yes you won't draw AAO from reach when you trip unless they have strike back feat. So you don't need improved trip. but the +2 to the roll helps as targets cmd are often at lot higher then an ac. And when they are within 5ft of you can still trip, after shorting weapons reach, This also open the door for greater trip which greats another +2 and grants you AAO to the person you just tripped. Also for each leg over 2 a creature has add they get a +2 to their CMD. SO the feat helps a good bit.
trip is very powerful, if you can pull it off, attack creature goes prone taking -4 to attacks and AC, and ranged weapons can not be used expect cross bow. They do get +4 to AC vs ranged attacks. it draws and AAO to when they get up or if they try to crawl away. So with greater trip you end up getting two or 3 AAO against the same target, and you stop there movement and leave them stuck with standard actions from that position. Give it a try without improved trip for a while and see if the extra +2 and greater trip would be worth it.
it is a special full round action, that lets you make a single attack at all targets with in reach. You can replace any single attack with trip. If you do a trip or another combat maneuver with it a GM may lock in to doing it to every target. greater trip allows you to take an AOO when you successfully trip some one. AAO happen out side normal flow of time so should be able to get them while whirlwind but some DM disagree. There has been some debate on this and varies to DM to DM. Even if they don't let you get the AOO for the trip from greater trip, you will get them for when the creatures try to stand back up. either way it is still a strong tactic.
You can apply combat expertise to whirlwind also but you take the -x to the roll raise your ac. You can apply power attack to it also. but user suffer -x as normal to attack roll. Furious focus negates the - on power attack from the first attack, but considering whirlwind is just one attack there should be no - to any of the attack roll with it. if DM argues other wise, the feat is still useable on the first attack roll. So it is not a waste. it still useful. Cornugon Smash lets you demoralize every target struck with power attack as a free action. So if you do damage you cause fear also. every thing here works with it in some way or another.
Dorn Dergar a good weapon for this damage tactic because you can do this with change the reach as swift action with darting viper. lunge, increase your range to 15ft. add power attack, more then likely hit every target once then, try to demoralize them all as a free action.(that helps everyone in your party, because now the creatures have -2 to everything.)take a 5ft step during or after to reposition your self for the creatures to come in on you in the on their turn and uses or not use your swift action to adjust the reach. if you don't you more than like going to get some AAO on targets. your next turn targets or more then likely going to be on you or with in 10ft of you or they ran far from you. if they are with in 5 and 10ft, use swift action to take in slack, rinse and repeat or adjust reach and full attack on target, or trip what ever.
it is open to what ever you want and it is always useful. when you can't trip you can do damage. If you want to be mobile and get to close to BBEG to start pushing him to the ropes you can do that by charging use combat expertise and fighting defensively. to give you ac a huge boots to AC vrs all the AOO you trigger. lets say your level 8 fighter thats is +1 from dodge, +2 from combat expertise, +4 from mobility, and +2 or 3 from fighting defensively if you have 3 ranks in acrobatics. your looking at +10 bonus to CMD, AC, touch ac at vs AAO and +6 vs all other attacks at level 8. So you could easily run strait in to middle of a bunch of creatures end up not getting hit and go balls to the walls offense on your 2nd round.
These are very powerful tactics and work well together especial if optimized, but if DM shoot some of this some stuff down mention. There are still effective option and can still be used and not wasted. There are some builds out there that can just fall apart if dm saying no that does not work like that and agreeing with other side of a debatable topic.
That is legal according the FAQ http://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fm#v5748eaic9o4s
Also note that dodge, moblity and Combat expertise when in use also apply to your CMD, so you will be a lot hard to trip or disarm or even be stopped from standstill feat. If you decived to run past everyone strait to the BBEG. when those feat are in use. That what I like about whirlwind versality and you have the ablity to do more tricks. The fighter in my group end up retraining Cleave for lunge at level 8 because it was just not as effective as he thought it would be. get a lot more use out of lunge with his scythe. if he had a reach weapon it would be even more effective. The dwarf barb in my group does two-weapon fighting with dwarven dorn dergar and shield for bashing.
Dorn-Dergar would be better for you. It is still useable close up. it a move action to adjust grip two handed, swift action with darting viper feat. use use your move action to adjust grip with out actual moving so keep your Stance up. you have a small feat chain to use it one hand if you want.
