|Paizo Pathfinder® Paizo Games|
|About Paizo Messageboards News Paizo Blog Help/FAQ|
More questions arise : do automatons act during your own round or do you roll initiative for them when they are activated ? Are they able to perform 5-foot steps ? (this one in particular is to determine if a ranged automaton is actually in for a world of pain, especially if you don't want to rebuild your alpha every other combat)
This is awesome. The only thing missing is the ability to wield firearms sooner (I bought the supplement introducing this ability and was sad to see it come up so late)... considering their drawbacks, I would have loved to see them receive clunky proficiency with one-handed firearms at lower levels, then lesser misfires, then two-handed with invention upgrades, so as to balance things out. Guess I'll ask the DM nicely to see if he'll allow this tweak when I get to play one ;)
I have a quick but important question about abilities that increase an automaton's HD : does an empowered automaton also receive the BAB, saving throws and ability bonuses it would receive by gaining those HD naturally thanks to the tinker leveling up, as per the progression table ? Or does increasing the HD only increase an automaton's HP ?
Hi everyone !
Do you like 3PP classes but find they are lacking options ?
(... did I mention there are rules to play a brain-in-a-jar ? Who could resist the call of such a higher form of being and existence ?)
In the meantime, in case you missed those, know that there are class options that I have not yet put into my archetypes documents :
The Handcannoneer has been revised !
... and even more to come !
I hope you'll love them !
Hi Cyrad, thanks for your comment. I know gluttony is not only about eating but more about a wild and unreasonable attitude toward food, money, alcohol, sex, drugs or power, toward any kind of addiction actually. I had to choose how to write abilities based on the fact that such individual themes could (and would) be covered within the most appropriate deadly sin, which I intend to post on these boards. I also thought about the reaction of the reader finding the purge ability first which could set a too silly tone for the rest of the mystery, but decided to go for it anyway.
As a design choice, I made this mystery by focusing on the most popular depiction of gluttony being one of bulimia, dysmorphism and grotesque, demonic appetite complete with the least savoring parts of consuming things. The way I wrote some revelations still includes the fact that overindulging isn't only about food, and those are easy to adapt for a more general thematic. I hope you will enjoy the other mysteries, who will better represent their dedicated sin as they are more straightforward in their approach.
Onyemu >> the Greed and Wrath mystery are already available on the Homebrew forum. Sloth and Lust should come next when I get time. :)
Inspired by the 7 deadly sins, comes a mystery for NPCs and PCs consumed by a contagious, devouring hate.
Some people are born in misery, others in luxury, but the most unfortunate grow in a hateful environment. Whether it is hate toward the unknown, the different, a sworn enemy or the imaginary source of one's misfortune, oracles of Wrath find intoxicating power in anger and vile resentment, and they find true power in spreading this sentiment to divide and crush their enemies.
I hope this option will bring something new and fun to your table, and am as always open to all your suggestions, critics and questions :)
- Brain-in-a-jar Maxximilius
Inspired by Dante's Divine Comedy, more precisely Inferno's Circle of Gluttony, comes a mystery for NPCs and PCs indulging too much in the pleasures of food, drinks and drugs.
Indulging in the consumption of whatever is within reach rather than spiritual introspection, oracles of Gluttony live with a ceaseless thirst, a devouring hunger for the unknown and the delicious. This unhealthy lifestyle would lead most to think it leads to a short but intense life, but to those touched by the divine, indulging only seems to fill a bottomless pit whose well becomes stronger and bigger with each bite, and numerous primitive civilizations see those oracles as heralds of prosperity that must be kept fed day long, lest the people itself shall suffer famine.
I hope this option will bring something new and fun to your table, and am as always open to all your suggestions, critics and questions :)
- Brain-in-a-jar Maxximilius
Ms. Pleiades wrote:
My suggestion was allowing it to work on things other than weapons, so magic rings, headbands, or ornate belts. Effectively, it disarms an enemy of a single magic item slot. Don't know if that makes it too powerful, but it's certainly a very unique debuff to impose. Fort-save for half damage might do as a better save.
