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LazarX's page

Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber. FullStarFullStarFullStarFullStar Pathfinder Society GM. 35,714 posts (36,157 including aliases). 1 review. 1 list. No wishlists. 22 Pathfinder Society characters. 16 aliases.


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Grand Lodge

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thejeff wrote:
LazarX wrote:
Boomerang Nebula wrote:


Perhaps it is, or perhaps not. But we do know that Pathfinder magic is modelled/approximated by rules that are mathematical. We don't really understand how quantum physics works but we do know it can be accurately modelled with mathematics. I see more similarities than differences between the two systems.

Pathfinder magic is modeled to be part of a wargame simulation that has been having roleplaying layers bolted onto it for the last four decades.

The only theory that the design follows is gaming theory.

Yeah, the big problem with any scientific analysis of PF magic is that it very quickly leads to the discovery of spell levels and character levels and different character classes and the whole paraphernalia of game mechanics.

It's not just magic that's effected, it's the revelation that creatures and things move in quantum steps that break down into huge 5 foot stages. Try to imagine our world if quantum effects were that visible. :)

Grand Lodge

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Askanipsion wrote:

Wow I really want to love the Medium but I am so disappointed how the final version turned out.

Many of their class features specifically the ones dealing with Haunts will never get used.

Just because YOU may not use them, does not mean someone else won't.

Grand Lodge

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Faelyn wrote:
The only way I know to somehow get more than one flanking bonus would be Pack Flanking with your AnC/Familiar and then have tradition flanking positioning with another person. I do not believe that flanking bonuses would stack; however, I do not know any specific rule that states otherwise.

The approach is simple. You have the general rule on stacking bonuses. if the mechanic you use does not SPECIFICALLY call out an exception, the general rule applies. Which in this case means No, they do not stack.

Grand Lodge

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Scei wrote:


There's also a point in the text that says the ritual summons the eidolon to your "side." That begs the question of distance or not.

To me that seems to be the textbook definition of "adjacent space".

Grand Lodge

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Can you be a bit more specific? Especially on how you would get more than one flanking bonus?

The general rule is that bonuses of the same type do not stack. The only exceptions are dodge and untyped bonuses. Since flanking IS a type of bonus, multiple instances, however you're managing them, do not stack. You take the highest.

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EBay.

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Xellrael wrote:

I recently played a scenario which granted a permanent negative boon for failing a saving throw. My eidolon failed. The GM asked me to post here to find out if the negative boon actually stays with the eidolon.

I believe that an eidolon shouldn't be able to receive a negative boon because an eidolon shouldn't be able to receive a positive boon. There is too much room for abuse by effectively doubling some of the best boons. That is just my opinion, of course.

Please point me to any official rulings that you know of.

Thanks!

It's not the eidolon that's receiving a boon.. It's the Summoner who's been inflicted with a permanent modification on one of his class features. And yes, that's legit.

Grand Lodge

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Insain Dragoon wrote:


Even assuming you aren't confusing the term optimization for combat optimization, please tell me how it's a bad thing to be combat optimized? How does being good at winning fights make me a worse roleplayer? How does losing fights make me a better roleplayer? What does my combat ability have to do with all the skill points I shove into non-combat skills every level?

No one ever said it was. But you can usually tell the difference between the player who uses mechanics to build a roleplaying concept, and one who uses rationalization to justify a game-breaking build.

Grand Lodge

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You don't need to be "sold" on anything.

Golarion is a huge toolbox of stuff to build stories with. You don't have to use them all.

Take a look at any of the Pathfinder Tales novels. Generally they mention one or a couple of other gods. All the others might as well not exist.

As a GM decide what kind of narrative you want to build your campaign around and use the elements that fit. Golarion is intentionally built this way if you break the world down region by region.

Grand Lodge

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Boomerang Nebula wrote:
Gisher wrote:
The Blood War.

Thanks for the link.

Interesting, it gives a possible origin story for Asmodeus. It also matches up with my initial assumption of the contest being an unwinnable war for either side. Whilst Hell might be better organised, the Abyss has far greater numbers.

For YOUR game it certainly can. As far as Paizo canon goes, it's been stated by the devs that the last thing they wanted to do was repeat what Wizards had already done.

One of the changes they did in that way wss to make Asmodeus an out right diety.

