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Goblin Squad Member. FullStarFullStarFullStar Pathfinder Society GM. 1,035 posts. No reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 23 Pathfinder Society characters.


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From all the breaking down of the rules, I agree you can not Stealth with a 5' step after Full Attacking.

Which brings us back to the original Question -

What is the DC to spot (figure out) someone under the effect of Invisibility that takes a 5' step away from you?


My view on this is that while that extra CON is nice, it's more for the extra +Fort save then the HP.

Standard front line usually has a 14 CON. At 10th level that's just 12 HP more then the same front line person with a 12 CON.

That extra 12 Health usually has little effect when you're being attack 3 to 4 times with around a +9 static damage modifier.

Better defenses will usually make up the differences and most races that do have that -2 CON penalty, usually have a +2 DEX bonus. That extra AC from that DEX can usually play more of a roll in keeping you alive then the extra health.
This does require you to keep your defenses up and does make it hard for some classes, like barbarians.

My opinion, sorry for rambling, long day.

These topics seem to come up fairly often. The problem is everyone interprets everything differently (plus trying to interpret alignments) there's been a quick ruling that doing something that MIGHT change your alignment/loose your divine powers, the GM has to give a clear warning about that action and why. The player then should be given a chance to defend that action. GM then makes a ruling on if that action might have a effect of a alignment shift.

All this needs to be done before the action happens!

The real problem is this line -

Action: Usually none. Normally, you make a Stealth check as part of movement, so it doesn't take a separate action. However, using Stealth immediately after a ranged attack (see Sniping, above) is a move action.

in the pathfinder rules on stealth.
So reading that, if using Greater Invis, you can make a Stealth check after full attacking.

Then there's this line -
You can move up to half your normal speed and use Stealth at no penalty. When moving at a speed greater than half but less than your normal speed, you take a -5 penalty. It's impossible to use Stealth while attacking, running, or charging.

Which clearly gives rules for using Stealth while you take a move action to move. Just nothing for the 5' step.

Just brought up the scent in case it happens.

What brought this all up is we had a similar situation happen but the assassin would use spring attack and move away, using stealth and Greater Invis. Think we had that figured out and done correctly. brought up what the DC would be with the 5' step after full attacking. Digging through the rules on stealth and invisibility led to some confusion on what was allowed and what wasn't.

The big questions seemed to be -
What action do you use to stealth?
*as in, is a 5'step count as a move action and you can stealth during it?
What are the penalties to your stealth checks for using these actions?
What is the bonus to your stealth check invisibility gives you (after your full round actions)?

So if the invis person doesn't move at all, after full attacking, he still gets a stealth check?

I'm assuming the invis attacker has to take a -20 on stealth check as if he was sniping.

Here's what it says about the sword breaker in Ult. Equip. -

Ultimate Equipment wrote:
You can use this dagger to disarm or sunder enemy blades by catching them in the grooves on the back of the blade and using your weapon as a lever. If you are proficient with this weapon, add a +4 bonus on combat maneuver check to disarm or sunder bladed weapons while using it.

Paizo clearly calls it a dagger in their own description so your should be able to use it.

What is the perception DC for someone under the effect of Greater Invis that took a 5' step away after a full attack action?

Give the person a +22 stealth skill
Has a Armor Check penalty of -2

What if the person making the perception check has the Scent ability?

Still undecided on what exactly I'll do. Still a bit in the future.

I will probably end up picking up a level (or more) of Warpriest starting at 8th level. That would give me access to heavy armor, Blessings, Feat: Weapon Focus, some Cleric Spells, and Scared Weapon Damage. All at the cost of 1 BAB and continuing up the Slayer class progression.

I completely forgot about the Ranger Styles require NO heavy armor. So I'm stuck in Med Armor.

Did think I had found a work around, by saving up my gold, I thought I could purchase a Mithral Full Plate of Speed. Till I found I needed 40 fame to grab it. :(

Need a little clarification on this

Ultimate Equipment wrote:
Heavy armors are treated as medium, and medium armors are treated as light, but light armors are still treated as light. This decrease does not apply to proficiency in wearing the armor. A character wearing mithral full plate must be proficient in wearing heavy armor to avoid adding the armor’s check penalty on all his attack rolls and skill checks that involve moving.

