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Contract Devil

Sebastian Hirsch's page

Goblin Squad Member. RPG Superstar 2015 Star Voter. Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber. FullStar Pathfinder Society GM. 2,212 posts (2,562 including aliases). 2 reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 16 Pathfinder Society characters. 2 aliases.


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Silver Crusade *

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CariMac, I am sorry that you had a bad experience, without knowing what scenario you played, your experience and the other players, it is very hard to judge the situation properly.

The tone of their delivery might have been unacceptable, but that doesn't grand us insight into why they acted in such a fashion, there
are a number of scenarios out there where one wrong step can lead to a TPK.

I suspect, that you were just unlucky enough to sit at a table with a couple of difficult players, it is an unfortunate chance when you go to a convention, but the other people are usually worth it.

Silver Crusade *

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Honestly seems like a nightmare to balance, and not unlike alchemists, I can see a situation where one player regularly crafts consumeables (scrolls, potions etc. ) and hand them out to the group for the duration of the scenario.

Scribe scroll and craft wand would be so amazing...

Silver Crusade *

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Just to clarify, it is ok for your paladin to accept the evil outsiders of your party members... however getting one yourself might not be the best idea.

Silver Crusade *

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I think a lot of my playes would welcome the chance to play catfolk.

Personally after all the tech scenarios in season 6 I would appreciate the chance to play an Android.

Samsarans would be very welcome too.

Silver Crusade *

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
BigNorseWolf wrote:
Well, we DO account for wands crafted by rangers if they're the only ones that can make it.

Yeah, but only if the spell isn't on the druid list, and please don't remind me - I am perfectly aware of the legality of the potion of strong jaw, and suspect that this ruling was only made to annoy people like me. ^^

Silver Crusade *

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A wand of alchemical allocation is so damn cheap, and can be abused with quite a number of high CL potions out there.

Removing the option to buy it as a wand, seems like a positive development - if it was ever legal.

Clarification would be appreciated, if only for PFS. Just like we don't account for wands crafted by rangers, we should not account for other unusual corner cases.

Silver Crusade *

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Well I gues it depends on the GM, but why would any GM, but I usually carry only one of each pregen (2 for some of the more popular ones, and I flat out refuse to give some of them to new players).

Silver Crusade *

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Avatar-1 your guide works very well for me, thank you very much.

Silver Crusade *

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Captain Sir Hexen Ineptus wrote:
Nefreet wrote:

Do you play nothing but Tieflings?

EDIT: specifically, what did you think of this comment earlier?

No, just had an idea for a few recently. I have played a lot of standard races, but the small races, in my long career in DnD/PF playing. I think I just need a game that is more open to creativity than this ATM. I am not bashing on the PFS, its just a personal preference atm.

I was referring to comments like this.

Thats ok, if you ever see a PFS game in your area, maybe grab a pregen and give it a try. I can't guarantee any particular performance, but it is a good option to see if this could have long term value to you.

Personally I think PFS offers quite a bit of RP, and allows much more than most home campaigns (I know a couple of GM who would not allow anything outside the CRB)

Silver Crusade *

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Muser wrote:
Sebastian Hirsch wrote:
I am frankly pretty happy that Demon Lords and similar entities are not legal options in society play.
Additional Resources wrote:


Inner Sea World Guide

Gods: All gods listed in the tables on pages 229, 231, and 234 are legal for play.

Sorry for raining on your parade. Table 231 lists the major demon lords and hellish archfiends.

Ok I need to report a hero lab error - I regularly use it search for gods based on keywords - and I was absolutely to lazy to comb through all this:

Pathfinder Campaign Setting: Gods and Magic wrote:


Gods: all of the gods listed on the inside front cover are legal choices for clerics or inquisitors;
Pathfinder Campaign Setting: Inner Sea Gods wrote:
Gods: all of the gods listed in the appendix are legal choices except daemon harbingers, great old ones, infernal dukes, malebranche, nascent demon lords, orc deities, outer gods, qlippoth lords, and whore queens;
Pathfinder Campaign Setting: Inner Sea World Guide wrote:
Gods: All gods listed in the tables on pages 229, 231, and 234 are legal for play;

Silver Crusade *

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I am frankly pretty happy that Demon Lords and similar entities are not legal options in society play.