Grand Lodge

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Boomerang Nebula wrote:
Those were not intended to be flippant questions. Some well renowned scientists have stated that the origin of the universe is not amenable to scientific inquiry because it can't be reproduced.

And for the most part those are scientists that are mired in an outmoded approach to science.

Cosmology is not looking to reproduce the Big Bang. What it's looking to do is to refine the present model in order to come up with the best possible scenario that predicts the universe we have today and give us a more refined idea on how it's going to evolve. We have used science to push back farther and farther in time to give us general models of what we think the universe was at a given date.

So far, we've got good approximations up to Zero Plus 10 the minus 40th power second.... the value of the Planck Constant. The current challenge is to push past that. And we may very well find out that doing so might require changing our ideas radically of the time before that point.

Grand Lodge

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Boomerang Nebula wrote:


Perhaps it is, or perhaps not. But we do know that Pathfinder magic is modelled/approximated by rules that are mathematical. We don't really understand how quantum physics works but we do know it can be accurately modelled with mathematics. I see more similarities than differences between the two systems.

Pathfinder magic is modeled to be part of a wargame simulation that has been having roleplaying layers bolted onto it for the last four decades.

The only theory that the design follows is gaming theory.

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Ghray wrote:

So I had a very interesting D&D session the other day. I host a game that has players currently in the Numeria campaign setting, but their original world is one of my own making called Verda. The main is an artifically intelligent robot called Scion who built a huge army of machines to conquer Verda in Numeria. Currently, Scion is using a small, temporary portal to pass between both worlds but is building a massive portal to link Verda and Numeria, so it bring its full army over.

The leaders of Verda has learned of Scions intentions thanks to the players and most are bringing their army to stop the construction of the portal. The players however have found a quick and dirty way of destroying the portal: essentially nuking it. There is a crystal, when overloaded, will detonate like a small nuclear warhead. (and yes, they know how it works due to other Numerian characters explaining it).

This is the delimma: the machine army is located inside a city of nearly 100 thousand lives. If they nuke it, virtuallu everyone dies, but the army and portal are stopped. If they dont, then the players need to find a way to stop Scion amd his army on Verda.

My players took 20 minutes, bouncing in and out character, decideding what action to take. Destroy an entire city for certain, killing 100 thousand people, or finding another way. They choose finding another way, but what would you do?

Some folks might get a kick out of playing Torchwood D20. If that was the kind of game I wanted, then I wouldn't allow a 3rd option.

But since that's not the kind of story I'm interested in. Nor am I interested in setting up some twisted idea of morality defined by Hobson's Choice. That means Heroes do what heroes do... and that is finding a third option that does not involve mass murder.

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Matthew Morris wrote:

Only thing that annoys me about the power is that it doesn't take into account what is thrown. Throw silver coins? Doesn't count as silver. Throw a vial of alchemist's fire? Well even though the vial broke from damage, it doesn't splash or do anything.

Most annoying.

That's the price of handwaving inventory. Also just handwaving silver coins would be an end run around the price of actually making silver weaponry.

Psychics really should not be basing their build around a zero level cantrip.

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My Self wrote:
LazarX wrote:
Boomerang Nebula wrote:
LazarX wrote:
darth_borehd wrote:

There is an argument that Pathfinder magic is just science with different rules.

Magic has elements of whim and arbitrariness which pretty much moves it out of the set laws of science.
Actually it makes it similar to quantum physics and chemistry.
Quantum Physics still has bounds defined by mathematics It's what makes doing science in it possible. Magic in literature and legend isn't bound by math or logic.
Except that in Pathfinder, it is bound by logic. Perhaps a different logic, but there's logic somewhere.

The logic that Pathfinder uses is story based, not mathmatic, and frequently not consistent. Some of the legacy stuff such as the material components of lightning bolt and fireball are simply humor pieces carried over from AD+D. And some of it is symbolic.

The most important difference is that what magic does can't be produced on an assembly line by rote-trained labor with no magical talent. And much of the most mighty forms of magic can't be repeated at all. Pathfinder magic isn't bound by what players are allowed to in the rulebooks. There are magical effects that PC's can never duplicate. You can't make for instance a factory that produces Starstones on demand.

But more importantly, Magic produces answers without giving progression on questions to ask. Magic is and endall to development, rather than something that spurs an innovator to a further path of improvement.

