Elephant

Robert Cameron's page

Organized Play Member. 216 posts (218 including aliases). 2 reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 1 alias.


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This is one of the weak points of Golarion IMO. In a fantasy sense it's super cool to have a whole pirate nation, but when you actually think about the why and the how, it makes next to no sense. If it were a patchwork of colonies from the major powers, or even just Cheliax, interspersed with pirate holds it would be more realistic. But hey, in the world with dragons and magic we're worrying about realism in trade routes.

The way in which I compensated for this was by introducing "ocean markets" where non-hostile undersea creatures would trade scavenged materials with surface dwellers at incredibly deep discounts (low overhead when you strip shipwrecks). The trade off was having to head through pirate waters.


I am about to embark upon a post-Skull & Shackles game myself. My group was less interested in running the Shackles as pirate lords than taking the fight to Cheliax. Since they would lose the element of surprise going around the Eye of Abendego, they've decided they want to try and fly a fleet over it!

My plan is that among the Hurricane King's treasure maps is the location of a Shory flying city sunken in the Fever Sea. They'll have to fight the creatures that have taken up residence in the ruins (not sure what yet, maybe Deep Ones, maybe a unique Kraken and its servants) and then use the remaining records and an artifact or two make their own smaller scale version of the Shory flying technology.

Ultimately this may end up a Spelljammer campaign by level 17


Player here, a handful of encounters into Book 5 with:

Turok Steelfist Male Half-Orc Fighter (Martial Master) 12/Ranger 1 Trunau Native
-His cohort Stoney Male Human Bard 7/Ranger 4 Trunau Native
Alanna Blackdiamond Female Dwarven Cleric of Sarenrae 13 Vexing Defender
Xenika Woods Female Human Unchained Rogue 13 Trunau Native
Heqat Half-Orc Conjurer 13 Vexing Defender (my character)
-His cohort Rosaria Sabitini Illusionist 11

We have maintained our original party from the first session somehow and have a semi-Breakfast Club thing going on; Turok being the spoiled jock who is Halgra's son, Xenika being the emo kid who learned to sneak around to get away from strict parents, Heqat being the nerd who grew up on the wrong side of the tracks - you know, Orc country - but escaped, and Alanna as the outcast Dwarf kicked out of her home for converting to Sarenrae worship. So we all love Trunau as being our safe haven and we spent a good deal of gold and effort to make it better after the events of Book 1. Once the

Spoiler:
Storm Tyrant
business is dealt with, which the party views as more annoying than life-threatening, they plan to conquer Belkzen Orc clan by Orc clan and make Trunau the capital (because they plan to ally with the Oathkeeper Dwarves and give Urgir back to them in exchange for help taking down the current regime). The general idea is if we can conquer the orcs we can work to change the culture (our characters also plan to live hundreds of years if not indefinitely), so rather than having to constantly worry about defending Trunau and give out grisly Hope Knives to 12 year olds, we can make our enemies our allies.


Jessica Price wrote:
Robert Cameron wrote:
Will this contain a map of Katheer? Or a good enough description from which one could draw a map? I want to run an urban campaign set there and that would help significantly.
Yes, there's a map of Katheer. Bear in mind that Katheer is one of the largest cities in the Inner Sea region, so it's not like, say, the Wati map in Mummy's Mask that shows every individual building. It's more like those medieval city maps that show neighborhoods/districts.

That is perfect for what I intended. I wouldn't want all the gaps filled, just a proper layout and some pre-set hooks


Will this contain a map of Katheer? Or a good enough description from which one could draw a map? I want to run an urban campaign set there and that would help significantly.


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Using Cairan Barnes list on page one

Alignment: 1d9 ⇒ 3 Chaotic Evil

Alignment Domain: Chaos
Domain 1: 1d33 ⇒ 25 Strength
Domain 2: 1d33 ⇒ 16 Madness
Domain 3: 1d33 ⇒ 10 Fire
Domain 4: 1d33 ⇒ 30 Void

Subdomains: Entropy, Ferocity, Isolation, Arson, Insanity, Ash
Portfolio: Senseless Fire-based Destruction and Murder
Favored Weapon: Unarmed or A Lit Torch
Sacred Animal: None
Sacred Colors: Fiery reds, yellows, and oranges; and ash gray
Holy Symbol: A burning, crumbling tower; or a burning, screaming head
Power Level: Minor

Ghongnasur, The Final Inferno

Elder elemental fire shaped by the buffeting winds of Chaos and inspired to Divine Horror through the endless gyre, Ghongnasur is the flame to consume all. Those who pledge themselves to the Final Inferno do so out of deep madness or even deeper desperation. There is no prayer book and there is no philosophy other than this: all must burn! The faithful prolong their own immolation only long enough to burn all they can before they are finally called to cast themselves into the flames and join their god in eternal wailing agony. Answered prayers come in the form of sudden conflagration and the screams of the burned. Adherents could identify each other by their charred clothes and hair and the general ordure of burnt offerings, if their insane rage towards all things didn't prevented them from murdering almost everything they came into contact with.


