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Red Dragon

Matrixryu's page

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber. Pathfinder Society Member. 772 posts (2,218 including aliases). 2 reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 6 Pathfinder Society characters. 4 aliases.


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If I could request anything for this book, it would be official rules to kill the big six magical items. If I could play a game without ever seeing a cloak of resistance....


1 person marked this as a favorite.
thejeff wrote:
Matrix Dragon wrote:

Hold on, people actually believed they could use Eldritch Heritage(Arcane) to give a non-sorcerer non-arcane class sorcerer spells?

I entertained the idea briefly a year or two ago, and then quickly decided that that it wasn't supposed to work that way and was an unintended side effect of the eldritch heritage feats, lol.

Of course they did.

Unintended side effects are what system mastery is all about.

In my opinion, true system mastery includes skipping all the things that would make a GM say "NO, it clearly wasn't meant to work that way", lol. That's what I would have said if any of my players tried this on me. ;)


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Stark_ wrote:
My comparison, at least, was to the paragon surge spell...

Just wanted to mention: Paragaon Surge has finally recived the nerfs that it deserves. You can essentally use it to only learn *one* new spell each day. The FAQs have been updated.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Odraude wrote:
Ssalarn wrote:
Artanthos wrote:
Matrix Dragon wrote:
I know that the current version of the summoner can be hard for new players and GMs to handle. However, I just hope that the new version of the Summoner won't lose quite all of its customization powers. To me, the ability to use the summoner class to create any companion for your character that you can imagine is what makes it special (and one of my favorate classes).
Agreed. Please don't kill the ability of the summoner to customize their eidolons.
These are going to be new takes on the classes. Even if the "Unchained" Summoner doesn't have a customizable Eidolon, that isn't going to make the current Summoner suddenly cease to exist. They've been pretty clear that these aren't replacements, just alternate versions of the still perfectly valid core materials.

Unfortunately GMs don't work that way. If you give a GM the option of the much maligned APG summoner and the PU summoner without the headache of the eidolon, most are going to go with the latter. It's like how Pathfinder is 3.5 compatible and lets you use your old books, but you'll be hard-pressed to find a GM that does allow 3.5 material.

Unless the new summoner is grossly worse or more overpowered than the original summoner, it's essentially going to replace the APG one in the minds of many a GM.

This is exactly what I'm worried about. Especially if the new summoner ends up being completely diffierent from the old summoner class.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Deadmanwalking wrote:

To clarify the issue I'm having, it's not about content, it's tonal. And I'd go further and say there's some on both sides of the argument.

It's not that people object to any criticism of Paizo, it's that people on that side of the argument are coming off as really upset, specifically in a "How dare they!" or "They're incompetent!" kinda way...which is not generally conducive to a productive conversation. As well as seeming to leap to conclusions about the final class, which is part of the reason for the above emotions and also doesn't help the situation at all.

People on the other side, meanwhile, are ridiculing the first side despite them having perfectly reasonable balance concerns given the info currently available, which is also not generally conducive to productive conversation.

So can everyone just take a step back and calm down a little? The issues being discussed are legitimate, I just think something of a tonal shift is needed for the discussion to be productive.

I think you may be getting the wrong feeling from a number of the people who are posting. Remember that emotion (or lack there-of) does not convey well in a written medium.

Should I start adding smilies to everything I say? ;)


2 people marked this as a favorite.

I also hope that this book will give the under supported ranged attack types (such as crossbows and thrown weapons) the support they need. Archers have plenty of support already.


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Alexander Augunas wrote:
Ambrosia Slaad wrote:
Eric Hinkle wrote:
I'll just say that I would love to see a Kitsune player companion book; though I suspect that if one is coming it's a long way off. Heck, we don't even have a Hellknight book yet, and how often have they shown up in the setting?
Me too. Yeah, I think our best shot is convincing Alex to write an "Amazing Races/Kitsune Unbound" supplement for Abandoned Arts or Radiance House or another 3PP.

Well, considering that I just founded my own 3PP, I don't need to write a kitsune player companion for anyone but myself.

