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Hooded Man

Serisan's page

FullStarFullStarFullStar Pathfinder Society GM. 2,951 posts (2,967 including aliases). 4 reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 16 Pathfinder Society characters.


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David knott 242 wrote:

What do the Additional Resources say about Path of the Hellknight? That would be the most logical primary source for the Order of the Torrent.

It says nothing helpful, if I'm understanding the OP correctly.

AR wrote:

Pathfinder Campaign Setting: Path of the Hellknight

All material in this book is legal for play with the following exceptions. Conquering brands and branding iron are not legal for play. A PC may only benefit from either the Hellknight Obedience or a similar obedience character option (e.g. Deific Obedience) at a time, except as allowed by the Might of the Godclaw revelation. In order to swear allegiance to a Hellknight order for the purpose of qualifying for character options in this book, a PC must be lawful-aligned. The shackle spell uses either the fetters or frontal restraint rules on page 15.

If it doesn't say anything about the Order of the Torrent's order discipline choices in Path of the Hellknight, then the only source other than that would be Hell's Rebels 2, which is not sanctioned. Based on the AR, Order of the Torrent is legal, but you then have to reference an illegal source.


There is an exception for lich paralysis, which is what Vordakai has.

Bestiary wrote:
Paralyzing Touch (Su): Any living creature a lich hits with its touch attack must succeed on a Fortitude save or be permanently paralyzed. Remove paralysis or any spell that can remove a curse can free the victim (see the bestow curse spell description, with a DC equal to the lich's save DC). The effect cannot be dispelled. Anyone paralyzed by a lich seems dead, though a DC 20 Perception check or a DC 15 Heal check reveals that the victim is still alive.

***

Ragoz wrote:
I'm using the term directly from the chronicle sheet. Maybe you can go complain about it to someone else but not me.

How privy is your character to the chronicle? Additionally, we have evidence that things on the chronicle can have alignment impacts on characters, sometimes very directly.

Also, it's not hard to see the following scenario unfold:

Slaagh: “We welcome you to Godhome. You wish to make sacrifice now, or visit? Take holy grub maybe?”
Party: *ARROWS*

We're talking unprovoked murder here. That quote is the direct quote from the module and is the first thing out of the trogs' collective mouths.

CRB on Alignment wrote:

Evil implies hurting, oppressing, and killing others. Some evil creatures simply have no compassion for others and kill without qualms if doing so is convenient.

...

Chaotic Evil: A chaotic evil character does what his greed, hatred, and lust for destruction drive him to do. He is vicious, arbitrarily violent, and unpredictable.

I'm no huge fan of the alignment system, but such a situation would qualify under the Evil banner for sure, and I'd consider it fairly chaotic as well. The floor is meant to be a non-trap moral quandary - You are welcomed, given a non-violent solution that accomplishes your objective without filling your pockets. There's a puzzle, but it's optional. Hostilities are completely dependent on your actions as a character. If your character opts to be Indiana Jones instead of a gracious guest, you've trended towards neutral and get attacked for it. If your character opts for racism and immediate violence, it's evil.

I'm certainly not planning on punishing a party who wants to solve the puzzle, but the one that walks in like a tactical combat unit intent on slaughter isn't walking away from that unscathed on the alignment spectrum. I would be recording an evil act on the chronicle and reviewing characters to determine if it was a gross violation for divine casters.


My PFS psychic, level 14. He's a much more generic caster given that he's for organized play, so I can't make the assumption that there will be a wizard or similar at the table to take care of the other extensive needs.

I cannot speak highly enough about Will of the Dead. It is truly wonderful at filling holes in coverage. It also allows for interesting mid to late game utility - any undead you come across can suddenly be affected by Feeblemind, for instance, and have a resultant loss in HP that's pretty significant. While I haven't read Hell's Vengeance, I would expect that there are likely places where undead could pop up as side enemies. Given that your primary focus is a mind-affecting spell, this could be a significant utility for you. The only easy-to-skip phrenic power to swap would be Defensive Prognostication, though.

Logical Remove Fear is one of your most important defensive options in the mid-level range until you can get Intellect Fortress I and afford the slots for it. 7 seems like a reasonable choice for when to get Logical Spell based on your chosen specialization and the craft wonderous selection. The big thing is just remembering to take the spell. Until then, make sure to have potions or scrolls of it available.