Grand Lodge

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The rules only give support for one move action used to gather power.

Otherwise the progression is as follows.

! move action of gather power to save 1 pt.

1 full round action of gather power to save 2

1 full round action plus one move action of the next turn of gather power to save 3 which is the maximum amount of gathering supported by rules text.

There is a difference between 1 full round action and 2 move actions. If the full round action is interrupted, you lose the full round of activity.

Grand Lodge

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Boomerang Nebula wrote:
LazarX wrote:
darth_borehd wrote:

There is an argument that Pathfinder magic is just science with different rules.

Magic has elements of whim and arbitrariness which pretty much moves it out of the set laws of science.
Actually it makes it similar to quantum physics and chemistry.

Quantum Physics still has bounds defined by mathematics It's what makes doing science in it possible. Magic in literature and legend isn't bound by math or logic.

Grand Lodge

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darth_borehd wrote:

There is an argument that Pathfinder magic is just science with different rules.

Magic has elements of whim and arbitrariness which pretty much moves it out of the set laws of science.

Grand Lodge

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Mark Hoover wrote:
I don't want to get my old school card revoked

I'd be happy to burn mine in public. Back in the old days, I loved AD+D so much, I took a ten year leave of absence from it, and played RPGs that had nothing to do with TSR.

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ComicViolence wrote:
Thanks guys. ... also I don't know how to use a Spoiler Tag :-(

When ever you post take a look at the bottom of that window... There's that helpful "How to format your text" with the Show button next to it. It's got all the power tricks to posting you'll ever need.

Grand Lodge

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Nohwear wrote:
I have this basic idea for a world where nothing can be permanently changed without magic. Does anyone have any ideas of how use it with Pathfinder? Preferably without relying on 3PP, just hand waiving, or completely nurfing martial.

What does that mean? You can't chop a tree, take a bite out of a sandwich, or or pass your crap without magic? after all those are all permanent changes.

Whenever you make broad predicates like these, you must codify them.

Grand Lodge

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This thread makes me want to look up all those old SNL skits of Unfrozen Caveman Lawyer.

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And you're expecting this to sell at what price????

I don't want my setting books mixed with APs, even though I buy both. If I'm running an adventure, I certatinly don't want to be running back and forth through a hardback to reference an encounter.

These are two different kind of products best kept separate.

Grand Lodge

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Wildfire142 wrote:
Apart from the Inner Sea Guide and Inner Sea Gods what four other books do people consider essential to run games set in Golarion?

If you're running printed PFS scenarios or AP, they pretty much have all the information that's needed. You only need the books for building your own.

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Kirth Gersen wrote:

So far in this thread, food allergies are the only actual danger that's been presented. The rest as been hyperbole, hand-wringing, and outright fantasy (dissolving tomatoes decimating our food supply, for example). So, of all these other deadly dangers we should be cognizant of, please be so good as to enumerate a few of them.

You'll find me to be easy to convince by presenting actual evidence, but not at all by calling names and hurling accusations.

If food allergies were the only concern. (they're not has shown previously), that would be enough. Food Allergies can KILL.

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SmiloDan wrote:

Um. Maybe you should study some basic anthropology. Modern humans have been around for tens of thousands of years. It also takes a lot of intelligence to survive in pre-agrarian societies.

What you are proposing is borderline racist. Just a kindly warning.

Neolithic man was smart enough to make beer.

From what we can tell the true tipping point was not an enlargement of brain size. (Neanderthal man's was larger than those of modern Humans), but the sudden explosive development of language.

Grand Lodge

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Damon Griffin wrote:

Registering my guess, with no supporting evidence, regarding Hank Henshaw:

Some people have speculated Henshaw may be the Martian Manhunter, on the strength of nothing more than a flash of red eyes and a comment that he "used to" have a family.

In the comics, Hank Henshaw became the Cyborg Superman after his human body was disintegrated by radiation; he beamed his mind into the birthing matrix that carried Superman from Krypton to Earth as an infant and constructed a cyborg body in the image of Superman. I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that Kara's ship, which we know the DEO has on hand, was at some point involved in transforming Director Henshaw into a not-fully-human form.

Note that this is from a no-longer canon continuity in which Kryptonians aren't naturally born, and Kal-El was shipped off planet as a developing fetus, rather than a young child.

