Psychic A, in his home at the Capitol on Golarion, casts create mindscape and then makes it permanent. They then tell a friend, Psychic B, who is currently in the Elemental Plane of Air.

Psychic A & B both cast mindscape door to enter this already established mindscape. There are now two doors, one to a house in Golarion, another to a place in the Plane of Air.

What happens if Psychic B then walks over and goes through the mindscape door to Golarion, and A goes through the other to the Plane of Air?

A magic rod that, while wielded, doubles the area of the user's channel energy (to 60' radius). I don't know what kind of price point to give this, since there's not really any equivalent.

While you're inside a mindscape, barring certain circumstances, you're not aware of anything done to your body. Would you persist in the mindscape if your unconscious body were killed? Obviously you die once you leave said mindscape in that circumstance, but performing actions beyond your death has consequences to considre.

The question is whether you can be observed but have your attack be stealthed through the combination of HiPS and snipe.

If a character with HiPS is viewed as a non-hostile, could they use a Stealth check to snipe without being noticed as having attacked?

Other than liches and NPCs with class levels, what monsters have animate dead as a spell-like ability?

I have a potential villain to throw against the party, a level 7 halfling rogue against a level 7 party. The NPC has +30 Stealth modifier & expert sniper feat, which in an urban environment they'll be spoiled for cover options. Even while attacking, the party will have a lot of trouble even having a clue where the attack's coming from, & I'm not even being super focused toward the build's tactic. Should I be worried about this encounter being too tough on the party, and if so, what suggestions do you have?

The spell prevents AoOs because no one can tell what you're doing, but it doesn't prevent anyone from knowing what you're doing?

It's not the same source though. They are two separate feats owned by two separate people. Two people can perform aid another actions. What matters is the bonus type, and circumstance bonuses stack.

It's fascinating to see the mirror scrying effect survive such a long time. The Irrisen mirror sight spell is nearly identical in effect to the Mirror Sight feat Monte Cook wrote back in '01 (and used again in other products, like Arcana Evolved).

I checked with her, and from the sounds of it, this was not in an official Paizo room; it was evidently one of the free-for-all tables and she just got horrific luck.

I'll see my wife late tonight and find out if she retained any paperwork from the event. There actually is a chance this DM didn't pose as a representative. I wasn't there and I don't know how Paizo separates itself from casual tables, while she isn't experienced with con-gaming and thus wouldn't be familiar with the differences. Hell, *I* needed three conventions before I could differentiate worth a damn.

The character had other rules-issues going on.

Otherwise, that's actually a good question. It was something she had to sign up for in one of the rooms, but she's not used to con-gaming and so didn't pay attention to whether it was a Paizo-sponsored table or some basement-dweller having a power trip.

My wife went to PAX West, followed by other travel plans, and returned home recently. I didn't attend, so I'm hearing about this now. She enjoyed herself and loved the convention, so don't think this marred her enjoyment on the whole. She tried out one of the Pathfinder one-shot tables, and evidently one of the first things asked as she was signing up was whether she was signing up for her boyfriend. While she was the only woman in the room at the time, that's not a good sign.

The pregenerated 1st level rogue she was handed was heavily modified - no weapons except flasks, race switched to halfling, only knew Common while everyone else in the party only knew Elven (RP was thus difficult for her). At one point she threw a flask, rolled a 19, and was told she hit herself with the weapon. Enemies repeatedly saw through her +11 Stealth (no rolling) and bee-lined to attack her character, provoking AoOs from flanking PCs to get to her. There was no stated story reason for the aggro. No PC got below half HP through the entire adventure, except her due to the focus fire - survival was only because the players recognized what was going on and the cleric spent most (all?) of their time healing.

I'm certain that's not all that happened, but just this bit is frustrating to hear about. I am disappointed that Paizo had such a DM representing their company at PAX, and I can only hope my wife's survey/review made it through the process.

You cast Secluded Grimoire, then travel to the Outer Planes. Is your book presumably inaccessible?

Is the Night Hag presumably a creature that leaves for the Material Plane? Because it's ability to go ethereal shouldn't work in the Outer Planes where there isn't an Ethereal.