Which I'm totally going to do before the end of the year, mind you. ;-)

I am amused by this because I have totally been thinking you would be a good person to ask for tips if I were ever to try and write 3rd party content. It seems like my instincts on this were correct XD


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I like what you've with Studied Combat + Studied Strike. It really fits the theme of an intelligent fighter: when you play the class you'll really have to think about who to target and how many hits it would take to finish him. This is a nice difference from a fighter who can just wade into combat and kill everyone, but it keeps the investigator effective when it counts.

I wasn't too interested in the original design of this class (for extracts+sneak attack there was the vivisectionist), but now I am looking forward to trying out the final version.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
captain yesterday wrote:

forgot wardstone fragment one time use:)

paladins derail adventures almost as much as player vs player violence:)

If there is any adventure where paladins should be allowed, it would be this one. You're working with a crusade full of paladins after all! If anything, the people who are being difficult with the paladin players would be the ones responsible for derailing the adventure here.


5 people marked this as a favorite.
Troodos wrote:
I'm guessing Good from the story, but I cant tell if he's neutral, lawful, or chaotic.

He has the Batman alignment: super lawful guy who breaks the law.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I have to agree with this sentiment. At this point I'm more interested in learning about anything but the inner sea region and the 20 core gods, lol. Sure, I do like having the extra material, but I'd rather know more about Tian Xia and Arcadia.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

When all else fails, blame Cosmo.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
the Haunted Jester wrote:
Is the Ravener on the front cover supposed to be the remains of the Red Dragon on the cover of the Core Rulebook?

Nah, wrong element. The green color and acid means it probably had an acid breath weapon in life.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Hayato Ken wrote:

This theme is just sucked so dry and overdone.

Hopefully Paizo will stay away from this for a very long time and come up with newer, more refreshing and entertaining options^^

Like a book for Kitsune, Nagaji and Wayang.

As a fan of both Dragons and Kitsune, I am conflicted. D:

Hayato Ken wrote:
Dragons are cool. As NPC´s and enemies. As PC´s you get a totally different game.

Is it wrong that I am far more interested in playing an 'enemy and npc' race than anything that is available to the players right now? I like fantasy because of things like dragons. I'd rather play something based on the race than fight one.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

*pokes thread*

Hmmm, I think it has been more than half a year since the Mythic Adventures book came out, and there still has not been much in the way of erratas. I guess Paizo is busy :(

I have to say that I am looking forward to seeing what fixes Paizo implements to this book. As much as I love the Mythic rules I think this book is going to need even more faqs and erratas than any other book Paizo has put out.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I'm going to go ahead and say this: in a mythic game, "Beyond Morality" will be the least of your powergaming problems. If you don't want things to get totally out of wack you will need to require your powergamer to tone things down. A character who knows how the mythic rules work can make monsterous characters if he tries.

I suggest that you actually make your powergamer work for you and have him tell you what the most powerful ability combinations are so you can nerf/ban them in advance. Sometimes powergamers feel that they *have* to pick the best options if they are available, but won't feel like they're nerfing themselves if those powers are banned in the first place.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

According to the rules in the Magic section of the core rulebook, a spell can be copied from a scroll to a spellbook. Here is a link

Spells Copied from Another's Spellbook or a Scroll:

Spells Copied from Another's Spellbook or a Scroll: A wizard can also add a spell to his book whenever he encounters one on a magic scroll or in another wizard's spellbook. No matter what the spell's source, the wizard must first decipher the magical writing (see Arcane Magical Writings). Next, he must spend 1 hour studying the spell. At the end of the hour, he must make a Spellcraft check (DC 15 + spell's level). A wizard who has specialized in a school of spells gains a +2 bonus on the Spellcraft check if the new spell is from his specialty school. If the check succeeds, the wizard understands the spell and can copy it into his spellbook (see Writing a New Spell into a Spellbook). The process leaves a spellbook that was copied from unharmed, but a spell successfully copied from a magic scroll disappears from the parchment.