Right, but those dwarf-only cleave feats let you bypass that restriction - Goblin Cleaver lets you cleave Small-sized foes even if they're not adjacent to each other; Orc Hewer lets you do the same vs Medium or smaller foes, etc.
Too feat heavy for my taste with not much benfit to get the same effect with whirlwind with move.
I think you get more use out of whirlwind line and do moblity fighter archtype. The moblity fighter not going to tie you down to the one weapon your going get to move and full attack and also move and whirlwind. bonus to hit and damage every time you move at least 5ft. bonus to hit and damage to all weapons no just set groups. Dodge add to ac moblity add 4 more on top of tha when you just want to rush past people. combat expertise added also. You are now open up you up to combat menuver feats to trip or bullrush ect. if you want. Spring attack no aoo agansit you from reach. Wirlwind + Combat relfexs + greater trip + reach weapon = walking talking AOE. you put people on the ground and get extra attack on them all at highest attack bonus. add Power attack and Furious focus take no pentaly on the whirlwind and get extra damage on your AOO, you still take pentaly on your AOO. Add Cornugon Smash also to whirlwind and you can do damage and cause all to be shaken also. I go straight fighter also I would even not dip in to rogue. the only reason to really dip there are skill points and evasion.
either even if you go cleaving route look at Furious focus chain and Cornugon Smash. to add little something extra on your kills and hits.
note that con for cleave is also the target has to be next to each other they can't not have be space inbetween them. lunging whirl wind lets you attack all targets with in 15 ft of you. if you are enlarge even more. your more like to have more targets spread out all over the place in your long reach as compared to 3 or more sitting in this pattern xxx if the pattern is like this x_x you can't cleave.
2nd darkness. would work also but you would have to do some converting. it was writin for 3.5 rules not pathfinder ones. I am running it now. It starts off with pc invesgateing strange atmosphic events and a run down casino and local town crime bosses. chapter two involes crime boss from other town faction fighting over something that happens on abandon island, only to find out they bit off more then they can chew. 3rd chapter pull you in to heart of elven war, with drow chapter 4 you go undercover to see how drow are getting to surface and what there plans are(huge RP chapter). chapter 5 Betral in elven goverment it self(large rp chapter also.)
Both elves and drow each have a rogue groups trying to start all out war or distory the world. With the same Doomsday weapon. You find out about the change of hands of the weapon in Chapter 5.
I agree with Ecaterina Ducaird. Someone in my game has two both with fire ball in it. He never had to use it yet, they mostly been running into Illusionist and for some reason all the bad guys have lighting bolt memorize in this AP. but it does still help them when Shadow evocation that mimics fire ball, as they know to disbelief because the counter ring never goes off.
I can't tell from the Rise of the Rune Lord Ann. ed. It just says Male zombie Hill Giant. I have a CN cleric in my game that animates dead every so often of large and huge creatures as meat shields. So contantly have to apply these templets, and the frist time he did it and I read, that it retaints any extraordinary speical qualities that improves its melee or ranged attacks had me wondering what it was that they would keep.I was wondering if it keep throw rock and rock catching seemed like it is part of throw rock. Then I seen this example finaly come out.
I could not find any I posted on here still to this day has example of that extraordinary speical qualities as referance that a zombie would keep. search through all the monster books not a single monster has an extraordinary speical qualities that pertain to attacks. they are all stuff like blindsense and stuff like that.
No your skill did not increase but some of the ability allowed you take 20 more quickly or even in stressful situations. It also increased your skill by increase your ability’s scores every other tier. You got extra hp based on path. You also could spend a mythic point to increase those skill rolls or any roll by from a d6 up to d12 even after you know you failed. My players used it often to pass skill checks they had no points in. Same for saving throws, mythic save at tier 5 basically made you immune to effect that where pass or fail. So there was no need to increase the numbers. You don't need a caster level increase when a mythic meteor swarm can one hit a most creatures. there where increase to established feats, Mythic toughness added another hp per level, and when you hit 0 hp, you gain dr 10/epic that added with any other epic dr your had. Mythic rapid shot, gave you option to added 2 extra attack to rapid shot or ignoring the -2 penalty.
