Island Hopper19's page

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Well, hopefully one day it can happen. But yes, main concentration on your products is paramount.

Thanks for replying.

Jason Nelson wrote:
Island Hopper19 wrote:
Any chance of this going to Hero's Lab, as a alternate 3rd party material?
Neil talked to someone from HeroLab at GenCon and they talked about maybe sending us a copy to look at inputting a product. I am not personally very familiar with using HeroLab, so the best I can say is that we may well try creating some HeroLab-compatible products down the road, but it's not on the front burner. Our main focus is on creating new products and we have to balance that need versus the time investment required to revise existing products into new formats. We will definitely consider it, though.

Any chance of this going to Hero's Lab, as a alternate 3rd party material?

That is correct...

No, on both accounts.

3.5 Loyalist wrote:

If a pc accidentally kills another pc, do you give them xp?

If a pc accidentally kills a monster or npc, do you give them xp?

Bought, love it...well done!!!

I will stick with this...very straight forward.

Brain in a Jar wrote:

Okay i'm going to break this down as simply as i can.

Here is the rules concerning Overcoming DR.

** spoiler omitted **

From this you can gather how to bypass DR.

1. Special Materials (Cold Iron, Adamantine, etc.)
2. Magic Weapons (any weapon with a +1 or higher enhancement bonus, not counting the enhancement from masterwork quality)
3. Certain types of weapons (Slashing, Piercing, etc.)
4. Weapons imbued with alignment (Good, Evil, etc.)

Here is the rule for Unarmed Strike from the Weapon table.

** spoiler omitted **

From this you can gather that an Unarmed Strike is a light weapon.

Here is the rules for the Amulet of Mighty Fists.

** spoiler omitted **...

Might be 'Hammer the Gap'....

Dabbler wrote:
Can't find Hammer Blow in Pathfinder, is it a 3.5 feat or an unofficial one? and if so, how is it relevant?

Added; The additional damage increase from Dragon Style of Teir 1, only applies to the very first attack blow, if using normal or FOBs, after that, it returns back to nornal damage based on the current PC's level of that monk class.

Rjesterie wrote:
Seranov wrote:
Dragon Style would let you get through DR/Slashing, wouldn't it?

Boar style could.

Dragon style is more for treating unarmed strike like 2Hnd attacks (1.5 Str) and charging options..

In 2011....

Here it is

Added--The wording in EU at least, seems to add to the confusion on it's main function.

These weapons fit snugly around the
knuckles and allow you to deal lethal
damage with an unarmed strike
. You
may hold, but not wield, a weapon or
other object in a hand wearing brass
knuckles. You may cast a spell with a
somatic component while wearing brass knuckles if you make
a successful concentration check (DC 10 + the level of the spell
you’re casting). Monks are proficient with brass knuckles. Brass
knuckles can’t be disarmed.

The only question now, which stands? Errata changes or the current book supplement?

Lord Phrofet wrote:


for those that say that the brass knuckles no longer deal Monk's unarmed strike damage will you please post where it says so that we can see it?

Neo is right; unless posted on the FAQ, errata,etc. that it does not work (or a develop giving his personal opinion which must people respect as truth although not 100% valid) then the brass knuckles should deal Monk unarmed damage.

Please keep in mind, the monk's unarmed damage will be greater overall than the cestus and gaunlet can put out.

If you are looking to increase the damage pool, will have to attain that expensive amulet and place extra Wpn dmg abilites that work on contact of blow, not critical sucess.

Lord Phrofet wrote:

bookrat: grumble. At least the cestus and gauntlet in 3.5 worked for unarmed strike damage even if they didn't work with the Flurry of Blows.

Redchigh: I do not mean to sound offensive but this is a UNARMED STRIKE only topic. Yes I understand there are A LOT of options for natural attacks but that is not what I am looking for.

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Apologies, didn't read it carefully.


Lord Phrofet wrote:

So I am just trying to figure out the options for weapons that work with a Monk's Unarmed Strike Ability. The only three I know of are:

* Brass Knuckles (I think?)
Corrections were made, that they no longer trasmit the monk's own damage via a second medium. It will stay at D3 dmg plus natural strength bonus and others.
* Amulet of Mighty Fists (SO expensive!)
Yes, bloody expensive, but is the only item that will allow Wpn damage type effects to the Unarmed Attacks in general
* Bodywrap of Mighty Strikes (WHY do you take up the same slot at the monk robe and only work on the first attack!?)
There is no true worth in getting this item. Yes, one first attack only on the first part of the round. Second, you get extra 'attacks' for every 6 levels of the vocation.