The spell says that you need a clear idea, and gives a guideline for how clear of an idea you have, explicitly citing scrying as a method and without any other language hinting otherwise. Saying that you can't teleport with the information given by a scry spell is not a change, but a 'clarification', comes off as disingenuous. A less favorable interpretation would view it as condescending, implying that those who have run it as written have either failed at reading comprehension or are rules-lawyering munchkins.

Is "we feel that what is known colloquially as 'scry and fry' is not a favorable outcome, and advise the following change" somehow not an option? Even just calling it errata would be acceptable.

How does this look as a final result?

Level 10 Archer
HP 79
AC 27
Saves +7/+15/+7
Base DPR = 124.81
Haste = +24.96

Typo on weapon(s)
The reason for the base misfire of zero is because Giff weapons technology is over-engineered for safety at the expense of accuracy and subtlety. It was tempting to add a low-end thunderstone effect for the explosive sound, but the the added complexity doesn't feel worth it.

Early Two-Handed Firearm
Weapon Name Portable Bombard
Cost 400 gp
Damage (M) 3d8/x4
Range Increment 50 ft.
Misfire 0
Type B & P
Weight 80 lbs.
Ammunition 5gp & 10lbs per bombard stone, 20gp per dose of gun cotton
Special Wildly imprecise, targeting AC rather than touch AC.

Early One-Handed Firearm
Weapon Name Giff Snuffbox
Cost 75 gp
Damage (M) 1d10/x4
Range Increment 30 ft.
Misfire 0
Capacity 4
Type B & P
Weight 8 lbs.
Ammunition 10gp per paper cartridge
Special Wildly imprecise, targeting AC rather than touch AC.

Giff

The Giff are large humanoids with thick skin, enormous mouths, and tiny ears. Their faces look similarly to hippos or the goddess Tuart. Giff have poor hearing and loud voices. They delight in noise levels that are oppressive or even painful to races with more sensitive auditory nerves.

The Giff language is loud, and the first instinct of a Giff who has not been understood is to simply repeat themselves even louder. The subtleties of spellcasting requiring careful intonations are largely lost upon the Giff, but their scholars fair better in other fields on endeavor such as alchemy and artifice. The alchemists of the Giff gleefully experiment with explosive agents such as alchemist's fire and gun cotton that give pause even to Gnomes.

The skin of a Giff is thick and insensitive, and it is layered over a padded layer of protective fat. Giff simply do not mind repeated punctures with a tattooing needle, and it is quite common for a Giff to acquire quite elaborate tattoos on much of their body. Between this resilience and their poor hearing, Giff find nearby explosions to be amusing rather than terrifying as most other races do.

Giff are quite heavy, but are fairly buoyant, allowing them to float effortlessly in water even while asleep. Many Giff elect to sleep in a pool of water rather than a bed. The homelands of the Giff are marshy and overgrown. Many of the alchemical preparations that Giff use to acclimatize themselves to other lands are mixed with alcohol, which the Giff then drink in large quantities.

The mouths of a Giff are very large, and a Giff can eat a tremendous amount in a single bite. Giff are omnivorous and can eat almost anything. In Giff culture it is considered impolite to refuse to eat something offered, and Giff can generally be convinced to eat whatever other races happen to claim is food.

Away from the Giff homeland, most Giff that are encountered will be part of a military company. These corporations allow themselves to be paid as mercenaries or simply create their own adventure by invading places with lootable goods. Giff care somewhat for gold and silver, but are more interested in steel and still more interested in chemical agents. Giff military companies are willing to travel far and fight long odds to get their hands on valuable plant products that can be used to make dyes, medicines, spices, and explosives by their alchemists.

The most feared Giff weapon is the portable bombard. Too heavy for all but the strongest Human to even lift, it is essentially a bell which is filled with gun cotton and a catapult stone. The back of the bell is then struck with a hammer, causing the gun cotton to explode and the stone to fly out and wreak havoc. Creatures less resistant to sonic effects than a Giff would be well advised to stand far back when this weapon is used.

