Molten Dragon's page

Thanks for sending this!

For those who have played it, what do you think about the difficulty level? What level and how many PCs do you think would work well with this adventure?

This module has been a walk in the park for the 3 sometimes 4 PC's I dm for. I would start with first level characters.

@ William Ronald

Got my copy. My group has been playing it and the conversion has worked perfectly. I have the original module (still!) maps included so its worked great.

Thanks Again!!

MD

@Mr. Ronald

I would also like a copy of your conversion.

Email is dbcoatty AT gmail DOT com

Thanks in advance.

MD

If you think one rules lawyer is bad, imagine this if you can. A table of 6 PC's and 2 GM's... of which 6 are practicing criminal attorneys, one is a sitting criminal court judge, and the other is an electrical engineer. EVERY comma has a meaning... every prior edition and errata carry weight as "legislative intent". Blog posts are printed off and brought to table as "persuasive authority" but only FAQ and Dev's posts count as "binding authority". Unfortunately, sometimes players have been known to slip back into the mindset of the "adversarial system" where if something is missed that goes against the GM, it was the GM's fault for not catching it (although incorrect rulings against the players are always ret-conned to the correct result). There are usually 5-6 laptops or Ipads at the table w/ the SRD or electronic copies of the rule books always open. Flow charts of the grapple rules are laminated for quick reference.

And yet for all of this, we still take one full Friday off a month to game all day (9 am to midnight)... and have for the better part of 6 years. So the moral of the story is that "rules lawyers" aren't inherently evil. But anything the distracts from the fun of the game should be avoided at all costs. So really, it just depends on your table.

Sounds like my table. we have a genetic engineer and 3 practicing attorneys one of which is a judge. Its funny because we all look to the engineer when there is a rule question. And like others have said above, communication is key. We will stop in mid swing in combat to hash out a rule if need be. GM has final say of course. "Rules lawyering" is ok in our group but be prepared to "cite" your authority and be prpared for oral argument on it as well.

Allow 3.5 gestalt rules. this will allow the party to take on risks that would be above their challenge and allow roles to be filled with short number of people.

+1

This is what I do with my group. We regularly only have 3 players and a DM. The gestalt rules are great. The party can frequently take on anything a 4 person group can do.

MD

Good suggestions all around. I will probably end up using companion characters to help balance out the party.

Since this is a question I know my group will ask, what is an example of a class that has either striker or controller as a secondary role?

MD

Thanks ProsSteve, RedJack and Starglyte. This gives me some direction. Definitely will have the party make characters as a group. I have a couple of the low level modules and may look into modifying those for 3 characters.

If anyone has any more ideas or suggestions they would be appreciated.

MD

Greetings,

I really want to give 4E a try with my gaming group. They all have indicated a willingness to play/try 4E as long as I DM. I am the usual DM anyway. We are all veteran RPG-ers from back in the day and enjoy all styles of playing.

Question to all 4E players and DMs. Is it possible to play 4E with only 3 players and DM?

I'm sure it is possible in the strictest sense but after reading the 4E DMG it states the game is designed for 5 players and DM. It even states at one point that serious modification is needed if you have less than 4 players. (Page 6 of the DMG).

Has anyone ever had this experience with 4E? What problems did you encounter? Or if anyone can point me to a thread that already covers this topic that would be great also.

Thanks in advance.

MD

Posting more love for Space Master/RM/Merp/Cyberspace. I still miss the critical charts. (though my players don't)

One more for Fading Suns! Woot. Enjoyed the d20 reboot of that also.

One of my personal favorite under rated games:
Aftermath! by Fantasy Games Unlimited.

Tack on Flashing Blades by the same company.

Quick question about 'Detect Magic' as it seems to have made any adventure I run an exercise in gathering magic items as soon as rooms are entered/searched.

Some of the members of the party I am GMing currently continually use 'Detect Magic' to locate any and all magic items anywhere.

I find that it has made having magic items in dungeons a tad boring as the PCs automatically have them - and walk out with everything rather than have the chance of happening across an item that happens to be magical and have more power.

An example, that irritated me at the time - room description states that the chest (containing a magic item/potion) cannot be seen without a Perception check DC20 as it is hidden behind a thick veil of cobwebs - bard fails perception check - cannot see chest. So, then casts detect magic and 'must then see the magic auras emanating from the chest that he cannot see' and proceeds to find it and empty it, rather than any other members of the party searching and actually finding the chest via a successful roll.

It makes a mockery of getting my PCs to search areas for items as all this player does it cast detect magic rather than search.

Is this correct - I'm still new to GMing and would appreciate any advice on how to handle this or clarification if this should be the case.

