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I would like tho throw myself into the "The Fighter has a decent point" camp.
Th Oracle wants to bring a Evil outsider into the group. An outsider that can commune each week with it's boss.
I for one would take issue with an evil spy in the party, I have to sleep with one eye open now just so the Oracle can have a pet? No thanks.
Not only can the Imp commune all about us, it can kill me as I sleep.
If it betrays the party or kills the fighter in her sleep, what is the Oracle going to do? say "Oops..... I guess you were right.... um, my bad...."?
Honestly I don't blame the fighter at all for how she is taking it.
I think everyone is getting caught up in the "Copyright" and "Legal" argument when no one from Paizo has said anything about it.
The Pathfinder Society campaign has rules.
Those rules are not in question. We all know them.
Paizo and Mike could say "to play PFS you must wear a trout on your head and use only blue dice" that is their right.
It has zero to due with what is legal in what country, if you want to play PFS, please follow the rules we have set out. It's that easy.
If people feel that the rule is too much, don't agree with it, think it sucks, etc. then you can use whatever photocopy you want in a home campaign. Lots of people do it, and I like to think Paizo still loves you even when a whole group shares one book and uses a ton of 3pp.
But for the PFS campaign there are rules. this is one of them.
We as PFS judges are not the police, we are not their mom's, what we are however are voulnters that agree to run the PFS campaign according to the rules Paizo and Mike have set out.
One of those rules has to due with people and what books/pdfs they use/have with them.
The argument that "It's a freakin game" or "Come on dick, we are here to make it more fun"
I have several players in my local group that do not find it fun to have their character die. should I ignore the rule that says it could happen?
I am sure others would have more fun if they could play a goblin PC without a boon, should I just let it slide as it "adds to the fun"?
Again, like it or not, there are rules in place. When we agree to judge PFS we agree to follow them.
Or it could be another underlying assumption that is flat out wrong.
The fact that all of us thought it worked one way does not make it correct, just look at "flury as TWF" to see that 95% of players (and about 50% of writers) can be totally wrong about how a rule works.
As someone who have bought several books just to use one thing from it I have no sympathy for this.
Players know the rule, it is up to them if they want to use any given rule. If they do, then they need to get the book.
When I GM I actually enforce the rule.
If you use some obscure thing, then have a copy with you.
My best advice is simply this "DO NOT PLAY A RAGE CHEMIST"
I know thats harsh, but think about this.
you take a -2 Int from Mutagen then a -2 damn close to every time you take dammage.
when you hit 0 Int your out.
God forbid you ever go to level 6 alch. at that point you are at -4 each time.
In order to make this work at all you need to invest HEAVY in Will save. At that point just take the feats you would have spent on will and make yourself better in combat.
Also remember as soon as your int drops below 11 you stop being able to use any extracts.
So really, this is just a BAD idea.
Rage Chem is just really, really bad.
Like worse then Titan mauler bad.
Can't we just be proactive and ban all threads with either "Monk" "Flurry of blows" or "AMF" in the title?
It would seem that would cut down about 90% of the crap on the boards.
Also on a personal note, Making it personal with regards to the designers is uncalled for.
If you don't like a product, don't buy it.
If you don't like how a company does thing, vote with your wallet.
But please don't come here and be a dick to those that put out a game that most of us really like.
While I fully agree with the above that MT is a total turd of a class, I have a slightly different take on it.
Yes, it's total crap.
Yes, you can still play it in PFS and have fun.
Are you going to be uber powerful? well no.
Do you need to be to contribute to your party? also no.
Bottom line is that PFS is not a campaign that requires high op, in fact, you can get by with a fun, not as great character just fine.
So play whats fun, seriously.
for the first 7 levels you are only rocking 2nd level spells. (this is assuming you went prepared)
But a spont caster is only useing 3rds at 7th, so really your only 1 spell level behind.
At 8th, you get dual 3rds, the spont is only just getting 4ths, so again your not that bad off.
so my advice is "Go for it"
So you do that arcane mark jank huh?
