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GM Lamplighter wrote:
This much like the Monk = Two weapon fighting FAQ. affects alot of things besides just the cost of these items. There is a ripple to suddenly revealing that a majority of at least forum goers assumed that it worked contrary to the way the FAQ explains it.
Because to use that one feat I have to purchase the whole "X of Golarion" DLC for $19.99, I cannot simply purchase the "Use a polearm as a polevault implement for a +4 to a distance jump" feat for $1.99
And yet if for some reason they lose their faith and worship another glaive wielding god no dice you forget how to be graceful with it. Even though nothing about the feat is magical or supernatural, best part is you can't teach to your glaive wielding buddy either.
Which is fine when there is a reason only X can learn something or because Y god is sending you power. But when apparetnly only those who follow abadar can use a crossbow to shoot a gold pouch off of a guys waistband or only Halflings can have had a piece of gear they "didn't know about" in their pack it looks like your just gating for the sake of gating.
Valandil Ancalime wrote:
Amiros Valeri, have you ever had a DM rule against this?
From my reading of both threads no, he is worried about a future that I believe most of us would count at not happening. This would be along the lines of someone worrying that having all martial weapon Prof. means they still take -4 with a bastard sword in 2 hands because its exotic even if it has a special use.
A thought just occurred to me looking at the FAQ for the trait in question if the OP is correct and the spell even for an instance lowers the spell level then it can't be used on any spell at all.
Magical Lineage (trait): Can I use this trait to adjust a spell's effective level below the unmodified spell's original level?
So as we can see if the actual level is being lowered for a purpose other than simply finding the final value the trait fizzles and does nothing.
Can't remember the poster but one of my favorites mentioned on the boards before was an unarmed focused barbarian who acted like a Zen monk his rage was an enlightened state (same mechanics) that focused his body on becoming a living weapon. So no running around frothing at the mouth just calm deadly silence.
Jason Bulmahn wrote:
This is the closest you will probably get on the issue, it is not a means to lower the level it never lowers the level it just reduces the cost.
As a GM I find that calling the group "targets" or "unwitting pawns" helps alleviate any issues, then everyone is upset.
I say it every time one of these threads comes up, Hero Points. Hero points are the solution since it lets the player decided to "fudge". The player decides if the fight is hard enough to need help. When you fudge as the GM you never know if next round the wizard was going to drop a spell to incapacitate the opposition or if you accidentally lined up the enemy for the fighters newest feat to be able to kill 1/2 of them.
Don't worry I don't believe the LGBQT thread will be going anywhere. And anyone going there to troll probably will get the ban hammer.
Goth Guru wrote:
It's not about combat but a factor of Caster level in relation to reality. The higher it is the less reality matters.
I know but with any type of just trained technique there is no reason that a wayward follower could not teach it. Easy to find that guy not at all, but if he exist it's the same as a spell in a runelords spellbook. Once it gets learned by someone else there is a chance of it being disseminated to the masses.
I just wish those feats had a bit of Divine ooph in them. Right now most of the combat ones are just Techniques that anyone who learned them and fell to the wayside of their religion could teach. Actually making the feats supernatural or in some way tying the feat to the actual divine patronage would make them a easier pill to swallow. It's as bad a if a combat feat came out with Taldan as a prereq that taught you how to apply your power attack penalty to AC instead of Attack.
So what all do we need to cover before running a game? How many threads or FAQ hits in a thread are needed before I should consider making it part of my new player packet of how I rule things?
Basically I would like something from the higher ups if possible simply stating (mostly to ease and head off any issues whether GM or player) that for all intents and purposes it doesn't matter that you have to work with Evil people and that either it's not enough to warrant the atonement in the first place (though feel free to buy your own for RPness all day) or that if it is required that the society does something to help. We all know that outside of actual PFS play the Society probably doesn't send Paladins out with things that make paladins shudder that often. But in organized play it could be a weekly thing to have to put up with.
EDIT: In short whether its not an issue or the Society at the least covers basic enough aura cleansing that the player would only be out money if the chose to be either by RP reasons or choosing to do something outside their tenets.
Does the Society require you to bribe people or drink? The difference is they do require the paladin to work with evilish associates which can bring about that need. Unless you can show me where your class features say that any time the VC's roll you out of bed their is a chance of you needing to drink 450 gp worth of Alcohol then your booze tab is different.
Edit: Keep in mind we are also only talking about waiving the 450 spellcasting fee to cover forced associations and possibly for any missions that might cause through it's completion the need for atonement. Not for covering atonement when the character has taken it upon themselves to go against their god.
Since one of the major rules of the Society is cooperation, and sometimes that means paladins have to work with evil as part of the job would it be possible to get an answer on whether or not
1. Such cooperation requires atonement as per the Associates section of the paladin class.
While she may adventure with good or neutral allies, a paladin avoids working with evil characters or with anyone who consistently offends her moral code. Under exceptional circumstances, a paladin can ally with evil associates, but only to defeat what she believes to be a greater evil. A paladin should seek an atonement spell periodically during such an unusual alliance, and should end the alliance immediately should she feel it is doing more harm than good.[/b] A paladin may accept only henchmen, followers, or cohorts who are lawful good.
2. If so for this instance of atonement only would or should the Society foot the bill for the cost of the spell?
EDIT: I think that having this codified would help with making sure that GM's aren't causing paladins undue issues due to sheer dumb luck of who else is at the table, and also give the paladin players a RP reason why either they don't need said atonement or how they cover their possible need for constant aura cleansing.
Yes and this can be exacerbated when you get to things like PFS and 2 tables with a different ruling (heck possibly because of 2 different books with the rules) can cause a difference in play experience. Something as simple as T10 rules on climbing a rope up a cliff with no other factors could be the difference in one group sailing through with T10 and the other nearly TPK'ing because of bad rolls.
I meant researching new spells, if your wanting a lost or obscure option to be difficult then its a way to do it. Saying the player has to play RotRL to have to spell is effectively banning it as the GM since the player is playing what you let them.
What character concepts can't you play as a Kobold that you could play as a full sized "true dragon" character? Don't say "Guy who uses has a breath weapon, can fly around with multiple natural weapons, and is immune to paralyze and sleep effects" because that's not a character.
It feels like you can be as much an greedy gold hoarding lizard who is above the stature of mere mortals and as you want as a Kobold or comparable "lizard-like" race.
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