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Cayden Cailean

Protoman's page

Goblin Squad Member. FullStarFullStar Pathfinder Society GM. 1,338 posts (1,347 including aliases). 1 review. No lists. No wishlists. 9 Pathfinder Society characters.


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Dirty Fighting will help skip those prereqs for maneuver feats.

Gorum's Swordsmanship feat allows a special use of Vital Strike when you charge. Need the Divine Fighting Technique feat, alignment of the deity (the only prereq) and the specified specific weapons (typically the favored weapon of the deity). It also comes with advanced prereqs that if you obtain later on, you'd get the advanced benefits (without having to take another Divine Fighting Technique feat).

Oh that's what Thaago meant.

Hmm that's tough. On one hand the extra dice doesn't get multiplied on a critical as a regular bonus modifier would which would have gotten empowered along with the base blast dice. While on the other hand it does modify a simple blast and would even count for Kinetic Healer.

For now I'd just be running it as a No for my own kineticist for conservative reasons, but hope it gets clarified soon.

The same link I put up earlier has him saying "you couldn't empower it, since that's a different ability." Metakinesis only works for actual blasting for attacking.

Cao Phen wrote:
Does a Kineticist's Diadem gives extra dice to roll for Kinetic Healer? If so, since it states that physical blasts converts the bonus dice from d6 to d8, does it also do that for the Kinetic Healer?

Mark says a diadem should work with kinetic healer.

And yea, use d8's if you got a physical basic kinetic blast like water or telekinetic.

Salvage would probably help. The target is "one shipwreck" but who would argue that one can't go overboard on fixing something that ain't completely destroyed?

It's too bad the Dirty Fighting feat doesn't help with most of the feats from Weapon Master's Handbook since they don't deal with maneuvers much.

N. Jolly wrote:
Slithery D wrote:
The introductory language is sort of ambiguous in parts about whether it's a bonus wild talent or it replaces an existing one, but the Earth Child talent, at least, makes it clear in the attunement section that it replaces and existing wild talent. That must have been what they meant for all of them, although it makes this a very "meh" addition to Kineticists. You already have to seek these places out and pass a (sometimes hard and dangerous) test just to have access.
So what I'm taking from this is that it's not really guide worthy? It doesn't sound like the kind of thing I could really include a rating to aside from "elemental leylines good!", so everything else is a moot point.

It's so entirely dependent on a GM even allowing it or bothering to work it into a campaign I'm not even sure it's worth being in the guide. The book lists example powers (which are still pretty flavourful and cool) but any other powers are gonna have to be houseruled in as custom powers.

Occult Realms only has Elemental Saturation for kineticists, areas where the elemental planes are strongly linked to Golarion other other planes (though very common in the Elemental Planes). If one becomes attuned to an area with some appropriate skill checks, the kineticist can get access to a new wild talent (it says they can learn it, I think that means it's available to be picked up from regular wild talent progression/Extra Wild Talent feat and not that they'd get an extra talent on top of regular advancement automatically.) The book lists several example locations for each element with an example specific location and power.

Hey, Mark, with all the recent clarifications on spell-like abilities not counting as spells for prereqs (unless a specific name of spell is being mentioned), metamagic feats/rods specifically for spells, and in general caster level of spell-like abilities not counting as spellcasting levels, I'd like to ask about how feeblemind interacts with spell-like abilities.

PRD - Feeblemind wrote:
Target creature's Intelligence and Charisma scores each drop to 1. The affected creature is unable to use Intelligence- or Charisma-based skills, cast spells, understand language, or communicate coherently. Still, it knows who its friends are and can follow them and even protect them. The subject remains in this state until a heal, limited wish, miracle, or wish spell is used to cancel the effect of the feeblemind. A creature that can cast arcane spells, such as a sorcerer or a wizard, takes a –4 penalty on its saving throw.

Would someone suffering from feeblemind be unable to cast spell-like abilities (racial or class) when feeblemind says "unable to...cast spells"? My kineticist got feebleminded in a PFS scenario and I'd like to clarify the matter the next time that happens if he can still use kinetic blast or not to instinctively protect allies with blasts, such as the way a martial character might still instinctively use a weapon (would it be improvised or would they still be proficient) to protect allies?

