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Mavaro

Gisher's page

5,157 posts (5,334 including aliases). No reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 43 aliases.


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Isaac Zephyr wrote:
All of those natural attacks would still be at appropriate penalty. My TWF character is actually an unarmed, so there are kicks and punches available, however how much she can do is still limited. Choosing any 2, if a character had say a bite and 2 claws, one is the primary attack, and the second is secondary (off hand), so you could pick a combination and still be limited as any other.

That isn't how Natural Attacks work.


GM John Napier wrote:

First of all, get your Core Rulebook and turn to page 463.

The cost of the +1 Spell storing chain shirt is the cost of the chain shirt, plus 300 gold for the Masterwork component, and plus 1,000 gold for the +1. Unfortunately, Spell Storing is a weapon enhancement, and is therefore unavailable for Armor. Final cost: 100 + 300 + 1,000 = 1,400 Gold.

Masterwork armor only adds 150 gp to the cost. Also, Spell Storing armor now exists. Since that Armor Special Ability has a +1 equivalence, +1 Spell Storing armor has a +2 equivalent enhancement bonus. So the cost is 100 gp (chain shirt) + 150 gp (masterwork) + 4000 gp (+2 equivalent enhancement bonus) = 4250 gp.

@Malovec, I'm getting the cost of the equivalent enhancement bonus from the Armor and Shield Pricing by Bonus Table.

GM John Napier wrote:
Again, follow the above process for weapons. Unfortunately, again, Corrosive Burst isn't in the Core Rulebook. However, all other energy burst qualities are at +2, so your Acid Burst should be at +2 also. So, that's 20 (Great Axe) + 300 (Masterwork) + 18,000 ( +1 base enhancement, +2 energy (Acid) burst, total +3) for 18,320 Gold.

Your calculation is correct. Corrosive Burst is, indeed, a +2 equivalent enhancement bonus.

@Malovec, We are getting the cost of the equivalent enhancement bonus from the Weapon Pricing by Bonus Table. Note that the costs on this table are twice that on the Armor Table. Similarly the masterwork costs for the weapon are twice that of the armor. Armor is, magically speaking, cheaper than weapons.


All in wrist wrote:
blahpers wrote:

Example: If you combine a level 4 formula and a level 5 formula, the extract slot you have to use for the combination is a level 7 or higher slot (two higher than the highest level formula).

Edit: Technically, by that text the combination's actual level would be 7 as well, not just the slot it filled. That should affect DCs and the like.

So to be clear on this, if you have access to extract

Levels 1-4. You can only combine extract to a max level of 2 as you need to use the 4th level slot which is 3 levels higher? You couldn’t combine a third level one as you don’t have access to 5th level extracts?

Also combining extracts only uses one extract slot but from two levels higher?

blahpers' example is actually impossible since Alchemists don't have 7th level slots, but it is numerically correct. You use a single slot that is two levels higher than the highest level formulae in the combination. So if you have access up to level 4 extracts (say you were a 10th level Alchemist) then you could...

...combine two 2nd level formulae in a single 4th level extract slot.
...combine one 2nd level formulae with one 1st level formulae in a single 4th level extract slot.
...combine two 1st level formulae in a single 3rd level extract slot.

But you could not combine a 3rd level formulae with any other formulae because that would require at least a 5th level extract slot which you don't have yet. Since you can never have 7th level or higher slots, you will never be able to combine a 5th or 6th level formulae with anything.


KitsuneWarlock wrote:
Gisher wrote:
Which Chakra lets you add Cha mod to saves?

They all have Cha added to your saves for purposes of opening and maintaining your Chakras.

To quote the rules: ""adding his charisma modifier to each save""

I see. The saves for using the Chakras. I somehow thought you were talking about a Chakra granting Cha Mod to your saving throws as a benefit like an Occult version of Divine Grace. Thanks.


Re-read the OP, and I don't see how this is an effective combination. You have to first find a way to use Sneak Attack against an opponent or just hope that you score a critical. If you pull off either of those then you get a chance to intimidate nearby opponents so that they are shaken for at least one round. If you manage to move and then hit any shaken opponent before the condition wears off then you can use Shatter Defenses to leave them vulnerable to your Sneak Attack for subsequent attacks. It seems like a long chain of somewhat iffy steps to get that Sneak Attack vulnerability.


Which Chakra lets you add Cha mod to saves?


