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There are a ton of threads to dig through. It was a post by SKR on one of the many Wielding arguments.
He stated that for things like the Defending weapon property, the weapon had to be used that round to make an attack to count, but for non-weapon/shield items that they merely needed to be held or worn.
I didn't post to the thread myself, so I can't just look it up, but it's here on the forums.
This gets re-hashed about every 3-4 months, like people have never seen it before, even though it's been around since 3.0, 3.5, and now carried into pathfinder since different writers use "wielded" to mean different things depending on their understanding (or lack thereof) of the insane parsing people will do later.
Except that for non-weapon/shields being "wielded" just means being held or worn.
They can't mean the same "wielded" as in the defending weapon usage, since they can't be used in the same round as an attack (magus being the exception, which wasn't there when they were first used, or swift action castings).
Wielded means different things for different item categories, so for the purpose of Metamagic Rods a Tiefling's Tail is sufficient.
Tiefling. Prehensile tail.
Rod states it has to be held not wielded(which the tail can't do). Done.
Note, this doesn't let you spell combat with a 2 handed weapon for a full round of attacks, it just lets you cast as a standard action normally, and deliver a single strike through a 2 handed weapon as the free touch "Spellstrike" attack.
I'd actually dip 2 levels.
Either bard (Dervish of Dawn, dex to damage with scimitar(reflavor to cutlass/sabre easily enough) double performances to yourself, and get Versatile Performance for a couple skills to make the gunslinger 4 skill points go farther, a couple nice spells, and some stat synergy.
Or cavalier (Waverider if you keep mount, strategist if you ignore mount, Musketeer for no mount archetype) and use the order that gets you Dazzling Display as a standard action Demoralize (shaken debuff).
Dune Drifter Cavalier is also a fantastic choice (gives you Gunsmithing and Amatuer Gunslinger as bonus at level 1 and grit based on Cha), but normally restricted to Mana Wastes, so might be hard story-wise, unless you play someone who was a child in the wastes, and ran for the ocean to get away from the desert, which feeds into the change of class.
EDIT: Dune Drifter also gets you the firearm.
Multi-Class. Take a single level dip into another class and take the Amatuer Gunslinger feat, use it to pick up the Quick Clear Deed, and go on about your day.
A couple levels of Bard would also be kinda cool for Reloading Hands, or Jury Rig, and some buff abilities to all allies.
There's also the ACG Swashbuckler, since it is supposed to have a sword and pistol archetype that seems to meet what you want, and gets dex to damage as well.
So far as Sacred Geometry, I would let a player use it, but I would also tell him up front that from the IRL time the numbers are rolled to the time he works it out is the new casting time for the spell.
That was a suggestion from another thread that I thought was wonderful, so blatantly stole it.
One... comparing it to certain races who get an amazing FCB to determine it's balance is arguing the wrong power problem.
It takes a feat or 2nd level bard spell, so 4th/5th level comparisons:
Glitterdust: AoE Blind, and a one shot Invisibility Purge
Blistering Invective: AoE debuff, any number in the area, no SR/save on the debuff, plus damage rider with a save.
Second, the Masterpiece does exactly what it says it does, it allows him to supernaturally come up with some $#!& that is so crazy it's true. Yes, it makes pretty much all int skills a single skill point, but lets be honest, at level 5 he gets a to take 10 on any of them, making them a 13 base.
And, in the case of archetypes that happen to trade Bardic Knowledge away, I would also say that it doesn't remove the limit of having to be trained in a skill to get anything over a 10 DC.
Crossblooded sorc (orc/whatever element you like) gets +2 damage/die 1 level.
Kirin Style and Kirin Strike (takes 2 rounds) let you add double Int to any attack roll after you see if it has hit, provided you can do a 15+HD knowledge check first.
Spell focus components give you a +1 damage/spell.
So, at any level you have d3+3+2xInt+1/2(level-1) Assuming a:
2nd Char 20Int 1st Wiz: d3+3
Alt, you can go MoMS Monk 2 Instead of the sorc dip, and start getting double Int at 3rd level on your third round.
