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Maedar

GeneticDrift's page

RPG Superstar 6 Season Marathon Voter, 7 Season Marathon Voter, 8 Season Marathon Voter, 9 Season Marathon Voter. Pathfinder Society Member. 1,443 posts. No reviews. No lists. 1 wishlist. 3 Pathfinder Society characters.


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The Exchange

Only combat feats have stamina options.
Honestly if just every new combat feat had combat tricks I would be happy.

The Exchange

I like stamina, it sucks that it ends up being a list with no context, especially for feats ive never heard of. But the internet really picks up the slack there.

The weapon master's hand book has no staminina options for new feats they added. Which is really lame, no combat feat should be printed with out it (doubly so for the melee focused players guides) They didnt even have a stamina based AWT option.

We are running out of class features to replace. Maybe we can drop all but ~5 weapon proficiencies for a few fighter talents as we level, maybe one at level 3 and every 4 levels after?

The Exchange

Background is in the past. He could regret what he did. Lots of stories are like that.

The Exchange

Fighters need more int based options, that are not bad. Taking a level in wizard should not be so tempting. (prescience school power, true strike, anticipate combat, knowledge is power discovery)

Hopefully advanced armor training allows for some smart options.
Free ranks in knowledge skills
Mobility options
Evasion with a shield
Defending allies around you
Making armor options more interesting

Armor tricks: catching weapons (improved disarm), swift action movement (spring attack), immediate action Total defense (combat expertise, becomes staggerd).
Armor spike tricks: bleed damage to attackers (combat reflexes), steeling spells they disrupt (disruptive), moral bonus when droping a foe (bravery)

Heavy Armor combat styles (im tired of prancing fighters)
Geometric style: int and engineering focus
High Tower style: reduces penelties from using a tower shield, offensive and defensive use of the tower shield.
Enduring style: combat stamina focused style.

The Exchange

The anticipate dodge feat helps get feats with dex prerequisites, you use int instead. Still not awesome, but helpful for student of war.

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Knowing will bring their eyes apon you. Pay no attention to this thread and drink to forget.

//no idea but secrets like this are secrets for a reason.

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One of the PFS pregens had an oil of align weapon, no alignment was listed. Anyway I would just assume the user decided when the oil was used. Nice way to get around alignment restrictions if a good angle appears and attacks first and asks questions later.

The Exchange

First thought, greater vital strike.
Second thought, a race feat for an other race.

The Exchange

Not a build, but you should look at this archetype and these feats.

Undead lord archetype
Guided hand
Channel smite
Shatter resolve
Selective channel

archives of nethys

The Exchange

Charon's Little Helper wrote:
GeneticDrift wrote:
Charon's Little Helper wrote:
GeneticDrift wrote:
A 3rd party feat that is also constantly used (so we are wasting time on this)
Please don't bring up Deadly Agility in a balance thread. It is the feat that makes STR builds pointless. Any game with it allowed and players who optimize AT ALL - every martial will take it unless they're refusing out of protest at its inclusion.
The other dex to damage feats didnt make str builds obsolete.

That's because they specifically went out of their way to make TWF, THF, flurry, and nat weapons not work with them. Only Fencing Grace allows the other hand to be used for a shield - and that would probably be changed if it wasn't from a player companion. The only Paizo way to get it for THF/TWF is a 3 level dip in Urogue - and that's generally too big of a price-tag.

For Magus - the vast majority of them are dex-to-damage builds because they can only fight with a single hand anyway - so for them pretty much the only cost IS a feat. (And even for them it's not as good as Deadly Agility - since they don't get 1.5x stat damage even if they two-hand with Spell Combat.)

Deadly agility is never x1.5. And is only for finessable weapons.

An agile AoMF is super cheap. For any natural weapon build it is easy to fit in.

Magus has a great archetype for ignoring armor, with super obvious synergy.
Base magus has a problem with when it gains the ability to use armor, make an archetype that can actually benefit from armor in a timely fashion and dex builds will drop in frequency.

Melee dex builds still have to get into melee unlike archery, which has way more advantages.

How is any of this on topic for unmonk vs core monk?