If I do go with a Mithral Full Plate, I do understand I need to have the heavy armor proficiency to wear it BUT does it count as Medium Armor for the Rangers Style?

Character Plan -
Going with the Weapon and Shield Ranger Style (Shield Bash, Shield Bull Rush, Cornugon Smash, etc).
For enchanting, I'm planning on working on my Dwarven Maulaxe and Heavy Spiked Shield first. Then sometime after 7th level make the jump for whatever I end up doing for my armor.

Going build & run a Dwarf (standard dwarf with Axe and shield) Slayer in PFS. Plan is to make him a tank and a trap spotter/disabler.

What I need advice for -
Thinking about getting him some heavy armor since it'll have little to no effect with him. Just trying to decide how to go about getting this heavy armor or if I even should.

Do I grab a feat for Heavy Armor?
At moment I'm against this as I've got more feats to pick then I have spots for the feats.

Take a level of Fighter?
Leaning towards this as it gives me a extra Feat slot & Heavy armor.

Grab some other class or a fighter archetype that gives me heavy armor?
Thought about Warpriest as it boosts my Will save and gives me some nice utility while just loosing +1 BAB and +1 HP

or Do I just forget the Heavy Armor and make do with Med Armor & Shield?

Just a suggestion since it sound like this might not be happening right away -

Take a look at the PFS (Pathfinder Society) boards and see/ask if there's a local group around where you live and when/where they play. Most groups are very helpful and like to see new members joining them.
Over-all, home games are usually a lot better as the characters usually have a background and a story that flows with the playing. PFS is limited to 4 hours of play and most stories have to be completed in that time frame.

My biggest gripe about clerics is not that they're healbots. It's the rest of the party treating them as healbots!

Just seems that if there's a cleric in the party, the party neglects their defenses and they feel like the can take st*p*d risks.

This isn't true with all parties but it does seem to be my experience when I play.
No healbot in the party - let's play smart!
Look, we have a healbot. I'm going to run smack into the middle of all these bad guys and take them out!

Potions, Scrolls, and Wands should be everyone's friend. If you want to be nice, just make sure some of them are higher then minimum level. Example: Scroll of Remove Disease at a 10th caster level.

Thanks, what I thought but was hoping there was something in some out of the way splat book.

I'm trying to find a PFS Trait that makes UMD a class skill and uses WIS.

Is there such a thing?

How about if it worked off STR/DEX/ or CON?

My INT is kind of low and no CHA to speak of so those traits won't work.

Is there such a thing out there for PFS?

Looking for some advice on a Dwarven Tank type that I'm planning out for PFS. Trying to build a somewhat stereotypical dwarf Waraxe/Shield fighter. Need him to be a serious threat while still having a great AC.

Dwarf Tank (Ranger/Divine Tracker - from ACG)

STR 18 (4th & 8th level bumps Strength)
DEX 12
CON 14+2
WIS 10+2
CHA 10-2
(20 point buy)

HP 14 (favored class HP)

Skills: Climb 1, Intimidate 1, Perception: 1, Swim 1 (leveling Intimidate & Perception, last 2 skill ranks spread out)

1) Favored Enemy: Humans, Track, Feat: Power Attack
2) Endurance, Favored Terrain: Urban, Combat Style: Weapon & Shield (Two Weapon Fighting)
3) Feat: Improved Shield Bash
4) Spells, Blessings (Trudd): Good & Protection (3+1/2 ranger levels x day)
5) Favored Enemy: Outsider-Evil, Feat: Shield Slam
6) Combat Style: Shield Master
7) Woodland Stride, Feat: Improved Bull Rush
8) Swift Tracker, Favored Terrain: Underground
9) Evasion, Feat: Bull Rush-Greater
10) Favored Enemy: Construct, Combat Style: Saving Shield
11) Quarry, Feat: Weapon Focus: Shield (Thinking multi-class to fighter here)
12) Camouflage (Thinking multi-class to fighter 2 here)

I wouldn't allow it, due to a number of different ways it can be used in a 'broken' way.

