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Sheriff Belor Hemolock

Sauce987654321's page

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As far as the HD limitation, you could just make a level 5 NPC class with the template.


The game has drakes, wyverns, linnorms, creatures with the half dragon template, and a bunch of other creatures with the dragon type. You don't necessarily have to use those reality warping monstrosities like true dragons.


Shasfowd wrote:
Sauce987654321 wrote:

Maybe you could make it cost twice or more of their speed to move a square (10'-15' to move one square) while the boss moves at normal speed.

Colossal monsters generally fit into a 30' square, even though they are much larger than that. That is because it was meant to make it easier to use and play with on the map and is not meant to be an accurate representation of the monster. So you don't need to necessarily make the creature occupy the exact same size of squares that the monster is.

The boss dosen't move. It is just there. Image you're on a bridge over a canyon, and a dragon attack you, but it's such a big dragon, you only fight its head. That's what it's like.

I guess for starters, you could shrink the map and make the boss occupy a bunch of squares with a giant reach. Players could move at 1/2 speed to represent how far they are from the boss.

I can probably think of more ideas that I'll post later.


Shasfowd wrote:
Shasfowd wrote:
ElementalXX wrote:

Am i the only one who read Hugo boss?

Now seriously what CR are you handling? is this monster epic?

I haven't decided yet, but I know it's gonna be a long fight.
It's less about the stats, and more about how you fit this thing into a map. These are LITERALLY the size of mountains. You're fighting a mountain.

Maybe you could make it cost twice or more of their speed to move a square (10'-15' to move one square) while the boss moves at normal speed.

Colossal monsters generally fit into a 30' square, even though they are much larger than that. That is because it was meant to make it easier to use and play with on the map and is not meant to be an accurate representation of the monster. So you don't need to necessarily make the creature occupy the exact same size of squares that the monster is.


Paulicus wrote:

Shadow of Colossus could provide some inspiration here. At that size, the boss is probably less like a 'boss' and more his own adventure/dungeon.

I remember hearing a story on these forums about someone who made a creature of that size (I remember the feet were 25' on a side or so) and it was moving towards a city. The PCs had to defend against it by targeting critical areas to weaken it. My point is, some kind of time element like that would be pretty neat.

For Shadow of the Colossus, they would be in the gargantuan and colossal range.

I don't know the CR range of your game, but you could start off with higher CR animals with the giant template to make them colossal and work from there (if it's a lower CR encounter).


Medusa heads (beheaded?)are in bestiary 4.

Templates, such as zombie, skeleton, giant, and shadow could be used on many monsters to create a number of various monsters. For example, take an elephant and apply the giant and skeleton template. Now you have a skeleton version of an oliphant from lord of the rings.


ElementalXX wrote:
It needs a energy attack or breath weapon, 1998 version had green fire thing attack, i feel a drake or a dragon would make a better base

I could throw on an additional mythic rank to grant it an ability from the universal monster rules (breath weapon). Other than that, I feel this build is pretty spot on. Making him a dragon or drake I feel is pretty inappropriate.


Tarantula wrote:

Doh!

You could.... feed the Tarrasque other animals/magical beasts that you have pup shaped?

Nah, it does a good enough job on its own, and it probably prefers to eat them at their normal size.


I3igAl wrote:
Sauce987654321 wrote:
Berselius wrote:


Ah, well, you've already have a problem then. See, Roland Emmerich's idiotic and pathetic excuse for a monster is NOT Godzilla. His monster is called "Zilla" (seriously, it's LEGALLY CALLED that now). It also goes by the titles: "Iguanasaurus" and "massive waste of Hollywood's time and money to produce a substandard piece of crap"
I wanted to stat this version because it's much easier, which I already pinned it at about CR 14.

I agree I would have gone around CR 15 myself.

For comparison a Brachiosaurus is Gargantuan and CR 10 with 18 HD. A T-Rex is CR 9, huge and 18HD too.

A Collossal T-Rex would be CR 11 after applying the Giant Template twice. If we add a swim speed and a breath weapon it might get to 12 and then you'd need to add a few HD and some more Natural Armor to get it to 14.

