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Not least because that would be possibly the least efficient method of getting amino acids you could come up with, most of the volume of blood is water. A protein shake would so much more efficient, not to mention you wouldn't need to hunt the thing, just stop by your local late night GNC.
Not to dogpile Auren, but that's kind of the issue with scientifically explaining magic. You start getting players nitpicking on things like the inefficiency of drinking blood. And if there is one thing us nerds are known for, it's being really nitpicky when it is unnecessary. :)
Interesting, I never noticed this. I'll have to take a look.
Alraune was never really a mythological creature. More of a creature inspired by a novel of the same name, rather than an original creature.
I don't see how the Adaro is different. Nor Cerberus. Three headed dog, and in some legends, they are skinless. And I don't see how the rusalka is different, aside from adding spells which would fit her theme.
Zomok exists as it does because there is little information about it. Literally all I could find was "Winged snake that is a mount for wizards." So with creatures like that, with little description about them, they take liberties with. For that, it's fine to do that because there isn't much description.
With Tamanous, there is enough description to form the creature. And really, with any creature, there will be some liberties taken to help it fit better with an RPG. I just think that keeping it as close as possible to the original when we have a good description about the original is good.
DM Beckett wrote:
I couldn't agree more with your last paragraph.
James Jacobs wrote:
Makes me smile to see another fan of Turok. My late brother and I really loved the series.
While I'd love to see an "Ultimate Technology" or similar, I demand equal rights for an "Ultimate Primitive" book, too. More in-depth rules for bronze and stone age weapons and equipment, barter, pre-literary magic, etc. :D
Honestly I could see that covered in Ultimate Technology.
Each chapter would be separated into eras, no? So Just have the following:
Primitive Era: Stone Age and Bronze Age adventuring, with rules for low magic, sword and sorcery, Hellenistic, and sword and sandal gaming. Themes would include low magic, tribalism and animism, survival, and humans transcending from nomadic tribes to sedentary civilizations. Or on the opposite side, high magic with demigods roaming the world doing wild things. Ancient astronauts, cities of wonder that are destined to sink from their hubris, living gods.
Industrial Era: Late Enlightenment through Victorian and Edwardian and ending just during the Interwar period. Classics such as Steam Punk, Gaslight Romances, Pulp Stories, Early Soft Science Fiction, and Sword and Planet. Themes such as the difference engine, the march of industry, eugenics, imperialism, nationalism, exploration, and weird science.
Modern Era: Postwar Modernism to the Information Age. Noir, Dieselpunk, Atompunk, and Contemporary Era genres. Would deal with themes of paranoia, nuclear technology, war, and such.
Future Ara: Beyond the modern era. Science Fiction of all types, from Hard to Soft, Cyberpunk to Post Apocalyptic. Human transcendentalism, exploration, rights of non-humans (robots), oppression... sky's the limit on this one.
So yeah, four chapters on technology of all types. I think we can do it :)
James Jacobs wrote:
Awesome. I am tumescent with anticipation :D
Kicking this off for some collective brainstorming. These could be anything, from stars and planets to comets and meteors to space stations and generation ships.
1. A red dwarf star with its own planet that orbits close to an earth-like planet and causes problems for the denizens.
2. A comet that has a powerful ice elemental demigod trapped inside of it.
3. A massive cylindrical spaceship is on a course through the solar system. No telling what alien wonders await inside.
James Jacobs wrote:
Sweet. Am I 100% correct in thinking that this book has rules for a gravity gun? :D
Course, that is fine in your setting. But even in the base assumption for the game, according to the bestiar, undead do not need to eat, drink, or sleep. With the possible exception of the dhampir, which I think is a monstrous humanoid. So, thats why in Golarion and the base setting, taking a creature's blood/life energy/flesh without needing the sustenance and against their will is evil. They don't have Porphyri and don't spread vampirism via pathogen. They, like all undead, are the result of magic.
And honestly, at that point, if you are making the reason for being a vampire biological, I'd just go ahead and change them to monstrous humanoids instead of undead.
Joshua Goudreau wrote:
Well, some GMs would say that this being in the hardcover line would mean that it isn't options. But screw them :D
I wanna see Steampunk, Dieselpunk, Magicpunk, Clockpunk, Atompunk, and Cyberpunk rules in here. Maybe even some styles of space (Retro Futurism Space Age of the 50s-70s, Hard Science Fiction, Weird Space Science of the 1800's to early 1900's like War of the Worlds, Barsoom Series, and First Men on the Moon). There are so many popular genres that could be touched on in a book like this. It would be awesome to see. And frankly, it would help me with my time travelling adventure I wanna do :)
I have to wonder if paizo thinks they would lose support for Golarion by publishing a book like we're talking about though. Golarion is their cash cow for sure so it's a reasonable deterrent. My thoughts on it though are that any loss they may experience, if any, would be hardly noticeable. On the flip side they'd get a respectable chunk of business that was once going to other systems. I would continue to purchase the same paizo lines I always have because Golarion's an awesome setting that I love to play in. It's not the only setting I like to play in though. I play multiple games a week and playing the same setting in every game gets old, so I like to mix it up. Cyberpunk is fun as well. If there were a book or a line to support that, paizo would get my money where as right now it goes elsewhere. This is why I was so happy to hear about the tech guide and iron gods, and why I will be even happier to hear of like products:)
Well, their AP line is their bread and butter last I heard. So I think they will be fine. But I'm not a business major so...
Fantasy culture is much more present in our society than it was in the past. Therefore, people already have an idea of what fantasy should be and if you don't deviate from it, you'll never get that wonder and awe.
So in order to do that, you should stray from the familiar. make something really different that players wouldn't know. Most are familiar with henotheism and monotheism. throw in some animism and astrology. Don't stick with standard monsters, make your own. or reskin monsters. But as long as you make a setting that is a checklist of what is considered normal for a fantasy setting, you won't get that awe back.