If you're worried about this causing resources to be lost you could rule that the copying process does not destroy the scroll. Or you could give the magus spellbooks to copy spells from.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Stephen Radney-MacFarland wrote:
Chemlak wrote:

There's an FAQ request about this floating around somewhere.

There are three schools of thought:

1) The character is undetectable by any means (including Perception skill checks, blind sight, tremorsense and true seeing).

2) The character is undetectable by magic, but senses work normally.

3) The character is immune to "detect" spells and any effects based on the scry spell.

Pick your preference. I waver between 1 and 2.

Yes, it is 1. Because mythic.

I really wish that it wasn't option 1, because this lead my GM to just ban the ability before the party's ninja could abuse it.

'It has to be awsome because it is mythic' is nice, but the players still need to be challenged in some way.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Well, here's hoping that there will be some new information on Apsu for my Paladin/Dragon Disciple. Also, that enough humans worship Daikitsu that she will get mentioned at least, hah.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

As long as all the books about humans get renamed to "Boring People of Golarion" ;)


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Atarlost wrote:
Nobody even wants to like the summoner.

Objection! The summoner's flavor makes it one of my favorate classes, and I know that I'm not the only one. ;)

Admittedly though, the class does needs one of the following to not mess up a game: a rework, gm supervision, or a very well prepared and trustworthy player running it.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

*Sigh* All these people just refusing to buy a new edition that hasn't even been announced yet.

You claim that you wouldn't buy the next edition.... However, if you decide that the next edition is better and that you would have more fun playing it you probably will start buying it.


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Lemmy wrote:

"Oh no! A martial class can move 10ft. and still be effective! HOW DARE THEY? NERF IT INTO NOTHINGNESS! Now excuse me while my Cleric teleports as a move action and then casts 2 different spells..."

Apparently, Pounce should be exclusive to 6th level Druids and 1st level Synthesists.

Beastmorph Alchemists get pounce as well at level 10. I would also call the Dimensional Dervish feat chain a varient of pounce since you can get full attacks out of it.

Plus, archers are superior to pouncers in general since they basically get to make a full attack and ignore DR at the same time....

Be careful about calling for one or two things to get nerfed when there are 10 other options that do the same thing. All you'll do is make the other options more popular.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Zhayne wrote:
Oh, and of course ... NO ALIGNMENT.

Not sure that Alignment actually needs to go, but I could see it's impact getting reduced so that 'normal people' are essentially all netural no matter what they believe. You'd have to be directly associated with a god or some other power in order to have a strong enough alignment for it to matter.


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I have to say that when my group did eyes of the ten it was pretty easy. Then again, each character was an optomized monstrocity. We would have had a good chance of completing the thing with *two* characters.

There are 1 or 2 tough spots, but basically expect the usual season 1-2 difficulty.


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The main thing that would need to be fixed in a new edition is preventing the game's numbers from getting out of wack at high levels. It is beyond annoying that saving throws and BAB diverge so much at high levels. It is possible to work around it, but I wish it wasn't an issue in the first place.

In addition, the 'big six' magical items need to all be destroyed and never seen again. I hate it when I see some fancy magical item with a great and fun ability, and then have to say "I can't use that, because I would die without my Cloak of Resistance". I would like choosing magical items to become an actual choice again.


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To me, the real annoyance with skinwalkers is that several of their mental stat bonuses are only applied when shifted. Not only does this not make sense thematically since the shift is supposed to be more physical than mental, it also hoses skinwalker spellcasters and special ability users. Unless they stay in their shifted form for an entire day they don't get bonus spells per day or extra ability uses from that mental stat.

If I houserule anything about skinwalkers, it will be that they gain their physical stats bonus while shifted and the mental ones will be perminant.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Personally, for small cracks I would recommend liquid green stuff rather than the putty version.


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J-Gal wrote:
And another group with 2 half-orcs, a kitsune, a human (thank the lord) and a vishkanya.

I'm suddenly amused by the thought of playing a kitsune in a group like this and having the character try to convince everyone that HE is the one human in the party.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

Just a thought. Since Pathfinder Kitsune have a bit of a fey theme, they could probably also fit into a fey themed Player Companion. After all, their semi homeland seems to bet the Forest of the Spirits and Kitsune who aren't from that area generally know Sylvan. Plus, just look at the spells they get from the Magical Tail chain... definitely fey/trickery themed spells.

