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Verzen wrote:
Paizo released a book on PLANAR ADVENTURES and didn't include anything for kineticists who are deeply tied to the elemental planes? o.O

James Jacobs developed it, I'm not sure he's even read the entire Kineticist class yet based on past answers in his thread.

There are Kineticist planar options in the Player Companion Planes of Power.

Fallen_Mage wrote:
Wultram wrote:
Verbal component on Ki powers? Yeah no bad idea, sure if it is some sonic effect or something go ahead.

I have to agree with this.

While I can see a Verbal Component making sense with some powers, Somantic Components make much more sense in my mind as you are making specific moves or striking specific points on your opponent for the desired effect. Does that make sense?

A somatic component would have two downsides: requiring a free hand and (per a Mark comment I'm pretty sure I remember) triggering an attack of opportunity from opponents that have that reaction. Somatic, but not verbal, components count as an object manipulation for AoO trigger purposes.

Weather Report wrote:
Rysky wrote:
Can we not compare slavery and sex work like it's the same thing? Forced prostitution absolutely, since that is a type of slavery, but not all sex workers are being forced into their profession.
Yes, I know some very content, focused, happy, successful ones.

"I'm not just the president of Hair Club for Men, I'm also a client."

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Diego Rossi wrote:
AnimatedPaper wrote:
edduardco wrote:
AnimatedPaper wrote:
edduardco wrote:

Considering that it will require a caster at least level 17 and spells per day is capped at 3, I don't see any issue in that.
5, and that's just counting the options we know about, and not including preparing 9th level spells in 10th level slots.
From where do you get 5? Only Wizards has 4. And for what I have seen in other threads there will not be 10 level slots, the so called 10th level spells are just feats usable one per day.

Wizards get 5, including their arcane focus. Cleric's effectively get even more, although that more is just a bunch of heals.

I have not seen the same regarding spell slots. I've seen that the spells were feat locked, but haven't seen the same regarding the slots themselves. I recall the opposite in fact, but I may simply be misremembering or misconstrued that post. And to be honest I wouldn't even know where to start looking for it.

Edit: fixed the quote

Wizard get 3, +1 in the field of specialization (if any), + you can repeat one of the used spells if you drain your arcane focus.

So 3 + maybe 1 from a more limited list + 1 from a 4 spell ist. Not 5 spells without limitations.

They can also take a feat to get an additional use of their arcane focus, so that's 6 available to a specialist.

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edduardco wrote:
Paul Watson wrote:
edduardco wrote:
Cuttlefist wrote:
Not a big fan of “quickened” giving you different types of actions depending on the source. Really unintuitive and messy, and basically means that haste and that monk ability don’t actually give you the same condition, but it has the same name anyway. Would quickened just giving you an additional action you can use for whatever really be that overpowered?
Probably not, definitely something to mention during playtest
I dunno. Casting 2 9th level spells in one turn seems pretty potent to me.
Considering that it will require a caster at least level 17 and spells per day is capped at 3, I don't see any issue in that.

It's a 20th level Wizard class feat to cast two spells at once, and even then they put a "same target" limitation on it. They are not going to let you have this capability through Haste.

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Cyrad wrote:
But wasn't the sickened condition also used for pain-related effects? How would that stop you from drinking?

Intermittent screaming.

Kaemy wrote:

Biztak is worth mentioning knowing that losing 4 AC, while it always increases the chances of being hit, sometimes it won't affect Crit at all depending on your AC and the enemy Hit Chance. If they need to roll a 14 to Hit you (something normal), lowering it to 10 still means they only crit you on a Natural 20.

Not a fan of the Monk's pseudo-Quickness. Either give it Quick 1 (Strike included), or make it non-related to Quick. The way it's right now looks like it doesn't really stack, so that Lv20 Monk is less affected by the Haste Spell than anyone else (only winning the ability to use the extra action it already had to Strike, but was probably going to use at least one to move anyway, or we are probably talking about a -15 Attack unless he uses 2x 2-Action Attacks).