Silver Crusade *

4 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Well it seems like your player is making his chosen faction work - I always assumed followers of Groetus (despite being followers of a CN God) always want to stop Rovagug with the words:

"You are not allowed to destroy the world, we have a schedule to keeeeeep! "

After writing that I suddenly feel extremely German...

That followers of Rovagug and other "unconventional" deities sometimes have problems in scenarios - in one very recent scenario... well chances are, that a player could become irredeemably evil after switching sides.

Silver Crusade would have been a disaster, I can't - but I want to see - imagine that character in first steps part 1, doing the Silver Crusade mission.

Silver Crusade *

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Alexander Lenz wrote:

I would not have a problem with that but maybe that comes from playing with a VL who fanaticly tries to get the (non divine casters) to worship his Eidolon as a God of Fluffyness and "all cute things" -> As long as everyone at the table is ok with that i do not see a problem if there is you can remain silent because you do not get anything mechanicly from this. Not to say that I play with a Paladin of Erastil since 4 Levels and must ask every Scenario what god he worships because it could be any "good god wiht something to do with nature/boats" so i do not think it is THAT relevant to know the exact god of a divine class -> Heck there is even a seperatist archetype for those wierdo Clerics.

And because of Crossovers: After seeing someone playing Sara Kerrigan (Starcraft) as an Eidolon of his (pretty nonexistant) summoner and that contributing much to the fun of the table i have no problem with crossovers.

But all in all as long you do not disturb the table with it do it if it makes the game more fun.

Well, I guess there is a difference between the inspiration for a character (in my chase usually a piece of art (picture, game novel) and how you actually want to RP the character.

When it comes to the specific rules question in the OP, the only issue, that is a bit unclear is Deific Obedience and the Evangelist class. Claiming as part of your RP to be the disciple of one god, and having another god on your character sheet (and the corresponding obedience feat... well expect table variation), and since this can ruin a character, I would advise against doing so.

(Unless you know the GMs in your are and ask them ahead of time).

Silver Crusade

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Mark Seifter wrote:
Talgeron wrote:
Can you clarify if Unwelcome Halo, from Inner Sea Gods, in fact works the same way as Daylight? I've experienced table variation based on the spell level, despite the fact that it has the same language as Daylight.
It's not in the RPG line, so the design team can't officially clarify on it. That said, it sure looks like it does, which, granted, puts it far outside the expected power level of a 1st-level spell.

I am very grateful for the illuminating blog, but the fact that that policy (no FAQ/Errata for softcovers etc.) is in place, is still pretty high on my admittedly short list of things I would love to see changed.

Silver Crusade *

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Streamwalker wrote:

Ok, a little weird question:

Since Tiger and Lion use same statistics as animal companions, is their hybrid, known as Liger, possible to use as companion?

Seems like a pretty cut and dry reflavoring question. So yeah, expect table variation, and choose and animal in case it ever becomes relevant if your cat is a lion or a tiger....

And frankly if you are a Hunter, like my -1 it is pretty damn relevant when I want to use share shape

Share Shape wrote:


School transmutation (polymorph); Level ranger 3, sorcerer/wizard 4, witch 4

CASTING

Casting Time 1 standard action

EFFECT

Duration 1 hour/level (D)

DESCRIPTION

This spell functions as beast shape II, but you may only assume the form of an animal of a type identical to your animal companion or familiar. If your familiar or companion is not an animal, this spell has no effect.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I would welcome a clarification regarding this issue. Currently I assume, that modifier is not multiplied.

Also remember that logic doesn't equal good game design.

Silver Crusade *

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Congrats! Maybe they work you to the bone ^^ :P

Silver Crusade *

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Congratulations Alexander, unfortunately I could not immediately place your Name... but of course Azlanti Ric is a character one tends to remember.

Good luck, and if you need any help, just ask Mainz is not a significantly longer drive than Frankfurt for me ^^ (I am looking forward to congratulate you on Saturday in question, there might be cake)

Silver Crusade

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So two friends had a falling out, well it happens.

Try reduce the amount of sharing and off topic discussions at the table, and schedule a separate time for anyone who wants do participate (maybe a shared dinner or something) to talk your their real lifes (you know the stuff you can talk about with close friends).