It already works on anything explicitely made of precious metal ;)Finally, I removed the Fortitude Saving Throw, but now the gaze attack stops as soon as the oracle gets hit by any successful harmful spell or attack, meaning it's a standard to activate and a move to maintain for low damage, stopped by any hit that could break your concentration. The higher the party will be, the easier they'll be able to deal with this ability by just targeting the group's spellcaster once in a while, and the least likely an oracle will be able to exploit this ability instead of just casting a high level spell and be done with it. It will remain useful (for the special sights), thematic and handy for clever players though.
The intent of this ability was basically to provide both a way to supernaturally perceives riches and the equivalent of a potential "disarm purse" or "disarm ring/jewelry" where you punish the greed or pride of your foe by making its riches betray it.
@chaoseffect > In order of your questions and suggestions :
Finally, you didn't strike me as "too critical", I enjoy all critics, especially when they are this constructive ! Thanks again for your time.
When I get some time, I might get around writing revelation for all other 6 deadly sins, complete with an archetype to be Oracle of Sins able to pick among all these revelations at high personal cost... :D
I'll answer a longer message later this day for all your advices, but I'd like to say that my design philosophy has always been to bring cool, effective but balanced options allowing for a wide range of gameplay styles and options. Picking powers should be a "hard" but rewarding task based only on what nice ability you want your character to receive and how fun to use and roleplay those powers will be, rather than finding which are actually worth your time. Said revelation may seem on the weak side, but it will litterally save your butt more than you'd want to believe, especially in roleplay heavy campaigns.
I don't believe in trap options that are a loss of time for everyone, fun for everyone around the table and lots of roleplay opportunities is my way to go. :)
Kamenhero25 -> the ability is intended to work as per the spell for the purpose of its actual effect on a target, but otherwise, it is more restricted : it can only use valuable items as a focus, and the target does not receive the normal +4 bonus like the spell - instead, some creatures have either a penalty, a bonus or immunity against this ability, depending on the character's ability to deduce what´s most valuable to his enemies. So, no +8 bonus. I'll make it clearer as soon as I get home. :)
Ms. Pleiades -> to deal damage, Goldeneye only works on precious metals. It would not act as a burning disarm unless you wield a silver, cold iron, mithral or adamantine weapon. In my personal experience, those are not common in a typical low-to-mid level adventuring party besides mithral as armor, but considering it´s a standard to initiate and a move action to maintain within a melee danger area, I'll add a Fortitude saving throw for half damage, and limit its use to 1 round per day per character level, keeping the metal detection.
About the Capstone, it doesn't stack with Divine Protection since you cannot stack same type bonuses, but I'll make the skill check 1/day (and admittedly, level 20 balance has never been a concern for the Pathfinder system. As long as it strong, thematic and doesn't break the game, let´s roll with cool powers that will never replace a 9th level spell anyway).
Very good points. Although don't forget divine spells have no ACP, and light armor/mithral plate (which you would favor with Dealer's Grace for their high Dex bonus) do not reduce the base speed. I think the issue here is really with very high Charisma modifiers stacking.
I changed Bling Armor from "Cha as armor bonus" to "+4 armor bonus to AC" with a possible +1 bonus at 3rd level and every 3 levels later if the character uses enough riches to produce the Bling Armor, and a max Dex modifier of +4, 1 every 5 levels later.
- Your 12th level character using the Greed mistery would have +6 max AC from Charisma, and up to +7 from the armor if you spend 9000gp and two revelations - so 23 AC with heavy investment (not counting shield and other protective items).
Thanks again for your review.
Thanks for your suggestions, RumpinRufus.
Actually, the Bling bonus was originally the same as the Bones/Wood revelation : a free, finite armor bonus of +4 becoming +6 at lvl 7, then adding DR at higher levels.
Dealer's Grace is just a rewrite of two existing revelations from Lore and Nature mysteries allowing you to swap Cha to Dex for the purpose of AC.
