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Count Lucinean Galdana

Wraith235's page

FullStarFullStarFullStarFullStarFullStar Pathfinder Society GM. 821 posts (833 including aliases). 1 review. No lists. 1 wishlist. 28 Pathfinder Society characters. 1 alias.


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Shadow Lodge *****

Auke Teeninga wrote:
Wraith235 wrote:

I just have 1 question .. and Im not trying to start a fire here

in my experience of Convention events - scenarios don't go out until around T minus 10 days... how did they even get the scenario at the 3 week mark ...
We're trying to get the convention support procedure more streamlined, so scenarios will go out faster. Work in progress!

cool .. thank for the answer ... and good to know

I know that has been a long time complaint from a lot of Con GM's ... just not enough time to prep

Shadow Lodge *****


Shadow Lodge *****

I just have 1 question .. and Im not trying to start a fire here
in my experience of Convention events - scenarios don't go out until around T minus 10 days... how did they even get the scenario at the 3 week mark ...

Shadow Lodge

this is a thread about infernal healing and fast healing

not Flight,Pounce, Wildshape, Beast Shape, Plant Shape, Form of the Dragon, Barbarians, Sorcerers, or any other Straw-Man you Want to introduce

the problem Chess is 95%+ of your entire argument is a Straw-man and Im ashamed with myself for falling for it .. I should have realized much Sooner that that is what you were doing

by RAW Infernal healing Meets All Critera for being a Magical Healing
as has been pointed out many times ..
as I noted in my last Response the fast healing granted by the spell does NOT meet the Criteria for an (Ex) because there are certain Wounds it Wont heal - that is a Fundamental Difference that does not meet with Fast healing as presented in the Universal Monster Rules

Shadow Lodge

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Azothath wrote:
ya know, if you have to resort to all caps or interesting symbols it might be time to take a step back from posting. It's just people's opinions and posting it doesn't make it correct.

sorry for the use of interesting Symbols ... those were aimed at myself since I lost an edit I had been working on for a while ... didnt know the site had an hour limit on edit

Deadbeat Doom wrote:

I see your reasoning here, but I would respectfully point out that if Fast Healing says it works like Natural Healing, and Natural Healing contains only information concerning Rest, then it isn't all that far a leap to assume that Fast Healing directly relates to Rest.

As a side note, as far as I know this is not a PFS Argument as this thread is located in Rules Questions, not in Pathfinder Society.

I do get what you are saying though. It would be nice if we could get a FAQ on what, exactly, constitutes Natural Healing.

Forgive me I and allow me to Reclarify

Mine and chess's involvement in this is Seeded in PFS is what I Should have said - it is a rules issue to be sure and due to the involvement of PFS requires a different type of diligence in debate since we should all be using the same Rules

and yes .. it should be that simple .. but the argument that would be used against it is "Thats 1 way of getting natural healing" but yes - I agree with you

Shadow Lodge

$!@#$%!@ Lost my edit ... ugh what a pisser

as for Flight -
Technically Flight Doesn't care how you got it Since SU Flight ends in an AMF
it also doesn't care how it ends
so as for your pigeon hole TECHNICALLY (Sure its a stretch)any Flight that ends in an AMF would be Su

Chess Pwn wrote:




Yes I understand that you are in no way alluding to the fast healing being a separate effect

Fast Healing (ex) Heals Damage from Silver or Good Aligned effects
Fast Healing (ex) does not make you feel the evil of the Magic
Fast Healing (ex) Does not make you detect as evil

the Spell Creates all 3 Effects Simultaneously, and as we have discussed you cannot end 1 piece without the others
Because of the Change in what it can / cannot heal it is Not Fast healing (ex) Since Fast Healing (ex) doesnt care what did the damage
Its been Modified to something that doesn't exist in the Universal Monster Rules regardless of how much you want it to Fit
the Spell also does not Say Fast Healing (ex) when all other instances of Fast healing that I have found so far (and there are probably many more) DO Clarify as an (ex) by RAW this one Does not

- interesting Note .. I'll have to check if there are any other abilities from this particular book that grant Fast healing ... that would Solve the soon to come Editing Error argument
Edit only thing I found was Red Shroud from the RMA which is an SU

Shadow Lodge

your Dismissing evidence because it does not suit your argument

and yes ... AMF is Basically the breakdown as stated here

CRB pg 221 wrote:

Spell-Like Abilities (Sp)
Usually, a spell-like ability works just like the spell of that name. A spell-like ability has no verbal, somatic, or material component, nor does it require a focus. The user activates it mentally. Armor never affects a spell-like ability's use, even if the ability resembles an arcane spell with a somatic component.