The problem with increase the numbers in the game like you want breaks the game after level 20. I created a monster that is an outsider shape shifter that has 33 hit dice, and guess what it will never ever fail a save it will never ever not miss. The game math starts so break down at level 15. Because guess what it is based on 20 side dice. The dice roll it self-become irrelevant. It becomes auto fail auto passed depending on bonus, unless you roll a 1 or 20. That is why epic rules where abandoned by Wizard and not upgrade from 3.0 to 3.5 the whole system would have be reworked to support levels beyond 20.
Can you multiclass Mythic paths?
Kinda of, but there really no need to do it in the mythic play test.there the only benfit of doing it was to select ablitys from another path. it not like a level. It was just a base what teir you where gave the same bonus and upgrades to all paths. But each path had different ablities or powers that could be used. Some of them even had the ablity to pick a power from another path without having. 80% of the Paths in the play test worked with all classes, there where only 2 that really only work with certin things and that was the Arcane path and Divine one. I liked it, there was not need for extra level that people are asking for. It still need some things worked out at the end of play test but I am sure they are going to be addressed. People complaing about the numbers did not do enough play testing. there was ablity at teir 5 where saves be came a none issuse. you where either immune to something to or you took a lesser effect. It was a bit much, SO I am sure it was be reworked.
It loses rock catching as a zombie and racial mods to stealth as it is not longer that race. there was a zombie hill giant in an AP and it lost that ability. http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/undead/zombie/zombie-hill -giant. see here
I planing makeing a bounty hunter/batman type HellKnight
This is what I got so far I just wondering if I should go with different feats or ablities or Maybe I should get them in different order
Fighter 1 Feat Power Attack and Furious Focus
Any suggestion are welcome also, if maybe level dips in other classes. I do want to stay away from two weapon fighing or limiting my self to one weapon.
you have to pick the one of those element types. as listed. Graveknight is Pathfinders version of death knight from D&D they only changed the choose item from a weapon to armor. but they gave the graveknight the abilty to pick elemenal. It has always been just fire in the past. Also the problem is that few creatures are immune or have resitance to negative engery. So you would not be nerfing your character. while a good number have resitances to elements of some form.
considering this is evil advenutre you are more then likely going to be fighting good creatures where almost none of them immune to negative engery.
you are already almost indistructable. So I would not worry about it to much. you keep coming back short drop in heart of volcano. You rebuild you self in 1d10 days and can almost instantly kill some one that tries to wear your armor.
I am going to get with My DM on this, we are playing custom Camp. In a custom world. He has not established orders for his world, but he said I could be the PCR and has no problems with it, Maybe I will be the frist of this class and creator of an order in his world. In the long run I am sure other people would be wondering about this per RAW and for PS games. I know as a DM my self I wondering about this as I do use the pathfinder world and If I made some Hell Knight NPCs I would want them fuction correctly.
I am working on building a Hell Knight Character, but I had a few questions about Pentamic Faith Dicipline and uses per day.
Lets say Level 3 Hell Knight with Pentamic Faith- Picks Travel domain.
So that means I would get the Agile Feet power. Agile Feet power says I can do this can do this number of times per day = 3 + wisdom mod. But Hell knight power says Diciplines say he can only use a dicipline 1 once per day?
So does get get to do this 3+ wisdom or 1 per day
Now when it reachs hell Knight level 8 it has two uses of Diciplines per day. and would gain access to Dimensional Hop Travel domain power.
This says the power can be used to teleport 10ft per level a days as move action and must be used in 5ft increments. 80 total feat.
If these are limited to times per day as Diciplines Do i get two uses of each power or do I have two uses of Dicipline and have to pick which power I use.
the rules mention exception with Pentamic faith, but the they way it is worded sounds as if just can't get the Discipline if you are not of the order that has it. Not uses per day.
Kobold Cleaver wrote:
Acceptation to number 5 is unless profit or reward is promised.
As the Ninja I would not say anything but I be keeping a very close eye on this Paladin. Because if he willing to do that to the people in those who knows what he would do to you. CN and need of personal survival the most important thing keeping quite you don't want to provoke him and don't go out your way to help him either.
on a side note don't care who his god is or race what the paladin did was a chaotic evil act and is subject to falling. The correct act to for his god would have been to yes crush his enemy, but not do it while they are unarmed. he should have tossed them a rock or dagger with broken condition in a square close to them and said defend you self and then to kill them.