Some of them have already been posted but another is it's Casting Time vs the Casting Time of the spell being 'replaced'. There's a number of Full Round and longer spells this could be of serious use for.


I was using the same logic too. Just had some munchkin's wanting to UMD a scroll of a Deity Spell and in a quick search, couldn't find anything saying it was illegal.

Ended up by using RAW as he had the books with the spell and you can buy divine scrolls as a legal item.


How about a Deity specific spell?

Can you buy a scroll of that and use a scroll with a Deity spell on it?

Those spells are open access to a worshiper of that Deity and, supposedly those deities/temples can make scrolls of those spells and sell them.


Need some clarification of spells pulled from Pathfinder Player Companion: *Race* of Golarion & the ARG -

ARG PFS Rules: Alternate racial traits, racial archetypes, racial evolutions, racial feats, and racial spells are only available for characters of the associated race. Racial equipment and magic items can be purchased and used by any race as long as the specific item permits it (for example, only halflings can purchase and use solidsmoke pipeweed).

Can you purchase scrolls of these spells and then UMD them?

Confusion comes up with this sentence -
Racial equipment and magic items can be purchased and used by any race as long as the specific item permits it.

Example: A Human Character goes to the Temple of Trudd (Dwarven Deity) and buys a scrolls of Mighty Strength (Cleric/Paladin Spell).

If doing something like this is legal, what's stopping Arcane Casters from purchasing a Racial Spell as a scroll and then writing that spell into his spell book?

For thinking it would be easy to kill these Stirges -

Summoned into the same square (or even adjacent square as 5' step does not trigger AoO).

Having 1D3+1 Stirges draining your CON. When your turn comes around you have a choice -
Attack the Sturges or attack the party members.

Next round you have another 1D3+1 Sturges attached to you. As the Druid is in the process of summoning up more. (Party was set up tactical to stop the Devil from being able to get to Druid to interrupt the casting).

Creature had no defense against this tactic but for DR/Good

Thought that was the case. Just seemed wrong that a bunch of Stirge's could bring down a CR11 Devil. Not going to say more about the type of creature but it should have been a very nasty fight.

Had a Druid summon up a bunch of Stirge's against a creature with DR/10 good. This was in PFS so have to use the RAW of the rules.

Since the creature had a lousy touch AC, how much threat were these Stirge's to the creature?

By RAW, all the Stirge's needed to do is hit the touch AC of the creature then they'd do 1 point of CON damage. Having multiple Stirge's made this a rule threat.

Could not find any rule, ruling one way or another on this so I ended up letting it slide as a creative spell use (plus it painted a funny scene of this big tough monster being brought down by a bunch of giant mosquitos).

What should have been the actual ruling of this?

I think you need to do some serious tweaking for this Boss fight.
Some things to consider -

I'm assuming you've added Anti-Paladin levels to a normal troglodyte. If this is the case you probably need to adjust some of your stats -

Normal Trog's have a -
9 DEX, that's a -1 AC modifier.
11CHA, unless you 'bump' this up to +1 to a 12CHA for the stat bump, you wont get the bonus to hit from the smite good. With a 12 CHA you'd be at +1 to hit and a +1 AC Bonus. With this low of a CHA, it should have no real effect on the Trog's saving throws.

The Trog's Stench ability might be a problem. If I've figured the DC right for a CR7 Trog, the party would need to make a FORT DC 15 or be sickened.

Trog's BAB +7
STR Mod +1
Smite Good +0 or +1
Feats +1

Probable To Hit Bonus: +10

This guy will probably only end up hitting the paladin he'll end up attacking on only 35-40% of his attack rolls. Causing this to end up as a big swing and miss fight for everyone.

So I wouldn't worry too much about the Anti-Paladin Trog, it's what you put with him that's can be a problem. As the Trog will be suffering from a 'Action Economy' deficit compared to the players.
If he's a solo 'encounter' I'd bump his CR (level) up at least one or two more.
If you give him some more "Trog" minions, it could then turn into a nasty fight. Just remember, for each Trog, the party needs to make the Stench save.