Thanks,

Paul

I feel your pain. I am not new to GMing and the over-use of detect magic is a little irritating. My group does the exact same thing. The suggestions above are good ones.

MD

Enemy speeches an monologues can not be interrupted. You have to let them finish before you can take an action of any kind. To him, talking is a free action no matter how long it goes on for, unless the PCs do it.

Even if you sneak up on an enemy that is totally unaware of you...

Wasn't that a rule/guideline in the Champions RPG. My GM in the Champions game we were running at the time, who I still game with, called it the "villain soliloquy". In fact, I use the rule too when I GM sometimes. Not so sure about the sneaking bit, but sometimes we do that.

MD

Ultradan wrote:

Seraphimpunk wrote:

( btw. i love Pathfinder RPG. i loved it since its inception. i was so happy when it fixed so many silly things about the game when it was ushered in, like sneak attack vs. undead. I just wish it would continue in that vein and fix certain things in errata that seem to be common quandaries among players )

HOLY MISSED DETAILS BATMAN!!!

Sneak Attack vs. Undead has changed !?!?!? I totally missed that!! (I've been playing Pathfinder since the beginning!! lol)

Has Critical Hits vs. Undead change as well??

Can we now Sneak Attack and criticaly hit undead now?

Ultradan

In a word... yes. And constructs.

DOH! Sneaky sneaky Talynonyx. You snuck the answer in while i was typing my question.

Seraphimpunk wrote:

( btw. i love Pathfinder RPG. i loved it since its inception. i was so happy when it fixed so many silly things about the game when it was ushered in, like sneak attack vs. undead. I just wish it would continue in that vein and fix certain things in errata that seem to be common quandaries among players )

HOLY MISSED DETAILS BATMAN!!!

Sneak Attack vs. Undead has changed !?!?!? I totally missed that!! (I've been playing Pathfinder since the beginning!! lol)

Has Critical Hits vs. Undead change as well??

Can we now Sneak Attack and criticaly hit undead now?

Ultradan

I have these same observations and questions regarding SA and Crits v. Undead. This came up in one of our games recently and after scouring the PF rulebook and Bestiary, we came up empty. I ruled undead could be both SAed and Critted and we moved on.

The way I prefer, as a player, is for the PC to RP it out as best they can and then roll the dice. The dice actually determine the outcome with the possibility of a "good idea' thrown in by the PC adding a small bonus, if applicable.

Thats usually what I do. I GM far more than I am a player and all my players are way better actual negotiators than me.

I solve this by have a determined out come or set of options that I want to happen as a result of the negotiation. This end result is always in furtherance of the plot/story rather than necessarily anything the NPC wants.

For example, and I am not familiar with the Kingmaker AP, if the PCs have to negotiate so that Faction X will attack Faction Y, before any rolls are made we roleplay it out. If they do a good job, I have them maybe make a couple of "ghost" rolls and on we go. If they do a terrible job I back that up with some rolls that will dictate the outcome more than poor role play. (Not a slam on anyone, it happens sometimes, self included.) If that doesn't get the PCs what they want, as the GM I inform them of the consequences and maybe they need to spend some time fixing the problem.

Back to my example, if Faction X now adamantly refuses to attack Faction Y, but that's what the plot calls for, maybe the PCs need to do a side quest to retrieve Leader X's lost dog or something and we can re-do the negotiations with some bonuses.

I think the ultimate advice that I can give, is knowing what you, the GM, want to happen. If, though, by the PCs choices/rolls/roleplay takes the plot off course then so be it. I dont think its so much about being to hard or easy on the players, its about, in my mind, keeping things moving. If the PC's seemingly breeze through a negotiation, awesome, lets go. If the PCs fail at it, cool lets go off the rails for a while and see if we can come back to it.

/end ramble
MD

(In fact, this whole thing reminds me of the chase mechanic from Spycraft, which was a blast.)

Thats the first thing I thought of when I saw this advertised. Looks neat though.

MD

Double agree. Thanks for adding that feature to the modules.

MD

I am probably the most unorganized Player/DM around. When I play (as opposed to DM) I usually carry my character in a yellow tablet stuck between the pages. Said yellow tablet has all the notes and such from the play sessions, along usually with notes from previous games too. Usually I only take my PH or Rules Compendium when I'm a player. As far as dice, I only barely have two sets (long story), I think I only have 1 d8 in that mix. I carry them in a Crown Royal bag, you know purple with the yellow draw strings. All of that is stuffed in an old nylon backpack from my college days (the early 90s).

Now when I DM, things get more chaotic. I came into the possession of a first responder bag. Big duffel bag with lots of pockets, you get the picture. I usually stuff as many books as I can comfortable carry in it, DMG, PH, RC, MM1,2,4; forgotten realms stuff etc. All my campaign notes, when I take them, are on said yellow tablet above, or backs of maps, scraps of paper next to the taco place's number, on top of old player notes....

