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Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Roleplaying Guild Subscriber. FullStarFullStarFullStarFullStar Pathfinder Society GM. 3,811 posts (3,849 including aliases). 12 reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 23 Organized Play characters.


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Still waiting for the update where level 1-5 combats stop being as long as 1st ed level 12+ combats (the drawn out variety, not the SoD I Win variety). It gets entirely too tedious to bother with combat currently.


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I agree with OP's 3 loves, so I'm just reposting those here.

Zi Mishkal wrote:


3 Loves:

1. Three action system. Its simple, it works.
2. Cantrips that scale.
3. Crits at +/-10 to hit, rather than just on a 20 or 1.

3 Hates:

1. The narrow band of skill floor and skill ceiling.
2. The general slowdown of combat and strange numbersflation.
3. The retention of anti-crit mechanics.

I need to provide some context here as, frankly, I'm probably done with the playtest. Unless there's a substantial mathematical rework, I don't know that I have interest in 2e anymore.

Re: skill floor and skill ceiling, I readily admit that 1st ed has a massive gap between the floor and the ceiling. One might easily say this in martial terms as a scale from Harsk to Crowe - universally, Harsk is regarded as the worst pregen among the martials for having suboptimal choices in favor of flavor. Crowe, on the flipside, is one of the most optimized pregens available while still being interestingly flavored.

Harsk - - - - - - - - - Average Monsters - - - - - - - - - Crowe

Looking at Starfinder - a.k.a. proto PFP - the band narrowed substantially. A large part of that was the way that equipment became more controlled. The common complaint I hear, though, is that there's entirely to much homogenization of characters, which can be described as "You don't have to say Soldier 1/Mystic X, I knew you had a level of Soldier when you said you were playing a Mystic." There are still other factors in there that complicate things, like Starship Combat, but by and large, the skill floor was raised and the ceiling was lowered. It didn't completely close that gap, though. Using our same Harsk/Crowe spectrum, it's more like this:

- - - - - - - Harsk - - - Average Monsters - - - Crowe - - - -

PFP's scaling has created an interesting new problem - lots of flavors of the exact same proficiency. The skill floor is SO HIGH and the skill ceiling SO LOW that it's hard to actually have a scale. Everything is more or less mashed together.

- - - - - - - - - Harsk - Average Monsters - Crowe - - - - - -

This creates an entirely different set of issues than "everyone dips soldier" in Starfinder because there's a degree to which classes suddenly lack identity in other ways. A wizard with 18 starting strength that takes Fighter Devotion at level 2 is functionally a fighter with full spellcasting. You don't need to take more feats for this to work out well. At most, you'll only be down 1-2 points of attack for most of your career and down the fighter-specific class feats (mostly), but you'll be a capable fighter with full spellcasting, wearing full plate if you want and using whatever weapon you choose.

But really, the key thing to look at here is how much design space did you lose? Suddenly, you find that your floor and ceiling are so constrained from 1E to PFP that there's little differentiation to be had. There is currently very little investment you can do into anything that makes you significantly better than someone with no investment at all. Now, to be clear, I don't mind the raising of the skill floor. Building a mechanically terrible character is certifiably not-fun for the majority of people. Having virtually no headroom above that, though, is where the pain truly starts.

Re: combat speed and numbersflation: Aight fam, this is where point 1 starts to hurt. For this, I want you to consider what should be equivalent monsters between 1e and PFP: the CR 3 Medium Fire Elemental from 1e and the Creature 3 Minor Fire Elemental from PFP. Pitting them head to head is generally kinda pointless - AC and attack values vary wildly between the two systems. There's one key indicator of "hold up, what now?" to them, though: HP. Did you expect monster HP to increase by 50% on an equivalent creature between versions? Probably not.

Let's look at another example: Flesh Golems. Again, largely pointless AC and attack values, but the HP goes from 79 to 143. That's an 80% increase, roughly.

In both cases, we see a significant increase in HP that is likely intended to counteract the expected increase in damage from multiple attacks per round. I'm here to tell you, however, that this simply doesn't bear out in actual play. Having run Arclord's Envy (a level 5 PFS scenario for PFP) multiple times this past weekend, I can without a doubt tell you that the increase in monster HP is dramatically felt. A 6 player table spent nearly 90 minutes on an encounter with 4 minor fire elementals + an ifrit ranger, while a 4 player table struggled to take down a flesh golem at all. In both cases, it was not poor tactics, poor builds, or other standard issues. It's that they're swinging relatively limp noodles at giant sacks of HP.