For bow/crossbow users, this is even better since with Focused Shot you get weapon damage +3xInt. For say... an Arcane Archer or an Arcane Trickster (with sneak damage too boot) this could be fun stat Synergy.
There's no reason not to have a metal tankard, which you lined out, so the first 2 are good as is, and fun.
In Your Face: Should be changed to "Once per combat, the user can make a Dirty Trick Combat maneuver in place of any melee attack, or as a ranged attack within 10ft, to give the Blinded or Sickened Conditions. This maneuver does not provoke AoO's. You may spend a move action to refill the Mug with liquid, which allows another use of this ability each time it is filled."
Slippery Grip(Imp Dirty Trick):You can splash liquid on an enemies hands to create a Grease like effect. Make a Dirty Trick maneuver against a melee target, if the maneuver is successful, the Reflex DC to pick up the weapon/item is equal to your CMD. You may spend a move action to refill the Mug with liquid, which allows another use of this ability each time it is filled."
Goes Down Smooth(Imp Trip): Your splashing drink causes your opponent to slip up. Make a Trip maneuver against a target within 10 ft. Regardless of success, the square is under a Grease like effect, the Acrobatics DC to move within that square equals your CMD. You can target an empty square in this manner. The effect lasts an number of rounds equal to half your BAB. You may spend a move action to refill the Mug with liquid, which allows another use of this ability each time it is filled."
I constantly threaten to play an Aasimar Lore Warden/Archivist Bard who talks like the Crocodile hunter.
"See that there, that's a Lemure. The most dangerous Devil at our CR. Poke him with a blessed or silver stick."
I also have a Str 7 Cha 24 Bard who talks like Sacha Baren Cohen's Bruno character.
We have a couple of Duck Dynasty looking elves (wish wood-elf statlines were legal in PF) who are the new Hunter and Slayer classes. Brothers, they constantly offer the party members a sip of "Feyshine, it's kinda like Feywine but without the tax stamp."
They have errata'd Brass Knuckles to not get the scaling damage because of the Sacred Cow AoMF pricing, if you could use brass knuckles and still get your unarmed strike damage while only paying single weapon costs it would be "too cheap" to make anyone buy the AoMF anymore.
Emei Piercer is the same thing, it has a weapon damage listed (although I agree that it should be the same as brass knuckles and get unarmed strike damage but with a different type) so that is what it does.
@XigXag, that doesn't work.
True Strike is +20 on the next single attack roll before the end of your next turn.
Sudden Charge gives you a free trip after hitting with a bite. The Bite is the first attack roll, the trip which is a separate attack roll (Maneuvers are attack rolls, and it lacks the caveat that Shield slam has to make it use the same bonuses as the original attack) would not get the +20.
The Emei Piercer is a weapon.
The answer is very clearly spelled out, all the ring does is make it immune to disarm. It also makes your unarmed strikes piercing instead of bludgeoning.
You could not use both an Emei Piercer and a Sansetsukon at the same time without an ability to use a 2handed weapon in 1 hand, or a third arm.
The brawler's flurry has the same language as the monk flurry, so even when using a 2 handed weapon you only get single Str damage.
ACG Playtest wrote:
Also, until the final version comes out, the Emei Piercer would only do a d3 damage 19-20x2 crit, since the playtest version doesn't scale monk weapon damage like it does unarmed strikes. (although it has been released that monk weapons/close weapons will scale, it isn't clear if it will be as fast as unarmed strikes do).
You can't combine Beliar's Bite with a weapon attack, only an unarmed strike. So neither weapon allows this.
Just put something down and get at least one chronicle of XP on it before the 14th.
After that, you can change anything you like at anytime until your 4th game.
I plan on having 2 of them get credit next week, and after the ACG comes out I will decide which particular heritage they are when I re-build the full characters.
I built one at level 9 for a module, and went slayer 6 Horizon Walker 3 for the Dimensional Agility awesomeness.
They are the best well rounded combat character in my opinion, being good at skills, full BAB/HD, with the option of both rogue and ranger tricks.