Damaging Magic Weapons: An attacker cannot damage
p.459 A magic item doesn’t need to make a saving throw unless it
Living Steel Heavy Shield
This non-magical heavy steel shield is made out of living steel. It has no enhancement bonus, but its material and construction can damage metal weapons that strike it. Whenever the wielder of a metal weapon (other than one made of adamantine) rolls a natural 1 on an attack against a creature wielding this shield, the item must make a DC 20 Fortitude save or gain the broken condition. If the weapon already has the broken condition, it is instead destroyed.
I would say Living Steel would be exception to the rule as it is granting a saving throw and not doing damage as if struck by sunder. It was also published after core rule being it is more up to date rule. Also it requires the attack to strike the shield not the shield attack the weapon. It is on par with rust monster.
Damaging Magic Weapons: An attacker cannot damagea magic weapon that has an enhancement bonus unless his
weapon has at least as high an enhancement bonus as the
weapon struck. p.468 of the core rule book at +5 it would take another +5 weapon. Adamantiun +4 does no damage to a +5 weapon. +5 is the way to go, at +5 it goes through alignment DR. a +4 does not. +5 and save up for speed or some type of bane or holy later. get the +5 out the way and you will out hit every one and damage all the time. Damage all the time is better then damage every now and again.
Ok last Game session my group Had to fight 4 vrocks in a semi collapsed tower. 140ft above ground level. I we new to pathfinder, and figure we could use some exercise on combat maneuvers. I intend to use the spell in that manner only. A huge argument started over the rules of this spell. and the spot I could preform the bull rush from. I was trying to bull rush the dwarf from the side in my diagram. I had already push the sorcerer down off the ledge. The cleric proceeded to grab him since he had a ring of feather fall. it was going to be dam near impossible to bull rush this dwarf off edge. But I was going to try it any way. My fighter steps in and started to argue I can't because point origin of the spell would have only option is to bull rush strait basically in to spot label 1. I am aiming for spot x. My argument was I can start the spell as if the Vrock moved in an L pattern and preformed the maneuver but instead of moving I have the hole range of the spell as movement. need to say this took up a lot of time. I said fine forget it I am just going to violent thrust him off the edge targeted square X AC 5 with dwarf as weapon. So I did the same thing to him and the fighter. since they both have poor will saves. I forgot the dwarf had a ring of feather fall so he gets lucky fighter not so much. My players where still curious about this and asked me to post about it.
So my question is can the dwarf be bull rushed in to spot x with this spell or spot 1 only
Wasn't there actual stats for the Purple Dragon in the 3.5 days?
Yes it was located here.Purple (Energy) Dragon "Missing" chromatic 3(.5)rd Dragon Compendium Volume 1
This dragon was made in dragon mag. for 1st edition, then converted into 2nd ed. and again to 3.5. Along with 2 other dragon the yellow and Orange. 1st ed version was issues #65 starts on page 27. 2nd edition version was issue #248 starts on page 48. 3.5 is listed above There was a 4th Dragon the Pink Dragon added in issue 165 p. 18 I don't think it was ever converted to any other edition other then 1st.
The 4th edition purple dragon was known as a Deep dragon in all other editions and part of the under dark creature in forgotten realms setting.
Since he is using two natural attacks with his claws, does that mean he gets four attacks when his BAB gets to +6?
nope, natural attacks function separate BAB. other wise high levels monster in with only natural attacks would be really nasty. If you have natural attacks you get as many as you have primary. you have two claw there for you get two claw attacks at full BAB at level 1. if you have claws and bite. Claws are primary the bite is at -5 BAB. unless you have
Neither give what you see fit. A lot of people Band leadership from there game because it over powered. I think the only reason it is over powered is because of the free wealth that is giving with it. No where in the feat does it say that the cohort must have wealth of any sort it just recommends it. to support this a cohort could be monster or animal. It does not have to be a humanoid or even have class levels. It can be all monster hit dice. It is up to DM/GM to make the call. Also you do not have to let the pc in say in what you give them as cohort. If you want to give him a Griffin as a cohort you can. If you want to give him a 4 level farmer you can. Also you as GM control the way the cohort levels. The cohort is a npc under your control not the pc. The cohort will expect some of the PC loot or he may stop following. This how the feat in balanced with heavy GM control. The cohort will be drawn either from the pc wealth that he choose to share or the groups should they choose to share. I like the idea of run away Prince looking for adventure following the pc around. 7 level aristocrat and he start to take pc level in the pc class as he learns from him. The Prince could use is position of power to help the pc, and it could also bring a king guards down as they search for the run away lad. Have fun with it and pick what you want not what the pc wants.