54. (as a retort) It will help me hear you better if you take your head out of your ass before you speak.


I would love the opportunity to talk with my editor, but I wouldn't want to force the conversation if they're uncomfortable talking with the writers.


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Thank you so much for accepting my article. I actually whooped for joy at the email.


455. The Frame, (also known as The Litran Manuscript or The Shifting Manuscript)
This massive, well-worn, bound manuscript was first found in the possession of an unknown wizard executed in Litran during one of Galt's bloodier purges. The book has no official title and no author is named; consequently is has been called a half dozen different titles, but it is most commonly known as The Frame, as it is a frame story of byzantine complexity. The manuscript has a number of extraordinary traits, the most obvious of which is that it is never the same book when read by different people. It always begins with a tale of one of the reader's parents, purporting to be an account of their younger years. Each of these parents meets a blind mendicant who tells them a tale of his youth as a soldier searching for adventure, riches, and true love. He describes fleeing from a siege and coming across a cult ritual in the woods nearby, when he is captured by the cultists. He is brought before the group and the high priestess begins to tell the tale of her induction into the mysteries of their obscure god. From there the accounts always diverge, but the story never advances more than 50 pages before another character begins telling a different story without finishing the account of the previous narrator. When the reader reaches the end of the manuscript it shuts itself and reopens to the very first page with a continuation of the story picking up right where it had ended. A few scholars have managed to read more than 30 "volumes" and all of them have stated that the story finally starts completing narratives at volume 24, but none have ever possessed the book long enough to see the finale, presumed to be at volume 46. Aside from the first two stories always being similar, at a random point there is an account of a member of the Abdarian clergy who becomes convinced that Law is a sham created by Chaos. The reasons are never the same, but this heresy is always present in every version known. The reader can never go back and read the previous volumes again which leads all but the most fastidious note takers to give up in frustration. The book radiates no magic, but does possess a mild aura of chaos.

456. The Receding Margin: Interpretations, Accounts, and Theories Concerning The Frame Complied and Edited by the Department of Literature at The Quarterfaux Archives

Those who aren't lucky enough to run across The Frame in the course of their lives are informed of its existence by this hardcover book published by the Quarterfaux Archives Press of Caliphas. It is a compilation of work on The Frame, including brief descriptions of each volumes content as it appeared to various reader. The editors attempt to draw rather dubious conclusions about the nature of the book from these disparate accounts, but even they admit that their conclusions aren't particularly elucidating or comprehensive. One of the more interesting sections of the book is an account of a bard who traveled the Inner Sea region attempting to learn if events in the book actually occurred. She could not find hard evidence of most of the events in her version of the book, but she did learn that the Abdarian heresy written of is real and causes a great deal of shame to the clergy that are aware of it. Not shockingly, those clergy members were not willing to explain the nature of the heresy to an outsider and nothing more was learned on the subject.


I do a base 15% chance four times a day (morning, noon, evening, night), then I roll a d6 to determine which hour of the time period the event occurs in. From there it's basically a coin toss as to whether I use a monster or a ship. However, I do like simon hacker's idea for hazards and ship board encounters. I'll have to make up a table for those.


Mosaic wrote:
AsmodeusUltima wrote:

Iobarria is mostly of mixed Ulfen and Kellid descent; Iobar I, founder of Iobarria, was himself from the Ulfen-founded city state of Orlov.

As for the Issiens, I am not sure if there is official statement of it, but I personally believe they are of Ulfen descent, as they appear to be based on real-world Norse river raiders that would eventually mingle with Slavs and form Russia, etc.

That's the vibe I got too.

I got more of a Stark crossed with Greyjoy kind of vibe from the Issians. Don't get me wrong, the real world analog is at work too, but Brevoy draws very obviously from Song of Ice and Fire (divided regions on the brink of civil war in a country formerly united by a dragonriding conqueror? Nope doesn't sound like Game of Thrones at all), so there is also that at play.


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450. The Impressive Books of Importance, (vol 1-20), by Ronold Burgundian

This set of handsome leather bound books smells of rich mahogany and looks very impressive. The books themselves have no actual content with the exception of a potent curse. Any person who comes into possession of a volume must make a Will Save DC 10 + number of volumes owned or become completely self obsessed and desire to own all twenty volumes. Curse victims let everyone know that they are kind of a big deal and their opinions are more valid and correct than those held by others. When all twenty volumes come into the possession of the afflicted, they must make a Will Save DC 30 or choke to death on their own smug sense of self satisfaction, a condition that prevents the victim from being raised by any means other than wish or miracle.


