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I'm beginning to wonder if Mark isn't being all 'sneaky sneaky' and gave us an intentionally underpowered version of the Kineticist to see if we can't buff and break it in ways he didn't expect. Meanwhile, he's keeping the full powered one all to himself and running that one through his spreadsheets and stuff and tweaking it based off the playtest.
It would be a sneaky and yet, brilliant move.
Pillbug Toenibbler wrote:
It's not Lemsgiving yet! That's next month!
Natsu is clearly a Pyrokineticist, if only there was a mechanic in the game that allowed for elemental kineticists to consume their element to reduce burn or something.
For example, a pyrokineticist could consume a fire spell and reduce his burn damage by the caster level of the fire spell. Or he could consume a fire and reduce his burn damage based off the size of the currently burning fire. However, he can't consume fire generated by his own abilities. So if he were to try and set a forest on fire with his abilities, he wouldn't be able to consume the fire because it spawned from himself.
If he were to consume enemy spells, it would function much like a readied action to dispel.
Just from the first glance at the doc, my wife and I really want to roll up water and fire kineticists, respectfully. Composite blasts are our favorite part because we tend to roll characters that work in tandem with each other, so I'm really hoping that they get expanded in the final book :)
This makes me think that there should be a Teamwork Feat for Composite Blasts between two Kineticists. Kind of teaming together to combine their elements for a single more powerful blast.
Then I do not find your problems to be due to the Vigor power but to the combination of other rules and party cohesion.
Indeed, and if a Party has that level of scouting down to be prepared for future encounters....
Have you have seen what a Wizard can do when he knows what's coming around the corner and has time to prepare for it?
So the Psion has a bunch of HP, the Wizard can just destroy the reality the Psion lives in which renders that HP completely irrelevant.
Barachiel Shina wrote:
What exactly is so wrong with a power point system anyway? You can't nova. There is a cap on that. I've seen arcane casters pull off way more broken effects than what Psionics could hope to accomplish. Plus you gotta expend psionic focus to use one meta psionic feat.
It requires people to learn a new casting system. Also, you're going to get a lot of anecdotal evidence of people misreading the rules that allows the psionic casters to nova all of their PP into a single power for like 10 bajillion d6 points of damage.
People insist that because you can manifest a power that deals 20d6 points of damage at 20d6 points of damage at 20th level more often than a Wizard can do the same, then that means Psionics is broken. They completely ignore all of the broken stuff Wizards do.
In fact, many such posters out right state that in a comparison of psionics to magic, you aren't allowed to bring up spells such as Planar Binding/Ally, Simulacrum etc. because, truthfully, they have no argument to counter them, so you can't use them.
It's kind of mind boggling how Paizo has repeatedly stated, for years, even before psychic magic was being worked on that, Paizo's answer to psionics would in no-way-shape-or-form have power points or the augmentation system; that it would be exactly like arcane/divine magic with the vancian roots. It's been abundantly stated that psychic magic won't be psionics, over and over and over again.
Despite all this, there are still people thinking it's going to be power points with augmentation and exactly like psionics.
Seriously, stop judging something by what someone else did when it's been stated numerous times that it won't be like what someone else did.
Mythic is not Epic; Psychic Magic is not Psionics.
Well, I am literally finishing the campaign by not giving a crap about balance anymore, so I am not judgemental at all. :p
Does that explain why I sometimes get discount codes from Victoria's Secret in my email, letting me know that I can 'find just the right bra' and get 15% off from their online store?
If so, I blame Cosmo for giving me the 'happiness' of some lady out there.
Is there a post somewhere in this thread with updated links? All the links in the original seem to be dead.
The first post in the thread has an updated link at the bottom of the page via an Edit, but here is the link. Favorite it, because you will be coming back.
James Jacobs wrote:
Does this mean that young boys without parental guidance are the embodiment of all horror?
Ambrosia Slaad wrote:
I could tell you of the great battle... years ago. How the Red team was crippled. I could tell you of the power of the Blue team, their ancient enemy... There are many tales. But I don't have time to explain why I don't have time to explain.