A spell-like ability has a casting time of 1 standard action unless noted otherwise in the ability or spell description. In all other ways, a spell-like ability functions just like a spell.

Spell-like abilities are subject to spell resistance and dispel magic. They do not function in areas where magic is suppressed or negated. Spell-like abilities cannot be used to counterspell, nor can they be counterspelled.

If a character class grants a spell-like ability that is not based on an actual spell, the ability's effective spell level is equal to the highest-level class spell the character can cast, and is cast at the class level the ability is gained.

Supernatural Abilities (Su)

These can't be disrupted in combat and generally don't provoke attacks of opportunity. They aren't subject to spell resistance, counterspells, or dispel magic, and don't function in antimagic areas.

Extraordinary Abilities (Ex)

These abilities cannot be disrupted in combat, as spells can, and they generally do not provoke attacks of opportunity. Effects or areas that negate or disrupt magic have no effect on extraordinary abilities. They are not subject to dispelling, and they function normally in an antimagic field. Indeed, extraordinary abilities do not qualify as magical, though they may break the laws of physics.

Natural Abilities

This category includes abilities a creature has because of its physical nature. Natural abilities are those not otherwise designated as extraordinary, supernatural, or spell-likr
Bolded for Contrast

well an SU is only effected by Anti Magic Areas so yes

By RAW no matter how you get it or what it gives you if an SU is Suppressed (since it cant be dispelled) you cannot use it...

and for the Record - you still have to make Fly Checks with magical Flight not sure where you got that Idea that you didnt

Chess Pwn wrote:

the setup
If you're using a magic item to qualify for a feat the feat is a natural or EX ability and the magic item is obviously magic.

my view
The feat is and always will be an EX ability, just because you lost the magic granting you access to the EX ability doesn't suddenly make the feat a magical ability. Yes you lose the feat in the AMF, but not because it is magic but because it's source is magic.

another example, is the feat weapon focus a magical ability? I say no. But you can get weapon focus from a magical item. Since the item turns off in the AMF you lose the feat in the AMF. NOT because the feat is magical, it's still clearly a normal feat that is not magical, but because the magical source of the normal feat has been turned off.

Exactly ... the Source is Magical therefore you Loose them because how you gained them is no longer Valid

Greater Beatst Totem(Su)
Dragon Totem Wings(Su)

Regardless of how or Why in an AMF you cant use them

Chess Pwn wrote:

NO, I'm saying pounce is EX. Greater beast totem is SU. It really seems you're not reading my posts clearly enough to understand if you felt I said that pounce was an SU.

under your view, as I understand it, greater beast totem an SU ability, grants some new SU ability of pounce. So I am clarifying. if you maintained GBT in an AMF would pounce be disabled? Are you really saying that GBT is granting a new SU ability of pounce?

I say and feel the rules make the most sense, is that GBT a SU is granting the normal pounce ability, which is an EX ability. Thus if you somehow could keep GBT in an AMF that the pounce would work just fine as it would be an EX ability.

Allow me to Clarify

your statment that it is an EX is Absolutely Irelavent to me - the Ability is an SU on paper in the book its in Reads XXXX(Su) - thats all I care about for the purpose of this Discussion because when it comes to AMF thats all that matters

Chess Pwn wrote:


you are saying that 2 parts of the Spell are Magical and 1 is not your ignoring that the person Cast on can "Feel the Evil of the Magic" (says it Right there in the Spell description that its Magical)

Deadbeat Doom wrote:
So I guess no one noted the part where I pointed out that Fast Healing works like Natural Healing, which is healing from Rest, which is also affected by the Fast Healer feat...

no I saw

sad as it is this is a PFS Argument and as much as I hate to say it the Spell Specifically calls out Rest ... not Natural healing and all Natural healing says in the crb is Rest ... then we have the line
Except where noted here, fast healing is just like natural healing which really does nothing

Shadow Lodge

either way Chess you and I have both agreed we will not change our views untill there is an FAQ (or in this case the travesty that is the campaign clarifications does something decent for once)
I have put my evidence down and am not looking to waste anymore energy debating it with you

Shadow Lodge

thaX wrote:
Just to have a clarification, what is AMF?

Anti-Magic field

Shadow Lodge

Chess Pwn wrote:

There was a lot and after reading your post I feel it wasn't clear.