Grand Lodge

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Jacob Saltband wrote:
Damon Griffin wrote:

Registering my guess, with no supporting evidence, regarding Hank Henshaw:

Some people have speculated Henshaw may be the Martian Manhunter, on the strength of nothing more than a flash of red eyes and a comment that he "used to" have a family.

In the comics, Hank Henshaw became the Cyborg Superman after his human body was disintegrated by radiation; he beamed his mind into the birthing matrix that carried Superman from Krypton to Earth as an infant and constructed a cyborg body in the image of Superman. I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that Kara's ship, which we know the DEO has on hand, was at some point involved in transforming Director Henshaw into a not-fully-human form.

So in the comics was Henshaw a telepath? That was the impression I got from the lastest episode.

He's the Cyborg Superman... able to integrate with any piece of technology. He was one of the four would be replacements when Superman was killed by Doomsday.

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GM_Beernorg wrote:
Well, if they can sell Moby Dick as an action/adventure movie, then anything is possible I guess (am I the only one horrified by the turning of a literary classic into a mindless man vs. nature informed action flick?)

Considering that it was a well acted high production flick, you may not be the only one, but you're definitely in a minority.

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What I like about the site is the sheer web mastery that's displayed.

What I'm a lot less keen about is the attitude displayed and encouraged.There are enough Players with the attitude the self entitled attitude that they can dictate to their GMs without a support site encouraging them further.

Grand Lodge

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Caineach wrote:


That type of engineering is what I'm calling haphazard and reckless.
Why? Its being done in a controlled environment with lots of precautions taken.

Once the product is used out in the wild,any notions of a "controlled environment" go out the window.

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We have a roleplaying game whose elements include politics. They include religion. Religion was a hot enough topic in the game way back when, that TSR came up with the "bright" idea of appeasing the fundamentalists by coming up with godless clerics, in an idiot move to appease the parents who were going ape s+#~ on their precious child playing a Cleric of Apollo/Bahamut/Pelor. As well as taking out the two "D" classfications of devils and demons.

Paizo is making a further political statement by opening up characters outside of the so-called white "cis" norms. So politics is not avoidable. The discussion, which on the whole I think was rather productive on the long term about trans and lgbt characters in Golarion is an example of this. And I don't think that Paizo as a company is going to walk away from that topic.

On the whole I think the heated religion and political discussions here are a good thing. But there isn't a sword in anyone's back forcing them to click on the thread titles if they don't want to swim in the pool. But wanting to close the pool for others is rather selfish, I think.

And from what I've seen, the involvement of Paizo's staff in moderation hasn't slowed down the monthly deluge of new product.

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On a related segway, how many more genres are you planning to put into Golarion, region-limited, or not?

It seems sometimes that Golarion is turning into a version of "The Starlost"'s EarthShip Ark.

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Kirth Gersen wrote:
thejeff wrote:
Everything else being equal, the rice would certainly help, but it's not a panacea.
Is that a viable standard? GMOs are bad and evil and should be banned because, even though they certainly help, they're not a panacea? Because that's exactly what a number of people in the thread seem to be saying.

No it's a caution that because you've applied a topical treatment to one symptom of a problem, that there is a danger for mistaking it as a long term or comprehensive solution.

One example is Marijuana. It can be an important element in pain relief caused by the side effects of certain treatments. That doesn't eliminate the problems that careless use can cause.

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James Jacobs wrote:
LazarX wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
David Neilson wrote:
Silly question, do people dig up and burn coal in Golarion? Is mining in general influenced by the issue that if you go too deep you can break into a hostile underground world?

Yup; coal is used as a fuel in Golarion.

Mining is also influenced by the fact that you can break into the Darklands, but the lure of money is usually enough to take the risk.

If it's something that people dig up on the surface, wouldn't it be peat, the precursor to coal?

Nope. It's coal. There's also peat burning too, though.

Whenever folks ask questions like this, my first reaction is to go to Wikipedia and research the topic. For coal, it looks like we humans have been burning coal for THOUSANDS of years. Just burnign coal does not mean steam engines are "just around the corner."

But yeah... my general take is that if we humans have had something several thousand years, it sure as hell is a thing on Golarion.

And it's also worth noting that the first steam engine was built by Hero in the time of the Ancient Greeks, but it was ridiculed as being good for nothing more than a toy that could do nothing that slaves couldn't do better and cheaper. Progress can be easily sidelined by cultural bias... or historical upheavals that bring down a culture before it's inventions can spread or progress.

