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Raistlin

Nephril's page

Pathfinder Society Member. 399 posts. No reviews. No lists. 1 wishlist. 2 Pathfinder Society characters.


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Qadira

Hey guys I was just curious if there was an average income per level of scenario available. a table would be really helpful when plotting out gear buys.

Qadira

Amazing stuff guys i really appreciate it. i used alot of yoru suggestions cevah. i kept some of the things as i had them purely a prefference thing. but your insight and proofreading was very appreciated.
Zhelgadis and matt thank you for the additional corrections. they are all helpful.
and prong glad you enjoyed it please refer any friends you have to it i would appreciate any circulation i could get.
another week or so and ill be putting in some time on a finalized version of this i cant wait.

Qadira

i put the index in specifically so people could cherry pick the information they wanted from it. this started out as a aid to help someone build characters but turned into a play assitance guide also. there are lots of finer points that players dont take note of.

Qadira

Chaiguy great stuff.
did you download this or are you checking the drive for it. i already fixed the first 2 things you found. just now modified my incorporeal listing. your cleric note was supposed to be covered under spells but i forgot about it during the time thank you very much.
i added to the druid instance. its a tough choice to cover specific limitations in classes. each class has so many things to mention but i agree that the non metal limitation is a significant one that warranted mention.
no i never intended vital strikes to be paired with shot on the run. its more of a move out from cover and shoot, or a retreat and shoot feat.
updated min maxing to better explain my version of the terminology.
dwarfs now "excel" at wearing armor and i explained why.
thanks for the natural spell corrections.
my combat free perception checks is not to mean you can search each round for free. each round your character is looking in one direction or another since there is no facing in this game it is important to point out which way you are focusing. if you are looking at an area not previously covered you should get a perception check to notice obvious things. example i attack and kill my foe i turn to guard the door behind me. there is a stealthing character somewhere in view. if your dm is not a nice guy and just asks for perception checks you may need to ask for them (as in most games ive played) if your character is looking somewhere a perception check should give you the 3.5 spot equivalent information. this could be a house rule but i think its pretty basic stuff.
as for mentioning where feats come from there are several through the document i need to list thank you.
changed carrying to wielding. the clarification should be made.
added the potion AoO to the AoO section.
added another point to damage reduction.

Qadira

chapter 2, section 2, reworked this section to try not to sound so negative while still highlighting the bards strengths and weaknesses (in my opinion of course)

Qadira

ChaiGuy, this is the only thread with a link to this guide. i never posted it anywhere.

Dekalinder, during another players turn you should not be using metagame tactics (in my opinion) if they can ask you a short question (feasibly asked and answered in 6 seconds) then you could respond. however during someone else s turn they should be allowed to operate unimpaired. players who abuse game chatter to create strategies during fights dont set a real expectation for combat. each player talking during each other players turn definitely exceeds the 6 seconds time frame. yes this is a coop game. and i would expect people to play to a mutual end and help one another while staying within game limits.
Dekalinder, while table rules and expectations can vary i still think it is a reasonable expectation to work on your character in your own time. just like a teacher that let you do homework in class you should still be ready to do homework at home.
Dekalinder, thank you for reading through the first section. i hope you enjoy the rest as it gets more to the heart of the game.
Deadmanwalking, ill take another look at the bard instance in my guide. i try my best to convey the characters strengths and weaknesses ill check out my words they may just be coming across too strong.
Dustboy, thanks for the read ill be adding pics, colors, fonts, hyperlinks, and other pretties when im out of rough draft phase.
sgtrocknroll, it took some reading on my part (every chapter has a section 2 lol) but i found the instance you were talking about thank you very much for pointing that out i fixed it.

Qadira

lol you can still do a divine list if you want.

Qadira

glitterdust, fog cloud, resist elements, web, darkness, comprehend languages, identify, magic aura, communal protection from alignment spells, whispering wind.

choosing spells that you dont normally want to have prepared is a good focus for your scroll library. for under 300 you are looking at 2nd level and lower spells. my list is all level 2 and lower and packed with strength.
these spells also dont heavily rely on saving throws or spell resistance meaning that are very useful without a full caster using them. its nice to have a scrolls others can use with minimal difficulty to great effect.
i am currently playing a fighter, scryer, eldritch knight. ill be developing an exttensive scroll library. for any casting class scrolls pose a unique utility that can make you appear as though you planned for every situation.

