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Kayerloth's page

Pathfinder Society Member. 1,027 posts. No reviews. No lists. No wishlists.


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LazarX wrote:
Kayerloth wrote:

per the CRB:

Rods are scepter-like devices that have unique magical powers and do not usually have charges. Anyone can use a rod.

But not every rod is useful for everyone. I.e. metamagic rods in the hands of non-casters.

He he

Yeah but define 'use'

1) Barbarian waves his Metamagic Rod at the orcs while telling them in no uncertain terms he will 'turn them into a less than pleasant smelling dung heap if they don't do as he says RIGHT NOW! (and rolls for intimidate). Nice prop there AM SMASH the wizard pretender.

2) Nothing really says that a Metamagic Rod is of less sturdy construction than the norm (though I do tend to picture them with more baubles). Could still be used as a weapon by the fighter trying to take on a skeleton when he finds himself without a bludgeoning weapon.

I.e. less useful may indeed be a more accurate statement.


Mathius wrote:
I agree on SLAs and items that cast the spell but not items that create a constant effect similar to spell. Like magic weapon on sword or true see goggles.

If I'm following you I agree I believe the intent is for it to function against an item that 'casts' the spell not generally for it to function against something continuously active. Spellbane isn't going to stop a +3 flaming burst sword from functioning the way it would in an AMF ... it might however prevent its wielder from using its special purpose power to activate (i.e cast/SLA/command word into effect) a fire shield on the user 1/day.

All that said your GM is going to be the finale arbitrator on the issue.

And then there is the current thread(s) running on about the duration of things like a Hat of Disguise or a Ring of Invisibility and this leads into how you view Spellbane working (or not) against these items because of how they generate their effects (if one is going to be consistent anyway).


First thing that comes to my mind is if the gang is into protection and such things could get more expensive for the PC's. Shops the PC's frequent could add a 'cost' to things the PC's want to either because they've been told to do so or because the shopkeepers are being forced to pay a bit more for dealing with the PC's, perhaps some of both or even find that their 'room' at the Inn is now over the manure pile in the stables despite costing the same the last time they stayed there.

Perhaps the PC's catch the shopkeepers glancing at a Wringer before deciding the desired item is more expensive.

Gather Information and Knowledge Local checks may be effected again either by costing a bit more or folks simple don't want to be associated with the PC's because ... .

Likewise friendly NPCs could find themselves paying a bit in blood for associating with the PCs


As long as this portion is also not a problem:

Quote:
The spell to be brought into effect by the contingency must be one that affects your person and be of a spell level no higher than one-third your caster level (rounded down, maximum 6th level).

I'm not currently knowledgeable enough to know if a Mythic version of a spell alters its effective level. If a Mythic Haste is still a 3rd level spell then it should be doable as long as you pay any associated costs as MurphysParadox has stated.


No, Spellbane is only going to stop Greater Dispel Magic, not a Wish being used to duplicate the effect, nor will it stop Dispel Magic, Miracle or Limited Wish.

I would allow it to stop a Greater Dispel Magic generated by a SLA of a creature or one generated by a magic item since this would be the case for Spell Immunity/Greater Spell Immunity.

Then again I'm not sure I would allow Spellbane into my campaign (especially as is) ... it bothers me, the duration specifically. It would definitely carry a 'warning label' that it may find itself subject to change or banning, use at ones own risk.


Note the interaction with Detect Scrying. At that point it ceases to be a 'trap' and becomes a 'blast'/attack spell since it has a standard action casting time. Note also that all divination(scry) spells create a magical sensor that may be detected by anyone particularly those with good perception skills. Skill/Perception monkey says "Hey wizard we are being spied on." And Wizard 'blasts' back with Scry Trap. Not how I think you are envisioning the spell being used/employed or is it?

I'd probably up the casting time unless you wish it to be used in response to being Scryed upon rather than as a protective measure against scrying. Sepia Snake Sigil, Fire Trap and Glyph of Warding all have casting times of 10 minutes. My Loremaster tended to have Detect Scrying up at all times by the time he was 10th or so. This is why/how you know someone is scrying on you ... solid perception skills and/or Detect Scrying.

A very interesting concept for a spell in any case.

Edit: I just noticed the post was brought back to life by its OP. Probably long since decided what the cast time was I guessing ...


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per the CRB:

Rods are scepter-like devices that have unique magical powers and do not usually have charges. Anyone can use a rod.