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447. Entombed and Exhumed (vol one): Personal Accounts of Premature Burials, Compiled and Edited by Demahn D'rosien

This first slim volume is a collection of first person narratives and interviews with people who had been buried or entombed alive and how they escaped their confinement. Naturally, they are somewhat disturbing stories, but anyone who studies it for 10 hours gains a +1 bonus to escape from rock slides and premature burial. It is bound in black leather with delicate silver lettering of the title along the front cover and spine.

448. Entombed and Exhumed (vol two): Personal Accounts of Resurrection, Complied and Edited by Demahn D'rosien

This slightly larger second volume is a collection of first person narratives and interviews with creatures that were laid to rest and later raised from the dead. The bulk of the accounts are confused stories about the afterlife, mostly dealing with the endless tedium of waiting in line to be judged. A handful of the authors go into greater detail about their reward or punishment, but the accounts of those are even further confused and provide almost no factual information other than Damnation is No Fun. The final account is an interview with a dog who reincarnated as an Elf. Few elves credit it a real interview, but it is undeniably funny. Anyone who studies this tome for 20 hours gains a +1 on Knowledge (Planes) and Knowledge (Religion) specifically relating to The Boneyard and its inhabitants. It is bound the same as the first volume.

449. Entombed and Exhumed (vol three): Personal Accounts of Rising from the Grave, Complied and Edited by Demahn D'rosien

The final volume in the series was never delivered to the printer and exists only as a single massive manuscript. Much like the former volumes, it is a collection of interviews and first person narratives, but this one was of those who had died and rose as undead. These macabre accounts include those of three vampires, two liches, several ghouls and and ghasts, twin attic whisperers, assorted lesser known undead, and a telepathically interviewed zombie who gave an oddly compelling account of herself. The compiler, Demahn D'rosien, vanished while seeking out members of The Whispering Way who claimed to be able get an exclusive interview with the Whispering Tyrant himself. Anyone who manages to find this manuscript and spends 100 cumulative hours studying it gets a +2 on all Knowledge (Religion) checks involving undead and +2 on Diplomacy checks with intelligent undead.


Timitius wrote:
Robert Cameron wrote:
Paris Crenshaw wrote:
Good point, Z. When the time comes, we will post a notification that we have sent an e-mail to all writers who had work accepted. That will be the cue to start pestering...er...I mean, send us your queries. ;)

Okay, you have completely answered my question, thank you! I hope to receive an email soon and if I don't by next week, expect to hear from me complaining about how you overlooked my obvious greatness ;)

But seriously though, good luck on sorting through all the submissions.

I would be curious to know about how many of each type of article were sent in, if that's information you feel like compiling and revealing.

I can try and get a final update to the total submissions in each category later tonight. So some of you can see how many others you are up against!

That would be much appreciated. You are exactly right too, I want to know what I'm up against!


Paris Crenshaw wrote:
Good point, Z. When the time comes, we will post a notification that we have sent an e-mail to all writers who had work accepted. That will be the cue to start pestering...er...I mean, send us your queries. ;)

Okay, you have completely answered my question, thank you! I hope to receive an email soon and if I don't by next week, expect to hear from me complaining about how you overlooked my obvious greatness ;)

But seriously though, good luck on sorting through all the submissions.

I would be curious to know about how many of each type of article were sent in, if that's information you feel like compiling and revealing.


Paris Crenshaw wrote:
We're aiming to have decisions made before next week. And since our schedule is compressed by the requirement to have copies printed for PaizoCon, we don't have much choice but to hit pretty close to where we're aiming.

Excellent, I wish you luck in juggling all of your growing responsibilities.

One more question: will people denied receive a rejection notice or will silence be the rejection notice?


Curse me as impatient, but when should we expect the article choices to be finalized?


Vod Canockers wrote:
412: Bart's Big Book of Big Bags This book contains descriptions of Handy Haversack's and Bags of Holding. It also includes biographies of some of the more famous magic bag makers through history.

I love this. I completely believe finding this book in a wizard's library.


AlgaeNymph wrote:
Robert Cameron wrote:
391. The Erotic Acts of Iomedae: This book is the collective work of eleven anonymous bards who were each contacted by a Chelaxian publisher to contribute to this mildly blasphemous text. [...] Many of these variety can be found in upscale brothels (especially in Cheliax) to whet their clients' appetites.
Interesting. What's the publisher's motive?

Well, this is sort of an adaptation of something that a PC of mine did a few years ago. There was a fellow PC who was an upstanding Cleric of Iomedae and my PC was a bard who wrote plays and they had a friendly sort of rivalry. So when we opened out first brothel in the city we founded (it was Kingmaker), my PC staged a performance of The Eleven Erotic Acts of Iomedae as a publicity stunt/joke to PO the Cleric.