Racial Traits

Race Aging Effects
Starting Age 16 years
Middle Age 30 years
Old Age 45 years
Venerable Age 60 years
Maximum Age 60+2d20 years

Random Height & Weight
Base Height 6 ft. 4 in.
Base Weight 270 lbs.
Modifier 2d6
Weight Modifer x7 lbs.

Early Two-Handed Firearm
Weapon Name Portable Bombard
Cost 400 gp
Damage (M) 2d8/x4
Range Increment 50 ft.
Misfire 0
Type B & P
Weight 80 lbs.
Ammunition 5gp & 10 lb per bombard stone, 10gp per dose of gun cotton

Favored Class Bonuses
Alchemist +½ to bomb damage
Gunslinger Add +⅓ on critical hit confirmation rolls made with firearms (maximum bonus of +5). This bonus does not stack with Critical Focus.
Fighter Add +1 to the fighter's CMD when resisting a disarm or bullrush.

Why can't you create it with all of its components? Axes have multiple components (wooden handle, metal blade, etc), for example.

Why do you need the feats? The spell says you only need to make the associated skill DC.

Is it legal?

Presume you have ranks in Craft (mechanical) and are a 10th level wizard with Skill Focus. Cast Major Creation and make the skill check (likely +24). And now you can fairly reliably make a Death Ray for use in an upcoming fight.

I understand that it's a psychological craving rather than a physiological requisite. But they show discretion & patience when keeping it buried to 'ripen' before eating, and when choosing the flesh of one race other another. So it's not so limiting that they can't be picky. That the core writeup and other books indicates that they eat fresh only when hungry enough indicates gradations to their hunger. On a practical level, this is functionally the same as regular need for food, only instead of starving to death they become more focused on eating.

One could argue that ghouls' hunger, with a managed diet, isn't any more pronounced than a human's. The supposed severity can seem worse given the social taboo that the ghoul was undoubtedly raised in. Social isolation and lack of support networks makes access unreliable, so long periods of time without eating would be common, easily on par with starvation scenarios for mortals. That they won't die nor suffer actual physical debilitation means these famine periods can go longer and possibly deeper than what a human is physically able to experience.

Weirdo's reference to Blood of Night is what I was looking for. Thanks :)

It's established that they have a craving for humanoid flesh. What isn't established is how much they need to 'comfortably' subsist. How long can a ghoul go with just a single corpse before they need to refill their larder?

Can you cast Summon Monster V to summon 1d4+1 crocodiles, then cast Alter Summon Monster to turn each one into a Kyton?

Sorry to intrude James, but on Telekinesis:

1) it uses the wizard's Int bonus to hit, which does a lot for overcoming the poor BAB
2) GMW on the weapons is usually +3 th/dmg or better. They are ammo, so you can do a bundle with one spell.
3) that's 60d6+180 damage potential for a 5th level spell (avg 400 pts). If half of them hit, that's 30d6 +90, or 200 damage. Not bad for a level 5 and level 3 slot.
4) An Item spell on your ammo takes care of all encumbrance issues.
5) the 4d6 per item is from using Colossal Javelins. Which are still ammunition.

As JJ noted, it's pure cheese.

In order to avoid derailing, I want to point this out. It's not pure cheese, and I find the implication that it deserves nerfing for the above reasons to be poorly thought out.

1] Yes, it uses the Wizard's Intelligence, but it's still using a BAB at half and has none of the weapon feats that an equivalent fighter is throwing down. A 15th level wizard is throwing down maybe +17.

2] Let's assume 'antics' for a +1 CL, and now we have a +4 from GMW. Javelins are not ammo, so we need to be using arrows, which lowers our damage to 3d6. If you notice, we're working at a +21 attack bonus, easily surpassed by the local archers.

3] I have no idea where you're getting the 180 number, because that's implying a [u]+12[/u](?!) damage bonus per arrow. A realistic damage potential is 45d6+60 (202 avg), with an average of 111 damage against a typical CR 15 monster's AC (half its HP).