(multiple links in there explaining references)
I was playing Destiny on Xbox One and some friends were talking and I wasn't really paying attention, but I heard someone say, "You know, it kind of looks like a big cat."
My mind *clicked* and I immediately responded with, "What, like a puma?" and waited...
And no one got it :(
I blame Cosmo.
Mark Seifter wrote:
Pfft... No way, of course I'-he's not!
VM mercenario wrote:
Nearly all videogame magic is point based. I woud say all but there may be some corner cases I don't remember.
Magic in video games is almost always point based, or infinite. The only ones that I can think of that aren't are specifically made in D&D's image, like Neverwinter Nights. But even then, that game is balanced around the possibility of resting after every fight, because the spells are weaker and the enemies tougher than in actual D&D.
Add to it that I think Paizo underestimates the power of the internet and the shared collective of knowledge that exists.
Gamers have changed in the last 10 years. In the last 10 years, we've seen the online presence of games explode, and the upsurge of competitive gaming thrive. In addition, you have competitive games with RPG elements like DOTA, WoW, or LoL that incorporate level up mechanics and accumulated skills/abilities. This means that players will seek advice to become better at the game, reading guides, watching videos, seeking builds to further their characters success.
People raised in this shared knowledge age are doing the exact same thing to TTRPGs like Pathfinder. New players that eventually get online seeking advice on how to be better at the game. What do they find? Complete character optimization guides.
They take these guides and extract the information within to suit their build needs. So every time a guide comes out for a class, that becomes more and more knowledge that is put into the hands of new players. This means that you have new players that are having their hands held through character creation by leaning on someone else.
It'd be like creating a level 1 character and the GM handing you items of 10th level PC wealth. Sure, you're not as good as a 10th level PC (just as a new player reading the guide isn't as good as those who have experience), but you're a damn sight better than a normal 1st level PC.
The 8th Dwarf wrote:
This brings to mind Cthulhu with a top hat and monocle asking for 3 sugars in his tea...
I took san damage, didn't I?
Indeed, once your non-lethal damage equals or exceeds your current HP, you fall unconscious.
So, for example, say an enemy has 100 HP, and you hit for 20 points of damage on average. Your opt to do non-lethal damage on your attacks until you hit him once. Your first hit does 20 points of damage, meaning he has 20 non-lethal damage, and 100 remaining HP. From that point on, it only takes 4 more hits to drop him, and he won't die from it. Because, once he hits 20 HP, he falls unconscious, but alive.
All you have to do is make the enemy hit the non-lethal threshold, and then it doesn't matter.
As someone playing a Mythic Wizard that heavily uses metamagic to augment her spells, I use Ravingdork's character template for Microsoft Word/Open Office, slightly adapted to my needs, and then I use a spreadsheet to track my spellbook and potential metamagic spells. I use digital charactersheets because it makes tracking things easier without wasting paper. When I prepare my spells each day, I use the "sticky note" program to keep track of daily deviations. The spells prepared on her character sheet are the ones I've chosen for her to keep prepared 'unless otherwise noted'. So if the GM randomly rolls out an encounter, then those are the spells she's going to have prepared. But if she's in a specific environment, then she'll prepare a different selection.
Here is the latest version of Cairen's sheet and here is her spellbook (she can add two levels of metamagic to fireball for free). Yeah, it can be more than a bit of a hassle tracking spells in this way. Thank god for the feat Preferred Spell so she can spontaneously drop a fireball (her specialty) when she needs to; this makes it so much easier to make spell selections as she can prepare more utility spells and be secure int he knowledge that she'll always have a combat spell no matter what.
Fun fact, the majority of weapons that are in the one handed category and also deal slashing damage are not compatible with Weapon Finesse. So if you took Slashing Grace with a Scimitar, you would get strength to attack rolls and dexterity to damage.
The only compatible weapons are the Aldori Dueling Sword and the Whip if I recall correctly.