Attack penalties bottom out at -10. If you use a Quick action to strike, your attacks are at 0/-5/-10/-10 for a full four attacks.

Monks probably have some flurry thing that already gives them extra attacks, or lots of damage (relative to unarmed) at the cost of 2-3 actions.

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Cuttlefist wrote:
Not a big fan of “quickened” giving you different types of actions depending on the source. Really unintuitive and messy, and basically means that haste and that monk ability don’t actually give you the same condition, but it has the same name anyway. Would quickened just giving you an additional action you can use for whatever really be that overpowered?

Hugely so for spells, and bigly for the "two actions gets you three actions worth of effects" class feats.

It's unclear how often these "quick, but with special options" abilities are going to exist, actual variation and confusion may be minimal. Having to remember that a 20th level monk can make some new fringe uses of an extra action doesn't seem like much of a burden. If you demand a uniform solution, the one you're likely to get is removal of those extra, fun options.

JoelF847 wrote:


First off, you're too sick to drink anything—including potions!
I'm down for that affect for sickened, but not sure that makes sense when applied to a potion of remove sickness/nausea. Peptol Bismol works great when I'm sick/nauseous in real life.

Many of the traditional "get better" potions have gone away. None of them are "spells in a can" anymore, they have unique effects not tied to spells.

dragonhunterq wrote:
willuwontu wrote:

Since movespeed increases don't stack anymore, do movespeed slows still stack?

Edit: doesn't seem likely.

How about different conditions that apply opposite effects, do they automatically negate each other? Or do they merely supress each other for the duration of the shortest one.

blog wrote:
These aren't cumulative, so if your barbarian gets slowed 2 by one creature and slowed 1 by another, she loses only 2 actions.

I would imagine that if you have a positive condition and a negative condition both apply.

So Slow 1 and Quick 2 equals Quick 1.

It seems the most likely conclusion from what I've seen.

The concept is sound, but the example is flawed. It's pretty clear as described in the blog that while Slow has levels, you're either Quick or you're not, there's no levels of being Quick.

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master_marshmallow wrote:
graystone wrote:
nogoodscallywag wrote:
BPorter uses the vacuum of space as an example for Survival Assurance...will it mean players can ignore basic physics? That's the part that bothers me.
We KNOW that physics work differently in pathfinder or giants couldn't survive under thier own weight and dragons wouldn't be able to fly. So how do you prove it's against pathfinder physics?

Unless giants have extra sets of lungs that enable them to respire more oxygen, after all elephants are pretty big.

Dragons could have a chemical reaction in their bodies that fill bladders within them with ultra light gas that enables them to fly. It could even help fuel their breath weapons hence their extraordinary description.

Physics maintained.

Giants can’t stand without magic bones.

Shinigami02 wrote:
KingOfAnything wrote:
Xenocrat wrote:
The really important question not answered is whether entering rage requires an action.
It was a free action in PF1, what makes you think that would change?
Changing from a 1-handed to 2-handed grip was a Free Action in PF1e too, and that's an Action now. The inverse may or may not be too. There's no way to know what has or has not changed use time until they tell us or we see the document.

Using a shield now costs an action, too. Unless the bonuses aren't that high, there's precedent to fear that rage might now cost an action to initiate.

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The really important question not answered is whether entering rage requires an action.

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Egen_Blackwater wrote:
This all sounds wonderful (particularly fatigue being something barbarians actually have to deal with), but I'm surprised that somatic components are available and not verbal. I can imagine a barbarian shouting their spells at someone in a rage (FUS-ROH-DAH!), But making intricate Dr. Strange style hand motions seems a strange fit.

It takes more mental effort to curse someone than to flip them the bird. Magic works the same.

Benchak the Nightstalker wrote:
BryonD wrote:
Fuzzy-Wuzzy wrote:
BryonD wrote:
On the other hand, if you are not even "trained" in athletics, the you shouldn't be even try to climb a rope free handed. I don't care that you are a 16th level wizard. Cast a spell. If you learned by example then become trained, spend resources on it. If you don't spend the resources, then you are not trained. Therefore you can't climb ropes, wobbly ladders, sure, ropes, no.
I'm not sure rope-climbing is the best example (don't Physical Education classes often require the schoolkid population at large to do just that?)
No. Not at all.