Anti-crit = anti-fun. "Sweet, we get to crit things that have low AC way more?" Yeah, I bet you've heard that from players when they hear the +10/-10 crit rules. This is, in part, one of the mechanics that allows high level players to completely dunk on low level monsters...at least in theory. I have an incredible hatred of immunity effects in every game (I'd rather things be resistant in various ways, such as an automatic increase of success by 1 step on saves against a type of effect), but this one in particular rubs me wrong despite being a holdover. It actually feels worse than PF1.

Remember that Minor Fire Elemental? Creature 3, as you'll recall, with 47 HP. As it turns out, those are still a slog for 5th level characters... and 6th... and 7th... and 8th... only really improving at 9th, when you're expected to have a +2 weapon (let's be real, your first 8th level item will always be the +2 weapon, just like your first 4th level item is the +1). Until then, you're still reliably requiring 3-4 hits with your +1 weapons for each fire elemental. And what do we know about encounters at high level with low level monsters? There are just more of them. Again, crits are supposed to be the mechanism for mopping these things up, along with reliable hits.

What happens as a result is that you're left with compounded disappointment: your relatively advanced characters continue to struggle against old foes (well, at least the sack of HP that they represent, the incoming threat is fairly low) AND that new shiny mechanic of crit range is completely thrown out the window.

So ultimately, I could whittle down the Love/Hate to 1 item each.

  • Love: The system is easy to learn.
  • Hate: The system is best when you're ignoring the rules entirely.

****

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numbat1 wrote:
Thank you all for a great event. I am taking home some very special memories. I'd love to learn the final fundraising result. Again, thank you to everyone who made this happen.

The not-so-secret total is taped to the door behind all the tiara-wearing Venture-People.


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I am very happy to hear that Signature Skills as a concept dies today. One of my frustrations in my initial readthrough was the inability of characters to be good at things that they may have character reasons to be good at while being outside their class.


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First and foremost, I want to say that I'm going to continue giving the system a shot, but DAAAAAAAAANG was I unimpressed with my first session running.

Two major problems:

  • Encounters felt long. Up to 18 actions per round for the GM to handle in 2 different encounters. Given how cramped the rooms were for some areas, this means up to 18 Strikes per round. Even so, these become extremely tedious encounters.
  • Long combats means probability shakes out more often. 18 Strikes means you're really likely to crit with the monsters every round or pretty close to it.

What I really want to focus on, though, is how absolutely tedious these encounters felt. Sure, challenging-ish. Whatever.

I didn't enjoy running the game because the mechanics felt bogged down and, frankly, bad in larger encounters.

If the game feels bad running trivial encounters at level 1, I don't even want to imagine combats where I actually have to think at higher levels. It sounds like masochism. As an example, I'm thinking fights like Karzoug from Rise of the Runelords. That already sounds exhausting. Looking forward in Doomsday Dawn, part 5 looks horrifying. Encounters with 10+ enemies? Just...no.


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Background: I'm sorta plugged in on PFP and very familiar with PF1 and SF, but my wife found PF1 to be completely overwhelming and is generally more old school (read: most of her RPG experience comes in the form of being at Dave Arneson's table as a sub for some sessions). She's literally looking only at the things that catch her eye and hasn't read the whole book, but said she'd be willing to play a level 1 playtest adventure at an upcoming con. She said Ranger to start, so we started building a Ranger. Here's a short list of things that sent her down the spiral a bit:

  • Lore skills don't make any sense, especially since you could have something like Lore (Pickles). This also means that authors could reasonably put things like Lore (Pickles) into an adventure.
  • Backgrounds feel too complicated. Tying a skill feat into the Background, while thematic, caused every single one to be a page flip. Tying a Lore to each one made her question the value of any Lore skills because, again, Lore (Pickles).
  • Speaking of Backgrounds, Animal Whisperer was super confusing to her, particularly whether Train Animal (the skill feat that comes with the Background) wasn't particularly clear as to whether it did anything for her Animal Companion or if it was required for her Animal Companion to do anything worthwhile. WAAAAAAAY too many page flip rabbit holes came from this.
  • Still on Backgrounds, there's no label for it on the chapter section (that thing on every odd numbered page). Adding it to the Ancestry header would help with that.
  • Ancestry: "Hey, Gnomes can get an animal. Can I have 2 animals? Wait, it's a Familiar and they suck. F*** it, just go Dwarf." -Actual quote when reviewing this section. This was then followed by a thorough review of Rock Runner vs Weapon Familiarity. There's a feeling of TOO MANY THINGS.
  • Traits: intuitive to hardcore gamer husband, not so much to RPG luddite wife.
  • There's just a lot of page flipping and it feels like too much.

