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An orc can start with 22 Strength. A bit non-standard, but doable. And does the ragechemist alchemist archetype increase the Strength increase from mutagens? And I think there is a trait that increases morale bonuses by +1, so that combined with a 5th stat gain at level 20 is an additional +2.
Yeah, whenever I play two characters, they're pretty different. I've played a NG aasimar ranger/cleric of Thor & CN tiefling rogue/wizard, a LG human Paladin/Cleric & CG halfling ranger/rogue, a CG chaos gnome dragon shaman & N whisper gnome ninja, a LG half-elf paladin & CG half-orc wanna-be Conan witch.
Can you use the 3.5 battle sorcerer alternate class? I played with a guy who did, and he did great in melee. A lot of it might have been the Feral template, but he was a kobold and would use the wraithstrike spell to full attack as touch attacks.
And are you married to the sorcerer class? Maybe orc scarred witch doctor (witch with Con as casting stat) or magus would work better? Or play one of the native outsider races that get all martial weapon proficiencies as a racial ability and go into Eldritch Knight? Even Fighter 1/Sorcerer 9/Eldritch Knight gets 18 spellcaster levels, and thus 9th level spell. Magical Knack trait would keep your caster level equal to your character level, naturally.
I made a human paladin 3.
I took Magical Knack (paladin) so I will have CL 3 at 4th level when I finally get spell. I'm thinking of Altruistic Diplomat (+2 Diplomacy) or Group Fighting (+3 when flanking).
Gonna go sword & board. The party found a +2 longsword they plan on giving me... Yeah, yeah it's meta-gaming. I don't care. :-P
I'm going to make an elf alchemist archer, a cleric, and a scarred witch doctor blaster/healer. And see what I like best.
EDIT: Might go Irrepressible to add Wisdom to Will Saves vs. charm and complusions.
My half-orc inquisitor 3 of Desna fed an owlbear.
Now I need a new PC.
We have a fighter (dueling sword) and Dark Tapestries oracle. Sometimes we have a psion, and we can and often hire player-controlled NPC meatshields.
I'm considering a paladin, a fire cleric, and an alchemist. We need lots of healing and some area effect damage. I don't really like arcane casters. Will consider a half-orc scarred witch doctor.
15 point buy, 3rd level, standard wealth by level, 2 traits.
Houserules is no AoOs, 20s autocrit, and if you can explain it, it trumps skill checks.
For one adventure, I offered them the help of the King's men, and handed each PC an NPC card (level 1 warrior). The PCs didn't trust them, and left them behind, and are now suspicious of the city that was going to be their hometown, so I don't think pre-gens are the way to go! Hahahaha! Maybe for a less paranoid group. They have a history of some PvP stuff in the past, and some dishonest DMs with low rules mastery, so that is a legacy I'm dealing with too. The gunslinger is a relative newbie, and thus much less paranoid. My other group uses NPC class henchmen, and it works for us there. I've managed to keep my level 1 warrior alive so long he is level 2 now! :-)
We had 3, but one is moving away. We started at 1st level, and now they are 3rd. We are looking for other players, but it is hard getting people to commit and/or match out schedule.
I've done the 2 PCs/player before, and it's not too bad. You can even kill a character, and still have the player keep on playing his second character.
They also all dumped Cha. So I'm leaning towards a cavalier, paladin, oracle, or summoner. I'm also thinking a witch would be a good utility/healer/de-buffer. The gunslinger is an utter newbie. He has a tiefling rogue w/ 2 daggers figurine, so he might want to make a PC that matches it.
I'd kind of like to see a Float Like A Butterfly/Sting Like A Bee combo (dual-wielding kukris or wakazashi sneak-attacker and beefy x3 or x4 critter).
One of my players (half-elf alchemist) is leaving, so the remaining 2 players may have to double up and play two PCs each.
One is a LN dwarf inquisitor with a dorn-dergar. The other is a CN human gunslinger/pistorelo.
Any suggestions of what suggestions I should make to the players? Level 3.
My other PbP PC (only two players + GM, so I get to play 2 PCs) is an elf barbarian with a curvesword. I'm taking the +1 ft of tpeed favored class bonus, and working up to the virtual Spring Attack rage power (Bestial Leaper? something like that.). I think it will be fun to have a speed of 55 or 60 feet and do Vital Strike, and eventually, Improved Vital Strike damage. Move 30 feet, do 3d10+11 damage (+20 when power attacking), move 30 feet as a full round action sounds like fun.