Is there any others that work? And do Brass Knuckles still work?

1 person marked this as a favorite.

From Ultimate Equipment.

Bo staff, **brass knuckles, butterfly sword, cestus, dan bong,
double chained kama, double chicken saber, emei piercer,
fighting fan, jutte, kama, kusarigama, kyoketsu shoge,
lungchuan tamo, monk’s spade, nine-ring broadsword,
nine-section whip, nunchaku, quarterstaff, rope dart, sai,
sansetsukon, seven-branched sword, shang gou, shuriken,
siangham, tiger fork, tonfa, tri-point double-edged sword,
unarmed strike, urumi, and wushu dart.

**BKs have redacted as Light wpns, and therefore does it own dmg, not from the monk's.
Added:Some weapons will required an extra Feat *e.g. Martial Wpns Feat* to be more proficient.

Pinned: A pinned creature is tightly bound and can take few actions. A pinned creature cannot move and is denied its Dexterity bonus.. A pinned character also takes an additional –4 penalty to his Armor Class. A pinned creature is limited in the actions that it can take. A pinned creature can always attempt to free itself, usually through a combat maneuver check or Escape Artist check. A pinned creature can take verbal and mental actions, but cannot cast any spells that require a somatic or material component. A pinned character who attempts to cast a spell or use a spell-like ability must make a concentration check (DC 10 + grappler's CMB + spell level) or lose the spell. Pinned is a more severe version of grappled, and their effects do not stack.

While pinned, one can do a few actions, but no attacks.

The 'ability' of Speed grants an additional attack, if the power is derives from the Amulet of Mighty Fist(s) *an added ability on the main item*

But alot of what was written by the OP, does need some major straighten out. And good job on pointing them out.

This will no longer qualify them as a monk in any fashion, even as a suggestive idea.

However, monks having spells was already done in the 3.0 or early 3.5 days. There's a Dragon magazine article that goes into depth with your suggestion.

Psychic...most definitely not. :)

Revan wrote:

Some possibilities which occur to me for improving them then:

A particularly drastic change would be to give monks spells. Make them divine half-casters and load them up with personal buff spells; the Qingong archetype taken to a further extreme, and giving monks a role comparable to the Psychic Warrior.

Please, no seperation on the monk's whole state of being.

Starbuck_II wrote:
Dabbler wrote:
The black blade has to be an actual weapon you are gifted with. You could have unarmed strike as a paladin's divine bond weapon, though.

No, it says the blade can appear in anyway. Not just as a gift, you become level 3, wake up and bam! One appears.

Who is say your hand/body can't become sentient if it works?

Much thanks for the PDF, bought... :)

Currently in the game I am, my PC has two pairs, Cold Iron and Silver, the GM waved the limitations *dmg wise* on them. And they were used for maybe two or three game sessions.

Then they got 'retired', cause I felt it was a crutch rather as a helpful additional aid.

Neo2151 wrote:
Island Hopper19 wrote:
This sounds nice, but this will pigeon-hole the class in one way, let us not forget, the monk's body *head, arms, legs, etc, etc* are considered as a weapon as well. There should be no exclusion to what can be used, within reason.

This is exactly why I've never understood the draw to having brass knuckles/gauntlets/fist wraps/etc be the "fix" for monk enhancement.

Monks don't have Natural Weapon: Fist - they have an Unarmed Strike, which can be a lot more than just a punch.

A question to fans of the brass knuckles that allowed monk damage (ie: pre-nerf) - If your monk didn't invest heavily in Escape Artist and ended up getting his hands shackled and had to rely on kicking or head-butting, would you allow the bonuses you placed on the brass knuckles to apply? If yes: how do you justify that? If no: Why do you then think brass knuckles were an effective fix?

This sounds nice, but this will pigeon-hole the class in one way, let us not forget, the monk's body *head, arms, legs, etc, etc* are considered as a weapon as well. There should be no exclusion to what can be used, within reason.

ciretose wrote:
Andrew R wrote:
I think allowing gauntlets or brass knuckles to do unarmed damage and flurry and making it so they can swap wis for str would solve most of the combat gripes.

It did, except the devs (correctly IMHO) think it is not proper flavor for monks to have to have brass knuckles.

So I've suggested making monks hands into masterwork weapons that can be enhances magically at around 3rd level when they become magic.

I may be wrong, but somewhere in the Player's Guide Core or DM section. High and Veritcal jumps are not suppose to go pass the full movement rate *land speed* number of the PC's mobility.

Jumping around as it suggested here at 51' ft, can lead massive abuse by clever and creatively players *I know, I am one of them :)*

I tend to use the environment a lot, to attain further height if doing a straight vertical jump is not feasible.

