Destined bloodline power I'll be getting a +2 to my will saves that will eventually scale up to +6. So I'll just need to survive the low levels.


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Heretek wrote:
Going Crossblooded without Primalist for Superstition is just putting a giant sign on yourself saying "Please dominate me so I kill my party". Again, it's advised you not do so. Also, unless your DM is outright banning Primalist, there's no reason to not take it.

If the GM is going to put us up against things that can cast dominate at 1st - 3rd level we have bigger problems than my character's low will save.


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@Bret - I'm doing crossblooded and sucking up the low will save because I want bloodline powers from both bloodlines. Raging Vitality is going to be my 1st level feat.


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@My Self - for sure not doing primalist, but Arcane Strike will be my 5th level feat.


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@Java Man - Unfortunately I can't do that straighforwardly because of the way the GM is doing stats. The 18, 16, 10 are set and can't be adjusted with points. So if I wanted to be able to dump Int I'd need to put the static 10 into Dex. On the other hand, I could go with a 10 in Dex and bump Wis up to 14 without dumping Int.

@Secret Wizard - The 4th level Destined bloodline power gives a +1 scaling luck bonus to saves and AC. Since I'll be taking the Fate's Favored trait, that will immediately start me off with a +2 to all my saves, which is nice. I originally didn't want to do steelblood, but if I did I could drop my dex and put those points somewhere else...


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I'll be playing in a Carrion Crown game and decided a long time ago that I wanted to try a bloodrager. I'm going to play a crossblooded Arcane/Destined human bloodrager who uses a nodachi. The GM gave us our stat array and here's how it works:

8 points for 3 stats; other three stats are fixed at 18,16,10. After consideration I'm thinking of the following:

Str 18+2
Dex 14
Con 16
Int 10
Wis 10
Cha 13

I'm a little concerned about my the low Will save I'll have due to being Crossblooded, but I have some extra feat slots in my build so might just address that with Iron Will. I also thought about dumping Int in order to get some extra stats but I just always dislike stat penalties. Thoughts?


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Heh, this finally happened to my Wednesday game last week. 2-player, Olenjack goes first and his very first explore he encounters Goblin Keelhaullin'. The funny thing is that with Goblin Keelhaullin' you stash the cards regardless if you defeat the barrier or not, so victory was guaranteed as soon as he encountered the card.


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Jirikki wrote:
Lini and Damiel could probably play through an infinite number of scenarios without losing or dying.

I just want to expand upon this; There is a pretty significant power difference between characters. Me and a buddy played Feiya and Heggal through S&S and we were having such an easy time of it we decided to play with 8 locations for deck 6 and still beat 2 of the 5 scenarios on the first try.

On the other hand we've now played through AD1 of S&S with Vika and Olenjack and are struggling to the point where I'd swear we were playing a different game entirely.

I actually really enjoy the fact that the characters have varying levels of power because it allows you to adjust the difficulty of the game without resorting to house rules.


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The environmental rules for extreme heat only have effects for 140 degrees or more, but I think that's insufficient; there should be a difference in damage between 140 degrees and say 350 degrees. I'll make up rules myself if necessary but was wondering if anyone knew of any 3rd party stuff that's already done so.


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Devilkiller wrote:
@Xexyz - Ok, I asked partially because since the Wizard was Feebleminded that could make Teleporting away more difficult. Did you cast Heal on the Wizard to cure the Feeblemind? If so I think that shows a pretty good use of healing spells by a Cleric.

Unfortunately I didn't have heal memorized that day because we weren't supposed to be looking for trouble; I had instead memorized 2 wind walk spells so the party could get to Rimeskull from Riddleport.

I was able to teleport myself and the wizard since I get teleport as a domain spell (travel domain).


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In the Black Market player companion there's a feat called Cunning Caster. Here's what it does:

Quote:

Prerequisite(s): Deceitful, ability to cast 1st-level spells.

Benefit(s): When casting a spell, you can attempt a Bluff check (opposed by observers' Perception checks) to conceal your actions from onlookers. If the spell requires material components, you take a –4 penalty on the Bluff check.

If the spell requires somatic components, you take a –4 penalty on the Bluff check. If the spell requires verbal components, you take a –4 penalty on the Bluff check. If the spell requires a focus or divine focus, you take a –4 penalty on the Bluff check. If the spell produces an obvious effect (such as a summoned creature or visible spell effect), you take a –4 penalty on the Bluff check, and even if your check is successful, observers still see the spell effect (though they fail to notice that you are responsible for it). All Bluff check penalties are cumulative.