I'm up in the air about Gifted Adept vs Magical Lineage. ML is going to have a significant impact once you begin using more metamagic feats. You have a lot of them in your line-up. Just something to consider.

***

So, one of the things that really bugs me about this floor is that the clear change in nature from base troglodytes has not actually resulted in the expected alignment shift away from CE. PCs who succeed at the pitiful DC 6 Knowledge (local) check to identify these guys are going to know that things are weird from the start. After all, Slaagh is speaking in Common, a language that troglodytes don't typically know, and offering the party "holy grub" immediately upon meeting them.

If the PCs go full murderhobo straight out the gate, I would have one of the troglodytes flee ASAP to find Savisk. Once Savisk is dead and unless the box has been triggered, I would have one or two troglodytes cowering somewhere. If the PCs outright slaughter them, definitely an atonement for anyone who doesn't attempt to stop the murder. For clerics and similar, another consideration is the deity they worship - Sarenrae in particular might consider this a gross violation of her tenets.

The most warning I would give players before going down that path is "are you sure?" given that I don't like the idea of this floor being excessively railroady. It's easy to modify the NPC decision tree to impact the characters, though.


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Gisher wrote:
derpdidruid wrote:
Ah. Thanks for the clear up! It was just so I could get the familiar to say "I'm a tumor" in the Swartzinager voice anyways.
And that is awesome! A method for doing this must be found or created!

You just have it take the form of a raven, which can speak one language of the master's choice.

***

I did not get one of the whirlpool tub rooms, but they're still available!

***

jon dehning wrote:
Serisan wrote:

I HAVE TERRIBLE NEWS! The Radisson is completely booked for the entire weekend. >.<

Edit: The Courtyard Marriott up the street is not full, however.

Wait. Wut?

That's pretty much what I said when I tried to book a room. I even called the Radisson directly to see if they saw anything different than what I was getting on the website.

The Courtyard Marriott did have some nice rooms available, including the variety that have whirlpool tubs and king size beds. They probably also have classy things, like strawberries dipped in chocolate. The rooms were all renovated last year, which may be part of the reason that I didn't know about that place when I made my reservations last year. The downside, of course, is that the Courtyard is about 5 or 6 blocks away, whereas the Radisson was basically just hopping a fence.

I still drove that distance because I'm lazy and I only got 1 night last year. What a mistake that was...

***

I thought 2 months out was early. :-p

***

I HAVE TERRIBLE NEWS! The Radisson is completely booked for the entire weekend. >.<

Edit: The Courtyard Marriott up the street is not full, however.

***

My interpretation is that the Profession 5 rank unlock doesn't work because standard craft/prof/perform rules for gaining wealth are replaced with the Day Job system. The unlock is effectively doubling the gain under standard rules. If that's how PFS wants to handle it, that's fine. We already have the Street Performer Bard ability clarified that way, too.

Street Performer wrote:
Gladhanding: A street performer earns double the normal amount of money from Perform checks. As a standard action, he may use a Bluff check in place of a Diplomacy check to improve a creature's attitude for 1 minute, after which its attitude becomes one step worse than originally. This ability replaces countersong.

FAQ link for Gladhanding


Thinking back to the OP's question, I have to go with the non-lich route. Frankly, eternity is not an appealing prospect once I give it thought. I'm in my 30s now, so I could reasonably get 50+ years of good work done, especially if my first act is to create a Ring of Sustenance to reclaim all the time I currently spend sleeping and eating.

Re: caster class, I'm torn between cleric, druid, and shaman.


silverfoxdmt73 wrote:
master_marshmallow wrote:
There's the ursine vigilante.
Where can that be found please?

Wildsoul is an archetype in Ultimate Intrigue. Ursine is one of the options for that archetype.

***

Rei wrote:
Yeah, that's definitely something that invalidates prestige awards and is therefore essentially a class option that replaces PP.

While true, the question immediately becomes one of relative value. Taking one of the best cases for the selection, you could use it to get Diplomacy, Intimidate, or Bluff rather than spending 5 PP for Caravan. If we assume that Caravan is purchased ASAP (let's say scenario 3's completion), there's a whole 3 scenarios where the Vigilante could theoretically have used Entrepreneur (since you can't day job with Caravan on the chronicle you purchased it). Let's also go SUPER CRAZY and assume that the Vigilante hit DC 30 on all 3 of those day jobs (again, at level 1, where it's likely going to require a 16+ on the die with major investment).