Your last paragraph shows you clearly don't understand. The spell, is granting an EX ability to you while it's active. If it's not active then there's nothing to give you fast healing.
If the spell was written as such. Durration instantaneous. this grants fast healing 1 for 1 minute. this fast healing can't heal some damage and makes you ping as evil. The totally, the fast healing would persist in the AMF. Since it is an EX ability granted by the spell. But since we both agree that the fast healing only persists while the spell is active your idea that because the fast healing doesn't persist in an AMF the fast healing must be a magic source has no merit. As soon as the magic granting the fast healing is gone the fast healing stops existing for your character. So the granting of the fast healing is totally a part of the spell, but the actual healing being done is the EX ability fast healing.

the logic of the argument is that fast healing is an EX and thus Not Subject to AMF and thereby Preventing iot from benifitting from the Fast healer feat thats the rabbit hole we are exploring

and the spell Does not say "While active" your words again

the inclusion of a Duration to to tie it to a spell
Makes it a magical effect -
putting it into the conjuration (healing) school
thus Making it Magical Healing (a spell as is Called out by Magical healing on page 191
the 3 parts of the Spell that all effect it Calling out that it is indeed Magic in nature because you must apply everything in the spell

by RAW - the definition of a Spell is a "one time Magical Effect" that is pretty clear cut to me .... no matter what the Spell does it is a 1 time Magical Effect, regardless of how many effects there are - they are magical, no matter what the effects are - they are magical

you Cannot have it both Ways



So you're saying that a barbarian with great beast totem a SU effect that says,"the barbarian gains the pounce special ability. This also upgrades claws" is not referring to the monster universal EX ability pounce and gains that. But is a new SU ability called pounce since he would not have the pounce ability in an AMF?

Right? You're saying that his pounce ability is a SU ability and not the EX ability that we have listed in the book?

That if the barb could keep one SU or SP effect that he couldn't have both greater beast totem AND this new SU pounce ability because that is two abilities.

you Said it yourself - its an SU ...

We already have precedence for Loosing access to things due to outside circumstances (ability damage causing you to no longer qualify for a feat or Loosing access to a feat causing you to loose a whole tree)
since I've tried to answer this Multiple times I will ask you ...
Are SU's suppressed in an AMF?



Are you saying that a barbarian with dragon wings totem and activated the wings uses magical flight and not wing based flight. that under the fly skill it says, "If you are using wings and you fail a Fly check by 5 or more, you plummet to the ground, taking the appropriate falling damage.", "If you are flying using wings and you take damage while flying, you must make a DC 10 Fly check to avoid losing 10 feet of altitude." and, "If you are using...

you Cannot have it Both Ways - I am Saying that if you cease to qualify to use them then they become useless

the Ability is listed as an SU
the SU allows you Manifest Wings, you enter an AMF you Loose the ability to Manifest them so they would disappear as you would cease to qualify to use them because the effect is Suppressed in an AMF

Dragon disciple Sorcerer - Wings are SU .. enter an AMF you would cease to be able to Control them since they are granted by an SU

all until you leave the AMF thats the distinction between an SP/SU and EX/Natural

Shadow Lodge

Chess Pwn wrote:
when you enter an AMF the spell stops granting you fast healing. Since you no longer have the EX ability of fast healing you don't heal any more. NOT that your fast healing was stopped by the AMF but the spell granting it to you.

you cant have it both Ways .. Infernal healing is either Magical or its not - the Spell gives all 3 parts ... not 1 and 1 and 1 as soon as you say its Not Magical you are Separating the effects

Part 1 you gain Fast Healing 1
Part 2 Cannot Repair Damage from Silver or Good alligned
Part 3 Detects as evil for the Duration and can sense the Evil of the Magic
Part 3 alone Classifies it as Magical

Like the animal shape into a hawk. If you say that the caster is using the Hawks wings to EX fly then going into a AMF doesn't turn off the flight but turns off the spell that was granting the EX ability.

Flight EX or SU only Cares if it ends in an AMF thats it Look at the Rules for Flight all it Says is this

If the ability is supernatural, it becomes ineffective in an antimagic field, and the creature loses its ability to fly for as long as the antimagic effect persists. -
your Wild Shaped - effect ends and you fall

But if you say that the factor is if that ability is removed by whatever reason in an AMF then that means that animal shape's flight is magical flight and not restricted by EX flight rules.

the portion of Flight that would apply to "EX" status is this A creature with this ability can cease or resume flight as a free action, and Maneuverability Rules

the Fly Skill only says this
You are skilled at flying, either through the use of wings or magic
and yes .. pretty much AMF Suppresses all SU and SP PERIOD ... no exceptions

I've only met one person that said that an animal shape's flight is magical flight. But it's spell that has SR too.