Stacking "twice" Charisma to AC may seem strong at first glance, but I invite you to consider a second look and note that Bling is actually strictly worse than the original revelation it is based on :
- to gain a relevant bonus, you need high Charisma (admittedly not a valid limit for an Oracle... but let's take a look at the amount required as the balancing factor : even with a 18 modifier, so a high average for low to mid levels, the best you can get is +4, the equivalent of a chainmail, and also the exact same bonus granted by a mediocre 1st level revelation)
The only thing this combo allows is for low Dex and low Str oracles to have decent AC in combat and hold their own, at the expense of carrying capacity, awful damage potential, skill checks, vulnerability to ability damage and picking two whole revelations just to make it work. Is it good for its niche ? Yep, it was designed for it (actually, for a morbidly obese NPC almost unable to move who's also the greediest, richest man on the continent but is supposed to have weird divine powers granted by a greed devil).
I notice I forgot to mention the oracle cannot wield shields when using Dealer's Grace though, I'll make sure to mention it so that the numbers never add up to said vanilla-oracle-in-armor-and-shield.
Hi everyone, it's been a long time I didn't write some homebrews... but here is something I hope you'll love ! :)
Full of envy for the wealthy and curiosity towards the power that can drive the wisest men and women mad for riches, most oracles of Greed find solace in the shiny reflection of gold, cherishing the power they buy enough to inspire a kind of respect even among the foulest dragons. Those oracles often begin their life in extreme poverty or wealth, and are quick to money they revelations, visions and spells to the highest or most desperate bidder.
(Fellow roleplayers here who never saw my previous works, know that you can find much, much more options in my profile.)
- Brain-in-a-jar Maxximilius
Too much vanilla class variants ?
Long time no see... but I have been keeping my eyes on a project, and working on it whenever I could find some freedom of mind and inspiration to do a great work.
The Secrets of Renegade Archetypes II gives you - yes, you guessed it - even more new archetypes for the most popular base classes created by your favorite 3rd Party Publishers, allowing you to make the most out of the most radical and revolutionary designs available for the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game. (It includes brains in jars, metroid inspiration, tyrannosaur barbarians and tactical swashbucklers who fight with mobility and taunts. Seriously, get this.)
The classes (and their archetypes) supported by this product are as follows:
Death Knight (Rogue Genius Games)
Death Paramours use their bond with the Low Road to steal the souls of their departing victims before they have a chance to face final judgment, and raise their undead bodies as servants and temporary vessels for their own soul.
Elven Archer (Kobold Press)
Elven Exemplars blend natural and arcane magic with master archery, representing the apex of elven civilization's finest aspects. Their arrows of pure energy, scroll arrows, ranged spellstrikes and versatile spell list makes them deadly opponents and allies.
Machinesmith and Fleshwraith (Louis Porter Jr. Design)
Cybernetics Doctors are scientists bordering the edge of sanity, experimenting with invasive grafts and devices like brains in jars and other improvements intended to reinforce one's physical capabilities, whether with glass and metal or flesh and bone.
Pact Magic Binder (Radiant House)
The Artisan and Lover are two new constellations that all binders can attempt to tap upon in order to create incredible pieces of craftsmanship, or promote peace, affection and understanding. Each comes with a new spirit to bind.
Shadow Assassin (Rogue Genius Games)
Mage Slayers forsake their deadly strikes in order to resist spells, hit through magic protections, and break the concentration of spellcasters. They may track their victims over long distances, proving immunity to fear is always a handy gift.
Swordmaster (Dread Fox Games)
Braggarts have a great natural skill with both their chosen weapon and their tongue. Passionate about their personal quest, they act recklessly in combat with unique maneuvers in order to provoke and punish their foes, swashbuckling their way to success.
Witch Hunter (Rogue Genius Games)
Witch Eaters have a taste for magic, especially the living kind. Their ability to leech spells and consume body parts of their fallen victims in order to receive their courage, insight or strength make them as feared as could be a werewolf in some communities.
Wolf Shifter (Paizo Fans United)
The Werebeast includes 13 animal variants to the wolf for all those who wish to play a serpentine, mastodon, tiger... or yes, a tyrannosaur-themed lycanthrope/barbarian.
I hope you’ll enjoy it !
