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Thinking of making a 'likeness' of him for an BBEG in my homebrew. LvL 20, I like the idea of a dark god/caster that can actually fight hand to hand. The summoning of evil monsters and the huge skeletal hands and that um...pez dispenser fatality in MKX is so dark and yet cool.
Anyways...looking for advice...have a nice day.
Humans are roughly only 1/5th of the total population of humanoid 'aka' PC races, instead of around 95-98% ish as presented.
There is still no canonically good drow, but born drow doesn't mean guaranteed evil either. (a predisposition to acting like an a-hole sure...but so are their paler cousins.)
Lesser racism, except for places like Cheliax and Taldor.
Yeah, letting players constantly switch into new characters can be a serious struggle, especially if they are just trying to avoid the Raise Dead penalty. I haven't dealt with it as a GM yet, but my f2f GM imposes a minimum -1 starting level penalty for making a new character (i.e., 1 level behind the rest of the party).
Yeah I'm sure she will like this idea as she has had some bad luck in APs.
Can't do raise dead cause none of us have the material components or gp to substitute for it. She finished the last session playing Haleen, (Summoner in our party has the trait involving her and has leadership) but she wants a character of her own.
As far as where we are, we just finished talking with the Azer guy. Getting him his dang crystals is what brought the death on to begin with. And the session ended with meeting Neshari on the coast of the island.
So our druid got pulled down by a swarm of ghasts when everyone realized they were standing in an anti magic field and her wild shape wouldn't work so....she wants to make a new character but what would fit story wise for the new pc? She is leaning between one of the genie kin races, and we are all at level ten right now. But wouldn't that character be thousands of years old?
Already lost the NPC Rayhan to a dragon turtle.
I FINALLY Finished:
Set 2 with Beast Rider Cavalier Order of the Tome, Oracle of Flames Blackened Curse, Summoner, Gravewalker Witch, Exarch Inquisitor, Soulforger Magus, Wrath Sin Specialist Wizard, Stonelord Paladin, Trophy Hunter Ranger,Thug Rogue, Tattooed Sorcerer, Gun Tank Gunslinger, and Grenadier Alchemist
Shelyn more then likely. I am an artist. I do tend toward NG. Or at least doing what I feel is right, in the moment. I like sharing and helping others get better at artwork if I can. And as a um...not good looking fellow when my ego is being honest I can appreciate inner beauty in others over the outer stuff.
There really isn't a race though under 20 RP that's any more powerful than a standard race (the most powerful across the board race IS a standard race after all.) , and the star system in ISR isn't really that good of a power estimate either. Trox do edge above the average race and early on are going to be great until class abilities and BAB catch up. Maybe allow them to switch a class ability for a race ability or something if they really want to play one. The half-trox compromise isn't to bad either.
Jessica Price wrote:
I'm a history buff too, which is probably why I'm so jaded and slightly misanthropic.
Anyway I'll try to back off on the anti-human and focus more the pro everything else.
I was fine with and enjoyed the coverage of the human ethnicities. If I have any complaints it's that we didn't get more treatment of the existing non-human ethnicities. It would have been nice if the Ekujae Elves, or the Pahmet dwarves, got there own two page or something entries. Also didn't really much care for the amount of space being spent on half-races, which don't have their own culture and tended to end up being a bit repetitive because of that.
Well to me it'd of been so much better if they had 2 pages of human coverage, and then spread the 62 pages ethnicity stuff over EVERY race in the Inner Sea. But in that light the Ekujae Elves and Pahmet dwarves should get coverage too, if that much detail is going to be locked to one race that already has everything.
Well I'll admit, in this context 'need' and 'want' are interchangeable.
They do get a lot of attention, and that's why there are people clamoring to see them less, and the other races get a chance at the spotlight, as it is, humans get the sun while halflings, dwarves, and elves, and half races are equivalently in a basement with one 40 watt bulb flickering on and off. That's not to even compare the other non core races. I see the point on Trek and Wars, but thriving and dominating EVERYTHING are two different things. The human populace of the Federation doesn't own 95%+ of the known galaxy for example.