As an aside, if you are a Swashbuckler or a Daring Champion Cavalier, you have less issue as Slashing Grace allows you to treat the weapon as if it were a one-handed piercing weapon for class features, which then triggers the Swashbucklers Finesse class feature of the above two classes. That means Slashing Grace only *truly* works if you have at least one level in Swashbuckler or Daring Champion Cavalier, anyone else is paying for a feat that only partially works, and clunkily at that.
Forcing people to only learn magic from mentors also makes for awkward immersion. Like in Skyrim, you can only learn spells from reading spell books which destroys the book... so who gave the first casters spell books?
It also basically forces you into the trope of "ancient civilizations were more magically powerful and their magic has been lost"... which kind of sums up the majority of campaign settings out there, be it in games, books, or even anime. In this way, the ancient civilizations discovered magic and can just *learn* it (previous Elder Scrolls games), while the current generation has lost this ability and needs to be taught it and if all the casters were to die, so too would the magic (Skyrim).
I wasn't disappointed with the announcement, because I already knew Paizo wasn't going to do power points and that psychic magic was going to be vancian. That's been abundantly clear from following the Ask James Jacobs thread. Normally, he's doesn't talk about potential future projects, but he's been pretty adamant that psychic magic, when it was done, would be vancian and wouldn't involve power points.
Regardless, I'm super excited about the kineticist. It sounds kind of like I'd be able to play an Avatar style bender with it, or even mimic several Force abilities. If only Paizo had released some sort of energy blade in the Technology Guide... Jedi Bender!
That module being Seven Swords of Sin for those that are curious.
Legacy of Fire:
Also this seems to be a major aspect of the backstory for the this AP. That is, a wizard binds an efreet to grant him wishes and, in return, the caster will make wishes that will benefit the efreet.
[Edit] Also, for those who care about the passage that refers to the genie granting wishes.
Seven Swords of Sin:
Upon arriving in this room, the PCs confront two identical red dragons basking in the pool’s heat. Only one of them is real. Revorax, a very young red dragon who Tirana has raised from ha tching, is intensely loyal (most of the time) to his adopted mother. In order to keep him safe and entertained, Tirana has entrusted him with Surnom, her captive efreet, who spends much of his time lurking below the surface of the lava pool. Surnom has a rather low opinion of Revorax but must grant the dragon’s wishes. The other dragon in the room is a permanent duplicate image of Revorax created by Surnom to confuse intruders and appeal to Revorax’s vanity.
Another case of "I can't argue against it, so it's not allowed in this discussion!"
Seriously, any time someone makes brings up undeniable proof of magic being the more powerful system, you claim it's not valid because it's cheese, or an exploit, or an exception to the rule.
It seems like the only points which are valid, are your opinions. Any concrete facts, or opinions of others, are invalid because they aren't stated by you.
Fun fact, I saved your posts about "why blaster druids are awesome" into a google doc that I called Ashiel's Guide to the Blaster Druid. Though, now that I look at it, you referred to it as Incense of Asswhupping, not whoopass :P
I sorry, Senpai, I failed your lessons! :'(
In Pathfinder, my preference for caster strongholds is the Create Demiplane spells with awesome melee minions. See, you use Lesser Demiplane with permanency for your basic structure. Then you use castings of Create Demiplane and Greater Demiplane to add stuff, because when you use any of the Create Demiplane to alter a plane, the duration becomes instantaneous (which means permanent). So you first use Greater Demiplane to add in a permanent gate (so you can get out), then you give the demiplane the 'dead magic' trait (which functions like antimagic field. Drop in some beasties who don't need magic of any sort to kill PCs and then watch them cry as they enter the demiplane for the final showdown, only to find that all of their thousands of GP of magical items... stop working. Dem martials get eated right up and spitted out.
Bonus points if you hand a sign over the Gate that says "Exit" on it so the PCs know where to flee too with their tails between their legs.