Yup that was Me .. and you got that answer because you pushed me for an on the Spot By RAW answer - and my answer was Yes because your Wild shape is suppressed so you loose flight... did you have wings before ? ok that's a different Story

and your Confusing EX with

Natural Abilities

This category includes abilities a creature has because of its physical nature. Natural abilities are those not otherwise designated as extraordinary, supernatural, or spell-like. which is a summarily Ill exposed Catagory Just like Natural Healing


A draconic sorcerer has a bloodline ability Wings(SU) at 15th level, leathery dragon wings grow from your back as a standard action, giving you a fly speed of 60 feet with average maneuverability. You can dismiss the wings as a free action.

Do you believe that since this turns off it's magical flight and not a magical ability granting wings that grant EX flight?

its an SU ability Not EX - SU abilities are inherently Magic by their interaction with an Antimagic Field, and the ability States how its an SU so I dont know what your trying to accomplish here

Like are all movement granting spells, are they suddenly granting SP flight/burrow/earth glide/ since it "doesn't technically reference the monster ability?"

SP or SU - since its granted by a Spell and therefore subject to AMF

Is the barbarians pounce from Greater beast totem or the wings from Dragon Totem Wings, granted from SU rage powesr, explicitly saying "he pounce special ability" and "wings that grant her a fly speed equal to her base speed" granting SU pounce and SU flight? It would turn off in a AMF. And it seems that's your platform for saying that fast healing is magical. I don't think most people would say that he's getting a special new ability of SU pounce or that the wings are granting SU flight but that the rage power is granting the normal EX pounce and EX flight that that the AMF is stopping the rage powers, not the actual pounce or flight.

its not EX Flight ... the SU gives you Wings Which Cease to Function in an AMF - EX by their Definition Would Continue to Function in an AMF ... and so would Natural Abilities


So YES it does technically reference fast healing since when an ability is referenced we're to look in the in the rules for how it works.

Fast Healing (Su) eidolon evo
An eidolon’s body gains the ability to heal wounds very quickly, giving it fast healing 1.
fast healing is defined as an EX ability.

Except in the Eidolons Case it is an SU and NOWHERE in the description does it say Ex ... that's YOUR Words Not RAW

If there was an ability that said "you can keep one effect that normally turns off in an AMF on" that the fast healing granted by the spell would turn off since it was magical healing if you kept the spell on? (cause remember the spell is giving you "the new SP/SU/magical ability" fast healing, not that the spell IS fast healing) so if you picked the spell you'd detect as evil and be being granted the magical fast healing, but that the fast healing would be turn off? And obviously if you picked the magical fast healing the spell stops, which stops the granting of this magical healing, and thus you wasted your choice?

you've Round-aboutly highlighted the Conundrum ...if Fast Healing is Not Magical then it would Remain active During the AMF (as per an Ex or Natural abilities) and everything else tied to the spell would end

Would you say that if the sorcerer/barbarian/polymorphed creature picked the bloodline power/rage power/spell that they'd have the wings but be unable to fly since it'd be considered magical flight, Since the ability normally would have been gone in the AMF?

if they are SU then yes .. the Wings would disappear Since they are Granted by an SU and they would no longer be able to Fly... if they NATURALLY had Wings ... then no

Or are you proposing that all those abilities that behave oh so similarly to this situation, where it's seemingly a SP/SU granting an EX ability are doing that but that fast healing is somehow the special exception?

if they are an SU or SP or Granted By an SU or SP then yes it ceases Functioning because it was Granted by what is Magic... and that's the argument being used against it being magical healing ... not my argument... Hell Look at the description of the Spell itself ... it Says they can feel the evil of the MAGIC

Like I really can't see how you can see these and say "Yes this spell is granting magical fast healing ability", and also say, "No those spells and SU abilities are granting the normal EX versions of the ability." And not think anything of it.

