Axebeak

Haldrick's page

316 posts (317 including aliases). No reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 1 alias.



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OK so to start, I was a player so don't know all of where we diverted from the AP as written. And a lot of it was played a long time ago, so memory is sketchy
Clearly this is a great AP. We were an unbalanced party. We started as
Abigale 1/2 Elf Cleric/Paladin of Erastil
Kelso Gnome Wizard (Illusionist)
Jarl Dwarven Ranger (Archery)
Sven 1/2 Orc Rouge

The opening book was run straight as written as far as I can tell. Really great Sandbox with a tough fight at the end. We chose to start our kingdom centred on the Stag Lords base. With kingdom building we set out to keep the kingdom reasonably small to keep the DCs under control.

It was in the second book where the DM started to get creative. I am reasonable sure Kingmaker is the AP which is least likely to have no custom material in it. Some examples of ours:
Our spymaster was an awakened, very intelligent horse.
We had a recurring thread about a spy and shadowy organisations. I am reasonably sure this came from a random dice roll, when the DM roll a minor item of a scroll of read magic. As you need read magic to read it why would you write it? This led to all kinds of spy stuff.
We had a recurring Necromancer from a random encounter.

Anyway second book equally great sandbox.

Book 3 Was run as written (apart from the madness happening at home) It has the first dungeon of any size, but the was great. Abigale who at this stage only has one level in cleric, so was a mid level Paladin should have smited the lich's *@##, but of course got paralysed. The rest of the party had to rescue her.

About this time we also noted Kelso incredible ability to teleport us into the Hooktongue. So much so that Abigale bought a folding boat.
While on the subject of Kelso, he had a number of item creation feats and we used them a lot


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Yes we have not ventured into 2nd E. We have at least half a dozen AP to run and loads of 1st Ed classes yet to play.

Thoughts on the campaign and books to follow (work is a bit crazy)


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We alternate between 3 DMs, playing one book before another DM takes over.
We started Kingmaker in 2010
Finished last night
Found Nyrissa (for the second time) She hit 3 of the characters with a prismatic ray. Karli the 2 weapon fighter rolled a 1 on a poison ray. Abigale Paladin/cleric saved. Kelso failed against insanity.
Sven the rouge was blinded by he beauty a few rounds later.
Kelso contributed when the confusion roll allowed. Abigale went toe to toe with Nyrissa. Briar protected her with SR.
Finally rolled a 20 and confirmed the critical for the 2nd time and beheaded her (again)

I will add some more comments about the campaign later


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So we alternate who is DMing
Kingmaker is about to end. We just found the boss at the end
Jade regent has 2/3 of book 5 to go (and obviously Book 6)
Giantslayer we will start book 3 soon.

We still have many AP to run/play RotRL, Iron Gods, Hells Rebels and Hells Vengeance and WotR. I don't see us leaving 1st Edition for several decades.


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I am currently Playing in Kingmaker, Curse of the Crimson Throne, Munies Mask and Giant Slayer.
I am running Jade Regent and Ruins of Azlanti


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I would add more minions (as well as adding some levels)
Witch is certainly more agressive (and very hag like)


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Book 3 is not a diversion, or no more then Book 2 and 4. All are getting the characters from the castle to Minkai.
It has been commented on before that half the AP is getting you to Tian Xia, and another book to get to Minkai. So it is not a very Oriental AP.
I am running this and the party are just approaching the Forest of Spirits. My players found nothing wrong with book 3. We had long dropped the caravan rules.


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Sorry for the late reply.
I agree with Yakman. It will work fine ending with book 3. The AP takes a different tone after this and it can logically end here.


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The last book of Serpents Skull has has this as well. We all joked about selling the doors and hiring mercenaries to complete the adventure


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That is why I think classes should not have less than 4 skill points per level


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This question may impact the
"This outsider was summoned and has been a guardian here for 1,000 years"
Staple
They cannot do this without adequate supplies


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The group I play with are sticking with 1st Edition.

We have just finished Serpents Skull and will start Giant Slayer or Hell's Vengeance with that GM.

We are 2/3 way through Kingmaker. That GM has Wraith of the Righteous to run.

I am half way through running Jade Regent and have Iron Gods, War for the Crown and Rise of the Runelords (AE) to run.