- Benjamin “Maxximilius the Brain-in-a-Jar” Rombeaut
Life as an evil mastermind ruling over the feeble minds of walking meatbags feels awfully good. Knowledge itself has a delicate taste that you could only begin to experiment the day your tongue is forcefully disconnected from your spine. The iodized electricity that runs around my jar is a permanent call to ecstasy, prompting synaptic fireworks that show me the deepest secrets and rules of the universe.
Fiddling with those to create, bend and amaze the living and the not-so-living is just the icing on the cake. Why, with such power, should I miss the icy breeze of the wind on my skin in summer, the eye-melting sight of a sunrise over the ocean, the unfathomable stench of perfume on a woman ?
... god I miss my body.
Er... no. As a general rule of thumb when it comes to archetype design, you are supposed to swap like for like. That's what every designer has said when asked for advice on building archetypes. Sometimes it's Ok to swap it for something else, but you should try not to increase it's overall power.
When doing an archetype, you actually increase its overall power, at least when focused on a single gaming style or build... and few characters focus in several fighting or adventuring styles anyways, since doing a single thing really well means you are more useful 80% of the time and you will have a much harder challenge the remaining 20% compared to the vanilla class which always tends toward more versatility and balance than archetypes. The Cognatogen/bombing alchemist is clearly superior to the vanilla alchemist damage-wise, but he is also much more reliant on a damage source that can be easily negated or resisted against : bombs.You don't have to replace abilities like for like. You can grant offensive abilities instead of crafting feats, or talents instead of spell-like abilities as long as it grants you nice and fun powers fitting the archetype's theme. You just have to make sure your archetype doesn't invalidate its base class or any other class (something the Knight archetype sadly is doing in ACG), usually by adding a tactical component to your strongest boosts over the vanilla class for a nice risk-reward mechanic.
The Lore Warden can deal damage just as well as the basic fighter can, and it's also better than the Fightr at all combat maneuvers. If he does it right, he'll have nearly the same AC as the Fighter, more skill points, and more combat potential.
The fighter still rules AC and damage over the Lore Warden, especially if put against target resistant to his maneuvers. While strong and much more interesting to play, I find the Lore Warden strikes a nice balance between a lot of meh archetypes for a class that already needs all the help it can get at mid-to-high levels.
Some time ago, I wrote a full set of grit-like powers for fighters, granting cool abilities covering pretty much any type of weapons you could fight with as a fighter : general, circumstancial, and weapon-based abilities (mounted, ranged, shield, free hand, two-handed...).
We tested them in our group and it granted a much needed touch of heroism and tactical insight when playing a fighter ! I think the class would benefit from such a feature, much like gunslingers have grit and deeds.
Natan Linggod 327 wrote:
A creature can also add any circumstance, deflection, dodge, insight, luck, morale, profane, and sacred bonuses to AC to its CMD. Any penalties to a creature's AC also apply to its CMD. A flat-footed creature does not add its Dexterity bonus to its CMD."
Natan Linggod 327 wrote:
Pretty cool and nicely balanced, I like the idea of switching between two stances and having wild pikes of efficiency when doing so.
Just a bit on the weak side IMHO. (I would have granted the dodge bonus as a morale bonus to all attack rolls with the base offensive style (competence bonus means it doesn't stack with bardic performance, which badly hurts a class relying on a lot of attacks), along with a defensive option to double it for one round instead. No bonus to CMD as dodge bonuses already apply to your full CMD.
Alexander Close wrote:
The Drakker makes reference to the Mounted Heroism feat... but i cant actually find such a feat. What is it?
I hope you enjoy the book ! Mounted Heroism is a Dragon Rider feat in the 101 Renegade Class Feats supplement which basically allows you to switch places at lightning speed with a helpless creature in close range when mounted on your draconic steed.
The feat was mentioned to show the intended compatibility and synergy between Steven D. Russel's previous 101 Renegade Class Feats and this supplement. Ideally, I wanted this supplement to blend perfectly with any other of the Renegade series and bring only new ideas, while retaining the great value of already available rules. Likely, the other archetypes in this supplement can use their class-dedicated feats from "101" (armiger, etc.).
