Epic Meepo wrote:
11) 6th-level prepared spells, medium/heavy armor, cleric-like spell list (war priest)
Possible Loot Methods...
5-Finger Discount - Pocket something when no one is looking. Sleight of Hand check vs an opposed perception check. Each pocketed item makes to easier to be detected next time.
Contract - Player X is interested in crafting mats. Player Y is interested in gear. Player Z just wants a larger cut of the cash.
Need/Greed/Pass - Old, tried, true, hated by a lot of people. You've got the jerks that just 'need' everything instead of using it appropriately.
Round Robin - Each person is assigned an item that they get. Lots of strange loopholes and usually doesn't come out fair. Often combined with the need/greed/pass system to better deal with rare items.
Open Loot - Free For All. Again, often combined with Need/Greed/Pass to deal with rare items.
Loot Table - A big list of all of the loot. Players can choose a variety of methods to distribute items including some of the methods listed above. Also, a switchback draft system could be used in combination (example order: A, B, C, D, D, C, B, A, A , B, C, D ...) which has its own advantages and disadvantages.
Well, getting "That one rare drop" I don't believe will be an issue. The reason I don't think it will be an issue is that there won't be regular raids to go kill the same big boss every week.
Instead, you'll have to search for strongholds to break into every time you want to go "raid". These will be a new one with a different group of baddies running it each time. Loot will probably be randomly generated from a couple tables grabbing an item type, subtype, and lob a series of keywords onto it and then randomly generate a cool name for it based on those keywords. That's if the looting is setup like a traditional theme-park MMO.
What I'm guessing (based on some random comments from the Goblinworks guys) is that you'll kill the boss and he'll have whatever he was using on him. Otherwise, you'll raid his treasure trove and find a bunch of gold, crafting materials, wondrous items, potions, and a few randomly created weapons/armor in the method I listed above. You'll probably also find more general quality items as well that could be sold.
Really, don't expect to see things laid out at all like a traditional MMO.
I agree with Xaer that a contract system would probably be negotiated, but even that gets sketchy when you start listing out items that have to be compared against regional trading posts in order to figure out their value.
You'll probably be doing this in well defined groups from your chartered company, settlement, or kingdom as there will be no "Random Dungeon Finder" nor "Random Raid Finder". There will likely be an internal organizational structure about how you distribute loot (DKP, Suicide Kings, Loot Council, etc) specific to the group you run with that figures out how to split things out and keeps a cut for the overarching organization itself.
So, only run with people you trust. Ninja-looters will be thrown out of their respective organizations, have bounties put on them, and will have people hunt them down in game to exact just punishment for their crimes.
Okay, I remember a discussion on this from Ryan, but can't find the actual reference for it.
Essentially, there will be something like 4 to 8 game days per real life day. This gives people the opportunity who can't play 24/7 to participate in events that happen at "night" or "day" that they normally wouldn't be online to participate in. This includes access to particular resources, bad guys, and rituals.
However, months are still going to line up with the real world months. This means that in the PFO game, months are just 4 to 8 times longer than they should be.
This is all paraphrasing from what I can remember, but I think that's how it went.
If this were in another industry, it would be called a "soft launch". It's something that's kinda-sorta open, but still has some gate to prevent things from getting out of hand. A dress-rehearsal of sorts.
I really like the idea of it being labeled as "Kickstarter Launch" or something similar to let people know that it's launched, but only for the people that helped it get off the ground in the first place.
Sorry, the following also popped into my head based on other comments.
Generally, the best place for skirmishers is in your opponent's back field. This is sometimes called a Rabbit group. The general idea is that while the main forces are formed up against each other, the skirmishers sneak in the back and start to foul up the lines of communication as well as stabbing people in the back. If you hear the order to charge or fall back coming from behind, your instinct is to believe that it's your own officers giving that order. It could be the skirmishers instead.
The reason this is successful is that the formations aren't able to face two opponents at once and if they have to break off a couple fighters to deal with that group of skirmishers, then the line itself has been weakened.
In essence, skirmishers mess up the ability of the enemy formations to function properly.
The other good place for a skirmisher group is in your own back field to kill any skirmishers your opponents send against you.
The other advantage of these groups is that if the line is starting to fall, the skirmisher group can be cannibalized to reinforce the line.