Plus some folks may forget to add their own height on top of the clearance height of a jump, e.g. attaining a VJ of 8 ft is around DC 32, add that with the PC's own like 5 ft +, and you gaining around 13 ft and some plus inches in height.

If you add some magical equipment or spell, the additional bonus will get you further up or across.

But if you can't reach them, then you can't reach...simple as that.

Googleshng wrote:

I honestly don't understand why everyone is always freaking out about monk BAB.

If you are making a full round attack, you essentially have full BAB.

If you are making a CMB check, you essentially have full BAB.

If you are power attacking while making a full round attack, you still essentially have full BAB.

The only situation in which 3/4 BAB ever comes up is when you first fly across the room with your crazy move speed, and thus only have a standard action with which to attack, but so what? Just open with one of those crazy accurate combat maneuvers you get for free or something. Granted, you suck in terms of ranged attacks but I don't think that's where the complaints are coming from here, because the whole concept of the class is about getting up close and personal, and hey, zen archer.

My only real complains with monks are that even with totally crazy bonuses, vertical leaps never get you the height you need to pull flying monsters out of the sky, or show off about not needing a climb check. (When I'm blowing a ki point on it, an acrobatics check of 51 really should just launch me 51' into the air I say!). The other issue is that there really aren't enough practical options for spending money. Bracers of armor, amulet of mighty fists, cloak rings belt, maybe a headband of inspired wisdom, but all the other classes grab that stuff on top of more colorful items that are frankly redundant here.

I wouldn't object to having more HP too, but I've really honestly never found them particularly lacking on that front as-is.

That part will weaken them, curtailing any feats that are non-team they cannot get for themselves.

In fact, the majority of all the classes are 'solo' per se, the option to use Team Feats are optional to the said character.

They should not be 'forced'....

Irontruth wrote:

One of the things I've seen and considered is allowing monks to either:

- Increase their 5ft step range
- Spend a ki point to move as a swift action

There are variations depending on how powerful you want the change to be, but a big disconnect is a monk's mobility and how moving makes them worse at combat. Let them move for free a little extra distance and the issue goes away.

Another option, that instead of making them a solo melee class, make them a teamwork melee class. Give them bonuses to Aid Another, let them do it with faster actions (like a Swift), or to replace an attack, etc. The problem with that is it becomes a one-trick pony and doesn't work for small parties or independently.

Even if monks don't get a permanent enhancement bonus to unarmed attacks, something along the lines of the Paladin's Divine Bond would work well. It's limited in usage per day, but it's effective and provides a big boost when the monk really needs it.

Yes, the knuckles were redacted to damage only of the light wpn (+Str), no more IUS dmg will be allow to go through it.

Well, well...nice job there. Nice Job indeed!!

As long the material is solid, I will be buying it.

Martiln wrote:
Island Hopper19 wrote:

Actually EF is a umarmed attack feature. The pre-requirements on the Monk's side is the IUS and some decent ability scores. Although there is no actually description of that power can be transmuted to another medium, the pre-requirements that are stated to use it...does.

And the lesser form of EF, for non-monks does states, that it is through the fist only.

But being a creative player and GM, the use of it in a monk's hands, should be restricted by the means of a dedicated weapon that is Ki empowered.

I counter your arguement with the feat, Perfect Strike, which doesn't work with unarmed strikes, yet has IUS as a prerequisite.

Tnat has nothing do with the use of EF, which is the main topic. But I will not dismiss your statement either. I know the original writing is very coy, but any seasoned player will understand what was truly intented.

Please keep in mind, the ability is called Elemental Fist, not Elemental Whatever. :)

Actually EF is a umarmed attack feature. The pre-requirements on the Monk's side is the IUS and some decent ability scores. Although there is no actually description of that power can be transmuted to another medium, the pre-requirements that are stated to use it...does.

And the lesser form of EF, for non-monks does states, that it is through the fist only.

But being a creative player and GM, the use of it in a monk's hands, should be restricted by the means of a dedicated weapon that is Ki empowered.

Stunning Fist was one of the technique replaced, upon taking up Elemental Fist. How was it possible to regain it?

-Listens well with intention-

I bless you with the foresight on doing this.

Thank you.

-Sharing a tissue-

Zurai wrote:

I actually still have the set in storage somewhere.

Still have the old Wrath of the Immortals stuff, too. And a Poor Wizard's Almanac.

Ahhh, the good old days...

Wow, talk about a flashback. Still have the Box set, was indeed grand to play a dragon.