225gp + 5 PP vs a class feature. Not only that, but it's competing with Social Grace for the slot at level 1. I think that's a terrible trade. You don't even earn enough gold to retrain out of it, assuming that retraining class features is possible for the Vigilante.

If you instead go for Perform or Profession, you get two of the weakest skill unlocks in the game.

Perform wrote:

5 Ranks: Whenever you attempt a Bluff, Diplomacy, Handle Animal, or Intimidate check, you can attempt a DC 20 Perform check to gain a +2 circumstance bonus on the check.

10 Ranks: Whenever you cast a spell with the emotion or language-dependent descriptor, you can attempt a DC 25 Perform check to increase the save DC by 1.

Profession wrote:

5 Ranks: When using Profession checks to earn income, you earn gold pieces equal to the result of your check each week.

10 Ranks: When attempting Profession checks, you can roll twice and take the better result. When answering questions about your Profession, you can always take 10.

As far as I can tell, there's no adjudicating the Profession 5 rank unlock - it just doesn't work. I'm not precisely sure who would actually utilize the Perform 5 rank, but it's not exactly overpowered. The 10 rank unlocks for both are laughable for the level.

The only defense I can see for the ban is protectionism for the old prestige awards, as you said. I think that's a pretty lame reason to lock out a fairly underwhelming mechanical option that doesn't conceivably imbalance the campaign. I mean, even if you convert that 5 PP into 2 wands + 150gp of other things (level 2 scroll?), that's still just the extra equivalent gold of a 4-5 or 5-6 chronicle, but locked into consumables more or less. Seriously, the biggest possible danger is that a player uses Entrepreneur for level 1, then uses level 1 retraining as soon as they can buy Caravan, but that still doesn't let them spend that prestige on semi-mandatory wands.


I'm a huge fan of using Diabolical Negotiator (Inner Sea Gods) if you're willing to be an Asmodean. The feat allows you to use Int or Wis instead of Cha for Diplomacy and removes the cap on attitude shifting. The prerequisite is something you were probably going to get anyway - Skill Focus: Diplomacy.


Drahliana Moonrunner wrote:


The Pathfinder Society would not be sending members on active duty that don't look like they could survive in the wild and rough and tumble situations that Pathfinders find themselves in. A character on Peg Legs is FAR FAR more handicapped than a dwarf or a lame oracle. A character on peg legs is dependent upon using both of his arms for crutches. Which means you have no hands for melee, no hands for ranged, and no free hands for spellcasting. And we won't even talk about climbing and jumping. There are ways a character like that can serve the society.... Field work simply isn't one of them.

Actual rules for 2 peg legs wrote:
If you have two peg legs, your base speed is reduced to half and you take a –10 penalty on Acrobatics, Climb, and Swim checks. You are immune to damage from caltrops.

There is ZERO evidence that your hands are occupied if you have 2 peg legs.


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You could, of course, go with the option that's likely funnier and less likely to offend or see table variance.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

1. "What mechanical space do I want to play around in?"
2. "Ok, that space sucks. What other spaces are there?"
3. Fall down the character creation rabbit hole for several days.
4. "Alright, I suppose I can work with this."
5. "Ok, I've got a basic shtick. What sort of personality traits do I associate with each element of that shtick?"
6. "Given those personality traits, what mechanical elements become relevant?"
7. "Did I do that right? Maybe I should start over in another mechanical design space."
8. Repeat from 3.


Darksol the Painbringer wrote:


The problem with save or die spells are that you really gotta use feats, class features, etc. to pump up your DC. Which is fine for a Save-or-Suck caster, since as you said, Persistent spell is all you need (Heighten is really nice too, as that increases the Save DC as well), but to be honest, it's very difficult to make universally strong, and can only function in niche situations.

As a spontaneous caster, I have a lot of options for Persistent. Here's a PDF of said Psychic, now 14. Typical Persistent spell options: Oneiric Horror, Mental Block, Wall of Blindness/Deafness, Feeblemind, and Plane Shift. You'll also note that I have nothing but Overpowering Mind to increase save DCs. While I'm not batting 1000, I'm still doin' pretty fine.

