Paizo Top Nav Branding
  • Hello, Guest! |
  • Sign In |
  • My Account |
  • Shopping Cart |
  • Help/FAQ
About Paizo Messageboards News Paizo Blog Help/FAQ
Sunlord Thalachos

Quintain's page

Goblin Squad Member. Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber. 362 posts. No reviews. No lists. No wishlists.


RSS

1 to 50 of 362 << first < prev | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | next > last >>

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

The grammatical use of can does not indicate an option. It indicates an ability which replaces his normal ability to wield medium weapons as a medium creature.

In other words, he is considered to be large when it comes to the rules pertaining to appropriately sized weapons.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Jayder22 wrote:
Quintain wrote:

Unfortunately, this build is mechanically unsound (unless something in this build allows for qualifying for combat feats without having to qualify for them):

Monkey Shine is just a combat feat, not a style feat and thus cannot be taken as the Monk (MOMS) bonus feat.

All the style feat lines work this way. The initial feat is considered to be a style feat and the rest are combat feats.

** spoiler omitted **

from Master of Many Styles:

"Alternatively, a master of many styles may choose a feat in that style’s feat path (such as Earth Child Topple) as one of these bonus feats if he already has the appropriate style feat (such as Earth Child Style).The master of many styles does not need to meet
any other prerequisite of the feat in the style’s feat path."

Ah, thank you! I knew I was missing something, just couldn't put my finger on it (probably didn't read far enough).


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Your aegis is treated as large for weapon size purposes, so he'll use large weapons normally, and medium weapons will be considered to be on size smaller.

So, you'll take -2 when wielding medium weapons, and light medium weapons will be too small for you to wield. One handed medium weapons will be considered to be appropriately sized light weapons.

No, you won't gain any benefit from using the Aklys in two hands.

Quote:


Using two hands to wield a light weapon gives no advantage on damage; the Strength bonus applies as though the weapon were held in the wielder’s primary hand only.

Because you are considered to be large, thus allowing the dual wielding of large light weapons, you are also considered large when trying to wield a large light weapon in two hands.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Unfortunately, this build is mechanically unsound (unless something in this build allows for qualifying for combat feats without having to qualify for them):

Monkey Shine is just a combat feat, not a style feat and thus cannot be taken as the Monk (MOMS) bonus feat.

All the style feat lines work this way. The initial feat is considered to be a style feat and the rest are combat feats.

Monkey Shine:

Monkey Shine (Combat)
You combine acrobatics and opportunity to devastating effect against your opponent.
Prerequisites: Wis 13, Improved Unarmed Strike, Monkey Moves, Monkey Style, Stunning Fist, Acrobatics 11 ranks, Climb 11 ranks.
Benefit: While using Monkey Style, if you successfully deliver a Stunning Fist attempt, in addition to the normal effect of Stunning Fist, you can spend a free action to enter a square adjacent to you that is within your opponent’s space. This movement does not provoke attacks of opportunity. While you are in your opponent’s space, you gain a +4 dodge bonus to AC and a +4 bonus on melee attack rolls against that opponent. If otherwise unhindered, the opponent can move away from you, but if he does, he provokes an attack of opportunity from you even if his choice of movement does not normally do so.
Normal: You cannot enter an opponent’s space.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Question on teleport trap:

If you have a mage that is teleporting multiple people, do all of them get a save, or do they all relegate to using with wizard's save (and they either are redirected or not depending on his save)?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Stockvillain wrote:

There was a 3rd level spell back in 3.5 (Anticipate Teleportation) that handled this, but I don't know if there's any kind of updated PF option. The greater version (lvl 6) even added a 3-round delay before the teleporting creatures arrived, without them being aware of any time passing.

I used it in a campaign that took us to the Abyss back in the day. My GM was a sad panda.

This is actually perfect.

Beopere wrote:


The spell divination:
"Should I prepare for someone to teleport into my presence the next 7 days?

No? We're gravy!

Yes? Crap!

Divination: Should I prepare for someone to teleport into my presence in the next 3 days...

Nice. A little vague though on the particulars. But can be narrowed down with enough effort.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

That would trigger when someone reached the area...which at this point, is too late.