For my own game, the publisher's intent was twofold: 1) to mock and denigrate the Church of Iomedae in an attempt to draw them into a religious conflict that would hurt more foolish innocents than actual diabolists and 2) to make money off of diabolists who find the erotic adventures of the Paladin Goddess amusing. There's also an undercurrent of misogyny to it as well, but some of the actual stories subvert that and show Iomedae as a woman in full possession of her sexuality who gains the upper hand on lecherous and foul men (or women as is the case with the second Act). However, any other GM is welcome to make their own back story (like me saying they couldn't would have stopped them).


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391. The Erotic Acts of Iomedae: This book is the collective work of eleven anonymous bards who were each contacted by a Chelaxian publisher to contribute to this mildly blasphemous text. The stories stick to the general theme of each miracle but they are recast as legendary sexual escapades that led to Iomedae's ascension. The tone and quality of each story varies, some are light and bawdy, others are explicit and pornographic. The final Act is considered the finest of the collection, renown for the sensual quality of the writing, and has been known to inspire many amorous encounters. While the Church of Iomedae has a dim view of this heretical work, they refuse to take an official stance on it. On an organizational level, to even acknowledge the book's existence would give it more undeserved attention. On a more personal level, some members of the clergy are known to offer rewards for copies (presumably to destroy them, but who can say?). The first edition was published cheaply on pulpy paper with a cloth cover and a crude illustration to begin each chapter. Later editions have been known to be leather bound and lavishly illustrated. Many of these variety can be found in upscale brothels (especially in Cheliax) to whet their clients' appetites.

-If a PC with Perform: Comedy spends an hour reading this book they gain a +2 bonus to that skill to tell humorous (but dirty) jokes and stories for 24 hours.
-If a PC spends an hour reading the final Act they gain a +1 bonus on Bluff or Diplomacy checks to seduce someone for 24 hours.


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390. The Laughing Masters: The Complete Guide to Catching and Keeping Slaves From the Secret Traditions of the Gnolls: This exhaustively researched (and thoroughly contemptible) tome details the traditional methods that Gnolls use in the capture, treatment, and sale of slaves. Copious details are presented on the best way to perform raids, how to "motivate" troublesome chattel, and how much food slaves should be given, calculated down to the bite. This is supplemented by four appendices: the first is on the creation of more potent poisons, specifically ones made to knock out the victim. The second, comprising almost half of the book, is anatomical and psychological details on many different races (exact number for GM to determine), human and otherwise, and how these details might be used to the advantage of the captor. The third is a recent guide on how and where to sell slaves, including abolitionist countries such as Andoran and The River Kingdoms. The fourth is a glossary of Gnoll slaving terms and translations of 50 phrases into many different racial and regional languages (again, exact number up to the GM). These phrases range from the more general and common ("Shut up.", "Get back to work.", and "Food later. Work now.") to the bizarrely specific ("I'm going to bash your skull so hard that your eyeballs will pop out and then I'll pull them around to the back of your head so you can watch me kick you ass."). The Eagle Knights offer substantial bounties for copies and they have an enormous bounty out for information leading to the capture of the anonymous author or the author itself (alive, so that they may be put on trial and made an example of). Multiple editions exist, so there can be substantial difference between the outward appearance of each edition. Many of the copies on ships or on persons traveling outside of slave nations are disguised as something less offensive, usually a boring looking religious or philosophical work.

-When used as a reference in the creation of poison it adds +1 to the save DC. If the poison causes unconsciousness the bonus becomes +2.
-If a person studies the appendix section on a specific race for 4 hours they gain a permanent +2 bonus on Intimidate checks against captive members of that race and a +2 bonus on Appraise for determining their market value. This bonus can be earned for every race included in the book, but it requires 4 hours of study for each additional race.


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I agree that there is too much Varisia already, let's get some other places fleshed out. I'd like to see something from Galt, not too much on them in any of the books. Same with Isger.

And it would be nice to see something on Thuvia and Qadiria.


I actually think it sounds like a great idea, from a role playing stand point that is. Lots of people want things that aren't necessarily the best for them, dumb people especially. So this fighter got the instruction manual and/or a terrible/cash-strapped tutor and learned the basics of wizardry, wasting a ton of time and effort on something that will never fully work, just like in real life.

Heck, now I'm tempted to play a fighter/wizard with an awful intelligence score.


I used to have horrible problems with this, so I feel for you. The cure was a TPK. They camped outside the BBEG's room after every previous attempt at camping in the dungeon had been met with monsters and malicious spells. So he waited until they were sleeping and killed them all. They stopped doing that after.


And I agree with who ever said that it might be a good idea to do the fiction as an in-universe history, like Plutarch doing the rise of House Thrune. Whoever said that had a good idea.