Quote:
The other problem is that their applications aren't universal. Let's take our Mental Block spell as an example; it's really powerful for its level, and only certain Psionics, or a Bard, can cast it, so not even a God Wizard can shut down encounters that way.

Yes, and I think that's fine. The Wizard has a better spell list than the Psychic anyway. You'll note that the majority of my spells actually come out of the CRB and the overwhelming majority are shared with Wizard. A single spell is not the be-all, end-all of a character in most situations.

Quote:
But, if you're running into creatures with strong saves versus Mind-Affecting Effects (or even Immunities to said effects), you just became useless in that fight, Persistent Spell and all. There's also a question as to whether the Persistent Spell effects apply to saving throws after the initial one, as Mental Block gives you a Saving Throw every round.

For Mental Block, sure. Mind you, undead aren't safe from Mind-Effecting vs this character (Will of the Dead), but I can certainly just Plane Shift, Greater Object Possession, or Mass Mydriatic Spontaneity to offensively contribute. By the way, did you know that hitting a lich with Will of the Dead Feeblemind makes them lose a lot of HP? A stock bestiary 1 lich loses 88 of 111 health from that.

Or Haste, Wall of Force, strategically Dim Door/Teleport allies, buff allies... That's all good too.

Quote:

The way I see it, if you can reliably affect a Human Barbarian with Superstition (and the FCB into it as well), which is the epitomy of powerful Will Saves (as high as +28 for their Will Save against your spell) then yes, Save or Die spells are great and can trivialize most every encounter. However, I have yet to come across a DC that is higher than ~32, so the odds of beating that Will Save is highly unlikely; at least, without some outside help or debuffing (which would likewise be difficult to implement, at least in spell form).

Depending on what level you're looking at, I might have answers for that. At 16, I get Euphoric Tranquility, which has no save and ends fights. *shrug*


Monster Summoner's Handbook has Dispel Focus and Greater Dispel Focus, worth +2 each. You can also pick up Varisian Tattoo: Abjuration (ISWG) and Spell Specialization: Dispel Magic (UM) for +1 and +2, respectively. You can use Cold Iron worth 1gp as an additional material component to increase your caster level for dispel. If you're feeling really spendy, there's also the orange prism ioun stone (CRB, I think) for an extra +1 caster level.


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Darksol the Painbringer wrote:
Metamagic feats are really only for Blasters;

*snip*

Counterpoint: Persistent Spell. Until you start getting No Save win spells, Persistent drastically increases the odds of a spell successfully impacting an encounter. My 13th level Psychic used Persistent Mental Block (after adjustment, 4th level, base spell is 2nd) to shut off a dragon. There were, of course, other things going on, but Persistent caused the dragon to have a roughly 1% chance of getting out of the effect. It was a CR 17 encounter.

What do you call a dragon that can't remember how to fly and can only full attack? Answer: dead.

I agree with the other posters that Quicken is a higher level metamagic. I would take it no earlier than 13, probably pushing towards 15. 7th level slots make it much more viable.


Lynthara wrote:

I appreciate the input so far! I guess my main goal would be to build a "melee with spells" kind of character. There's plenty of that in Pathfinder, of course - but I don't get quite the vibe I'm hoping for from cleric or inquisitor. Celes didn't necessarily appear to be a divine-powered character, as her abilities were derived through Magitek.

I'm not very savvy on Oracles, so I'd be interested in being "led by the nose" there.

I haven't played FF VI in quite awhile, so it's been good just to have a refresher on just what Celes did in the game.

Her main aspects were:

1. Automatic (automagic?) spell learning for Ice, Cure, and a couple others.
2. Runic, which absorbed the next spell with a target.
3. Decent with weapons/armor.

In general, the Rune Knight job focused on antimagic defensive fighting with a small amount of magic to go along with it. Compare this to the Magic Knight (sometimes also called Spell Sword or Mystic Knight, IIRC) that imbued their weapon with spells, the Paladin that was a defensive warrior healer, and the Dark Knight, which did emo self-harming darkness attacks. These 4 jobs were hybrid warrior/casters that focused on the warrior part more than the caster part. As I co-authored a game system based on the E-games, I've got a fair amount of background on this stuff, though it's been a while and we were hybridizing several E-games at once into a single tabletop system, so some design space decisions may not reflect the full canon.