Ive never said that ... I have said if its an SU or SP it is Supressed by an AMF ... Period

the logical conclusion of this debate is as soon as you start calling the fast healing Seperate from the rest of the spell - thus breaking the spell into its Components that since its an EX as per what people are saying it would continue to function in an AMF

the Fast healing working in an AMF is a thought excersise to highlight what is wrong with this argument

this Whole argument on every level can be broken down to 1 question
Is it affect by AMF
Yes - SU / SP
No - EX or Natural

Shadow Lodge

Chess Pwn wrote:

If you find something that said, fast healing (su) heal 1 hp... and never reference the "fast healing" from Universal monster rules then I'd think you got something.

interesting that TECHNICALLY IH doesnt Reference the Universal monster Rules ... its the side of the Community that says it doesnt Work that is referencing it

the farther I dig into this the more I believe that Fast healing given by Infernal healing is not an EX

does the fast healing end when you walk into an AMF
yes ? SU or SP
No ? Ex

if your fine saying that the fast healing Stays after entering an AMF then sure I can get behind your argument but Dollars to Donuts noone has that opinion ... and you really cant have it both ways
because of this line in IH
The target detects as an evil creature for the duration of the spell and can sense the evil of the magic (Clasifying it as magic)
whats even funnier is that all the spell says is it gives you fast healing 1 ... and as soon as you seperate fast healing from the Effect that allows you to "sense the evil of the Magic" your left with a duration-less Fast healing 1

someione tried to use the polymorph into a hawk argument and thats lead me to believe this is much more binary than its being made ... the interesting thing about the flight argument is not about Wings .. its all about " If the ability is supernatural, it becomes ineffective in an antimagic field, and the creature loses its ability to fly for as long as the antimagic effect persists"

same goes for EX, SU. SP ... do they end in an AMF ...

the natural healing Entry on pg. 191 confuses things more since it only lists 1 Type of Natural healing and I cant find any other definition of natural healing anywhere else in the books
And anything else is considered Magical healing

as for the Regenerate Spell it doesn't GIVE you regeneration ability so without debate it would work

Infernal healing is further Convoluted by the fact that it allows SR... EX and SU don't

I think theres to many markers pointing away from an Ex to support it BEING one

Shadow Lodge *****

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Fast healing granted from Infernal healing and the fast healer feat

Shadow Lodge

I've been on both sides of this in the last 48 hours and after seeing that Eidolons Fast healing are not (Ex) but (Su)

Fast Healing (Su): The eidolon's body gains the ability to heal wounds very quickly, giving it fast healing 1. The eidolon heals 1 point of damage per round, just like via natural healing.~

I think the argument that all fast Healing is (Ex) is a dead and redundant argument. If there had not been another example of Fast healing being (Sp) or (Su) I probably would not have sided for it working

Infernal healing is a Conjuration (healing) (Evil) Spell
Cure X Wounds are Conjuration (healing) spell

in the Rules for healing on page 191 of the Players Handbook
Natural healing is Listed as a full Nights Rest
Magical healing is Listed as "Various Abilities and Spells can restore Hitpoints"

since its a spell it falls into magical healing because of "Various abilities and spells"

yes it would help if it Told us what TYPE of Fast healing provided Particularly since the ISWG was released After the APG

By RAW All it says is fast healing .. nothing more .. nothing less not (Ex) or (Su) and as soon as you start applying those to it you are venturing into RAI

Shadow Lodge *****

5 hours+ Really ?
so does this run long ?
Im about to play this in a limited time slot and if there is a time issue I will switch post haste

Shadow Lodge *****

any Idea when this goes live to 5 stars ?

Shadow Lodge

1 person marked this as a favorite.

I realize your at GenCon but how would you handle this

a large building is the location of a Hallow and Forbidance Spells
a Graveknight walks in (Desecration Aura)

My initial thought is that the Hallow would suppress the desecration since they are in the same Realm of functionality but after readinfg Im doubting it (since its a constant effect)
or at least limit the effect to the graveknight himself

Shadow Lodge

How much on city of brass....I'm in need of that for another adventure path

Shadow Lodge *****

I too would like info on travelling there
While I have a PC with that boon my need for info is based on a non paizo adventure path

Shadow Lodge *****

now that blood money is banned the only symbol spell I use regularly is Symbol of mirroring because I can offset the cost with false focus

they just get too expensive to use

Shadow Lodge

Claxon wrote:

So it's important to note, that whirlwind (the Supernatural ability from the Universal Monster Rules and not the spell versions) requires that a creature be a least 1 size category smaller than the user. So a Peri could only suck up a small creature (or smaller), so it's highly likely that the whole thing simply couldn't be done.