Qadira

thank you ironskull. ill be adding pictures hyperlinks mutliple fonts and alot of other pretty stuff after rough draft. i was using open office for the first draft and couldnt figure out how to number pages with the thing. i am working with google.doc now and i think i got that figured out but i agree it would look much better without the table of contents and title pages numbered.
thanks for the positive words always appreciated.

Qadira

Please if you have a list of corrections id appreciate it. wish i could open it to editing but there is only so much trust in forums lol. an easy way to edit would be like

ch 1. sct 2 blt 2 ln 3. this tells me that in chapter one section 2 bullet point 2 and line 3. this can be used to quickly point out spelling or gramatical errors.

for anything more significant like a mechanical problem just mention the section and the problem id really appreciate it. i know its a lot to read.

Qadira

If anyone reads a portion (or all of it) i'd really appreciate feedback or suggestions. significant input could warrant an honorable mention in the final draft. i have always appreciated the leagues help when pounding out ideas.

Qadira

once the spelling and error checking is done ill work on creating links within the document so that the index can take you to where you want to go. but right now i just want it all correct.

Qadira

thank you for reading through. i tried to have some friends go through and double check my work. spell check doesnt catch everything.

Qadira

2 people marked this as a favorite.

I have been a member of the forums for quite some time. I have been working on this guide for a while now and finished a rough draft. It's full of little tips and tricks as well as being chalked full of useful information that most beginning players will not know and some moderately experienced players may overlook. I would hope that any new players take the time and read through it. it is broken down into sections to make "cherry picking" the information you want a bit easier.

Nephril's Extended Beginners Guide..

Qadira

I have been a member of the forums for quite some time. I have been working on this guide for a while now and finished a rough draft. It's full of little tips and tricks as well as being chalked full of useful information that most beginning players will not know and some moderately experienced players may overlook. I would hope that any new players take the time and read through it. it is broken down into sections to make "cherry picking" the information you want a bit easier.

Nephril's Extended Beginners Guide..

first time using bbc code forgive any links ill try and fix them.

Qadira

this is obviously a dead thread. as per umd:
This skill does not let you actually use the class feature of another class. It just lets you activate items as if you had that class feature.

a few things here.
it does not give you an effective class level just the feature. so level 0 druid can wild shape to turn into about 0 things.
while rogues may need a buff changing the way a skill works would buff all classes that choose to take umd as a class skill (dangerously curious)
the other fighter items i don't have a problem with. as per the rules they should work just fine. and your dm has ruled correctly saying you have 0 levels of fighter for that purpose. why did he change his own ruling when it comes to wildshape and INCREDIBLY powerful class feature that makes weapon and armor training look insignificant.
by your interpretation by level 8 you can wildshape for most of an adventuring day and by level 12 half a day. that is just ridiculous.
if you are homebrewing rules why not just take craft wonderous item and create an item that allows you to wildshape as a druid or your level once per day. consider the cost of such an item. a polymorph shirt that could be used 1/day for 12 minutes (not hours) would still cost 24000 gold. that is just to give perspective on what you are trying to do.
but of course to all of this you could simply say
"Your interpretation isn't wrong, but it is not the only viable interpretation."
it doesnt make you right it just makes you sound less indignant.

Qadira

Society takes current level into account for acs and saves. so the real problem with being a rogue is the 3/4 bab progression. meaning you have to roll higher and higher as the game goes on. tougher encounteres take into account that you should be attempting to get flanking no matter what the class so then there comes the additional to hit requirement. if you are playing in a group that meets every week there are a few things you can do.
1. make friends with someone and ask them to take outflank and you take it too. +2 more to hit.
2. Eldritch heritage (arcane) for a familiar then Improved familiar for an imp or something that can flank for you while invisible (if the gm doesnt allow it thats his interpretation whatever) or he can aid you if you already have flanking (to aid he would probably have to be visible). +2 to hit either way.
3. there are a number of traits and feats that equate to improved chance to hit. i.e. weapon focus, sword scion, these can make up for the difference of your missed bab levels for quite a few levels. the only thing you miss out on is the power attack bonus (that you should not be using as a rogue).
4. forget about dual wielding it is not viable.
5. weapon choice. if you are playing a elf or half elf use an elven curved blade, if you are using a half orc use a falchion.
6. if you go weapon finesse route you will be worthless unless you are sneak attacking. i would recommend going strength based with a 2 handed weapon.
7. its already been said but i will +1 it at this point in my post. Feint is very useful for you. though it is feat intensive it can let you work solo when need be.
8. make friends with a mage or get a familiar and have it use wands on you. wands of bulls strength, invisibility, vanish, dimension door,
9. most classes should spend about 10% of wealth on consumables it is my belief a rogue should spend more. you must be the swiss army knife. ready for any situation with the correct scroll, potion, wand, contraption, skill check to handle the problem.
10. do not give up your trap finding. in all honesty its the only reason im ever happy to see a rogue at my table. without it people will view you as less useful. i know the archetypes look cool without it but it is something the party should have. and making someone else give up a useful piece of there class so you can get some little trick is not worth it to the party.
11. you are playing a very sub optimal class. accept that do your best to make up for it. and remember everyone else can get away with just doing what they want. you need to hold delay initiative and hold action and think about every play or you wont make it.