Note this will result in a simple melee brute, which an intelligent party of that lvl should overcome easy due to much higher versatility

I went with spinosaurus with the giant, advanced, and savage template.

The savage template was so it could have DR and energy resistances to ignore most mundane attacks, and so that it's melee attacks are more dangerous.

The giant template was for obvious reasons.

The advanced template was just for good measure.

That all comes to CR14 in order to function just like zilla did in the movie.


Berselius wrote:


Ah, well, you've already have a problem then. See, Roland Emmerich's idiotic and pathetic excuse for a monster is NOT Godzilla. His monster is called "Zilla" (seriously, it's LEGALLY CALLED that now). It also goes by the titles: "Iguanasaurus" and "massive waste of Hollywood's time and money to produce a substandard piece of crap"

I wanted to stat this version because it's much easier, which I already pinned it at about CR 14.


ElementalXX wrote:
Paizo already statted Godzilla btw.

I was just going for the 1998 film version, which is plenty weaker than the original.


Psi51 wrote:

I was thinking more in terms of physical attributes the tree would be at least 640 ft tall which would make it 3 sizes bigger than colossal assuming a doubling for each size category that would be +24 strength on colossal size and the damage dice would go up I imagine. What is the biggest creature in pathfinder ?

There is no bigger than colossal. The biggest monster is Oliphant of Jandelay, who is an elephantine monster that's thousands of feet tall.

Mechanically speaking, though, the biggest is the Aspidochelone because it occupies a 150' square.


What is a "rocket launcher tag?" I've searched it and didn't find an answer.


Why are people talking about humans swallowing mice? People do not have swallow whole. I was just bringing up the fact that you can have a bipedal colossal saurian that swallows whales and mammoths according to RAW.


Matthew Downie wrote:

"A typical triceratops is 30 feet long and weighs 20,000 pounds."

And on the same page of the Bestiary:
"The tyrannosaurus is an apex predator that measures 40 feet long and weighs 14,000 pounds."
And yet somehow the T-rex (Gargantuan) can swallow the triceratops (Huge) whole.

to be fair, the t-rex used to be huge in 3.5. You could just apply the young template to better suit it to a real world t-rex.

I like to think of pathfinder t-rex as more of a fantasy titanic sized t-rex, anyway.
It being 40' long is just fluff, as it could be nearly 100' long and it wouldn't really make a difference mechanically.


So I recently noticed that monsters with swallow whole could swallow up to a size category 1 less than the swallowing monster. I also realized that means gargantuan monsters with that ability can swallow a mammoth whole, and that same gargantuan monster that swallowed the mammoth can be swallowed by a colossal monster. That sounds pretty crazy, really.

"Realistically" speaking, how big would a colossal T-rex have to be to swallow a sperm whale?

How big would a colossal vortex dragon have to be to use its breath weapon and suck a kraken from a distance into its maw and then swallow it?

It seems like not many people have noticed this about swallow whole since I barely found anything about it by searching the boards.

What do you guys think about this? I think it's really cool to have monsters that massive in the game.


Thaine wrote:

Comics and pathfinder don't mix.

Batman's ability to work just fine with the Justice League without being overshadowed has nothing to do with his physical capabilities. It's because he's a brilliant, cunning, downright devious person. A master tactician.

In pathfinder terms, he's the player with absolute system mastery. Or the guy at the table who is always coming up with the creative solution that make the DM throw out pages of notes. You know the guy I'm talking about. That's what makes him Batman.

And that can't be replicated in Pathfinder. You can't make system mastery or creativity into class abilities or feats or attributes. It's just something the player either has or he hasn't.

He sounds like a guy with plenty of hero points.


lemeres wrote:
Sauce987654321 wrote:
chbgraphicarts wrote:
Sauce987654321 wrote:
I never liked the idea of having categories beyond colossal, as I think it sells the gargantuan and colossal size category pretty short. A gargantuan monster could swallow a mammoth whole, while the colossal monster could swallow whole that very same monster that ate the mammoth. Beyond that you could just increase reach and/or space.

Except that's not the case at all. Only certain creatures can Swallow Whole; it's not a quality of being a certain size.

Gargantuan creatures are only 30x30/6in. bases, while Colossal are 12in. bases.