I don’t think it’s common anymore, but that was absolutely a thing, at least in the US.

It depends on what you mean by "require." They might have had a rope and told kids to climb it one day (I vaguely recall that from childhood) but that doesn't mean that most could or there were any consequences for failure or not really trying very hard.

Jurassic Pratt wrote:
BPorter wrote:
Jurassic Pratt wrote:
BPorter wrote:

I never said he did. I said he was the exception, not the rule.
Good thing the PC's are exceptions to the normal populace of lvl 1-5 commoners right?
Good thing they can eliminate the speed bump that was the Test of the Starstone, right?

Once again, you can do extraordinary things that don't make sense in our reality without needing the test of the starstone.

Also, if you have an issue with these legendary skill unlocks, you must've really hated rage powers in PF1. You know, the things that let you resist energy damage or even swallow people whole without using magic.

Weren’t some Su abilities? They used magic.

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Maybe the real magic was the skill feats we learned along the way.

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Legendary feats are powered by the same magic that lets giants stand and dragons fly. It’s unnamed and functions in a AMF.

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thorin001 wrote:

The skills rules are currently trying to do two contradictory things:

1) Keep the numbers within a small range so that everyone has a chance of success.
2) Automatic failure for not having the requisite level of training.

That's not true. They want everyone to have a chance of success for the sorts of tasks that a normal person can reasonably attempt without training (e.g. sneaking or trying to stop blood loss by putting pressure on a wound). They want automatic failure for not having the requisite level of training for the sorts of tasks that a person can't reasonably attempt without training (picking a lock, sewing up a wound, knowing magical theory, etc.).

It's a goal for a "a few years" from now.

Rysky wrote:
UnArcaneElection wrote:

Since a partial equivalent of Mythic (flawed implementation in 1st Edition) is supposed to be baked into the 2nd Edition core system, they could take a second shot at Wrath of the Righteous (great idea but flawed implementation) once they have a couple of original 2nd Edition APs under their belt.

[Emphasis mine]

I have not heard this. Do you have a link for a source?

Looking over what all the Legendary Rank stuff does it's pretty much Mythic/Epic.

It's Mythic/Epic in the sense that "normal characters never could do this before without either spells or mythic abilities" but not in the "LOL check out the damage on this optimized Mythic Greater Vital Strike build who can one shot a CR30."

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Marco Massoudi wrote:

A player characters ecplicit ability always overrides any monster abilities and you shouldn't take that away, that's written down somewhere (maybe in the Game Mastery Guide?).

I would definetly rule it so.
Even with a level 20 spawn slayer (and acompanying party), the Tarasque is a level 25 threat & can wipe out the pc's.

It can't fly or burrow. It can't see invisible fliers. And it has a +12 Will save against possession (followed by coupe de grace) or being plane shifted to the Elemental Plane of Water (where it can't breath) or any demiplane where it can't escape.

Pretty much all the super scary monsters that aren't demigods are vulnerable to these tactics. Most of the demigods don't have Plane Shift or similar escape abilities, but some do. Against a true neutral Greater Possession optimizer they all struggle in vain.

SheepishEidolon wrote:

I'd argue that the spawn slayer was designed with the intention to take down Spawns of Rovagug, that includes the tarrasque. And the archetype comes from a much younger book, so I'd count the ability to be more specific (while they are equally specific otherwise, IMO).

That said, the slayer will still have a hard time to pull it off. They must hit, the tarrasque must fail the save and then the group has only 2d6 rounds to both not be defeated and take that thing down.

The tarrasque has a relatively weak Will save of +12 - still, against a DC of 20 + Int mod it has some chance to succeed.

Curse it first.

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Elfteiroh wrote:
kaineblade83 wrote:
I haven't thumbed through the entire post yet, though this is skill related... Do we know what Assurance in a skill does, yet? I've seen it mentioned, and I believe Mark mentioned it in a post about the Medicine skill.

