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Thornborn's page

416 posts. Alias of KRNVR.


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Not that reason matters all that much, but it's always seemed reasonable to me that normal (critical multiplied) damage be done, and a life point (which does not further harm the target) be gained.

I think it's incorrect to seriously claim Unarmed Strikes are not Natural Attacks, when they are cited as counting as Natural Attacks for effects intended for Natural Attacks.

The multiattack cite is flawed, multiattack reduces a penalty on Secondary NAs, no such penalty exists on Unarmed Strikes.

My reading is PA works with Dragon Style, and that such was intended, because otherwise the far more economical phrasing 'primary natural attacks' could have been used, and it was not.

"Snake" wrote:
Yeah, I noticed Lucky is up next. Until further notice, Lucky will NEVER do anything in combat. No way am I gonna chance on getting him killed. I'd just feel too guilty. So you can just skip his turn permanently. :)

In your place, I'd quiz my GM on how clever and capable the critter is. Might could be Luck can fetch a potion from in your bag, saving you search time. He doesn't have to leave the bag, he can just pop up with the potion when you reach for it. Maybe he's clever enough to know whether you asked for a potion, an apple, or some cheese. Kind of a Heward's Handy Have-a-snack.


Snake: "Luck, gimme some cheese."

Luck: (Luck brings an apple to be grasped.)

S: "Cheese, Luck."

L: (Luck doesn't move, keeps holding apple ready to be grasped.)

S: (Taking the apple:) "You ate all the cheese, didn't you?"

L: (Hides in the bag.)

I seem to recall a 'dream messenger' or similar spell?

I know I recall poor Maplewing's heartbreak when the dreams of her father/mentor were out of the spell's range (same plane). But the game mechanics evade recall at the moment.

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It's a curious kind of reasoning that suggests that one point of nonlethal damage can do what two points of lethal damage cannot.

I'll be interpreting in favor of the utility of the feat to the tough characters.

I see two intents of the rule:

A) "it sucks to be turned to stone, let's imbed some solution", the gameplay motivation.


B) "prey entirely within the basilisk returns to a fleshy form", the gameworld-logic explanation for the blood-caused restoration to flesh.

I see nothing about the Dracolisk that changes B (which admittedly, I just made up), and similarly nothing that changes A.

If you choose to have the Dracolisk's blood not restore fleshiness, then perhaps the clever Dracolisk keeps a stash of basilisk blood handy, perhaps in triangular pink bottles.

Or course it all needs the people at the table to buy into it, but:

Continual Light/Flame/Darkness on an object at the bottom of a tube for a directional 'flash(light/dark)'

Firetrap in the same location with a sturdy tube.

Eversmoking Bottle to power machinery.

To show what I mean, the Ring Gates use the term 'put through', which might argue that unattended use will not work. There's also the 100-lb/day limit, which begs the question of what happens to the guy trying to put his 10-lb head through a gate after we've sent 19 5-lb metal ingots through. Asking where the 20th is, you see...

But if the table is in agreement, having the orbital-launch shuttle leave everyday PRECISELY on time as the one hundred pairs of ring gates under it all recharge at once, providing ten thousand pounds of high-pressure gas to the underside of the launch platform...

The ancient skull-shell of a beholder-lich?

A fleet of lava-boats, to float up as the surface sea runs down, with apocalyptic clouds of steam making fog and lava-lightning around the landing zone. Have some big elementals not joining the fighting, as they go about building levees at the edge of the hole (the underworld doesn't WANT to be flooded, it was just a way to float ships...). Your side caverns can be protected by having them slope up and make airlocks, or let their full or partial flooding be a part of the scenario.

If the levees get built/stay built, the underworld dries out mostly. Maybe breaking the levees is one way to strike back at the underworld. Perhaps, having fought the vanguard, the PCs can smash/protect the levees to soak/thwart the gathering main force?

Is it carved to resemble a barrel with an attached handle?

Doesn't that Witch have CLW on her spell list, anyway?

If they are both 'Faith' traits, you cannot have them at the same time.

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Maybe channel your best Clint Eastwood, get in the face of the nearest offender, and gravel-voice, "Any particular reason we're talking about my nards?", with implied or rolled Intimidate check.

Essentially, try to establish that while the players might not take the NPCs seriously, the NPCs take themselves seriously, and the PCs either will, or the NPCs will take THAT seriously.

When that message has been delivered, consider trying to burn off the pressure... "Three minutes for nut jokes, GO!"

It's perhaps worth noting that this thread disappeared while I was reading it, somewhere between page 1 and 2, though it's back now.

