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RumpinRufus's page

Pathfinder Society Member. 1,014 posts (1,109 including aliases). No reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 5 Pathfinder Society characters. 3 aliases.


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Are you the GM here? If so, I'd just say, "calibrate". Let the Gunslinger start with the normal gun rules, applying DR as normal, and if he's not doing enough damage then just keep dropping guns as loot that do more and more damage until he's up to par.

Eigengrau, I'm a bit confused in what you're doing. It looks like you're taking Slashing Grace with the sibat, which is a weapon that is only in the Spears weapon group. So it's not clear how you'd be using Martial Flexibility to get Slashing Grace for either Polearms or Heavy Blades.

Identify does not require concentration, unlike Detect Magic.

It's a little questionable whether Titan Mauler would allow you to do that.

Jotungrip wrote:
At 2nd level, a titan mauler may choose to wield a two-handed melee weapon in one hand with a –2 penalty on attack rolls while doing so. The weapon must be appropriately sized for her, and it is treated as one-handed when determining the effect of Power Attack, Strength bonus to damage, and the like.

The ability is ambiguously worded - it's apparently not treated as one-handed for all purposes, only for purposes of "the like" of Power Attack and Strength bonus to damage. Both of those give penalties, mind you. So it would be up to your GM whether Slashing Grace is "the like" of Power Attack and Str to damage.

Darth, in order to make a Spellcraft check to identify a magic item at all you have to cast Detect Magic, which requires concentration and thus you could not maintain while you are in a trance.

Also keep in mind that using the Identify spell requires three rounds of study. It doesn't make much sense to me that you'd first go in a trance, then study the object, and figure out what it is that way. However, it would be reasonably to study the object with Identify, use your trance, and then make the check. However, I don't believe that's technically allowed by RAW.

Moving Through a Square wrote:
Opponent: You can't move through a square occupied by an opponent unless the opponent is helpless.

You cannot move through the square of a non-helpless enemy. Nothing in this spell overrules that.

As far as the mythic version, the benefit is clearly that if there is a line of opponents, you may hit them all. For example, if "_" is an empty square, "S" if your starting square, "F" is your final square, and "E" is an enemy, you could hit 10 enemies at least using the mythic version.


The spell works perfectly fine without moving through enemy squares, and it's clearly not allowed by RAW to move through enemy squares (unless you make an Acrobatics check, which would be allowed. If you fail the Acrobatics check, you stop moving in front of that enemy and you provoke, as listed in the Acrobatics rules.)

I think you have to make the skill check immediately upon coming out of the trance. So I don't think it will work in conjunction with Identify.

Piercing, because it makes a hole.

Bludgeoning, because it works against skeletons.

You should post this into the Conversions forum instead.

I had a half-orc character based off Intimidate (Thug archetype using Blade of Mercy and Enforcer) that got reincarnated as a gnome. Instant -6 to my Intimidate checks (-4 for small and lost my racial -2) on top of losing strength. So that wasn't great.

The problem is, "counts as a grit user" is different than "counts as a gunslinger". Most grit feats require the "grit class feature", but Signature Deed requires both the "grit class feature" along with "gunslinger level 11th". And while Swashbuckler levels count as Fighter levels, they don't explicitly count as Gunslinger levels.

But obviously Swashbucklers were intended to be able to take Signature Deed, because some Swashbuckler deeds explicitly can't be used with Signature Deed.

Swashbuckler Finesse wrote:
Swashbuckler Finesse (Ex): At 1st level, a swashbuckler gains the benefits of the Weapon Finesse feat with light or one-handed piercing melee weapons
Martial Versatility wrote:
Benefit: Choose one combat feat you know that applies to a specific weapon (e.g., Weapon Focus). You can use that feat with any weapon within the same weapon group.
Slashing Grace wrote:
Benefit: Choose one kind of one-handed slashing weapon (such as the longsword). When wielding your chosen weapon one-handed, you can treat it as a one-handed piercing melee weapon for all feats and class abilities that require such a weapon (such as a swashbuckler’s or a duelist’s precise strike) and you can add your Dexterity modifier instead of your Strength modifier to that weapon’s damage. The weapon must be one appropriate for your size.

So, when you take Slashing Grace, it makes a one-handed slashing weapon count as a piercing weapon, at which point Swashbuckler Finesse applies to it. Then by taking Martial Versatility for Slashing Grace, all weapons in the weapon group of that one-handed slashing weapon now count as one-handed piercing weapons, so Swashbuckler Finesse applies to them.

So, it's a little convoluted, but any weapon that it in the same weapons group as a one-handed slashing weapon (including any axes, heavy blades, light blades, or flails) can be made finessable.