not entirely true .... the wording is "Creatures one or more size categories smaller than the whirlwind" not the creature

so 5 ft base and up to 20 ft Wide at the top

as for the rest yes ... protection and resist were both in play so this wasnt a particularly deadly encounter ... just a resource spender ... tho now that I see I forgot it does double damage to undead ... the Vampire caught in the Whirlwind should have been in a LOT Worse trouble

Shadow Lodge

had a situation in a game last night

now while not particularly dangerous due to the spells that were up at the time it brought up a very interesting rules discussion for future situations

this was in a Way of the Wicked Campaign

the Encounter was with a Peri the creature used its whirlwind dance and was able to successfully suck one PC up into the Firey Twister

it then started using its Wall of Fire SLA's and put 2 of them down and started dragging the unfortunate soul back and forth through the walls of fire ... this was not a planned tactic ... but one that evolved on the fly

my question in the end is ... if you are forcibly moved through a wall of fire (in this case 2) with the possibility of dragging him through each wall 2x in 1 round ... does the wall do damage each time ... my logic says yes .. but my OMFG this is super OP says no

Shadow Lodge *****

have an odd bit here .... We know we can sell them back for full cost
but I have a strange thing on the Gloves of Recon

I picked them up

for free at the end of fortress of the nail

am I allowed to go back and change that ?

Shadow Lodge *****

4 people marked this as a favorite.
Matthew Morris wrote:
TOZ wrote:
The jingasa is now either a use once and replace item or not even worth your time. May as well have been banned.
Yeah. Changing either 1/day crit negation OR luck bonus would have rebalanced it. As is... meh.

once ever with a luck bonus Id have been happy with

Shadow Lodge

I am having a map Issue


on Day 217 one of the events is the following

2-20 The Pillar marked ‘B’ collapses smashing into the
double doors. Any guards stationed on either side of the
double doors must make a second DC 15 Reflex save or
take a further 6d6 damage (save negates).

my issues with this the ceiling is 50 ft
the distance to the double doors is 100ft
Further more this cuts off the only access to the 3rd or 4th floor other than the newly opened entrance on 3-11 completely ruining text that is presented later in the book considering that that particular pillar has the stairway in it that leads up from the Maw- Causing the Following events to not make sense

the boggards assult on the sanctum
the Sons of Balentyne

Since without those stairs - they simply cannot make it to the sanctum

any sort of advice on this ?

Shadow Lodge *****

4 people marked this as a favorite.

first of all I do feel that this spell probably should be in the realm of a 5th level spell .. trading Area for the casting time ... but that's not my call

secondly.....k why are we having this argument at all

Players WILL break encounters - we know that
Players can and will break entire scenarios

Think back to the story of a Wizard trying to use Dominate person on a particularly high level caster from a season 4 scenario

yes we as GM's have a limited amount of response that we can use

yes .. we as human beings have a right to complain

but the farther I read into this thread the more it looks to be becoming adversarial (i.e. GM's vs Players) Unfortunately this is a growing trend that Ive seen on the forums .. particularly in these ban this or that threads (alter summon monster aside)

PFS is about everyone having fun ...
Loosing a character is RARELY Fun for a Player (I know of a couple of instances where this is not the case but those are fringe)so is allowing players to have a get out of jail free card so harmful ?

is this 1 spell Ruining the fun of GM's So bad that it requires this level of targeted response ?

if the answer to either of these is no then again ... why are we debating this
if the answer is yes to either of these then I think we as players / GM's need to ask ourselves why we feel this way ...

Shadow Lodge *****

John Compton wrote:

Janira just happens to be the last to possibly die as part of the Scroll-Seekers, meaning the PCs get to deal with her tearful reports about how the PCs' mismanagement killed yet another one of her friends.

I am REALLY Suprised they have kept her around after how many times she is mercessily slaughtered at the hands of the aspis agents in that 1 scenario

John Compton wrote:
if you know that the players/PCs are critical of their venture-captains for perceived tight-fistedness, lack of empathy, or incompetence

lol. my players always complained about Hakeem and the baubles for his daughters

Shadow Lodge *****

scouts count the target as flat footed if they move more than 10 feet or charge
looks like it might also be a sap adept / sap master build