A couple of additional options...

The Dazzling Trail portion of Equipment Trick (cloak) increases the duration of the Intimidation's demoralize effect by 1d4 rounds. (Plus a Rogue will probably get some use out of the Distracting Cloak portion.)

You can also use a Dazzling Radiance weapon which will blind and/or dazzle everyone within 15' when you use Dazzling Display.


This FAQ may answer some of your questions.

FAQ wrote:

Multiple Weapons, Extra Attacks, and Two-Weapon Fighting: If I have extra attacks from a high BAB, can I make attacks with different weapons and not incur a two-weapon fighting penalty?

Yes. Basically, you only incur TWF penalties if you are trying to get an extra attack per round.
Let's assume you're a 6th-level fighter (BAB +6/+1) holding a longsword in one hand and a light mace in the other. Your possible full attack combinations without using two-weapon fighting are:
(A) longsword at +6, longsword +1
(B) mace +6, mace +1
(C) longsword +6, mace +1
(D) mace +6, longsword +1
All of these combinations result in you making exactly two attacks, one at +6 and one at +1. You're not getting any extra attacks, therefore you're not using the two-weapon fighting rule, and therefore you're not taking any two-weapon fighting penalties.
If you have Quick Draw, you could even start the round wielding only one weapon, make your main attack with it, draw the second weapon as a free action after your first attack, and use that second weapon to make your iterative attack (an "iterative attack" is an informal term meaning "extra attacks you get from having a high BAB"). As long as you're properly using the BAB values for your iterative attacks, and as long as you're not exceeding the number of attacks per round granted by your BAB, you are not considered to be using two-weapon fighting, and therefore do not take any of the penalties for two-weapon fighting.
The two-weapon fighting option in the Core Rulebook specifically refers to getting an extra attack for using a second weapon in your offhand. In the above four examples, there is no extra attack, therefore you're not using two-weapon fighting.
Using the longsword/mace example, if you use two-weapon fighting you actually have fewer options than if you aren't. Your options are (ignoring the primary/off hand penalties):
(A') primary longsword at +6, primary longsword at +1, off hand mace at +6
(B') primary mace at +6, primary mace at +1, off hand longsword at +6
In other words, once you decide you're using two-weapon fighting to get that extra attack on your turn (which you have to decide before you take any attacks on your turn), that decision locks you in to the format of "my primary weapon gets my main attack and my iterative attack, and my off hand weapon only gets the extra attack, and I apply two-weapon fighting penalties."


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Mark Moreland wrote:
Melkiador wrote:
It clearly broke the designed intent it had to let it work with previous and future materials made for both shortbows and longbows.
The designed intent shouldn't matter at all. We get in things with downright outlandish intent from freelancers all the time. It's our job as developers to correct that when we see it. In this instance, had I done my job as lead developer better, I would have just removed that last sentence. The hornbow works perfectly well without that line. In fact, if it's really such a huge problem, cross that line out in your book. Problem solved.

I just want to say that I think you all did a great job with Adventurer's Armory 2. It's one of my favorite Pathfinder purchases. And I definitely appreciate your participation in this thread.


If you stick with non-lethal damage, Sap Adept and Sap Master do work well with things like Enforcer and the Sapping Weapon Special Ability.


If your weapon is dealing lethal damage then your Sneak Attack damage will also be lethal. Sap Adept and Sap Master both state that they require your Sneak Attack damage to be non-lethal, and so they won't function if your weapon is dealing lethal damage.


Mark Moreland wrote:
You folks really know how to make a guy less likely to chime in on rules clarification threads!

I said 'thank you.' :(


Mallets wrote:
Gisher wrote:
The Shield Bearer Human Race Trait is something to consider.
Is this a human only race trait? Looking here it doesn't say so. I was hoping to take it on a Dwarf Shielded Fighter.

It's a Race Trait from Humans of Golarion and requires that you be Ulfen, a human ethnicity, so I'm pretty sure that the race in question is human. d20pfsrd isn't allowed to use terms like Ulfen so I'm guessing that's why the entry is incomplete. Archives of Nethys is a much better source for Pathfinder information.


The Shield Bearer Human Race Trait is something to consider.


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PossibleCabbage wrote:
I might also point out that +2 Damage isn't worth jumping through an enormous number of hoops for. Martial Focus is half of Weapon Specialization, but lets you take weapon specialization feats, some of which are fun options.