But took a long time to grow (snicker), but Dragons tend to do that.

I guess not...if I am the only one, answering this post.

Well, I am playing a 'gish' Bladesinger now.

Much greater than the prestige-class design.

Home-brew built by the gm.


Gworeth wrote:
Xum wrote:

And I remember with extreme joy the good old days of the Bladesinger... how I miss it...

Ohhh.. The Bladesinger... Yeah... Those were the days... :)

Tagged for goodie reference


That discussion appeared on EnWorld Pathfinder Forum, on August 22.

Why do elves sleep now?

Mr. Jacobs also made a comment to that supposed 'changed' information.

Thank ypu for yoir input.

Can someone give some clarity, to the notation of the fighter class (only) in the Campiagn book.

With the extra bonus modifer for skills at 1st level (if going to a guild/school for training), does it mean, is that feature is still applieable.

Besides what is stated (concerning fighters only) in the Pathfinder Core Book now?


Top Secret S.I., back then for me, was the best for a spy, local, or commando scenario.

To this day, one character is still in jail, for chucking a flaming cocktail, during a shoot out, in Hard Rock Cafe, Manhattan NY, during a firefight. He threw the firebomb, straight at the upstairs serving bar.

And I asked him, 3 times, to make him understand to what he was doing.

So he did the action, after an investigation by Fed & Local law enforcement. He got busted, went to trial, and got sentenced for 20 years+.

That character was never played again. :)

And oh, he was a private dick (character wise).

Ah...cometh the cry that summons the HORDE!!!

-Tagged for reference-

-Tagged for reference-

Blaming 'pirates' is one problem, not advising the general public first is a greater one.

Wotc has not learnt this lesson.

Oh well...

Hmmm, where is the link to the errata?

Nevermind...found it.

AndyMML wrote:

Hey friends -

A quick update about what's new with 5th Epoch Publishing and the Metal, Magic and Lore RPG.

We just updated our website, see us at:

Early in the month of February we posted our binder covers as a free download here in the Paizo site. The covers were popular with the folks who follow the game in NYC, so we wanted to share them with people who enjoy the game, and live outside the tri-state area.

This past week we posted our newly revised Errata Booklet PDF. This free download addresses the errors and ommisions we found in the Basic Game Player's Rulebook. It also contains three Dwarven SAPs that had a series of numbers omitted and an Index. A number of fans had indicated they felt an index was missing from the book, so we took this opportunity to get this tool out there.

We are working hard on a number of PDFs that will be available here through Paizo. The next one to be completed should be our GM's Starter Kit. I'll write a little more about this in the coming days.

Thanks to everyone for their support and we're happy to answer any questions. So, post away!

Best Regards,


I agree with this statement...wholeheartly.

Khat wrote:
I met these guys at Gencon two years ago. I had to say that my initial touch with game was kind of wary. My job at Gencon was to try out games for a store in St. Louis. As I got to looking around there were only two roleplaying games I thought were even worth looking at and to say the least Metal Magic and Lore is the one who won out. The more I demo this game for people, and get my own gaming group into playing this, the more happy I am about owning it and trying to get other people into playing this. I grew up with D&D in the myriad of forms it has taken over the years and got burned out on the idea of fantasy roleplaying. To say the least Serenity was the big game for a while. Then my group got curious about MML. Wanted to give it a shot, and they are done with character creation and are enjoying the game and they have not even gotten to the game yet. (Schedule is hectic as all...heck!) They like the system and the lethality of your decisions. One of my players made the analogy of: D&D is an action figure you get to paint and chose the weapon it carries, MML, you get to carve the miniature from the ground up, paint it and put all the background detail around it. To say the least I was very happy to hear this from my players! I am hoping to see more of what these guys can do!

Do not travel alone without a Life Elementalism!

The Undead Union Local 1111, wishes to inform the living, that they have found us wanting, and they want us dead.

-runs away-

The Staten Island Kid wrote:
Just bought the Bestiary 1. I can only say Awesome! Can't wait to run these undead in a pit fight scenario. I'm scared just thinking about it. I ran them against myself for testing, and got my butt kicked. These guys are not your D&D undead. The skeletons can run circles around a decently armored character. More feedback soon!

You are quite welcome, and if I may add, MML should be considered a back to the basic of fantasy and adventuring.

-Made simple, of just you, the character and just the skills-

It is not everyday, you can redo a favorite module, from a different point of view.

Right now, I am looking of redoing old 1st Ed. 2nd, and maybe 3/3.5 Ed PCs, into the MML game engine.

Before I even get the stuff up, I can already reimagine them, in that style.