What differentiates Celes from the normal job is that FF VI allowed for characters to learn magic outside of their job. Thus, I'm not really comfortable putting her in the 4-level caster category. My suggestions of Cleric, Oracle, and Inquisitor were around that defensive aspect while still retaining reasonable combat potential. Truthfully, any FF-based character with magic is likely best shown by a spontaneous caster as that's more reflective of the spellcasting of the games, but that's not a hard-and-fast rule. While a Magus would be a good reflection overall, it tends to be a more offensive caster - one I would associate more with the Magic Knight job than the Rune Knight job - so translating mechanics can vary some things here. Also, I was doing what I could to keep within your existing book ownership.

If I were to build a mechanical translation of Celes, I think I would end up going with a Battle Oracle, going heavy armor ASAP via Skill at Arms (remember that Celes was one of relatively few characters who could wear the heavier armor options), and going with defensive options for spells. I would trend towards a physical-heavy stat selection - 16 12 14 10 10 13 before racials, perhaps? - and wade into melee. Eventually, you can work your way up to Spell Resistance and similar defensive options, which mimic the defensive options of the Rune Knight well.

The most difficult translation piece for the Oracle is needing to select a curse. My recommendation would be Legalistic, despite being from a source you don't own (Blood of Fiends). It doesn't dramatically alter what we know about Celes and it allows you to get better at fulfilling promises, which seems appropriate to her.

While you won't have easy access to ice-themed spells, you'll have a strong defensive warrior with some magic to back it up, along with the ability to utilize Dispel Magic as a Runic-like counterspell.


There's no perfect emulation available for the Rune Knight job from Final Fantasy, which is what Celes' ability set most closely resembles. I would agree that the Magus is a relatively good emulation for an offensive interpretation of the character, but I would say that Cleric, Oracle and Inquisitor are all valid choices, as well, and they're available in books you already have. All 3 will provide both natural magic progression and combat competence. If you had APG, I would recommend Shaman and Warpriest, as well. Even Bard can handle some aspects of the character.

What capabilities do you want to focus on? That can help narrow down what we look at.

***

That ruling really needs to be put into the PRD at this point.

***

MadScientistWorking wrote:
Serisan wrote:

The only bribe I can think of from Calisro is letting you use a folding boat to get to a mission, which some players have cleverly used during said mission.

Not how that scenario plays out at all.

** spoiler omitted **

You must be thinking of a different scenario.

A certain scenario wrote:
Benarry lets the PCs borrow her folding boat

***

The only bribe I can think of from Calisro is letting you use a folding boat to get to a mission, which some players have cleverly used during said mission.

***

MisterSlanky wrote:
Serisan wrote:
Re: Ferious Thune's spoiler, I've certainly volunteered information to players if the quote is funny, as well. Marcos Farabellos has an amazing line in All for Immortality 2 that is difficult to get PCs to ask about, but it's well worth the table reaction.
Did the same. And don't get me wrong - this frustrates me so much I try very hard to distribute the relevant information. That doesn't mean everybody does, and when it's outright written that way, it doesn't help things.

Oh, the sacrifices we make...

***

Re: Ferious Thune's spoiler, I've certainly volunteered information to players if the quote is funny, as well. Marcos Farabellos has an amazing line in All for Immortality 2 that is difficult to get PCs to ask about, but it's well worth the table reaction.

***

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Also Declan Dreng.

***

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Hilary Moon Murphy wrote:

Okay... this is hilarious, Serisan. I've never seen Kreighton portrayed with the falsetto, and we're in the same area! In my mind, he's been portrayed like Compton suggested -- intelligent, yet distractible. Maybe a little feminine, but not overly so.

Must be the YMB GMs. We've all followed a former VC's lead with Shaine.

Re: [redacted], I remember your excitement at that table. :-)

***

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John Compton wrote:
Nefreet wrote:

When I started PFS, Dreng was RPed to me as a total stoner. It made perfect sense considering his operating hours, his carefree attire, his untamed hair, and his bleary, squinting eyes.

Just last week I GMed #1-49, one of the famous "wake you up in the middle of the night" scenarios. I RPed him interjecting words like "dude", "totally", that he had the munchies, and everything that epitomizes a Cali pot head.