To be fair, the Psion can simply manifest 9th level powers 24 times where as the Wizard cannot. For example, an Egoist could manifest Greater Metamorphosis 24 times in a day if he so chose to do so. Where as the Wizard could cast it only 5 times (if specialized) in a day, or the Sorcerer 6 times.
Fun fact though, the Arcane caster gets 200 minutes per casting of Shapechange, while the Egoist gets up to only 17 minutes per manifestation of Greater Metamorphosis (if he manifests it at ML 20th, he can't manifest 24 9th level powers each day).
So, lets do some math! 17 minutes per manifestation times 24 manifestations each day equals 408 minutes of Greater Metamorphosis each day! Odd, a Wizard needs only 2 castings of Shapechange to achieve nearly the exact same duration. So that Egoist has blown all of his power points for the equivalent of 2 Wizard spells. The Wizard still has 3 more 9th level spells and all of hist 1st - 8th level spells left.
Man, them psionics is sure OP. Magics is teh sux0rz!
The Genie wrote:
I would love to see official psionic or psychic magic in Pathfinder. I do so love that gut reaction of someone when you say you are bringing a psychic to the party and they immediately start complaining how broken psionics are. And there sits the Wizard not two seats from him who has the potential to summon a celestial quasi-god level being to destroy anything he desires 4 times a day should he choose.
6 times a day if he opts to fill all of his slots, because, you know, he can just add s%%# to his prepared spells between encounters if he needs to.
Or that Druid who is all "lol, psions..." *incense of whoopass* *dazing maximized flame strike* *wildshape* "RaWr!"
If you have to make a list of spells that 'all reasonable GMs ban' from the get-go, but get to include all of the psionic powers... well, then he just lost the argument from the get-go.
We're going to talk about how psionics is OP compared to magic, but you can't bring up and of X spells because they are b@*+@&$ crazy OP and destroy the game. Also, I don't have a counter to them so...
No one brings up the shenanigans that is Explosive Runes yet?
Sure, a Balor has SR, but only an SR of 28, so CL 20 Explosive Runes gets a roll of 1d20+20, it's not a guaranteed odds, sure, but it only needs a roll of 8. See, funny thing about Psionics, I don't recall if they have a lot of 'permanent' duration powers, and the ones that are? They aren't like Explosive Runes. The Wizard or Sorcerer could, theoretically, have nearly any number of Explosive Runes prepared on an object, and with only need an 8 or higher, most of those Runes are going to get through the SR.
Also, if you use a Wand of Dispel Magic, the CL check to dispel the runes is 1d20+5 vs a DC of 31, a.k.a. zero chance of succeeding in the dispel and 100% chance of causing all of the runes to explode because 3.5 Dispel includes an AoE option. I don't recall if you can cast at a lower level in 3.5, but if you can, then you could also use Spectral Hand and Erase to do the same job.
But... you know, those are all low level spells and are completely useless in a combat at high levels.
Does not. There is no energy blade in the Tech Guide.
Mars Roma wrote:
Yeah... that's not going to happen. Also, 3.5 and Pathfinder Psionics were/are well balanced. The issue comes from people not following the rules. But that's an issue regardless of whether or not you're using Psionics.
One of the big issues was the manifester level cap on PP. It's akin to someone saying, "Oh, I'm 5th level but I can cast a 10th level Fireball".
Seriously, compare all of the similar powers/spells between the two systems and you'll find Spells are more powerful probably 9/10 times. In addition, when you compare what Psionics can do that Spells can't vs what Spells can do but Psionics can't... again, Spells are more powerful.
no it doesn't, you just don't see the Cosmo until it is too late
Think of it more as a suppressed Cosmo existence, but one with retroactive consequences. As long as you keep eating the brownies, you ward of Cosmo... but if you ever miss a day, then Cosmo gets to inflict chaos on your life again. Plus, he gets to include all of the chaos that would have affected you without the brownies.
So be sure to secure those supply lines, because the longer you go with the brownies, the worse the backlash is for you.