There are also several Traits that give you a +1 trait bonus to damage.

- Shield Bearer (race): Shield.

- River Rat (region): Dagger.

- Quain Martial Artist (region): Unarmed Strike.

- Monk Weapon Skill (combat): Any one Monk weapon other than Unarmed Strike.

- Weapon Training (race): Bastard Sword, Battleaxe, Greataxe, Greatsword, Handaxe, Light Hammer, Longbow, Longsword, Shortbow, Short Sword, Throwing Axe, and Warhammer.

Combining the last one with Martial Focus (hammers, bows, axes, or heavy blades) would get you the numerical equivalent of Weapon Specialization with multiple weapons at once.


ngc7293 wrote:

If you are one of the Occult classes, you can cast spells mentally.

For the most part that is true. Psychic casting still doesn't let you ignore expensive material components or focus components. Otherwise you are good to go.


Quarterstaff Master lets you take Weapon Specialization (Quarterstaff).


Mark Moreland wrote:
Dragonborn3 is correct. Proficiency does not affect the weapons in which one is proficient. So you need to take EWP to get proficiency with the hornbow. Weapon Focus needs to be Weapon Focus (hornbow) to affect this weapon, because you normally need to take it twice to affect both long- and shortbows, while a fighter's weapon training would apply to the hornbow because bows encompasses both long- and shortbows.

Thank you! I love getting insight from Paizo staff! And I now also have an answer to my longstanding gladius question. :)


Yeah, you can't replace replacements.


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Melkiador wrote:
Gisher wrote:

Does Herolab assume that classes that grant short sword profiency but not proficiency with all martial weapons (Bards, Investigators, Rogues, etc.) are also proficient with the gladius?

UE wrote:

GLADIUS

Price 15 gp
Type martial
The gladius is the favorite sword of gladiators, with a heavier blade than the standard shortsword. Feats and abilities that affect shortswords apply to the gladius.
Knowing that might help clarify how they are viewing proficiency.
I don't know, but I really have no problem with that. It's much less questionable. Both are martial weapons, and if you had the feat weapon proficiency(shortsword), that feat would also seem to apply to the gladius.

Interesting that you think this is less questionable. I read "effects" as at least as broad "feats and abilities." That is, I think feats and abilities would both be considered effects.


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Does Herolab assume that classes that grant short sword profiency but not proficiency with all martial weapons (Bards, Investigators, Rogues, etc.) are also proficient with the gladius?

UE wrote:

GLADIUS

Price 15 gp
Type martial
The gladius is the favorite sword of gladiators, with a heavier blade than the standard shortsword. Feats and abilities that affect shortswords apply to the gladius.

Knowing that might help clarify how they are viewing proficiency.


Bob Bob Bob wrote:

Imbue Arrow is great. The rest, not so much. Too many X/day abilities that really aren't worth it. And even Imbue Arrow is mostly about abusing abilities that aren't meant to be used at range. Detonate, Antimagic Field, Blasphemy, Silence, things like that. Enhance Arrows saves a little money but really doesn't matter unless the GM doesn't want to give you magic items (in which case, they probably won't let you use it).

And hey, it got better. Didn't it used to be Elf only?

Yes, they removed the racial requirement. The Favored Prestige Class and Prestigious Spellcaster feat line makes taking extensive levels in Arcane Archer much more viable.


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FAQ wrote:

Sorcerer, Crossblooded and Wildblooded: Can I take both of these archetypes for the same character?

No, because the archetype rules say none of the alternate class features can replace or alter the same class feature from the class as another alternate class feature. Because the crossblooded and wildblooded sorcerer archetypes both alter the bloodline arcana and bloodline powers, they aren't compatible archetypes.

Note that it is certainly within the GM's purview to allow this combination. However, the character should not be able to use the crossblooded archetype's ability to select a lower-level bloodline power that was replaced by the wildblooded archetype. For example, a wildblooded brutal (abyssal) sorcerer replaces "strength of the abyss" with "wings of the abyss" at 9th level; the character has "paid" for the wildblooded archetype by giving up "strength of the abyss," and can't use the crossblooded bloodline to select "strength of the abyss" as her 15th-level or 20th-level bloodline power.


Benjamin Medrano wrote:
Gisher wrote:
Mystic_Snowfang wrote:
Styers are all male.
I can’t find any references to Styers.
I suspect a typo when saying satyrs.