I'm talking a round of warning or perhaps a spell/ability that can deliberately delay the resolution of the teleport until actions can be taken.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Does anyone know of any method for giving prior warning when an incoming teleport is about to happen so that you can take prepared actions?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

There are plenty of 3pp products that allow for ranged flanking for the cost of a feat.

If you aren't playing PFS, taking a feat to give you ranged sneak attack is really quite doable.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Quote:


I know that +1 ML is more powerful than +1 CL though, so I'm not sure how to price the +2 headband.

With the lack of automatic scaling, manifester level is not more powerful than caster level, it just allows for an ability to exceed your class level if you desire.

I'd price the +2 headband the same price as the magic item, and say that the bonus to manifester level does not stack with overchannel because they are both from "powers" similar to stacking enchantments from spells and items.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

as an enchantment, similar to a 'cleaving' weapon.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

It'd be more logical to have the mechanics of the vital strike feat line apply to a single lance attack at the end of a charge than try to squeeze in the logic of using pounce.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Xethik wrote:

So in this case you would need

Dwarf or Gnome
AND
Defensive Training Racial trait
AND
(Imp Two-Weapon Fighting and Two-Weapon Fighting) OR Flurry of Blows
AND
Twin thunders
AND
Weapon Focus x2
AND
BAB +6

This is correct.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

^This


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Ok, so it's weakness is that it is a burst effect and it plays by those rules, despite it being a Will save vs. A reflex.

At least it's a start.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Simply because once you have willingly joined the collective, you are always a member of the collective until you declare you want to leave the collective.

A collective is just a mental network you can join. You don't actually participate in anything other than being a member if you are not the collective owner.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Does anyone know of an effective way (other than simply not being in the AoE of a channel), to negate the effects of an enemy channel effect?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Nimoot wrote:

I was meaning if the whole party is in the Vitalist Collective and the Tactician Collective, could abilities be chained or anything special.

No automatically belong to 2 collectives, that'd break stuff lol.

No, there is no chaining or anything special if you belong to multiple collectives.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Nimoot wrote:
Just got a wicked idea... Do the Tactician's and the Vitalist's collective link together so they could combo off each other if all of the same targets are in their respective collectives?

If you are talking two different collectives for two different characters, no, they don't link together (as in a collective member does not automatically belong to a second collective if the vitalist is a member of the tactician's collective).

I'm not sure what you mean when it comes to "combo off each other".

Now, levels of tactician and vitalist (and anyone else that has a collective stack for purposes of the effective level of the collective ability.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Playing a tactician will take a lot of pre-planning and in-game coordination with your party in order to be effective.

You'll need to explain to your party members just what can do in specific scenarios.

You won't be a player that can personally take down the BBEG, or a front line combattant. What you will be is the guy who ensures that your damage dealers will have maximum efficiency.

You'll want a high intelligence for powers/power points, and a high charisma for maximum use of strategies.

Recommended strategies:

If you have a melee sneak attacker: Coordinated Distraction

Coordinated Distraction:

Alternatively, the tactician may make the initial attack against the targeted enemy, gaining the +1 competence bonus instead of the directed member, and the directed member treats the target as being flanked, but using the strategy in this fashion makes it a full round action instead of a swift action.

If you have a Maneuver using monk (combat tripper): Coordinated Maneuvers

If you have a GM that likes to use charging/poucing foes: Disruptive Terrain -- this also is good for preventing bad guys from fleeing.

Distracting Gaze deserves special mention in that it works extremely well well with the gang up feat, allowing rogues to pew pew pew and actually shine in combat the way they really should.

Reposition: this allows 2 5' steps for those bandit/sniper rogues and their ranged sneak attacks.

Telempathic resistance is a potential life saver for all members of your collective.

Coordinate:
At 6th level, as long as the tactician maintains psionic focus, he may share any one teamwork feat he has with one member of his collective within line of sight and line of effect. Declaring which member of the collective gains the teamwork feat is a free action that may only be done once per round. The ally’s positioning and actions must still meet the prerequisites listed in the teamwork feat to receive the listed bonus, but the ally need not meet the feat prerequisites to gain the benefit.