We also have the hardback CotCT and Emerald Spire

This lot will keep us busy till the 2030's
We tried the play test. It didn't turn us off like 4th ed D&D did bot the changes were not "Wow we have to chuck away £100's of stuff to start a new edition.


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We recently completed this AP. We started about the time it came out, but it is one of 3 being run in the group. Even so you can tell we are not quick.

Since I wrote the following in the “Who are your Castaways” a few things changed.

Quote:

“We have reach 12th level now.

Tian (Monk) Has become the skill monkey/2nd rank combat person
Valden (Druid) Has 2 modes a) Buff his dinosaur animal companion into a killing machine or b) Wild shape and cast spells or buff himself into a slightly less dangerous killing machine
Toomba the sorcerer has the aberrant bloodline so has just gained long limbs/fortification/SR. His mage armour has been very useful. He does not cast it on himself often, monks wildshaped druids and Animal Companions like it a lot.
Gardura, inquisitor A bit of a glass cannon. Devastating when not fallen over. Main Healer”

Tian died a couple of times. On each occasion only a reincarnate was available. So Tian went from Human to Elf to Halfling. From a mechanical point of view the character was fine in each new form. Towards the end Valden lost his T Rex animal companion (hit with a prismatic spray and ended on a random plane) He was replaced by a velociraptor who was not quite so scary. Valden also started summoning a lot more towards the end.

Toomba just got more powerful without changing much.
Gardura multiclassed into fighter. She was finding that without extensive preparation she was missing too much with ¾ BAB.

So how did we find it?
Book 1 is widely regarded as a great module and I would agree.
Book 2 is on tight railroads, but enjoyable enough.
Book 3 we really enjoyed the sandbox of a city to explore.
Book 4 This became a drag, particularly with the titled madness
Book 5 and 6 were ok without being great.

The final fight we had some sensible tactics. The Druid pin the Big Bad Guy (BBG) in place with summons creatures. Even the BBG finds a purple worm a distraction. However the normally effective Toomba’s sole contribution was communal Prot Energy. Everything else bounced off SR or was saved.
On the who we enjoyed our time in the jungle and thanks to everyone who helped produce the AP.


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I think a fourth character is your best route.
Whether this is someone playing 2 characters, an DM run NPC or a NPC run by the other player on a rota will depend on the preference of the people involved.


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I can understand the OP. I spent hours on these boards every week. But now they will be supporting a system I am not playing. No criticism of Paizo they have to support their new game.

I have nothing against PF 2nd. It just didn't strike my group in as a big improvement.
When you have enough AP to last 10 years and loads of character options yet to try, and £100's already invested why make a change for a marginal improvement.

I feel a hole in my life coming up. I am still interest in the setting so the fiction will still be of interest, as will any guides to Glorantha. But the crunch not so much.


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Going back to the OP's original point. This is something I have found amazing. On their own site they have simply made very general comments.

Mathmuse pulled together some quotes to show that Paizo had talked about the design plans

Jason Bulmahn wrote:


Welcome to the next evolution of the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game!
Just shy of 10 years ago, on March 18th, 2008, we asked you to take a bold step with us and download the Alpha Playtest PDF for Pathfinder First Edition. Over the past decade, we've learned a lot about the game and the people who play it. We've talked with you on forums, we've gamed with you at conventions, and we've watched you play online and in person at countless venues. We went from updating mechanics to inventing new ones, adding a breadth of options to the game and making the system truly our own. We've made mistakes, and we've had huge triumphs. Now it is time to take all of that knowledge and make the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game even better.
...
New, but the Same
Our first goal was to make Pathfinder Second Edition feel just like the game you know and love. That means that as a player, you need to be able to make the choices that allow you to build the character you want to play. Similarly, as a Game Master, you need to have the tools and the support to tell the story you want to tell. The rules that make up the game have to fundamentally still fill the same role they did before, even if some of the mechanics behind them are different.

Building a Character
It's worth taking a moment to talk about how characters are built, because we spent a lot of time making this process smoother and more intuitive. ...

Playing the Game
We've made a number of changes to the way the game is played, to clean up the overall flow of play and to add some interesting choices in every part of the story. First up, we have broken play up into three distinct components.