That said, I know how it feels to have others air their grievances to you (I might be to good at that, apparently people love to tell me their problems), and sometimes even I need a friendly ear to talk about my own problems.

Every gaming table has their own set of unwritten rules, and those should be relatively obvious to everybody.

Silver Crusade *

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Smoke & Mirrors wrote:

not sure how I can keep the flavor of Smoke and re-skin into a Unchained Summon.

So, I'm fishing for help converting my 4th level Summoner, trying hard to keep the flavor...

Background. Mirrors is an Azata Blooded Aasimar, a well-to-do rich kid who in his adolescence slipped off with some of his fathers cigars ("he'll never notice them missing) to try out smoking. Mostly with the expected results (got sick). But he found that when he tried to blow smoke rings (something he had seen his father do) he kept getting humaniod shapes.... several weeks and a number of cigars later and he found he could create "almost real" shapes. Being a young male with a normal imagination, his "imagined shape" began to take on the shape often imagined by young adolescent males... you get the idea. Now add in a touch of Anime - and perhaps a splash of succubus (but not evil). And you have Smoke.

Table Tent describes him like ths: Summoner/"Party Face" - Azata Blooded Aasimar, Silver Mirrored Eyes, white hair, Golden Halo, Dressed in brightly colored silks and leather lamellar armor - he often has "Smoke" hiding near by.

Mirrors calls up Smoke with a procedure that involves lighting up and "smoking" a cigar -

Smoke - Small Humaniod Eidolon. NOT a combat creature. At the first sign of combat, Mirrors will normally "send her away". She is VERY SHY, and hides all the time (and is very good at not being seen). She is very curious - kind of like a kitten - and always looking for hidden things - and good at finding them.
Feats: 1) Extra Traits (Kobold neighbor & Inspired), 2) Skill Focus (Stealth)
Evolution Points: 1)Skilled (Stealth), 2) Skilled (Perception), 3) Skilled (Disable Device), 4) Scent, 5) Climb, 6-7) Flight (just gave her this one, and haven't used it yet, so not sure what her wings look like. Butterfly wings maybe? or more like a succubus?).

So - how do I convert this? I've got a "Rich Kid" Summoner with a "Sex Kitten" Eidolon who many people will think is just imaginary... 'cause they never see it.

You might have a clashing alignment, but and air elemental eidolon should work for that concept.

Silver Crusade *

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Kerney wrote:

I'm not a fan of the new summoner. In fact, I don't think I really understood on a gut reaction how some people felt about the APG summoner until I realized I felt that way about what think of as the new coke summoner.

That said, I feel like I need to at least look at converting. Considering that my favorite thing to do was to skirt designer intent by not making pounce monsters but making 12 int skill monkeys and wand wielding creapy children and such I suspect their is little here for me.

Am I wrong? Please, tell me I'm wrong.

The new summoner makes a pounce eidolon significantly harder, your creapy children should be fine^^

Silver Crusade *

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Nefreet wrote:
Divvox2 wrote:
gnoams wrote:
cons- way less customization, particularly in your eidolon's appearance
Am I missing something? You can't play plant-types or (actual) insect types, that's true, but looking at all the different lores of deamons, angels, and other subtypes I'm having a hard time picturing a situation where you couldn't do just about anything outsider-themed. It IS an outsider after all, and always has been (there really aren't many outsider plants or insects).

As I had mentioned (somewhere) up thread, I had a 6th level GM credit blob slated to be a Summoner, who would RP as a Necromancer.

Undead Eidolon, Skeletalal Champion themed, who took traits and feats to really fit the whole theme (including my Dhampir boon).

Needless to say, that idea got scrapped.

(not a complaint in the manner of wanting a change, or an exception, but a response to the sentiment that whatever the old Summoner could do, the new one can as well)

Actually, I asked and could not find a source one way or the other regarding the evolutions from ultimate magic.

So unless I missed something you could totally create that undead looking eidlon (some the evil outsiders, could work and maybe we will get a daemon variant at some point)

Silver Crusade *

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Woran wrote:
Blackbot wrote:
Guys, I'm not saying it's impossible - just that it's not as far-spread and most people are hesitant to get a credit card just because they want to buy PDFs at paizo.com.

You cant get pre-paid credit cards at a gas station in the netherlands, that's for sure.