The fact that this is a feat annoys me. Why does this have to be a feat? Why couldn't have this been a new thing anyone could do with the Bluff skill, instead of locking it behind a feat prerequisite? It especially annoys me because in my game I was already allowing players to do this kind of thing with the Bluff skill (and will continue to do so) but now that this feat exists the implication is that what I was doing before now goes against RAW.

In a greater sense, my question is why Piazo chooses to go down this path of creating new feats that essentially restrict players from performing actions. Of course Paizo needs to create content, but this could have very easily been presented as a new use for Bluff instead of a feat; where before if a player wanted to do something with a skill (or in general) that wasn't covered by the rules the GM would make a decision, but now it's like, "Oh, so you want to do X action now? Do you have the feat for that?"

Has any developer ever addressed this question?


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Mark Hoover wrote:
Per this player there's only a few "correct" feats to take and everything else is a trap. His example was Power Attack for a fighter. If you're a fighter Power Attack is the "right" feat to take and everything else is either sub-par or a trap.

That's his mindset and there's nothing you can do to fix his dissatisfaction short of getting him to change his mindset. The problem isn't the Pathfinder system either, because he's running up against a reality that's nearly universal to all games: The more strongly you want to optimize toward any one goal, the narrower your choices are going to be.

In your friend's case picking fighter may be what's causing his consternation. For fighters there really are a set of feats (anyone ever play a fighter without weapon specialization) which more or less feel "mandatory", which flies in the face of the initial appearance of the class being the most open ended due to the multitude of feats they get.


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Thanks for the advice guys but at this point I'm more just venting/complaining because the fighter's really not going to take any of your suggestions. He's going to do what he wants to do, and I've now decided I'm not going to go out of my way to keep him alive. It's clear to me his weaknesses are 100% the actions he takes, and not his gear or his build.

@Devilkiller - The plan was for me to find the wizard (he fled in fear after he got feebleminded) and for the sorcerer to group up with the pally, fighter, and multi; we were going to teleport away. Once I went off to look for the wizard, the other four decided to try to kill the dragon because the fighter didn't want to leave. Unfortunately they declined to inform my character of the change of plans so as soon as I found the wizard we teleported back to Sandpoint, my character thinking the rest of the group was already gone or right behind me. The rest of the party didn't leave until the fighter got knocked out (he lived only because of hero points).


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Welp, he almost died tonight due to his own actions. We were in a bad position against a dragon and while we decided to retreat after the wizard got Feebleminded and the paladin got her good bow sundered, he decided he was going to try to go toe-to-toe with the dragon as soon as he could get into melee range. One round of claw-claw-wing-wing-bite-tail and that was that. (Well, he should've died, but used Hero Points to save his life and the GM was being kind as well.) For good measure, he almost got most of the rest of the party killed as well.

Oh, he also decided to spend his money to improve his weapons instead of any defensive items.

Ugh, this party is so disfunctional. My character is seriously considering leaving them.


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I've purchased three of them - one for each set - and am disappointed. The corners of two of the three don't stay connected, so I'm going to have to glue them together or deal with an unusable row.


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The biggest fix I was hoping would come from a 2nd printing was the change to all of the banes that had their BYA powers as before you encounter to the updated paradigm of BYA. Would make evasion a lot less painful.


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As it stands, there's been so many erratas and misprint corrections for RotRl that I feel like I can't play it without having to reference my computer every other minute. Has there ever been any thought about a revised edition that fixes all the cards?


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Mike Selinker wrote:
We decided to patch this ridiculous thing after all.

WHY DO YOU HATE FUN?!?! *cries*

Seriously though, I'm glad you decided to change the scenario and not Kyra's power.


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1. Seelah encounters Khorramzadeh, and Kyra is also at her location. They both fail Khorramzadeh's BYA check and are forced to move. What happens?

2. Feiya and Ranzak are at Sharkskin Reef at the start of Ranzak's turn. When Ranzak encounters his shark, Feiya plays dimension leap in order to move to a different location. What happens to Feiya's shark?


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DM_Blake wrote:

At 13th level, I hope it's more than a +1 Cloak of Resistance - which would, of course, take longer.

Still a great idea.