I was allowed to use the retraining rules, (since it was a one shot, it was very clear it would never be allowed again afterwards) to retrain into the entire chain, and being able to self-flank while ignoring the Dex reqs for TWF/ITWF/Double slice and 2d6 sneak was insane.
My friend has one built on the standard archery ranger route at level 4 in PFS, and he is usually the stealth/scout/most reliable damage dealer in the group, until the raging barbarian or the pet gets there.
I have a couple in my local area who have a massive con Life-link oracle and a 2W Fighter blender that work amazingly well.
The oracle shares half the damage, has almost as many HP, has channel and swift heals on himself somehow.
The TWF is a solid damage dealer especially now that she has gloves of dueling and Weapon Training.
I have a massive buff bard (aasimar with FCB to inspire boost), and my friend has a natural weapon Tiefling Ranger/druid (going for rage/pounce/smite at level 9). Now it is good, at 9+ it will be insane. (+7attack/+6damage and an extra attack for 3 fights a day, while all enemies in 30ft are at -2) on a character who has 6 attacks a round with a 26-28 Str already.
Slayer is exactly what most (combat oriented) people want from the rogue.
I have one at level 9, and he is awesome at stealth/outdoorsy/combat situations, but does not really have the ability to be the social rogue that some people want.
If he's combat/stealth/assassin focused in his concept, slayer will be wonderful for him.
If he wants social abilities, redo the ninja fluff and have him build a combat ninja with some social skills.
Human with Racial Heritage Halfling
Underfoot Adept/Maneuver Master/Quingong Monk 13
Stats: Str 8 Dex 20(24item) Con 14 Int 10 Wis 18(22 item) Cha 8
Monk 1(Imp Trip), 2 Imp Grapple, 6 Gr Trip, 10 Gr Grapple
Levels: 1 Combat Reflexes, 3 Vicious Stomp, 5 Snapping Turtle Style, 7 Snapping Turtle Clutch, 9 Binding Throw, 11 Rapid Grappler, 13 Binding Throw
Quingong Ki powers, Barkskin for Wholeness of Body, and another for Diamond Soul at level 13.
At 12th level count as Gargantuan for CMB/CMD and size of trippable creatures, which also means you can Ki Throw up to gargantuan.
Now, you can Ki Dimension door as a move, and trip/grapple as a standard, then also grapple again to pin with Binding Throw.
Alternately, you could take Dimensional Agility at 13, and Binding Throw as a monk feat at 14, working Towards Dimensional Dervish.
If all else fails, your AC Should be mid to upper 30s, Saves f:10/R:15/W:14 before any items.
Now: on a Full attack action (provided you lead with a trip which you should)
You get to trip(MM free, +30 including MM -2)
Featherstep Slippers 2000g
Monks Robes 13000g,
AOMF: Agile/Holy 36000g or Agile/Mimetic (to steal resistances for energy attacking foes) 16000g and 20k more gold for other gear
+4Dex Belt 16000g,
+4Wis Headband 16000g
Wayfinder with Dusty Rose Ioun Stone slotted 5250g (+1 insight AC, =2 all cmb/cmd)
Runestone of Power 1(1000g) if the sorc has mage armor known, if not add 1000g page of spell knowledge for 13hours of mage armor/day.
Cracked Purple Ioun Stone (spell storing 1st level, used for sorcerer to cast shield into) 2000g
Wand of Shield x2 (for sorc party member to cast shield into purple stone)750g
Cloak of Displacement 24000g
Jingasa of the Fortunate Soldier 5000g
Ring of Prot +2 8000g
Ring of Ki Mastery 10000g
Delisquisent gloves 8000g Acid damage unarmed and ooze prot.
148,750g spent (20k left if you didn't do Holy AoMF, you should have Winged Boots instead or at least 2-4 pots of fly and sundry other items)
For those counting Encumbrance, this whole list is 12 lbs. Leaving room for your standard BAG of gear at 18lbs (spend the money on MW Backpack for the extra 4lbs) that you should be dropping before combat.
Dragon's Demand is a 1-7 level mini-AP... it would let them get a feel for the system without getting into the high level rocket-tag kind of game.
Then, once they have some experience, you could go with a longer running game.