In that you are right I should lay off the 'monkey' stuff. But I have heard people on these forums bash 'xfolk race' or ban this race, ban that race it's overpowered, it's a furry ewww, or Paizo should kill off 'x' race. (That one got deleted though as I can't find it anymore.) To me personally humans are boring, the same way I personally find Superman boring, they get it all, best at everything, no real believable threats,(Worldwound maybe?) Etc. The only thing it seems that keeps humans from being 100% on Golarion is other humans. (Which is generally the generic fluff of Orcs in Fantasy, if they ever united yada yada unstoppable, but the inverse is more truthful.) If presented as a united front there isn't a place unconquerable on the map, Kyonin (Elf), 5 Kings Mountains (Dwarf), Hold of Belkzen (Orc), none of those places could possibly hold out.
And speaking of Elves, as example I guarantee you story wise it won't be an elf that takes out a big bad like Treerazer, it'll be a human with a special sword that after the big bad has slaughtered all the 'helpless' elves will 'bop' the monster and big bad is dead. Hooray the human. The only non-human, major protagonist in a D&D or Pathfinder novel series was Tanis, Drizzt, and Varian Jeggare. (And admittedly Cattie Brie, Artemis and Wulfgar are all really well done human characters. The Dragonlance ones...eh...I don't hate them but I mean Fizban isn't really a human either.)
Draco Bahamut wrote:
And yet I've seen people get hammered because they want to play the counter culture. "Oh no Dwarves can't/shouldn't be Wizards or Sorcerers. They should only be Clerics or Fighters." Or "Halflings can only be rogues" cause god forbid someone wants to play an agile yet very angry short fella with a big axe.
That said, I'm with the person that would like to play the Ulfen Sylph, I'd welcome that character concept to my table.
If the ethnicities can/could be applied over all races in the books there might not be as much hate, and we do need a dog/wolf race and maybe a Lapine/Rabbit race. But that's neither here nor there.
The big problem with human-centric is many fold, 64 pages of hairless vanilla monkeys is a lot. When other races get 2 pages or less then a paragraph. Especially when humans have since the very beginning got 95% of the Pathfinder coverage. Then you look at what role humans play. 9/10 they are cannon fodder/monster food, or the mastermind BBEG. The 1 out of 10 humans are generally the named NPCs that either hand out quests or are speed bump villains. The PC human is generally in the minority of party composition for most gaming groups. (Our group only had one guy that even played the race.) Yet we are supposed to believe they are over 9 tenths of Golarion's humanoid population. So not only are they over saturated, but by and large just numbers alone they out number the races that are supposed to be the endless hordes like the orcs and goblins.
If they had those numbers then you have to look at either the breeding out of or given human nature the far more likely genocidal removal of every Elf, Dwarf, Gnome, all the way to the rarest of rare races within two generations. Humans are also stupidly overpowered/overly flexible in the mechanics of the game, with some of (if not across all classes) the best racial FC bonuses. A racial feat with more potential for abuse then even Leadership, and so many other annoy things.
So TLDR a lot of the hate of the human-centric stuff is the race is already getting the very best of the best, and yet they are generic, boring, oversaturated, over covered, and it feels like the race is really PUSHED on people whether they want them or not and those who play the game to ESCAPE being human in the real world.
Or for an even easier TLDR read this: http://horizonwalking.blogspot.com/2014/03/orthoss-observations-humans.html
"Devil's Advocate" wrote:
Yup the Racial Heritage feat and the fact the generally get an extra feat to burn anyway. Makes humans very strong and certainly an OP contender.
Lord Fyre wrote:
Yeah but heck other then Troxs and maybe Kasatha, and maybe just maybe Svirfneblin, the monstrous ones aren't any better then a stock human. So this to me is bunk. As far as advanced, you could argue Drow, but as long as it's not 'noble' it's not op.
I really don't think of aasimar and tiefling as advanced races.
People say it's the resistances but those people are wrong.
My best dressed character? Oh that's gotta be my Daz Bangfang
I mean that fur coat, both on him and the fur lined cloak of resistance and pants, rocking sandals, practical yet stylish belts, poofy entertainer's outfit, a gold leaf earring and a well made backpack. Not to mention those weapon cord accessories. And Raccoon > Parrot. :P
Golarion is a lot less humanocentric, like instead of 95% in a region it's more like 50% and the other 50% being other races. Except in deeply human ran/racist nations like Cheliax and Taldor.
As far as what's popped up in game that changes the world?
There is a dwarf wizard in command of all of Xin-Shalast, slowly making it a dwarf colony.
Not my fault most NPC populaces then are racist...speciesist?...But gnolls are a 'civilized' part of certain regions like Katapesh. So it's not like you would NEVER find one walking down a street. I have 3 in Pathfinder alone that I enjoy playing and they fit so well in to the party and story.