If you really need it, there is always someone you can ask. Its just a bit sour to pay 10$ (or 9 with the taxfest code), for a PDF so you can play your character if you dont really want to.
I dont have a horse in this race. I dont have a summoner character. But I am a physical book kind of person. So are many others here. That's 10 bucks you could have spend on other items.

Agreed, but I feel that this is a special case, since only 40 or so pages of the book are really relevant (ok and skill unlocks) so just printing the class should be a valid option for many players.

Silver Crusade *

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Mystic Lemur wrote:
Sebastian Hirsch wrote:
And it is not like having more GM stars really gives you more forum credibility - personally I think it kinda creates a bit of an unfair expectation like "What did that 4 Star GM just say? I can't believe how someone with so many reported games can still say something so [description] " ...

Hey! I represent that remark! Although I guess I don't have "so many" since I've been sitting at 3 stars for over a year now.

Some folks just like to do the "sanctioned" material. Some like to explore the town and learn all the little plot connections. There's no wrong way to play besides outright cheating. "Alright guys, I have no idea what's in this next room, but for some reason I have a feeling the guy with the highest touch AC needs to go first."

Represent or resent ? Depending in [description] I can see this go either way^^ :P

trollbill wrote:
Sebastian Hirsch wrote:
Woran wrote:
The Fox wrote:
How much are the gold stars worth? Maybe we should just get rid of them if they are causing this much trouble.
I just dont see how you could abuse them. That +4 or whatever one a single re-roll wont be game breaking.

#

And it is not like having more GM stars really gives you more forum credibility - personally I think it kinda creates a bit of an unfair expectation like "What did that 4 Star GM just say? I can't believe how someone with so many reported games can still say something so [description] " ...

Damn. There goes my delusions of thinking I had credibility.

Well, you have/lack the credibility you obviously have/lack, based on your actions at the table and your post here in the forum.

So yeah you are fine/doomed ^^ It is just, that the spiky things between your faction symbol and your username have nothing to do with it.

Of course if you were a VL or a VC, things would be different. Every positive remark would be received as expected (and kinda fake, since it is your job) of you, and every not 100 % courteous and professional, you are literally the an amalgamation of Adolf Hitler and the devil.

Isn't the internet fun ^^

Silver Crusade *

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Benjamin Falk wrote:
Try a prepaid credit card. Those should be available for free at most banks from 16 years on for students and people in apprenticeship.

I second the suggestion, and have to add that quite a number of local supermarkets and petrol stations started to carry the prepaid kind.

EDIT: And players/other GMs can just ask me to get them some store credit, if you bother to ask, finding someone in your area who can help you is easy.

Silver Crusade *

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
BigNorseWolf wrote:
The page number thing is annoying as heck

Agreed, but there might be method to the madness, that way it is significantly harder to learn what is legal in the book, if you don't have the book/pdf in front of you.

And frankly I don't think that the archive and hero lab are entirely reliable either.

Silver Crusade *

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Woran wrote:
The Fox wrote:
How much are the gold stars worth? Maybe we should just get rid of them if they are causing this much trouble.
I just dont see how you could abuse them. That +4 or whatever one a single re-roll wont be game breaking.

#

And it is not like having more GM stars really gives you more forum credibility - personally I think it kinda creates a bit of an unfair expectation like "What did that 4 Star GM just say? I can't believe how someone with so many reported games can still say something so [description] " ...

Silver Crusade *

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Anonymous Visitor 163 576 wrote:
They are very simple to rig, Sebastian.
kinevon wrote:
Sebastian Hirsch wrote:
kinevon wrote:
GM Lamplighter wrote:

Often you had to add the color yourself, with a marker, and fill in the indented numbers with crayon so you could read them.

And since the earth's crust hadn't yet solidified, we lost a lot of dice into the molten lava... ;)

Then again, god help anyone caught using either a spin down die (Migic life counter), or Formula D dice (most of which have non-standard numbering), in my games.
What is so bad about the life counter ones, they do roll just fine.

Because all the large numbers are on the same hemisphere, they can be easy to do a roll on that leaves that side (or the other side) of the die on top.

Side spins and such, instead of a true roll.

Bad enough I had a player when I was organizing LFR that was known for "dropping" a d20 with an unwanted number on it off the table, so he could put another one down with the number he wanted to have rolled showing...