Nation Prophetic wrote:
Can I follow up an attack with my axe with a quick at hand grab of a fallen enemy and throw him at another guy in the same turn?
There are no set rules for this but it would more then likely go down like this.
that would require 3 rounds worth of actions. attack to kill round 1. a grapple check(standard action)that is round 2. and then another attack roll with improvised weapon take - and possibly draw two attack of opportunity (because it is improved weapon and another because it a ranged attack)turns happen over 3 or 6 seconds. Some DM may say you have to pin(another stander action)(this would simulate lifting the body in preparation to throw it) the body before allowing you to throw it. The game is not made to do what you want to do. you are looking for movie style action, the pathfinder system does not work well with that effect. sounds like you are new to the game, and you should stick with just the core book to start absorb all of that then worry about the add books with extra feats and what not. learn the game first don't look for instant mastery. IF you are looking for movie style play try world of darkness systems they are made exactly for that style of play. Pathfinder is systematic style system. It is very structured with lots of checks and balances. some people would say not enough.
I added Tripping Staff Chain to monks bonus feats list in my game. How many martial arts film out there has some one use a spear or quarter staff in that manner. A lot of them. These weapons also get use as reach weapons a lot but that can simple be use of lung feat. It is part of Kung-fu weapon forms that these weapon be used in that manner.
easy solution counter spell it with a priest of your own or dispel magic, or anti magic field. Your the DM do this every so often but not all the time. It is your game after all if you are running an adventure path, I suggest limited players to Core Rule book. Most the them are made for standard party in mind with those spells as everyone is not going to have supplement books.
Give your Monsters Ring from BBEG that cast any of these spell once per day. Say the rings are tuned to the blood of the wearer. And disintegrate on death. If the players try capture monster and use the ring for them self they can't not tune the ring past the person it has already been tuned for.
There always ways to deal with this stuff with out banning it out right. If your player are going to spam the spell, spam it right back at them. They will get the idea.
But a 5ft step uses your move action so you can't charge until the next round. I feel surprise rounds need to be rework to be just that a surprise round, the group that get surprise get no action those that are doing the surprise get a full round action.
Human Mobile Fighter
make sure to craft or buy these
This feat also which would be really good if you go human and use long spear as base reach weapon
It would allow you to use weapon focus and weaponSP and improved crit and so on. With all spear weapons. You can use pilum to get rid of shield ac or slow target by limit it to move and free actions only if they want shield ac.
Dragoon Archtype is weak and is kind of silly. Half it's ablitys limit you to lance the other half to being mounted. It last ablity actual requires a lance wielder to dismount instead of useing ride by attack and constalty doing heavy damage. Very limit archtype. That is my build for moblity spear fighter. He has some switch hitting, I made him to be veristle and combat controler. You can more then likely do better switch hitting with two-handed fighter with a spear. As there is two handed throw feat.
You may have just saved me some Time =). in 3.0 I had my players make there own races for campaign and A friend of mine made a very similar race but we made the a sub category of shape shifters as so sneak attack and critical could still effect them but we had them take reduced damage do to odd Anatomy. Even though they looked like Oozes, They would change shape and turn in to feat and hands,swords for their all Slam attacks. Very slapstick race. They where well known for being prankster so we gave them -2 to CHA instead Wisdom, +2 con, -2 STR and +2 dex from being small size. They could also change in to shape of humanoid the size of gnome if they wanted to wield weapons. It made for very funny and fun monk. We did not give them ability to talk and they spoke thru charades or shaping them selves in to words or changing colors like a mood ring. + to innuendo skill. The males where all Yellow, Females Blue and the young where green until they reached maturity and sex was determined later. Also gave them natural climb speed say they could stick to walls.
I was going to rebuild them for pathfinder for my next Campaign but you saved me huge amount of time with your build. Thanks I would rid of the wizardbred ability and Acid Body and bring them down to 11 AP and keep them in range with Other core races.
Maybe have those ability like for Bubble Squishy, King Squishy, Heal Squishy or Metal Squishy also lol. Have them as separate like Drow VS Noble Drow This will allow for different type of of AP Point play and make your race comparable to core race and advanced ones.