This is a weird situation. RAI is obviously that Swashbucklers can take the Signature Deed feat, because it specifically says in the text of Precise Strike "This deed’s cost cannot be reduced by any ability or effect that reduces the amount of panache points a deed costs (such as the Signature Deed feat)."

However, the Swashbuckler also has specific text that says "Swashbuckler levels are considered fighter levels for the purpose of meeting combat feat prerequisites", but nowhere does it say they are also treated as Gunslinger levels.

So by RAW, Swashbucklers can definitely take feats that require the "grit class feature" (due to the text TheBulletKnight posted) but by RAW Swashbucklers don't seem to be able to ever qualify for Signature Deed, even though by RAI it seems like they should be able to.

If you take a Swashbuckler level, you can take Slashing Grace, and then Martial Versatility if the weapon you want to finesse is not a one-handed slashing weapon.

But unless you take a level of Swashbuckler, I don't know any way to make a non-finesse weapon finessable.

This thread is very mysterious.

"The thread with no name."

I would think the Lore Warden/Maneuver Master would be best if you have a buddy who's doing Sneak damage. But if no one else is getting Sneak Attack, I would still need convincing that the Lore Warden is going to get out more damage than the Knife Master.

thegreenteagamer wrote:
The orc-only dirty fighter is pretty good for a dirty trick build.

That's cool, I didn't know about it, but it doesn't kick in until level 9. It still seems like Maneuver Master/Knife Master will probably end up stronger.

Per this FAQ, the Maneuver Master would use his monk level instead of the BAB he gains from his monk levels, but he'd still add BAB from other classes normally.

The thing about Dirty Trick Master is that it kicks in so damn late. I'm trying to make a build that's viable from 1st level onwards. The Cad archetype is fine, but it's not until you get Quick Dirty Trick and/or Greater Dirty Trick that the action economy turns in your favor. The typical problem with Dirty Trick is that you use your standard action to eat up the enemy's move action, but Flurry of Maneuvers solves all that.

I was thinking of going Cad, but the sneak attack damage just seems great with this build.

Even with the new Wildcat archetype, the best way to build a character based on Dirty Trick seems to be taking at least one level of Maneuver Master. Flurry of Maneuvers lets you blind, attack, attack, even at level 1.

So, where do you go from there? I'm thinking Knife Master is best to maximize sneak attack damage.

So maybe a build something like this:

strength 18, dexterity 15, constitution 14, intelligence 10, wisdom 10, charisma 8
1 (Maneuver Master): Flurry of Maneuvers, Improved Dirty Trick, Two-Weapon Fighting, Martial Weapon Proficiency (kukri)
2 (Knife Master/Scout): Sneak Stab 1d8
3 (Rogue): Weapon Focus (kukri), Improved Initiative

After that, I'm already faltering on what feats, rogue talents, etc. would be helpful.

So, is there a better Dirty Trick build than the Maneuver Master? How would you build it?

Green Smashomancer wrote:
Wait, so 8000 gp nets you the best kind of AC bonus (deflection goes to touch and flat-footed, and stacks with itself right?) off of Charisma? and on a necklace or something? Am I clear about that?

It's a custom magic item, which means it is completely up to the GM's discretion whether you're even allowed to make it, and if so what the price is.

Precise Strike wrote:
Precise Strike (Ex): At 3rd level, while she has at least 1 panache point, a swashbuckler gains the ability to strike precisely with a light or one-handed piercing melee weapon (though not natural weapon attacks), adding her swashbuckler level to the damage dealt. To use this deed, a swashbuckler cannot attack with a weapon in her other hand or use a shield other than a buckler.

It says you may not attack with a weapon in the other hand, but doesn't say you can't be wielding a weapon in the other hand.

Not familiar with the character, but this should be posted to the Conversions forum.

Zwordsman wrote:
You do lose your precise strike damage, but if it doesn't bother you go for it

You only lose your Precise Strike if you attack with a weapon in your off-hand.

So you can hold a flail in your left hand, and a rapier in your right hand. On your turn, you fight with the rapier only, getting Precise Strike. When you parry, you may parry with either the rapier or the flail, and riposte with either the rapier or the flail. If you are riposting to do damage, you would use the rapier to get Precise Strike. But if you are riposting with a combat maneuver, you could use the flail to get a +2 on the disarm or trip attack.

Upon further research, I'm back to thinking it does provoke. Let's look at the feat Pin Down:

Pin Down wrote:
Benefit: Whenever an opponent you threaten takes a 5-foot step or uses the withdraw action, that opponent provokes an attack of opportunity from you. If the attack hits, you deal no damage, but the targeted creature is prevented from making the move action that granted a 5-foot step or the withdraw action and does not move.