This one ability is potentially the best one the tactician can bring to the table, given this feat in the Advanced Class Guide:

Pack Flanking (Teamwork):

You and your companion creature are adept at fighting together against foes.

Prerequisites: Int 13, Combat Expertise, ability to acquire an animal companion.
Benefit: When you and your companion creature have this feat, your companion creature is adjacent to you or sharing your square, and you both threaten the same opponent, you are considered to be flanking that opponent, regardless of your actual positioning.
Normal: You must be positioned opposite an ally to flank an opponent.

Note the difference between this (which is a constant effect) vs the similar strategies. Note the synergy with Distracting gaze.

For spellcasters in the party, echo effect allows for single target spells to be echo'd onto another party member (such as yourself). Never forget to use this.

Let me give you an example of what I'm talking about: You have a tank and a rogue with you and a healer.

In a typical dungeon scenario, you are following along a 10' corridor with no branches (to keep the scenario simple). You meet the conga line of death that you have to plow through to get to the BBEG.

In the scenario, you have a static battle line and the rogue that is up next to the fighter is a sub-par combatant due to not being able to flank...in comes the tactician with distracting gaze. You are now considered to be flanking and the rogue can now go to town with full attack sneak attacks with his two handed fighting crit fishing kukri build, while staying on the front lines allowing the cleric to heal him and the fighter, and you plow through the bad guys with out having to expend tons of spellcasting resources and time to take out said conga line of death.

Getting snap shot and improved snap shot will allow you to threaten squares you can't specifically get to, but will allow your rogue friend to be a whirlwind of death.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
TriOmegaZero wrote:
Quintain wrote:
Yep. But this could be done for the entire climb. Taking 10 is like hand waving the entire dungeon until you get to the BBEG.
No, it's like handwaving the lone kobold guard.

When that kobold guard could potentially kill you, sure.

I'm glad we agree.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Quote:


That's not for a single point in climb. That's for a +14 to climb and a feat. At low levels that bonus to climb is a significant investment and a feat is always important.

The reference was in regard to the requirements for the feat. Not the overall effort.

Quote:


"Just as you're nearing the cave, you find a perilous overhang blocking your way up. It's harder to climb than the relatively simple rocky slope you've been following so far, and your regular effort isn't quite enough to get past it. (Taking 10 isn't enough, but it doesn't fail by enough to make you fall.) You could try to make a heroic effort to get over it and risk falling, or you could search around for an alternative route, though you might become fatigued if you have to keep going much longer."

That's the kind of thing that could happen within the rules.

Yep. But this could be done for the entire climb. Taking 10 is like hand waving the entire dungeon until you get to the BBEG.

Quote:


Quintain, I'm curious why you see a monetary investment in climbing gear reasonable but not an investment of skill points? Many classes only get 2 skill points per level. Putting a single point is 50% of their class skill point resources. Shouldn't they benefit from it?

I have never stated that an investment in skill points isn't reasonable. What I don't find reasonable is a static skill check for active actions.

And if you have a class that has only 2 skill points, you'll definitely want to prioritize your investments. Climbing gear is something everyone can get for close to nothing.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Quote:


To sum up : an environment is not interesting, it's what you do inside that matters.

Maybe you should just teleport to all your encounters.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

You could also actually describe the climb and give the character decision point to change his path, instead of giving him one decision of go or no go.

Its up to you to make your game environment interesting or not.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Quote:


I'd rather spend the time working out ways to overcome a far more interesting challenge; one with multiple possible ways of overcoming it, and which rewards intelligent strategy. There's nothing clever in just rolling the dice until you succeed, with no reasonable alternative plan; everybody knows what to do to climb a wall, and which pieces of equipment will help (should you happen to have brought them along).
That's why the game rules 'trivialize' the challenge by allowing take 10; it's really not a challenge worth wasting game time on.

Therein lies the problem...and it's all about attitude.

Spock to Kirk: Why are you climbing this cliff
Kirk to Spock: Because it is there.

You don't see it as a challenge to overcome, you see it as a trivial obstacle that prevents you from getting to what you think you want.

We do indeed play two different games.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Quote:


That's exactly what's supposed to happen. It's by design.

Oh, I know it's by design, I am just not a fan of the design.