Yep, and the effect change based on your proficiency rank.

Trained use give you the option to use a free "10" as your result when rolling the associated skill.
Expert, Master and legendary proficiency bump that free result to an appropriate level, that make DCs you should easily win at you level of proficiency auto succeed.
Expert could be auto "15", master "20" and legendary "30".

PLEASE note that we don't know the exact numbers (or I don't remember them) beside the trained base one, it's just as an exemple.

A key point is that these are allegedly your final result and are not reduced for any penalties, such as ACP or situational modifiers.

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bbangerter wrote:
Fuzzy-Wuzzy wrote:

Yes, you can, because there are always manifestations visible side effects (barring the use of feats saying otherwise).

Corrected that for you. Whether manifestations are visible, audible, smell-able, or some other sense-able is entirely up to a particular group and what works best for their table.

No, because the Spellcraft skill itself requires sight as the method to identify a spell. So whatever the manifestations is, it must be visible.

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It'll be interesting to see if any metamagic or caster enhancing ability remains as a general feat rather than class feat. Similar for things like power attack that fit with several class concepts. Where is the line between a general feat and a class feat that is available to several classes?

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Just as you need "trained" to even attempt some things, for at least some skills you'll need "legendary" for the same, beyond the feat options it opens up. The one we know for sure is that you can't craft legendary items (such as weapons with a +3 item bonus, and which quality is a prereq for some enchantements) without being legendary in crafting. There might also be legendary locks to pick or legendary distances to try to jump.

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GentleGiant wrote:

There was also this little critter revealed (sorry if the formatting doesn't quite contain all intricacies of the statblock, such as italized text):

GRIM REAPER - Creature 21
Evil, Medium, Undead
Perception +38, darkvision, see invisibility, status sight, true seeing
Languages Common, Necril
Skills +26, Acrobatics +38, Athletics +36, Deception +38, Intimidation +38, Religion +36, Society +36, Stealth +40
Str +8, Dex +10, Con +8, Int +5, Wis +6, Cha +8
Items Legendary scythe
Aura of Misfortune (aura, divination, divine, misfortune) 20 feet. Living creatures in the aura must roll twice and take the lower result on all d20 rolls.
Death's Grace A grim reaper can choose not to cout as undead of effects that affect undead differently. Even if it does, it still never counts as a living creature.
Status Sight A grim reaper automatically knows the Hit Points and emotions of all creatures it can see, as well as all conditions and afflictions affecting those creatures.

AC 45, TAC 44; Fort +34, Ref +35, Will +36, +1 conditional to all vs. magic
HP 350, Immunities Asleep, death effects, disease, paralysis, poison; Resistances all damage 10
[[R]] Lurking Death (attack, teleportation)
Trigger A creature within 100 feet uses a concentrate, manipulate, or move action or makes a ranged attack.
Effect The grim reaper teleports to a square adjacent to the triggering creature and makes a melee Strike against it with a -2 penalty. If the Strike hits, the grim reaper disrupts the triggering action.

Speed 50 feet, fly 75 feet
[[A]] Melee +5 keen scythe, +37 (agile, deadly 3d10, magical, reach 10 feet, trip) Damage 6d10+8 slashing plus death strike and energy drain
Innate Divine Spells DC 42, attack +37; Constant haste, true seeing (6th); 10th finger of death (x4); 7th plane shift

This seems to confirm, incidentally, that spell resistance doesn't exist anymore in PF2. If it existed, this creature would have it. And eliminating it works given PF2s switch to levels of success rather than a binary fail/succeed outcome, as well as eliminating boring "must have" feats like Spell Penetration.

Nathanael Love wrote:
Starbuck_II wrote:
Arachnofiend wrote:
I guarantee you that nobody other than dedicated caster fans think that a spell that grants completely unavoidable damage should be an infinitely spammable cantrip.

It is only 1d4+1

The cantrip version can have a hard only once per turn limit.
Considering a wand makes this effectively doable for a few gold per shot now it doesn't seem terribly problematic.