I'm on record supporting mods, but when there's a glitch in the matrix, one tends to suspect the presence of Agents. That somebody is in thread-locking, actually thread-hiding, mode suggests that there's heat on both sides of the issue.

Maybe Ashiel can be banned, and that solves one side, for some value of 'solve'. But if there was a problem on the other side, that too needs examination.

I neither request nor expect transparency in the decisions and operation of a corporate house organ. I hope simple faith in the people involved will be well-founded.

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NobodysHome wrote:
Er... not to be dim, but... why would arrows be any better than daggers? (Other than getting in a bludgeoning weapon for skeletons, I assume...)

Cheap metals? Nearly cheap enough to leave them as signature items. "Who was that masked midget?" "I don't know, but she left this adamantine arrowhead embedded in the Alcalde..."

First, assume a perfectly spherical haversack...

Seems to me the wizard swung in through the proscenium to claim the prize you'd unearthed. You can blame him for that.

He is probably too shallow-souled to have given any thought to the ring's emotional value to your character. You can't blame him for that. You can pity him.

Your GM ought not have PCs that teleport from scene to scene, but it can be very handy when all the PCs are needed for the planned battle, and that's a sacrifice of logic to fun, so please be understanding that the GM may not have even thought about this.

The wizard has a ring of regeneration, now. He really doesn't need as much care and effort as the others. Triage puts regenerators last, right?

BlackPickle wrote:

okay few good ideas there im mentioning them to my Gm to see what he says the oil & waxed canvas might help with the less severe storms with the dust etc

would it help with more killer storms that do the real damage ?

do you know what that second level spell is & what book it is in ?

Carry Companion is the spell. I've got a witch NPC with a collection of hummeled critters. :)

It's from "Pathfinder Player Companion: Knights of the Inner Sea"

I don't know of any 'ant survives the sandstorm' potion. But there's a shield that will pokeball an animal ally. There's a 2nd-level spell that will do the same. If you're not able to get magic, an oilskin (oiled and waxed tight-weave canvas) tarp carefully wrapped around the ant should trap enough air to ride out a storm.

Or pitch your GM on a new magic item, 'Hourglass Antfarm', which is the 2nd-level spell-in-a-can, touch attack to use it on an insect, and they go into the hourglass, which starts timing, and two hours later, they're freed. You have to invert the glass and let the sand run through again, maybe, before you can use it again.

There's a whole other level of discussion on how a giant insect breathes, which may not be germain to any particular campaign. I would expect the spiracles need to get deeper, and after deeper, need to get active, probably in synergy with nearby muscles tension, so moving and breathing are the same action. That might lead to a visible/protectible 'nostril' at each joint... but that's all wild speculation.

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Latest houserule is "When the campaign is rolling for stats, at 2nd level 2 point-buy pts are given to each character, with an additional 1 pt given each lever thereafter. These are spent as if used at creation, before adjustments for race and level."

This lets a very unlucky roller dig himself out of a bad roll, while not funding munchkinery until much later levels, when it's not _so_ bad.

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So there was an existing warrant? So they could have gone to the guy's home, and got him. Instead, during their stopping of people for no good reason, they happened upon him. And, being used to stopping people for no good reason, and thinking they had no exposure to cover, they arrested the guy because that's what you do when there is a warrant. And during that arrest, found evidence of further crime.

If all that's true, I'd have to say, this guy does not get to skate on the technicality.

I would ALSO have to say, were I in the chair that says such things, that stopping random people needs to stop.

Frogsplosion wrote:
The Mortonator wrote:
Well, it is a terribad feat for everyone else sitting around while you balls around with it. Not even the munchkin in me would take it just cause it would make the game worse.
our gm imposed a 30 second time limit to do the math portion of the feat or the spell fails. Our wizard has still only ever failed once.

The one local campaign where Sacred Geometry was used, we found the working of the dice into the desired numbers to be trivial and swift.

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I did say I'd go with the earlier ruling... But the grognard geek in me wants to point out that the mold was first 'discovered' in a set of physics that had no time unit smaller than one minute. To assume that it can instantly chill what was described as happening in a minute is perhaps losing sight of the historical source of the mold as a concept.

I still want my lava-boats, though. :)

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For the sake of playability*, I'd like to present an alternate interpretation of the encounter with a pool of lava. Assuming a pool large enough and deep enough that we need only consider the mold's effects, and taking the ruling in Avoron's post where the mold makes an island...