That and it's very hard to flourish with an illegal system that has little to no advantage over a completely legitimate system.
The people providing the illegal service will generally give up in that scenario as it won't be profitable enough to pursue as most people will generally prefer to take a legitimate route if one is available.
Having rituals for certain spells to be cast isn't "ground breaking" in MMOs, they've actually been done before. Warlocks in World of Warcraft used to need to do a very long quest chain in order to gain the ritual to summon a certain powerful demon as a slave.
When they did this ritual, everyone in their party had to help summon the demon and it would randomly sacrifice one of the party members upon summoning at which point the Warlock could enslave the demon. The problem with this is that there was a 20% chance that the Warlock would be the person sacrificed and then you'd have an unrestrained demon running around killing your party.
This wasn't a one time thing. This was the ritual that happened any time you wanted to summon this demon to fight for you (and he was pretty powerful, so you really did want him).
Now, would it be cool to have some "teamwork feats" for casting show up in the game? Sure. Probably something similar to the group tactics talked about in today's blog, but altered to match casting instead of soldiering.
Your guess is as good as mine.
It sounds like there will probably be a series of commands for the officer to be able to give in order to move the unit around, put it into a defensive posture, engage enemy, charge, hold, flank, turn, and a variety of other small unit tactics. Those commands will have a corresponding button on a special group tactics toolbar that the grunts in the unit have to hit within a window of time with being either early or late being bad.
For example: The officer yelling "Advance!" means that on a certain beat (generic term designating a period of time and in now way related to DDR) you need to press the button labeled 'advance'. "Wheel left" means you need to hit the one that turns the unit left and so on.
I'd also guess that generals will be given a slightly modified version of that command list that would allow them to command the officers under them to go various places or to perform various tasks which get repeated down the line.
It's a lark playing on Magic the Gathering.
However, I think they'll end up with a system that is very similar to other systems currently used in video games, but with a more Pathfinder spin on it. Also, while I think it will be influenced by the vancian system, it won't necessarily hold directly to it in a lot of cases and may diverge completely from it.
For example, how do you show the difference in a Sorcerer and a Wizard in an online video game? They have the same spells after all. I think it comes down to resource systems and adaptability.
Sorcerers would have a finite spell list available to them that could be changed under very special circumstances, but within that finite spell list, they'd have a distinct amount of power. They'll likely have a casting resource of some sort (think mana as a reference) and higher level spells consume larger portions of that resource and lower level spells consume less of that resource. But, the resource would regenerate slowly over time in combat and possibly faster out of combat (or at least have some way of being made to do so).
Wizards, on the other hand, have a seemingly infinite amount of ways that they can prepare spells based on the spells available in their spell book, but once they are chosen, that list is fairly fixed until they re-prep their spells. So, we'll say that our Wizard prepared fireball 3 times today and as such can easily cast the spell 3 times in succession. The problem is that he must then wait for that spell slot to recharge (any amount of time based on gameplay and balance) before it can be used again. This would allow for the customizations and feeling of a prepared caster without being limited to _ONLY_ having that spell 3 times for a 6 hour period (remember, they've sped up time 4x in PFO so that you get 4 'days' per 24 hour period). There will be some mechanism to add spells to your spell book either by merit badges or by just purchasing scrolls and scribing them in (with a chance to botch it).
Other than the customization of spells available, we're talking about resource systems which are fairly standard across the video game markets and each have their own issues balancing. You can have more in depth resource systems or simple ones such as the ones I described. There is something to be said about a more complex resource system to manage in that it forces players to use more skill to play. A lot of games have started using hybrid resource systems involving multiple types of resources that you must manage in order to use your abilities.
It still comes down to how Goblinworks wants to do their combat system. If they really wanted to, it could be turn-based and have an interface like old school Final Fantasy games. Until they figure out their combat model, any guesses at the magic system are rather moot, because they won't have a proper context in which to be framed.
All in all, I'll still bet it's going to be similar to most modern video game magic systems in some fashion with a little flare thrown on to make it their own.
TLDR: No idea and neither do you.
It will likely be fairly similar to other magic systems in MMO or single-player RPG video games. It could be anything from the Diablo III style to SW:TOR to Skyrim. We don't know until they announce it and they will likely announce something that aligns with their overall concept of how their combat system will work in the game. Until they figure out their combat system, they can't really figure out their magic system and for the most part, vice-versa.