Not sure how this would work with your BAMFing -

Have you thought about picking up a couple levels of Magus?
Benefits -
*Fake TWF with spell combat. Does require making a concentration check but if you pick up the traits for this the DC is really low.
*Having to only enchant one weapon instead of two.
*You get to add your full +stat modifier damage to your attacks without having to spend feats on them.
*Have access to a bunch of arcane spells (magus spell list - scrolls).

Cons -
Your +BAB is one lower then where it should be.

This is situational but is what I prefer doing when I can -

4th level Scroll of Stoneskin
Duration: 70 minutes
Effect: DR10/admantine up to 70 absorbed damage.
Costs: Scroll: 700 + 250 diamond dust = 950 gp

Does require a arcane caster and access to some scrolls.

This is a lot cheaper option then going with Adamantine FullPlate.
While it does have some drawbacks (anti-magic or getting hit with a dispel) I fill the pros out way the cons.

I'm a big fan of taking Skill Focus: Acrobatics for any type of Rogue character. Just makes it that much more easier tumbling around and through the bad guys.

Not a fan of the Feinting feats. This has more to do with the penalties you'll be facing for a good third to half of your fights when attacking monsters that just don't know what feinting is.

Skill Unlock: I like Escape Artist. Escaping a grapple as a move action at 5 skill ranks, At 10 skill ranks, if you take a full round action you get a +10 on your Escape Artist roll.
There's just way too many things that can mess you up when grappled. As a Rogue, you usually do not have a high CMD, so anything that can help you when in trouble is a big help.

Suggest you take a look at the Slayer -

Slayer is a Rogue/Ranger Hybrid build, allowing you to pick up the Rangers TWF feat chain & the Rogues Trapfinding skills by using the Slayer Talents.

For what it sounds like what you want to do, you gain more then you would loose going with the Slayer or the Unchained Rogue.

Here's another suggestions - this is something I'm building/working on for PFS.

Race: Elf
1) level 1 Magus Archetype Spire Defender.
Feat: Butterfly's Sting. Class abilities: Arcane Pool, Spells, Spell Combat, Feat: Combat Expertise, Feat: Dodge
2) level 1 Unchained Rogue
Class Abilities: Weapon Finesse, Sneak Attack 1d6, Trapfinding
3) level 2 Spire Defender (Magus)
Class Ability Spell Strike, Feat: Combat Casting
4) level 2 Unchained Rogue
Class Abilities: Evasion, Rogue talent - Weapon Focus: Rapier
5) level 3 Spire Defender (Magus)
Feat: Weapon focus: Touch Attacks. Class Abilities: Arcane - Close Range.
6) Unchained Rogue rest of levels.

What I like about this build -
Magus Archetype Spire Defender give you access to a nice selection of feats right at the start, access to a bunch of mage spells (Shield will be your go to spell for bumping your defense), a fake TWF using the Arcane Mark cheat, and access to a bunch of knowledge skills (makes ID monsters easier, specially with all those skill ranks you'll be picking up with Rogue levels.)
You'll also get a 30' attack cantrip you can use at range to get that first round SA damage in while monsters are still flatfooted.
Butterfly's Sting allows you to pass you're crits onto the next person's melee attack. This does depend on you having a brute in your party using a big 2handed-weapon.

Con -
You're kind of weak compared to other classes the first couple of levels but it does work out pretty good in the mid, to upper levels.

You take a hit in your BAB but can get around this by making Touch Attacks with Ray of Frost, dealing SA damage and applying Unchained Rogue ability: Debilitating Injury, lowering the targets AC and then following up with a Rapier attack (at 7th level). Then there's also you're Arcane Pool (limited) you can use to enhance the plusses on your weapon.

Blessings -
Good Blessing: I like this one as it helps you by-pass DR and can apply a bit of extra damage. Plus the level 10 summoning can be very useful.