Though, I'm betting that this setup is probably unlikely (or would mean getting very little info on kitsune) since I be there are a lot of other fey related things that Paizo wants to talk about first. Still, I figured it was worth mentioning since a fey themed book is probably more likely to come out than a 'blood of beasts' or kitsune focused book.


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I do have to point out that it messes with my suspension of disbelief when every time a party member dies he is randomly replaced with someone who just *happens* to have the same powerlevel and goals as the rest of the party. Especially at mid to high levels.

I'd rather have Raise Dead in the game than replacement character silliness.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Hayato Ken wrote:

Or instead: Blood of the FOX!

Localized Kitsune all over Golarion!

It wouldn't be a page of the Next Player Companions thread if someone didn't ask for a book on Kitsune ;)


5 people marked this as a favorite.
Eirikrautha wrote:
Athaleon wrote:
Or is this because I said in the Swashbuckler thread that this was great for Swashbucklers?
You know, you might have been joking when you posted that, but it makes a lot of sense. One of the main complaints against the Swashbuckler Parry was that it was so much less than Crane Wing (a feat that anyone could take). Now that the ACG is in production, they fix the problem by... nerfing Crane Wing! LOL!

Honestly, I think the swashbuckler is exactly why Crane Wing is getting nerfed. A lot of people were talking about how the best swash build was to pick up Crane Wing so you could deflect TWO attacks per round. One with Crane Wing, and one with Parry.

Well... at least if this isn't the main reason, it is probably part of it.


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Personally, I've found that the best way to keep casters 'under control' is just to give the enemies that you don't want getting one-shot some Hero Points. At least three. Casters will have to go through four 'one shot kill' spells to get through the guy's defenses unless you get some really unlucky rolls on those GM dice. That'll give melee plenty of time to move in and do their thing.


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Personally, I would suggest just having the smite work against everything that the paladin would normally get his double damage bonus from smiting. This basically means evil outsiders (or rather, ones that have the evil subtype), chromatic dragons, and undead. You may also want to allow them to smite people who are clerics of gods that the paladin opposes.

So, basically, this means the paladin will be less effective fighting say... a thieves guild or corrupt officials, but will still be fully capable of smiting the big bads.

You may want to consider letting the paladin do a 'partial smite' against other targets to balance things out. In my games I replace Aura of Justice with the ability for paladins to smite non-evil things. They gain their charisma bonus to hit and AC, but no damage bonus or DR penetration. I got tired of paladins becoming useless in areas filled with golems, and I also didn't like the absurd damage boost that a party gets from Aura of Justice.


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Simple solution (if the party is high enough level): The paladin asks the party wizard if he has dismissal prepared.


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Cheapy wrote:

Halflings, mostly.

Space halflings.

You mean Giant Space Halflings?


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Aldarionn wrote:

Aasimar (Angelkin) Sorcerer/Dragon Disciple/Champion - 15 point buy

Str 13
Dex 12
Con 14
Int 10
Wis 8
Cha 15

+2 Str from Angelkin
+4 From Dragon Disciple
+5 Inherent from Manual
+5 Level Up
+6 Enhancement
+10 Form of the Dragon III
+10 Mythic Rank 10

55 Str

And that was just from a cursory look. I could probably ditch the 10 Mythic Tiers if I search hard enough for a way to get another 6 points of Strength. The worst part of it is that a strength based sorcerer/dragon disciple is not a bad way to go. It could actually be an effective character.

It can actually be a very effective character since there is a mythic power that lets you get a BAB equal to your caster level when polymorphed. Just make sure you have the Magical Knack trait to undo the caster level loss. (I am starting this type of character for a game)


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SmiloDan wrote:

What if each time you got Swashbuckler Weapon Training, you got to choose a special ability, which would include early access to Improved Critical, Dex to Damage, a bonus to CMB & CMD with the weapon, an increase in the weapon damage die, etc. etc.