Quote:


Significantly improves our odds. ... In our example before that had about a 7.5% chance of success, we instead have an 89.9% chance of success. In order to get to a 50% chance of falling, you would need to make 260 checks and climb a nearly 2000 foot wall.

So, for a single point in climb and a single feat our 300' cliff (DC 20 ) isn't so impossible to climb anymore.

But it still has a chance of failure to keep consequences a real part of the game.

The only time (and this is strictly opinion) that Take 10 would be a viable mechanic would be for passive type checks.

Quote:


...nobody wants their character to spatter his brains at the bottom of a perfectly ordinary wall simply because the dice were cold.

Nobody may want it, but as in real life, Murphy's Rule applies.

The funnest games that I have played have all had a realistic world that had one basic rule: you will not always encounter things that you can defeat...that includes monster as well as the environment, plan accordingly.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

If that's a better investment in your estmation, at least it's an investment.

What it is not is hand-waving.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Quote:


Why would I take craft magic item feats if I can fail a basic roll and waste tens of thousands of gold on an item my character should in theory have no problem creating?

Why would you try anything where you have any chance of failing...is basically your question. Or are you only willing to risk failure when it's really important to you.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Here's an interesting feat I found:

[url=http://www.archivesofnethys.com/FeatDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Sure%20Grasp]Sure Grasp[/url

Quote:

Source Ultimate Combat pg. 1 (Amazon)

Your quick reflexes and skill at climbing keep you from falling to your doom.

Prerequisites: Climb 1 rank.

Benefit: Roll twice while climbing or when making a Reflex save to avoid falling, and take the higher result.

How does this little gem alter our probabilities of making our 300' successful climb?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Quote:


Does it matter?

When would be the best time to attack in such a scenario? Probably the half-way point when the PC is in the worst possible position. At which point it doesn't matter if they are using gear to help climb, or taking 10 (and no longer able to once you start attacking). The point at which the invisible BBEG decides to reveal himself doesn't change anything for this.

Yes, it would matter, if your BBEG's minions are worth more than the paper they are written on and actually react to your actions and are pro-active in their own right.

Or do all your BBEGs sit in the room at the top of the tower waiting for you to come kill them?

Why would you not choose to remain invisible and untie the rope from it's secured point without breaking invisibility and revealing your position making you a target for potential counter attack?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Kudaku wrote:

Here's the thing. Climb is tied with Swim (and depending on how you look at it, Linguistics) as the weakest skill in Pathfinder. Climb and Swim are primarily relevant at very low levels and are quickly and utterly eclipsed by low level magic spells and cheap magical items that do everything the skill can do, better. While you can have a climb modifier of +5 or +50, it doesn't change the fact that the 3rd level wizard will happily beat you to the top of the wall with a single cast of Spider Climb or Levitate.

Your house rule heavily punishes characters with a decent but not dramatically high climb modifier. "Decent but not dramatically high" skill bonuses are primarily found at low levels, when characters don't have the resources available to really specialize skills and guarantee that, for example, a low climb roll won't see them fall of a cliffside. Because of the extremely numerous rolls a climber needs to make to climb even a moderate cliff, that all but guarantees that he will plummet off it potentially to his death.

Your house rule annihilates the one small niche where the climb skill (and presumably also the swim skill) is potentially useful.

My "house rule" (which really isn't -- this is a philosophical discussion) is leveraged to reward intelligent and imaginative game play and not use rules that trivialize the game world's environment.

No everyone that uses the Pathfinder d20 base ruleset plays in the high magic environment that you assume.

Have you ever played a campaign with no arcane or divine magic?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
bbangerter wrote:


If the enemy is around to exploit a weakness in equipment, isn't he also around to shoot arrows at the climber negating the ability to take 10?

Tell me, when invisible, do you always attack, and thus break invisibility?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Kudaku wrote:
And you realize that your villain now needs to invest in a piece of equipment that doesn't actually exist?

The equipment as it is described can also be used by securing a rope to it and threading a rope through pitons so that in case of a fall, it stops them prior to actually reaching a significant distance that would cause them damage.

You know...kinda like how it works in actuality.

Which incidentally, will allow someone to climb an obstacle that would actually ensure periodic failures.