Well I have used them for years to determine who starts in MTG, but then I usually use a dice cup.

I think the dice with only the numbers 11-20 are easy to catch, but the ones with 2 20s are quite insidious. I really hope it never comes up. I might declare the character irredemably evil just right then and there and await whatever judgement comes down the pipeline (actually just kicking the player out of every Game I GM might work just as well, and I would avoid the wrath of my VC)

Silver Crusade *

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kinevon wrote:
GM Lamplighter wrote:

Often you had to add the color yourself, with a marker, and fill in the indented numbers with crayon so you could read them.

And since the earth's crust hadn't yet solidified, we lost a lot of dice into the molten lava... ;)

Then again, god help anyone caught using either a spin down die (Migic life counter), or Formula D dice (most of which have non-standard numbering), in my games.

What is so bad about the life counter ones, they do roll just fine.

Silver Crusade *

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

A combination of Inkscape and poster Razor works quite well for me, I will share pictures when it is opportune.

Silver Crusade *

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Woran wrote:
Ibram Gaunt wrote:
Woran wrote:
137ben wrote:
Sebastian Hirsch wrote:
BigNorseWolf wrote:
Undead Mich wrote:
As a Magic player, I've noticed a definite sense of superiority from RPG players, It kept me out of the hobby for a long time, until a friend invited me into his home game.
i think role players and card players are on that mutual level of "thinks they're not a geeky as" level of the chart...

Yeah it is nice too look towards other people and think "at least I am not that nerdy", my only problem is that I am part of too many groups: I played WOW excessively, I play MTG, I watched the old Pokemon anime, I watched entirely to much MLP, I watch way to much anime in general, read comic books, novels, play MOBAS... and watch Dr. Who...

Really the only group of Nerds where I don't have anything to talk about are sport nerds, and even then talking about certain martial arts works.

Everyone else: "At least I'm not as nerdy as Sebastian Hirsch"

:D
HA I AM MORE NERDY I ALSO LARP

Let's see:

Watching MANY MANY Anime (Even very old one) check
Still playing MTG Check
Watching MLP Check
Beside PFS I also played 4 different RPGs Check
Being a Treckie: Check
Did play many Video Games on Tournament Level in the Past (For example Tekken, Soul Calibur, Street Fighter etc. ) Check
Looking at DVD Shelf: Let's see: Arnold Schwarzenegger, Bud Spencer, Sylvester Stallone...... Check
I also still play Battletech: Check
Looking at Book shelf: Forgotten realms, Warhammer 40K (Gaunts Ghosts) the entire Battletech series, Wing Commander, Warrior Cats, Harry Potter, Moby Dick, Shakespeare, Dracula, Sherlock Holmes Hmmmmmm Many classics more.... CHECK.

Hmm, Sorry, I think I beat you ;)

Only thing I avoid with a passion is everything, Marvel, DC related. These are definitely not my style of comics. ;)

Aw, sorry honey, for giving you hope :P

I am really into Dr. Who, have the scredrivers, have 10th doctor cosplay, have a signed Dalek. Met David Tennant and Billy piper.

I have a portal gun, and much more collectible merchanidse.

I am probably forgetting some things, but its late..

Literally kinda green with envy.

Silver Crusade *

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Kerney wrote:

One request as a summoner lover. I get the feeling the stigma the class has had extended to some extent to the designers and editors. I don't have proof. It's just things like not seeing am npc summoner since season two and the speed of the transition.

What I am asking is some "rehabilitation" for the class in pfs adventures. Make a summoner eidilon combo important npcs in some adventures. Maybe have a Summoner venture captain with an eidilon sitting in on the briefings. Basically, please try to make the class a bit more part of the world.

Thanks in advance,

Kerney

One "lovely" level of Emerald spire featurs the same summoner 3 times.

Silver Crusade *

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Anonymous Visitor 163 576 wrote:

Very old dice were printed 1-10, twice. The color of the number was how you told the difference between a 4 and a 14. Basically, the other color meant "add 10".

Actually you can still buy those "special" D20s with nonstandard numbes, a friend of mine recently got one as a surprise gift.