Also, if a character is still able to cast spell-like abilities, do they need a minimum amount of Intelligence (or Charisma for some creatures I guess) to even be able to figure out how to?

Check out Archives of Nethys.

MadScientistWorking wrote:
Another question. With the Elemental Annihilator can you use weapon finesse with your attack if you wield the Devastating Infusion with two hands?

If you formed it to be a light weapon, it can be finessed. However, light weapons typically can't be held in two hands for increased strength bonus. That situation would be the same here for 1.5 x Con modifier.

PRD - Equipment - Light, One-Handed, and Two-Handed Melee Weapons wrote:
Light: A light weapon is used in one hand. It is easier to use in one's off hand than a one-handed weapon is, and can be used while grappling (see Combat). Add the wielder's Strength modifier to damage rolls for melee attacks with a light weapon if it's used in the primary hand, or half the wielder's Strength bonus if it's used in the off hand. Using two hands to wield a light weapon gives no advantage on damage; the Strength bonus applies as though the weapon were held in the wielder's primary hand only.

As clarified elsewhere, if a fighter gives up armor training, he doesn't get to use the sash of the war champion. So it's not about the level of the class, it's about specifically being granted the class feature. And have a class feature when your class description tells you you gain that class feature. Which the brawler's Martial Training does not do in regards to any of the fighter class features. All it does is let brawler count his class levels as fighter levels for feats and magic items, not class features.

Shadow_Charlatan wrote:
If gather energy is used but not discharged with a blast, how long can it be held (possibly by making concentration checks each round as per a spell that requires concentration?
Gather Power wrote:
If she has both hands free (or all of her prehensile appendages free, for unusual kineticists), a kineticist can gather energy or elemental matter as a move action...Gathering power in this way allows the kineticist to reduce the total burn cost of a blast wild talent she uses in the same round by 1 point. The kineticist can instead gather power for 1 full round in order to reduce the total burn cost of a blast wild talent used on her next turn by 2 points (to a minimum of 0 points). If she does so, she can also gather power as a move action during her next turn to reduce the burn cost by a total of 3 points. If the kineticist takes damage during or after gathering power and before using the kinetic blast that releases it, she must succeed at a concentration check (DC = 10 + damage taken + effective spell level of her kinetic blast) or lose the energy in a wild surge that forces her to accept a number of points of burn equal to the number of points by which her gathered power would have reduced the burn cost. This ability can never reduce the burn cost of a wild talent below 0 points.

If you use a move action to gather energy, it lasts for 1 round, so until the beginning of your next turn. If you gather power for 1 full round, then it lasts until the end of your next turn. If you gather power for another move action after the full round, it'll still only last until the end of the second turn. You don't need concentration checks unless you get damaged while holding the gathered power.

Shadow_Charlatan wrote:
And if not discharged by the maximum time that you gather energy (assuming you can't hold the energy for later) would it result in a wild surge like when you take damage and fail a concentration check ?

If not discharged, the energy dissipates harmlessly and the end of the duration. Unless you get hit.

Shadow_Charlatan wrote:
If able to hold the energy would it be safe to say that you would no longer have a 20 foot radius effect centered on you since you've already effectively gathered the energy and would be walking around with some kind of energy effect held between your appendages/hands ?

"Gathering power creates an extremely loud, visible display in a 20-foot radius centered on the kineticist, as the energy or matter swirls around her."

I'd say the energy is constantly swirling around you in a 20 foot radius no matter where you move while holding the power.

Shadow_Charlatan wrote:
Could gather energy be used to create the display then discharged without a blast, such as an attempt to intimidate or as a loud signal for others to do something/ warning of an attack ?

Constantly gathering power would be awkward for 1 minute of conversation for Intimidate to change a person's attitude. For demoralizing in combat before the standard action Intimidate? Sure? Any actual bonus would be GM determined.

For a loud signal, should work fine.

So this came up in PFS recently.