That's as far as I got with her in about an hour. No ability boosts, no skill selections, the only feat selection was the Ancestry Feat. We're using Hero Lab Online to build this level 1 character, so I'm not sure how much that adds or detracts from the process, but she has been primarily looking at the book itself for the process.


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I'm a bit late to the party, but I'm gonna throw in my 2cp. My upfront disclaimers: I buy a lot of Paizo product, I participate in the playtests, I play a lot of PFS (here's a sample of some characters), I GM a lot, I've played a few other systems, and I've co-authored a system.

Part of the problem with PF1 high end content demand is the fact that everybody knew walking into the system that high end mechanics were borked. Like, seriously borked. So why play that, right? Why would you want to set yourself up for that? That, in turn, affects the sales and design choices.

The problem with that situation, though, is that you have customers like me, who wants to go to high levels and spend a lot of money on product. I'll even go on record as saying that if there's not fairly robust support for high end content, I'm probably not going to retain interest in PF2. It doesn't have to be there right away, but I have virtually no interest in the 1-5 area of play, where PF1 has historically felt like "I don't have the ability to do anything interesting."

Low level stuff is great for simple mechanics and relatable stories. Not my area of interest, though, which means not where I want to spend my money.

****

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Also 1cp:

Ultimate Equipment wrote:

STREET MEAT

Price 1 cp; Weight 1/2 lb.

Usually sold by vendors on a thin wooden stick, these small chunks of cooked meat often come from many different sorts of creatures—rats and pigeons are the most common.

****

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Nefreet wrote:
At low level I don't think you're supposed to know anything about "that".

With a certain boon applied from a high level character onto a level 1, I would think some level 1s could very well know of those injustices.

****

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Christopher Hamilton wrote:
Why did it take so long for Colson Maldris to “go missing”?

I dunno, but I've subtitled the new scenario as "To Kill A Maldris."


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OG3 wrote:

Hi folks,

Looking for a rules clarification. Can I take Weapon Focus for the Ectoplasmatist's manifested lash.

I'd like to then take Slashing Grace and have a question about how that it interacts with Spiritual Combat.

Spritual combat does not stipulate that the free hand is being used to cast the spell the same way Spell Combat stipulates. Can I use Slashing Grace with a one handed lash and channel a spell through Spiritual Combat?

The ectoplasmic lash explicitly is a weapon, so it qualifies for Weapon Focus.

Re: Slashing Grace, my read is yes, it's legal. This FAQ talks about the issue a bit via bucklers, which can be used with SG since they don't occupy the hand. Spiritual Combat never references the hand being occupied and Spiritualists use psychic magic, which lack somatic components. Spiritual Combat also never references any of the banned combat forms, such as two-weapon fighting. While Spiritual Combat is similar to Spell Combat, they are not the same and neither references the other. Expect table variation, though.

****

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Steven Schopmeyer wrote:
Then you will love The Tyrant's Grasp. :) I suspect the last volume will be sanctioned for 20th level characters, if time allows.

I would hope that Return is similarly sanctioned.

****

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I would very much like it if the level range extended past 15 for that special. It would be nice to have something besides Race to get to 20.

****

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1 hour 26 minutes in is about where Lini starts up.


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My PFS reach dude. Not exactly brute strength, but I did throw a minotaur 60' once. 30' reach with full threaten is pretty good.


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Replying here is the best way to continue the topic.

When interpreting the FAQ, it's important to understand what penalties it's talking about. Specifically, it's referring to the ones referenced in the combat chapter:

"Two-Weapon Fighting
If you wield a second weapon in your off hand, you can get one extra attack per round with that weapon. You suffer a –6 penalty with your regular attack or attacks with your primary hand and a –10 penalty to the attack with your off hand when you fight this way. You can reduce these penalties in two ways. First, if your off-hand weapon is light, the penalties are reduced by 2 each. An unarmed strike is always considered light. Second, the Two-Weapon Fighting feat lessens the primary hand penalty by 2, and the off-hand penalty by 6."