The future Secrets of Renegade Archetypes II will follow the same logic. ;)
Caradwen: if you go the archery route, you'll first need the Arcane Strike feat. This feat alone will increase your damage by +1 per arrow, then +2 at 5th level, then +3 at 10th.
But with stats like yours I'm afraid you'll have a hard time feeling efficient in combat. Arcane duelist wouldn't help much, especially if it breaks the character concept.
Weird words is an incredibly potent damage-dealing option - you'll be looking a 6 attacks dealing each 1d8+Charisma modifier on a hit. Each of them is treated as a ray that deals typed damage reduced by DR, so Arcane Strike would work too since rays are weapons. Only problem is this ability comes at 6th level, and by the time you'll have specialized in archery maybe (unless you don't take Rapid Shot and Manyshot at all).
/Says the argument is gargabe but just proves it anyway by confirming the summoner is OP and the synthesist must be dealt with through cheap tricks like Antimagic Field in order to be balanced.
There is so much wrong in this thread. I could insert a long rant, but I'll not follow the ass wagon and just remember people reading this that all your arguments and those of synthesist defenders since the beginning of this thread can be resumed to:
- "my opinion is better than yours"
I don't need to justify myself or defend the skills of my group's DM ; neither do other people who just like us ban the synthesist.
Taku Ooka Nin wrote:
Guys, guess what, the regular summoner can give his eidolon hp AND cast rejuvinate eidolon on top of that. Hence making your entire argument that synthesists are overpowered to be complete garbage.
Nope, it just proves the summoner itself is even more powerful. I hope you at least recognize that just because you will burn your hand in a 200°C liquid does not mean it is COMPLETE GARBAGE to suppose a 150°C liquid can be pretty hot as well. Also, I was hoping thinly veiled condescension could stay far away from this thread after the first page.
But back to the topic: a vanilla summoner himself can at least be targeted more easily in order to challenge him without resorting to cheap tricks based on totally negating its powers or utterly screwing the player. And while it is both a potent damage dealer and spellcaster, it remains less powerful than a dedicated class, unlike the synthesist who overshadows barbarians and fighters in a pinch. Hence : more versatility, yet better balance.
"Short of a walking wall that does little damage"
You'd be surprised how damage can stack nicely when you TWF with a fighter, especially when you get to 11th level and spam Bashing Finish with your main 15-20 scimitar.Before then, just pick a quick draw shield and TH your main/draw shield/shield bash/TH your main/draw shield/shield bash.
Or hey, if you want a high AC monk, try a snapping turtle Tetori : a 20 Wis/16 Dex grants you 10 + 5(wis) + 3(Dex) + 3(monk with robe) + 4(bracers of armor) + 4(barkskin) + 2(deflection) + 2(shield) + 4(with a Ki point) = 37/25/22 AC.
Taason the Black wrote:
For that matter, explain how any class short of a walking wall that does little damage can have a 40 ac at lv 10.
10 + 5 (+3 Light bashing shield w/Shield Focus) + 13 (+4 Full plate w/Defender of the Society trait) + 2 (natural AC amulet) + 2 (Deflection ring) + 3 (Dexterity).
= 35/15/32 AC.
Add in fighting defensively for +3 to AC, up to +6 with a Halfling (small sized + racial feat) :
= 38/18/32 AC. (41/21/33 halfling)
So, I was wondering.
What happens if a creature provokes an attack of opportunity by attacking you, and you disarm that creature before its attack is resolved ?
- The attack continues but the creature must now perform its results with an unarmed strike (or gauntlet, if any)
Thanks for the honor of suggesting my name Endzeitgeist, especially by including me among so many talented big names of the industry !
Interjection Games wrote:
I wonder what it would take to get Rich Burlew to put the Dashing Swordsman in this thing.
Incidentally, I may have some WIP for Dreadfox Games's great Swordmaster class in The Secrets of Renegade Archetypes II. Something based on Charisma and awesomeness...
Yes it does actually : "When making a full attack action, a hasted creature may make one extra attack with one natural or manufactured weapon.".
I brought Haste in because Titania suggested that the synthesist's elemental attacks shouldn't be nerfed if all other characters using elemental attacks aren't.