The Exchange

Charon's Little Helper wrote:
GeneticDrift wrote:
A 3rd party feat that is also constantly used (so we are wasting time on this)
Please don't bring up Deadly Agility in a balance thread. It is the feat that makes STR builds pointless. Any game with it allowed and players who optimize AT ALL - every martial will take it unless they're refusing out of protest at its inclusion.

The other dex to damage feats didnt make str builds obsolete. Anyway it is was just an option instead of a cheap agile AoMF which is probably the better choice.

Str builds are great, if they fall behind it is because hvy armor has been the weakest choice if the player plans any investment for defense. I think dex builds are better than str in most things, but that was even before these builds existed (archery).

Totally agree with the above secret wizard post.

The Exchange

A 3rd party feat that is also constantly used (so we are wasting time on this), mythic exists no reason to ignore it, play style would be different for a few levels, but imwouldnt say gimped.

solo play happens how often?much less than mythic is played i bet. Parties without a full caster could happen, but potions of mage armor are very cheap, the character probably has not used all the potions he could have bought instead by level 8. The amulet is 1 purchase, not neeeding to be upgraded. Your build did not spend it on defense, so if you do that the finesse build just looks better.

The Exchange

Secret Wizard wrote:
GeneticDrift wrote:
I cant imagine playing an unmonk that didnt max dex and wis. making your ki pool, stunning fist dc, will save and ac all real good. Damage is low until you get an agile something, dex to damage feats, or something like it.

1. You can't use dex to damage feats with flurry.

2. Again, you saw my build on the first page. Put a build with better Stunning Fist DC and AC to show me. I could only imagine a build with +2 AC or perhaps +3 but losing a lot of damage.

3. Imho, 14STR/18DEX mix Weapon Finesse Jabbing Style is better than full DEX.

1) yes you can. Mythic weapon finesse (paizo) and deadly agility (dreamscarred press), i included other options if these are not available.

2) easy, mantis style, better stat boosts, the damage looks a little lower due to piranha strike give penalty to hit, when not used it looks to be 1 less to hit and 3 less damage per hit. there might be a better feat i have not considered.
3) jabbing style seems nice, i could probably tank int to meet the prereq and take the first two in the chain. But im not sold on it yet.

Build is copy paste of yours except
the stats would be like 10,18,13,10,18,7 at lvl 1.
Different gear :
Amulet of might fists (+0, agile)
Pearl of power 1
Dex +4 belt
Wis +4 belt
jingasa
Next purchase: pearl of power 4 ( greater magic weapon)

2 different feats:
Feats: being lazy and just replacing ascetic form and style (changing weapon focus to unarmed strike)
Piranha strike
mantis style?

The Exchange

I cant imagine playing an unmonk that didnt max dex and wis. making your ki pool, stunning fist dc, will save and ac all real good. Damage is low until you get an agile something, dex to damage feats, or something like it.

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I Dont kmow of any...im sure there are situations more dangerous than stormy. I am interested in any answers.

The Exchange

Wear full plate and a tower shield. Never make an attack and dont bother with the feats, use your actions to buff. Inevitable and leadership domains are solid here.

Spells:, bless, deathless, circle of protection, blessing of fervor....protectin from energy, holy smite, command, murderous command.

Feats: quick channel selective channel, toughness, ...

The Exchange

The PRC student of war tries to do this, int instead of dex to ac. But it seems a bit lacking over all.

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DM_Blake wrote:
GeneticDrift wrote:
DM_Blake wrote:
GeneticDrift wrote:
Any "commoner" who learns anything would be an expert.

This is not Pathfinder's definition.

In Pathfinder, "Commoner" is a class. "Expert" is a different class. See this page.

Your statement is like saying "a fighter who learns anything would be a wizard" - hyperbole, but it's still true. Learning "anything" as a member of one class does not mean you automatically become some other class.

Unfortunately, the web page doesn't list definitions for these NPC classes, but a person can be a commoner for his whole life, even if he has a job. A farmer, for example, would be a commoner forever. He might even be a very good commoner, with lots of XP and become, say, a level 10 commoner. He's the best farmer in the land, but still not an expert.