God save the player if I ever catch him with one of these ^^

Silver Crusade *

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Sammy T wrote:
Quote:

The leadership of this organized play community assumes

that you will use common sense in your interpretation of
the rules. This includes being courteous and encouraging
a mutual interest in playing, not engaging in endless rules
discussions. While you are enjoying the game, be considerate
of the others at the table and don’t let your actions keep them
from having a good time too. In short, don’t be a jerk.

You want to fireball the gaggle of goblins.

I'm in the middle of the gaggle of goblins.

You want to cast Fireball.

You ask if you can Fireball me too.

I do not want to be Fireballed.

You decide to Fireball anyways.

I hope the GM stops that action as that violates the "don't be a jerk" rule. If the affected player does not want to be affected, then as courteous players we should defer to their request.

Quote:

The goal of Pathfinder Society Organized Play is to provide

an enjoyable experience for as many players as possible.
Player-versus-player conflict only sours a session. While
killing another character might seem like fun to you, it
certainly won’t be for the other character’s player. Even if
you feel that killing another PC is in character for your
PC at this particular moment, just figure out some other
way for your character to express herself. In short, you
can never voluntarily use your character to kill another
character—ever. Note that this does not apply to situations
where your character is mind-controlled by an NPC and is
forced by that NPC to attack a fellow Pathfinder.

Just because your attack won't kill me immediately, I would still consider it PvP as you intentionally damaged me against my wishes.

I honestly can't get onboard with anyone who thinks it's ok to intentionally damage another PC against their player's wishes.

What if you (well not you, the hypothetical player) are a bloody fool?

What if this Fireball is the difference between life or death for the whole party ?

The chance to kill a character vs the near certainty, that the enemies will decimate you...

Of course if the player who got himself surrounded by goblins, is successful in his attempt to have the GM prevent the action, and it results in a TPK.. the result could be that the other players at the table will just reject every playing with him again.

Silver Crusade *

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

In the product thread of Heroes of the Wild, it seemed pretty clear, that the Wild Caller is not compatible with the new summoner, and it is lacking the new kind of advancement the new summoner gets.

However it is a legal retraining option for grandfathered summoners.

Silver Crusade *

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
GM Lamplighter wrote:
Michael Thompson wrote:
I just don't understand why there is a push to negatively effect your GM pool.

Actually, the main impetus behind this suggestion is to strengthen the GM pool. Right now, there are a few people only GMing the double-credit scenarios. They are becoming higher-star GMs with half the time put in as other people, which devalues the GM reward system (and just feels wrong). There are also players preferentially playing the 3XP, single-session modules to level faster, who are "learning" that PFS is all about combat and getting points (levels) with nothing else being relevant. This style of player has caused problems in my experience, as other GMs stop wanting to run more PFS-relevant scenarios because the players just kick in the door and fight everything.

I get that there are several ways to play PFS, even if I obviously have a preference for a particular style. However, right now there is an in-game incentive to play PFS by rolling initiative at the start of the night and just fighting until you're done. To me, that isn't all that PFS is about.

Regarding GMs: I am not fully convinced, that any change would actually result in those people GMing more, it might actually have a negative effect, but since I honestly can't ever see me or a GM in my area do this...

Regarding players: Yeah, while I could run Emerald Spire for new players, the utter lack of RP in the sanctioned part (at least in the first levels) makes it a terrible introductions.

However I think the current solution - adding some particularly nasty optional encounters that people do not have to fight - and making it downright impossible to get 2 PP and some nice boons - is a good fix.
Just look at the overflow archives, a group of murderhobos will leaved that scenario with 1 PP 90 % of the time.

Silver Crusade *

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Jason Hanlon wrote:
Wind Chime wrote:
I don't know they obviously see the summoners class as being utterly broken, so much so they didn't mind insulting 90% of there fanbase by banning before they could have access to the replacement. If it was that bad to begin with then it probably shouldn't have been released to begin with.
If leadership had felt that the summoner class was enough of a disruption to play, they would have banned the class long before work had begun on putting Unchained together. Do they feel that the class needed to be powered down a little? It would seem so. A large portion of the forums seem to agree as well. But broken? They'd have outright banned it from the start. They've done it to more than one archetype or option before.

Well, let's just say, that playing something like a fighter on the same table as a summoner with a pouncing Eidolon, at lower levels it can feel a quite unfair.