The island begins to sink. Lava laps around the edges, enters the field of the mold, and is chilled to solidity, forming a lip of stone at the edge of the island. If not yet a buoyant unit, the island sinks further, the lip chills again, and again, until the island is a boat. The traditional bubbling of the lava wobbles things a bit, the lip builds a bit more, and we can either take on cargo/ballast/crew (slowly) or chuck it out to adjust our waterline.

Aside from propulsion, we're set to sail the Lava Sea. With more islands, we might build a catamaran. Perhaps powered by a heat exchange engine.

*Not in the 'every party should have three of these' sense, but in the 'SOME party should do this at least once', sense.

Petit Tom (could perform "She was from Erelhei-Cinlu")
Journey Cash (You can always count on Cash!)

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Orcs are proficient in tORCh...?

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Lorewalker wrote:

So your argument is... "I play this way at home, so that means its the rule for everyone"?

That is NOT how things work. The rule IS the rule. The GM can CHANGE the rule. But that doesn't...

No, my argument is "The rule for everyone is 'we are here to have fun' and 'do not be a dick'."

So if a guy comes to the table wanting to fight with torches and ignite them with a cantrip, we look for a path toward 'yes', rather than a position from which to shout 'no'.

It's obvious to all of us at the table, mages have a way to light their cigarettes. So any other reading seems willfully uncharitable. We'd be surprised at the desire to limit the new guy's cool idea. We'd rather cool than optimized.

But let's say this is all just the learned caution of the lifeguard, no running near the pool, no towels left out near paths. I DO agree, there are redoubts from which you can shout 'no'. We're just playing over here, instead.

If the OP is still listening, put tindertwigs on your torches, and keep them in scabbards lined with whatever's rough enough to scratch the twig when they are drawn.

Martin Weil wrote:
Thornborn wrote:

they publish because we pay by the word.

Presti could light, until Spark

Actually, Presti couldn't, even before Spark.

How do you justify allowing its use for anything more than cleaning clothes and changing colors and flavors?

Not to mention, as someone else pointed out, how do you justify allowing it to light torches but not flasks of oil? And, indeed, if it can light torches, does that mean that a torch lighted in that fashion cannot do any damage either?

I don't have to justify it to people who game with me. They either rode along through the history of cantrips ("Firefinger", would be the topical citation, but cantrips then were 4-to-a-lvl-1-slot, so it actually did damage) or they just respect reason. We aren't trying to earn or defend stars, though.

There's a real-world tool with a spring handle and a bit of flint rubbing on a striker-file, and so we don't imagine the two-handed flint-and-steel as the only way to light a thing. And the leap from that spring-flint tool (which can do no damage) to letting Presti do the same is not burdensome to us.

Presti inherited all the homeless cantrip functions because we like for our old stories to still be possible, regardless of ruling-of-the-month and nerf-this-so-we-can-sell-it-again.

We let it light things that are ready to light, at no range, while Spark has a range. And no, we don't interpret 'this cantrip does no damage' to mean 'no damage can result from any application of this cantrip, plus fuel, plus standard action, plus attack roll...'.

Again, we don't need to be strictly canonical. We're here to have fun, and we've found we have more fun when we don't engage in that kind of legalistics.

We also let illusions provide flank and rough ground.

they publish because we pay by the word.

Presti could light, until Spark

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as stone is removed, to sculpt a statue
so possibilities removed, to sculpt a system
the sculptor, is praised for the beauty
the writer, is paid by the word
which is most likely, to carve too deep?

Of course a magician can light a purpose-built flame-dependant object. To mirror an earlier post, if anyone can do it with flint and steel, why deny it to the mage? Because a later text includes a stronger argument? What about earlier texts that include pipes lit with the first draw on them, or candlewicks whispered white with wyrd words?

No, the evidence is there, it's possible. The question is, cantrip or spell? And if it's one step up from flint-and-steel, that's a cantrip, and presti is the catch-all.

I like the encounter.

Declare the behavior of the gate as follows:

Makes a tone on activation of a glyph. (Lights a glyph?)
Opens gate when three glyphs active (perhaps to bring in guards).
When gate closes, three tones are played in sequence.

So the parrot, watching (often?) people who know the combination go through, has got used to the correct three glyphs and the correct song.

What's significant about this set of behaviors is that someone using the gate never hears that the gate plays the 'shutdown song', and never hears the parrot(s?) mocking the song.

Now here come these goobers, making strange ugly song, and calling strange ugly people, and bringing chaos and nonsense. What's a bird to do?

Well, besides singing the right song, maybe the bird lands on the first glyph while singing that note?