Or perhaps a sort of book-as-artifact style, like Jeff VanderMeer's City of Saints and Madmen, where the story is something actually published (and not just a diary entry) somewhere on Golarion.

I would be more likely to read something like that.


I haven't read a single piece of the fiction in the any of the 40 APs I have and I don't see myself doing so any time in the future. However, I do appreciate it for giving exposure (and a paycheck) to a writer. If it were to be dropped I would not mourn its loss, but I don't mind skipping a few pages so a fantasy writer can get some exposure and a decent meal.

If it were replaced my wish list would be:
-More player handouts.
-Details of a specific location, like a tavern or magic item shop.
-Details on random Holidays, local, national, religious, whatever, but they add flavor that I often think goes over looked.
-Golarion flavor stuff in general, local cuisine, sports, sayings.


Even with a heavy rain it's not full immersion.


This AP has had some really strong titles for the individual adventures, but this one is a stand out for me. Something about Into the Nightmare Rift just says awesome to me. Much like the title for the film Beyond the Black Rainbow.


I agree that it shouldn't be a combat maneuver. I think that it should work as a part of sneak attack or as a rogue talent or feat.

Also, the restriction on full plate doesn't make much sense to me. Look at an actual suit of armor from the back and you'll see that it's quite open and vulnerable, the perfect place for a stealthy rogue to slip a blade.


RedDogMT wrote:

I think using a readied action as a solution works fine for a couple reasons. First, it follows guidelines that already exist. Second, if the attacker knows the result of the attack roll, it will influence the outcome. For instance, if you roll a 1 on the ultimatum attack roll, then what? The attacker knows they can't do damage. Does the defender also know? What if a 20 is rolled? Should the attacker know? What about the defender?

I think it only works if the attack is known to be a success by both parties, that way it actually becomes an serious ultimatum rather than a (possibly) hollow threat of a readied action. If you roll a one you fail to put knife to throat (or whatever) and alert the defender.

Now would this be an option that any sneak attacker could have or would this be a rogue/ninja trick?


RedDogMT wrote:

Note that you could also pull this off using a Readied action.

You use a move action to go up the target, a free action to tell him what will happen, "Tell me where the treasure is or I'll gut you like a pig.", and then ready a standard action to attack if he so much as moves.

I think that you'd already need to have rolled the attack. Just telling the baddie that you plan to stick him (readied action which still might fail) isn't the same as a knife against an artery (a successful hit withheld for ultimatum). Or at least that's how I see it working.

On the whole though, something rubs me wrong about giving this ability to non-sneak attack having classes. And doing it out of surprise rounds seems like a monumental waste of time. It would require at least two separate grapple check to put someone in the position, not to mention the actual sneak attack itself.


Very cool idea!

I'm shocked that this hasn't come up sooner or if it has why it hasn't been shouted from the rooftops for rogues everywhere to know of and rejoice in.

Would this only be used on during a surprise round or could this be done at any time? It seems like it'd be considerably more difficult to accomplish this without the element of surprise.


I had a personal experience with something very similar and I still look on it as the worst experience I've ever had gaming. I lost the most fun character I'd had up to that point and the GM was upset with ME for not understanding how great a twist it was to the story.

I beg you, don't do it!


Nymian Harthing wrote:

Sorry, Robert Cameron. I assumed a few things, and need to clarify.

1. I assumed that your players were generally law-abiding and that they were in a town/village/city and could be arrested by local guard.
2. I assumed that said jail would have solitary areas, where said characters could be stuck so they'd be "quiet" for a bit. Much like what happens in some groups when you die: "Sorry, you can't talk, you're dead, and there's no speak with dead spell going."
3. I also assumed that the other players would get sick of the individuals being twerpy and picking fights...and not be "hell and high water" family types.

Sounds like a talk with the players is in order. Most of this could be cleared up with discussion about what RP means to you, what it means to them, and how the actions their characters take may have grave consequences.

No, the party is generally not law abiding. Both time they were in out of the way areas with no formal guards. Once in an open air prison with no guards to stop them from getting stomped to death by a gang they had grievously insulted. The other was at a roadside tavern where they were given some mob justice by a group of lumberjacks who were attacked by the party after the party lost a bet and refused to pay up.

I guess I'm just a not getting it, but I'm not sure what a "time out" would accomplish. Have you tried this in the past and had positive results?

I had part of that talk before the prison game. I explained that this would be a very dangerous environment and if they decided to go against the flow they would be risking their lives. That did not help. However, I do think that's a good suggestion, so I'll have to ask them what it is they want and what they're trying to accomplish.

But I'm still sticking with the real people as characters idea for the moment. Mostly because I wrote up the game for it.