Or just spend a couple weeks in town with downtime. Maybe the fighter can retrain a feat or two and buy a bit of defensive gear while he waits for an NPC to craft his cloak.

Nope, he has a +1 cloak. Thus far in the game saves haven't really been much of an issue, so I'm not really worried about it. We finally do seem to have some downtime, but the fighter's got all his feats planned out and I really doubt he'd be willing to change them.


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DM_Blake wrote:

There's good advice in this thread, that's already been said, so I'll just answer the thread's title:

Play a fighter. Nobody ever asks them to be the healbot.

After RotRL the GM's going to run Carrion Crown. I've already informed everyone I'll be playing a bloodrager.


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So, I've had a discussion with the other players. The fighter is seriously considering a cloak of lesser displacement, which would be very nice. He'll have to give up his cloak of resistance +1, but we're thinking that could be a worthwhile trade-off.

We also had a discussion on strategy, but the conjurer's player wasn't at the game tonight so we'll have to talk to him later.

Right now my current dilemma is figuring out what I want to spend my money on. I have 30,500 gold to spend, and here are my current magic items:

+1 full plate of light fortification
+2 heavy shield
Belt of Giant Strength +4
Headband of Inspired Wisdom +4
Sihedron Medallion
Jingasa of the Fortunate Soldier
Pearl of Power (2nd level spell)

Since Barkskin (domain spell) lasts 10 mins/level, I pretty much always have it up for fights. I always have Greater Magic Weapon on my adamantine waraxe, which is why I haven't spent money on a magic weapon. I'm able to also have shield of faith and magic vestments up, which is why I haven't bothered with a ring of protecting or upping my armor. My current considerations are as follows:

1. Lvl 5 pearl of power - would let me recall a 5th level spell, such as teleport or breath of life.

2. Increase my shield up to +5 - would make my AC even higher, but I think it's high enough as is. Most stuff we fight already needs a 20 to hit me if I have my buffs up.

3. Buy my weapon up to +3 - would eliminate the need for me to cast GMW, and would also bypass a lot of DR.

4. Cloak of Lesser Displacement - 20% miss chance to go along with my high AC.


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I've taken 4 characters through RotR, 2 through S&S, 1 through WotR, with several other characters of various progression through them. Don't know where that puts me on the continuum of enthusiastic vs. casual player, but I'm kind of feeling a little relieved for the release push back. I've got a backlog of characters I want to play; in addition to the ones that I've started but not completed playing through, there are characters I want to start (I have't decided if my next character will be Arueshalae or Athnul). I'm excited for the upcoming class decks as I'm sure there are going to be characters I want to play from those decks as well.


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dragonhunterq wrote:

Do you leave spell slots open? It can help with that problem. Not always, as sometimes you need that spell right now, but it can help.

Also stock up on scrolls, potions and maybe a staff or wand if you anticipate using a particular spell a lot. As any kind of spell caster consumables are your very best friend.

I tried leaving slots open, but that never seemed to work. The scroll bit is a good idea; I'll have to think about some useful scrolls to get.

Avh wrote:

If he took the Two weapon warrior archetype, his AC gets a buff each round he makes a full attack. Adding magic armor, a high dex, an amulet of natural armor and either ring of protection or your shield of faith, he should have pretty high AC.

I'm guessing he should have between 30 and 35 AC, without a shield (a two weapon warrior with a shield as its second weapon will be around 35 to 40 AC, without optimization).

I'll have to see what AC gear he has, but I know that yesterday his AC was 28 with haste and his Defensive Flurry bonus. I think his dexterity is either 17 or 18 and I know he's wearing magical mithril breastplate with the light fortitude ability. He's also got a Jingasa of the Fortunate Soldier.

Nicos wrote:
Eh, as much as that would help with the HPs, for fighters cloak of resistance are mandatory.

Lol, that's a whole 'nother issue all together.


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nicholas storm wrote:

Unless the fighter's DPR is really high - like high enough to one round a glazebru (186HP), then he may be better off using a shield. A fighter that level can easily get to the mid 30s AC with a shield and up to 40AC if he was specced for defense.

An AC40 fighter with a moderate DPR can kill probably 20 glazebru while a AC25 fighter with a high DPR can probably kill 1 glazebru.

Heh, he's a two-weapon warrior, so him using a shield is a non-starter.