Destruction Blessing: Am not a fan of, reason why is - Takes a standard action to use the ability and only last 1 minute. The potential damage you loose for not full round attacking is a lot greater then the damage you would gain for applying this buff. Same for the level 10 part of the Blessing.

Nobility Blessing: I feel is one of the better blessing that warpriests can get. Inspiring Word (minor) works best with skill checks or that need to make saving throw (ongoing damage). Lead by Example (major) takes a swift action to use. While Warpriests have crazy amounts of swift actions they can do, this still allows a full attack action.

Most poisons at 1st level are bad. While Drow poison doesn't have any really nasty effect, it can still completely drop one of your players out during the first round of combat. You then can end up with a unhappy individual twiddling their thumbs not being able to do anything for the rest of the fight.

Anything that's Save or Out is usually bad. People are going have bad rolls and you, as a GM, need to have some type of plan in place in case that happens.

Save or Out can be fun, exciting, and risky for players but only if they have some type of way to negate the effect if they fail their rolls.

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Stay away from weapons that use x3 or x4 crit modifiers. You will roll a crit sooner or later and weapons that do use the x3/x4 modifiers can take most 1st level characters from full health to dead.

I'd think strongly about some type of melee that can use some type of reach weapon. Then stand behind your sword and board pally and deal damage that way.

Reasoning for this is because this is a dungeon crawl so most fights start in corridors 5' to 10' wide. So unless you can get everyone into and spread out inside a room, you're going to be stuck fighting in these corridors.

I character concept I've played around building that might work here is a Dwarven Barbarian wielding a Dorn Dergar. You should have lots of health, good saves, good damage, melee flexibility, and a so-so AC (but if you're behind your front line, you don't need to worry so much about the AC). Just have to decide which type of barbarian you would want to run. (Since this is a character concept of mine, I've only changed the build about 5 times so far.) :)

I'm against Superstition but that's more of a theme thing then anything else. I just find it hard to see a Superstition Barbarian that's loaded down with magical gear when that same Barbarian is afraid of and doesn't trust magic.

There's kind of 3 main cleric types. Each have their own types of builds -

Combat Clerics: These wade into battle using their spells to buff themselves to increase their damage and defenses.
Usually go with a 14-16 Wisdom with a high STR or DEX. face a problem of spending a round or two buffing themselves before going into combat.

Party Buffers: Uses spells to buff the party. Need a high (16+) DEX, getting those buffs out before the party starts spreading out in combat. Good Wisdom 16-18, this is more for those extra spells you get for high wisdom.

Debuffers/Nukers: Debuff the bad guys or nuke them. Need a high Wisdom, 18+, to make the bad guys fail the DC.

Ask what kind of cleric interested in playing. There's just way too many different ways to build a cleric.

Dimensional Slide is a GREAT exploit. You'll want it around level 5 or at least level 7. Two reasons -

1) You have a 20 move as a small creature. Dim Slide can more then triple that move rate. There will be times when you want that extra move. Dim Slide can also be used going up and down.

2) Getting out of grapples. You're going to have a lousy CMD and CMB. With Dim Slide being a (SU) ability, no casting checks. Around level 5+ you can face monsters with a grappling secondary attack.

Suggest you move Dimensional Slide to level 5 or level 7 exploit.

Quick Study as a Exploit. I've found that when I've wanted to change my spells for something else on my spell list, I just do not have the time. Plus I really prefer using my Arcane Points for upping either my spells CL or DC with the Potent Spell Exploit.

If you're going to keep a high CHA. I suggest taking a look at the School Exploit and picking up Void. The Void School Arcanist, depending on how you and the GM read it, can be very powerful or just useful.

With your correction to Dex, everything looks right.

I do suggests that since this sounds like the very first time playing for you, that you check with your GM on how he handles character creation. There are a number of different methods out there for character creation and your GM might be using something different.

The guides Fruian suggested can be very helpfully...but, most of them are written with high end play in mind. If you're playing in a low level game, there can be a big difference.

As people have stated, you're making it a bit too complicated. Simplify the laws to people tied to the land and travel being restricted.