After the game one of our newer GMs asked me if that's really how he's like. She'd always thought he was just a crotchety old man. I told her that's how I've always thought of him, but feel free to RP him however you feel comfortable.

Seeing as nobody in this thread has mentioned it at all, maybe I'm in the minority.

If we had a short blurb on each of the VCs, including pronunciation and RP, developed into some sort of document, it would probably go a long way to lessen table variation on how VCs are portrayed.

I've seen both Kreighton Shaine and Drandle Dreng presented by GMs as stoners, though that's far from my approach for either. This was only after I had come to understand Shaine as a generally upbeat, inquisitive, and easily distracted fellow with a mind for obscure trivia, and Dreng as an experienced, mildly goofy, avuncular, and somewhat grimly optimistic older man. These characterizations are partly my own interpretations and partly the result of other GMs' presentation, but they're now the filter through which I present the two leaders in publications.

I hear a lot more variation on Dreng than Shaine in my area. Most everyone I know presents Shaine as extremely effeminate (after all, Elven genders are feminine and more feminine) and as distractible as a dog when a squirrel runs by. I get the idea that Shaine is high INT and low WIS. Virtually every Shaine voice is done in falsetto, explicitly at a higher pitch than female NPCs.

One of our local VOs has Dreng as a proper Taldan gentleman, while others have him as rather oblivious and still trying to play straight-and-narrow - just starting to lose his edge, as it were. I tend to run him as mentally present, but starting to lose his sight and slightly off when it comes to time, as though he sleeps during the day, though I do tend to think of him as an alcoholic.

My single biggest problem with Osprey is that he seems to be this guy. My perception that he's trending towards Neutral Evil doesn't help my opinion of him, either.

***

Wei Ji the Learner wrote:
BretI wrote:

Seems a lot of people are missing the most obvious indication that Dreng is not a bumbling fool, likely because they missed the roll and have never GMed this scenario.

** spoiler omitted **

** spoiler omitted **

That's pretty obscure and it's no wonder it gets missed. We didn't pick up on it during our run if memory serves.

Very few characters have that knowledge in that tier.

***

graywulfe wrote:
Serisan wrote:
graywulfe wrote:
SCPRedMage wrote:
James Anderson wrote:
My first interaction with her was as the GM on Night March, where she's trying to help a retired pathfinder.

That was my first interaction with her, as well, and she did not make a good impression.

** spoiler omitted **

** spoiler omitted **

Probably rope

... Seriously you don't have rope on every character... I am at a loss to how to react. This seems like a straight forward purchase. Every character I have has rope.

EDIT: Just want to be clear I am not trying to insult or attack anyone. I just literally can't imagine not having these items.

Depends on the character. My 14th level psychic does not have rope. He's got flayleaf, so obviously he cares about one type of hemp, but no rope. For virtually any use of rope, he has a non-rope solution that he's happy to employ.

Honestly, "do you even have rope?" is becoming the singular test for Pathfinders anymore. I mostly said it as a joke in my prior post.

***

graywulfe wrote:
SCPRedMage wrote:
James Anderson wrote:
My first interaction with her was as the GM on Night March, where she's trying to help a retired pathfinder.

That was my first interaction with her, as well, and she did not make a good impression.

** spoiler omitted **

** spoiler omitted **

Probably rope

***

Steven Schopmeyer wrote:
** spoiler omitted **

1. I don't remember much about that scenario other than it making me dislike Osprey.

3. Haven't done Abducted and I don't recall actually interacting with Osprey other than his name in a book for Siege.

For Quentin:

1. She's slowly being turned into a monkey and is in the room with the lich.
2. That's exactly the point: who filled the slots? What's going on there?
4. Yes, and that's why I want to retire EotT and build out the surrounding stories.

***

Quentin Coldwater wrote:
Serisan wrote:
Steven Schopmeyer wrote:
In much the same way Aram Zey's death was not kept secret?

I haven't had the opportunity to play terribly much of S7, but my interpretation is yes. The events of Captive in Crystal are a great example of addressing the critical issue of Aram Zey's murder.

** spoiler omitted **

** spoiler omitted **

Reply to your reply, still very Eyes spoiler-y:

1. The important monkey: Kyalla (sp?)
2. Why aren't we calling them the (some integer between 5 and 7)? How was that problem resolved?
3. And they appear in few or no scenarios because of Eyes.
4. Reporting shouldn't be necessary to determine the canon events, especially with 5 years worth of content having occurred since the release of the final scenario.