As far as the rest of us:

cleric of abadar 8 / holy vindicator 5 dwarf (me)
two-weapon warrior fighter 13 human
red dragon bloodline sorcerer 13 gnome
divine hunter paladin 13 halfling
conjurer wizard 13 half-orc
cleric of cayden calien 3 / ranger 2 / shadowdancer 2 / sky seeker 6 dwarf


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Overall I think there's just a bunch of sub-optimal play within the party. It's weird because when this group played Kingmaker we were a well-oiled machine - so we have the knowledge to play well - just for some reason we make mistakes we didn't make when we played Kingmaker:

- The fighter tends to get himself into dangerous situations and expects to always be bailed out.

- The sorcerer's spell list could be better; he's dragon bloodline and has too many blasting spells, IMO.

- The wizard doesn't communicate well with the other party members. It'd be easier for the rest of us to maximize the effectiveness of our actions if we knew what he was going to do during any round of combat.

- The paladin is a new player, and is still getting the hang of playing a martial character. I think the biggest thing holding her back is that she's too cautious with her smites.

- I always seem to have the wrong spells memorized. 75% of my memorized spells stay the same from day to day, but it's the other 25% that trip me up. The previous session I memorized 2 Breath of Life when I really needed True Seeing, while this session I didn't need True Seeing and could've used the extra Breath of Life.

- The cleric/ranger/shadowdancer/skyseeker is the only PC that almost always makes the right decision in combat.


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@Nigriscence - I'm going to talk to him about it, but I think as a party we're behind on WBL and are limited in what we can afford. I don't know about everyone else, but my total wealth adds up to about 80,000 gold. One thing that made things difficult tonight is that we were fighting a pair of heavy hitters (glabrezus) and he decided to take up a position right between them in order to minimize his need to move. So they tag-teamed him and knocked him unconscious in two rounds.

@nicholas storm - Yep, my AC is pretty healthy; most of the things we fight need a 20 to hit me if I've had a chance to buff up. I take the point as much as possible.


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Azten wrote:
Do you have anyone that could scout things out? Fight smarter and harder with a plan!

Yes, scouting seems to be the weakness of this party; we're constantly fighting battles that are CR +2/+3 for our APL due to our lack of planning. So that's another thing I'll try to figure out how to address. You'd think with a wizard and sorcerer in the party we'd have good ways of scouting, but it just doesn't seem to work out for us (I suspect that if I took some time to analyze their spellcasting I'd find they both tend to favor sexy spells over useful spells.)


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Davor wrote:
Tell that fighter to stop scrubbing up, get in the game, and get off his butt. If they're still having issues, consider getting Aid Another bonuses, and the Bodyguard feat. Invest in means that prevent damage, rather than heal it. There are lots of means of preventing damage, as long as you know what's coming in a fight. Plan accordingly.

I'll try to convince the fighter to save up his money and buy a cloak of lesser displacement. What other things are our there?


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My group just started book 5 of RotRL, and combats are becoming tough to the point where my character, a cleric 8 / holy vindicator 5, is having to spend more and more turns healing [the fighter in particular] just to keep him alive. The damage is just going to go up from here, and there's just no way I'll be able to keep up with it. So I have to conceive of a way for the fighter to take less damage. Ideas?


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Joshua Birk 898 wrote:

Am I missing something? Can't you just use Kyra to on the acrobatics check? The army has both the demon and undead trait, so she can roll her divine check and steam roll the 23.

Alain - Combat
Crowe - Combat
Balazar - Arcane
Shardra - Knowledge
Andowyn - Divine
Kyra - Acrobatcis

Yes, I just double-checked and Kyra's power says "for your check to defeat" not "combat check to defeat".


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Jeraa wrote:

They were priced in 3.5 D&D, which had body slot affinities. Any magical effect that didn't match the appropriate slot had a 1.5x multipler price increase. Helms were not an appropriate item slot for movement-related abilities.

When Paizo copied the 3.5 SRD to make Pathfinder and removed the body slot affinity rules, they didn't go back and make sure the magic items followed their new rules.

I see now, thanks. I wonder if there are any other items like that.


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Why such a difference in price?

Helm of Teleportation costs 73,500
Boots of Teleportation cost 49,000

As far as I can tell, they both work exactly the same. They both are CL 9, and they both allow the user to teleport 3 times per day. Am I missing something, because I can't see why they're priced differently.