Until then, I'm predicting that it will be a system based on cards and you have to 'tap' certain cards in order to play others. These eldrich spells will be aligned with certain colors and you'll want to build decks of them in order to be a powerful magic user.
Manual of Gainful Employment +1 ?
Those are three of the big ones.
Of course, Ryan said that they're using an engine that supports a full MMO back-end and not just the graphical front-end. As such, Unity falls into the same box as Unreal Engine and is unlikely to be the client, because it lacks the billing and support infrastructure on the server side.
Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Reference Document on Paizo.com wrote:
Emphasis mine. Source Paizo's [link].
And I'm done with this thread.
BigWorld engine has been fairly successful. There's a couple fantasy MMOs using it as well as some really popular off-the-wall concepts (World of Tanks!).
HeroEngine is what I thought BioWare was using for SWTOR, but I can't remember.
Icarus Studios makes an MMO engine, but I don't know anything about any games made on it.
Multiverse died and went open source. Being as Ryan said that they'd negotiated a contract, I highly, highly doubt that this is their engine.
Monumental Dev Suite disappeared off the face of the planet never to be seen again.
BigWorld is the most likely candidate, but if that fell through then I'd guess HeroEngine.
I don't know enough about Icarus to even start to predict them as using it.
This sounds a little too much like Puzzle Pirates for my liking.
I was thinking more of having collected all of the materials from harvesting, monster killing, and dungeon delving, you give the stuff to the foreman and he clicks 'Build Inn'. X amount of time passes and the building appears.
Well, you'd want to pick someplace you know... and you know should be 'safe'.
There is, after all, a chance of mishap and all that. If you're trying to go someplace that is owned by another group and the little forest glade you've chosen to arrive in has been cut down or there's a watch tower sitting there now, then you're much more likely to screw it up in some way.
Ah, I see. That would make sense if you weren't in my head, which you weren't. :) As I demonstrated, I was talking about expecting a single product to "steal the market." There is no magic bullet so don't even look. If you look at wildly popular consumer products such as the iPhone you'll see that the product itself doesn't really do much besides enabling other functionality so it gets to be an extension of consumer expression instead of being the end-result of that expression. Outside of these types of products, you get into niche markets where product diversification is the way to go.
Wildly popular products also have the concept of "Network Externalities" working for them. Essentially, their functionality gets them some users and then at a certain point they reach critical mass and the fact they have sufficiently large community of users is what starts attracting other users.
I'm likely flubbing the explanation, but I originally came across that concept in an interview I read on some gaming site quite a long time ago. You might take a look at it and see if you can find if that guy has done anything since.
So, I've been tracking down and downloading all of the nice, long deity articles from the APs.
I've got ones for:
Have I missed any?
Well, why shouldn't they be allowed to pick their alignments? You do in the normal RPG.
You're also allowed to start out at a settlement that best matches your alignment. There is the chaotic settlement (Thornkeep) in the woods, the good settlement (Fort Riverwatch) in the north, and the lawful settlement (Fort Inevitable) in the south. So, any evil characters would likely be split between Fort Inevitable and Thornkeep depending on your variety of evil.
A Fort is just a Fort. It is not a Settlement.
I have a feeling that the upgrade from Fort to Settlement will be more than the materials needed to build the Fort in the first place. Probably enough more that any Chartered Company interested in doing it would either have to dig deep or expand their sphere of influence.
What this would do is if someone was saying, "Hey! I want to build a new settlement from the ground up. Give me your materials so I can build a Fort." You tell them to bugger off, because you have no guarantees that you won't be screwed over.
Someone else says, "Hey, I have a Fort. I'd like to upgrade it to a Settlement. Here is the proposed Settlement Charter. Who else would like to sign up?" Then you have a settlement charter and the initial settlement community. You have the community to start upgrading that Fort into a full settlement and you have some vague guarantees that you won't be screwed over by con artists. Everything would be built on the contract and community systems of the game instead of on the good will of others to keep up their ends of the deal.
I have no idea if that's how things will be, but it would give more guarantees to those wanting to be involved in the building of a settlement. At that point, you just find someone with a Fort who wants to build a Settlement out of it. There might be Chartered Companies that make a living out of clearing hexes and building Forts to sell to those wanting to build a settlement.