The Ghost Who Walks wore a ring that left a skull tattoo.

Arcane Mark can be invisible, it doesn't have to betray he caster's secrets.

You can fluff the spell as sort of magically reaching to learn where the target will be. After all, if it (mechanically) empowers another attack, and that's as intended (and it's been said, it IS as intended), then letting the fluff catch up to the mechanics and intent needn't smell too much like cheese.

Isn't there a Cleric Domain that lets you use an action to give an action? Sounds like the Dancer to me.

The Will'o'Whip is the spirit of a Will o'Wisp bound to a masterwork bullwhip by a process similar to Magic Jar. Retaining the native electrical attack of the Wisp, the Whip can be a superior weapon, except it literally has a mind of its own. Desiring to feed on the life essence of fallen enemies, the Whip can usually be relied upon to use its electric attack whenever wielded in battle, but once a foe has fallen, a hungry Whip will insist upon feeding on that fallen foe, a process of some long minutes. Lacking languagable parts, the Whip has only one way to communicate its displeasure, and it will electrically damage its wielder, increasing such damage until the Whip has a victim on which to feed.

Thus it is that Whips are sometimes found with their victims, either their first in that battle (the wielder having left it to feed), or their second (the wielder having left, it to feed).

substance: shadow

"I'm afraid you were mistaken. It doesn't do that. You can swap it next time you rest. What do you do this round? The rest of the table's waiting."

A folding boat is also a shelter/shade, hard cover, perhaps the furnishing you put in front of a door you want kept closed...

I once gave a party a Xeno's Arrow. It moved half the distance to the target, the first round, then half the previous round's distance, toward the target, every round.

Jacob's Larder is a handheld toy/noisemaker, but if a leaf or similar object is placed under its ribbons, and the toy worked, the leaf disappears, until it is specifically looked for, and the toy worked. Herbs stored in a Jacob's Larder emerge as fresh as when they were stored.

A Looselace (usually found in pairs, but read on), threaded into a boot (or other laced garment), drawn tight, and tied once, will soon untie itself, and let the boot flop open, appearing about to fall off. But, the looselace's magic will keep the footwear in place. The wearer of the looselaced boots can remove them at will, and step into them and find them immediately as secure as before. Looselaces are banned in Bearkshire, after some wag seeded several in a dancehall dressingroom.

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The Rattlerent: In the rare occasion when an entire corpse of a sentient undead is consumed by snails, and only snails, and those snails are denied other food, until they, too, pass from the state of life, the hunger of the snails, and the malice and cunning of the sentience might form, from the snails, a Rattlerent. Such a creature is not well-equipped to cause harm, instead working to trick and lure onto other hazards. A rattlerent presents much as a crawling swarm, aware enough to present the emptied shells toward attackers as if shields, while the whole mass retreats, leading prey onto other hazards nearby. Clever rattlerents might wait at the top of a stairs, shells raised as if pebbled stone, hoping to collapse under the weight of an interloper...

Substance: spitoon contents

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Bioboygamer wrote:

I am currently a player in the campaign, but I was previously the GM.

...part of the issue is that the other players tend to not pay attention to tactics at all. Have you ever heard of a wizard who refused to use any of their 1st level spells? There's just such a large gap between Bill and the other players. Not necessarily a gap in experience, but more of a gap in effort.

Bill is in a no-win situation. He's shown up with a sweet bored-out Indian motorcycle, and your other players have a ten-speed, a mountain bike, and a Big Wheel.

It's fairer to everybody to say to Bill, "These other players are going to derp about building and playing. And they have that right. If I had four of you and one of them, that guy would be the odd man out. But in this set, you are. I don't know how to solve this problem, and keep everybody at the table."


Doesn't any underground manufactured space count as 'urban' or 'dungeon'? (RAW question)

Shouldn't even an urban Druidic Grove count as 'forest'? (RAI question)

(And both rhetorical)

I know that common sense is far from the last word in Rules Court, so I know that this isn't going to change anyone's mind about what anything ELSE means.

But if a human with no natural weapons, and thus no natural weapon attacks, can use a method to gain two claw natural weapons, which then go on the human's two hands-and-arms 'limbs', and GRANT two natural weapon attacks...

And a human can gain two more limbs which are declared to give no more attacks (remember, those first two limbs the human was born with also granted no more attacks)...

Then it seems to me another trip to the 'gain claws on two upper limbs' method would grant two more natural weapons attacks.