Colossal is freakishly huge for a normal human, but compare a Great Wyrm Red Dragon to an aircraft carrier; or better yet, an Island Turtle - those are creatures so huge entire cities are literally built on their backs. Are we supposed to believe that something that massive only has the same statistics as a creature that is dwarfed in comparison?

Having Size Categories larger than Colossal only makes sense, frankly.

Plenty of creatures can swallow whole. A colossal T-rex can swallow whales or even Krakens. I know not all big creatures can swallow whole, but the ones that can do exactly what I'm talking about.

Like I said, you can always use a bigger space and reach. The aspidochelone is a giant whale with an island on its back, it also has a space of 150'.

....I kind of want a general rule that you can swallow hole any creature 3 sizes smaller than you...

I say 3, since I am imagining a human doing it. They can't swallow halflings. They can't swallow cats. But how about a mouse?

Are you saying I can't shove a mouse (or somethign smaller) into my mouth? I know it wouldn't be pleasant, but it at least seems possible. Maybe make it give an AoO against 0 AC, where you can prevent it if you scratch up their mouth and make them spit you out.

....plus, when I imagine the players facing Gargantuan and larger foes, I just seem to want to imagine Attack on Titan....

Humans do not have swallow whole.

Haflings do not have swallow whole.

Cats do not have swallow whole.

You do not have swallow whole.


Rogar Stonebow wrote:
So you awaken said whale. It advances as cleric, it casts righteous might.

This will make it easier. Give it the Divine mythic template and Advanced template, it could then learn and cast righteous might.


Rogar Stonebow wrote:
TriOmegaZero wrote:
Rogar Stonebow wrote:

Take a Rune Giant and then cast mythic enlarge person on him.

Mythic Enlarge Person wrote:
You can increase the target's size by up to two size categories, to a maximum of Huge.
No your wrong.. when I look at that passage, I close my eyes and can't see anything like what you describe.

Even if you do raise a rune giant's size by 2, it still doesn't go beyond colossal. This is because there is nothing beyond colossal according to RAW.

You probably still gain a size bonus from the spell's effect, if it doesn't mention anything about the spell failing if cast on a colossal monster. It's like how a huge dragon using beast shape to turn into a huge creature and still gaining the size bonuses to strength.


I take it that they're never going to have above colossal categories. Especially when creatures like Oliphant of Jandelay is thousands of feet tall and is still "only" colossal. I doubt they want to have to redesign many monsters because of adding more size categories.


chbgraphicarts wrote:
Sauce987654321 wrote:
I never liked the idea of having categories beyond colossal, as I think it sells the gargantuan and colossal size category pretty short. A gargantuan monster could swallow a mammoth whole, while the colossal monster could swallow whole that very same monster that ate the mammoth. Beyond that you could just increase reach and/or space.

Except that's not the case at all. Only certain creatures can Swallow Whole; it's not a quality of being a certain size.

Gargantuan creatures are only 30x30/6in. bases, while Colossal are 12in. bases.

Colossal is freakishly huge for a normal human, but compare a Great Wyrm Red Dragon to an aircraft carrier; or better yet, an Island Turtle - those are creatures so huge entire cities are literally built on their backs. Are we supposed to believe that something that massive only has the same statistics as a creature that is dwarfed in comparison?

Having Size Categories larger than Colossal only makes sense, frankly.

Plenty of creatures can swallow whole. A colossal T-rex can swallow whales or even Krakens. I know not all big creatures can swallow whole, but the ones that can do exactly what I'm talking about.

Like I said, you can always use a bigger space and reach. The aspidochelone is a giant whale with an island on its back, it also has a space of 150'.


I never liked the idea of having categories beyond colossal, as I think it sells the gargantuan and colossal size category pretty short. A gargantuan monster could swallow a mammoth whole, while the colossal monster could swallow whole that very same monster that ate the mammoth. Beyond that you could just increase reach and/or space.


I like to use templates to do this. If I want a titanic sized shadow saurian monster, I would use spinosaurus + giant template + shadow template, for example.


Vod Canockers wrote:

The largest animals max out at around 100' or so, which is just under the 128' that the next size category would be.