As far as mechanical brokenness of the human race? I've barked up that tree on other threads, tl;dr it's part of what Corvus said...among other things....racial heritage...*eye twitching*...best FC bonuses...
As far as Tieflings and Aasimars in the long game/campaign/ap are well balanced in comparison to a human. As long as I've played I've only seen one player in our group make a really powerful Tiefling, and she did it so the other people at the table would take her seriously. But even then what made her character terrifying could of been done with a human.
Under 20 ARG RPs the human race is king of the builds,book support and the cheese.
Lord Fyre wrote:
No! They should take the place of Halflings! Cause they are certainly cuter. ^-^ /jk
I do like Kobolds as well though, defiantly a top ten race in my book.
Alexander Augunas wrote:
Actually they are now and they came from. ARG:
Which is good as they should of never been a lvl adjustment race to begin with. (Of course if it was up to me they would of been a core race cause gnolls are awesome)
At least they aren't broken as hell like humans ^-^
Well can't speak too much on Golarion but I know Faerun had an entire race of dark skinned dwarves, called Gold Dwarves. I think they also had elves of varying skin colors and such. I really don't see why you can't make your character a certain skin tone if it fits what you want. Though it would be epic to have a 'modern' campaign with a dark skinned dwarf dressing and acting like Shaft or Mr. T.
Four pages for each human ethnicity? A considerable chuck of this book has lost its value to my group and I. Darn, I was really excited for this one. :/
Well like I said it's just best to take the ethnicity stuff and apply to other races as well. IMHO. I don't see a good argument against a Varisian Dwarf/Catfolk/Half-Orc/Kitsune, etc. If that's the culture around them.
Anyways, any idea when the book will be on store shelves in September?
Except it's not, not by a country mile. It neutered the class. And made it a generic. The con casting was true to an Orc fluff and something no other class did.
Just wanting to have fun, so I've seen plenty of Class this, Race that discussions so why not talk about the combo of the two. What's your favorites?
Mine in no particular order:
1. Catfolk - Inquisitor: Sure they have the penelty to Wis, but cat's are natural hunters, and who hasn't felt like their cat is judging them? I generally pop this out with Desna or Caydean as the deity as both make sense for the freedom and Cats=Chaos idea.
2. Kobold - Ninja: They are small, really sneaky, and love traps and sneak and stab. What's not to love? The fact they are generally adorable mini dragons helps too, vanishing trick, and tail terror feats make them fun as well. One of these days I'm going to build a Sweeper + Kusari-Gama trip build.
3. Gnoll - Paladin: Nothing says holy knight then a near seven foot tall creature normally known for eating people. Also lay on hands to people thinking a gnoll is about to eat them. It was hilarious.
4. Ratfolk - Gunslinger/Wizard: Because Skaven are awesome. If Spell Slinger was better...eh, I still like this, shooting and blasting people with lightning bolts and cloudkill...happy days.
5. Halfling - Cavalier (Order of the Paw): Tiny lancer of doom, with an adorable puppy as a mount. Bonus points if the riding dog can be a...Dire Corgi.
6. Dwarf Wizard -: I like them, Dwarves aren't normally thought of casters but this and Deep Earth Bloodline Sorcerers are so much fun. Dwarf Skald was very close to.
7. Half-Orc Monk: I also like Half-Orc Cleric, but even since 3.5 I've loved playing a big green and mean punching machine.
8. Kitsune Barbarian: Kitsunes are tricksters, kitsune have a str penalty, but you know what? A rabid angry fox to the face hurts. I had an Intimidate build and he was so cool.
9. Lizardfolk - Saurian Shaman: You know dinosaurs are awesome, this is also a class I like playing as a Kobold too, but Lizardfolk have the dino theme more to their side. And like the skaven analogy, Lizardman riding a Carnosaur. Oh yeah. Also fun to summon a T-Rex right onto a ship you are going to pirate...just saying.
10. Dhampir - Oracle of Life: Cause sometimes I like to throw common sense right out the window. Before the errata this would of been Orc-Scarred Witch Doctor, but oh well. This is still a fun build if a bit crazy. Have to get Life Dominate Soul though. Blood Drinker would be fun too if it wasn't considered evil.
(Oops I meant to put this in General Discussion not PFS, can someone move it please?)