It scales by level.

And it competes with other cantrips that do that much more damage, but can miss, can be resisted, can (maybe) save for half damage.

And most problematically, it scales by number of casters. One of the big problems with Magic Missile is you have to explain why 20 (or fewer) low level Wizards can't burn down a dragon that attacks their town while they hide and shoot through windows. In PF1 the reason was limited slots and spell resistance. It's not clear if spell resistance still exists in PF2.

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Gregg Reece wrote:
Jester David wrote:
Not sure of the difference between Arcana and Occultism. Is it a Arcana/ Planes distinction? Arcana vs Mysticism?

Oh, it's an easy difference:

Arcana -> Spells, constructs, dragons, magical beasts

Occultism -> Rituals, planes, aberrations, ia ia cthulhu fhtagn

My guess is spells will be associated with their related spell list, so Arcana lets you recognize a Wizard's spells, but to identify a Druid's spell you need Nature.

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Has anyone complained yet that an Expert in Athletics (presumably) can't flap his arms in order to gain a 90' fly speed?

Lots of people mad that PF2 is going to give them limitless abilities to do things that are flat out real world impossible (and not previously possibly in PF1) as an outgrowth of investing an abundant character resource just because they aren't as good as magic that inherently breaks the laws of nature, is a limited resource, and requires foregoing all the other classes' abilities that also can't be replaced by skills.

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edduardco wrote:
Meirril wrote:
At a certain, fundamental level from a game designers point of view, spells that grow more powerful with the leveling of the caster (to the point that they are equal with higher level spells) is wrong. That is just bad design. A 5th level spell should be far more powerful than a 3rd level spell, but a 9th level wizard casting fireball does as much damage as a cone of cold, and if that fireball was made into a 5th level slot it could be more powerful than a 5th level spell! This is bad! This is horrible design! This...has finally been addressed.

Then what is the point of Heightening?

A level 9 wizard in PF1 (and maybe PF2) only gets two free 5th level spells. Heightening gives you the option to rely on Fireball in a 5th level slot as your blasting option and pickup Dominate Person and Teleport as your new spells known, rather than have to blow 50% of your new spells known on a tiny damage upgrade through Cone of Cold.

Once wealth and scroll availability catch up, it's less of an issue, certainly.

John John wrote:
QuidEst wrote:

- Animal companions have the minion trait. (No, it's not like 4e minions. Or Despicable Me minions, thank goodness.) That means that they get two actions on your turn if you spend a Command an Animal action. This replaces the normal effects of that action.

So if they are allowed to do whatever they naturally want they get the normal 3 actions?

That seems pretty unlikely. This matches up with the action economy nerfs to companions we say with Starfinder's mechanic drones.

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PossibleCabbage wrote:

So one of the concerns I have about "you need to be level x in order to craft an item of level x" is that if the PCs are able to find or buy level appropriate gear throughout their careers (in case nobody wants to be a crafter) you have to assume there are high level NPCs wandering around making all these magic swords and the like.

I don't know if "a level 15 swordsmith" is a thing that should be common enough to be easily accessible by PCs.

In a world with 9th level Clerics for Plane Shift and 9th level Wizards for teleport, any reasonably sized city can get any level of nonartifact (and evil/restricted) magic item on order. Clerics of Abadar surely don't mind making money by going to Axis to fill orders, and Wizards can distribute to satellite cities.

Or you pay spell service costs to go there yourself.

Axis has effectively infinite high level NPCs.

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Missed opportunity to tell us at least a little bit about rituals.

Bellona wrote:
motteditor wrote:

* TB's phylactery is not on the Isle of Terror.

I looked at that sentence and my immediate reaction was "So, the phylactery is the Isle of Terror?"

Which would be kind of neat.

Hanson from Zoolander voice: "The soul is in the island!"

Excaliburproxy wrote:

A fun side effect for gish characters: you get to make an attack at high bonus and demand a save from an enemy on the same turn. That is pretty neat and kind of pays people back for having to deal with their multiple ability dependence.