As long as the archers are doing rapid shot (+1 attack/-2 hit)
And the TWFs are well... fighting with two weapons (+1 attack/-2 hit)
then yep, I will also be useing my class feature to get..... (+1 attack/-2 hit). Only difference is I have to make a concentration check to do it, and they dont.
Short anwser is..... You don't
If ever you are unsure on how casting defensivly works, just find someone that plays a Magus, they WILL know the rules as they use them every round.
Currently I play a level 7 magus and have devoted a lot to making this check easier.
Sadly if you use your magus ability to get a bonus equal to your int mod and take the same penelty to hit, you will miss, a LOT.
Here is the breakdown for Sebatian, you can check out his sheet Here
My take was to make it automatic as soon as I could.
The DC to cast are as follows.
Cantrip DC 15
In order to do this and still have all the damage output I did the following.
Caster Level +6 (I splashed Unarmed fighter)
This gives me a +18, +19 when casting Arcane mark and Shocking grasp thanks to the trait "Precocious Spellcaster" (Take this)
Anyway thats how I did it, and this is a PFS character so it was played all the way from level 1.
Eric Brittain wrote:
And I understand that happened, and I really do thank those that did what they said they would do.
I don't think the complaints are about the cluster that was the muster.
It happens, it sucks, but Mike and co did a great job trying to get through it.
However having said that..
If you (the powers that be) know that the game is a challenge to get done with in 5 hours, and you also know some tables only are going to get 4ish hours, then you need to do something.
Don't let them win if they didnt finish, thats cool.
But killing the whole table due to missing the 5 hour mark when they only had 4? Thats just not right.
Again, everyone did a great job under the circumstances, and our GM did his best. but he was behind the 8 ball when he sat down, then addin several templated creatures that he had to convert?
So first off, great guide!! Thanks for writing it.
Second I have never built a Ninja before.
So my wife recently received a PFS boon to play a Kitsune.
She was intrested in doing a Kinsune Ninja, mostly as we have the Kitsune and she wants to play a Ninja :)
Anyway, I instantly thought of somehow getting SA with natural weapons, Kitsune get a bit naturaly.
Sadly I am just not seeing how this can work, is there an easy way to get claws without a 2 ranger dip? (Not that it would be that bad, but we would like to avoid multi)
Past that I was thinking TWF, but good lord is that a lot of feats.
How do I make the Kitsune Ninja different from the Human Ninja? (all I can manage is that the Human is WAY better, and while yes that is different, it's not really what we had in mind)
Lord Twitchiopolis wrote:
As you may have noticed the racial heritage/treesinger thread was started by me.
I mention this so you know that on a lot of this I am on your side.
however in anwser to the mini question there are 2 anwsers.
1. most of us have seen players use a d20 as how they represent a barbarian, personally I have adventured with a skittle sorcerer once. so really, what the mini looks like is not a huge deal. this is not WYSIWYG.
2. were it me, I would do this.
Jackass other player "Um, dude, I'm fairly sure that is not a katana, that looks more like a Kopesh"
Me "........ No, it's a katana"
JOP "Are you sure, when i studied ancient swords for 4 years there were no katanas that looked like that"
Me "look dude, its a katana" Turn to Judge.. "So anyway, you were saying?"
Not really adding anything to the discusion here however...
I will be the first to admit that as soon as these become legal, every character I have will buy a closet full of them.
Seriously, for 5k you can have an extra move every fight. thats like mini-pounce.
Do I think it's game breaking? not really.
Do I think it's game changing? oh my yes.
So here is a great story for you all.
My wife and I decided to drive to Western MI to play a game this last Sat (we live on the east side, about a 2 1/2 hour drive)
Anyway, the point being we did not really know anyone at our table.
Going in we really wanted to make a good impression on everyone, you know, make sure to RP well, not overshadow the rest of the group, fight as a team, the norm.