Also, the free First-Steps 1, 2 and 3 scenarios for Pathfinder Society Play are an excellent intro to all the mechanics of the game, and are built for 1st level characters.
If you have pounce, you can do it.
Pounce allows a Full Attack at the end of a Charge, which could be used for the Full attack required to activate Whirlwind Attack.
But normally, no, Charge lets you take a single attack, not even a Standard action attack, with some specific particulars listed under Charge.
Because you didn't threaten the square he was leaving until after your readied action took place, which specifies that it happens before he actually moves, so he can decide not to move based on your new placement.
You can't move as part of a readied action if you moved as part of the turn that you readied during.
You are picking and choosing the best parts of the text to say you get to move and ready an action during your "round" but that the ready action applies to only full initiative "rounds" from the combat perspective.
Now, even if it worked the way you would like, you don't necessarily get both attacks.
You would get the first one, since that is what triggered your readied action, and he is moving in the grease.
Yeah... it's poorly worded. You just have to go ahead and spend the good number of skill points bards get on 1 rank in each knowledge you need, if you traded the ability to make them untrained away.
The Masterpiece was written for the base bard, who doesn't have to worry about this by the time he qualifies for the masterpiece.
@sowero, Can't put Brawling in Bracers of Armor, specifically called out light armors only.
Dusty Rose ioun stone slotted in a Wayfinder +2.
Depending on your GM, AoMF enhancements could count for Grapple, since you are getting a grapple off of an unarmed strike attack per Grab.
Lore Warden 3 levels, 3 feats and a +2 to all CMB/CMD.
Hobgoblin race gets 1/4 levels FCB to grapple/trip.
Should have : Level-20, Str-10(Str 30, maybe more), Gauntlets-2, Feats-+4, Trait-1, Weapon Focus(grapple)-1, Ioun Stone-2, ... That's 40 with a single classed character.
Yeah... that's it. Now, I agree with james and disagree with james on ceratin issues, but if they had meant masterpieces to count as performances in toto, they could have added "Materpieces count as Bardic Performances, and you may only have one performance active at a time." without actually changing the spacing on the particular page, as it had a couple blank lines.
Also, as part of the descriptions, they call out that masterpieces also benefit from things that normally only work on performances, which wouldn't be necessary if they were performances themselves.
I read it as specific trumps general on that part. You can use a bow or crossbow without penalty, but any -other- weapon takes the -1.
My original post was referring to the armor check penalty for characters not proficient with them, since they have no armor check penalty.
The shift power doesn't count, since the feat is very specific and calls out casting Dimension Door or Abundant Step Class Feature.
It's not like some that just say ability to create magical darkness (not specifying the spell) or such.
Well.. at least you don't have to worry about Str penalties with the Aid Another using a spiked gauntlet. If you have weapon finesse, as it is a light weapon, for any purpose that you make attack rolls (which Aid Another is an attack roll vs AC 10) you would be using Dex.
With a Bard, even with the -4 fighting defensively, just your self buffs should make it a pretty good chance so long as you take weapon finesse.
Spiked gauntlets are normal gauntlets, with spikes or blades on them per the Equipment entry.
Would anyone not allow you to hold another weapon or item while wearing gauntlets, (which come on all medium armors other than a breastplate)?
Rods only have to be held, not wielded. So, you should be fine.
Just in case, use the Cestus instead. Avoid the argument entirely.
UE Cestus entry:
The cestus is a glove of leather or thick cloth that covers the wielder from mid-finger to mid-forearm. The close combat weapon is reinforced with metal plates over the fingers and often lined with wicked spikes along the backs of the hands and wrists. While wearing a cestus, you are considered armed and your unarmed attacks deal lethal damage. If you are proficient with a cestus, you can have your unarmed strikes deal bludgeoning or piercing damage. Monks are proficient with the cestus. When using a cestus, your fingers are mostly exposed, allowing you to wield or carry items in that hand, but the constriction of the weapon at your knuckles gives you a –2 penalty on all precision-based tasks involving that hand (such as opening locks). A cestus can't be disarmed.