When I think of point buy, and how many points should be given out, I think about how many 14 do I want the average PC to have. Basically, you get one 14 per 5 points. So, in a 15 point game, you're going to have PCs that are 14, 14, 14, 10, 10, 10 before racial adjustments. Obviously, some are going to splurge and trade two 14s for a 16 and 10, or raid the 10s to 7s to get 4 more points, or split a 14 and 10 for a 12 and 13, etc. etc.
I still need to read The Graveyard Book, the Ocean at the End of the Lane, etc. etc.
I've been slacking.
Newbies should play rangers. They're fun and easy and introduce lots of gaming concepts as they level up (bonus feats, pets, spells), and have lots of the skills newbies like to use and the skills that are always useful (Perception!).
For a 3 person party, I would play a cavalier, druid, or summoner to get a pet.
Nope, she could do it with anyone's dice.
Honestly, I once rolled up an 18/17/17/16/16/15 PC for another player, so I know it's possible to get ridiculous stats. This player also couldn't roll less than 17 on a d20. She's just super lucky.
But I would suggest starting a level 1 game, and then tell the uber 5th to 7th level players to wait until the average party level is the same. It will either give y'all some cooling off time, or the ubers will get sick of waiting to play and agree to play a more balanced character.
Alternatively, grant other special abilities to lower point buys, like Hero Points. In my games, Standard races get 3 Hero Points per session, Advanced races get 2 Hero Points per session, Monstrous races get 1 Hero Point per session, and Very Powerful races get no Hero Points.
Higher point buys can be considered alternate races with lots of additional Advanced Ability Score RPs.
Another thing I've learned when dealing with superpowered PCs: Don't try to challenge them, try to unchallenge them. If they are level 1 and have +10 to hit and do 30 points of damage, instead of giving them a creature with AC 25 and 120 hit points, give them a creature with AC 13 and 5 hit points. All the autokilling will get boring, and they'll either re-balance their characters, or have very slow advancement (low CR opponents = low XP gains).
K177Y C47 wrote:
Ranger? Paladin? Druid?
My alchemist, gunslinger, inquisitor party just got to level 3. It's fun. They have some magic, and lots of special abilities, but they also melee a lot. The gunslinger is a newbie, so he tries all sorts of fun things, like stealing and riding the BBEG cavalier's horse companion. In a castle.
I also like the slow spellcasting progression because it kind of slows down the power level a little bit. They get to enjoy their class abilities and not just nova their high level spells. I'm also having fun making NPCs with actual NPC class levels, oddly enough.
Tengu get ALL sword proficiencies. They would make good FLABs. I made one for PbP, but the campaign never worked out.
The Swordmaster rogue archetype is pretty sweet. It replaces Trap Sense for a rage-like trance mechanic that grants some cool combat options, like a swift action 5 foot movement, charge, etc.
Also, the tengu rogue's favored class bonus is +1/2 to confirm critical hits.
So, a tengu swordmaster rogue can use a pair of (keen) wakizashi (15 or 18-20/x2) with a bonus to confirm crits.
Kydeem de'Morcaine wrote:
I can't find them.
FLAB: Wayang ninja, probably Two-Weapon Fighting, Weapon Finesse, Combat Expertise, Butterfly Sting, maybe Improved Two Weapon Fighting and Weapon Focus. I think it was a pair of keen kukri, since it was a level 9 party. Boots of Haste would be nice, or a 3.5 Belt of Battle.
SLAB: Nagaji samurai, probably with Weapon Focus, Power Attack, maybe Furious Focus.
I think a bunch of each would be fun for a higher level party. Lots of flanking buddies. Maybe a BBEG buffer.
Yeah, just overcoming poison immunity is a powerful ability. I think there is an alchemist discovery for it, though.
Also, it would have good design space to give Poison Resistance, where a critter with Poison Resistance 1 would reduce ability damage or drain by 1. PR 3 would reduce it by 3, etc. etc.
I'm GMing a game with an alchemist, gunslinger, and inquisitor. So far, so good, but they're only 2nd level. The next BBEG will be a spellchucker, but also a melee tripper. With adept/warrior mooks. Should be...interesting.