Physical Description: Rods weigh approximately 5 pounds. They range from 2 feet to 3 feet long and are usually made of iron or some other metal. (Many, as noted in their descriptions, can function as light maces or clubs due to their hardy construction.) These sturdy items have AC 9, 10 hit points, hardness 10, and a break DC of 27.

Is this what you are asking for?


As Lord Vukodlak pointed out some adventures/encounters will have higher amounts and others will have skimpy amounts. Do you feel your characters have solid wealth for their level or are they complaining about feeling a lack? If not then I wouldn't worry overly about adding more. It's always easier to add more down the road if you feel the group is in fact getting underpowered in terms of wealth.

That said logically any items that do survive need to have a reason for surviving. Inherently they should be able to survive being inundated by a flood of gold. An Ioun stone that is floating over the destruction for example.

Or add the wealth after the 'completion' but before the next adventure. If so few folks enter and leave the City alive then have a sage (with an appropriate specialty) or someone similar approach the party with an offer to trade their story for "treasure". 'Obviously' this individual doesn't want the knowledge spread around as that would lessen its value to them since they are in the business of selling their knowledge.


372 - Not my idea but see the thread titled Plot Seed: the Last Girl.


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Any particular level?

Mage's Magnificent Mansion and anything or way to produce it daily (ninja's!!!).

More mundanely several hirelings, and a pack animal or two to carry, transport and set up a nice large tent etc. and do step and fetch for him.

Cubic Gate with one side keyed to open to ones own demiplane and well stocked with tomes and other sagely materials.

Ring Gates one end located at his favorite eating/drinking spot the other end, of course, where ever he is (and who says you can have only one set).

An Instant Fortress only reworked to provide an Instant 'Tower of Lore'.

Hand of the Mage - never have to get up again to retrieve a book or cup of hot toddy or ring the servants bell.

Necklace of Adaptation - never have to smell the muck and mud again never mind all that other stuff about breathing in vacuums and underwater.


First I would decide how much of a tangent I'm willing to throw into the ongoing campaign/story. As you said the first hurdle is deciding what plane they have been flung to. Then based on that I would decide where I might send them. And I would decide ahead of time where I would and would not send the PC(s).

Things to remember. Prismatic Spray (and its Plane Shift effect) allows both SR and a Will save. Stopping it from working in the first place is a good idea. The easiest is Dimensional Anchor but that isn't on the Inquisitor or Druid lists. Its also totally random and therefore easy enough to simply fudge the result assuming you don't make all your rolls in front of the party. Don't want the hassle they don't go anywhere and just hit them with something else on the PS list.

Next assuming you don't want a major divergence send them some where 'friendly' not someplace where the environment and creatures are likely hostile. And not in the middle of nowhere but where a quick scouting the shifted character can see a settlement where they might bargain for help (or serve as a major landmark for their companions to zero in on) or both.

Sending, Scrying and Greater Scrying all work (potentially) across planes.

I'm thinking Transport via Plants is supposed to work only on the same plane (along the lines of Greater Teleport) but strictly speaking it says the range is unlimited and only that it must be between the same sort of plant. So find the right plant and the Druid may be able to Transport either to or from the party or shifted character.

The shifted character now gains the Extraplanar subtype (almost all the time anyway). This means, for instance, he may be Banished, Dismissed or be subject to Holy Word (or its alignment base variants) and get sent voluntarily or otherwise back to his 'home' plane.

The more you are willing to go sandbox and off whatever story line you are currently in the more obstacles and barriers can be thrown up or add in to the encounter.


The Bald Man wrote:

I don't think wishing the lava would work. GM would probably invoke the conjuration rules that require the material be summoned on something capable of supporting it.

Looking at the Teleport Object I see 2 flaws. 1 is that it teleports objects away from you. And second, at caster level 21 it is only about 7 cubic-feet of lava = 2' cube.

And, of course, as 20th level Gold Draconic Sorcerer is IMMUNE to fire.

Yes but breathing (i.e. suffocation) if submerged in hardening lava is going to be an issue, as is moving away while encased in lava/rock.


Very sweet, love it.

Young girls 'waking' to find themselves tied up in sacks tend to scream and thrash. Last Girls do the same but at very inconvenient moments.