The new summoner sidesteps some of the more problematic issues (spell list, some evolutions etc. ) re balance the class a bit.

I hope that the players of summoners will receive a warmer reception at PFS tables(event though I never had any complaints), and that we can now concentrate on playing more PFS^^

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John Rivers 639 wrote:
Thanks for reply. I was hoping to play female dwarf Kinetiscist/Oracle of earth named Toph. Can't wait to do so when book is released.

Well let me guess what oracle curse you will take ^^ And the best thing is, just never have to learn names, just call them "moron" or "twinkletoes^^"

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Is free RPG day a big thing in the US ? I mean if you want to try PFS you can do so pretty much for free, just sign up to an even, grab a pregen and roll some dice.

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trollbill wrote:
The Fox wrote:
trollbill wrote:
Steven Schopmeyer wrote:
Not true trollbill. If you get stuck doing every level after Godhome at full XP, you will level out of some segments and be unable to complete the entire dungeon on the same character.

My bad. You are correct. You still have to go half at least 2 levels of the adventure.

Wait, that's not right either. There are 15 levels to the dungeon and the dungeon caps out at 12th level, so you can't be higher than 12th when you play the 15th level. So you would have to go half xp for at least 6 levels normally unless you got less in Godhome and then you only have to go half xp for 4 levels.

Did I calculate that right?

If you get less than a full reward in Godhome, then you are unable to go slow unless you first do scenarios. Why? because if your XP total is not divisible by 3, you are not allowed to choose to go slow.
Ah, okay, that is a problem.

I proposed a change to the slow/fast track rule

here.

Being aware of the issue, when I played and GMed this level, well let's just say that it took us about 7 rounds of miserable combat to clear lat level.

And even considering that, I could not play level 5 yesterday with the character I actually wanted, since I used her to play a scenario (overflow archive with 3 Paladins and a Calvaier - I regret nothing^^) and switchingto slow track would have been pretty impossible after that.

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Wraith235 wrote:

trust me I am well aware of all the yes's, No,s , Corner cases, fringe events, Failed saves, Natural 1's and all that

my main thing is before I take this to the store coordinator and VL of the Store I want to make Absolutly sure that I am in the Right here

TO reiterate what BartonOliver said, just ask them for a written source, you are unlikely to get one.

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FLite wrote:

Sorry if this has been answered.

For summoner, the version in this book replaces the versions in the APG, including evolutions in the APG. (so pounce costs three points instead of 1.)

What about evolutions found in other books? such as undead appearance or shadow blend?

I think we haven't gotten an answer yet, but this might very well be a Pathfinder Rules Team issue.

Unless I am missing something, the unchained classes are silent on the issue of certain plug ins like monk vows, additional evolutions etc.

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I don't believe that rule actually exists in a written source, especially since the guide has not bee updated yet.

And frankly while I can see where this line of reasoning comes from, making it a blanket rule that doesn't even give players the chance to agree, is something I really can't agree with.

Swarms are a good example, and alchemists being unable to throw their alchemists fires and bombs ... cause they WILL miss (trust I am one of them), I don't think that this rule would actually help.

Most of those corner cases are well covered under don't be a jerk.

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9mm wrote:

Tell that to the first time pfser who walked away from my table last night when I explained what a blog post posted an hour before the start meant for his character.

At the very least I would have let him play his character as he brought it, at level 1 the differences between the two summoners is miniscule at best, then just hand him a printed version of the class from the unchained PDF and tell him to get the book when it is convenient for him.

And I would try to explain that the APG is a good book anyway (and the source for something like evolution surge). The timing was quite unfortunate, but I would not have been surprised to learn that the same happened when the synthesist and the vivisectionist were removed.

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nogoodscallywag wrote:

Wow- all 4 classes will be PFS legal...

Why would anyone play the original core version of the classes from here on out?

Quite a number of archetypes are not compatible with the new classes, some concepts like drunken master are not mechanically supported.

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pH unbalanced wrote:
Sebastian Hirsch wrote:
That said, I don't think that the list is meant to be exhaustive and while a scorpion is definitely out of the question (without Improved Familiar) some other familiars might be an option.

Unfortunately, for PFS that list is considered exhaustive, even though there are some perfectly reasonable ones that have come out since then.

I have a Winter Witch in non-PFS play -- it's a fun class.