I'm also playing in a game with a Dark Tapestry oracle, my half-orc inquisitor of Desna, and a fighter, sometimes a psion. Also 2 or 3 henchmen warriors (it's a 15 point, gritty, Old School D&D-type campaign). Healing is definitely an issue. No wands yet, but we just turned 2nd level--after having to do a rewind after a TPK vs. a white wyrmling.
Our Kingmaker campaign has my dwarf barbarian/magus, an archer ranger, a rogue/witch, and a cavalier/fighter with a cleric cohort. We do pretty well. Used lots of wands before the King got a cohort.
Honestly, the ranger is probably the best introductory class in Pathfinder. Good at fighting, two good saves, lots of skill points, and lots of great class skills. It also introduces spellcasting, bonus feats (but limited in scope--so the choices aren't overwhelming!), animal companions or party buffing, and lots of fun class abilities.
Does your campaign use traits? If so, pick one that grants Disable Device as a class skill. Or be a half-elf and take Skill Focus Disable Device (the +3 from Skill Focus would counter the non-plus 3 for it not being a class skill. Or take a 1 to 4 level dip into Rogue to get trapfinding, some sneak attack, and maybe Evasion, some rogue talents (some are bonus combat feats, Weapon Finesse, or Weapon Focus, so very fightery), and maybe Uncanny Dodge.
Fighter/Rogue, Ranger/Rogue, and Barbarian/Rogue are all very solid multi-class options. Even if multi-classing isn't necessarily the best option in Pathfinder.
Here's a little something I threw together...
Craft alchemy 7 ranks, Knowledge nature 7 ranks.
Class Skills: Craft, Knowledge (all), Profession, Spellcraft, Use Magic Device.
Skill Ranks per Level: 4 + Intelligence modifier.
Venomous Scholars gain no new armor or weapon proficiencies.
Extracts (Sp): The Venomous Scholar’s class levels stack with alchemist levels for the purposes of learning, preparing and using extracts.
Poison Resistance (Ex): Venomous Scholars gain a bonus equal to their class level on saving throws against poison.
Potent Alchemy (Ex): When using an alchemical item, the Venomous Scholar adds his class level to the saving throw, if any. He adds his Intelligence modifier to the damage, if any, of any alchemical item he uses. He multiplies the duration of any non-instantaneous alchemical item by his class level. The Venomous Scholar adds his class level to Craft alchemy skill checks. The Venomous Scholar can cast detect poison at will, with a caster level equal to his character level.
Bomb Brewer (Su): Beginning at 2nd level, the Venomous Scholar adds half his level to his alchemist level for the purposes of determining the effects of his bomb ability, and when determining the number of bombs he gains per day.
Discovery (Ex, Sp, or Su): At 2nd level and every even level thereafter, the Venomous Scholar gains an alchemist discovery. His Venomous Scholar levels stack with alchemist levels for the purposes of meeting the requirements of alchemist discoveries.
Poison Immunity (Ex): At 3rd level, the Venomous Scholar becomes immune to poison.
Overwhelming Poison (Ex): At 5th level, the Venomous Scholar learns how to create potent poisons. Any poison crafted by the Venomous Scholar is difficult to detect; anyone who casts detect poison must make a caster level check with a DC equal to 10 + the Venomous Scholar’s level + the Venomous Scholar’s Intelligence modifier. The Venomous Scholar’s poisons can affect creatures that are normally immune to poison by making a level check (1d20 + the Venomous Scholar’s class level) with a DC equal to the target’s number of hit dice. If the Venomous Scholar created the poison he using, he adds his Intelligence modifier to the level check.
Persistent Poisons (Ex): At 7th level, when the Venomous Scholar uses a poison, its duration increases by a number of rounds equal to his Intelligence modifier, and the number of successful saves to be cured of the poison increases by 1.
Instant Alchemy (Ex): At 9th level, the Venomous Scholar can create alchemical items with almost supernatural speed. He can create any alchemical item as a full-round action if he succeeds at the Craft (alchemy) check and has the appropriate resources at hand to fund the creation. He can apply poison to a weapon as an immediate action.
Poison Touch (Ex): At 10th level, the Venomous Scholar gains a poisonous touch, as if under the effects of a poison spell. He can suppress or activate this ability as a free action. The physical appearance of how the Venomous Scholar generates and delivers his poisonous touch varies from Venomous Scholar to Venomous Scholar.