I also think there should be a choice in deeds.

That way all swashbucklers won't be identical and predictable. Some would be high damage dealers, some would have high AC, some would be highly mobile, some would be battlefield controllers, some would be really good at enhancing their allies, some would be really really good in social situations, etc. etc.

I like this idea actually.


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Alright, I have to raise my hand and ask a question here. Why can't the Swashbuckler simply get a straight Cha to saves bonus at level 2? Even with this direct copy of one of the best paladin abilities, the class may still be worse than a paladin in most games except for ones with no evil creatures to smite.

The way things are, almost all (Lawful Good) swashbucklers will simply dip two levels into paladin to pick up those save bonuses and smite evil. They don't really lose much for it.


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Actually, here is an idea that may fit bloodragers well: allow them to 'burn' rounds of rage in order to cast a spell as a swift action. The number of rounds of rage they have to expend would be equal to the level of the spell.

This would make it possible for them to cast in combat, but they woudln't be able to do it all the time because it would be expending a limited resource. Plus, the fact that the resource being expending is 'rage' it fits the theme of the class perfectly. Plus, they may be able to make do with just the Magus spell list instead of getting a custom one!

Edit: an alternative idea would be that the bloodrager could expend rounds of rage to add metamagic to their spells. This would give them a choice between casting quickly in mid melee combat (via quicken) or casting a spell that does noteworthy damage (via maximize or similar). With this variation, the number of rounds of rage expended would equal the level required by the metamagic feat.


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The unfortunate thing here is that there really isn't a way for bloodrager spells to be worth using in mid combat without giving them Spellstrike, Spell Combat or some similar way of casting while attacking. This may be stealing too much from the magus though, so maybe a better route would be to simply give bloodragers more magic based powers and defenses so they are more paladin-like?

Alternatively, bloodragers could get an alternate list similar to the Paladin or Ranger. All of the best spells from those lists use swift or immediate actions, and that may fit the bloodrager's style more.

At least Paizo has several routes they can choose to go with in modifying this class.


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I just hope that the swashbuckler gets dex to damage by default so when I'm building my character I can worry about something other than how to get Agile or Dervish Dance as quickly as possible. I'm kind of tired of having to do with with every dex based character.


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So, a lot of people have been asking whether or not the Draconic Bloodline for Bloodragers should work with Dragon Disciple. After thinking about the implications of this, I say It should, because otherwise it will cause some interesting problems.

Option 1: The Bloodrager's Draconic Bloodline is advanced by Dragon Disciple

  • This means only Draconic Bloodragers could become Dragon Disciples
  • Dragon Disciple would be a very good prestige class for Draconic Bloodragers due to its perminant bonuses and that it advances both the class's bloodline and spells (to a lesser degree).

Option 2: The Bloodrager's Draconic Bloodline is NOT advanced by Dragon Disciple (weirdness)

  • This means any Bloodrager can become a Dragon Disciple.
  • Dragon Disciple would advance a Bloodrager's spellcasting, but not his bloodline
  • Dragon Disciple would be a very useful class for Bloodragers who aren't interested in some of their higher level Bloodline powers.
  • Draconic Bloodragers would actually be the worst of the Bloodrager types to become Dragon Disciples because a number of abilities would not stack. (For this reason alone I hope the developers go with Option 1)


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So, I've begun putting together a Draconic Bloodline Bloodrager for PFS. The character looks like he'll be an effective level 1 character, but I have concerns about higher levels.

  • He won't get a 3rd natural attack until level 16. This means that once he gets Iteritive attacks he will be better off simply ignoring his claw attacks instead of using them. I would suggest that the Draconic Bloodline get a Bite attack by at least level 6 to put it on par with other natural attack classes (such as Beastmorph Alchemist, Beast Totem Barbarians, and just plain old Dragon Disciples).
  • I am worried that if Bloodrager works with Dragon Disciple that a multiclass Bloodrager/Dragon Disciple will be better in most ways compared to a standard Bloodrager. Even if the Dragonic bloodline from bloodrager doesn't work with the Dragon Disciple "Blood of Dragons" ability, it may still be better than a pure Dragonic Bloodrager due to all the perminant bonuses. The Draconic Bloodline for Bloodrager should get some of the Dragon Disciple's tricks and abilities.
  • Why is it that the Arcane bloodline can turn into a dragon, but the draconic bloodline can't?
  • The Draconic Bloodline gives Fly as a bonus spell, but not until the character would have already gained wings while raging.