4] We're already at a 5th level and 3rd level spell slot thrown into this combo. Throwing another 3rd level spell, especially if we're using familiars to ready them instead of doing something else, only reduces the efficiency. Efficiency is the key here, because at a certain point, it's more efficient to just throw

5] The javelin not being ammunition has been covered, so I was presuming bolts. If someone manages to find a workaround to get ammo a size category larger, then our average jumps to 140 damage.

Look at the final score here; our 15th level wizard of telekinesis is throwing down a damage that's comparable to archers in the DPR Olympics, except those guys are FIVE levels lower and have way more rounds of throwing down such attacks. Even if the AC was so terrible to permit a theoretical maximum of 255 average damage isn't all that mind-blowing at level 15 when you can throw down a suffocate, or have a draconic sorcerer's empowered fireball hit just 4 monsters.

If you look at lower levels, a level 9 is averaging about 65 damage with a single casting of one of their very few level 5 spells (and a GMW, and some gold for a porter to carry them around) against an equivalent monster. I'm not impressed there either, since that's about 50% greater than an empowered fireball which can hit an entire group of monsters.

It's like a poor man's disintegrate, statistically speaking. You just need a decent amount of preparation, additional magic to handle logistics, and does as well as a fighter...for a round.

Midnight_Angel wrote:

James Jacobs wrote:

That said... the explosive runes hack is lame and that spell needs errata as badly as telekinesis.

Huh? What's so wrong with Telekinesis? What did I miss?

Folks using telekinesis to do a bazillionty points of damage by launching dozens or hundreds of magic arrows is the classic loophole folks use.

Not the intent of the spell.

But you can't launch dozens of magic arrows. It's explicitly limited to a maximum of 15 using the violent thrust option, both in 3.5 and in Pathfinder.

Another handy trick with wizards and this spell. Use the Multimorph discovery to switch out the feat for the spell as needed.

Seems a bit much to charge two extra spell levels and +23.500gp to have your next attack against an undead (or similar restrictions) automatically hit.

It's an established option that limited wish can grant a creature the ability to automatically hit on their next attack. Can you wish to automatically succeed on the creature's next saving throw? Can you wish for the next attack on that creature to automatically miss?

Is it possible to wish for the auto-hit on a different trigger; such as on the creature's second attack, or next against against an undead, or the next attack after a certain trigger (when I say 'take that!')?

Does a rogue who walks on his hands gain a bonus to Stealth? For those who think it's too good for the price, the only way I can see that happening is if the tiny-range silence is worth more than 5k on its own.

I had a bunch of trouble remembering that poisons had been altered in descriptive text, especially since the effects of mine are still possible.

This is not a problem with time stop, but with the combat resolution taking too long.

Feral Heart

They use a different dash for the weight, and if it's negligible you don't use 'lbs.' Are creatures bull-rushed before or after the growth (since you can grow to be adjacent), and does the effect provoke an AoO? Will an Int 4 character go into a coma when they use the item?

It's very rare, possibly even discouraged, for magic items to have their effects scale with the wearer; and you might do better presuming a level 9 user for that reason. I disagree with the non-scaling thing for many items, but wishes, fishes, you know the drill.

Bah, forgot those were notes for a different format I was making it for (took a bit to even add the italics in BBCode), which is a bit different from Paizo's. Granted, I never put full work into it for editing because I already knew the price would be viewed as too little; and the accepted value would likely be in lesser artifact realm. Didn't think it was that similar to the Apparatus of the Crap for it to break the general rule; since its purpose and effects are drastically different, but seemed an ideal use for formatting.

I didn't think it necessary to answer the question for the levers. Pulling one is a full-round action, not an attack action, and there isn't debate as to whether iteratives apply to using any other full-round action.

I'm posting mine now because I'm unlikely to even remember this thread once the competition starts. I was tempted to submit my Assault Apparatus as well; but the philosophy behind the price is unlikely to be accepted.

Say you're making a magic item using uncommon rules, such as Ship Combat or Boons. Would you just add a line of (see Fast-Play Ship Combat) after the effect that uses language from the rule?

You're describing a world that has never had legends before the players entered the scene, and 'spectacular' doesn't exist in the dictionary until they do something that deserve it. This implies very self-centered bards, because the only tales they can tell are about themselves. I guess slaying dragons, zounds of bandits, dark necromancers, and the like just never happened before? You know, all the stuff the PCs would be doing in a non-mythic game, unless adding the <mythic> tag to your notes somehow makes it more special.