Because of this, even if you didn't have the feat Two-Weapon Fighting, you wouldn't take the normal -6/-10 penalties if you used two shields. Other penalties, like the shaken condition or if the shield has the broken condition, still apply if you have Shield Master. Only the Two-Weapon Fighting penalty is negated.

You cannot use a buckler to shield bash unless you have another ability that allows it. You could use two heavy shields and not take the Two-Weapon Fighting penalties, though.

Responder aqui é a melhor maneira de continuar o tópico.

Ao interpretar o FAQ, é importante entender de que penalidade está falando. Especificamente, está se referindo aos referenciados no capítulo de combate:

"Combate com Duas Armas
Se você empunhar uma segunda arma na sua mão, você pode obter um ataque extra por rodada com essa arma. Você sofre uma penalidade de -6 com seu ataque regular ou ataques com sua mão principal e uma penalidade de -10 para o ataque com a sua mão quando você luta dessa maneira. Você pode reduzir essas penalidades de duas maneiras. Primeiro, se a sua arma fora da mão for leve, as penalidades são reduzidas em 2 cada. Um ataque desarmado é sempre considerado leve. Em segundo lugar, o talento Combate com Duas Armas reduz a penalidade da mão principal em 2 e a penalidade da mão em off por 6. "

Por causa disso, mesmo que você não tenha o feito Combate com duas armas , não tomaria as penalidades normais de -6 / -10 se você usasse dois escudos. Outras penalidades, como a condição de abanão ou se o escudo tiver a condição quebrada, ainda se aplicam se você tiver o Mestre do Escudo. Apenas a penalidade de Combate com Duas Armas é negada.

Você não pode usar um broquel para proteger o bash a menos que você tenha outra habilidade que permita isso. Você poderia usar dois escudos pesados ​​e não tomar as penalidades de Combate com Duas Armas, no entanto.


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1st: No, due to this FAQ. When using the Shield Brace feat, one hand is occupied with the shield, while the other is wielding a two handed weapon. As such, the FAQ specifies that you do not use the two handed damage bonus.

2nd: Yes, you do not suffer penalties for two-weapon fighting due to this FAQ. Each shield counts as "another weapon" for the sake of this FAQ when two-weapon fighting with two shields. The equipment chapter is clear that shields are weapons, with heavy shields being one-handed martial weapons and light shields being light martial weapons.

1º: Não, devido a esta FAQ. Ao usar o talento Escudo, uma mão está ocupada com o escudo, enquanto o outro está empunhando uma arma de duas mãos. Como tal, o FAQ especifica que você não usa o bônus de dano de duas mãos.

2º: Sim, você não sofre penalidades por combates de duas armas devido a esta FAQ. Cada escudo conta como "outra arma" por causa deste FAQ quando duas armas brigam com dois escudos. O capítulo do equipamento é claro que escudos são armas, com escudos pesados ​​sendo armas marciais de uma mão e escudos leves sendo armas marciais leves.


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Weather Report wrote:
Serisan wrote:
No joke, my level 20 psychic in PFS had a ring of sustenance that he wore from early in his career...to stave off the munchies. He was Psychedelia discipline.
Nice, I am picturing Shaggy, the Occultist.

I suppose Venture-Captain Mystic Mickey with the Sick Sticky Icky is not that far off from Shaggy. The whole Venture-Captain thing was a lot like getting promoted to manager at Taco Bell - he started feeling responsible for his junior agents.


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kyrt-ryder wrote:
Boomerang Nebula wrote:
Ryan Freire wrote:
So beyond the standard magic items, and stat boosters, i'd really like to see some of these other magic items bite the dust. Leading off with the ring of sustenance and all of its permutations. It should take more than a couple grand to kill sleep requirements and eating requirements dead. Cheap magic that removes environmental threat, supply management, and time management needs to go. PC's should have to think a little before traipsing off to the uncharted wilderness for an adventure.
I think 2,500 gp is too cheap relative to other rings. In our medium to high level parties everyone has one.

Really?

They're all giving up that precious ring slot for such minor benefits?

No joke, my level 20 psychic in PFS had a ring of sustenance that he wore from early in his career...to stave off the munchies. He was Psychedelia discipline.


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^^ The ring is the best option out there.


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blahpers wrote:


Anguish wrote:

Stop, please.

We just had this debate four days ago and the thread is locked because it's still being moderated. I get it that you're excited to drive traffic to your blog. But really, we don't need this topic again.

?

This one.