Qadira

do you mean dreadful wrath?? also why not go half or inquisitor for the amazing racial. adding half your level as a bonus on intimidate is incredible.
cant take weapon specialization without weapon focus. the dazzling display to shatter defenses should be rushed as early as possible i cant even find imperious command.
just think ahead then you dont need quicken spell rather see extend spell for self buffs.
and as far as your domain i would suggest Liberation. its so powerful and can save your life countless times.
i also like 1 handed weapons i can use 2 handed. that opens me up to more options. Scimitar is an awesome weapon. then you can make it keen for some big damage later in game.
with these suggestions you could support your friends better when you are injured using shattered defense with a bonus equal to your level+ranks+3(class skill)+charisma+2 orc racial. against a dc of 10+targets hit dice+wisdom mod.
you can take traits to make intimidate work on additional foes like unnatural presence to affect animals and vermin
love lust is a trait that gives +2 to intimidate.

Qadira

thanks i couldnt find a way to do it but i figured id check here first.

Qadira

I have a half-elf ranger in our group who swears he found online where it states he can take precise shot at level one. i disagree and cant find any wording or ruling that would allow a ranger to take precise shot at level 1.
obviously if he was a human he could take point blank then precise but he is half elf so just the 1 feat. if anyone has anything to say id appreciate it.

Qadira

one more question guys if the second attack of the flurry of maneuvers i.e. a trip then an attack he believes the second attack should take a -2 penalty which it specifically states it does not.

Qadira

that's why we do our rules debates between games. you don't know what your talking about and your coming off as a dick. i am asking for rules clarification. it is difficult to locate all the final rulings so after he and i look we turn to the boards for more help. bltzkrg242 your not helping. your not contributing to the discussion you said your piece and now your just causing issues please find another thread where your input will be valued.

EDIT: took out some language i am understanding is undesired in here :-)

Qadira

Thanks i was pretty sure but wanted to hear it from someone else.

Qadira

Ok I'll retire the threat final understanding disarming while wearing a gauntlet is fine so long as you do not use the gauntlet as a weapon i.e no applying its special properties while disarming. that is fine thank you all.

Qadira

I understand you need to qualify for a feat before you can take another feat.. now if you gain multiple feats in the same level could you for example take medium armor proficiency followed by Heavy armor Proficiency in the same level??

Qadira

thank you grik i am inclined to agree with you. if i forgo the +1 to attack from the masterwork gauntlet i.e. not wielding the gauntlet as a weapon then all should work out fine.

Qadira

and this is for a society game so im just wondering what is actually legal if i have to drop the gauntlet i will its no big deal i just want to know.

Qadira

Can you wield a weapon while wearing a spikedgauntlet in the same hand...

YES

Can you disarm someone while wearing a spiked gauntlet...

YES

i dont see a problem here. and to ask about it in a forum is just one way to try and figure it out since there are devs and experienced players here bltz thanks for your input (that i disagree with but thats not the point) but dont cause the forum to fall apart bringing up that forums are not the best way to do something i dont care to here the neigh saying.

Qadira

the problem is my DM is claiming since Flurry of Maneuvers is not flurry of blows that he wants it individually erratad

Qadira

an unarmed strike is a weapon??? and disarm states it works with that.

Qadira

3 people marked this as FAQ candidate.

So when a maneuver master monk uses flurry of maneveurs and he has levels in another class how do we calculate his cmb for bonus feats.

i feel it should be monk level in place of monk bab+bab from all other classes+str+other modifiers.

my dm disagrees saying it should only be my monk level+nothing else.

Qadira

When disarming with a gauntlet can you end up with the weapon in hand as per the ruling on disarm

Disarm

[Source]

You can attempt to disarm your opponent in place of a melee attack. If you do not have the Improved Disarm feat, or a similar ability, attempting to disarm a foe provokes an attack of opportunity from the target of your maneuver. Attempting to disarm a foe while unarmed imposes a –4 penalty on the attack.