Titania, the Summer Queen wrote:
Sure. Everyone knows a flaming weapon you swing up to twice per round is gamebreaking and should be nerfed as hard as the one using it 4/5 times per round before the haste at the same level.We are silly for suggesting such a nerf and not applying it to the most OP classes of all times, aka melee combatants with elemental weapons.
Dreadfox Games's Swordmaster has a pretty awesome mechanic similar to deeds : the Dex/Int class knows specific actions that it may perform in combat and gains more of them as it levels. Basically each round, he may spend his round's action to start a customized combo out of openers/chain/finishers melee moves activated with different conditions and actions.
That's pure love for skilled players and pretty much what everyone wants the swashbuckler to feel like. It's like having a class with only deeds that can be used together in differents fashions and actually synergize together, allowing for highly mobile fights.
And going back to your previous post on Cha-INSTEAD-of-Wis-to-WIll saves, I would like to hear your thoughts on why you would take Wisdom out of the equation. Also, keep in mind I will be throwing the "But replacing Str with Dex for damage apparently marginalizes Str too much" point back at you if you cannot sell me on why making Wisdom add to nothing but skill checks is a reasonable option. At least Str would still be needed to carry a sword and get to PA. I'm all for making Charisma more desirable, but having a stat with almost no penalty for tanking (sort of like Charisma now) does not seem like a good idea to me.
- Because the swashbuckler as written badly needs a dump stat to become less MAD- Because "Wisdom" is the last quality I would associate with any swashbuckler ever
- Because even Wis-based skills don't fit with the thematic
- Because the fighter can basically dump Int and Charisma without much prejudice
- Because "resisting mental control out of sheer pride" is awesome and swashbuckl-ey
Since I want the classes I play to not be incredibly MAD, to have mechanics fitting their thematic, to actually feel like the way they are supposed to be, and plainly be awesome, I rhknk you'll unserstand the fil rouge behind my mind on objective AND subjective reasons to make Wisdom a Swash dump stat the same way I want my gunslingers to have accute senses ans son't want my barbarians to be intelligent.
... because we think of what we'd like in a swashbuckler in the final version, not the current one, which has already been proven to miss what the class should ultimately feel like.
The swash needs to be primarily Cha and Dex based, though we should be able to play off PA or Dervish Dance or a rapier and a buckler or TWF or a pickaxe without being crippingly gimped one way or another.
So I guess you were just trading them out because they are too weak? Because it sounds like replacing CHA for WIS on Will saves would also work against charms... Quite frankly, I would rather see Cha and Wis added to Will saves so that I'm not rewarded for tanking Wisdom the same way I am currently rewarded for tanking Charisma. Take away the Wis bonus to saves and you will see a lot of Wis 7 swashbucklers.
Way to shorten my whole argument into fallacies - you may note I was the first to post in this thread, in between I put quite some time explaining what I'd like out of a swashbuckler, that includes recognizing the class needs better ST (my suggestion : Will as a low save but using Cha as its bonus and Ref-swap, more about this later)
To answer your question:
- on all saves if this a stand-alone ability and the swash has low will progression (solving some issues at mid-to-high level and making Cha more important)
But even with the second option, I wouldn't want additional bonuses against what I feel are thematic weaknesses for the class, the same way a cumulative bonus to Fort would be lame for a wizard.
Considering how it went in previous playtests, and since the designers's job is to design things (not read the boards and copy-paste the suggestions from people that may or may not at all get the concept of balance or theme right), I'd say the more we try to write the thing ourselves, the least the final result will deliver to our expectations.
Just consider one of the only things we know about the future playtest version : people complained about Parry/Riposte being both "weak", "too random", "much too hard to use" and "requiring a feat just to use it".
I trust Paizo for the job, but I honestly get the feeling than the most we point toward cool deeds and ask for improvement in the others, the most we'll get the cool deeds leveled down to a lower bland baseline for the sake of simplicity.
I think some of us have major divergent opinions on what the swashbuckler should be and feel like.