My kineticist got affected by a song of discord and attacking allies. Another instance of clear spindle resonance + wayfinder not being enough.

Party wizard casted feeblemind on my kineticist with intention of casting break enchantment the next day.

Feeblemind wrote:
Target creature's Intelligence and Charisma scores each drop to 1. The affected creature is unable to use Intelligence- or Charisma-based skills, cast spells, understand language, or communicate coherently. Still, it knows who its friends are and can follow them and even protect them. The subject remains in this state until a heal, limited wish, miracle, or wish spell is used to cancel the effect of the feeblemind. A creature that can cast arcane spells, such as a sorcerer or a wizard, takes a -4 penalty on its saving throw.

Can characters still use spell-like abilities? If not, does feeblemind affect the kineticist's spell-like ability usage of kinetic blasts or selecting infusions or wild talents? Maybe not tactical use but inherent instinct of using flame jets to fly away from danger or going very fast or simply blasting things in self-defense?

We went with "no spells, no SLAs" for that session but I figured I'd get some input.

Grumpus wrote:

Does a small kineticist take the size penalty on the CMB-based infusions?

It probably doesn't make much sense logically, but I'd say yes the size modifier (-1) for a small kineticist would apply to the CMB, as I'd allow a large-sized kinetic form using character to apply the size modifier (+1) too. I'd argue that the balance is adjusted on the size bonus to the kinetic blast attack roll.

Dekalinder wrote:

Unstoppable Magic is moot since it's exactly the same of Spell Pen, so there is effectively no point unless you pick all three, and I don't think is actually worth since at 13 you have access to Pure-Flame who renders all this feats usless. Simple picking up Spell Pen, maybe the improved one, and later reatraining is better than committing the racial extra feat.

Additionally, I feel Extra Wild talent to be pretty pointless especially if you plan on be pure Pyro, there isn't enaugh stuff so you are going to have almost anything anyway.

If you are open to considering other races, I think the best racial bonus is the Halfling one.

Pure-Flame is a level 7 infusion, so earliest pyrokineticists can pick it up is level 15 if they pick up Expanded Element (fire) at that specific level. For single-element pyrokineticists, that's kind of a long time to bank on not ever having to worry about Spell Resistance. Oh, and it only works on blue flame composite blasts. If one's just wanting to throw on status-effecting substance infusions on a fire-immune target (like blind, burning, or dispel), a simple blast is more worthwhile because at least it'll be easier to throw on some form infusions to go with it, such as a simple extended range, snake, or kinetic blade/whip to at least make the whole blast effort safer for the kineticist to do so. And if targeting a fire-immune target, which is likely in high level games, then a pyro is gonna wanna defeat SR consistently and getting all the Spell Penetration feats could be worthwhile, especially if gotta play up to level 15 just for pure-flame, which isn't even an option for games that go that high. Whereas SR can be encountered as early as level 1 or 2.

Extra Wild Talent is worthwhile if one wants a bunch of wild talents at their disposal. If by level 6 I want 4 infusions, such as burning infusion, extended range, kinetic blade, and fan of flames, I'd need Extra Wild Talent.

Unstoppable magic is less useful if one's branching out to a different element, just grab a physical simple blast. But until then or if single-elementing fire, SR can and will bone a kineticist, especially if their damage is noticeably lower than other optimized characters and just consistently hitting touch AC and doing some damage is the only way their contributing to tough fights. The alternative racial trait seems like an ok idea (even getting the Spell Penetration feats to go with it) if one does wanna go pure fire and knowing the game isn't gonna get to level 15, like with PFS, or simply fighting lots of consistent enemies with SR, like a Wrath of the Righteous game.

I hope the avenger vigilante at least keeps the full BAB from the playtest.

Faelyn wrote:
For those of you who have played a Pyrokineticist... would you suggest Human with Unstoppable Magic? Or a Half-Orc for the extra damage from their FCB? I am curious if the bonus to SR penetration is more important? Or if raw damage would be the better way to go?

You should figure out what feats you'd want, and if you'd like the human racial favored class bonus of 1/6 Extra Wild Talent feat or not.