I for one would not put anyone I didn't implicitly trust in a Bag of Holding or Haversack. Might find they cut a hole in it to escape. Mundane sacks are not generally tightly constructed, tend to have small holes (i.e. peep holes) in them and are not sound proof (see above).
Last Girls with access to Silent, Still and Eschew might see being tied up inside a mundane sack as a wonderful hidey-hole from which to work mischief with minimal suspicion.

I might extend the House demiplane to a more vague point beyond the actual walls of the House allowing for some creepy/dangerous areas outside the actual House (Kennels, Outhouse, log pile, tool shed, family plot/cemetary, *cough* Gazebo's :p).

I might have fun if the characters did have extradimensional items of giving the House the special property to link extradimensional spaces to some similar small space within the House. Open a side pocket on the Haversack and find not only your stuff in there but some very memorable stuff from a cabinet in the kitchen of the House. And yes go check the cabinet and find your stuff sitting in said cabinet ... that ought to cut down on putting things in the Haversack especially if 'something' starts rearranging the things in the cabinet.

Also demiplanes are extradimensional spaces. Placing extradimensional spaces within one another is risky strictly speaking often leading to one of the spaces being locked away at minimum ... though I think having the result above is more fun for this encounter idea.

CRB, bolding mine wrote:
Demiplanes: This catchall category covers all extradimensional spaces that function like planes but have measurable size and limited access. Other kinds of planes are theoretically infinite in size, but a demiplane might be only a few hundred feet across. There are countless demiplanes adrift in reality, and while most are connected to the Astral Plane and Ethereal Plane, some are cut off entirely from the transitive planes and can only be accessed by well-hidden portals or obscure magic spells.


Hmmm

Don't dump my Wis score (On the other hand the difference between an 8 and a 12 is +2). Take Iron Will and if it seems I'm getting thumped often anyway consider taking Improved Iron Will. And well if I am the cleric/oracle/wizard etc. etc. I am not going to twiddle my thumbs while the party fighter, rogue etc. go and get dominated etc.. I am going to buff and select spells that insure my companions and myself continue to operate effectively.


Melkiador wrote:
137ben wrote:
Trolls can't fly!
Sounds like an excellent idea for a subrace.

I had a friend for whom it became a bit of an inside joke for him to run into variant trolls no matter which character he might be on or which of his other friends might be the GM.

Vegetarian Trolls
Flying, Fire-breathing Trolls
Giant Trolls (long before such actually appeared in the MM/official game)
Trolls immune to fire and acid
And, of course, any and all new variants as soon as they were published. He truly learned to hate trolls of any sort even if well dressed, well spoken and very civilized :p.


All invisible things in the game tend to be less than perfect and subject to being seen whether they are magical sensors, a wizard's quasit familiar, or just a lurking creature using a potion or what not. The biggest difference is the DC to note the sensor is essentially static and therefore doesn't scale against a higher level party or monster as well.

Also why my arcane casters generally have Detect Scrying running as soon as the slot can be spared as well as See Invisibility on the asap list for permanency. And if I had reason to believe someone might be scrying me/the party then that slot is likely going to Detect Scrying very early.

I'd also think strongly about fooling the Witch by fooling a trusted (relatively anyway) subordinate. Presumably the subordinate is lower level, less magically protected and therefore easier to fool than the Witch herself. I also assume she is dangerous and risky to directly confront or we wouldn't be having this discussion.

To aid in defense against Commune and Contact type spells I'd also tend to appear in public in disguise as much as possible preferable using both mundane and magical means to do so. Seeming and Veil are a couple of longer lasting solutions to magical disguise.


GRRRRRrrrr I've managed to erase/delete my post twice now, irritating friggin touch pad.

Note:
Scrying/Greater Scrying does not 'target' the creature it creates an effect. That effect is a magical and mobile invisible sensor which can be seen (by anyone) with a successful Perception check Base DC = 20 + spell level.

I'm prone to saying that when a creature makes the Will save the sensor fails to be created.

CRB wrote:
Succeeding on a Saving Throw: A creature that successfully saves against a spell that has no obvious physical effects feels a hostile force or a tingle, but cannot deduce the exact nature of the attack. Likewise, if a creature's saving throw succeeds against a targeted spell, you sense that the spell has failed. You do not sense when creatures succeed on saves against effect and area spells.

And obviously if the sensor fails to be created that is definitely 'sensed' by the caster making the last line of the quote above somewhat contradictory.