Nymian Harthing wrote:

I'm confused. Why do the other PCs have to get involved, exactly? Part of the consequences of PC actions is the other PCs have the freedom to wash their hands of their dopey companions.

Sounds like these PCs could use some jail time (due to their actions) and the players shouldn't be allowed to talk or anything during that time. Kind of like many groups do when a character dies.

It just seems to me that making people play themselves might not have the intended effect you're seeking. They still know it's a game.

They're family IRL (two brothers, a cousin, and a friend since childhood; the cousin is the overly aggressive one), so they're used to sticking by each other, right or wrong, and that's carried into the game.

Actually, funny you say that abut jail, because one of those TPKs was picking a fight in a Chelaxian penal colony. I don't really get how you're suggesting I deal with jail though. Who isn't allowed to talk and when?

Perhaps you're right, but I think it's worth a try. Nothing else has worked.


Icyshadow wrote:
It might work, unless the moron who started the mess is aggressive IRL as well.

He actually isn't IRL, he's a big guy and talks a big game, but he's too mild to pick a real fight.

Nepherti wrote:
Or if the players are too attached to the characters that are themselves. They may interpret GM actions as personal attacks rather than as "the GM trying to teach them something."

I had not considered that actually. I used to have a guy in that group with whom this would be a problem, but the current guys I've got get that it's a game and I'm not out to get them. But I will keep that in mind, thanks for bringing it up.


I've been running into a problem with a few inexperienced players who keep acting as if the freedom to do anything in a game also frees them of the consequences of their actions. So far this has resulted in two TPKs, mostly because a single player acts pointlessly aggressive and initiates combat with an NPC and draw the ire of all their allies and also the town guard. The rest of the PCs, showing solidarity, fight along side their completely in the wrong partner and get killed along with him when they inevitably turn to deadly force to try and escape.

I've thought about this for a little while and I decided that the new characters they make will be themselves (at least for a little while). I'm mining the classic trope of heroes from another dimension quite shamelessly, but I think that playing as themselves will make them feel more inclined to protect their life and less likely to pick fights with people to whom they fairly lost bets.

Does anyone think this will work?


Lobolusk wrote:
Q&A

I don't plan on really using the zombies, or at least the zombie apocalypse scenario at the beginning, I'm sure there's more than a few strewn around Ravenloft. What did you do specifically with the zombies, add a template/work out higher hit die or just an ad hoc ruling at the time? I'm \curious to see what you did so I know what to expect if I implement it.

I hadn't even thought about the feats! Something so basic... My group is going in with a 15 point buy. I'm trying to get them to play smarter so I'm making them more vulnerable. I sincerely hope it works and hope that I'm not just sending to their graves faster.

That coffin golem idea sounds pretty awesome so I might take it. Factor in the grave dirt as some kind of evil earth elemental...yeah... I'm going to TPK the heck out them! Muahahahaha


Sorry in advance for the wall of text, I have a lot to say however, so please don't hold it against me.

Now that I've addressed some of the early issues, I wanted to share what my goals for the campaign. I have a group of relatively inexperienced players at present who have a problem understanding that just because you can do whatever you want in a RPG doesn't mean that you're free from consequences and that your character doesn't come back from the last save point. So I've decided that I'm going to have them play themselves as regular people transported by a magical accident (or whatever, I haven't really decided yet because the field is wide open in this regard) to the world of Golarion. I'm hoping that this will cause them to think with self preservation in mind.

After their trip through dimensions they end up in a crypt where they arm themselves with rusty weapons and armor and find their calling as adventurers. I'm thinking that the crypt might have some connection with the Knights of the Raven, but I haven't decided yet. Regardless, when they exit they find themselves already within in the county of Barovia, coming up at the crossroads by the gallows and the unhallowed graves. Their actions in the crypt get the attention of a hermit who acts as a caretaker for the area and offers the PCs his roof and whatever food he can scrounge up, but more importantly he trains them in what class they wish to become and hints that he may know what happened to them.

As to the area itself. I'm planning on expanding it a little, adding a second village, New Barovia (I'm thinking that each will say that it's the original Barovia and that the other village is full of liars), and some wilderness to accompany it. Each village hates each other and says that it's full of liars and werewolves and necromancers and all sorts of horrible things. However, each village will be almost exactly the same, some people even down to mannerisms and speech patterns. I haven't yet decided if that's a creepy coincidence or something more sinister. The only thing that keeps them from rushing to burn each others village down is Strahd, who, rather than being a devil and a scourge upon the land, is seen as a necessary evil.

The way Barovia was set up before always bothered me. It just seemed like the residents would all be killed years before the adventure started by Strahd and his minions at the rate they attack. And if that didn't happen the tension and fear would drive the village mad and they would either storm the castle and all die or try to run and die that way. It seems to me that Barovia needs something else to hate besides Strahd, and he's smart enough to realize that, so he solved that problem by making them hate each other.