Inventive and imaginative gaming vs hand waving.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Kudaku wrote:

Er... You have read the description for the Second Story Harness right? The harness does nothing to keep you from falling while climbing, the +5 circumstance bonus is only active when you are secured in place (by definition not moving) and the bonus is only applied against climb checks to avoid falling when taking damage - ie it'll help you if someone is shooting at you, but not when you roll badly on a normal climb check.

Here's a Harness clicky for convenience.

Assuming the harness worked the way you thought it would though, that's an item that trivializes the risk of climbing a cliff - exactly the thing you seem to object against the Take 10 rule for doing?

It requires an investment to succeed vs hand-waving. And a dependency on equipment can be exploited by enemies. Hand-waving cannot.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Avh wrote:


Spider harness doesn't exist.

You can have a climber's kit, but that only gives +2 to climb checks.

Even with your spider harness, you wouldn't be able to climb your DC 15 wall taking 10 (1d20+0 DC 15, means you need 15 to succeed, not 10).

Sorry, I used the wrong name, possibly a memory of the name of the same item from 2nd edition: Spider Harness =

http://www.archivesofnethys.com/EquipmentMiscDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Second-s tory%20harness

My objection to take 10 is basically game philosophy -- it's hand waving of things that are relatively dangerous activities. Defined as relatively dangerous due to the fact that failure leads to the potential for death.

You could easily extend this philosophy to combat and "take 10" and just crunch numbers and say who wins combat.

Question for you probability types: If you take a -5 on your checks (effectively increasing your DC by 5), but you have to only make 50% of the checks in question, do you have a greater probability of succeeding given a starting DC 20 dungeon wall?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
TriOmegaZero wrote:
Quintain wrote:
You guys are ignoring a lot of rules when you start talking your probabilities and quips about "auto failure".
So you hate take 10 but are fine with auto-succeed bonuses.

This is no different results-wise than having a climb speed...which basically means that climbing is as natural as walking to you.

So, no, I don't have a problem with it.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Saldiven wrote:

@Quintain:

Even if a character only falls on a roll of 1, once you get to the point that 14 checks have to be made, the character has greater than a 50% chance of falling on at least one of those checks. If a character has to make 20 checks, he has only a 35.85% chance of making every single one, and that's if they only fall on a 1.

If a character could normally succeed on a 10 (thereby making taking 10 just barely possible) and taking a fall on a five or less, the numbers are much tougher. Every required check after the second means the character is more than 50% likely to fall. If only 10 checks are required, there is only a 5.6% chance that all ten will be passed.

http://stattrek.com/online-calculator/binomial.aspx

Again, skill checks do not auto-fail on a 1.

In order to fall, you have to miss your check by > 5.

So, on a DC 20, with a spider harness, that's a modified DC 15. That would allow a level 0 character to climb that cliff at will with no effort and no climb skill, and no strength modifier with Take 10.

Because he would never fall...he would just have to take more time than someone who didn't miss his check.

Level 0, no climb skill, no strength. Your prototypical non-athlete commoner.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Quote:


Benefit: You gain a +2 bonus on Climb and Acrobatics checks, and may take 10 on Climb checks even when distracted. If you fall, you automatically reduce the damage taken by the fall by one die, as if you had fallen 10 less feet. This reduction in damage stacks with the Acrobatics checks to further reduce falling damage.

I like it! Nice find.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
thejeff wrote:

Climbing the cliff:

Fall!
12d6
Did you survive? Try again?

You forgot a few things:

1) Rolling a 1 isn't automatic failure.
2) You can get gear modifiers: See Spider harness
3) You get a saving throw to catch yourself in the case of a fall.

You guys are ignoring a lot of rules when you start talking your probabilities and quips about "auto failure".


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Quote:


How have you made the challenge more interesting?

By putting the mcguffin in the one place you'll never go, thus making the BBEG invulnerable (or at least having an easy escape).


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
thejeff wrote:
blackbloodtroll wrote:

More interesting for himself.

It's a different DM style.

It's not about playing with others, it's about playing with yourself, and having others there to watch.

Some groups are in to that.

I still think he's just not getting the probability part. Still thinking of it as fun risk, rather than nearly guaranteed failure, even with the smallest possible chance of falling.