I've seen suggestions to add bonuses to saving throws against Charm and Alcohol/Drugs/Poisons, for example - but I must object to this idea. I have to say that if it was implemented, I would immediately ignore these bonuses and even swap them if possible for an archetype.
A swashbuckler SHOULD get drunk, charmed, easily influenced and reckless enough to get involved in dangerous situations ; because that's what makes fun and interesting things happen, and cool/daring abilities being used.
(Hence why I suggested Cha-instead-of-Wis to Will saves to represent the strength of personality ; and a limited amounts of daily Reflex saves instead of Will and Fortitude saves to represent the slippery bugger.)
But again, let's just wait for the next playtest document. As of now the swashbuckler is one of the coolest ACG classes but it still needs some tinkering.
Taku Ooka Nin wrote:
So telling a player he should remove his crazy OP character for the sake of everyone's fun around the table is BADWRONG unimaginative noob GMing ; but screwing him in any possible fashion by using the cheapest tricks in the book to prove you can win (it's black friday, dominate, coups de grâce, banishment and negative levels for everyone !) anytime you want is proof of imagination and good DMing ?
Yeah. Sure. It's so balancing and fun to get from "crazy OP" to "dead or killing his party" in a single turn.
Gwen Smith wrote:
^ So much this. The system can get complicated enough not to begin with Advanced Classes.
- Don't allow the Summoner for newbies.
Let's just wait for the next playtest guys, I think there have been more than enough suggestions already, and the issues we know need/will be granted revisions have been highlighted enough that we can hope they will be taken into account.
No need to continue filling with thread until the next playtest pdf unless we have playtest experiences to share (I don't, because as indicated in the first 100 messages, I got stuck way too many times when trying to simply BUILD a character).
Already said it a thousand times, but I'd rather keep Precise Strike and have cool abilities to match damage and synergize with critical hits - especially for non-conventional weapons. There are tons of ways to make Dex and Cha more important without adding it do damage.If my last posts showed how someone with a bit of game design experience could get around the current issues with cool balanced features, be sure that a professional Paizo designer can do it better if wants to (and I'd enjoy that over a lifeless Dex-to-damage).
Silly, a swashbuckler always fails againt charm effects by design !
Malachi Silverclaw wrote:
Lol yeah, so basically I stole it without even knowing it, sorry !With 1000+ posts I think this thread has already received all the swashbuckler feedback needed for the class to become the ACG's most awesome.
Sure. The idea would be to make it so that you don't need to pick Power Attack at all. The wording makes it possible to still pick it though.
You could absolutely pick Str and PA and still use a precise thrust - though you would have a reduced precision damage bonus when wielding your weapon in two hands and thus a reduced tactical damage output.
6th level, 20 Dex, +1 rapier in one hand, tactical hit (-2/+6):
6th level, 20 Dex, +1 scimitar in two hands, PA + tactical hit (-2/+4):
=> The PA build deals 4 more damage for -2 to attack (exactly the balance of PA !) ; he would still need 13 Str and 1 feat AND 1 panache for this attack roll, meaning he would be less versatile in other areas. This bonus damage can be multiplied on a crit, making the deal even more of a high-risk/high-reward style for brute swashbucklers.
This way it's balanced for mini-maxers and newbies alike because it's both simpler, stronger against low AC yet less abusable.
Ok mates, hear me out about this because I just got a cool suggestion that could please everyone.
Since the major complains are about :
... then what if the swashbuckler received his own version of PA based on Dexterity right at 1st level ? Something like :
=> This version allows TWFing by halving the base bonuses between your weapons.=> While more versatile than Power Attack (its penalties and benefits only apply to a single attack roll and you control the exact penalty to your attack rolls when using the deed) and costing 1 less feat, it doesn't pigeonhole builds in Strength and still has a hefty panache cost, plus it doesn't apply to all attacks on your round unless you burn through all your panache to cover a single full-attack.
=> This option grants a versatile, tactical Power Attack mechanic that instead of granting x2 precision bonus to damage, instead deals damage multipliable on a crit so the ability complements the style.
=> It's written in such a way that you can only achieve it by having a high enough Dex modifier.
This agile "Power Attack" actually feels right for the class !