The lagest ship ever built, under construction now, is 1600' the tallest building 2717'.

There are a number of creatures that exceed 128' that are colossal.


Arachnofiend wrote:
Time Stop is 9th level. you can't give Time Stop to someone else.

If mythic is being considered, mythic time stop allows you to.


Speaking of the immense tortoise. Immense tortoise + half-dragon template = immense dragon tortoise. Makes for a cool early boss fight.


Bandw2 wrote:
Sauce987654321 wrote:
Bandw2 wrote:
well then I guess most heavy weapons are doomed to being worse than a Bow.
At higher levels, at least.
the time when you have enough money to buy them?

I wasn't considering the cost but how well they function on their own.

Heavy weapons can attack in areas or target multiple creatures. It's not something the bow can do on its own.

You can still make +5 holy rocket launcher, for what it's worth.


Bandw2 wrote:
well then I guess most heavy weapons are doomed to being worse than a Bow.

At higher levels, at least.


Bandw2 wrote:

so the weapon in question is a Railgun, which acts for the most part as a normal firearm but slow firing, and I don't see the full round action to fire, limiting it from being used for other full round actions.

dead shot doesn't say anything about choosing a specific action, it says as a full round action, do yada yada. then it says roll a number of times your BAB allows. it seems that slow firing doesn't thematically or mechanically stop dead shot.

You're right. You would be able to do that. There's one problem. None of the heavy weapons are firearms. Even the Railgun is not a firearm according to RAW.


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I think it would be a bad and pointless thing to have written in a rule book. Not only would it be a waste of space, but that would just make me think if there has to be rulings on every little thing, like going to the bathroom.

Anyway, I don't think there is a single GM on this planet that would tell you no and that you're forced to dodge against your will.


PIXIE DUST wrote:

WHat makes you think you could get dragon shaping at low leve anyway?

The Form of the Dragon spells are all top level spells... and dragons are well known for being some of the most powerful creatures in the game...

The lowest level you can be to cast form of the dragon, off the top of my head, is a level 9 wizard using a hero point to cast a spell higher than their max by 1.


PandaGaki wrote:

They'd chase them off / kill them off due to the almighty power of plot and creative decisions.

Not everything needs to be explained by a detailed math chart.

It's not really a math chart that's involved, it's their staple ability that sets them apart from any other kind of monster.


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Since t-rexes were brought up, that's a pretty reasonable challenge for a party of 5th level characters


So I noticed this rule a little while ago

"Additional Mythic Abilities: The monster gains a number of mythic abilities equal to its MR + 1. Such abilities can be drawn from the mythic path abilities for mythic heroes or the mythic abilities listed with the monsters in this section, or it can be a new ability you create by taking inspiration from those abilities. These abilities should be thematically appropriate for the creature.
Some new monster abilities are especially powerful; at the GM's discretion, they can count as two abilities toward this total. For example, the mythic fire giant's fire vortex ability could count as two mythic abilities.

In place of a mythic ability, the monster may gain a universal monster ability, such as rend or pounce, either from an existing Bestiary or from this section."

So I was wondering since natural attacks are in the universal section if I could apply more natural attacks to a monster. Like if I wanted to spend 3 mythic ranks to give a Titan Centipede a gore and 2 claw attacks. Would this work as RAW?

I know I can just do it anyway if I'm the GM, but that's not the answer I'm looking for.


I don't know how anyone can see shelob as an epic encounter when compared to most monsters in any of the bestiaries. Some monsters are large enough to swallow a fully grown whale whole, yet Shelob can somehow still take on a horde of them by itself.


DrDeth wrote:
K177Y C47 wrote:
Sauce987654321 wrote:
Since lord of the rings always seems to be brought up, I remember in another thread where someone was saying shelob was an epic level encounter and a cave troll was a CR 17 encounter. I was pretty curious as to how someone finds these creatures that high of a CR, but that thread was pretty dead when I discovered those posts.
I think that was quickly debunked seeing as The Leng Spider is not even an Epic creature and that thing can teleport all over the place... and Last i checked Shelob has no real supernatural powers....