It seems a wash (or at best a +1 difference) to me. Casters will have high attacks with spell rolls because those go off casting proficiency, and maintaining a decent attack stat (presumably Dex for ranged) isn't that hard. Any deficiency on attack stat is presumably made up for a superior save DC from casting stat.

Excaliburproxy wrote:
master_marshmallow wrote:

I'm not surprised at all in how Double Slice works, mathematically it dwarfs Power Attack, with its trade-off being what happens to your third action.

I do not like action taxes on martial characters to initiate a combat style, this means the new feat abilities you have may not work either if they are all going to require an expenditure of actions.

With the clunky design they seem to be forcing, action economy will be worse in this edition of the game than in the previous. The difference? A paradigm shift in which combat methods are superior. Used to be Power Attack, now its Double Slice (since I'm pretty sure you can use weapons to grant yourself a shield bonus as well).

The maths are not aligned:** spoiler omitted **

Honestly, I'm a fan of everything in this edition but the classes and combat system. Everything out of combat aligns with my house...

Well, since magic items now multiply damage dice, power attack will tend to be the better option when you are wielding two handed weapons like greatswords and great axes. On a +5 weapon, the difference in expected value between a 1d8 weapon and a 1d12 weapon is 12 whole damage points and that is on top of the fact that you can still make a second iterative attack at a -5 rather than a -10 (in those admittedly somewhat uncommon situations where a "third" iterative attack is available).

Plus Power Attack has some (unknown) level of scaling as you level.

They only update pdfs when they update and order a new version of the hardcover book. That requires (1) the old version to have sold out, and (2) the new layout to be ready and finalized.

I have no idea how (1) is fairing given their original buy ran out and then the rushed in at least one subsequent order when they realized demand was higher than they initially dared to hope, but (2) depends on figuring out layout for the changes (nothing can slide to another page and ruin old page citations) and reaching a critical mass of FAQs. They've been surprisingly slow on the FAQs, so much that I'd still consider an updated 2nd edition a bad purchase, as they really kind of owe us more corrections and clarifications than they've provided so far.

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They do/will, per Mark.

gustavo iglesias wrote:
can someone point a link to the spontaneous casting stuff?

It was a Mark Seifter comment, probably in the "all about spells" blog comments.

Cat-thulhu wrote:

Yeah. I had actualy forgotten that, If i had one critique then it would be the need to prep ahead of time to upcast. I would have little issue with upcasting on the go, and may test the idea in the playtest to see id if OP, i suspect not.

Is it the case then thata spontaneous caster will need to learn spells at higher levels or can they upcast on the fly?

Not only can spontaneous casters not upcast their regular spells known, they apparently can't undercast, either. Instead they get a limited number of special spells known (legacy spells?) that they know at all possible levels.

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Burn is pretty widely reviled. It's also widely accepted. I don't think it's even narrowly loved.

They regularly have age issues given either the changing publishing timeline or editing/continuity errors. Is Abrogail Thrune a young early 20s who just finished taking the throne or a mature early 30s with plenty of experience? It depends on which book you're reading and when you're playing.

Emeric Tusan wrote:
graystone wrote:
PossibleCabbage wrote:
I mean, Ultimate Intrigue included the ability to use a skill (Knowledge (Local) IIRC) to tell what class someone is, and I'm pretty sure people in the diagesis are not aware of classes, or at least classes existing as distinct categories.

Also Phrenology (Knowledge [arcana]), Prognostication (Sense Motive).

PS: Read Aura (Perception) tells you the total number of points available in its ki pool, grit pool, or similar resource.

As to "I'm pretty sure people in the diagesis are not aware of classes", then what do they learn when they use the skill/spell? The simplest/easiest answer is the class name.

According to both Mark Morland and James Jacobs hit points and other mechanics don't exist in game they are there as concepts so we can play the game. A fighter doesn't exist in game some one leaning that information would have an idea of the persons capabilities based on the knowledge check. They spelled this out in the Secrets of Golorin panel, when someone asked how they explain new classes showing up. The answer is they always existed the mechanics just didn't have a name for us to play as one.