One thing I've always found a bit wacky is the way heavily armed and armored adventures can walk through towns without being stopped by the town guards. Having laws about carrying weapons and wearing armor is usually a must for any LE society in my opinion. The people on top want to make sure they stay on top. Anyone that might be a disturbance to 'Law & Peace' is considered a threat.
If you do go with something like this, you need a way for you're adventures to start with their gear and some way to upgrade through training and better gear.

If this is a random encounter - they should get exp.

If this is a Story Line Encounter - it depends a lot on the story line and what the PC are supposed to be doing and what they need to get done to complete the story.

Over all, I dislike giving out exp for encounters. There's just way too many ways for your players to do stuff you haven't planned for (How do you figure out that exp if the players do something weird, completely skipping a encounter?). Use the CR for your encounters to give you a rough idea for experience and then reward the players that experience at the end of a story arc. This gives the GM more control over how fast (or slow) the players level.

I think you're going have a problem keeping the monsters attention on you as I can't see you dealing no where near the damage your fellow party members are going to be doing.

I know Sword and board builds can be crazy good. Problem is, they're all very feat intensive and don't really become good till very high level. For PFS, these builds are usually made by someone applying a lot of GM credit to a character or by using retraining rules late in the characters life.

If you do decide to slowly work your way up through the feat chain. Be prepared to play a mediocre character the first 7-9 levels. I do know some people like this challenge and are knowledgeable enough about game tactics to carry it off and make it a fun challenge for them and the rest of the table. You just have to decide if you're one of these people to go through with it.

Restoration, restoration, and more restoration. Someone, somewhere will fail a save. Probably more then one person and if unlucky, multiple times.

Actually, having one or two potions/scrolls of lesser (normal) Restoration on any PFS character can save your character grief down the road.

I really thought about the Extra Movement but since this is for PFS, very rarely do you have space on the maps (encounters) that you need the extra movement for. Usually the problem is there just isn't enough space and you have your fellow party members getting in the way.

Over half the fights seem to be in buildings or some type of dungeon crawl.

Thinking about this now, might drop a Extra Ki feat for Feat: Skill Focus Acrobatics.

For my Monks Bonus Feats -
I already took Dodge at 1st level. That leaves me to decide what to pick at 2nd. I keep changing my mind between Improved Grapple and Combat Reflexes. At moment, I'm for Combat Reflexes and if I want to Grapple, I'll take the AoO for my Grapple check.
I have seen how powerful Grapple can be, I just don't want to go that route for a couple of reasons. The main reason is because it can be a pain to figure out and run all the options you have with grapple. ie, it gives me a headache.

Convinced me to drop Scorching Ray. With the Quarterstaff of Entwined Serpents and potions of Fly, that should help vs flying targets.
6th level will take - Ki Power: Furious Defense
8th level - Ki Power: Insightful Wisdom (with the Ring of Ki Mastery this will only cost me 1 Ki Point.)

Is Medusa's Wrath that good?
I didn't think it was since to set it up, you need your target to fail a Fort Save. I hate targeting the Fort Save. :)

Updated with some tweaks and have a few questions.

Race: Human (dual talent, two +2 stat bumps from the ARG)

STR 16+2 (18), DEX 14, CON 12, INT 10, WIS 14+2 (16), CHA 8
Stat bumps at 4th & 8th go into strength.

Traits: Honored Fist of the Society (+1 ki point, combat), Mizu Ki Hikari Rebel (+1 trait bonus to damage rolls made with unarmed attacks, regional)

Skills: Acrobatics, Perception, Sense Motive, undecided on the last skill rank.

1) Feat: Weapon Focus: Unarmed Stike, Bonus Feat: Dodge, Stunning Fist (DC13), Flurry of Blows, Unarmed Strike.