So we start in a level 5-9 game (playing 5-6 as we were all level 6)
Anyway the first combat is Vs 2 Annis Hags. seems like a tough combat for our group, they do a lot of damage, decent AC, loads of attacks, CR 6 each.
So this is where it went downhill......
You remember the "Not overshadow the group" part from above?
First round of combat the Pali provokes one of them and does some damage (not a lot).
My magus steps in and casts shocking grasp (intense, 6d6)...
Me: "I do 80 damage to it.... do you care how much is what type?"
Dm :"Wait..... You do how much?!?!?!"
For what its worth on her Init, my wife dropped the other one in a Create pit.
So thats how it went all night, all i rolled was crits, I could not lose. but really thats not the point.
So anyway, what are some of your "Wait...... What?!?!?" moments from GM's?
I know others have made the whole table go O_o..... in the past.
well either way,
I ma thinking a Human/Elf treesinger with a treant.
I am trying to decide how green faith acolyte would be good.
Honestly I am not sure WHAT to do with a treesinger.
send in Treant, Treant Smash.
druid sits back and buffs? summons? (I would rather not as it slows down play), goes in melee as a plant to? (past 4th that is), Shoots? realy kinda lost here.
Dear lord do druids have options.....
Yes, look for the 3.5 Book of Erotic Fantasy.
Do not look at the pictures, they are not well done.
It has all the rules you are after, prestige classes, spells, equipment....
I will say it is NOT a good book, it is NOT a helpful book at all (IMHO) and it is NOT a book I own or would ever want to use in a game.
but if your heart is set on this sort of thing, thats the book for you.
Right, I'll throw in my .02$ as well.
I think we can all (ok, all but one) agree that if you want it to do anything then the player has to see the die roll before deciding.
If you don't get to see the roll then this ability does nothing.
I am also in the boat of you use it on party members who roll a 2 on a save, the orc barbarian that just rolled a 20 to hit the party mage and any oter "Oh..... crap...." moment.
you give up a lot to get this, yes it's a great ability, but the cost is also great.
Yeah most of the time I would think the same thing, however a lot of the speaking Improved Familiars could use them with a good UMD.
Also I agree that as it is just a touch and a standard action iT SHOULD be free. And I assume it is free. however the rules don't seem to say that. In a home game I would just check with my GM, but, well, it isnt a home game.
I would also like to know the anwsers to all this.
And with that, I leave the thread.
As nothing is actually being achived here I can only hope it is locked before things get worse.
To the OP, were you being a bad guest? YES.
Please Pay for your share of the food we all ordered to eat.
Please do Not drop f-bombs around my kids
Please Don't help yourself to the fridge AFTER I asked you not to.
The point is that they are MY children in MY home.
If I ask you not to swear around them then you have 2 simple choices.
1. Don't swear around them.
2. Don't play in my home.
However in anwser to the OP.
You gamed 3 times in one year, you paid for food on none of those times.
It is not my job to track you down or remind you of a 5$ debt.
If you can't respect the group enough to toss in for pizza then thats a problem.
Honestly tho, the milk thing would have gotten you tossed from my home group.
if you ask to drink some milk and I say "sure, go for it" as I would, thats great, glad you enjoy the milk.
HOWEVER, if I ask you not to drink my milk for whatever reason, then you do it anyway? Please let me show you where to find the door.
most crazy (Read as Awesome)
Pathfinder Eberron campaign.
Our group (level 5) was on an airship attacked by harpys and it turns out a wyvern.
the wyvern was doing hit and run tactics and My Beguiler (yes 3.5 class converted) ran to the edge and jumped as the wyvern was passing under us.
The Acro check to jump was through the roof with exp retreat going.
As I had spent the exotic weapon prof on whip and had the trait prehensile whip, the GM gave me an attack roll to whip around the wyvern's tail.
Nat 20 later, I was ghost riding a wyvern.
The Whip was shocking so the GM invoked the rule of cool and let me do my 1d6 elec to it each round I could manage to hold on and not die.