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I'm guessing that someone has already mentioned this one, but I want to point it out just in case.

I'm currently building a Kitsune Swashbuckler, and I've found one issue that kind of bothers me: technically you need a the Combat Reflexes feat in order to use the Riposte Deed. This is because you would have already used one for Parry.

It seems very odd that a class ability would not be able to even function without feat investment. That AoO requirement should either be removed or the Swashbuckler should get Combat Reflexes for free.


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Mystic Lemur wrote:

Thanks for that, Eric, but how do you mesh that with Jason's statement that the "ship has long sailed" on subbing out any of these classes?

On first blush most of these classes look really good, but some strike me as "meh" at best. It's a little off putting that even if the playtest response is universal dislike, the class will still make it to print.

Unfortunately, Paizo is a company with limited time and money. They can't spend an infinite amount of time coming up with new class ideas and throwing out old ones. Time spent throwing away, replacing, or rebuilding even *one* class will make the rest of the book suffer because in all likelihood they will not be able to delay the book for very long (if at all) before it has to go to print.

Basically, just give whatever feedback you can about the existing classes to try and help Paizo improve them. Telling them to throw away or replace any of these these is extremely likely to just be a waste of time. The biggest change that we can probably expect to see is probably something similar to what happened to the gunslinger during its playtest.


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MMCJawa wrote:
Slayer is a great example. It's basically a 20 level Assassin class, designed for and taking out individual targets. It's sneaky like the rogue, but isn't focused on trapfinding or being a jack of all trades. The class is intentionally designed for someone who mostly wants to play a sneaky killer, and not have to worry or deal with other class features that don't support that.

This is exactly why I love the Slayer class. Also, my players are going to be very upset to find that all the red mantis that they run into from now on are very likely to have Slayer levels... :D


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I love this class, but I think I should mention a few possible issues that I've noticed:

The Fey bloodline seems underpowered compared to most of the other choices. Here a perfect example: at 8th level the Arcane bloodline gets Displacement or Haste for their entire rage while fey just gets Blur for one round after a charge. Bloodragers get uncanny dodge, so the blur is inferior in every way here.

The Draconic bloodline gets the fly spell one level after they gain the ability to grow wings. Seems somewhat counterproductive, though I guess it could be cast on allies.

Is it just me, or is the abyssal bloodline way too good damage wise? Between its free enlarge (+2 size bonus strength and weapon die increase) and +6 strength bonus by level 20 it seems pretty crazy. I won't be surprised if they use the standard abyssal bloodline to get another +6 inherent bonus to strength as well! They are a bit weak on the defenses though and will overall have an extra -4 to their AC, but is that enough of a balancing factor?

Edit: I would like to recommend that the strength bonus from the abyssal bloodline be an inherent bonus (somehow) in order to prevent things from getting too crazy by stacking this with the sorcerer version of the bloodline.

They Fey bloodline suffers from a flavor problem. How many fey creatures really use strength? Maybe this bloodline should get a bonus to dexterity while raging either in addition to or instead of strength?


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Bobson wrote:
I'm going to flip this around - Why should a kitsune be able to cast spells while in a fox shape? Normally, a Kitsune can wield weapons, but when shaped like a fox they can't. Why should a Kitsune fighter not be able to wield his sword while a fox?

Kitsune fighters actually benefit a lot from getting Fox Shape because it leads into the Vulpine Pounce feat. Sure, it isn't the same as wielding weapons, but it is something.

On the flip side, kitsune spellcasters don't really benefit much at all from having Fox Shape even though a lot of players want the feat at least for flavor purposes. It just seems odd considering that in the 'real life' legends kitsune were often far closer to being spellcasters than warriors.

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