If you die, the undead are still there. At least until someone can free them of their curse. That's kind of what you are doing when you force them into undead forms. Cursing them with unlife, trapping the spirit, and denying them an afterlife corrupts it in the Physical World. You're essentially doing evil things to people. That's the deal with that ;)
People doing evil things to innocents is tragic. But that's kind of the point of evil. For example, a leader knows their town is in danger and as a last ditch effort, makes a deal with a devil to protect the city. Lo and behold, the city is saved. So now when the leader dies, the soul belongs to the devil for all eternity to be tortured and turned into the building block of Hell. Is that fair or just? The leader made this decision to save their town, so they did good. But even then, they signed their soul away and while it's unfair that they are being tortured, that's the point of evil. Just like daemons steal souls and harvest them for their own purposes. Those might be goodly souls, but at the moment, they are powering a terrible engine of destruction against their will. Because daemons are evil. Or a legion of vampires forced into their condition by an evil elder vampire. Sure they didn't ask to be vampire spawn, but the elder vampire needed troops. Because vampires are evil.
That's the point of evil. They do evil things to good people and corrupt and break them. Evil is unfair and cruel because it simply is. And the point of good is to reverse that and save said innocents from their fate. Or, prevent it from happening in the first place.
Considering by raw that undead can be turned back to their living form via resurrection and true resurrection, I imagine a trapped soul that is freed from undeath isn't doomed to an afterlife in the evil planes.
Advanced Genre Guide.
I like that. I've honestly felt that the d20 system is robust enough to use it with different genres. Obviously changes would have to be made. But I'd love to see this book. Maybe a chapter on different styles of fantasy genres and how to run them, then another on the other genres (pulp, space, cyberpunk).
I would commit terrible atrocities and war crimes just to have an Ultimate Technology. It would fit with the rules for Stone and Bronze Age weapons we have already. I could see them adding more Renaissance tech and Industrial Age tech in addition to the WWI tech, WWII tech, Atomic Age Tech, Information Age Tech, and Future Tech.
All this talk about health insurance makes me sad I'm leaving my current job. While the pay was mediocre, I was part of the ICUBA health plan, which is pretty nice. Just got new glasses practically free. Gotta love that flex card. I'm pretty sure that the company my girlfriend works at (Akamai) has insurance that covers the gender reassignment surgery. Unsure thought. I'd have to ask her.
Got me birthday coming up and the ladyfriend is coming up to visit. Along with a surprise. Woohoo :)
That is a good point to bring up. In the setting and rules, there is nothing stopping a vampire from hunting animals, or even having an ally donate blood so it doesn't feed on the innocents. Granted, I'd imagine it'd be like getting bad weed or coke cut with baking soda, but it'd be something a good aligned vampire could do in the setting and rules.
In my game, the victims have to be sapient creatures and animal blood/donated blood only resets the hunger DC penalty by half. It doesn't totally get rid of it.
Auren "Rin" Cloudstrider wrote:
i don't really use official golarion as published, i use a more customized variation with a higher level of magic and features pulled from anime and action cinema.
And that's fine. In your setting, you run how things work. You are the master of your world and the rules of nature. I'm just pointing out the flaw in the argument comparing undead to predators in the base setting. The disconnect is largely through the different perceptions of undeath in different media.
Also, this topic is about Golarion. Hence the title. And the forum it is in.
James Jacobs says that the Vampires hunger is supernatural. Quote. But thats for golarion.
Under the Undead Creature Type, it states that undead do not need to eat. And the bestiary says they have to feast on creature's blood. So it is safe to assume that their hunger is not biological in nature.
That's not how it works. While there is no need, the drive is there. It's a part of the curse. Again, undead do not follow normal biological processes. The curse of undeath forces them to find blood, or flesh (for ghouls), or life force (for shadows) because that's an inherent propery of the curse of undeath. It's like a drug to them. They are addicted and if they don't get their fix, they start to lose it. Unless you've been through that type of withdrawal, it is difficult to understand the force that kind of addiction has. With most undead (ghosts being one exception), this is every day life.
Again, in your setting, you can do whatever you want. But in Golarion and the basic setting, undead feed because of an insane drive caused by the curse of undeath. That's why it's a curse, not a biological function. Zombies and vampires in Pathfinder aren't alternate species of humans like in Underworld/Blade, nor are they infected biological creatures like in Dawn of the Dead/I am Legend. They are dead and cursed via magic, not science.
Actually, that's not how vampires work at all in Golarion. Vampires don't need the sustenance since they are undead. From Blood of the Night:
“Hunger” is perhaps a misleading term to describe a vampire's lust for flesh, consciousness, or youth. As unliving things, they technically require no sustenance, and yet ravenousness is often considered a key characteristic of those who walk without life. In truth, this desire is driven not by need, but by psychological greed. Feasting grants the undead no physical nourishment, but does fill them with a pleasure and power they can't attain by any other means. For undead, the act of feeding can be likened to that of an addict satiating her inner demon.
In addition, under the rules for undead, undead do not need to actually eat. The issue is that you are looking at vampires (and zombies) in a modern, more biological light. This is something you see in modern movies like Underworld, I Am Legend, any zombie movie since Dawn of the Dead, etc. However, in Golarion and the game, undeath is magic. There is no biological reason why undead feast, just like there is no biological reason why outsiders don't need to sleep. Almost no undead needs to actually feed to survive because they are magic. Unlike a tiger, which actually does require sustenance to survive.
So, in regards to Golarion and the setting neutrality of Pathfinder, you are incorrect about vampires requiring food. However, in your own setting, you can obviously do what you want.