So if I throw up my tower shield for total cover then use this ability, how does that work?
well considering the is ability not done on your turn, you can't put up your tower shield as that is a standard action which can be done on your turn. You can't do it. Now if on your turn you put up your shield,the whole LoS becomes issue you don't know to activate the ability because you can't see anyone attacking. It still comes down to clarification of numbers 1&2
here a 5th question for it. For attacks that are out of range do they fall short and not hit the Guardian, or does the attack just take the max penalty for long range attack?
Not sure about 1 and 2 but I would say the Guardian act like a magnet and LoS on him does not matter as even attacks out of range are forced towards Guardian. I also would think The Guardian would need LoS on his alley and the attacker. If he can't see his alley or attacker how does he know an arrow is being shot at him to even use the ablity.
Good qustions that need clarifcation. This I think this ablity should not be useable in total cover as LoS is broken.
Another question regarding Amazing Initiative: If you've used a full-round action (like a full-attack), could you still use amazing initiative to get an extra standard action? Full-rounds are described as, well, taking the full round.
yes, spending the mythic point for this is a non action that grants extra standard action for your turn. There are already several archtypes that turn full round actions in to standard action Moblity is example of this it allows you to move and wirlwind attack (Wirlwind attack is already a full round action.) Also current setup allow to take that standard action when you want. So a fighter can trip (standard action)then full attack his prone target. The way it was setup before this change you where allowed two full round action in one round but at two different points in the rounds with a mega high bonus(makeing feat improved initive not even worth takening). which was too good to ever not do. It was depowerd to just a extra standard action on your turn and small bonus. this make it still useful and compareable to other mythic ablities, gets rid of the confusion and clunk that went with, add a extra turn at another point in round.
I just wanted to update, it has been a bit. My group made it to next chapter his this adventure it is a heavy role play chapter. But there mythic ability have come to use in that section. When having to make these daily role playing skill checks, The mythic surge of 1d6 has saved a few of their lives from being executed or not blowing there cover while they are sneaking around spying, in drow society. They had mostly forgot about this ability until this game or did not care for it. It had a huge moment to shine and took them at 2 weeks in game time or 14 rolls to remember this ability. It saved a few that where barely making there skill checks and those where making them allowing them to double up on the roll getting double reward and speeding up game story to progress a little faster. I am sure they will now remember it and may not use there swift action as much as this extra dice can save them.
My group has not had a chance to try the new amazing inti yet as they have been in a role play skill section for last two game sessions. I add my thought later as they should hit some heavy combat this week. I can say from the old one thou, it was over powered by a long shot and to good to pass up over other mythic ability, so it had to be tone down to be on par with them. my players did not even bother with any of the other ability unless it gave them a free attack or something of that nature. They did not care about mythic spell be cause 4 spell off in a round was better then any two mythic spells. There is also the issues of it make the feat improved init completely useless
Also it did cause a lot of confusion who went in combat when a mix of mythic and non mythic creatures where involved. It was also paper work heavy because of that. I am sure the new one is still paper work heavy but as other said it going to make different combo in battle thing that rarely get use will get used. I got a Sorc. that has more wand then he knows what to do with. because he never has a reason to use them because casting the actual spell is better. The new version lets him use items now as well as his magic.
a wizard can only cast the mythic spell as many times as the spell is prepared.
you have to be casting the original spell first then boost it with mythic power point. And wizard must prepare that spell to cast it. you do not get X number of mythic spell per day. you only know X number of mythic spells for all casters.
nothing has changed, Sorc can spam the same mythic spell over and over again and a wizard can only do as many times as it is prepared.
There is a problem with changing Level Progression System leads to complex multi-class system. That another reason i am sure 3.x when to single experience table for levels. They made multi-classing easyer also, but it also created greater munchkin builds, Fighter/Rogue/Barbarian/Paladins..ect build that we have now. thus causing a even bigger unbalance.
If they ever do another edition of pathfinder, I would really like to see multi-classing done away with. And have rules like they did in 2ed. to build your own classes from scratch. Just have more kits and archetypes or whole classes. example Magus = Fighter/mages (then add kits or archetype to further expand for different type Fighter/mage build builds) Ninja/Mages = Shinobi or something, I rather see Ninja as a kit for rouge same with assassin. Get rid of the PCR make them archetype attainable from level 1