Shadow Lodge *****

sadly I can see Kitsune going ... all the tiny kitsune foxform songbirds of doom

Shadow Lodge *****

the 1 story about this thing that I remember well was at an online con

in GM Chat a message comes across that a GM had TPK'd the entire group Save 1 in Bonekeep 2

the 1 happened to be a songbird of Doom

the player made the choice that they were going to try to finish the scenario Solo

got to the final room and had to run away because he got mind fogged

the point is he made it over 1/2 the remaining way in that monstrosity Solo

now yes they nerfed Mouser .. but the ring was a large part of it

Shadow Lodge *****

Finlanderboy wrote:
Wraith235 wrote:

fair enough ... sorry I was on my phone when I was posting this ... there were a few other possibilities I saw when looking at the race list that MIGHT Work - I'll skip the obvious "No's"

Damphir - have been out of Rotation for what 4 years now ? they were allowed with the beginner box bash

Orcs - would love to see it but not gonna happen

Aasimar, Tiefling.... Doubt they want to go down that road again

Fetchling - very limited boon run - so no

Kobolds - would be cool but again - I dont see it

Elementalkin - these I suppose are possible ... there are So many boons out for them tho that I wonder if it would be a slap in the face

Changlings - MIGHT work - tho the flavor might be a bit wierd

Merfolk - the 5 ft. base land speed is a no go

Strix- this is an interesting one to think about with the heavy cheliax stuff as of late

Vanaras - I see these as the same category as catfolk ... Prolly a gencon charity boon

I would like to see hobgoblins over orcs myself.

Strix give flight at first level. This is usually a level 5 ability that costs resources. I would give a strong no to that.

I think android would be a great boon.

I covered androids in my previous post ... there is 1 in PFS - it was a charity auction boon at Gencon in season 6

Shadow Lodge *****

fair enough ... sorry I was on my phone when I was posting this ... there were a few other possibilities I saw when looking at the race list that MIGHT Work - I'll skip the obvious "No's"

Damphir - have been out of Rotation for what 4 years now ? they were allowed with the beginner box bash

Orcs - would love to see it but not gonna happen

Aasimar, Tiefling.... Doubt they want to go down that road again

Fetchling - very limited boon run - so no

Kobolds - would be cool but again - I dont see it

Elementalkin - these I suppose are possible ... there are So many boons out for them tho that I wonder if it would be a slap in the face

Changlings - MIGHT work - tho the flavor might be a bit wierd

Merfolk - the 5 ft. base land speed is a no go

Strix- this is an interesting one to think about with the heavy cheliax stuff as of late

Vanaras - I see these as the same category as catfolk ... Prolly a gencon charity boon

Shadow Lodge *****

My curiosity is what will they replace it with
Won't be samsaran because of the gencon boon same with rats and frogs
Vishkanya is the current race boon
Catfolk was a charity auction boon
No way will Android be legal
Gillmen is a possibility

Shadow Lodge *****

I am curious on Room A11

the description of the room is well done ... however mechanically I wonder if something was overlooked with spiked chains lying about the room floor everywhere that spin up and start shredding people , was the intent to make the floor difficult Terrain ... or function like Caltrops ? the description certainly leads to that Thought process

when I ran it I had a hafling Cavalier wanting to charge around to damage the mechanisms... this was after the chains had spun up

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1st I am not a huge advocate of retroactive banning of anything but ...

allow me to compare this to another Item that was banned

Bracers of Falcons Aim. - this provided a constant level 1 spell Aspect of the Falcon for 4k Gold , and was banned for being overpowered

while the bracers only benefited characters with bows / x-bows .. a similarity can be drawn to any character that uses a dex to damage build in melee - with an emphasis on monks
and IMHO this is a much more powerful effect -

so yes I agree this should have a ban consideration

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just woke up .... but the scimitar one still works (Cant remember the name)

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Most times they kill janira ...and disguise jolyrin as janira

Shadow Lodge

ya that one I knew ... spent a ridiculous amount of time researching that rule for Bonekeep 2

Shadow Lodge

Martin Weil wrote:

A couple of fairly minor points:

Except in rare circumstances, you are unable to end your turn while squeezing, so you can't start your turn in an area where you are squeezing.

I actually think this is incorrect ... the squeezing rules were quoted above in total ... and nowhere does it say you cant end your turn

Like I said before it would be easier if squeezing was considered a condition (which I think it really should be TBH)

Shadow Lodge

ya I almost quoted that feat then looked it up

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Mass Ghostbane Dirge - every one of them made the save

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SRD wrote:

Tactical Movement

Hampered Movement: Difficult terrain, obstacles, and poor visibility can hamper movement (see Table: Hampered Movement for details). When movement is hampered, each square moved into usually counts as two squares, effectively reducing the distance that a character can cover in a move.