If your attack is successful, your target drops one item it is carrying of your choice (even if the item is wielded with two hands). If your attack exceeds the CMD of the target by 10 or more, the target drops the items it is carrying in both hands (maximum two items if the target has more than two hands). If your attack fails by 10 or more, you drop the weapon that you were using to attempt the disarm. If you successfully disarm your opponent without using a weapon, you may automatically pick up the item dropped.

spiked gaunlets are said to have 0 weight when part of a set of armor. could someone disarm when wearing full plate and end up with the weapon in hand.
______________
my dm is once again calling my sheet into quesiton please post your feelings.

Qadira

Fleshgrinder wrote:
Chubbs McGee wrote:
Does that character even make sense? I think that is one issue with powergaming, the combination are not always taken with any attempt at reasoning them out. May be I am just quibbling?!

A Paladin who specializes in summoning celestial creatures and eventually works their way up to being the disciple of a metallic dragon.

Seems like a pretty neat character concept actually, even outside of the mechanics.

My eidolon looks like a multi legged silver dragon (chinese serpentine type) rushing to the aid of friends using magic to imbue and empower everyone and myself and when the time needs summoning goodly creatures to aid in our battle. and i follow Apsu dragon god.

I felt i needed to say something thank you fleshgrinder for thinking before posting. and chubbs you seem to neigh say an awful lot try contributing instead of just questioning everyones posts.

Qadira

Chubbs McGee wrote:
Ashiel wrote:
Chubbs McGee wrote:
Nephril wrote:

oh and the point buy for this would be

STR: 14 DEX: 12 CON: 14 INT: 10 WIS: 8 CHA: 14
All fine and good, as long as the player was willing to roleplay that WIS 8! :)
The catch is that there is no "correct" or even "wrong" way to roleplay an 8 Wisdom, beyond having the appropriate penalties. You might use it for character quirk ideas, but there is literally no wrong way to play it.
Not quite what I meant. I have played with loads of PGs who conveniently ignore their dump stat when, and wherever, they can.

look at the average npc most of them will have an 8 in a stat. this does not mean you are hindered in any way via roleplaying. you have a -1 to your perception and heal and a few others. will save goes down. i do however go out of my way to act rashly (unwise) and usually display a general lack of attention.

But this is a thread on power gaming not role playing so i didnt feel a need to include a how to guide on playing a character.

Qadira

oh and the point buy for this would be
STR: 14 DEX: 12 CON: 14 INT: 10 WIS: 8 CHA: 14
with an additional +2 in str from human so 16 str starting

Qadira

HERE IT IS a powerful build that is easy and fun to play for everyone

our build will do multiple things. Allow armor to be worn, good saves, close to solid bab and access to the top level spells of this list, as well as give you a fun pet to play with.

nothing here is broken just powerful

Level breakdown
1- paladin
2- paladin
this starts us out with some great saves and a few nice abilities to keep us alive (LoH, d10 hd, can use wands of CLW)
3-summoner
4-summoner
5-summoner
6-summoner
this starts us into our casting class working for more power and gives us an eidolon that we use as a mount so we get a +2 shield bonus and +2 to all our saves yeah!!
7-dragon disciple
8-dragon disciple
9-dragon disciple
10- dragon disciple
this gets us our 7th level of summoner spells which means we can now cast 3rd level summoner spells which is full of good buffs and utility. also the +4 strength and +2 natural armor and your pick of a bloodline power is nice. this also qualifies us for eldritch knight at 11th level
11- Eldritch knight and up we go
You end up with the top level spells at 18th level.
a bab of 18, +4 strength,
4d8, 12d10 and 4d12 hit dice DAMN
a 3 hit dice little pet that you can craft into a mount or a scout or a meat shield.

Qadira

favorite high level Power character is still the eldritch knight. using arcane armor training and rocking some ridiculous ac with near full bab and casting progression with d10 hd for the bulk of your career. this is just a fun powerful character that can be customized however you like.

Qadira

Stauffie wrote:

i would say that the armor that is melded into you in wildshape is still worn, so it still prevents the monks AC bonus to work.

My logic: -you were wearing the armor before wildshape.
-it does not dissappear and reappear (the line 'cannot be seen' suggests this, as does the fact that armor with wild quality DOES benefit you)
-you are still wearing it if you shift back to normal form.