It wasn't debunked at all. Shelob is a Mythic creature, almost a demi-diety. She is intelligent, and has Epic DR.

From LotR wiki:Ungoliant (Sindarin IPA: [uŋˈɡoljant]) was a primordial being in the shape of a gigantic spider. ...There, in a ravine south of the mountain Hyamentir, she established her dark abode and took the form of a monstrous spider, and here sucked up all the light she could find."

It took Morgoth (Sauron's boss and a ARMY of Balrogs to defeat her).

Even if shelob is a mythic creature (which wouldn't make sense as an ogre spider does the exact same thing as shelob) it would only grant her DR5/epic and her CR would still be around the same as an ogre spider (except with other abilities gained from mythic ranks which shelob doesn't have).


Thomas Long 175 wrote:

Good catch on the cybernetic arms, I missed those. Haven't read up on those rules yet, so that would double work with my ant haul as a x4 to bring it to

Heavy load
14,745,600 = 4 * 3686400

Drag or Push
73,728,000 = 14745600 * 5

So heavy load is just under 7400 tons.

If Ant Haul increases carrying capacity by x3 and cybernetics by x2, why is it a x4 total?


Do you mean NPC classes or NPCs in general?


I was wondering what the highest possible carrying capacity in this game could be. I don't mean just high strength, as I'm sure there are many ways of increasing only carrying capacity.
I'll post more in this topic later, as I just wanted to leave this topic here.


boring7 wrote:
UnArcaneElection wrote:

Also, in the d20pfsrd entry on Elohim I found:

"Organization solitary or horde (1 plus 5–20 animals, magical beasts, and plants of CR 8–10)" . . . but they can only create creatures of up to 4 HD, which doesn't get you CR 8, let alone 10.

Nah, it makes the creatures as children, then they grow up quickly because of time-distortion.

Oh wait, they don't get Greater Demiplane so they can't do that, can they? Nevermind.

It can wait for them to grow.


Since lord of the rings always seems to be brought up, I remember in another thread where someone was saying shelob was an epic level encounter and a cave troll was a CR 17 encounter. I was pretty curious as to how someone finds these creatures that high of a CR, but that thread was pretty dead when I discovered those posts.


Could it just recast the spell the next day to reset the timer?


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They are one handed. Like melee weapons listed under light, one handed, and two handed categories, firearms follow the same rules.


So I figure having a spinosaurus with the giant, advanced, and savage simple templates with 1 rank of mythic to grant it a breath weapon is the best way to go. Its overall CR would be 14 - 15. This build pretty much does the exact same thing as Zilla did in the movie.


Okay, I didn't really care for the movie, but I still like the monster in it.
How would you personally stat this monster and what CR you think is appropriate for it. I'll give my interpretation of it's stats later, but I just wanted to leave this thread here.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

You should check out mythic rules

Kelsey MacAilbert wrote:
I actually like the way a lot of anime martial characters have ridiculous jumping abilities. Like, 20 feet up into the air? No problem. Leap almost all the way across a chapel? Sure. Jump on top of buildings during a chase?

Aerial Assault:

You can charge at creatures in the air, or leap across obstacles as part of a charge. When making a charge attack, you can expend one use of mythic power to include a single Acrobatics check made to jump, adding 10 feet per tier to the height or distance you jump. You take no falling damage from the height gained as part of this leap. If your attack hits, you may deal an amount of additional damage equal to the falling damage appropriate for the height you reached. Alternatively, you may replace your melee attack from this charge with a grapple check. If you successfully grapple a creature, you bring it to the ground with you at the end of your jump, and it takes an appropriate amount of falling damage for the height it was at when you grappled it.
Kelsey MacAilbert wrote:
Okay. I also like it when people get shoved back absurd distances

Blowback:

As a standard action, you can expend one use of mythic power to make one melee or ranged attack at your full base attack bonus. If the attack hits, your foe is also knocked directly away from you a distance equal to 10 feet per tier. If the foe strikes a solid object before reaching this distance, it takes 1d6 points of bludgeoning damage for every 10 feet it couldn't travel.

If it strikes another creature, both it and the creature it strikes take half this damage.