You realize that dice rolls aren't *ever* evenly distributed over the course of any number of rolls themselves.

You guys crunching the numbers and determining probability are assuming even distribution of rolls.

That is not the case.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
DM_Blake wrote:
Quintain wrote:

As a BBEG, the perfect place to hide my mcguffin is in a small cave half way up a 300' cliff.

You guys would never find it...because it is "too tedious" to get to if you actually had to roll dice.

No he wouldn't - just like EVERYONE ELSE, he FAILED at least one of his 20 climb checks and fell to his death trying to hide it - your mcguffin is lying on the ground at the base of the cliff, along with the corpse of your BBEG.

Nope, he used gear to prevent himself from falling.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Quote:


Nah. Rolling a bunch of dice with no tactics or decisions isn't fun.

You assume that there is nothing to find while climbing said cliff. It's just an obstacle that exists between you and your BBEG.

As a BBEG, the perfect place to hide my mcguffin is in a small cave half way up a 300' cliff.

You guys would never find it...because it is "too tedious" to get to if you actually had to roll dice.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Saldiven wrote:

Gaming at Quintain's table sounds irredeemably tedious if he expects people to make checks like this. If he expected my character to make 20 checks to climb something he could take-10 on, I'd never come back to another session. All the required dice rolling is a boring waste of time for the party as a whole.

I wonder how many other people posting in this thread would come back?

I guess challenges are too much for you unless you have the instant gratification of taking down the BBEG.

For me, the fun is in the journey, not the destination.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
TheOddGoblin wrote:
Quote:
You transform the physical makeup of a weapon as you desire. This spell functions like greater magic weapon, except that it subtly alters the physical properties of a weapon, enabling it to bypass damage reduction of one the following types: bludgeoning, cold iron, piercing, silver, or slashing. The affected weapon still inflicts damage of its normal type and its hardness and hit points are unchanged. This spell can be cast on a natural weapon or unarmed strike.
Functions for Natural weapons. I believe with this or possible Eldritch Claws, I have what I'm looking for for the character I'm planning on making. I'd like for him to have some way of getting Adamantine claws, but magic(and upgradable from the Amulet) does the trick pretty nicely.

That's what I get for not reading the entire description.

Good catch.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Hrothdane wrote:
This spell

You might have some problem with that option, considering it "functions like greater magic weapon", which doesn't work with natural weapons.

Having a parallel spell that functions on natural weapons seems logical, however.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
aptinuviel wrote:
Quintain wrote:


That kinda depends :P

I read through this thread, and it was quite entertaining, but I'm a little confused by something.

You are aware that even if you Take 10, there is a chance of failure, correct? I realize people have said this a few times in the thread, but you seem to still think failure is impossible.

Yes, on a take 10 failure is possible, but not really failure with consequences.

Standing at the bottom of a 300' cliff, you'll need 20 checks to get to the top with a movement rate of 30.

Take 10: Can't get up 15'. No consequences, they look for a way around that is "safe".

But when fighting the BBEG against whom a 5% chance of failure is much more likely, you won't see players hesitate, they are all in from the rolling of initiative.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Wraithstrike,

I guess it comes down to a difference in approach when it comes to the game rules and the rules forum.

I'm not here to specifically state (unless I specifically state) that one way is better than the other -- that RAI is purer than RAW or argue what is right and what is wrong, but get more of a (and I've said this before in other threads) holistic result from the rules.

Being a bit old as well as "old school", the lack of realism or challenge with Pathfinder sometimes gets to me, so I look for a brainstorming session on how to "improve" things.

As it stands, YMMV.

Quote:


I don't really think so.

Most people want to play Epics like the Odyssey or the Aeneid. The high fantasy Pathfinder is modeled after.

...

I'm talking more about the epic failure being a good story that you repeat to your friends. Most of the awesome stories that we (my gaming group) remember are those where things went wholly and totally wrong on all levels, and somehow, someway a couple of us survived to tell the tail.