If extra feat's not necessary for your build, I guess Unstoppable Magic. A pyro is stuck with only fire for at least 6 levels anyways so fire immunity is a moot point. They might as well account for things that have spell resistance which could absolutely nullify their blast's effectiveness. While the obvious fire immunity would mean no damage, the status-affecting/debuffs fire infusions require the pyrokineticist to get past SR for the blast to still have any effect.

Falxu wrote:

I've taken Improved Critical at 9th, it delays kinetic whip for me till 13th, but I think my geokineticist can make due till then.

Improved critical is about as awesome as it is for any 20/x2 weapon: 5% better chance to critical hit.

In standard Pathfinder, you cannot increase the critical range once you already have done so.

How are you getting Improved Critical at level 9 with a BAB of only +6?

Gather Energy wrote:
If the kineticist takes damage during or after gathering power and before using the kinetic blast that releases it, she must succeed at a concentration check (DC = 10 + damage taken + effective spell level of her kinetic blast) or lose the energy in a wild surge that forces her to accept a number of points of burn equal to the number of points by which her gathered power would have reduced the burn cost.

The kineticist has two ways to getting rid of the energy gathered: blasting in the same round as a move action gather energy or on his next turn with 1 round spent gathering energy; or not blasting in the allocated time and the energy is gone.

But even if he didn't plan on blasting, if he gets hit before the energy is gone, then the concentration check is needed and the DC is always 10 + damage taken + effective spell level of the blast.


Coolio. I shall do the same.


If Cetenna gets captured and brought to the Ashfall Lodge, does that count as her surviving and I report box C? Or should that box only be checked if she escapes?

Kineticist. Pyrokineticist with (greater) flame jets if you want the right visual. Aerokineticist with wings of air if you want more control with your flight a lot earlier.

Arcaian wrote:
This is all correct, unless you have the Sage Archetype for your familiar - then it gets 2 of its own skill ranks/level, and doesn't share skill ranks with you.

For the case of the sage familiar archetype, would it get extra skill points with a higher Intelligence modifier?


Oooo updated seasonal handout? That's pretty great.

Flaming/frost/etc weapons and bunch of other items require a command word to activate.

Fortifying stone

Armor vents

Check out armor modifications. Has some optional rules from the Faction Guide.

Dirty Tactics Toolbox has a spiked hilt where one can hide a dagger inside the hilt of a sword or hafted weapon.

That's all I can think of for now.

The example involves a stupid goblin wanting a fiery blade.

But for simplicity sake, replace "disarm" with "trip".

Oh damn I'm so excited for that book to be released to non-subscribers!

Ravingdork wrote:
Protoman wrote:
Ravingdork wrote:
Couldn't you perform combat maneuvers with kinetic blade, kinetic fist, or kinetic whip?
Only the maneuvers that normally involve weapons. Trip, sunder (would be a terrible choice for energy blasts), and disarm.
The other maneuvers don't need weapons anyways. :P

And those ones would require regular CMB that isn't modified by Weapon Finesse and would use strength modifiers instead.

The infusion maneuvers Texas Snyper mentioned would use Constitution; and grappling infusion has its own formula of 2 + Kineticist level + Con modifier.

2 levels ranger or slayer worshipping Irori can score Monastic Legacy thanks to Combat Style (Faithful = Irori) [Inner Sea Combat pg 11].

Sacred fist uses its levels as monk to calculate unarmed damage so I would argue it doesn't work with Monastic Legacy since for damage purposes, it's basically monk levels. As argued in this thread.

However, RAW it can be argued that sacred fist still isn't monk, as argued in this thread.

In short: It's contested and no official answer yet. Also, ranger combat style is awesome to skip pre-reqs.

When you actually perform your readied action, your turn order in the initiative track changes to be RIGHT BEFORE the triggering action's initiative turn.
For example, you rolled a 17 initiative and readied an action if goblin attacks. Goblin at 12 initiative attacks. Your readied action gets moved to a 12, but still before the goblin's 12, and you kinetic blade him.

The kinetic blade lasts until the end of your turn (at your new initiative of 12 from the previous example). So you don't threaten with the blade after your turn ends. You'd need kinetic whip for that.