Therefore, there are definitely cases where taking a 5-foot step does provoke, using the "specific trumps general" rule. I think the Mouser ability, being specific in this case, trumps the general rule that 5-foot steps don't provoke.

I marked your question as an FAQ candidate, though, because it still seems ambiguous.

What is your question about? The rules seem pretty explicit on what the benefits are.

Pahlok wrote:
Would this include a 5-foot-step, even though 5-foot-steps normally do not provoke? It seems like the Mouser would be pointless if it didn't, since the foe could almost always 5-foot-step out and not care.

At first I thought it would, but the rules for 5-foot step do specifically say "Taking this 5-foot step never provokes an attack of opportunity."

RavenVoron wrote:

Yup, that's it. It's basically a feat that can be used as a deed, which is nice, but I don't know why you wouldn't want to just shell out the money for a buckler other than flavor. The entangle ability is nice, but if you just spent thousands of gold on an enchanted cape or cloak and the enemy just rips through it (which, let's face it, most non-intelligent enemies will, especially the big ones) So your money would just go out the window.

Unless you take Profession: Waiter and just carry around disposable table clothes to just keep entangling people. Or just flavor your swash as a matador and carry around sheets.

You can just wear a mundane cloak, and even wear it on top of your magical one. There's no rule that says you can't wear multiple cloaks, only that only one of them at a time can have magical effects.

RavenVoron wrote:
Actually, you can use a cloak in combat as your off-hand weapon mechanically. There's a new feat in the ACG that allows you to use a cloak wrapped around your off hand as a buckler and you can entangle enemies with it. If I weren't on my phone right now I'd link it.

That's freaking awesome, that's exactly what I was looking for!

edit: and I also just noticed the Cloak of Disarming, which is pretty sweet although it's quite a pretty penny at 35,000.

3 people marked this as a favorite.

Better idea - don't.

If your GM is nice enough to give you a cool magic item, and you make his life a pain by exploiting and abusing it, is that really going to encourage him to be so generous in the future?

Let's go one step farther: does it refer to a one-handed piercing melee weapon, or a light?

Because if you carefully swing a lantern into just the right part of someone's... special area... that's gonna hurt!

I've been toying around with the idea of using an offhand weapon specifically for parry and riposte.

Historically relevant off-hand fencing weapons would be the swordbreaker dagger or a cloak. Swordbreaker is nice but it requires Exotic Weapon Proficiency, and there doesn't seem to be a provision in Pathfinder for using a cloak as a disarming weapon.

But how about a flail? It can be used to trip or disarm the opponent (both of which are very attractive if the person is actively trying to kill you.) And the Swashbuckler is proficient with it. Clearly the Answering enchantment makes it even better, if you can afford to throw it on your offhand weapon.

So, besides losing the shield bonus from a buckler, is there any reason not to carry a flail in your offhand, not to use on your turn but just for riposting with combat maneuvers? Any other good ideas for riposting weapons?

The problem with sawtooth sabres is that they'd still use Str to hit, even if they get Dex to damage.

I don't know if Slashing Grace is worth it for a non-Swashbuckler, it is so much easier to use agile weapons. If you're going to go the Slashing Grace route:

1) You can use sawtooth sabres, get good TWF and Dex to damage but still use Str to hit

2) Take Martial Versatility and use a one-handed and light weapon in the same group (like whip/scorpion whip,) get Dex to damage and to hit on both, but have to take Weapon Focus and Weapon Finesse twice

3) Take Martial Versatility and then take Weapon Focus and Slashing Grace for a weapon you don't intend to use (like whip) and then dual-wield scorpion whips, so you can focus your (Greater) Weapon Focus/Specialization on the one weapon

4) Take the penalties for dual-wielding a non-light weapon, and do something like you suggest with the dueling sword

Maybe there's a good way to make this work, but I'm not really seeing it.

graystone wrote:
LOL 1 multiclass level of fighter and I can flurry in full plate and a tower shield. Love the errors in this new book. :P

Manuever Master/Fighter can already use Flurry of Maneuvers in full plate and a tower shield.

Tomos wrote:

Why would someone use their standard action when standing next to an enemy caster to Ready: (attack them when they cast a spell)?

Maybe they're invisible, you know where they are, and casting will break invisibility? In that case, you're right that Step Up is just as good as a Ready + 5' step. Pretty sure that's the only situation this applies to though.

Waiting around to see what they'll do instead of just smashing their face doesn't seem like a very good plan.

You know a caster has to make a concentration check when they take damage? If you attack them on your own turn, there is no chance of causing them to waste their turn and their prepared spell. If you ready to attack them when they cast a spell, and you are able to hit them, they have to make a (typically VERY difficult) concentration check, or they lose both the spell slot and their action.