And is also a Simple weapon, so bards are proficient in it.
+5 Bloodline, +4 Tiefling (alt racial gives +4 bluff instead of +2 bluff and stealth) +4 Stat, +4 class/trained, +3 Skill Focus, +1 trait= +21 at 1st level.
Make sure you have the spell Memory Lapse from the APG, in case you fail.
I have no reference for that AP, but with a 20 pt buy and human I wouldn't take both, just because of the double hit to Magus Arcana and arcane pool.
The only reason to mix both is if you don't trust the GM/AP to give weapon/armor loot properly, or are just really set on playing an anime style character (no armor but frontline fighty type with a few magic powers).
At least with elf or half-elf you get the Arcana back by level 12.
Half elf lose a feat (which you won't really miss) and a skillpoint/level off of human. Int based character makes up for the skills, and +2 will (h-elf racial) or skill focus (lots of characters take it) makes up for the feat, since Kensai gets free weapon focus/prof in their chosen weapon (even exotic).
This combo means he will have no armor/weapon costs. He will have few spells. His AC will be good (provided he invests in dex/int heavily, and will probably have a lower Str (subject to your rolling/point buy method).
Assuming 20pt buy, should be looking at stats close to...
At 1-3 levels, he plays like a dex fighter, with a couple of spells.
4-6, he gets his gear on, at level 5 he will have the equiv of a +3 weapon for most fights each day. (+1 blackblade, +2 from arcane pool, expect +1 Keen, and either an energy if the enemy is vulnerable, or a straight +2 Keen)
7-9 they get fun. Some fun spells, qualify for fighter feats, add dex and int to init, possibly get some crit feats.
10-12 is the best. If they are keeping dex/int maxed with gear, and mage armor/shield up, they have a great AC, good spell damage, decent to hit, and some nifty options.
13+ I haven't played, as I normally play PFS and that is where it caps.
Yes, but I don't count on retraining in a build.
If the GM allows it (or for PFS where it's 5pp and 450g) sure.
The best for this is a Slayer 6/Horizon Walker 3 with retraining, has Dimensional Agility, Assault, Dervish, and Savant... all with 2d6 sneak, using talents for TWF/ITWF/Double Slice, all at +14/14/9/9 at level 9, doing weapon+5+2d6 each (more really, not counting magic items or other buffs in this)
If you make him a skinwalker (Boar) you get 5 attacks without the TWF tree with Extra Feature, using Talents for Rending Claws, Aspect of the Beast, and Eldritch Claws as his feats. (Depending on what kind of AoMF you plan for).
But that's with retraining, and even then you only have 5-6 of them a day.
Snapleaf. 750g. Caster level 5, immediate action, invis and featherfall. Absolutely priceless, as my rogue has slippers of spiderclimb and spends a lot of time on the ceiling in combats.
Springsheath 5g. Daggers, CLW wands, Inflict wands (for my monk inquisitor), all kinds of nifty swift action fun (and for 2HF who happen to get grappled occasionally).
Smelling Salts. 25g. Healer stable but at negative hp? Need to interrogate a stable enemy and don't want to waste a heal spell? Just use these and get to act as if staggered. If you happen to be staggered or unconscious from some spell/effect you get a new save on exposure.
+1 MW Darkwood Buckler. 1205g. No reason not to carry one, if you don't use another shield (and aren't a DD or Monk). +2 AC in surprise situations, no penalty on attacks or spells even when you do need to use that arm for something.
Gloves of Reconnaissance. 2000g. Always be ready for the first 10 fights a day, (note, user needs darkvision to benefit to the fullest), by laying hands on the door before you open it.
Shawl of life-keeping 1000g. Instantly restore up to 10hp when you drop below 0 each day, for the low low cost of a couple CLW charges in advance.
Quick-change cloak 1500g. For infiltration types, absolutely fantastic. Take the time to get the disguise right before hand (take 20) and then have up to 3 changes at will.
Cloak of the Hedge Wizard. 2500g. Various uses for non-casters to get a couple of their favorite spells.