However, if you were to activate kinetic blade at the beginning of your turn and trigger an AoO that somehow still provokes an AoO from you, you'd threaten.
For example, after you and the goblin traded blows against each other, decided that it's getting a little dicey to stick around, especially as more goblins are approaching. But you don't want this lil bugger to keep breathing! You attack the goblin with kinetic blade, but missed! Next you try to tumble away, you rolled poorly on the acrobatics and provoked an attack of opportunity from the goblin as you try to back off. The goblin, mesmerized by your burning kinetic blade (ok cards on the table, pyrokineticist is my favourite flavour of kineticist and this example will be using fire kinetic blade) and tries to stupidly (goblin) disarm you of your fire blade without possessing the Improved Disarm feat (goblin) in order to brag to his goblin buddies (goblins love fire). He makes a disarm attempt for his AoO, which in turn provokes an AoO from you with your kinetic blade still active because your turn hasn't ended yet. You slice(/burn) him with your AoO with the kinetic blade, killing it finally, and finish your movement/tumble.

Imbicatus wrote:
Protoman wrote:

Or how about allowing a brawler to flurry with the temple sword? Or allow him to use his increased unarmed damage with the sword?

Could an unchained monk use kick/headbutt style strikes with the sword?

Yes, but there is very little reason to other than style points since a brawler could have had the same effects with close combat mastery with a close weapon.

Protoman wrote:

Could an unchained monk use kick/headbutt style strikes with the sword?
Yes, with Ascetic Form, the second feat in the chain.

Oh that's a good point. I also forgot that brawlers can already flurry with monk weapons (though proficiency is another matter).

Ravingdork wrote:
Couldn't you perform combat maneuvers with kinetic blade, kinetic fist, or kinetic whip?

Only the maneuvers that normally involve weapons. Trip, sunder (would be a terrible choice for energy blasts), and disarm.

Would Ascetic Style allow brawling armor to apply its attack/damage/grapple bonus to a temple sword?

Brawling Armor wrote:
The wearer of brawling armor gains a +2 bonus on unarmed attack and damage rolls, including combat maneuver checks made to grapple. Her unarmed strikes count as magic weapons for the purpose of bypassing damage reduction. These bonuses do not apply to natural weapons. This special ability does not prevent the wearer’s unarmed strikes from provoking attacks of opportunity or make the wearer’s unarmed strikes count as armed attacks. The brawling ability can be applied only to light armor.

Or how about allowing a brawler to flurry with the temple sword? Or allow him to use his increased unarmed damage with the sword?

Could an unchained monk use kick/headbutt style strikes with the sword?

Texas Snyper wrote:

Kinetic Blast

Kinetic blasts count as a type of weapon for the purpose of feats such as Weapon Focus. The kineticist is never considered to be wielding or gripping the kinetic blast (regardless of effects from form infusions; see Infusion), and she can't use Vital Strike feats with kinetic blasts. Even the weakest kinetic blast involves a sizable mass of elemental matter or energy, so kinetic blasts always deal full damage to swarms of any size (though only area blasts deal extra damage to swarms).

Bolded the important part. It is the kinetic blast that is the weapon. It is a ranged weapon, thus the point-blank shot and precise shot feats.

Unless word of god says otherwise, I would think kinetic blade would be a melee range ranged attack.

"Melee range ranged attack" would imply you'd be provoking if you use it in melee range.

Kinetic Blade and Whip are melee attacks.

Chess Pwn wrote:
I believe Mark commented that the blasts couldn't do non-lethal at all as an option. when this was asked in his thread.

A bit of searching, found it! Thanks for the heads up.

Combat wrote:

Nonlethal Damage with a Weapon that Deals Lethal Damage

You can use a melee weapon that deals lethal damage to deal nonlethal damage instead, but you take a –4 penalty on your attack roll.

I don't think any kinetic blast is able to do nonlethal damage normally.

As for Kinetic blade/whip, maybe? It says use a melee weapon rather than wield. But I don't know about the energy types though.

mardaddy wrote:
Travelling for some time to reach the largest city to get the largest reward you can is also known as, "greed."