Almost got misty eye, just thinking about it.

Jpanjo wrote:


That was really awesome.

Thank you for putting the work into that. You are either paid to write all that (just kidding), or you must really enjoy the game! It is really great to hear about a new game that has done away with all the trimmings and still works well.

Just limited to an Attribute and percentage based skill system sounds fascinating to me. I can't believe they pulled that off, that it is that good. I looked at the website, and it seems they have a good number of PDF supplements that have been completed, but i do not see them on the site yet. Still, it sounds great.

I will discuss this with my group and look to pick up a copy if they would be willing to try it out.

Thanks again.


Additional PDFs are now up.

Time to get busy!

And yes, Mr. Andy is quite correct. I am not paid at all.



That was really helpful. OK, I can see a number of differences now as compared to D&D that you mentioned. Somewhere on the internet this game is compared to old Rolemaster. Do you have any familiarity with that game?

No, never played it, but saw some material of it.

I only know it slightly, didn't really play. It seemed really charts intensive.

Heard of that too

How does Meal Magic and Lore play? I have an idea of the character system, which seems fluid.

Attributes uses (using the D20), Affect these areas. (And using quoted references (slightly modified) from the Main book as well). Pages 46 to 50.

Primary Block

Stature--- (used only one time, during the Character Creation process). Roll on a chart, to determine the height, weight and natural strength; of the PC (this is fixed permanently,

Strength—determines how much weight can be carried, this includes, the types of armor that can be worned. The stronger the PC, the more heavier, the armor that one can have (which includes on what race is selected also.) But there is a catch on wearing the more ‘heavier/better protection’ armor. (*)

This attribute also affects the means to make rapid movements; therefore affecting his/her percentage change to attack and defend, Strength also affects a character’s ability to sustain damage, and the amount of weight that one can lift relative to their own size.

Coordination—is a measure of the character’s manual dexterity, speed, and ability to maneuver. This pertains to both his/her athletic skill and fine more ability.

This affects also the ability to move deftly, affecting the percentage chance to attack and defend, and to perform athletic endeavors.

Health—is a measure of Stamina and physical hardiness. A high Health indicates that the character has plenty of stamina. Furthermore, the higher a character’s Health, the more resistant to disease that character will be, and the more quickly the character will heal.

In game terms, a character’s Health affects his/her ability to replace lost hit points, as well as to replace evocation points used by magicians, who expend energy as they cast spells. Health also affects the character’s ability to sustain damage, his/her ability to resist fatigue, and the amount of weight he/she can carry.

Beauty—is a reflection of the character’s physical appearance. As a frame of reference, this score is based on what is generally considered comely by most Mannish societies. In general, some races will seem more or less beautiful to the eyes of Men, however; it is true that there are beautiful persons who exist among all of the races.

In game terms, Beauty affects the percentage of tasks that are influenced by the character’s physical appearance.

Intellect—represents analytic ability, including the capacity for logical thought. A high intellect would represent the abilities to solve complex or abstract problems and study academic material. Mathematics and astronomy are examples of skills related to intellect.

In game terms, a character Intellect affects his chance to execute task that require analytical thinking. If the character is a magician, it affects his ability to learn new spells.

Reason—is a measure of the ability to apply prior knowledge to a practical situation. The skills related to reason are wide ranging, and might everything from “Instruction,” essentially playing the role of a teacher, to “Streetwise,” the ability to work through a situation requiring shrewdness or practical understanding.

In game terms, a character’s Reason affects his ability to execute tasks involving common sense. If the character is a magician, it affects the character’s ability to cast spells or activate symbols.

Creativity—represents the ability to be inventive or innovative. Linguistic skills and the learning of new languages are influenced by the creativity attribute. Creativity also plays a role in skills as the writing of music, poetry, and calligraphy.

In game terms, a character’s Creativity affects his ability to execute tasks requiring ingenuity or artistic ability.

Presence---is a measure of the character’s ability to handle social situations and interactions. Those of high presence may be strong leaders in a group situation, and /or strong negotiators in situations that finesse and influence.

In game terms, a character’s Presence affects his percentage chance to execute tasks such as negotiation, influencing others, and performance arts.

Secondary Attributes—(as description by title only): Willpower, Evocation, Perception, System Strength, Fitness, Load. Your primary attributes affect these areas greatly.

Racial modifiers can affect your stats with positive or negative penalties.

On the skill front, something quite different than what D&D can provide, as mentions in my previous post. Depending on the race selected. They can be given a template of racial skills that are taught them, from the early years, as they grow. Additional ‘mundane’ skills can be added (with the DM’s approval), this is before the ‘profession’ is even chosen.