So, you are wearing armor the entire time, you just don't benefit from it because armor designed to protect a human chest does not work on a wolf or bear

what about other gear that gives a magical bonus that is abosrbed into your form that you lose benefit of?? why is it that if you shift into a form while carrying a heavy load you are no longer considered encumbered. i see your logic but dont agree. when you shape you absorb the armor. when you shift out it reappears. wilding does not say that it makes the armor form to your new shape just that it provides an ac bonus equal to the armors bonus to you while in a shape shifted form.

Qadira

while wild shaped you gain no advantage or disadvantage of armor. it melds into your form. it cannot be targeted by any spell or ability. until you resume normal form it is gone.

now wilding on armor says you cannot see it. it does not state anywhere that this armor does not meld with your new form. just that you receive the bonuses from the armor. still at this point you still do not suffer from armor check penalties or arcane spell failure of any kind. this is why it is a +3 bonus. by a strict reading and understanding of this armor ability it would allow you to utilize the monks ac ability.

my next point the monk ac ability clearly states that you ADD YOUR WISDOM to your armor class. not that you get an armor class= to your wisdom.. by my understanding this means that you get the armor bonus from the wilded armor while shaped (since it is not being worn you simply gain a bonus from it) and add your wisdom to that number.

it could however be read that the monk wisdom ac bonus is your armor and would not stack with wilding armor in the way i mentioned above. this is a tricky issue but with the +3 cost of the armor i still dont think this is over powered.

Qadira

glorified masterwork fullplate. for 350 more lol

Qadira

but it already has teh MASTERWORK built in. what happens when you slap masterwork on fullplate??

let me see.....
9 ac, +1 dex, -6 acp. normal
reduce acp by +1 masterwork difference
9 ac, +1 max dex, -5 acp. masterwork fullplate
9 ac, +1 max dex, -5 acp hellknight plate

quote from hellknight plate
These distinctive suits of armor are a special type of masterwork full plate that, when worn by a character with levels in the Hellknight prestige class, grants additional effects.

i thinks we are at a disagreement mr the darkveinedtroll. :-0 np though i love a lot of your posts.

unless you can make masterwork hellknight fullplate ;-)

Qadira

Its raining really angry cats and dogs.

Qadira

though the books explain your reach in 5 feet and game play based on a 2 dimensional grid it is actually a functional 3 three dimensional game. easy enough to figure out.
you are a 5 foot cube 5x5x5. you threaten the 26 five foot cubes that surround you. usually barriers such as the ground stop you from taking any AoO against opponents that may reside in the bottom 9 cubes. when flying you threaten all squares around you. in turn enemies threaten the squares around them. this is why it is important to explain that the flying creature resides inside of the cubes located 10 feet above. (this happens to me my nape of the earth travel distance while flying and attempting to avoid other flying monsters) this would mean that if the monster were to lower 5 feet they would be in a square the player threatens and if they tried to leave again they would provoke an AoO.

someday through hologram technology we will have our 3 dimensional playing grid and all will be good until then it is best if you can come up with a way to represent how far your npcs are from the ground to explain to players why they cannot reach them.

Qadira

http://paizo.com/forums/dmtz3tdf?Armored-Kilt#17

Final word given until gencon.

Qadira

thank you for your response.

Qadira

but as of now is it allowed or not. i have an armored kilt on my battle oracle and now my dm is questioning its legality.

Qadira

With the update in the adventurer armory stating that it is bringing the armored kilt and a few others from the campaign setting along with it. That is a pretty easy way to say items have been brought from 3.5 to pathfinder with no necessary changes. The item is listed in the AA, the additional resources page says EVERYTHING in the AA is legal with "2" exceptions, and armored kilt was not one of those exceptions.
On the aforementioned thread I see where developers and well known gamers are all commenting on its proper use. It is referred to as legal for play no where am I seeing it as illegal except for people on this thread one of which is MARK MORELAND whose comment was made before the release of the AA see his comment posted on 4/29/11 came before the AA released on 7/21/11.

And since there has been NO further word on the armored kilts legality since the nearly COMPLETE inclusion of the adventurer armory we can all enjoy it as a perfectly legal society item. If anyone has a more recent ruling I would LOVE to see it.

Qadira

call it difficult terrain. no check required.

a passive perception check of 10+perception could be assumed as a continual thing to see if the party notices stuff to speed up the game.

as for perception dcs read some modules or scenarios there are tons of references in there.

Qadira

making full plate identical in every way to hellknight plate save the hellknight prc. but costs 500 more instead of 150 more. what a smokin deal.

Qadira

thanks all i appreciate the feedback i was sure that i was reading this right and the 3.5 flashback kinda solidifies this for me.

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