2) Bonus Feat: Combat Reflexes

3) Feat: Dragon Style

4) Ki Power: Bark Skin

5) Feat: Dragon Ferocity, Style Strike: Flying Kick

6) Ki Power: Scorching Ray (To help for my range combat ability. Would a Rod of Elemental Spell work with Scorching Ray since it is now a Ki Power and not a Spell?), Bonus Feat: Mobility

7) Feat: Extra Ki

8) Ki Power: Furious Defense

9) Feat: Extra Ki. Style Strike: Spin Kick

10) Bonus Feat: Improved Critical, Ki Power: Ki Leech

Comments -
While I really want to go with the Shattering Punch Style, I just feel I can get more use out of Flying Kick at 5th level and by the 9th level I should be able to get the gear to bypass most DR....but, have not made up my mind on this. I know which ever way I go I'll end up cursing myself some time in the future for not going the other way.

Have dropped the Feat: Power Attack and picked up another Feat: Extra Ki. Figure I can burn through Ki with no problem at all.
Have thought about instead getting the Extra Trait Feat or Skill Focus for helping out with UMD. Probably will not go this route as most tables will be playing with someone able to actually use my Wand of Mage Armor.)

Question: Do I have to wait till 3rd level to use the human alternative racial advancement of adding 1/4 Ki point every time I level?

Gear -
Headband: Headband of Inspired Wisdom - 4,000 gold (upgrade 16,000)
Neck: Amulet of Mighty Fist (Holy on first) - 16,000 gold
Body: Robe, Monk's - 13,000 gold
Chest: Tunic, Snakeskin - 8,000 gold
Hands: Deliquescent - 8,000 gold
Ring: Ring of Ki Mastery - 10,000 gold
Waist: Belt of Giant Strength - 4,000 gold (upgrade 16,000)
Feet: Slippers, Feather Step - 2,000 gold

Wand of Mage Armor - 750 gold
Quarterstaff of Entwined Serpents - 5,050 gold (to use the magic missile ability, do I have to UMD this? If so, will replace it with something else - maybe.)
Ioun Stone, Pink Rhomboid (+2 Con) - 8,000 gold

Thanks for the replies. Going end up doing some tweaking with the build and list some purchases but that probably won't go up till late tomorrow.

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Unchained Monk, trying to build one and have no real idea what I'm doing, except from what I've read on the forums. Here's what I have so far -

Race: Human (dual talent, two +2 stat bumps from the ARG)

STR 16+2 (18), DEX 14, CON 12, INT 10, WIS 14+2 (16), CHA 8
Stat bumps at 4th & 8th go into strength.

Traits: Honored Fist of the Society (+1 ki point, combat), Mizu Ki Hikari Rebel (+1 trait bonus to damage rolls made with unarmed attacks, regional)

Skills: Acrobatics, Perception, Sense Motive, undecided on the last skill rank.

1) Feat: Weapon Focus: Unarmed Stike, Bonus Feat: Dodge, Stunning Fist (DC13), Flurry of Blows, Unarmed Strike.

2) Bonus Feat: Combat Reflexes

3) Feat: Dragon Style

4) Ki Power: Bark Skin

5) Feat: Dragon Ferocity, Style Strike: Flying Kick (I'm assuming I can only move my movement bonus of 10', 20' at level 6, when used with Flurry of Blows)

6) Ki Power: Elemental Fury (Acid), Bonus Feat: Mobility

7) Feat: Power Attack

8) Ki Power: Abundant Step

9) Feat: Extra Ki. (Thought about taking Feat: Dragon Roar. At moment I'm leaning not to as the damage isn't that great, it's save is vs Fort, and costs 2 uses of Stunning fist.) Style Strike: Spin Kick

10) Bonus Feat: Improved Critical, Ki Power: Ki Leech

At moment, character has just made 2nd and really need to do some planning ahead.

Suggestions for proving this build and gear purchases (under 16000 gold).