That would make more sense.


Mystic_Snowfang wrote:
Styers are all male.

I can’t find any references to Styers.


Val'bryn2 wrote:
Sorry, I was thinking about using it with Slashing Grace, Spell Combat, and similar things. My mistake.

Spell Combat prevents you from using a buckler. It is a form of TWF in which your spell counts as your off-hand weapon so you lose the buckler’s AC Bonus. The Skirnir archetype gets the 8th level ability Shielded Spell Combat to get around this. Other Magi can use Spell Combat while keeping the AC Bonus by taking the Unhindering Shield Feat.


Val'bryn2 wrote:
It's been stated several times that bucklers can be used with two-handed weapons because they aren't actually used in the hand, they are strapped to the forearm.

Please cite these sources.

You normally can’t use a buckler while using a two-handed weapon. You can use a two-handed weapon with the buckler strapped to your arm, but you lose the buckler’s AC Bonus for that turn. (Plus you take a -1 penalty on your attack rolls.)

UE wrote:

BUCKLER

Price 5 gp
Shield Bonus +1
This small metal shield is worn strapped to your forearm. You can use a bow or crossbow without penalty while carrying it. You can also use your shield arm to wield a weapon (whether you are using an off-hand weapon or using your off hand to help wield a two-handed weapon), but you take a –1 penalty on attack rolls while doing so. This penalty stacks with those that may apply for fighting with your off hand and for fighting with two weapons. In any case, if you use a weapon in your off hand, you lose the buckler's AC bonus until your next turn. You can cast a spell with somatic components using your shield arm, but you lose the buckler's AC bonus until your next turn. You can't make a shield bash with a buckler.


I’m still having this issue. Right now I’m in Safari on a fully updated iPhone.


1 person marked this as FAQ candidate.

Yes, they meant Talent not Discovery.


Also, Light can’t be cast on creatures. The target is ‘object touched.’


It is a Magus Arcana, not a Feat.

You aren’t technically required to have Spell Combat to select it, but i can’t imagine why you would want to do that since it would be useless if you didn’t have Spell Combat.

To use 3 claws and 1 bite while casting a Spell you would need to select the Arcana at least 3 times and have the Spell Combat Class Feature.


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Mark Seifter wrote:
Ziegfeld wrote:

Hi~ Mark, I have a question about flat-footed and trap.

When a character don't find a trap and he is attacked by the trap, does he be flat-footed?

Because investigator and some other archetypes have the trap sense ability, but don't have the uncanny dodge ability. And the trap sense ability give a dodge bonus to AC against attacks by traps.

Thank you!

** spoiler omitted **

In many cases, a character is probably flat-footed when encountering a trap (though it opens its whole own can-of-worms about immediate actions to feather fall from a pit trap). However, there are various circumstances when that wouldn't be the case, such as failing to disable a trap by 5 or more.

While Investigators don’t get Uncanny Dodge, they do have access to the Inspired Alertness Investigator Talent which I think of as Uncanny-Dodge-on-demand.

Quote:
Inspired Alertness (Ex): Whenever the investigator becomes flat-footed, he can expend one use of inspiration to ignore that condition. He must be conscious to do so, and must decide to do so when he becomes flat-footed. Using this ability doesn't require an action.

Since it’s a non-action, I would think it could be used to remove the flat-footed condition as soon as the trap caused it. Then the Trap Sense Dodge Bonus would apply?


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A Haunt Collector Occultist might fit this theme.


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Mark Seifter wrote:
Gisher wrote:
Mark Seifter wrote:
Kalindlara wrote:
Also the circlet of persuasion, if I recall correctly. ^_^
For Cha checks, yes, and plenty of others for initiative, but some ability checks don't have many (sometimes any) other ways to add. It depends on the ability check.
Well, someone made sure that the Medium Spirit Bonuses included options for boosting any of the six ability checks. ;)
Indeed; it was important to me that you could surge to simulate having a higher ability score in your spirit's favored ability in all the most direct ways, including with ability checks.

My Haunt Collector Occultist enjoys that.


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Mark Seifter wrote:
Kalindlara wrote:
Also the circlet of persuasion, if I recall correctly. ^_^
For Cha checks, yes, and plenty of others for initiative, but some ability checks don't have many (sometimes any) other ways to add. It depends on the ability check.