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I refuse to track encumbrance without computer assistance (HeroLab) for PF1E, hard stop. Even then, I have to fiddle with it for things like "what's stored in my room back at the inn or similar?" There are odd artifacts that come up with encumbrance, as well, like magic items having singular weight values, regardless of size. I've known a particular 5 strength gnome kineticist who had difficulty staying at light encumbrance and still getting a belt, Pathfinder Pouch, and cloak on.

Bulk is just easier. I don't mind tracking that on paper. The numbers correspond directly to something on my character without a chart to convert and reducing items to only 3 categories of bulk (null, Light, and #) makes life easy.


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In campaigns, I tend to see no duplicate PC races. Organized Play doesn't fit that mold, really, but it's pretty close.


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Can we also do away with form-fitting butt armor?


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I've always ruled it as individual explosions, so fire resistance applies multiple times, there are multiple saves, etc.


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Source Severance selecting Divine and Mage's Disjunction should carry this fight.

****

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BigNorseWolf wrote:
nfelddav wrote:
. And self-indulgent explanations about how hard it is to get pronouns right are not better.

It is not self indulgent in the least. Its realistic. .

The difference between "he...sorry, they" and "she...sorry, they, I just have such a hard time with...(insert things and reasons)...and that's why I keep screwing up" is, in fact, self-indulgent and it doesn't help the situation at all.


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Matthew Downie wrote:
Quandary wrote:
Uh... "Spell Power" is less gamey than "Spell Points"?

Yes.

Anything with "points" in sounds gamey.

I can just about imagine something in a fantasy world saying, "His spell power is too much for us! We must retreat!" Or talking about "magic reserves" or "spirit energy" or "mana" or "mystic vitality" or something like that.

I can't imagine "He has too many spell points!" as anything other than a game term.

Not that this is a big problem. Hit Points is clearly a game term, but we got used to that.

I'm on your bandwagon here: Game mechanic term =/= how it's referred to by PCs/NPCs

I get that people aren't always on board with the terms used in the game. From a gameplay perspective, though, HP isn't supposed to be known without using status on people. Deathwatch provides a good explanation of how things appear to PCs.

I will admit, though, that some players have gone the extra mile to get around that with phrasings like "on an arbitrary scale of 0 to 94, I'm at about a 33."


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I've got an archer inquisitor 9 in PFS, no archetype. I went Transmutation, Abjuration, Divination, Conjuration for implements. Current powers are Sudden Speed, Philosopher's Touch, Mind Eye, Side Step, and Powerful Connection, though Powerful Connection is definitely due to theme more than mechanics. Typical daily assignment at this point is 4 abj, 3 conj, 6 div, 6 trans (total 19).

For melee, sword and shield is fine. You're a psychic caster, so you don't use your hands at all. For melee, Side Step is extremely helpful, especially if you're planning on heavy armor. I use the abjuration points almost exclusively for Mind Barrier, though it is effectively my cloak currently (I could change that, I have module gold sitting).


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CactusUnicorn wrote:
Just posting my experience. I'm a middle schooler (yeah Gen Z!) and I alternate between the two usually using points.

Glad to see a middle schooler engaged with the game and the community.

****

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Ignorant cis white dude here. When portraying non-binary character and in the position of correcting a wrong pronoun, is it better to use "I don't identify as..." over "I am not..."? Alternately, would it be better to use a more affirmative "I am nonbinary"? Is there a preferred standard around that language or should I look for clues in the character's write-up?


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I'm playing in Legendary Planet as a Vesk Soldier. He's convinced he's on a reality TV show and that there are microcameras everywhere, has ranks in Prof: TV Personality, and the like. I have Climbing Suckers and I tend to switch hit between a heavy weapon and unarmed strikes.

So I'm on the ceiling directly above the boss during one of our major encounters. I've got my reaction cannon in hand. Mathematically, the full attack is the clear winner here given my attack bonuses, but...

FROM THE TOP ROPE! *detaches climbing suckers and goes for the elbow drop*

*Nat 20*

*dead boss*


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Always remember that we're talking about a flying skull that should only be active if disturbed (unless Torpor was removed/modified by the GM). Scoop it into a bag of holding and poke the bag if you have to.

****

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philipjcormier wrote:

"kinetic healer(sp): save: none SR: yes 1 pt. burn to self or target to heal = blast damage".....umm....pretty sure blast damage goes up ever odd level....outstrips a CLW potion/wand at any level past 1st.