Curiously no laptop, I have one but where we play space is at a premium with two other laptops. I would love to use a screen but again space limitations.

Jeremy Epp wrote:

Good for a beer and pretzels crowd but don't expect anything to deep or meaniful here.

Oh so true. I've asked my friend and he's even admitted that his group much prefers the hack-and-slash type of game. Which is really a shame since some of my favorite adventures were "Diplomacy" or the Viktor Saint-Demian arc.

But I'll say, that mis-post has sparked my interest. Is it from some PBP? If so, how do I go about joining one?

Ok, you can't leave us hanging. You have to post how your first time as DM went. (If its happened yet.)

(This is a bump in disguise, in case you couldn't tell.) ;)

MD

All of those mentioned above adding Pushing Daisies.

My family loved that show: fun, quirky and interesting.

Heathansson's 412th Alias wrote:

Heathansson wrote:

You just have to master the fine art of attention whoredom.

Or create 412 aliases and talk to yourself so it seems like you're getting attention

I am not worthy. I only have 52 aliases. ;)

I thought you were my alias and I was hearing (reading?) voices.

I've been on the boards only a short time also, but my posts usually only consist of snarky remarks like the above. ;)

MD

Navigation by committee, only PCs would think of that. I would have it turn out like most committee work. Many wasted hours talking about it, followed by long stretches of no action and finally letting the guy with the lowest navigation skill make the roll.

I would probably let one person of their choice make the roll with the others adding the aid another bonus with no "try again" rolls.

MD

Page 81 of the 3.5 Players Handbook indicates that Sense motive can be used untrained. So the only modifier would be the Wisdom bonus. A Pit Fiend for example has a 26 wisdom according to the Monster Manual or +8 modifier. Thus against a normal human with a Wis of 10 or so the Pit Fiend would have a d20+8 to the humans roll of d20+0. Still pretty decent against normals, but against a high level PC with ranks in Sense motive it may not be so great.

If it was me, I would chalk it up to an oversight and make Sense motive equivalent to Bluff or Diplomacy. Of course that's just a quick fix.

As a long time gamer (20+ years), I have never, as a DM, used maps or boards. Played in a few games that did over the years but by and large don't have much experience with them.

That perspective is changing on my part and am looking to start using mats and miniatures. The posts here are giving me some good ideas of where to start. ;)

Hi

I am currently running my group through age of worms after previously doing shackled city but as we are nearing the end I am wondering what to do next My options are as follows :

1 continue with the adventure paths and do savage tide - was my 1st choice but am now thinking I would like a change from long story plots plus I would have to buy it first !

2 Convert the Randel Morn trilogy to 3.5 then run cormyr, shadowdale, anauroch series.

3. Convert the timeless classics temple of elemental evil, slavelords , giants spider queen super module - would be great but very time consuming would need alot of editing to run as a campaign.

4. Convert a host of 2nd edition modules, hall of the hifg king. haunted halls, dungeon of death etc.

Any advice on what i should run because at the moment I am changing my mind daily !

Read this and had to reply because my group is going through a similar-ish change. As a DM myself, I would love to convert some of those old modules to 3.5, especially the Giants series.

As to Savage Tide, I ran my group through about the first 10 or so episodes and we finally just fizzled out as it is a very long AP. My advice would be to either somehow borrow or read the Savage tide AP and decide, or look to Paizo's APs for the reasons mentioned by the other posters.

In my current group after Savage Tide, we switched over to a campaign set in the world of George Martin's Song of Ice and Fire. We are using the old ICE MERP rules for combat and skills as opposed to D20/3.5, though.

How about "Pathfinder EPIC Adventure Paths". You could pull in previous adventure paths with something like "If the characters just finished Legacy of Fire" or "Rise of the Rune Lords" etc then use plot hook/thread X, Y and Z to pull them in. After that the EPIC AP would take over.

I know that would add some to the word count but I don't think that much because complete consistency with the previous AP would not be required. Only a little hook or idea tossed in the mix.

MD

Thats great news. Spread the love for Kobold Quarterly. I had read the first two issues of KQ and was suitably impressed but then it sorta dropped off my radar. Anyway, keep up the good work over there.

MD

Bluenose wrote:

I don't like to draw a narrower distinction than that, because it's just one more way of saying "If you don't play D&D my way then you're doing it wrong".

Is that not the very foundation of the edition wars and the 4e is not D&D debate?

Not really. The debate is actually much deeper than that but most people are afraid to admit it.