Playing with a character build that's a Wizard/Rogue/Fighter type hybrid build. Here's roughly what I have so far -

PFS Legal, 20 point buy

Levels & Class: 3 Kensai (Magus), 4 Unchained Rogue, 5 Slayer

Human 12 STR, 16(+2/18) DEX, 14 CON, 14 INT, 12 WIS, 7 CHA

Traits: Clever Wordplay(Socal): UMD, Threatening Defender (Combat)

1) 1 Kensai (Magus)
Feat: Combat Expertise, Human Feat: Butterfly's Sting. Class abilities: Arcane Pool, Spells, Spell Combat, Canny Defense, Weapon Focus: Rapier.
2) 1 Unchained Rogue
Class Abilities: Weapon Finesse, Sneak Attack 1d6, Trapfinding
3) 2 Unchained Rogue
Feat: Combat Casting. Class Abilities: Evasion, Rogue talent - Minor Magic: Touch of Fatigue
4) 3 Unchained Rogue (+1 Stat bump to DEX)
Class Abilities: Finesse Training: Rapier, Danger Sense +1, Sneak Attack +2d6
5) 4 Unchained Rogue
Feat: Extra Arcane Pool. Class Abilities: Debilitating Injury, Uncanny Dode, Talent - Weapon Training: Improved Intitiative
6) 2 Kensai (Magus)
Class Ability Spell Strike
7) 3 Kensai (Magus)
Feat: Weapon focus: Touch Attacks. Class Abilities: Arcane - Close Range. Retrain Rogue talent - Minor Magic: Touch of Fatigue to Trap Sense
8) 1 Slayer (+1 Stat bump to DEX)
Class Abilities: Study target, Track
9) 2 Slayer
Feat: (lots of choices). Class Ability: Slayer Talent-Rogue Talent: Terrain Mastery: Urban

Plan is to use the Kensai 1st level spells to buff myself with Shield. and the Cantrips to use spell combat to attack target. At 7th level I'll attack the Touch AC using Ray Cantrips, drop their AC with Debilitating Injury, then attack AC using Spell Combat.
8th level and above, thinking about going Slayer for the +BAB, Studied Target, & the increase (slow) Sneak Attack dice damage.

Keep changing my mind -
Trait: Clever Wordplay(Socal): UMD - might go with Diplomacy (or even a different trait).
Grabbing the 5 levels in Slayer vs Picking up levels 5-9 in Unchained Rogue.

I shall check this thread again in about 24 hours to see if anyone has suggestions/comments for this build.

Here's a couple of my suggestions and why -

Vampiric Touch is a must have. It does damage and buffs you.

Burst of Speed (UC) for tactical positioning. Great if you have a minion in a choke point blocking the party from getting to a caster.

Air Geyser (ACG) has some fun uses and helps a bit for ranged fights.

Force Punch (UM) good vs insubstantial creatures and can allow AO from fellow party members.

Stay away from Elemental Aura. At first I thought it would be a good spell but the enemy taking a 5' step away from you pretty much wrecks it.

Darkness & Deep Darkness

These can be pretty nasty in that the completely shut down the 'sight' abilities of the party and there is a number of creatures that can use them. These powers should only be used now and then as they do build up a lot of frustration for the players.

Intelligent Monsters

Don't let the party buff themselves. Most buffs in the game only last a minute per level and take a round per cast. Usually these buffs only last once per encounter. As it takes time to recover (heal), search, and ID all the loot they find.
...So if the party tries to buff themselves before a encounter, monsters get a perception check to spot them. More buffs, more checks. Monster makes the perception check, fight starts.


Have guards (guard room) full of mooks outside the Big Baddy room. They're there to warn and also server as a choke point (doorway) to stop the parties advancement.

CMD Maneuvers

These can be hard for a new GM to use and figure out. There are monsters with very nice CM bonuses. Applying a grapple condition on someone effectively shuts that person down for 1+ round and makes that person a lot easier to hit.

Remember, all the tricks a party can use, bad guys can also use them.

Remember, Aasimars count as outsiders. While this is both good, it's also bad. There's a number of spells/abilities that don't work on them (unless the take the humanity trait) while there's other spells/abilities that have more of a effect on them.

Nothing worse then taking 1D6 per caster level + effect while everyone else is taking 1D8 every other caster level.

While I do agree they are slightly overpowered at low levels. During the higher levels, if their enemies know they are coming and can prep accordingly, can be painful to the Aasimar.

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