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I think the best caster/archer in the game is fighter1/wizard5/EK10. I've played it myself and it's really excellent at all levels relying on how OP archery is for the first few levels and then leaning more into magic to buff up and compensate for missing stuff later. You end up with 9th levels spells. You can even dip 4 of AA at some point so you can drop the anti magic shell cheese on casters.
can full attack anything in a 45' wide circle
So you mean 20' reach? Yeah it's not hard. You can build an abberant bloodrager who gains 5' reach at 4th along with access to enlarge person and long arm. At 4th level you can have a 20'reach with just that since they all stack which means a 40' reach with a reach weapon and later a 50' reach with lunge.
Froth Maw wrote:
TWF itself is mechanically deficient due to requiring more resources for an inferior product. I can't build a good playable TWF ranger that I'm happy with, but I can build extremely playable 2h rangers no problem. It really requires looking hard at your ranger style options, I like Gorums best.
Any class built with a pounce mechanic (without giving up too much) plays drastically better than a character without that mechanic. You can build without pounce, but you're doomed to spend half your time without something to do but move.
You can design around it by taking the cleave feats and hurtful, invoking more than one attack after moving via those mechanics. That ends up being just fine. There are just some classes where it's harder to do than others.
Optimizing hurtful really means waiting for cornugan smash at level 6/7 on a full BAB class. Anything sooner and you're blowing more feats for a more questionable applicability (immunity to non lethal). Also, the progression of your intimidate bonus slowly outpaces the target number by .5 per level, so the longer you wait to bring it online the less feats/traits you need to blow pumping intimidate for a certain roll.
In every AP I've run in as a player the GM applies a minimum of the advanced template to all creatures and buffs up the big guys even more, he then removes loot from the APs to the point where we never make WBL and the adventures still become obscenely easy after a certain point. The system really loses its luster in later levels, but you can stall that breaking point a bit by not having as much loot to buy the OP items as quickly.
London Duke wrote:
Actually your natural reach with longarm and lunge is 15', your reach weapon doubles your natural reach, so you can hit 30'. If you enlarge person your natural reach in this setup would go to 20' and reach to 40'.
So I've always assumed these two work together nicely, but now that I read closer it appears that heroic echo only works with spells, SLAs and magic items.
Bardic performance is a supernatural ability. Do those stack? If not does the shared buff ability bypass the requirement? How are people using heroic echo?
I'm trying to figure if it's worth having the eldritch heritage line for this bloodline.
I just looked at that build.
First of all, the familiar still gets all the saves and whatnot, still pretty flatly better than one bonus spell from an item considering what valet familiar and lookout get a diviner, that's not considering the tremendous boon a faerie dragon is if you snag improved familiar later.
I mean, in my opinion, +4 initiative and double craft speed is worth way more than one spell a day.
Secondly, how are you building a melee reach EK without mentioning combat reflexes?
Third, how are you telling him to take arcane archer when you laid out his feats and none of them included any of the three archery feats required to get into the class?
The "third character" build made no sense, took additional traits with other vital feats missing.
Savage Dirty Tricks is a perfectly ideal rage power if you're stacking bull totem on an amplified rage skald. The save is strength based and you get to stagger/daze nauseate someone once a round. This gives you a good amount of control for a melee character. Sadly none of those conditions actually makes the target easier to hit. I know in my build I'm looking at hurtful/cornugan smash though, so the loss of an attack each round isn't quite as bad.
Reckless Rage is (IMO) terrible, you invest a feat that is power attack without the scaling. I'd much rather have Harmonic Spell, lingering performance or invest in a measterpiece.
Paizo FAQ 2015 wrote:
Wow, so that now brings up a whole bag of worms. If all my moral effects are increased via courageous weapon property and the -2 AC is a morale bonus, can I negate the penalty and even eventually get a +1 AC if my +4 courageous/furious weapon is in use? Probably no, they'd say you don't get bonuses to morale effects, just morale bonuses.
Another thing that's kind of tempting me here is to access shield other and use share spell to have my familiar cast it on me, so he is the one taking half the damage, this could essentially double the effect of our fast healing.
Is it possible to share spell with the Tales of Twisting Steel masterpiece?