1 person marked this as a favorite.

What GM in the world would think you need to have both Brawler's Flurry and Flurry of Blows to qualify for a feat?

Hahah, you didn't fumble quite as bad as Kazumetsa with his "Scared Fist" character.

There was a recent thread about this. By my reading, yes, you can simply move into the opponent's square and benefit from the Underfoot Assault deed. However, this provokes an attack of opportunity (and by my reading, Mobility would not apply to this AoO.)

Ah, Undone is correct.

Bonus Style Feat wrote:
At 6th level, the sacred fist gains a style feat as a bonus feat. The sacred fist must meet the style feat’s prerequisites. He uses his warpriest levels as monk levels for the purposes of meeting the feat’s prerequisites. At 12th and 18th levels, a sacred fist gains either another style feat or a feat that requires a style feat as a prerequisite. This ability replaces the bonus feats gained at 6th, 12th, and 18th levels.

So the Sacred Fist can pick up Pummeling Charge at 12th level by using his bonus feat.

It looks like that is correct. If you like, though, you could take a level of Master of Many Styles and pick it up much much earlier.

Arksangiel wrote:
'cause the question was about combining slashing grace with weapon finesse as not a swashbuckler. scorpion whip was the only way I found.

Scorpion whip is a light weapon, so you can't use it with Slashing Grace.

I don't think you understand what "caster level" is. Having a higher caster level does not mean you can cast spells of higher level than normal.

For example, a 3rd-level wizard can cast 2nd level spells, or cast 1st level spells. Typically, these would all be at caster level 3. However, if he has an ability which increases his caster level by 2, he could cast his spells at caster level 5. He would still only be able to cast 1st or 2nd level spells, though - even though he has an effective caster level of 5, and a 5th-level wizard would be able to cast 3rd-level spells.

One feat that lets you cast at higher caster levels is Arithmancy, but there are several others.

1 person marked this as FAQ candidate. 1 person marked this as a favorite.

No FAQ is required here. You need ONE of the three prereqs of BAB +6 or Brawler's Flurry or Flurry of Blows, and you also need to have Improved Unarmed Strike.

Flames of Chaos wrote:

I have a barbarian with the whole Beast totem set and a BAB of +12/+7/+2. How many natural claw attacks do I get when I pounce with this scenario?

Thanks in advance

2 claw attacks. You never get iteratives with natural weapons.

However, if you like you can use your Greater Beast Totem ability to pounce using a different weapon, you don't HAVE to use your claws.

Exocrat wrote:

It doesn't say that movement is treated as equivalent of a 5-foot step or that it does not provoke.

So it provokes.

Huh, well then things get REALLY weird.

Following Step says "When using the Step Up feat to follow an adjacent foe, you may move up to 10 feet" and Step Up says "Whenever an adjacent foe attempts to take a 5-foot step away from you, you may also make a 5-foot step as an immediate action".

So that means that you ARE taking a 5-foot step (otherwise you would not be "using the Step Up feat"), so the first 5 feet of movement should NOT provoke. But then the second 5 feet of movement DOES provoke?

I'd agree with BigNorseWolf - at the VERY least, someone switching alignment should pay for the Atonement spell. In a home game, it would require a lot more role playing, but PFS being what it is I guess you might have to settle for Atonement.

I am debating this same thing.

My first thought was some kind of gift card for a site that sells miniatures, but I didn't know what site to use.

But after trying it out, I am leaning towards getting my GM Lords of Waterdeep. It's a great strategy game, we can break it out if some players unexpectedly cancel, and the flavor is all D&D even if the the gameplay is very different.

I think the main problem is not that it's OP but that it makes no #&$%ing sense.

GM: The lich casts Horrid Wilting.
PC: I curl my body to retain my moisture!

GM: As you walk through the door, a Symbol of Pain glows pale as your body is wracked with torment.
PC: I dance away the pain!

In response to the last two posts:

Firstly, you cannot riposte an attack from 15 feet away, even WITH Improved Snap Shot. It says:

Opportune Parry and Riposte wrote:
Upon performing a successful parry and if she has at least 1 panache point, the swashbuckler can as an immediate action make an attack against the creature whose attack she parried, provided that creature is within her reach.

Even if you threaten 15 feet, that monster is still not within your reach (unless you are a high level aberrant sorcerer or something.)

Secondly, remember that the opponent is making a melee attack against you, so you don't need to parry (or riposte) at range. They are coming to you. You slap away their limb with your gun (or bow) and then fire a shot at them in return.

Still no ammunition needed for the parry.

I feel like this is a stupid question, but... when you use Following Step, that movement does not provoke, correct?

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