The problem is that this is just motherhood and apple pie.

There may have had interviews and/or said things on other sites. But I expected this site to be where I go for that information

Mathmuse did show that the blogs on proficiency and feats had some high end objectives. But I have been disappointed in the lack of information on what was it about Ed 1 which requires a new edition and what they are trying to achieve.

As the playtest is now over I doubt we will get anything


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I have to agree with the OP. Apart from dex bases builds, this rule will make most weapons very sub optimal. Each class will migrate towards the weapon with the biggest dice.

It is one of many parts of 2nd Ed which I think are going in the wrong direction. Hopefully it will change when the finished rules come out.


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I agree that unless one is full time looking into this it is impossible to keep track of all that Paizo is saying on the playtest.

Personally I am inclined to stay with 1st edition, but am open to be persuaded. Currently they are not doing that. But it might be that I am missing important messages. Stuff on blogs/streams/interviews need to be linked to a "Pazio Blog" on the site.


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I first watched it at Christmas, so to ME its a Christmas movie!


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The caster vs martial balance depends on many things (as well as the table)
1. The length of the adventuring day. At low levels a wizard can one shot and encounter (sleep/colour spray) But how often can they do it? At high levels you still have limited high level spells. Lower level spells and wand normal do not have a dramatic effect.
2. Do the party know what they will be encountering? Clearly prepared casters benefit from this more than spontaneous ones
3. Do they know when they will encounter them? Linked to number 1

Clearly each table has it’s own balance. We have never really found a problem. Pathfinder has certainly levelled things out. We certainly find no shortage of people playing martials which is the real test.

• Battlefield control is useful, but not easy to pull off in reality, as opposed to the theory, without also hindering your colleagues
• Direct Damage has improved under Pathfinder but requires considerable specialisation to consistently keep up
• Save or suck is where pathfinder has even things since 3.5. The suck is now seldom as bad as it used to be.


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Serpents Skull and Skull and Shackles can also finish early.
Jade Regent could be changed so that you are simply trying to get the NPC to the other side of the world and not worry about what happens there.

Ruins Azlanti can be finished early, after the end of book 3.


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Seriously Ninja'ed

"Trap Spotter is a great talent for the role you say you want to play."

Trap Spotter and Fast Stealth" Great talents for any style of play in my opinion


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OK.
1. Rogue is the weakest class in the core rule book (and probably the game). This doesn't mean don't play one, but understand they have lots of other classes stepping on their toes

2. You have stated this is for PFS. So think what does my character contribute. Perception is the most useful skill in and out of combat.
a) Out of combat Appraise is seldom of help in PFS length adventures, Picking pockets (Slight of hand) is very very situational. Disable device (lock picking and disarming traps) does come up but not a lot. The social skills Sense Motive, Diplomacy and Bluff all have their uses
b) What is your role in combat? This something you need to consider at the start.

Peronally I love skill points, so do play rogue. The other disadvantage is you need to understand how many of the skill in the game work instead on concentration on just a few.

On your specific character I would move the skill points in appraise and slight of hand skill. I would also question why you have combat expertise feat. If this is to lead to improved feign then fine, otherwise pick a feat which build on your chosen combat preference.

Hope this is of help


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While the legality of Sarenrae has changed, I think there is still a lot of prejudice. This will probably be more likely the closer you are to the boarder. I can also see it as more entrenched in the upper classes.
This could still have your character hiding his allegiance from family and all his peers. It could still be a secret with all the roleplaying it can create.


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There appear to lots of people who are stating that the Allied powers in WW2 were evil. All sides used conscription.

Likewise the Korean War was fought with conscripts as far as the UK was concerned (not sure about the rest of the UN forces)

Looking at more historical examples. Most Ancient and military forces in civilised countries/empires used military service which was not voluntary.

Are we saying the whole world is evil?

While an individual paladin and/or religion may hold this view it would be seen as odd/out of place in the real world.


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Most adventures have railroads, work with the GM.


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Remember a lot of stuff said on these boards may not apply/be correct for your table.


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Just a few starters

Before Devil ruled Cheliax
When Hermea was a barren rock
Before the world knew of guns
When the god Razmiran was just a twinkle in his ancestors eye


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I am running Jade Regent and the party are a few books ahead of you.
Enjoying the read. Kali has a distinctive voice which brings the story to life.