The level of ‘expertise’ can adjusted to represent on the hos-posh, on what the character knows, and what knowledge areas they are strong and weak in.

I have only a few other questions - sorry if I seem pesky, I am just looking for something new, but there is so much out there!

Yes there is, but what is chosen, is what we will feel most comfortable with. And no, you are not pesky.

What is the combat system like? Their website claims it is realistic and fast-paced.

A round in MML consists of 5 seconds.

(*) In related to wearing better/more protection armor, the ‘catch’ is that the heavier the armor, the slower on the reaction time to combat. (Weight is factor in on the Initiative modifier).

The Design of the engine was done to represent the near possible elements of true physical & magical combat.

Compare to Dungeon & Dragons current and past mechanics, the true grit of ‘reality combat’, was never allow to seep in, because of the certain complexities, that would seem to bog down on the overall atmosphere, to make the game fun & enjoyable

*This is subjected to variant views on what is considered—from a fun & enjoyable perceptions*

Showing the differences: MML illustrates the physical exertion, on weight of armor use. Physical fitness to see how long one can sustain the same fighting output in so-many rounds before fatigue sets in.

Injuries sustain during combat, can affect your means (on the percentage roll) to fight or defend effectively in the long run.

As example, your PC can be render with a crippling, unconscious or death blow, in the very first round, if a major vital area is hit. Surviving such a blow, will depend on what the armor worned, and what protections is provided. If your PC head is marginally protected with a decent medium helmet, the majority of the damage from the weapon used might be absorbed first on the helm, then if there any left over, the rest goes to the affected area. And depending on what is left…it can go from mild, to crippling, or very severe, or death in one round *it can happen quickly*. (In MML, body hit locations are used, with the body itself, divided into areas that can sustain damage, until they are made ineffective).

Weapons use---can also alter your initiative ratio, the weight, speed and reach are factored in, during the combat round. The damage of the (physics reality use on MML) weapons is very different than D&D.

Comparisons—the Longbow---The differences from 3.5 to 4th Edition and MML damage and range stats…

3.5 Edition—Cost 75 gold pieces, Dmg(Small creatures)—D6, Dmg(Medium Size)---D8, Crit-x3 Range Increment—100 ft, Weight 3 lb.

4th Edition---Prof(iciency?) +2, Damage D10, Range 20/40 (for battlemap uses), Price----30gp, Weight---3lbs.

MML---Pull Rating—80lbs, Initiative Modifier---6, Point Blank Range/10 yards--3D10 Dmg/ Effective Range/50 yards--3D8 Dmg. Long Range/90 yards--3D6 Dmg, Extreme Range/200 yards--1D10 Dmg. Weight 1.2 lbs, Cost 26 Bronze or Silver.

Even though the Dmg ratio alternate on the range, by MML chart, if a non/vital area is still hit, your performance in battle will be still affected on what damage is taken. And if a critical roll is established, well, wherever it lands, pray hard that your armor can absorb most of it (depending where on the armor has the greater protection and sometimes even that may not be enough). Or an exposed area is struck (no armor protection period), that event has been explained just above, on the possible results.

Magic fights receive the same benefits as well.

If there is failure on the roll, it may or may benefit you, or the opponent.

AC rating does not exist in MML. The ability is hit is base on whenever the incoming blow can pass the opponent’s defenses.

The majority of attacks can be defended, if using a sword and shield (close combat), the player can attack with weapon, and defend with shield, when the opposition attacks them.

Characters can dodge incoming missiles attack, but the percentage ratio is set very low (yeah, don’t think doing Kung Fu stuff here), the weight of gear and armor can play havoc even with the small chance you might have on that roll.

In reverse, if you have medium to light armor, you will have a better reaction time (penalties soften up), but in return, that armor will not provide the great protection that is needed.

No armor, (just clothing in general), will give you the means to get extra attacks, but you may have a crappie defense percentage, depending again on what is worn, and what weapon is used. In the case of no shield, the weapon in hand, will act as offensive and defense also *depending on what is faced*.

When characters reach their ‘Fatigue’ point in combat, even if, by chance you didn’t take any injuries throughout the combat rounds, a roll check will be required to see if the ‘rest call’ will be heeded to recover from the excretion of activities. If the roll is failed, then you must for 6 rounds (if that correct), to ‘catch your breath’ as they say.

There are certain powers, that can alleviate that problem, if the battle is that important to win (wait, consider every battle is must to win), or take a chance to fall back, and hope that your companions can handle it, until you return refreshed. *Having a Healer on hand will help greatly*

If you are injured, the damage sustain will add up, and will be calculated to see how much it affects the ‘body’ overall. There are several levels of injuries that will affect your percentage roll and possibly your attribute numbers as well.