The spell also fails if the target is deceased ... unless you want to go with the alternate of its zeroing in on the soul/spirit etc. I'd likely allow the caster to know the difference between spell failing to conform and someone making the Will save. You know it failed but you do not know why ... and some of the above counter-measures such as Screen and False Vision rather explicitly prevent you from even learning that much (and make the Will save a non-issue).


Scrying and or Greater Scrying on a deceased person what happens?

Fails is the simple answer though I do see room for table variation. The question being does one scry the physical body or the soul/spirit occupying the body, because the next issue that pops if you say the physical body is what happens when they are under the effect of a polymorph type spell and someone attempts to Scry them, etc, etc..

But anyway:

Start with Nondetection (1 hr/level)

Then add in Detect Scrying (24 hour duration) and be aware of any attempt to Scry you (or otherwise use divination(scrying) magic on you) ... and potentially see them and know the direction and distance to them. Keep a Dimension Door or similar teleportation magic handy and maybe make them regret Scrying you.

Consider using Secure Shelter + Private Sanctum as needed for group coverage in the field (or just Private Sanctum if the room/structure is already present). Though reading it now I'm not seeing a RAW reason to actually have a structure/room to use Private Sanctum on ...

False Vision (1 hr/level) - You get to state what any scryer actually sees within the area when scrying (as if Major Image).

Then we have Screen, Sequester and Mindblank. As RumpinRufus said stopping things like Commune and Contact are going to be tough as those spells depend a lot on GM fiat and the cleverness of the one doing the asking and are pretty much the way a clever party can deal with a foe using some of the tricks above. So I personally wouldn't be in a big hurry to convince anyone they didn't work to find someone protected by spells like Mindblank provided the line of questioning was appropriate in skirting around directly asking about "you".

Spell Immunity and Greater Spell Immunity work against Scrying and Greater Scrying as well (as appropriate).

Note that Find The Path works to get to a location. A person or creature is not a location and it does not work across planes. It also shows only the direct physical route ... Teleportation is not going to be a possible path regardless.


There's an absolutely huge number of Sorcerer/Wizard spells alone that'll boost their defense (some directly, some indirectly). Some that I commonly use on my arcane casters, staying under 5th level spells:

Mage Armor, Shield, Protection from *Alignment*
Invisibility, Mirror Image, Blur, See Invisibility, Glitterdust
Displacement, Fly, Gaseous Form, Nondetection
Greater Invisibility, Detect Scrying.


Ipslore the Red wrote:
DominusMegadeus wrote:
Doesn't spellbane let a caster say "I'm immune to AMF"?
Yes, but it wouldn't work in a dead magic zone.

Or since we are talking about a city wide effect and given that Spellbane does not work against artifacts it just doesn't suppress the AMF.


Prayer, though not specifically for AC it does give the foes a -1 luck penalty to attack rolls (among other things).

Recitation mentioned above was, near as I recall, a double strength Prayer effect.


Jokem is correct only spells with the component DF require a holy symbol to be cast. While you will certainly miss out on some many do not have DF as a component. Just be sure you know which are which when 'faking it'.

And perhaps arguably the Still feat might allow you to void actually needing to present or otherwise actively be doing something with it (i.e the Somatics) other than have it on your person (possession).

And ultimately if your role within the faith requires stealth and subterfuge I'm thinking RAW concerning casting almost by RAW itself says to flex rule 0 and make it work.


Quote:
I'm considering it only as a plotline involving the npcs my group interacts with. This story is a more mental and emotional one than action.

Which is cool, but keep in mind that if you want internal consistency (most players/GMs do) then you have introduced that physical fact into your world ... and players being what they are may look to use or expect this in the future.


I haven't seen such yet in PF, earlier editions had methods ... Epic Spellcasting and the Forgotten Realms had Mythals which could accomplish such things.

Unless you want to count placing the City within a Create Greater Demiplane with the Dead Magic trait as "antimagic". Or the potential use of Wish, Miracle or Gate (to call a very powerful outsider/ *cough* deity) and plead for such intervention.


andreww wrote:
Avoron wrote:

Kayerloth: +20 bonus on your initiative roll? A lost cause?

Moment of Prescience, anyone?
It's not that hard to get a +Dex+36 on initiative, while making three rolls and taking the highest.

It is not at all clear that MoP will work on initiative rolls as it is not clear whether or not they would count as opposed ability checks.