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Byzantium did not see themselves as the successor to Rome. The were the part of the Roman Empire which did not fall. They were Romans and Latins. The difference is a more modern consideration

The identification of Taldor with Byzantium rather then Rome is interesting because it is something done less often in RPGs, while Rome comparisons are quite common.

Personally I think the issue of slaves is a minor detail, with more interesting things to consider first.


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Just wanted to disagree with one thing from Sir Longears

"Taldor and Magic: I think their view of magic are pretty standard... they are neither fanatic about it nor dismissive. It is simply a tool to achieve something. If you take in consideration the usual picture of a Duke, who probably had devoted much of his life in the military career, he'd probably not be a wizard... on the other hand he would acknowledge the value of having a wizard on his court as an advisor."

A Duke has probably never had a career. Most would not serve in the military. They may get to lead an army due to position/political clout.

He would be raised to further the interests of the family in the great game of politics.

Additionally:
The Royal family may not be absolute monarchs, but if they were just first among equals I would expect there to have been more changes of royal family then we have been told of.

Personally I have always seen Taldor as similar to Byzantium. Clinging on with a politic system that is half the ptoblem and not any help with a solution.


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Has anyone run this module and if so what was you experience?

I am particularly looking at the story awarded experience and the speed of advancement.The module need the party to be 8th before they face the Big Badie at the end. Therefore they need to be 7th when the enter the Manor. The problem appears to be starting at 5th.

The gap between 5th and 7th is too big for the module to fill, hence the story awards of Experience.

My problem is that the PC's will be shooting through levels every 2 sessions. It may just be easier to start at 6th.

However reading a module is different to playing it. Has anyone played this, and what have they found?


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The "healing in combat is a waste/inefficient" mantra like most perceived wisdom on the web has to be taken with caution.

What is said on a forum may have no relevance to your game. These perceived wisdom's are always based on assumptions which might not apply to your game. If you are all enjoying yourselves you are doing nothing wrong.


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Occult could bring up stuff which claims to get around normal prophecy,
Séances, Spirits, ancient lore.

The Knights of the Ioun Star know a lot about him. Aboleths (good luck to the party getting them to talk). Thassilonian ruins/records or Azlanti ruins themselves. The Mordant Spire Elves

These spring to mind


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Basically, without a totally different build you simply need to SA more. Without party support your only real option is feint. To do this usefully you need improved feint, which needs Combat Expertise. So without re-training you are 2 feats away.

Other stuff can help around the edges, but your class is designed to get combat damage from SA.


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Looking at real life history then several thing become apparent (in no particular order):
Salt is massively important (Roman legionaries were paid in it)
England became rich on wool
There is a big difference between short haul and long haul trade.
Allot of short distance trade was food and materials to make clothes and household goods. Urban areas need a lot of stuff shipped in to support them. Even in Golarion most of the world is still very rural and trade would be to to and from any rural center.
Long range trade is always a balance between weight/baulk vs value. Hence the spice trail from east to west was named after that product. The huge profit from the slave trade only came about because of very high demand in the Americas. Prior to that it had been generally a (high profit) small scale business, over relatively short distances. Skilled slaves might be moved around the Mediterranean or from Africa to the Middle East or vis versa but you would not see huge numbers moved long distances.
Overland trade over long distances tended to have a lot of merchants moving the goods part of the way. The spice trail did not have Chinese merchant turning up in Venice/Cairo with their caravan. Sea travel between East and West changes this.


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Book 1 includes a journey of about 2.5 weeks. But not a lot of other time
Book 2 Starts with a journey but after that is urban and time constrained
Book 3 is a long overland journey, lots of time.
Book 4 has a stay in a city. Then a journey. Then a big dungeon.
Book 5 Is very sandboxy. Lots of time
Book 6 Not a lot of time


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We have found that a wizard has been useful. You have plently of time to craft items, unlike many APs


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Avern from Savage Tide. Baby sitting a spoilt brat was great fun (for the GM).


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The monk weapons in the core rule book are clear. The monk weapons introduced in the APG all state that monks are proficient in them. The weapons in UC do not. Am I missing something or do monks have to burn a feat to use these effectively?