Or simply following supply and demand. Any city with the biggest bounty would have had the biggest issues with Jack and happy to know for sure he/it is dead.

Roll a Knowledge (local) check for your GM.

Spell Penetration feats will definitely be in a future build solo-elementy pyro build. Retraining two feats in PFS takes a lot of prestige points.

As for telling melee players to not get in the way; in narrow indoor spaces such options are often unavailable, and even in open spaces, I'm of the opinion if range characters can full attack wherever they want (not applicable to default kineticist, sure, but the policy applies in general) they can move elsewhere to take one shot and full attack afterwards. Melee characters have limited options on where they can attack from (typically adjacent or within 10 ft) and even more limited mobility moving around enemies or establishing tactical positioning for flanking or teamwork feats; ranged characters can attack from wherever, just with potential penalties. Most folks would prefer melee types directly between enemies and rest of non-melee party. It should be ranged characters' responsibilities to either get a clear shot or account for penalties. The prohibitive cover rules are the only thing ranged character supporters argue that full-attacking ranged archers aren't too strong when defending their builds to skeptical GMs/party members and those cover can be negated too easily in higher levels as it is: Improved Precise Shot or Snake infusion.

Ravingdork wrote:

Protoman, I'm honestly not certain I'd recommend Point Blank Shot and Precise Shot unless you're relying on physical blasts.

With a pyro, you're always aiming for touch AC, so you can usually get by quite well even without those feats. I plan on playing a PFS human pyrokineticist in the near future who, by level 3, will have Unstoppable Magic, Spell Penetration, and Greater Spell Penetration--SR will pretty much never be a concern. Her later feats will likely be Toughness and Extra Wild Talent.

After playing the pyrokineticist pregen a couple of times, I'm not the least bit concerned about not having Point Blank Shot or Precise Shot.

It was much very needed in early levels for me when allies were providing cover and getting into melee with enemies (+3 to ranged blasts and a -4 to attack due to allies adjacent to enemies and +4 to AC/Touch AC cuz they're providing cover? Bleh), with standard 30 ft or extended range, allies are typically blocking at least 1 corner somewhere in the shot. I wasn't doing enough damage (1d6+3 with PBS at level 1) to account for a crappy modified to hit modifier. Also at lower levels, kineticists have a comparable advantage compared to other classes (besides alchemist) against swarms and incorporeal creatures, and they're typically sporting touch AC as decent as their regular AC.

It may not be as needed now, but I've been enjoying >90% hit rate for only so-so damage which is the main way he contributes at higher levels. Even now when I make a crappy roll (which is rather common unfortunately. I've proven to my gaming friends about my crummy luck a have terrible dice rolls on average), the only reason I'd hit was due to having Precise Shot.

For the case of fire, my PFS pyro branched out at 7 for air to get a physical blast and eventually will get air's reach for increased range on attacks. (I considered earth, but I don't consider magma composite any better than plasma and at least plasma allowed for brilliant and flash infusion. Magma works with eruption but the damage in so drastically decreased with physical blast it's more worthwhile to stick with fire blast for it).

I had to seriously weigh in on monster options being thrown at me. For example, golems or other creatures with fire immunity or immune to magic that involves SR. Would Burning infusion still work on something that's immune to spell resistance? It says has to overcome it first which would be impossible without Pure Flame infusion.

Then there's all the high level devils and demons on scenarios the pyro would volunteer for. After picking up feats like Toughness, Precise Shot, Weapon Finesse, and after level 6 bunch of Extra Wild Talents, not a lot of room for Spell Penetration. Easier to pick up a physical blast that's more universally applicable than spending a feat to help with SR. I'd be worried I'm more of a liability in parties than help if I gotta bank of caster level checks with everything I do.

Though next pyrokineticist I make from scratch (I haven't played one from level 1 for the finalized kineticist, instead updated the playtest version which starts off its wild talent progression MUCH differently) I think I'll go full fire instead of branching out to try something a bit newer and tougher. I'd just have to focus in a different direction than current pyro.