There is no resurrection in this game. So…chose your fights wisely.

In this game, there is a body hit location; armor hit location, what weapons are effective (for damage) on what type of armor is worned. This is the meat of MML; there is some armor that has a high threshold on taking great amounts of damage. But those are the ones that can slowdown the reaction time in combat, greatly.

Wearing full Plate armor is great, but if the opponent is wearing lighter armor, will get more attacks on you. Meanwhile, ye will be stuck with one attack per round, no matter what you Init. Roll might be, and if you get injury…retreat if you can, I mean that with all sincerity.

How is magic presented?

Ah Magic…okay…first off, the slot system DOES NOT exist here. Second, depending on what profession, in the arcane field is picked, there are benefits to some.

Second, depending on what profession is selected, you can start off knowing a substantial amount of spells. You may know a lot, but what will limit your use, is the cost.

Upon character creation, if you are a caster of the arts, your primary attributes will generate a fixed given number (a pool of points), e.g. let’s says 62 points. Within that ratio, and depending on the cost of the spell invoked, again an example, a Life Elementalist using Eyes of the Wolf, cost 14 EP (Evocation Points). Now, depending on your roll, the points required can fluxate, by a successful roll, the normal cost goes on, if you get a critical success, the cost use is cut in half, or if you fail badly, you might burn up the cost in double effect and may disrupt your remain pool as well. (Yupe, there are dangers in spell casting as well) But with one noted acceptation, armor will not affect the energies used but will affect your Initiative roll, depending on the weight.)

The style of magic in MML is represented by these 3 areas; Wizardry, Elementalism and Symbolism.

The first one need no description, the second, Elementalism is based on the five elements, Air, Water, Fire, Earth and Life. And the Symbolism represents the power of magic by combing rituals and special geometric shapes.

Most of the formation on the magic writing was researched, using actual earth’s history. You will not find any important names that are well known through D&D magik history.(That is a good thing).

The view on magic, in the MML setting is seen as just ‘there’ in tone. The majority of the population just think it is just ‘mind tricking’ stuff, while those are ‘aware’ are wary, and there are those who know…and feels its present must be kept to a minimal. But again, whatever tone is set, is basically up to the Storyteller.

What about magic items, treasures, and monsters? How is the world?

Magic items—I cannot say anything of substance yet, because I have not encountered the usual ‘me find a great item of power’ jaunt.

Treasures—MML is not set up, with the precursor, of finding treasure out in the open. (Sorry, couldn’t help myself there). If there be treasure to be found, the usual tales of whispers, a founded map, or someone mentioning lost items of great value haven’t cross my character’s path yet.

Monsters—Tales of old, used in earth’s history, are used as the templates in MML’s monsters, and yes, there are some familiar ones, seen in D&D, that have been formatted to the MML engine. The major differences between them is, wait, here an example coming again.

Take the much hated and loved Kobolds, half Hit dice creatures, easy to kill, from the previous editions of D&D. (in 4E, they might have some bite now)

Take those same creatures, rev them up on the MML engine, with added battle tactics and weapons….you will have a different outcome. I have been told, that an old D&D module with Kobolds in a cave has been visited several times (using MML conversion)…the outcome as I was told, has been the same.
The attackers will get their butts handed to them, all the time, and the deepest penetration some far, was forty feet inward, and no further. The previous attempts before, met with failure and death, at the cave’s main entrance.

My reaction on every time I hear that…is like, DAMN, that sucks!

And happy…the (play-tested) Kobolds rule in MML, for now.

And oh yeah, MML monsters are a tough bunch.

The World---There are three different styles/types; one can do in the MML settings—

Spartan setting/In the Spartan campaign setting, the resources available to the player characters are limited. It is likely that characters will begin the campaign with few skills, and the ones they do possess will be developed as the campaign unfolds.

Adventurer’s Campaign/This is the common campaign setting in Metal, Magic & Lore. It is recommended for groups of all experience levels, including those who have little or no experience with role-playing games.

Heroic Campaign/The Heroic campaign setting is the stuff of legend. Player characters will take on qualities that are seemingly larger than life, and they will have many resources at their disposal.

Is this too much to ask?

Well, you got a lot today. (Laughing)

What is given here is just a smudge, if you really need to know more, the best offer I can advice, is to buy the main book. There is more detail info, there, to what I am giving here.

Your post led me to a few more questions. First, I wanted to ask what your role is as being with the creator/publisher - are you on the design staff, or are you a volunteer of sorts? I just was curious to know where you are coming from.

