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James Jacobs wrote:
Catalayne wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
Catalayne wrote:

There’s a pretty big Lore discrepancy in Dreamers of the Nameless Spires and I’m posting here in the hopes that James Jacobs can clear it up;

** spoiler omitted **

To answer those questions...

** spoiler omitted **

Thank you so much for a swift response! I think I might use Ruun as a sort of translator.
That's an interesting idea, but be wary of taking agency out of the PCs' hands. Consider giving the PCs a way to have first crack at translating, and if they fail their checks to succeed, let Ruun step in to help out, perhaps?

I think what I'm wary of is

:
cheapening or hand-waving the impact of Aqakaru's sacrifice. The Saumen Kar lore is something I'm very attached to and their language being wiped from existence is a very core part of that lore. For PCs to simply be able to understand a language that was wiped from existence by a God with checks isn't something I could justify narratively; especially as being so far North and separated from other societies would most likely make it a language isolate; so there would be no similar languages to compare it with.

I'll brainstorm some ideas of giving the players agency without clashing with the lore, and again I really do appreciate you responding and for writing this adventure, I'm stressing over this because it's a brilliant story and I want to do it justice and that's thanks to you and the other writers on the AP.


James Jacobs wrote:
Catalayne wrote:

There’s a pretty big Lore discrepancy in Dreamers of the Nameless Spires and I’m posting here in the hopes that James Jacobs can clear it up;

** spoiler omitted **

To answer those questions...

** spoiler omitted **

Thank you so much for a swift response! I think I might use Ruun as a sort of translator.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

There’s a pretty big Lore discrepancy in Dreamers of the Nameless Spires and I’m posting here in the hopes that James Jacobs can clear it up;

:
According to the entry on Ainamuuren in Monsters of Myth, when Aqakaru sacrificed herself to seal Osoyo underground, the Saumen Kar had their language wiped from existence, bar a single phrase: Saumen Kar, meaning ‘Bound in Ice’ and what they then went on to call themselves.

However, in Book 3 of Gatewalkers the PCs travel to the settlement that was built on top of Osoyo’s prison /before/ Earthfall and before Aqakaru’s sacrifice, yet there is no evidence of the language and in fact the players are able to decipher murals and scrolls in the library; suggesting it is written in a language they have the capacity to understand and Winter’s Favoured continue to be referred to as the Saumen Kar, with not even a hint given about their true name or origin, even from Ruun who remembers Aqakaru.

The backmatter article on Ainamuuren goes so far as to say ‘But the Castrovelian elves underestimated the people known as saumen kar.’ describing an event before Earthfall, when they were not known as that, and had no reason to be, for they were not bound at this point.

Also, the Elder Things are said to address the players in Common, but what is considered Common at the North Pole?

So was the tale of their language being lost simply a fable or is there some kind of ‘Rosetta Stone’ that wasn’t affected that would enable the player characters to translate the scrolls and murals in the library? One of my players is playing a Linguist who’s particular interest is the preservation of languages at risk of dying out, so this is going to be a very important plot point at my table and I’m a little stumped.


3 people marked this as a favorite.
Nefreet wrote:
I would suggest using the [SPOILER] tag in the future ;-)

I'm really sorry, kinda new here, how do I do that?


I'm not sure if this is the right place to ask about this, but in Lost Omens: Legends, Hao Jin's entry doesn't line up with the timeline in Fists of the Ruby Phoenix. (Here be spoilers)

Spoiler:
According to Legends, when she arrives on Axis, she hopes to meet and collaborate with the axiomites, but is instead reprimanded and she then gives up her memories of creating Hao Jin's Tapestry and serves Axis for 300 years.

However, in the Ruby Phoenix path, she seems to visit Axis a lot earlier and she does befriend and work with an axiomite, Syndara, who helps her improve her skills of creating demiplanes. But according to Legends, she goes to Axis after her 'greatest creation' is already complete.

Also, Hao Jin and Syndara are said to have spent time on Axis together, sparring and creating a tournament there that other denizens of Axis participated in. Syndara lifts their training ground out of Axis and into his demiplane and we see she literally has a statue of her there, suggesting she was someone respected in Axis, which doesn't line up with Legends.

Obviously, mentioning Syndara would be a huge spoiler, but I just wonder if there's any way to edit her entry so the timeline and Axis' reaction to her makes sense.