Also how are you getting multiple rolls? You can get two with an Oracle level dip. Are you using Rings of Revelation with UMD? If so again there is a lot of disagreement if these work for classes other than Oracles at all.

I agree expect some rather large amounts of table/campaign variation here but the underlying point still stands ... if such can be done at that table and/or in that campaign then both Sorcerers have also have access to 'whatever' for this duel.


Avoron wrote:

Kayerloth: +20 bonus on your initiative roll? A lost cause?

Moment of Prescience, anyone?
It's not that hard to get a +Dex+36 on initiative, while making three rolls and taking the highest.
<snip>

No not a +20 initiative, +20 greater (i.e advantage) over you're nearly identical opponent, though the next bit of the post seems to indicate we're on the same page there. We agree that if both Sorcerers have +40 on initiative it's the same effectively as if both had only +2 as far as who will win initiative ... correct?

And I'm off to find Contingent Action, sounds interesting and I was not aware of it ... along with a host of other factors in PF vs 3.5 (at least without a lot more delving). But then that's yet another option your foe could match and we are in an endless theoretical loop of measures and counter-measures that eventually breaks in the actual duel but will run endlessly in any theory of what might play out.

Edit: PS That's not to say that thinking about all those measures and counter-measures is not fun if ultimately only theory.


I was typing then realized I'm pretty much agreeing with the essence of Kikidmonkey's last post, in particular this bit of their post:

Quote:
I also believe that we should be assuming going second, as again, any feats/wealth/spells that we take, he can also take,

Getting anywhere near a +20 advantage on the initiative roll is a totally lost cause and likely is for both Sorcerer's. I think you could win but that it is far too uncertain a thing for either Sorcerer to rely on doing so. One is aiming for a huge initiative bonus not to win but to avoid losing the initiative in a near automatic manner


Wow mad posting speeds :)

@Adept Woodwright, I'll second that and LOL at a Dazing Wall of Iron ... though you would need to figure out how to topple it in the desired direction (DC=40 Str check but at least you can use magic :p).

Another potential Wish usage: Wish, in the 'reverse' concept of Spell Immunity, that 1 spell of your choice per 4 levels be immune to the effect of Antimagic Fields (or Spellbane, dead magic, etc.).

@Kikidmonkey (and everyone else): Maybe I'm doing it wrong but I've always read the area of a Wall of Stone to be 1 5x5 ft section of Wall per level or 25 5x5 ft 'sections' total which is more like 625 square feet of Wall (i.e a net of 25x25ft).

And also add any dumping of Dex and/or Con in particular really bad ideas if you want to start tossing around AMF's ... and what kind of spell caster starts a spell duel by casting AMF anyway, that ought to be an auto disqualifyer on principle alone. Heck just wish a Dead Magic area into existence why don't you :p


Wish you knew what the first 6 (or whatever you feel is 'reasonable' for your campaign) your opponent is going to cast (or actions) ... or something similar.

Learn his weakest ability score then consider going after that ability.

Based on the thread above I'd be sure to be carrying
1) One (or more) Rods of Absorbtion. Extra nice if the Rod can double as an Adamantine Light Mace.
2) Several Rods of Cancellation

Have access to Widen metamagic. Your foe is liable to forget to consider the possibility of spells getting Widened especially in the heat of combat. A Widened Sunburst is going to hit a very large area, quite possibly the entire arena unless it's huge (and could perhaps carry a disabling effect like Dazing etc.). Maybe useful against your foe if he manages to come out with Mindblank+Nondetection+Invisibility (of some sort) for instance. It's also non-elemental damage.

If possible precast Protection from Spells (that's another +3 on the 'minimum's list in Kestral287's post).

Foresight (again if possible) up and running in case your opponent is about to do something totally unexpected ... like go full on melee with some sort of antimagic up.

How big is the arena/battlefield for the duel? I assume one can't leave it.


RAW, near as I can figure, clearly indicates no, as the emanation does not have a line of effect through solid cover/objects and therefore the spells effects stop at the floor.

For me though things like Prismatic Spheres and Antimagic Field spells should pass through and ignore 'solid' objects ... but that is entirely my opinion and how it would work in my games with the clear understanding of that fact for myself and my players (and with the understanding that ruling may become revoked or altered if some undesired aspect comes to light that I've overlooked).


Tremorsense, X-ray vision or just turn the door Invisible so you can now see the Ogre through it --- O.o

Once you decide whether the arrow will pass through the door or not because of the brilliant energy, of course.