I am not a member of the Design team, in any fashion. I have been a Gamer for 22 years+ ongoing. Just someone who tends to check out RPG material very thoroughly

And no, not a volunteer either.

5th Epoch Publishing is based in Manhattan New York.

As far as what you mention, how is the character’s building system? You mention that it is more flexible and free of feats. Can you be more specific?

I will refer to Page 4 & 5 of the Main Book of Metal Magic & Lore.

Character Building(Character Profession) 01.02.05—Players who are already familiar with role-playing may expect that during the character creation process, the player must choose a ‘character class’ or ‘profession’ to delineate the notable skills and talents of his/her character. Such character types are often grouped into generic titles such as ‘Warrior,’ ‘Wizard,’ or ‘Clergy,’ In Metal Magic and Lore, the character creation process is slightly different and the terms are used differently.

A Character ‘class’ refers only to his economic or social status, and this is described in detail in the Character Creation section. A character’s ‘profession’ refers to the essential skills that the character has used thus far to earn his or her living. These factors may be considered separately from each other, or may be intimately related to the character’s adventuring persona.

If a player imagines an adventuring character to be of a certain type, a magician for example, then it is quite possible that the character will be skilled in some other profession in addition to this current role. For example, the character may have been earning a living as a scribe or seneschal prior to or during the time which the magical skills were required. This idea can also apply to a warrior who has been a soldier in the past, but has recently earned a living as a mercenary.

Players are encouraged to invent their characters from pure imagination, using only the logic of a creative background to guide the choice of skills and talents. It is possible to have a sword-wielding magician, or a warrior who is skilled in herbal healing.

In lament terms, comparative to D&D, the majority of the Classes in that system do not allow the means to express the character first ‘mundane’ career. The skill point pool is very tight, not allowing the ability to express that character had a different life in the beginning.

With one exception, the Rogue, which has more points than all the classes, is the only character with the means to express a ‘mundane’ life, before taking only the more ‘exciting’ profession. And I don’t count the ‘Cross-Class’ feature either, I did once, but not anymore.

(MML)The overall system is Skilled-based, the attributes are D20 (are used for saving throws, jumping, perception check, and other actions, *determining what situation that arise*, that is the only use). .

Weapon fighting, offensive and defensive, magic use, offensive, defensive, and healing, are percentage based also.

There is a ranking marker, or what should be said a’ title of experience’ for the skills, as more practice is gained. As the following shows:


When the percentage factor excels a given number (e.g. Skilled in Fishing is currently at 09%--that marks as a Novice learner, but later, if the PC pursue that skill at a steady pace, throughout the game sessions. He/she would be known to others one day, as a Competent or Journeyman of that skill *averaging around 15% to 25%)

And depending on what race is selected, that percentage base can be increased or decreased with modifiers.

Since this is a Skill-base system, Feats will not function in these mechanics. Plus, it is not Level-Based either.

In Lament terms, the character created by you, with DM’s approval, can be custom-tailored to your specifications. Even if, there is not a rule or guideline for a certain situation, it can be house-ruled if needed, to make that something work. This again, comes under an agreement and understanding by the Game Master and you. The system does allow such matters like this, to take place.

Here are couple more things to add. On Character Creation, it is stated (in the book); it will take 15 minutes to an hour, to create a persona. That will be based on the level of expertise of that individual that is well verse in CC.

For beginning players, once you understand the system, there is a lot that can be done with it.

All guidelines/rules, are based only in the Main book, there will be NO additional editions printed, I believe, and was told, that future errata can be located at their site, to update the MB or supplements (in PDF format).

Also, what is the setting like? How does it compare to other fantasy RPGs?

The setting has been referred to a Lord of the Ring style. There is are NO Gods outright to give reverence. Bronze and Silver are the current coin (Gold is a great luxury to acquire). The Magic uses a mana System (points pool), no slots!

If you are steep in Medival History, then the setup of MML will be idea place to use.

But that will come down to personal taste. So far, I have been liking it lot. If what I say here is not enough. Please feel free to inquire more.

At Metal Magic & Lore

Yes I am, currently with the creator/publisher, in New York. I do like the system very much, and in my opinion, it is more flexible in character creation.

I do highly recommend on getting it. And if you have played previous D&D characters. You might want to revisit them with the MML engine.

Things will be more different (especially on combat), and the fact that skills can be tailored to the character's history of your making, with DM's approval of course.

And Feat Free! (Not needed).

I have been playing since January, and plan to host a campiagn myself, hopefully next year.

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