If more than one hampering condition applies, multiply all additional costs that apply. This is a specific exception to the normal rule for doubling.

In some situations, your movement may be so hampered that you don't have sufficient speed even to move 5 feet (1 square). In such a case, you may use a full-round action to move 5 feet (1 square) in any direction, even diagonally. Even though this looks like a 5-foot step, it's not, and thus it provokes attacks of opportunity normally. (You can't take advantage of this rule to move through impassable terrain or to move when all movement is prohibited to you.)

You can't run or charge through any square that would hamper your movement.

Sadly I can see both sides of the argument ... Dragon style specifically calls out Obstacles and Difficult Terrain ... not "Hampered Movement" ....

unfortunately the rule-set does itself no favors on this since squeezing is not a condition which makes this a real Muck storm

if it were me making the call I would agree that squeezing is not covered by dragon style ... but not without some serious reservations, including being open to correction later as well as an apology to any player I ruled that way against ...

Unfortunately Squeezing isn't even considered hampered movement so that argument isn't even valid and as such I would consider it not "a clear path toward the opponent, and nothing can hinder your movement"

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battle poi explanation that weapon is just a mess

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Ninja is legal but has some Terrible Glaring holes in it

1 (and probably the least) no trapfinding
2 - no evasion

I played a Ninja ... once I hit level 8 (Ninja 6 Fighter 2 - very feat heavy build) the loss of evasion was too painful, I ended up taking 2 levels of Monk and a level of Trapmaster Ranger in order to fix the issues with it

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Tonya Woldridge wrote:
Wraith235 wrote:
I would like to request campaign coordinator confirmation before I start schedulaing it

I thought I had posted about Bonekeep II & III in these forums, but cannot find the post anywhere.

Here is the official word!

All Bonekeeps can be ran by any 4*/5*/VO at any time. They no longer need convention status.


Much appreciated ... I can now contact people about scheduling it

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Auke Teeninga wrote:
andreww wrote:

THIS is the last post I can find fro John about it. I cannot find anything from Tonya about it.

I assume it has been discussed in the super secret VC forum?


Tonya Woldridge wrote:
All Bonekeeps can be ran by any 4*/5*/VO at any time once they are in your downloads.

forgive me but Im hesitant untill I see something in a public forum ... just the way I work :-(

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I would like to request campaign coordinator confirmation before I start schedulaing it

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the problem I have with this is .. as has been stated a few times before
1 - we live in a digital age

2 - yes Herolab is Fallable and for the most part people know it but they also are smart enough to pick up on what the issue is

3 - if you say you cannot have Herolab at the table ... then how far off is the "No Herolab generated Character sheets at the table" because thats the logical next step and TBH not very far from the mark

we already have more than enough of the "Not at my table" the following are exmples

the I don't like that Option Discussion,
the Optimized character discussion,
the RAW vs. RAI Discussion
the "I don't like you as a player" discussion
the Under-optimized Character discussion

and now
the "your using hero Lab discussion"

it almost seems that we have gone to a place of entitlements where for whatever reason can be come up with you can have your character / player whatever prevented from playing at a public table - Note I didn't say WOULD BE or WILL BE.... but CAN or COULD BE

sure these are all separate issues ... but as far as I can see a symptom of a larger problem ..

Where does it end.....

because every week there seems to be a new thread or complaint someone has with a tool or resource that's being used

and true we don't see a lot of it in practice but IMHO the threat of it is enough to discourage some players past and present from returning or continuing (and yes I know players that have quit over these politics)

and thats just what this is, Politics .. IMHO Politics have no place in PFS ... We have the Rules by which we play by, nothing more and nothing less, so why are we Trying to make up more rules aside from what we are provided with

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kinevon wrote:

To be honest, ElterAgo, there are a lot worse combinations that are still legal for PFS.

Dazing metamagic, for instance.
Toppling metamagic, or a medium or better built trip/disarm PC.
Color Spray Oracles
Just for a starter.

I agree with all of these - aside from the trip builds (I have one and effectiveness drops to nill at a certain point)

allow me to add -
rulership variant negative energy channeling
Ale Variant negative energy channeling channeling

unfortunatly since we dont know the specifics of why this was removed as a legal option we cant debate it, we can only speculate

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I would like to second the motion for Spring loaded wrist sheaths and scrolls
Id also Like to request a ruling on False Focus and Alchemical power components

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