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Kalindlara wrote:


From what I recall, it wasn't just about diversity of vegetables. The potatoes themselves had become a genetic monoculture as well.

That's essentially the textbook definition of a lack of biodiversity.

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Jean-Paul Sartre, Intrnet Troll wrote:
More on trolleys

ABSOLUTE FREEDOM!

Grand Lodge

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Irontruth wrote:
Kirth Gersen wrote:
Hmmm. I've spent a fair amount of time in Toronto and had no problems with either cars or bicycles there, either. It may be that the U.S. is simply far less pedestrian-friendly a place for some reason (maybe because Canada is covered in snow for seemingly 2/3 of the year)? In that respect, Oslo would likely be more similar to GTO than to Houston, or so I'd think.

The US is extremely bike-unfriendly, which helps worsen cyclist behavior.

In NYC from 2007 to 2010, there was a 15% decline in pedestrian-cyclist injuries requiring medical attention (4 deaths from 2006-2013), but there was a 50% increase in cycling activity. This is the same period when the city starting making more bike lanes.

In comparison, pedestrians account for roughly 14% of motor vehicle deaths every year in the US. That's about 4,000 every year, or roughly 12 a day.

During the period of 1996 to 2005, there were 11 deaths in NYC, but that number seems to have declined.

Edited, found some better numbers.

The NYC Citibike program was recently extended to Jersey City. Not knowing when I was going to fix my bike, I took advantage of an early bird membership. At the same time many of our one way streets have received bike lanes.

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Grey Lensman wrote:
Krensky wrote:

I'll just leave this here...

Golden Rice

I consider this the litmus test on how reactionary one's GMO stance is.

It's a complicated issue, Yes the rice is Vitman A enriched, and Vitamin A deficiency is a major health issue in places where the rice is being implemented. How much of it is absorbed by the body? Is it wise to hang nutrition on on one food as opposed to trying to develop a variety of foods growable in the region?

What is the impact on biodiversity in agriculture from using golden rice? One might remember that a lack of biodiversity was the direct cause of the Irish potato famine.

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Krensky wrote:
Yes, by all means, let's celebrate violent, destructive, futile acts by people opposed to advancing technology because it imperils their interests.

Nice way to ignore the fact that these were people defending their livelihoods in an age without safety nets for folks that were soon to be put on the not-working list.

I'm pretty sure that if you were told that your job was going to be taken away, and you didn't have things like unemployment insurance or any other piece of the modern social safety net, you'd be as the Brits would say... "somewhat annoyed".

Yes, the Luddites acts are worth celebrating, because everything that Labor ever got from management, it wasn't from just asking politely. It involved struggle, and frequently, blood.

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GM Rednal wrote:

400,000 GP, please. That would be the equivalent price of a +20 enhancement bonus, minus half because it doesn't add to your damage, only your chance to hit.

On the other hand since it isn't an enhancement bonus it stacks with the enhancement bonus your weapons may have, so that balances things out a bit the other way.

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thejeff wrote:
LazarX wrote:
And if you understood WHY and WHO the Luddites actually were, you'll see that I don't count the name as the insult you intended it to be.

Yeah, basically the Luddites saw the problem correctly, but didn't have a good solution.

By definition, they really couldn't have a good solution. That as you note, would be a matter of externally imposed reforms, which as one might observe were fought against tooth and nail by the corporate magnates.

Pretty much all the Luddites could do was prove that they weren't going to be quietly swept under the rug without a fight.

And frequently when progress is made by the labor movement, it starts with hopeless battles like these.

Grand Lodge

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Krensky wrote:
Thank you for proving my point.

Which was?

Grand Lodge

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blackbloodtroll wrote:
What is known?

Qualify your question. If the rest of the question is ... by the average Yokel Joe, the answer is little to nothing, and most of what he "knows' is most likely wrong. Not even the Pathfinder Society knows that much of the details.

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Deighton Thrane wrote:
Also, to expand on what LazarX mentioned, or maybe correct it, the gate linking Golarion and Castrovel isn`t technically Elven.

They do have monopoly control over the gates... and they intend to keep it that way.