Interesting, has this been challenged yet?

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Xallis and Navia wrote:
Sebastian Hirsch wrote:

The way I understand it, no. But the Summoner hasn't really changed aside from the spells, so your former stat allocation is still fine.

EDIT: Looking at the picture of you and your Eidolon, you might have to change your alignment.

Well dang. Xallis was built to have Charisma to the sky, but I wanted to toy with the idea of something like a battle Summoner. Or at least fix him up so he doesn't have just 12 for dex and con.

What brings up the alignment change?

An unchained Summoner has to be within 1 step of his/her Eidolon's alignment, and the alignment is now set by the subtype. Angel Eidolons are NG, Devil Eidolons are LE and Elemental Eidolons are neutral.

If a summoner's alignment changes he might not be able to summon his Eidolon any more.

The Eidolons have gained quite a bit more character and independence, thus an Angel Eidolon will quite likely refuse to burn down the Orphanage.

EDIT: If you can tell me a bit about your Eidolon, I should be able give give you some examples.

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Xallis and Navia wrote:

Xallis opens the thick iron door to his bunker, slowly peeking his head out into the open air. Nervously, he cast his gaze upon the landscape. Surely, he was lucky to survive the impact. Strangely, the landscape was unchanged. Fields were not burned away. No crowds rioted through the streets. Anarchy did not reign supreme, and everything seemed to be pleasant.

A clawed hand ruffles his hair from behind. "See?" said Naiva, brushing past him into the open air. "I told you it wasn't a big deal. Now come on, let's see if I can learn some new tricks!"

For real though. As a Summoner player, I'm downright giddy at the shot for a rebuild in a new, more flavorful version of the class. I'll gladly trade in discounted spells for the chance at trying out this fancy new system, and a shot at rebuilding some unfavorable feats on my Eidolon without having to pay for 12 levels worth of class retraining.

And pardon me if I'm asking something that was answered upthread: does the free feat/power/etc rebuild include reassigning your stats on the 20 point buy, or no?

The way I understand it, no. But the Summoner hasn't really changed aside from the spells, so your former stat allocation is still fine.

EDIT: Looking at the picture of you and your Eidolon, you might have to change your alignment.

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Damien Helslicer wrote:

I'm planning on playing a Winter Witch in an up-coming PFS game.

I don't like the familiars you get to choose from for a winter witch, so I was wondering if I take improved familiar feat at "1st level", may I choose say for example the Greensting scorpion?

As others have mentioned, unless a class very specifically calls out that the character can ignore prerequisites, you always have to fulfill those prerequisites.

The text in question, is there to help the players who take improved familiar, since in many cases their living arrangements are subject to debate (angels etc.).

And from a practical perspective, many improved familiars are significantly stronger than a couple of first level characters, thus it would be difficult to justify.

That said, I don't think that the list is meant to be exhaustive and while a scorpion is definitely out of the question (without Improved Familiar) some other familiars might be an option.

Just let me ask, is there a particular reason why you want to play as a winter witch (I am seeing another rules complication ahead) ?

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John Compton wrote:
Rycaut wrote:

I've had some really fun experiences with well done Summoners (as a player with other players playing one and as a DM with players with creative Summoners. They were strong but at least in the hands of the players around my tables they weren't broken (it helped that in the cases I'm thinking of the players had focused on really interesting roleplaying options over every last bit of optimization (but still made effective characters). These players also really focused on the Eidolon (in at least one case playing the character as if the Eidolon was the primary character.

In the hands of creative players, the Summoner had nearly infinite possibilities. I'll take a look at the new version and likely make one to try it out.

On the topic at hand - how does this ruling change (if at all) any feats or spells etc that use Evolutions? Do they now need to use only those options in Unchained? (I haven't read the updated Summoner yet - I assume they still have evolutions?)

(or are all such spells and feats individually banned in PFS already? - stuff like Evolved Familiar? Or there are some spells that involve evolutions)

To my knowledge, no spell or feat collateral has been affected by this change. I don't have the book handy right now, but I believe all of the spells work as expected (albeit ocassionally at different levels) and the feats work the same way.

When it comes to feats like evolved familiar, your familiar might have trouble to fulfill the prerequisite of some evolutions since it like won't have the subtype (corner case when it comes to something like an imp familiar)

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