If Vestigial Limb said, 'this limb cannot attack', that might be clearer than 'this limb does not grant extra attacks', because one might read the scenario I outline above as Vestigial Limb not granting any extra attacks, but rather the claw-source method granting those attacks.

If as a GM you're not comfy with a four-armed four-clawed slashing NPCeeple eater, well, disallow it. If as a player your GM isn't comfy with this, don't do it.

The rules are thousands of pages. Torture them long enough, they'll admit to anything. But 'reasonable' is only one word.

It's magic. It affects everything and everybody you're carrying at the time of casting, nothing you cannot envelop afterward, and nothing you put down.

You could shoot from inside an invisible tent. The tent stays invisible, you stay invisible inside it, anybody nearby gets a roll to see your arrow slit.

Invisibility is not a lice/tick/Xill egg detector. You can't 'not open' the trapped box by invisibility-ing the lid. You Would make the whole box and contents invisible to outside observers. Shroedinger's cat in a box made invisible after the cat was put in, cannot see outside the box, nothing has changed for him.

All old-school gamer opinion, above.

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Make something up.

The Flask of Regret

This clear flask radiates enchantment magic only when filled with the regrets of a person who died while in contact with it. When empty, there is nothing to show it as anything more than a normal, if perhaps finely-made, crystal tube such as might be used for perfumes or alchemies.

The regrets of a dying person are rendered by the magic of the flask into a sort of syrup, light or dark, thick or thin, and colored evocatively of the regret. Thus, a dark, blood-hued syrup might be formed from regretted untaken violent revenge, while a rose-hued syrup the thickness of tears might form for unrequited love.

A filled Flask of Regret cannot be unstoppered accidentally, nor can it be broken into bestowing the regret. However, the first person opening the flask, even if unaware of the enchantment or contents, will find themselves possessed of the memories of the deceased, on all matters related to the stored regret.

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Hey, you know who gets to make the call of what's cool to discuss here on this free forum run by a game company?

Not you.

Please do not interfere with staff as they operate this vehicle.

It's too bad if you were just about to cure cancer or solve terrorism. But if you're THAT GOOD at what you're doing, if your words are so important you have to oppose Liz doing her job, you need to go say them somewhere else. This is not the place for such thoughts.

It's just a game forum.

37. It turns out Fleshfester Fever is actually an anaphylactic reaction to a spore-borne fungal infestation. And that stuff we thought was soot on the ceilings? Um...

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Matthew Downie wrote:

Is it an OWLbear an OWL?

Is an owlbEAR an EAR?

A tORCh is an ORC weapon...

That is my understanding.

Local bard uses the cantrip to summon instruments that he then Rough and Ready into battle with, using some other trait/feat to auto-confirm crits by smashing the guitar over the badguy.

...which might not be what you intend, at all. :)

Is it possible the player is using the ACCELERATE word twice in one casting?

I think I recall it's not possible for the caster to use the same word twice, but I can see how a player might read things differently.

I'm not sure I'd rule against repeating the effect word, given the system is partly about layering effects.

Happy to see WOP in the wild.

The '15' puzzle dungeon, composed of sections on rails that can slide past each other. At some interval, changes occur, with distant grinding noises, near grinding noises, or Reflex saves vs Prone status, depending on whether the section moving is far, near, or the same as the section the party is in.

The 'gap' in the sections might be impassible, or it might be the actual way forward. If it is, it's surely trapped/inhabited/machinery...

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It's a Sleep spell. It has a sort of 'common law' precedent from back when Invisibility was forever and Haste aged your friends. From back before the concept of 'conditions'.

It was the one shot the one-hp mage had, and it had a better-than-average chance of overpowering the available enemy targets and hitting the player characters, and yes, it made all affected unaware, prone, disarmed, blind, and helpless. And it would take a whole minute to wake up a friend, or kill an enemy.

A lot has changed. But I don't think the Conditions scaffold that was added to my Temple of Elemental Evil is supposed to obscure the stained glass of Saint Evilmancer Slumbering the White Knights.

I see how nowadays Sleep's peanut butter has been spread thin, all the way to at-will Hexes. And you'd perhaps like to water it down.

But it always bothers me when the feats of the great heroes of old (sometimes, of yesterday) become impossible, because the rules change.

If it were a 'Dire Daze' spell, you could do as you like. But it's Sleep. Would you really have the tightrope-walker remain balanced during it? The foe on the stairs? The one climbing the wall? The rope ladder? You're driving well past the median on the road to Interpretation, you've taken a left turn onto Wannanerf.

Don't Crane Wing my Sleep spell.

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