Kelsey MacAilbert wrote:
dropping strength checks for breaking walls and doors

Display of Strength:

As a free action, you can expend one use of mythic power to attempt a feat of Strength, gaining a +20 circumstance bonus on one Strength-based skill check or Strength ability check. Alternatively, you can use this ability to apply a +20 circumstance bonus to your Strength score for a number of hours equal to your mythic tier for the purpose of determining your carrying capacity.

Juggernaut:

Little can stand in your way when you charge forth into battle—even solid doors and walls don't stand a chance. While charging, you may attempt a free Strength check to break through a single door or wall in your path. You can expend one use of mythic power while performing this charge to gain a +10 circumstance bonus on your Strength check to break the object. If you destroy the object, you can continue your charge as though it were never there. If you fail to destroy the object, your movement ends in the square before that object. Note that destroying integral parts of a structure may trigger a collapse (treat as a cave-in) at the GM's discretion. This ability can be combined with other path abilities and effects that modify charge attacks, such as the burst through path ability. You can select this ability up to three times. Each additional time you select it, you may break through one more wall or door during your charge, and the circumstance bonus on your Strength check increases by 10 (to a maximum of a +30 circumstance bonus).

Kelsey MacAilbert wrote:
Hmm. It seems somewhat common that a martial can block spells with a weapon or shield. Perhaps allow shield bonuses to AC against ray spells, and make the AC bonus from defended actions a shield bonus if it isn't already?

Parry Spell:

As an immediate action, you can expend one use of mythic power to block a spell targeting you or an ally adjacent to you. The spell must be a ray, a single-target spell, or a spell that creates an effect targeting one creature (such as acid arrow), and the level of the spell's spell slot must be equal to or lower than your tier. Make an attack roll as if making an attack of opportunity. If the result of the attack roll is greater than the spell's attack roll or save DC, the spell has no effect on the intended target (though other targets from the same spell, such as multiple targets of scorching ray, are affected normally). A spell that has neither a DC nor an attack roll (such as magic missile) can't be affected by this ability.

You must declare using spell parry after the spellcaster's target is announced, but before the target's saving throw or attack roll is made

What do you think about this? This is exactly what your talking about.

You could always look here to check all the books out.


FormerFiend wrote:

You know, a while back I was calculating the carrying capacity for my fighter/champion I carried through wrath of the righteous; at lvl 20 tier 10 he ended up with a strength of 48 after he got a permanent enlarge person spell slapped on him.

Anyway, what I ended up with was as follows;

Light Load: 6400lbs.
Medium Load: 12800lbs.
Heavy Load: 19200lbs.
Lift Over Head: 19200lbs.
Lift Off Ground: 38400lbs.
Push or Drag: 96000lbs.

While that may or may not sound impressive, what that means is that my fighter can struggle to push or drag 48 tons, where as the Hulk can lift over 100tons and toss it a considerable distance.

Add Display of Strength and you basically multiply these numbers by 16.


DrDeth wrote:
anlashok wrote:

Quote:
Also, the Fellowship was "Low-level?" I've stat'ed the characters out, and there is no way the main combatants of the group were below level 10
Not sure where you're getting that. They tend to fight mostly orcs and other low-end enemies and even completely green and inexperienced combatants can hold their own among their ranks. Probably level 5 or 6 given their general capabilities.
Sam killed Shelob, who was part Deity (sorta). Merry and Eowyn killed the Witch-king of Angmar who was pretty Epic. There were also Wargs, Trolls, Fell-beasts, etc. Pippin killed a Olog-hai, which is a advanced troll.

shelob is a CR 5 ogre spider. It does the exact same thing as shelob.

An advanced troll is CR 5 (if it was advanced to begin with).
Wargs are CR 3.

Them being around level 3 - 5 sounds about right.
With the fellowship being at 4 - 7, too.


KestrelZ wrote:


Superhero RPGs tend to need a very different rule system as such characters commonly have the strength to juggle cars, become bulletproof, and are still expected to slugfest with other super powered beings for a few rounds of combat. To simulate this, a very different rule set is usually required to simulate what happens in comics.

Stuff like this already exists. Characters can easily reach enough strength to lift cars. Being bullet proof is already covered by damage reduction.

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