Absolutely agree, if you're in a wide open campaign the flying mount works out much better, and it works directly against snapshot. For my own purposes I know that snapshot will produce a higher DPR, and has an incredible cool factor when you're getting rushed by a lot of smaller minions.
I also have been playing the sylvanite EK archer, and I think they do the flying mount better. I'll be able to craft my own flying carpet which my familiar will fly for me, which essentially means my flying mount costs me nothing but a bit of gold instead of two feats. Casters get nice things again, film at 11.
I think if you play the griffon mounted ranger you need to shuffle the feats to your advantage. You have to take monsterous mount with your second level ranger feat because you don't qualify for it otherwise (removal of your animal bond feature). Monsterous mount mastery is a horrible 6th level feat when you're free to select Improved Precise Shot instead. Monsterous Mount Mastery is open to you on your normal 7th level feat and does no good to you prior to that since you need 7th character level to use the ability anyway.
Also, the griffon is only your level -1, so no need for boon companion there, very little return on investment from that feat.
I might be tempted to take mounted combat to protect your griffon a little better, and at that point I'd probably consider taking mounted archery later in the campaign if I find double moving to be useful. Remember the maps you play on are extremely tiny, you will have trouble getting off a double move on a griffon that doesnt break the map.
I'd build like this:
Ranger1 PBS, Precise
The whole concept of my snapshot archer is to replace the need for a switch hitter or melee ranger entirely. Archery is so vastly superior to either of those builds it's not really a choice once you see what archery is capable of. You're right to say the mounted builds need a segment. I'll add it after you guys give some feedback and we hash out what works.
I'd say the griffon mounted archer is vastly superior to the normal mounted archer. If you HAVE to play a mounted archer without a griffon/flight then yes, drop weapon focus last, but combat reflexes/snapshot/improved snapshot are immediate drops for anything else you like. Take manyshot sooner, and boon companion as soon as you like. Mounted combat is okay if you're taking return fire a lot and want to protect your mount.
So as near as I can figure the rules, it seems that if you choose to channel positive energy with rulership it means you either heal people with it or use it to harm undead, at which point you get the one round daze ability.
I'm building a cleric for mummies mask for a first time player, and I am not sure I need both, but since the saves are the same I'm not really certain I need the variant channel if I'm going to take turn undead. Does anyone have any experience with these abilities who can give me their take on which worked out better? I've read that turn undead isn't worth it.
Once the material is posted to the web I'll be happy to touch up the guide.
Grokk, I don't think it's worth it for my own purposes. Half the campaign occurs in a location where I can't be on my mount, so blowing a feat on it seems wrong to me when I have other pressing feats to take.
Edit: I think the only things I would really update are the value of the Erastil trait (old deadeye?) for the ability to completely ignore the first person in the way of your shot (ghetto IPS, and slightly better), and the bow you attune to a party member to ignore them for cover purposes. I'd probably also add the greater hat of disguise which I missed the first time around for all day small status (+2 to hit at no damage cost) and it's additional darkvision and scent capabilities to couple with pheromone arrows.
Beyond that, it's still mostly the same feats we're after. Not much new to include. After poking around online the ranged tactics toolbox appears to be more fluff than anything and doesn't add much of value. I'll see when it becomes available though.
At this point, I'd recommend a greater hat of disguise for all day small status which will net you a +2 to hit, scent for pheromone arrows, and dark vision to make up for being human as well as letting you ride a medium mount.
Give up snapshot/improved snapshot if you're going for the flying mount, you won't spend as much time in the thick of things to justify it.
On the other hand, the early entry EK archer can have a familiar who can pilot a small flying carpet for your archer. This is a far cheaper way to get a flying mount IMO and the EK archer is more relevant later on in the campaign (IMO).
Wow, so many experts showing up to explain why this guy is terrible. Too bad they're not contributing to the conversation.
After some consideration if you want to replicate the movement and firing you'd need to go mobile fighter. You can get a full move off and take a full attack action for the cost of your first shot after 11th. Mobility isn't typically needed as much for archers, but if you're trying to replicate the mobility this might be best.
If you were okay with a mount then there are a ton of ways to get that done, and you don't need to invest any feats into mounted archery. Mounted archery in PF is pretty OP.
I still think the sohei/fighter I posted above is best for rate of fire though, and if you were getting to level 19 you could have both the sohei rate of fire coupled with the mobile fighters mobility. Technically stacking weapon training on top of the mobile fighters weapon training replacement ability is possible too.