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Yakman wrote:
James Sutter wrote:
On the subject of whether elves are from Golarion or Castrovel: I find it's really fun to have it be ambiguous. There's some pretty strong circumstantial evidence that they're from Castrovel, but on page 10 of Distant Worlds, we deliberately say that nobody *really* knows which planet they evolved on, and that there's a certain amount of planetary pride at play. I love the idea of Golarion's elves—who many races see as snooty—rankling at being viewed as "provincials" by the elves of Sovyrian. :)

I guess I never caught that.

I always assumed that they were from Golarion and found the portals to Castrovel.

I had read both pieces of material which why I did not put anything on my posts about the elves being FROM Castrovel. As it's stated, the actual origin details are in dispute. It's something long ago even by elven reckoning.

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Krensky wrote:
LazarX wrote:
CBDunkerson wrote:


Yes, companies are using GMO technology to increase profits... e.g. making pesticide resistant plants rather than plants which have inherent insecticide properties. However, that doesn't change the fact that GMO could be used to develop these improvements. Ergo, protests should be aimed at corporate misbehavior, not a potentially beneficial technology.

I could use a chain saw for a haircut, that doesn't mean that it's the appropriate or safe tool for the job. I don't have enough of the background to say whether GMO's have a possible benefit. But quite frankly, the issue is with the GMO's as they exist now, and how they are implemented NOW. If these things can be some super panacea, than why hasn't Monsanto done so, of if they can't or won't, why hasn't some compeititor undercut Monsanto by DOING so?
Anti-science catastrophizing by luddites who don't know what they're commenting on but, God bless them, they're going to keep raising a ruckus because of their feels.

No, I don't claim to be an expert on GMO's, but a lot of people who DO have the scientific credentials, are raising questions and issues that are not being answered by Monsanto. And given the similar history that we've had with the tobacco companies, who like Exxon, DID know the truth but hid it anyway, you may forgive my well-earned skepticism about Monsanto's benevolence, and my reluctance to blindly trust their products.

And if you understood WHY and WHO the Luddites actually were, you'll see that I don't count the name as the insult you intended it to be.

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Reebo Kesh wrote:
Next February I'm moving to the U.S.

Did they warn you about the ebola?

But you need to be more specific about your questions. Such as what kind of work you're looking for. And your preferred environment. And yes, generally the better places are going to be rather painful in rents.

I live in the Hudson County, NJ area, one walk and a Path ride to the City.

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CBDunkerson wrote:


Yes, companies are using GMO technology to increase profits... e.g. making pesticide resistant plants rather than plants which have inherent insecticide properties. However, that doesn't change the fact that GMO could be used to develop these improvements. Ergo, protests should be aimed at corporate misbehavior, not a potentially beneficial technology.

I could use a chain saw for a haircut, that doesn't mean that it's the appropriate or safe tool for the job. I don't have enough of the background to say whether GMO's have a possible benefit. But quite frankly, the issue is with the GMO's as they exist now, and how they are implemented NOW. If these things can be some super panacea, than why hasn't Monsanto done so, of if they can't or won't, why hasn't some compeititor undercut Monsanto by DOING so?

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Todd Stewart wrote:
GMO technology allows us to better serve public health, reduce food waste, increase crop yield per acre, use less fossil fuels, reduce pesticide runoff, reduce herbicide runoff, reduce bacterial contamination of food, and increase crop efficiency. Somehow this is bad, "not natural", or a giant conspiracy between corporations and scientists to poison people, just like vaccines and chemtrails

I've also heard the same sort of claims from scientists that were hired by the tobacco industry about cigarettes. The increase in crop yield is questionable compared to sustainable non-GMO techniques.

The main purpose of marketing GMO seeds to farmers is to encourage increased use of herbicides, also coincidentally enough, marketed by Monsanto. So what we have are increasing levels of toxicity in our food. This has led to an increase in food allergies, including some very toxic ones in some cases.

Also in the same way that over use of antibiotics is leading to resistant super bacteria, the increased use of herbicides because of GMO plants will lead to herbicide reistant weeds as well.

Reducing Food Waste? Perhaps you missed John Oliver's excellent video on the subject. Food waste hasn't been reduced, it's continuing to skyrocket.

The reason GMO's are considered bad is that the only positive effect that they seem to generate is increased profit for companies like Monsanto. Profits that come at the cost of a lot of collateral harm to farms, the environment, and the consumers.

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