Sadly in the end the wyvern did get away (I did last 6 rounds tho) durring that time a buddy with featherfall had thrown himself off the airship as well so he could cast it when he got close enough thus saving us both.
While the wyvern did get away, and I did lose my whip (still wraped around the tail) it will go down in the history of our table as 24 karat, solid gold awesome.
I'll throw in my $.02 here.
I am 100% with Steve.
I only buy print products.
Call me "old school" but I still fondly flip through my 2nd ed spelljammer books.
I love going to the bookshelf and leafing through something I had forgotten I had.
At least for me, it is easier to find print products then try to remember what folder I put the file in, then try to remember what the thing is called.
I always seem to think..... "I need a hippo person..... crap, i think its the red book with the flying squid on the cover"
Add to that the feeling of actual value I have with a print book.
Yes I know that the cost of art, writing, dev, all that stuff goes into a PDF. But when I spend money I want something "Real"
Again, just my oppinion, but I know in my local area I am far from alone in this feeling.
W. Kristoph Nolen wrote:
And I really appreciate that.
Seriously, thank you.
Now I will give a bit of feedback as a new to PFS player.
Please excuse if this comes off as a tad blunt.
Trying to play this game should not be this f*!#ing hard.
I can easily see a new to Pathfinder player getting turned off by the grey areas of the rules. But more then that, I can see getting turned off be the process of trying to find out how it actually works.
And here I go sounding snarky myself....
The tone of some posts on this forum would turn off a new player. Hell I have been playing since beta and it turns me off.
For an example look at the thread on wrist sheaths and scrolls.
I think we all need to remember that new people come here looking for help and advice.
Honestly had I come to these boards before I started Pathfinder I more then likley would not have bought it.
95% of the people here are great. Jiggy has been awesome in anwsering questions for me.
the other 5% however. Well they take the fun out back and shoot it like old yeller.
I only post this as the powers that be are always saying that they want feedback.
All in all, I appreaciate all the help that you guys give.
If you could be civil (I'm talking to the 5%) more often it would be nice.
I would like to jump in and ask a question if I may.
I thought it might be a good idea to do it early before this thread turned like so many of your others.
Are you asking a question?
In other words, What are you looking for here?
This is quickly going to turn into...
Everyone else: "Nuh-uh"
I am honestly curious.
I am sure that by this point you know that most posters here do not share your playstyle.
So I am really curious what the point of this one is.
SO I have seen a few people talk about Dazling display and how (I think it was a barbarian) you can make this just amazing.
I have never really thought much of intimidate as the debuff seemed a bit lackluster.
I am looking to make a barbarian however and would likr to be able to do more then just hit people with a stick.
Thanks for any help.
So as i am intrested in PFS play I had been chatting with my roommate and with my wife about it (they both played 3.5 a bit)
And they are also thinking they want to get into it as well.
Anyway I was curious if anyone had made a mini group of characters that always play together?
these would be 3 (maybe 4 depending on one other person) characters that we only played together.
They would level up at the same time and in that way we could do things that most PFS characters can't, we could build for synergy.
Anyway in thinking about that we came upon the idea for a "Gang" of mounted halflings.
Honestly the visual is just funny as hell to me.
So if you were to build 3 characters to work really well together what would they be?
1. Will be (the one I really like) Cavalier of the sword.
We really want to stick to characters that have a good mount from go. so maybe a druid, summoner, etc.
Part of me really wants a barbarian with the mounted powers but im not sure how well it works.
Also keep in mind that these need to be viable from level 1. perhaps not "great" but at the least decent.
And we really want to play up the teamwork portion. maybe a bard?
Thanks for the help.
So in looking back over some Fav posts I came across this little gem.
Some people may have missed it so I will post it here.
this is the link if you want to see it.
Note: He did not bold that part, I did.
Ok, this question is about the RAW, feel free to mention the RAI but i already know what i think about it.
Weapon Master (Fighter) says....
So my question is this, if you are a 3rd level Weapon master, you gain weapon training.
Does that then let you flurry with it?