Congratulations on a 2 year necro to respond to someone who hasn't posted on the boards in 10 months.


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Just gonna throw out there that the old trope of nimble elves in the woods being a terrifying thing actually looks to play out in this system. A few underleveled archer NPCs and a few underleveled illusionist NPCs together could rapidly turn itself into a Tucker's Kobolds, but with elves. This wasn't nearly as easy to pull off in PF1.


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Grumpus wrote:

So do Elves get doubly screwed on their frailty?

It seems they get the least HP AND also a Con penalty.
I realize that we don't know exactly how HP are determined, but it seems overly harsh for a lot of concepts to have 2 penalties to HP.

You can use your floating bonus to buff your Con.


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And here I am, still wishing Seifter's April Fools joke was reality. Skittermanders >>>>>> Elves.


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Ring of Inner Fortitude (minor) and Stone of Good Luck, sell the horseshoe.


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Claxon wrote:
Dimensional Agility is less for actual casters and more for characters like Monks, people who take Horizon Walker, or find other ways to get access to DDoor where it might be harder to get access to the other spells you mention.

Rogue/Horizon Walker. I've run for a dimensional savant rogue before. It's nasty.

There are use cases for Dimensional Agility on full casters, particularly when you get Quicken Spell as an option. I don't think there's a point to it with most classes and builds, though.


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JohnHawkins wrote:
I don't think 2nd edition will have any impact on the Return of the RUnelords AP , and I would be amazed if we don't get stats for at least some of the runelords. I think Sorshen is almost certain to be one we get stats for, I half expect to get 1 runelord per module with Greed being the one we don't get due to Karzoug's earlier demise

Sloth is also canonically dead through PFS. The Waking Rune has you wake up and kill Krune.


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I said it at PaizoCon last year, in several threads, and I'll repeat it here: define Burrow. 10 years in and there are still no actual rules for burrow speed. I played a PFS character to 16 and he had burrow speed as an option for 11 of those levels. I had to ask GMs to define it at every table.


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Honestly, this personnel torpedo sounds far more goblin than vesk.


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Absalom Station = 10 pages. In fact, that's a pattern for all of the "worlds" sections, which are the first 147 pages. 148-164 expand on starships, 164-179 are a variety of factions and NPC stat blocks (hellknights, street gangs etc.), and 180-214 are player options, including a smattering of additional player races.

I suspect that a lot of what you're looking for will be covered in this book.


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Lord's Banner of Crusades is pretty amazing, honestly. Portable Hallow is very nice. Lord's Banner of Terror is also good with the auto-shaken, ditto for Hobgoblin Battle Standard (despair) for auto-sickened.


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thaX wrote:


"Hello. I'm Randoff Scott." Smile.

Mandatory Blazing Saddles clip.


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Isabelle Lee wrote:

True story: I specifically wrote the Westcrown devil to work with unchained rogue. In the original version, it even let you retrain your choice of finessable weapon to longsword when you gained the ability.

It lost that bit of text in development - if I recall, it was a mix of "cutting things for space" and a development policy of treating unchained classes other than summoner as purely optional. If I were your GM, I'd allow it without a second thought. And even if not, retraining should be an option.

Hopefully this helps. ^_^

How is it that you wrote like...all of my favorite things from that book?


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Easier to just link the character sheet.

I switch hit pretty frequently and spend a fair amount of time in melee, despite the 3 point stat mod swing. The devastation blade was looted from our last encounter, so I haven't started swinging that yet.


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For my Starfinder character: "Convinced his being kidnapped was just the beginning of a new season of Planetary Survivor."

For my proposed Preservationist Alchemist: "He wants to be the very best, like no one ever was."


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Erk Ander wrote:
HWalsh wrote:

Operatives are underpowered?

Uh... What?

They have the best skills, they can easily have the highest saves, they have the best skill bonuses bar none, their trick attack puts them above every class that isn't specifically Soldier or specifically a Melee Solarian.

What more do you want from a class? They are the most powerful freaking class in the game.

But All types of Soldiers, Solarians and MEchanics outdamage them.

This has not been my experience. Heck, last night, the only time I matched the trick attacks from a level 7 operative was when I crit as my level 7 soldier.


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TheFinish wrote:


I mean I think they're pretty distinct already. And nobody thinks Sylphs and Elves are the same, but they're both Medium Races with +2 Dex/+2 Int/-2 Con

No no, we definitely call them "fart elves."

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