Shield Cloak 1000g. Light wooden shield as needed for non-armored situation, or merely for those monks who want the defense without actually loosing their monk abilities. Can be enchanted as a shield as well. (and for those who say it should still count, I point you to countless movies where this technique is used by martial artists)
Cloak of Fiery vanishing. 2600g. Lots of fun with this one, especially if you have evasion, and a good enough ref save that burning hands is not a bad thing for you to deal with.
Yeah... you can't have Dimensional Agility at 7. You are only a 5th level caster, so no Dim Door. Magical knack doesn't give you caster level for new spell levels known/cast, only caster level for spell effects (although that is splitting fine hairs with all the ways they use the same terms). So you have 7 dice for fireball, but only 3rd level spells known.
You can take it at 9 though. I can't for the life of me figure out how to get the chain faster than level 13 for all 4 feats, and that version isn't even on a wizard.
@Silas, that is actually where I got that answer.
It wasn't my thread, but it has been hashed out on the forums already. It was actually the only reason I took masterpieces on my bard, because I have so many rounds I never use that double or triple use is fine.
Yes. Anything that directly targets an enemy or attacks that contain an enemy in its area of effect breaks invis.
PRD CRB INVIS SPELL ENTRY wrote:
For purposes of this spell, an attack includes any spell targeting a foe or whose area or effect includes a foe. Exactly who is a foe depends on the invisible character's perceptions. Actions directed at unattended objects do not break the spell. Causing harm indirectly is not an attack. Thus, an invisible being can open doors, talk, eat, climb stairs, summon monsters and have them attack, cut the ropes holding a rope bridge while enemies are on the bridge, remotely trigger traps, open a portcullis to release attack dogs, and so forth. If the subject attacks directly, however, it immediately becomes visible along with all its gear. Spells such as bless that specifically affect allies but not foes are not attacks for this purpose, even when they include foes in their area.
The bolded sections relate to the spells part of your question, the italics relate to the hex portion, since a detrimental effect is a supernatural "attack" and requires a save.
Hexes like Blight (area version) would not break invisibility, since they do nothing to creatures in the area.
The stone is hands free, one. 2nd, it uses the caster level of the caster, so it will last longer than a minute (provided they cast it themselves, which is why I actually spent the money on a 1st level PoP on my fighter/rogue, also gives flex for alt choices).
At lower levels, this isn't really a concern, because an AC of 18-20 is fine. At higher levels, 2-3k gold isn't a bad investment (considering a +2 shield would be 4k)
The Wand thing is fine, if you have the skills as a fighter (most don't) to burn on UMD.
I actually have used the Ioun stone and a wand of shield for my PFS half-orc. Everyone knows that he is going to ask the most obvious "waggle fingers" to "put magic from stick into rock plz".
I used it for Prot evil , I used it for CLW, there are a lot of 1st level spells that are insanely useful at low levels (3-6), and some that remain useful even later.
Actually I think the Pathfinder society is responsible.
And they are siphoning off his life force to power their machinations throughout Golarion.
His body is actually being slowly devoured in the Worldwound, which was opened in the massive energy release when he was struck down.
Just look at the timeline in the Inner Sea World Guide. Aroden dies, and the Worldwound opens the same year.
All of this was masterminded by Iomedae, in order to steal his portfolio and worshippers unto herself.
H-Orc Slayer (ACG playtest class) 6/Horizon walker 3
+1350g (10 x level:9 x days per feat:5 x3 feats) and 15 days for retraining gets you the whole chain, with 5 uses a day using the following stats.
Shaman's Apprentice racial gets you Endurance.
Str 20 Dex 14 Con 14 Int 9 Wis 14 Cha 7
Astral Terrain mastery/dominance gets you 5(3+wis) dimension doors a day. Buy a headband for another one.
Slayer gets you 2d6 sneak at 6th, so self-flanking helps you.
You have TWF, Double Slice, ITWF all with no pre-reqs from slayer talents, the 4 feat Dimensional Chain, and one more feat you can choose (power attack being the most likely choice).
Attacks at +14/14/9/9 doing wpn+2d6+5 before even factoring in any magical gear or buffs during those 5 rounds of attacks including flanking with yourself.