Echo Vining wrote:
Foeclan wrote:
It compiles and updates a lot of the previous race books into one place, as well as adding some new content. If you already have the 'X of Golarion' books, where X is 'Dwarves', 'Kobolds', etc., then it probably won't give you much new information. If you don't, then it's a good way to get that content, plus some newer things, all in one book.
As a follow-up question, if I get Inner Sea Races, can I skip over picking up the (race) of Golarion books?

Really depends on if you want more in-depth race details or not.

Kinetic fist gives d6 extra element damage to unarmed/natural attacks.
That extra damage doesn't include modifiers to kinetic blast damage, such as Con modifier.

Fire's Fury wrote:
When using fire blasts or composite blasts that include fire, add your elemental overflow bonus to the damage dealt. If the kinetic blast normally adds double your elemental overflow bonus to damage, these effects stack.

Fire's fury adds a damage modifier to a blast.

Kinetic fist's d6s of damage doesn't add damage modifiers that apply to a blast.

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Well that'll really depend on the reader. I can start midway into a series (sometimes that's all that's available to me back when I avidly went to the library as a kid) and if I was into it I'd wanna start back from beginning of publication order and go from there with the reasoning that I'm reading the stories the author presented them in.

It's like with Star Wars. I'm watching Eps 4-6 first. Then 1-3 (if I really have to). But for the novels? HAH. I pick up whichever actually interests me. There isn't much point to chronological if newer stories can be inserted into whenever in the EU timeline. Well Legends timeline now I guess. I'm starting the new comics and novels of new canon timeline when I have time.

Reading everything chronologically for Varian and Radovan stories can be awkward too:

1) A Lesson in Taxonomy - First set chronologically. No Radovan. Published after the first novel. It's kinda awkward to start here.

2)The Fencing Master - After Taxonomy but decades before Hell's Pawns. It would be more enjoyable reading this after Master of Devils and Queen of Thorns and definitely before Lord of Runes.

3) Hell's Pawns - While I read Prince of Wolves first, I'd personally start here. Told in Radovan's POV exclusively, it'll still give a good idea of their backgrounds and their roles as a party or in society better than the previous chronological ones.

4) The Lost Pathfinder - A prelude to the Prince of Wolves and more Chelaxian intrigue.

5)Prince of Wolves and onwards from the blog post should be chronological.

Advantage of chronological would you find out how they meet party future/current members, their equipment, previous mentions of adventures would make more sense, etc. Though for some reason Master of Devils ain't for everybody (lots of wuxia Kung Fu isn't for everybody?!) and I know a lot of folks skip it despite it having lots of good stuff in it.

If you were to read King of Chaos, I'd suggest reading Queen of Thorns before that one though as QoT introduces a character who'll have equal POV screen time in KoC.

But basically it's a matter of what kind of stories you like? Classic fantasy = Queen of Thorns. Horror fantasy = Prince of Wolves. Martial Arts fantasy = Master of Devils. Epic stuff that ought to influence Golarion in a way = King of Chaos. Runelords = Lord of Runes.

Simply love Varian and Radovan stories and wanna read them all? Start at Prince of Wolves or Hell's Pawns and go from there picking wherever you wanna go.

If your GM isn't making anything up to fill in time at Kenabres celebrations, you can basically start reading it now. Have you rolled initiative for combat yet? Then you can read the book safely.

As for chronological order, the novels are: Prince of Wolves, Master of Devils, Queen of Thorns, King of Chaos, Lord of Runes.

There's a more detailed list including short fiction of Varian and Radovan's adventures over at Dave Gross' blog.

I'd encourage reading the novel when you get a chance, it definitely gives off the right vibe of what traveling through the Worldwound would be like: stressful and terrifying.

Well it does have some nifty alternative racial traits and racial/ethnic teamwork feats + traits.

King of Chaos is actually the 4th book chronologically. Though the author Dave Gross encourages folks to read at whatever order interests them first.

Just don't start reading the book til you've actually started Book 1 of Wrath of the Righteous and you're good to go. The first chapter of WotR happens at the end of the first chapter of King of Chaos.

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