-CSB-
Like that time after being forcibly ejected from Undermountain into a garbage heap in Waterdeep: I had a drow necromancer with a staff of thunder and lightening and our party psionicist tried to use id insinuation on me (2nd edition complete psionics rules) and got a power score, turning me (an ally) who was chatting with him at the time, into an enemy. Due to this epic 5% chance of Murphy's law applying, I loaded 4 charges and hit him with everything I had (2x - stunning him the first round), and destroyed every piece of equipment, magic items. While all his gold and gems he had on him were embedded into the out-house behind him. All except for his broom and dust pan.

Which started and epic all out PvP battle between PCs that ultimately left my character in the garbage heap and others beheaded, fireballed and otherwise scorched. The psionicist was ulimately resurrected.

It was one of the most fun nights of my gaming life
[/CSB]

All because of a 5% chance of failure. It was a 5% chance, and the results were EPIC. And the mechanics involved were nearly identical to a skill check.

Quote:


The rest of my post still stands: Given that the two walls are identical and it's the same climber with an unchanged skill, the chance of success should be the same (DC 20) and the risk he takes should be the same (either 20% fall chance on BOTH walls or he Takes-10 for a 0% fall chance on BOTH walls). And since Take-10 is clearly allowed on the safe wall where we can apply no distraction, then it makes no sense to disallow it on the other, IDENTICAL, wall.

I hadn't thought of this at the time, so I skipped it...but one thing you are probably missing is the familiarity of the wall in the first case and the lack of familiarity with the wall in the 2nd.

Had the jumper/swimmer wall been there, I would say that take 10 is allowed due to having done it multiple times before.

Given an identical wall, but only coming upon it on an adventure to a land he has never been to? Nah...identical or not, I just don't see the rationale working. He may say: "Holy crap, this looks like a wall I climb back home all the time", but then look down and see his imminent doom at the bottom of the cliff and have a wholly different perspective.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Quote:


A good story failure does not make.

That kinda depends :P


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Quote:


I'll say that again: Pathfinder assumes you always try your hardest, do your best, most careful work, every time.

That is exactly what the Take-10 rule is for: trying your hardest, doing your best, and being extra careful to eliminate all chance of failure when you have mastered your skill to the point that the task you're attempting is easy for you."

The problem is: there is no 45% chance of falling off the other one.

There might be a 45% chance of making no progress at some point, but even on a roll of 1, you have to miss the DC by 5 or more in order to fall.

Other than that:

Quote:


Why does the DC not change in the second scenario? Because there is nothing in the description of the Climb skill that suggests changing the DC due to fear of failure.

That is the hole in the rules. And I'm not talking about changing the DC, I'm talking about not allowing take 10 due to the potential consequences of failure. Just like you try to assess whether the monster you are about to fight is going to curb stomp you or not.

In the second scenario there would definitely would be a fear of failure -- because the consequences of failure are certain death. So, the approach to the task would be wholly different barring the confidence level of a sociopath. You would bring gear that prevents falling (piton, spider harness) or change your tactic somehow that ensured success outside of your own skill.

Because, there is a Law. It's owned by Murphy.

Except in Pathfinder...a game designed for player success.

1 to 50 of 362 << first < prev | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | next > last >>

©2002–2015 Paizo Inc.®. Need help? Email customer.service@paizo.com or call 425-250-0800 during our business hours: Monday–Friday, 10 AM–5 PM Pacific Time. View our privacy policy. Paizo Inc., Paizo, the Paizo golem logo, Pathfinder, the Pathfinder logo, Pathfinder Society, GameMastery, and Planet Stories are registered trademarks of Paizo Inc., and Pathfinder Roleplaying Game, Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Pathfinder Adventure Path, Pathfinder Adventure Card Game, Pathfinder Player Companion, Pathfinder Modules, Pathfinder Tales, Pathfinder Battles, Pathfinder Online, PaizoCon, RPG Superstar, The Golem's Got It, Titanic Games, the Titanic logo, and the Planet Stories planet logo are trademarks of Paizo Inc. Dungeons & Dragons, Dragon, Dungeon, and Polyhedron are registered trademarks of Wizards of the Coast, Inc., a subsidiary of Hasbro, Inc., and have been used by Paizo Inc. under license. Most product names are trademarks owned or used under license by the companies that publish those products; use of such names without mention of trademark status should not be construed as a challenge to such status.