Well, someone made sure that the Medium Spirit Bonuses included options for boosting any of the six ability checks. ;)


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Three new UW FAQs!

FAQs wrote:

Animal Ferocity: The ferocity prerequisite of animal ferocity seems to do what the feat does and more? How should it work?

Animal Ferocity lets you take a full attack while disabled, but all attacks are at a –5. You can’t take any other full-round actions aside from full attack (for instance you can’t charge or cast a spontaneous metamagic spell). This will be reflected in the next errata.
Skirmisher Fighter: The skirmisher replaces weapon and armor proficiencies with a new set of armor proficiencies. Does that mean it isn’t proficient in any weapons?
No, it should only replace armor proficiencies. This will be reflected in the next errata.
Oozemorph and Items: I know I don’t have any item slots as an ooze, but what about items that take 24 hours to attune? Can I just never use those items?
An oozemorph can carry items floating in its mass that are considered to be attuned. When it turns into a humanoid form via fluidic body, it can equip any number of those items (even armor, which usually takes time to don), leaving the rest on the ground in its space. If it turns into a animal via fluidic form, the items meld into the new form and grant some passive benefits, as normal for polymorph effects.


Havzak wrote:
Gisher wrote:
Havzak wrote:
Genoin wrote:
Ah, I see, I missed the part that it should be compared to the cost of a similar item. So, the closest thing to compare it to in my opinion would be a +3 Mithral Buckler (+4 shield bonus, effectively hands free). The price on that is 10,005gp. There might be some consideration for raising the price slightly because it functions against magic missile and incorporeal touch attacks, though probably not much as those are pretty niche. I agree that 4,000gp sounded underpriced, but I don't think it is too strong to exist at all. I think something like 11,000gp or 12,000gp would be a fair price.
You also have the ring of force shield which is pretty closely comparable, which gives +2 Ac and blocks MM. It costs 8500gp. So for another +2 AC (Ring acts as if wielding a heavy shield, so a +2 heavy shield would be 4k more) I think a 12.5k GP price tag would not be inconceivable.
The Ring of Force Shield doesn't block Magic Missiles.
You are right, I thought it does. Was that perhaps a 3.5 thing?

I don’t know. I never played 3.5. I went from 1st edition to Pathfinder with only a very short stop at 2nd edition.


DM Default wrote:
Thank goodness. I was worried for second that something had gotten into my computer.

Only smurfish whimsy.


CrystalSeas wrote:
there are some variants that trigger the feature as well.

For example, the French "Schtroumpf" works.


Havzak wrote:
Genoin wrote:
Ah, I see, I missed the part that it should be compared to the cost of a similar item. So, the closest thing to compare it to in my opinion would be a +3 Mithral Buckler (+4 shield bonus, effectively hands free). The price on that is 10,005gp. There might be some consideration for raising the price slightly because it functions against magic missile and incorporeal touch attacks, though probably not much as those are pretty niche. I agree that 4,000gp sounded underpriced, but I don't think it is too strong to exist at all. I think something like 11,000gp or 12,000gp would be a fair price.
You also have the ring of force shield which is pretty closely comparable, which gives +2 Ac and blocks MM. It costs 8500gp. So for another +2 AC (Ring acts as if wielding a heavy shield, so a +2 heavy shield would be 4k more) I think a 12.5k GP price tag would not be inconceivable.

The Ring of Force Shield doesn't block Magic Missiles.


Fair enough criticisms of the Summon Monster path. Perhaps I've gotten spoiled by the Occultist's standard action Servitor ability. ;)

It is true that you don't need cheap material components, but focus components are required just as they are for other types of magic.

OA wrote:

Components

Psychic magic originates from the distinctive qualities of the caster's composite being, rather than through arcane formulae or rote supplication to divine entities. Therefore, psychic spells never have verbal or somatic components, and have only expensive material components. Psychic spells are purely mental actions, and they can be cast even while the caster is pinned or paralyzed. Focus components work the same way with psychic spells as they do with other spells.


richard develyn wrote:
Although there are some spells which are particularly called "ray", the term seems to have been used as flavour text in some places (e.g. Disintegration) leading me to believe that "ray" was never meant to be a game concept as such and that it is really just synonymous to ranged touch.

I am confused by your reading of Disintegrate using 'ray' as flavor text. That it is a ray is mechanically important.