Helm of Teleportation wrote:
A character wearing this helm may teleport three times per day, instantly transporting himself and objects he might be carrying on his person to a designated destination, exactly as if he had cast the spell of the same name.
Boots of Teleportation wrote:

When scrutinized closely, parts of these light gray boots appear to fade in and out of existence.

Any character wearing this footwear may teleport three times per day, exactly as if she had cast the teleport spell.


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So I have a dragon, and I need to fill its horde. I've determined it has 76,000 gold worth of magic items, but I'm at a loss of what magic items a dragon would find useful. I'd rather not give it any stat boosters or AC items, so what left is there?


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jones314 wrote:

The thing about larger groups that the designers might not have thought of is that you're more likely to get a wide range of player abilities and familiarity with the game. From my experience, and from reading others' accounts, this game has a lot of those fifth and sixth players being somewhat casual pick-up players. So they pick a character that appeals to them and because we don't want to tell them what to do too much, they sometimes make sub-optimal plays. It's exciting when we mange to eke out a win anyways but its happened a lot where we fail and then the next time we play it, with just the usual players, we hammer through for the win.

So yeah, maybe if you are playing with experienced players the large groups have a better win ratio but not in more typical play conditions. The fact that a whole lot of people can get drawn into a PACG game is an indication of how great the game is and designing scenarios and cards that kinda over-punish large groups is a bummer, imo.

I was going to say this but jones here beat me to it. My regularly scheduled game is 2-3 players, and this group consists of the people most interested in the game. Since we're the most interested and we play the most often, we're the most experienced. When our 5-6 player group gets together, the 5th & 6th persons are a couple of friends who have casual interest in the game and aren't as experienced. For our group at least, that skews the success rate of our 2-3 player games vs. our 5-6 player games.


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So I just got Deck 6 in the mail today and I have a few questions:

The scenario setup for Onslaught on Drezen is as follows:

Quote:

Villain: none

Henchmen: Abyssal Armies
During this scenario: At the start of the secnario, gain a medal on the troop Champions of Mendev.

When you close any location, shuffle its remaining banes into the location Sanctum, summoning it and building it, if necessary. When you would build the location Sanctum, shuffle the villain Aponavicius into that location deck.

I'm guessing you win the scenario by defeating and cornering Aponavicius, correct? Also, if you close a location and there are no banes in it, do you still build the location, Sanctum?


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Nothing huh? Darn, I was hoping the system was built up by someone.


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chuffster wrote:

Bonus gripe: doesn't it seem odd that it takes a feat slot to swing your weapon really hard? Like, feats are supposed to be these amazing abilities that level the gap between fighters and casters... but it turns out that the best feat is the one where you attack harder. And people who don't have this special training are completely unable to comprehend the concept of sacrificing accuracy for power.

Just picture the training montage where the wise old master drills the youngster in how to do a Power Attack. Pretty short, right?

I agree. They could've mostly avoided this by creating a base combat rule that allowed you to sacrifice accuracy for damage, but just not at the ratio of Power Attack; such as 1 for 1 instead of 1 for 2.


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I'm designing some homebrew races for my campaign but find that the options presented in the ARG aren't as expansive as I'd like. Does anyone know if there are any sources for additional race traits? Of course I can make up my own, but if there are other sources out there I'd like to check those out first. I'm willing to consider 3rd party sources.

(In case there's any confusion, when I say "race traits" I'm referring to all of the components listed in the back of the ARG for constructing custom races.)


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Claxon wrote:
you are looking into how to optimize your character further, you can actually do some math (with estimated values for a potential enemy).

Yeah, this is what I'm looking for; if someone's already performed this math so I don't have to duplicate efforts. =)


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I've read several claims that At high levels PA becomes sub-optimal because the penalty to hit outweighs the additional damage. Since both the penalty and bonus damage scale at the exact same linear rate, that implies it's really the 3rd & 4th iterative that's primarily affected and dragging the overall damage down. What's the math for this? What I'm looking for is a general cutoff in terms of hit percentage on the last two iterative attacks which delineate when to use PA and when not to.


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Charon's Little Helper wrote:
They may feel that anecdotally. The math disagrees.

I'm not entirely surprised. What assumptions does the math make?


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Lord Gadigan wrote:

8. Occult Rituals-

I think there's room for interesting expansion here. I like the idea behind special ritual spells with potent/unique effects. There's some mechanical weirdness happening with the success-odds, but I'd still like to see more rituals

This. I've been wishing for a system for ritual spellcasting for as long as 3.x has been around.

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