What's the difference between a warrior and a fighter, despite both being +1 BAB/level and requiring the same amount of experience to level? The Fighter is a PC class, which is also by definition more special than an NPC class.

I and many others have stated what is actually desired out of the Mythic rules, and that is something more evocative than a "slaying marginally more enemies or surviving some fraction more damage."

Here's another option if raw power is all you care about, which doesn't need an entire book; just set the XP for the fast track, give high-fantasy wealth (double WBL), use epic fantasy point-buy. Everyone else in the world can be stuck with the low fantasy point-buy, wealth, and slow experience.

Mythic rules enable those of us who aren't Ayn Rand fans to still have the Chosen One story, and now support it by actually being special and feeling like big badasses because our Fighter 10/Mythic 5 can and does outshine every Warrior and Fighter 10 on the planet by a wide margin.

But he's not outshining any of the other Fighter 10/Mythic 5 characters on the planet. The world is just as bent and PC-relativistic by denying Mythic tiers to only the players, which brings us to the same kind of tactics I suggested; make PC classes rare/special/unique, make NPCs lower level, etc. The difference is less homework and that's about it, unless Mythic fulfills a role of more than raw numeric power upgrades.

It puts you in an uncomfortable situation when you're running high-level games with humanoid enemies. If tenth level characters are special, where do you pull your enemies from? How much do you have to plan out each combat encounter in advance so it doesn't strain belief? Do you really want to include plot devices to explain mooks in your fights?

The mythic rules provide something of an answer to that. You don't need to be 20th level to be the chosen ones. It says you're the chosen ones right on your character sheets.

What's wrong with just writing "chosen one" on your background and in the plot? If you're a cut above any other humanoid, that's represented by being higher level. Adding tiers of Mythic doesn't make them any more unique than just adding another level or two to them, if raw power upgrade is what you're wanting. Another way to make NPCs inherently less than PCs is to just make the PC classes special; wizards are quite the force in a world of adepts, as are rogues amongst experts.

Nothing you're stating here as a goal/advantage isn't fulfilled by just adjusting the expectations of your campaign/setting.

I just see it as a simple fact. Mythic is a tone. Rules can certainly support the tone of your game, but the GM and players set the tone.

Dropping new rules into an existing game doesn't and, in my opinion, shouldn't be expected to, radically change the tone of that game.

Then you have no reason to buy the Mythic rules, if you can't expect them to change or support a mythic tone, that's why it's a bad thing. I never said every permutation needed to be covered, but there needs to be guidelines; when all of the abilities are boring number boosters, then you've set a precedent that anything new fits that paradigm of boring numbers. If all of the actual mythic activities fall under pure Mother-May-I without even benchmarks to go off of, then there is no reason to get the supplement.

Do you buy the Rifts Main Book for your Amber campaign and expect people to not see it turn into Amber w/Plasma Guns?

Will adding mythic tiers make your game Mythic? Nope.

You do realize that's a bad thing?

So far, I don't see how the mythic ruleset presented actually acts a toolset; any more than being told "your hero points refreshed each day instead of each level." Being given a list of +3s here, double strikes there, doesn't tell you when it's appropriate to be able to lift a Boeing 747.

Yes, I can work it out myself, but that calls to question the entire point of getting the Mythic rules; if I have to house-rule in everything mythic that isn't a bigger Power Attack.

I mean, I want to see someone more skilled come up with a set of rules for super strength in a D&D game than what I've done; where you can throw a cow as a viable combat tactic without breaking the game.

Alan_Beven wrote:

I agree with the OP. Paizo is great at creating fun "fluff" and this is sorely missing from this document. I hope that the full rulebook will fill the gap.

I honestly have no doubt it will.

Remember, the play test is literally just seeing if the rules are okay and what needs tweaking. This is entirely numbers work, seeing what works and what doesn't, what needs a buff or needs a nerf, what should be added or taken away, etc. Once the rules are all ironed out and fine-tuned, then they'll add in all the wonderful fluff that they do really well.