DrowVampyre wrote:

TEE-fling. *suddenly pictures a tiefling rogue sneak attacking with soggy tea bags

Would he fling them at his foes? :)

I know I certainly wouldn't want to be tea bagged.

In your own games you call the drow cheese elves if you'd like...

Mmmmm. Banana Drow Cheese-Steak

magic treasure chest on La Isla Invizabla

I didn't see that coming!

If I can make the switch while no one is looking it will be Rolemaster (ICE) but until then 3.5E for myself and my group. May 4th ed rust in peace.

Companion to the Worst D&D Books Thread:

Adams Wrath: Starts out with the party dying (encouraging the DM to cheet to make it happen) and then they wake up having been 'saved' by Viktor Mordheim. They then have to make a deal with him (automatic evil act) to be railroaded into the plot.

As soon as I saw the title to this thread, thats the first module I thought of. Very dumb and boring module. Probably looked like a fun idea in theory, but very poor execution.

Hello all,

Question. In D&D 3.5 I noticed that the main thing bogging our sessions down was multiple attacks. Not only by players but monsters as well.

How do you all as either GMs or players handle this in your games?

And if someone could inform me if there are any actual rules on the spacing/timing of multiple attacks that would be great.

I apologize if this question has already been addressed (probably multiple times).

Thanks

MD

I almost always wing it. Like CourtFool said listening to player talk has provided endless plot hooks and story lines. I learned this DMing a crap-ton of OWoD vampire. good times.

Good luck to you both. I know when my wife and I took the bar it was nerve wracking (ours was only 2 days) but almost everyone I knew passed the first time. I'm sure you will do fine.

Some quibbles (mostly beastie-related);

6) Lame monsters. I don't care how 'classic' it is, the Beholder is sillier than the darn Flumph. When the gun-toting space hippopotamus-people in military garb describe your race as 'funny-looking' and 'hard to take seriously,' you know you have a PR problem...

Awesome Spelljammer reference, you win the thread! :P

Up till now, I'd have said nothing, really. I'm not a big complainer and try to find the best. Having said that however :-) and playing Pathfinder RPG, I have found out that I cannot go back to 3.5 Turning Undead or any of the Combat Maneuvers without CMB. So I guess those are there for me.

-DM Jeff

Ack, for give my ignorance but what is the CMB? Complete...something?

Hello. I've been playing 3.5 D&D for ~7 months now, all as a DM. Mostly the previous stuff has been a bunch of fun oneshots, with lots of silliness thrown in. However, my three players and I want to try something new and more serious: the Savage Tide Adventure Path. I need to know:

1. How easy is it to DM this?
2. Will I be required to make many adaptations?
3. Do you have any tips on DMing Savage Tide in general?

Here are the characters, all starting at level one:
Human Scout
Human Dragonfire Adept
(race undetermined) either a Wu Jen or a Warmage, probably Warmage

The main problem is the lank of a real "tank" to take damage and be a frontline fighter. The scout plans to do more ranged combat than melee. Player 2 plans to spam his breath weapon and cast a lot. Player 3 is unpredictable, so I'm not sure what his combat style is going to be like.

I think I might have to stick in a Fighter (good versatile tank) or a Cleric (pretty good fighter and useful for buffs/healing) DMPC, but I would like to avoid that if possible. The players are not opposed to it, but they feel they would rather go it with their characters alone.

Thank you for your input.

My group (I'm the DM) started ST a few months ago. We are towards the end of "Here there be Monsters" chapter. My players (3) are all psionic types with two of them having sailing type skills in addition (more on that in a second).

As to your questions:

1. Fairly easy to DM. The reason being that the Lavinia Vanderboren sets it all in motion for you in terms of character/plot hooks.

2. Yes you will have to make adaptations as you have only 3 players it sounds like. You may want to fudge a little and lower some of the monsters spell resistance (and there are alot).

2.1 There are a number of NPCs that are available in the game to cover the Fighter/cleric types. Lavinia has access to a mercenary group whose name escapes me and she could send one of the fighter types along with.

3. Tips on DMing ST. Don't be afraid if the party does some things out of order it won't mess up the adventure. I even cut out some of the dungeon crawly parts of the 3rd and 4th chapters and the party is doing just fine. Watch what levels your party is at and make sure they can handle the monsters.

About the sailing skills. My party did some trading and privateering in some of the down time between adventures. They ended up with 3 ships(!) sailing off to the isle of dread instead of just two. ST has been alot of fun, but I think I will end it after the 5th chapter somehow as the party wants to sort of continue with the trading/privateering angle. There is some plane hopping in the later chapters that were really not interested in so....

Anyway hope that helps. If you have other questions, post and I will try to help.
Good luck!