The early adventure, before they're ready to meet Strahd, they'll work at solving a mystery of disappearing townsfolk. Obvious both villages accuse the other of harboring witches, necromancers, werewolves and every other monster you could think of. They're also quick to blame the hermit at the graveyard (who is clearly up to something, everyone agrees on that) and his new boarders who came from nowhere and have funny accents and strange clothes, even stranger than the gypsies (but they have the Count's protection).

I had more, but the forum ate my post.


Lobolusk wrote:
A little off topic, but I ran a castle Ravenloft conversion lat year, and it went well, you have to adjust bad guys up +2-+5 CR and tweek a few characters, but the 2.5 module Return to Castle Ravenloft worked great. let mm know If you have any questions? UStalav is the perfect place to set it.

I don't think I've ever seen Return to Castle Ravenloft, is it available online for free or would I need to pay? (which I'm totally willing to do if it's worth it) How did you deal with the issue of channeling vs turning in the conversion process? How did you deal with the Sunsword and Holy Symbol of Ravenkind, did you keep them as legacy weapons or did you just make them unique magic items of a less intricate quality? What gave you the most trouble in converting and what should I watch out for? I had more on my mind, but it escaped me, but I think I've asked you plenty of questions already!


Haladir wrote:

I started a conversion of Expedition to Castle Ravenloft to Pathfinder about a year ago, but ultimately abandoned the project. I was going to put Barovia in Varisia, in the northern Malgorian Mountains, about three days' ride east from Ravenmoor.

When I started the conversion, I was completely new to both Pathfinder and Golarion. I picked up the then-brand-new Inner Sea World Guide, and was looking for a place to put Barovia. I decided that the Zarovich family had been exiled from Ustalav, and had relocated to Varisia. I chose Varisia because the write-up seemed to be the most "standard fantasy" setting, and that a gloomy place like Barovia would be out-of-place. I then decided to start the PCs at Level 1 in a "normal" place, and the Sandpoint description in the ISWG seemed like a great place to start. Given the one-paragraph write-up, I wrote the outline of a goblin raid on the town, and a conspiracy involving the ghost of The Chopper and a cult of Lamashtu worshipers. When I ran my outline by people on these boards, it was pointed out that I was essentially writing Burnt Offerings, so I bought Pathfinder #1, and ran it. For a while, I had planned to run Skinsaw Murders into Ravenloft, but when I began the actual conversion of EtCR, I came to the conclusion that Rise of the Runelords was just an all-around better adventure series, so I abandoned the whole Ravenloft thing.

I do agree that a lot of the supplemental material in EtCR doesn't convert all that well to Pathfinder. Actually, I found the whole plot of EtCR to be a bit disjointed and thought that the writers were trying to cram too many horror movie tropes into it, diluting the gothic horror that made the original so special. I ended up picking up a copy of the original 1985 AD&D module I6: Castle Ravenloft, and worked on converting that directly to Pathfinder a bit, so as to strip out the zombie apocalypse/witch coven/Lovecraftian stuff that EtCR threw...

I will make sure not to read a better adventure and get tempted away then! I do think that I'm going to be subbing in a good deal from the original adventure and scrapping some of the more headshake inducing parts of the 3.5 version, like the zombie apocalypse scenario that must have sounded great in the writer's room, but did not translate well to the actual adventure.


Thanks for the responses and dealing with my vacillation on the issue of location. Ultimately I think that I'm going to go with NW Ustalav as the location of Barovia.


Son of the Veterinarian wrote:
Robert Cameron wrote:
Son of the Veterinarian wrote:
Have you thought about putting Ravenloft somewhere in Cheliax?

It hadn't occurred to me actually. Why do you think it would be a good spot?

You seemed unenthusiastic about Ustalav, and Cheliax sounds like another place that would provide the requisite atmosphere of gloom and paranoia.

That's a pretty good reason. The more I think about it though the more I want to put it in the River Kingdoms. That way at the end of the adventure I can give them the castle and the village as a reward so they've got a home base. It might also lead into a Kingmaker style conquest game.


Beckett wrote:

A lot of the options in the back, (and a good deal of the special gear in the book) are designed around Turning, and are either wierd with or useless for Channeling. Channeling Energy is limited in PF. You can only take Extra Channeling one time, for example, and the Feats do not work together at all, but rather let you use the same pool to do something else, but not at the same time. Headband of Wis/Cha also uses the same slot as the Phylactery of Channeling, meaning that the Cleric is going to be extremely hard pressed to keep up with what a 3.5 Cleric was expected to do at minimume. A Neg Energy one will likely get a lot of party TPK's.