Dot for interest, lots of sweet ideas in this thread.


I like the idea behind Mad Alchemists suggestion -> Aiming more for building her reputation and power over other witches with her staff. Maybe she can see and hear through the eyes and ears of any of the witches she has granted an additional Hex as well.

I also like your idea of soul absorbtion to power/recharge the staff. Souls which are absorbed are destroyed and won't be helping any other deities maintain power as the soul is gone and lost to them (and everyone else for that matter).

Perhaps she can release a trapped soul into an empty vessel/corpse restoring it to life but they then come under the effect of a Geas/Quest. Further she can communicate with those she has trapped bargaining with them the conditions of release.

Is Matron the leader of a Coven?


Dot, dot.


Terathiel wrote:

Would a Bow or Crossbow of Distance Double the range at which you can sneak attack as well? Would it double the effective range of Point Blank Shot, since all your range increments are doubled?

No, the 30 ft 'range' of sneak attack (and most other forms of precision attack that I know of) is independent of the range of the weapon. For example, you can throw a dagger 30ft and do sneak damage but that is the 3rd range increment of the weapon. It would effectively reduce the range penalty for doing so however.


Hmmm, well first, as has been pointed out (more or less), how do you envision the item as a continuous Ring or one with some sort of duration?

And just for thought I'd ask once the bearer is in combat how different really is a Ring of Invisibility, Greater versus a Cloak of Displacement, Major? Convince me the difference is really worth paying something on the order of 50,000 or more (a 100% or more difference) because I'm thinking that's a stretch. Out of combat, is being under the effect of Invisibility vs Greater Invisibility somehow that great a difference to justify the increased expense? What if the duration of Greater Invisibility was a total of 10 rounds per day (vs the Displacements 15 rounds per day)?


kestral287 wrote:
First step though is really to find out what his plans are. Epic rules, can progress a class past 20, go find a new class, something else entirely?

This about a gazillion times over.

Having played beyond 20th twice (up to 23rd and 31st) and GM'd up to 30th once in campaigns (vs single shots/short lived stuff of various sorts - all in pre PF times) this is probably the single biggest question otherwise any planned builds/ideas may simply not be possible under whatever rules are in fact in use.


Ones I carried on my post 20th Loremaster (a 3.5 character) were:

Permanency - Arcane Sight, See Invisibility, Darkvision
Telepathic Bond (permanent with one other individual) also via Permanency
Nondetection
Greater Magic Weapon (available)
Detect Scrying
Mages Private Sanctum (available) +/- Secure Shelter
(or Mages Magnificent Mansion)
Prying Eyes (or Greater Prying Eyes)
Overland Flight
Contingency (typically linked to Teleport/command word to a 'safe' location upon being triggered), later Elminster's Evasion
Mind Blank
Moment of Prescience

Depending on circumstances:
(Extended) Protection from "Energy" or Resist "Energy" +/- 'Mass' version (of whatever I expected to go up against)
(Extended) Stoneskin
False Vision and/or Screen
Seeming
Veil
Sequester
Instant Summons
Dimensional Lock
(Extended) Foresight
(Extended) Prismatic Sphere

Rarely: Protection from Spells, Status (via Limited Wish)


Seeking would be high on my list also. While certainly not the "best" I had Distance on my primary bow which complimented my feat Far Shot nicely and led to a the occasional GM's eyebrows going up (in Living City play) when he lit up a few targets at some relatively extreme ranges (ship to ship or ship to shore combat situations usually).


I guess I'd make it the 7th vote for "depends/varies". The last portal I recall running was a fairly innocent looking archway of stone with some 'arcane' runes on the Prime Material side. The other side was more or less the same only it was well below the thick bog mat over the dark, murky and demon infested lake waters of one of Demogorgon's layers within the Abyss. It was also a one-way trip if you didn't have the proper key/permission for its use to exit back out to the Prime.


Magda Luckbender wrote:
Rosc wrote:


Because melee players absolutely love charging in as soon as they can for those delicious Claw Claw Bite sandwiches. At least at my tables.

This morning I played in a level 7-11 PFS scenario with a tactical trap for stupid. <snipped> Our group sure wasn't fooled, but I'm sure many would be.

:D In a similar ambush layout my Mystic Theurge promptly cast Sanctuary and then rushed the "trap". A whole lot of AoO's followed by missed Will saves later our real melee types moved in free of AoOs and demolished the foes.