I don't believe that there is such a table in print, but Ultimate Campaign suggests that the Designers incorporated the concept into the choices of slots.

Some Abilities Are Assigned to Certain Slots: Some of the magic items in the Core Rulebook are deliberately assigned to specific magic item slots for balance purposes, so that you have to make hard choices about what items to wear. In particular, the magic belts and circlets that give enhancement bonuses to ability scores are in this category—characters who want to enhance multiple physical or mental ability scores must pay extra for combination items like a belt of physical might or headband of mental prowess.

If there is a trend of all Core Rulebook items of a particular type using a particular slot (such as items that grant physical ability score bonuses being belts or items that grant movement bonuses being boots), GMs should be hesitant to allow you to move those abilities to other slots; otherwise, they ignore these deliberate restrictions by cheaply spreading out these items over unused slots.

There are still some items that don't fit into those patterns, though. The Snakeskin Tunic granting a +2 DEX Enhancement, for example.


Secane wrote:
Gisher wrote:
CupcakeNautilus wrote:
Gisher wrote:
The Fox Shape feat requires a Charisma of 13 and a BAB of +3.
Unless you take the "Superior Shapeshifter" Alternate Racial Trait, which gives it to you for free at level 1.
The OP stated that this was for a PFS character, and Superior Shapeshifter isn't PFS legal.

Thanks for pointing that out. I will pick up the fox shape feat, later down the line. And maybe select a Cha based discipline instead.

So any advice on feats and discipline?

I've never tried playing a Psychic, but it seems to me that they could be decent at summoning. You get the Summon Monster spells at the same levels as a Sorcerer. The Conjured Armor Phrenic Amplification can boost their AC, and you'd want the usual Spell Focus (conjuration) -> Augment Summoning chain to boost STR and CON. Note that the Summon Monster spells do require a Focus Component which psychic casters aren't exempt from needing, so casting them in fox form could be problematic. (I have a Psychic Detective with Superior Shapeshifter that I was building that way until I realized this would be an issue.)


CupcakeNautilus wrote:
Gisher wrote:
The Fox Shape feat requires a Charisma of 13 and a BAB of +3.
Unless you take the "Superior Shapeshifter" Alternate Racial Trait, which gives it to you for free at level 1.

The OP stated that this was for a PFS character, and Superior Shapeshifter isn't PFS legal.


The Fox Shape feat requires a Charisma of 13 and a BAB of +3.


Activation: Usually a character benefits from magic armor and shields in exactly the way a character benefits from nonmagical armor and shields: by wearing them. If armor or a shield has a special ability that the user needs to activate, then the user usually needs to utter the command word (a standard action).


Backpack wrote:
Might just be me but he you only get an AO once from a creature's movement was a rule I missed for a while. Didn't come up till I started spamming the field with ponies to eat up the enemies Ao's.

LOL!


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That you can choose to deal no damage with an attack by taking a -4 penalty on the attack roll. (See "Normal" below.)

UC wrote:

Stage Combatant (Combat)

You are a master of stage and nonlethal combats.

Prerequisites: Weapon Focus, base attack bonus +5
Benefit: When you make an attack with a weapon that you have Weapon Focus in, you take no penalty on the attack roll when you are attempting to make an attack that deals no damage or nonlethal damage.
Normal: When making attacks that deal no damage or nonlethal damage, you take a –4 penalty on attack rolls.


SheepishEidolon wrote:
Chemlak wrote:
Also, the rules never refer to so-called “iterative attacks” (seriously, search your rulebooks), as that term doesn’t exist. They are extra attacks gained from high BAB.

'Never' is a strong word and pretty much begs to be challenged. Unchained uses 'iterative attacks' for a whole section. Some more examples can be found in the Bestiary and in the Technology Guide.

So it stands to reason that some writers adopted the community (?) term. Could hardly find the word 'iterative' in the CRB, though - took the PDF reader till page 406 ('ending the campaign') for the first hit.

And a number of FAQs use the term, including this one which explains the use of the word (which matches Chemlak's description).

Quote:
an "iterative attack" is an informal term meaning "extra attacks you get from having a high BAB"

I wouldn't consider the extra attacks from ITWF and GTWF to be iteratives because you don't get them from merely having a high BAB. You have to actually take feats to get them. That said, the successive -5 penalties is clearly meant to mimic that of iteratives.

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