Rules are what we use to play the game, and if the rules don't support the fluff in cases like Mythic play, then you'll end up perilously close to 4E or those Final Fantasy spells where you nuke a planet in your cut scene...to deal some damage against the party.

A hopefully more lucid explanation of the concern is that the mythic rules don't feel any more mythic than adding another +1 to your character sheet and saying hero points are refreshing each day rather than each level. From the point-of-view of the characters, they're not going to look any more mythic unless you staple fluff onto them to describe their actions as being bigger and better, which is something you could've been doing with a level up to begin with.

Epic and mythic are both synonymous in expectation with a shift in paradigms in how your character's abilities interact with the setting. Slaying marginally more enemies or surviving some fraction more damage is neither dramatic nor is it 'mythic' unless you inflate the numbers to something obscene. Lifting wagons and buildings, stealing the colour of someone's eyes, cutting someone so deep that others who see the wound suffer stigmata-level sympathy wounds, scaring people so profoundly their kin are shaken regardless of distance; these are the kind of things that go beyond 'get two actions this round' or 'you succeed at your action 15% more often'.

Merge it with a mechanical ability that's appropriate, like immunity to disease or resistance to negative levels or something.

Notice that they don't have rules for people getting the bends? It'd be a needlessly nit-picky rule to include that only hurts game play.

1) I don't think you can change your orientation when you use teleport. It isn't a portal gun, just a moving from A to B. Now gate on the other hand...

2) I'm not a physicist but I'll take a crack at it anyway. I would say it does absorb the changes from the handful of kj from relative velocity. It's just that the subjects are so used to dealing with, and compensating for, that momentum that they don't perceive it as any big deal when they teleport.

I, however, am a physicist. There is NO difference between teleporting between planets to that of teleporting from ship to/from land; in regards to caring about momentum. Orientation is equally relative, especially on spherical planets, otherwise you're always landing off-balance. There is no advantage to this change. It creates ambiguity, inconsistency, and free range for Gygaxian jerk DMs.

Virgil wrote:

That rule is frankly bad. It opens a can of worms in regards to questions your players will very understandably want to know, which would be automatically ignored if you stuck with the more sensible effect of the subject automatically adjusting to the frame of reference of their destination and lose all comparative momentum. It's not even overpowered, because feather fall is a 1st level spell, and using something as potent as teleportation to evade falling damage will NOT harm balance.

What if you teleport in a different orientation, falling up? Why does it absorb the changes in orbital momentum, rotational momentum, and gravitational potential but not from the handful of kJ from relative velocity? Does interplanetary teleport automatically result in maximum falling damage? How does plane shift interact with this? Do you remain standing (or even take damage) if you enter or leave a ship through teleportation as you slide from the change?

...Magic.

So constructive, thanks. You're the best.

That rule is frankly bad. It opens a can of worms in regards to questions your players will very understandably want to know, which would be automatically ignored if you stuck with the more sensible effect of the subject automatically adjusting to the frame of reference of their destination and lose all comparative momentum. It's not even overpowered, because feather fall is a 1st level spell, and using something as potent as teleportation to evade falling damage will NOT harm balance.

What if you teleport in a different orientation, falling up? Why does it absorb the changes in orbital momentum, rotational momentum, and gravitational potential but not from the handful of kJ from relative velocity? Does interplanetary teleport automatically result in maximum falling damage? How does plane shift interact with this? Do you remain standing (or even take damage) if you enter or leave a ship through teleportation as you slide from the change?

When I run D&D, it's usually 2 or 3 rounds, give or take a round. During some of the major boss battles, they last anywhere from 8 to one time for 20.

The githyanki one being claimed is a little weird, personally, as they were written two years prior to being published/associated in D&D by George R.R. Martin in Dying of the Light; in which they were a psychic race of warriors enslaved by an alien race. This is without attribution to George, I might add, who didn't even know of them until sometime after the new millennium.

And illithid visually resemble star spawn by a fair bit, an established Lovecraftian race that are essentially man-sized version of Cthulhu, who itself would be best described as a mindflayer with wings.