Now if that partridge had been there ...


Cyrus Lanthier wrote:
Well, I don't think you can quick draw a sword that's stowed (mostly) in your backpack, either.

I would quite agree

Cyrus Lanthier wrote:
The butter knife scenario seems to imply that your answer is "Improvised Weapons are Weapons." Though drawing a hidden weapon is in fact slower (still a move action with quick draw) I assume that what you mean is that you would draw it as a move as opposed to a standard, meaning that quick draw would be "working."

Yes I would in general agree that an Improvised Weapon is a weapon ... improvised is an adjective, just like martial or two handed and doesn't in itself preclude it from being an object normally intended to sit on called a chair, for example. To be honest I'd forgotten that drawing a hidden butter knife from up ones sleeve would normally be slow enough from the norm to be consider a standard vs move, but yes I would probably allow someone with Quickdraw to speed up drawing a butter knife (which while improvised is a lot more akin to an weapon than the chair is to a Great Club)

Bottom line is I don't think there is one specific covers it all answer for the question, "Can I Quickdraw an improvised weapon?" as it is entirely too dependent on what exactly is being drawn.


There is also Protective Penumbra, a second level cleric, sor/wiz and witch spell.

Hopefully it's a big sturdy tree the wizard can't easily destroy and good for hiding behind (total cover). Maybe you can use total cover/cover to draw the wizard close enough to grapple then pull him back into the shade. Is this tree by the way the only tree within running distance (sounds if yes it is)? If it isn't the lone tree running like crazy might be a good start.


With the perfect 20-20 hindsight of an outside observer the first thing I'd note was if death was going to be a major story issue the time to fudge things was when the crit landed/before death was dealt ... for me you strongly risk cheapening death/bad stuff happening if you have to handwave stuff to bring the same character back to life. (And I'd want to keep any such fudging secretly behind my screen and unknown to my players)

But once its happened its happened and I'd be more liable to use something along the lines of RumpusRufus suggests, a previously unknown primitive humanoid race living on the island or even just a lone survivor from a previous shipwreck to allow the player to participate in the next session because a forced sitting out sucks and then some as a player.


Any clue what is up with the wizard? Is it a 'player' issue involving PvP or is he being dominated or otherwise controlled? And what is the other non-vampire character up to?

Otherwise as Claxon said you are in the crick without any paddles in a boat with numerous holes.


My answer as a GM would be, "It varies", followed by "What are you trying to draw?"

The chair or barstool you are sitting on is already 'drawn'.

The butter knife you palmed and slipped up your sleeve earlier I'd probably let you.

The shovel stuck in your backpack with the end of the handle sticking out (and on your back) probably not.


Various random thoughts:

Seeming and/or Veil could be used by the kidnappers to aid in avoiding being spotted while tailing the party.

If he or his party has a mount(s) give the kidnappers access to a Cauchemar Nightmare (CR 11). Use Veil to disguise the Nightmare as his mount then give him the ride of his life.

Use Nondetection as needed to ward against things like Detect spells, See Invisibility etc.

Mirror Hideaway and/or Mirror Transport could be a lot of fun to use in a smash and grab attempt.


And then there is Discern Location (cleric 8, sorcerer/wizard 8).


Sissyl wrote:
Flurry of antennae... with bonus feats for extra reach... mmmmm....

Hehe, for those veteran "know all the monster" types a variant with Roper like antennae that rust as normal rather than drain strength.


boring7 wrote:
Destruktokon am Half-orc Barbarian, son of chief and witch. Destruktokon demand entry to fizzy wizard home. Destruktokon make intimidate check, roll 12 plus mod and door open by itself out of fear. Door smarter than fizzy wizard.

last time my party faced a magical talking door:
The party's sorcerer, Seamus, had the habit upon meeting someone for the first time of asking them if they like his hat ... his hat being a rather obnoxious tall pointy thing covered in gaudy near worthless baubles. Say anything negative and he had the tendency to go blaster mode on whoever declined to tell him the hat was a work of art, glorious, etc.. So we are in the Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil and facing a magical talking door to continue. Seamus asks, "How do you like my hat?" The Door is tactlessly truthful. Seconds later the Door is dust after Seamus lets loose with a Disintegrate, hits the Door, beats its SR, and the Door fails its Fort save. Seamus had a lot of "barbarian" smash in him :D
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