Yeah, these aren't great sources. James Jacobs has repeatedly demonstrated he's not that reliable on knowledge of (I think he still hasn't read all of Occult Adventures) and interpretation of Pathfinder rules, and Moreland is a former developer whose credits don't include any rule books and now manages franchise licensing stuff. Probably a minimum of 1/4 of the regular participants of this board have a stronger knowledge of the rules actually published by Paizo as a result of actually reading the products and engaging in debates here about ambiguities therein and the implications of potential rulings.

Ravingdork wrote:

I'm inclined to agree that a race specific ship might not be quite so accomodating, but I imagine most space stations open to the general public would make for such allowances.

The campaign world's concept completely falls apart of you assume such accommodations don't exist.

I'm sure parts of Absalom Station have been retrofitted to accommodate large species, but it would be pretty weird to do that for the majority of the station. No one is going to mandate that all rooms in Manhattan be made 16' tall and four times as spacious just because we make contact with a big alien species who sends several thousand people as permanent residents and rotating tourists.

Bardarok wrote:
John John wrote:
Question, can everyone "cast" a ritual or only spellcasting classes?
I don't think it is spellcaster only but I doubt just anyone can cast a ritual. I'd bet it is linked to the Occultisim skill through skill feats and proficiency levels. So anyone who invests in the skill could cast rituals but spellcasters likely get trained in it as a default skill.

I'll bet different rituals are linked to different magic skills. So Resurrection will use Religion, Elemental Swarm will use Nature, etc.

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Rob Godfrey wrote:
Dragon78 wrote:
Scaring someone to death sounds more like a monster ability then a class ability or at least the use of the Intimidate skill.
it's an Intimidate based Legendary skill feat (so the hell knight commander can literally scare malcontents to death, their corrupt hearts bursting in terror) or similar. You are just that terrifying.

R. Lee Ermey was one level short.

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Deadmanwalking wrote:

Bear in mind that things like Magic Circle and Planar Binding sort of have to fall under either Mental or Material (probably Mental) as well as Spiritual or a Wizard couldn't do them (which they pretty clearly should be able to).

Given that, Spiritual seems less about dealing with external spirits and more about dealing with and empowering your own soul and/or channeling divinity.

I think Magic Circle and Planar Binding are going to be rituals presumably not restricted to class, and therefore their essence classification isn't necessarily relevant to class spell lists.

I also wouldn't be surprised to see the essences used as a reason to narrow some of the more expansive spell lists. Wizard can still be very broad, because physical covers a whole lot, and mental covers a big enchantment/illusion space, but the kitchen sink might get tossed back.

Conjuring, however, can easily fit under the Arcane conceptual scheme. Physically calling/creating a creature that you mentally control.

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Metaphysician wrote:
So, once again, I am forced to ask: how does +4 to a single stat provide any advantage over any of the races that provides +2 to two stats? You have the exact same number of points to spend, and the same cap. You can hit 18 INT with a human just as readily as a grey. Only downside to other species is if the stats they provide bonuses to, are stats you didn't want to buff. But since there are good reasons to pump nearly every stat in Starfinder, this is a really marginal downside.

The only racial upsides are penalties in a stat you'd like to dump combined with bonuses in places you wanted to increase more than 10. Any bonuses in places you didn't want to increase are harmful, bonuses in places you did want to increase are a wash.

Deadmanwalking wrote:

The Occultist also seems better suited to Mental/Vital than Mental/Spiritual, and if they aren't Occult, who is?

The Occultist was noteworthy among the occult classes in that it's spell list was the closest to the Wizard. Lots of blasting. Their enchantment spells were actually lackluster. Necromancy was good. The "psychic only/psychic specialist" spells that they got were things like Node of Blasting and Etheric Shards (blasting/evocation) and very early access to Retrocognition (investigation of spiritual traces of the past).

I could actually see them as Physical/Spiritual. Fireballs and spirit calling. The implements had spiritual resonances/traces that they were supposed to be channeling in some fashion.

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