***

Steven Schopmeyer wrote:
In much the same way Aram Zey's death was not kept secret?

I haven't had the opportunity to play terribly much of S7, but my interpretation is yes. The events of Captive in Crystal are a great example of addressing the critical issue of Aram Zey's murder.

Eyes of the Ten threads I'd like to see resolved:

1. What the heck happened to the monkey?
2. Assuming nothing good in #1, who "disappeared" from canon or otherwise ascended? Has that not been resolved?
3. What's up with Osprey and Eliza? The latter is rather interesting now that several people have brought her up in the "Badmouthing our bosses" thread.
4. From a continuity perspective, what was the campaign result of the final encounter in part 4? i.e. was the target protected?

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Eric Ives wrote:
Steven Schopmeyer wrote:

Y'know, he DID get us up at a reasonable hour for one of them. Sewer Dragons, I think?

Also yes to Eliza.

6-02 The Silver Mount Collection is another one where Dreng is talking to you during daylight hours.

I would disagree here. While we don't explicitly have a time for the initial "briefing," we do have a description of the first outdoor location, which is described as being "unlit" with illumination from elsewhere making it "dim light." It is most definitely night.

Edit: Sewer Dragons is interesting in that I played it with a True Dragons pregen and thanked Dreng during the briefing for agreeing to assist in my enslavement of the tribe. In essence, I made Dreng even more morally questionable.

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I really like Calisro Benarry. Her foibles are far from cavalier and generally conspiratorial in the PCs' favor. She's genuinely a joy to interact with for most scenarios.

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Steven Schopmeyer wrote:
I don't quite follow. Are you saying that it cannot be considered canon in future scenarios due to possible spoilers? Because that happens quite often already.

There are specific NPCs who essentially disappear from the campaign in order to maintain secrecy about the events of EotT and, while literal years have passed since those events, there are several outstanding questions that have a great deal of importance to the Society as a whole. While it did address a big part of the Shadow Lodge story arc, I would say that the ramifications of EotT simply aren't apparent outside a pile of proteges and characters who have some new titles. The end result is that the story of EotT simply doesn't matter to the campaign.

In my mind, that's a problem and the only way to address is adequately is to remove the secrecy associated with it so we can explore those stories.

***

Quentin Coldwater wrote:
I've played Eyes, and I see no reason why it should be retired. The story is a bit old, but it isn't as if it's worthless. I'd be very surprised if it would be retired, it's a great way to finish your PFS career.

I literally just finished playing it and, while it had interesting character development options, it is incredibly dated and its continued legality has reduced options to tell very important stories. I would very much like to see it retired at the end of Season 8 so we could explore those stories in Season 9.

***

Keith Apperson wrote:

My personal issue, while minor, would be that they're spending minimal time with those PFS characters, up to high levels. Sure, they've built them, but if they haven't played them, the experience is quite different.

As an experienced player and GM, I would still not be as good with a level 12 character I built to level 12 as I would be with one I played from 1 to 12. Personally, I would probably not enjoy playing with someone who built a level 12 instead of playing to level 12 for the same reason - there's a lot going on with a character at that level that you might not have experience with beyond theorycrafting.

There's also a difference between PFS play and home game (homebrew, AP, or module) play - a lot of minor things that you learn in low level scenarios as you work your way to high level scenarios. Popping in at level 10+ there will likely be a notable difference in styles, intentions, and general flow of the game that other players are aware of and have characters that work with, while you've got high level 'fresh out of the box' characters (and players) without that background.

On that note, there's something to be said about the cardboard cut-out nature of characters that are built at higher levels without the early play. I just completed EotT (Keith GM'd it) on my pothead psychedelia psychic, but most of his interesting character development happened during the series because he was a GM credit baby through level 8. His prior "experiences" via chronicles did result in character growth because he wasn't reacting to the the scenarios - at the time I was running the modules, he was an amorphous credit blob and he never interacted with other characters.

I recently implemented a personal policy that I will not accept GM credit except to bypass level 1. All of my higher chronicles just become level 1 equivalents. Yes, this means I have something like 5 blobs that I haven't started, but they'll progress with actual experiences, not just mechanical ones.

***

Robin Aeronica wrote:
Stupid trap.