Your example is a flat 10% lower chance to hit, shooting 25% more often. Thank you for agreeing with me and illustrating my point :-)
Also, obviously my fighter levels can be archer fighter levels as well. No loss of functionality there. The archer fighter can't use gloves of dueling, but the sohei can, this makes up for much of the lost attack progression. I can't see the drawback to diversifying.
Never take mounted combat feats for archery, they're terrible and don't justify the loss of the feat.
The only thing this guy is doing is putting a lot of arrows in the air. A Sohei archer can technically stack flurry with rapid shot and multishot to get the greatest number arrows out. I don't even think the sohei mounted combat feats replace the monk feat list, just augment them.
The only other thing you can do to fire more arrows is take the improved snapshot like with combat reflexes, but it's hard to afford on the monk feat budget.
The monk has a jump off at 8th when he gets his second flurry attack, waiting out the third at 15th is probably not worth it. I would say you stack any full BAB type after that (fighter being obvious to make up for a lack of feats). Optionally take a level of empyrial sorcerer and go eldritch knight (assuming you build in an early entry for it) for the buffs and a couple extra feats.
Monk1 PBS, Combat Reflexes, Precise Shot
We have an ongoing campaign consisting of an alchemist (with trapfinding from the campaign trait), a deathless barbarian and a conjurer wizard. We've got a melee paladin who has been spotty on attendance due to real life issues.
I'm looking for a setup that a new player can get into. My initial thought is a generalist cleric (we do not ask our clerics to heal in combat, we don't need it and we don't want to burden a player with a forced role). I feel the ability to full cast, get up into melee and participate in the campaign discussion with some diplomacy will be a solid start to PF. The benefits of a cleric on a campaign focused on undead are pretty obvious.
Any suggestions on a character and build?
The problem with most OP builds is they take no defense into account. Why not be invincible? The Deathless Barbarian build has been all over the boards for some time, I'm playing it in my current AP and it's really great. The ability to wade into the enemy completely surrounded and come out of it with no injury is really astounding. Not caring about AC is tremendous.
1 Barbarian1 Power Attack, Endurance
TWF is really horrible, you only get the benefit of this massive feat investment when you full attack. You won't be full attacking all the time, and maybe not even most of the time. Don't waste your time on that.
You can DPR calculate TWF any way you like it, but in a real AP where you have to move and attack all the time it's horrible, and even when you get to use it it's at a penalty.
On the other hand a thug/scout rogue with a big two hander, hurtful, cleave and surprise follow through has nicely invested his feats into places that compliment his abilities. Building for the worst case scenario of moving and then attacking, while still getting multiple attacks off is pretty awesome.
Fighter1 Power Attack, Cleave, Hurtful
First attack of the round:
Even without cleaving he's got a good chance of attacking twice due to hurtful.
I would say cleave becomes his primary method of attack. In later levels, with Escape Route and a valet familiar he's getting no attacks of opportunity triggered by movement, which is of great benefit to him.
Ranged rogue is by far better off simply buying a goz mask and getting a familiar to drop smoke sticks for him, or using a wand with obscuring mist on it. Any other method of obtaining range sneak attack for a rogue has a lot of feats associated with it and rely on dazzling display.
Also, grease doesn't deny anyone their dex.
I think this is where having NPCs really helps, where you can sum up the situation the players face and give them their options without going outside of the game too much. As you help them along they'll begin to think more for themselves, but the story elements can be difficult to tie together for players sometimes.
Yes, it's horrible when your players have a sense of direction with their characters and understand what it's going to take to make them effective. Wanting to play a person who is amazing with a whip, coupled with planning to take whip mastery and improved whip mastery so they can actually deal damage is totally game breaking.
On top of that, it's likely the player will want a whip. I mean, what the heck is that player thinking? He should totally give up his ideas.
(...) Pretty sure the DM is already going to be unhappy with the raw damage I will be putting out without the added fun of dazing anything I don't kill outright.(...)
Then your DM really wont like a standard barbarian or just about any archer, since they do more damage in a given AP adventuring day. The only thing that makes the evoker so good is the ability to tie control to that limited damage, it makes them really excellent IMO.