A lot of the options, like the Lightbringer Cleric, added to the class, in 3.5, but it does what PF Clerics already do, just slightly differently, but will need to be houseruled to work. I have not actually run EtCR in PF, so I am just guessing here, but this adventure (which is epic and on my top 2 ever published) seems like it will really show the cracks in the Channel Energy change. I would either suggest going with the Beta version or reducing the threat level on many of the encounters. I could be wrong, though.

Also add in the fact that Rogues can Sneak Attack Undead all day, they can be critted, it's really shifted the presumptions of the 3.5 adventure.

That does really change it. Hmm... I don't think I was really going to do the Lightbringer substitution levels anyway. But the turning vs. channeling does raise an interesting issue of how to avoid making a 5 minute work day into a two minute day. The last time I ran this was shortly after it came out and I'm honestly having trouble remembering how it worked out for then. I remember being annoyed at the lack of a proper ending, so I'll be swapping in the optional ending from the older edition. I guess I'll just have to see how it goes. But I'll certainly have to change how some of those items work or it'll just be a drag to give out a badass magic item that does nothing. I've got time though, they've still got to work their way through the first five levels.

Also, do you think that I'll need to use the fast XP track for this to work out properly?


Son of the Veterinarian wrote:
Have you thought about putting Ravenloft somewhere in Cheliax?

It hadn't occurred to me actually. Why do you think it would be a good spot?


Beckett wrote:

Well, as you have said, there is already a (sort of) Ravenloft-light area in Golarion called Ustalav. Ustalav isn't that undead heavy that Barovia would be questionable. You could actually do a few things, and many of them are actually fairly close to that area. One could be to place it inside the Worldound near Mendev, which could be an interesting way of hiding it from the rest of the world. Isseren and the Lands of the Linorm Kings would also be a great choice, (especially due to the connection with Hags already), with minor flavor shifts. Drop Baba Yaga completely, or make her a minor, more localized threat at best, for example.

Varisia is an okay option, but it's also far past the point of having way too much attention/stuff crammed in there just because. A few other options, sort of off the wall would be to leave Barovia/Ravenloft as a pocket plane, or even another planet like those presented in Distant Worlds. It could be a rather strange (slightly overdone, but no moreso than Varisia or other elements) secret within the Eye of Abendego.

It could also easily be a land outside of the Inner Sea Region of Golarion that isn't yet explored.

There really ins't a wrong answer, per se. However, you should note that the changes in Pathfinder, specifically about things like Channel Energy, will make any Ravenloftish game from difficult to extremely difficult 5min work days. Even the majority of the fluff about the Lightbringers and the Knight of the Raven (which is amazing) is kind of negated in Pathfinder.

I'm trying to keep it on western Avistan simply because these are relatively new players and they're kind of familiar with that area already. I don't want to overwhelm them with place names and different cultures too soon. You make a good point about Varisia though, there's hardly a hamlet in that country that doesn't have a monster problem. I think that I might go with my original plan and stick it in Northwestern Ustalav, somewhere in the Palatinates along the mountainous border with Belkzen.

Would you mind expanding a little more on the changes that will possibly make this more difficult? I'm prepping the beginning of the adventure for tomorrow so it's not especially important that I have all that info right now, but it would be nice to have in mind early on.


Chaotic_Blues wrote:

Well you could take a page from the original Ravenloft.

As I recall, the original had Castle Ravenloft, and environs in a pocket plane that would occasionally grab the occasional adventuring party. Nothing quite like the terror on players faces when you told them a fog bank rolls in in the middle of the night....

That's definitely from the campaign setting and not the original adventure. It's a decent idea, but that's not the direction I want to take things. There's already some plane-hopping to start the adventure out, don't want to double down on it and confuse the relatively newbie players.


I am very much of a mind to convert the 3.5 Expedition to Castle Ravenloft (with some elements of the original) to Pathfinder and run it in the world of Golarion. I am aware that there is an older thread for this, but it hasn't been posted in for over a year so I decided to make a new one. If this offends others you have my apologies.

First, I was considering placement. Part of me leans towards NW Ustalav, in the more mountainous parts of the Palatinates where a fog shrouded village like Barovia could easily be tucked away and lost to time. But others have pointed out how undead heavy Ustalav is already and that makes me consider either Varisia (probably in the SE) or the River Kingdoms, where a small village like Barovia could easily be dropped in among the constantly shifting holdings. I ask you, my fellow Paizoians (Paizoites?), to weigh in.

Secondly, I am considering if there is a way to start the PCs at first level around the village and have them work their way up to the actual adventure itself. The adventure doesn't start until 6th level so I need at least five levels of distraction before they turn their attention on the Count. I was considering using them as unwitting pawns in the priest's mad scheme from the 3.5 version. Anyone else have some suggestions as to how to tone down Barovia until they're ready for the real pain of Strahd's attention?

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