I think you mean "awesome trap."

***

Steven Schopmeyer wrote:
MisterSlanky wrote:
Jack Brown wrote:

One thing I did, that I got positive feedback on, was when the group had the option of drinking the Sun Orchid Elixer, I went to a different room, and asked each the question individually. Felt that kept the potential problems at the table down to a minimum, since when I played it, we didn't realize it was an individual choice.

Not a bad idea - it also keeps individual pissing and moaning to a minimum when somebody does decide to do it. "I stop you" isn't an acceptable answer, even though players could easily think it is.
It also mirrors the way I and others handle a certain deal with the devil in another Season 7 scenario.

In general, I liked this (I was at Jack's table). I agree that individual answers should matter. The one problem I have is if a specific PC locates the portable hole and says they want to Sleight of Hand or otherwise obfuscate the objective. It's possible (though unlikely) that a PC could succeed at the Sense Motive, locate the portable hole, and teleport (however ill-advised) to the Emir without allowing the other agents the opportunity to take actions. Similarly, you could see some impressive Bluff checks that, indeed, the fireball broke the vials on the dragon's neck and the SOEs are destroyed, then Sleight of Hand the vials out of the portable hole before telling the party about your discovery.

There's also the hilarious possibility that a player tries to stuff the portable hole (with all its loot) inside their haversack.

It's a pretty big break from realism to allow individual choices to matter. I think it's right and justified, but I can imagine a number of characters who would be built and have personalities conducive to the above solutions where the players would feel robbed of character development opportunities.

***

jon dehning wrote:
Serisan wrote:
What do you use Jimmy Hoffa for?

He carries the Hamm's.

It's ok, I'm a Teamster as well.

Oh snap, extradimensional Jimmy Hoffa!

***

Sat on the other side of the screen for this last night as a local VO was preparing to run this at Gen Con. This is kind of a minor complaint re: editing and positioning, but for the Loaralis fight, the dispel DC is multiple pages away from the disable device bit (pg 23 vs 25-26). If there are hazards like this in future scenarios, I would strongly suggest putting all of this information in a single sidebar.


#1: Absolutely yes. Your hexes are mental abilities.

Regarding 2 and 2A, my interpretation is that a permanent +X bonus would not just fall off because your soul left your body, but I see your point about it cutting both ways. Either way, your save DC is determined when casting the spell. Once a spell starts, it retains all properties from casting unless the spell details otherwise.

I can probably answer Question 3, and that answer is no. If you follow the Possession caveat from Occult Adventures, as soon as you enter the extradimensional space, you are unable to return to your body until it is removed from the haversack.

Quote:

Extradimensional Spaces

A number of spells and magic items utilize extradimensional spaces, such as rope trick, a bag of holding, a handy haversack, and a portable hole. These spells and magic items create a tiny pocket space that does not exist in any dimension.

Dimension is a tricky word, but it's seemingly used interchangeably with Plane in several instances. For example, Plane Shift is an example of extradimensional travel. It could be that "plane" is a subset of "extradimensional" - i.e. all planes are extradimensional, but not all extradimensional things are planes. Either way, "a tiny pocket of space that does not exist in any dimension" would not exist in any plane, either. Thus, you would not be on the same plane as your body if your body was in a haversack.

Beyond that, you do have to note the size and weight limits of the haversack. The large compartment only holds up to 80 lbs and 8 cubic feet of stuff. A halfling or gnome might be ok, but a human is right out, even before gear. The minimum weight of any medium-sized race in the CRB is greater than the carrying capacity of the haversack by at least 7 lbs. Medium-sized creatures could likely be accommodated by a Bag of Holding type I.

***

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What do you use Jimmy Hoffa for?


Glass River Rescue comes to mind, although that's slightly more investigative upfront. The Sharrowsmith arc from S6 is good, too (Scions of the Sky Key). Scions would give you a 3-parter in Mwangi.

***

Jeffrey Stop wrote:
John Compton wrote:
Serisan wrote:
[[Research questions]]
** spoiler omitted **
Is there anything preventing PCs from skipping the research initially and coming back to it later? I didn't see anything that would indicate research done after getting to the professor would be any less effective. Did I miss something?

Part 2 of the research becomes impossible as the God Fount's death triggers automatic hostility with the Council of Shadows.

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