You are making a straw man. Classes are game terms, a real life commoner is likely an expert, just trained in more common things. The best farmer in the land is not a commoner, especially with an npc stat array. You are not stuck in any class due to birth, it represents your skills and training.

Now you're talking about multi-classing or level-dipping.

Of course a fighter who multiclasses as a wizard, or level-dips as a wizard, will know more than an ordinary fighter who doesn't. Or better yet, dips a level of rogue to get lots of skill ranks.

Of course a commoner who multiclasses as an expert, or level-dips as an expert, will know more than an ordinary commoner. Or perhaps he, too, should dip a level of rogue to get lots of skill ranks.

There's no straw men here, just an analogy to other classes.

What are you talking about. I never mentioned anything about multiclassing.

The Exchange

DM_Blake wrote:
GeneticDrift wrote:
Any "commoner" who learns anything would be an expert.

This is not Pathfinder's definition.

In Pathfinder, "Commoner" is a class. "Expert" is a different class. See this page.

Your statement is like saying "a fighter who learns anything would be a wizard" - hyperbole, but it's still true. Learning "anything" as a member of one class does not mean you automatically become some other class.

Unfortunately, the web page doesn't list definitions for these NPC classes, but a person can be a commoner for his whole life, even if he has a job. A farmer, for example, would be a commoner forever. He might even be a very good commoner, with lots of XP and become, say, a level 10 commoner. He's the best farmer in the land, but still not an expert.

You are making a straw man. Classes are game terms, a real life commoner is likely an expert, just trained in more common things. The best farmer in the land is not a commoner, especially with an npc stat array. You are not stuck in any class due to birth, it represents your skills and training.

The Exchange

Basing a skill on level one commoners is silly. They are basicially uneducated children. Any "commoner" who learns anything would be an expert. commoners who gain experience are unskilled laborers and beggars with experience, maybe the average based on sheer numbers but not on assumed skill or education.

The Exchange

mind explaining what it is? Is it a 3rd party thing? what do you mean by modern?

The Exchange

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Thrallherd from 3.5/dreamscared press pathfinder: make every mortal npc a puppet
Cleric of an evil god, i like ghlaunder or henspur
Mantis assassin (cause evil games dont happen often)
Mesmerist
Wizard demon binder

Hell is a specific place in pathfinder. So a LE reason to be there, probably dealing with devils and selling your soul. Could also be due to your belief system in life, you dont need to be baby eating evil tomget there.

The Exchange

I wouldnt go all in with mythic since the PCs are probably not mythic. Making hits insta kill isnt fun for anyone. CR is reigned in by average to hit and damage, this monster is ending up way to high. A cr 13 average dmg is 60.

I went mythic for the solo encounter to be a challenge. Freedom of movement, protection from good, mythic blessing of fervor...

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I am assuming greater shadow conjuration since i dont know any low lvl wall spwlls off the top of my head. So a 60% chance, isnt to bad. I cannot see bow you could ot disbelieve an illusion you cast.

Shadow: A shadow spell creates something that is partially real from extradimensional energy. Such illusions can have real effects. Damage dealt by a shadow illusion is real.

Shadow Conjuration, Greater

School illusion (shadow); Level sorcerer/wizard 7

DESCRIPTION
This spell functions like shadow conjuration, except that it duplicates any sorcerer or wizard conjuration (summoning) or conjuration (creation) spell of 6th level or lower. The illusory conjurations created deal three-fifths (60%) damage to nonbelievers, and non-damaging effects are 60% likely to work against nonbelievers.

The Exchange

Mythic templates

Agile and divine,, then two levels of fighter for the vital strike buff.

Two actions a turn, mythic spells.

I would use arcane, but you will want/need? A headband or something to up charisma.

The Exchange

str: 3d6 ⇒ (2, 4, 1) = 7
dex: 3d6 ⇒ (6, 2, 3) = 11
con: 3d6 ⇒ (5, 2, 6) = 13
int: 3d6 ⇒ (2, 3, 4) = 9
wis: 3d6 ⇒ (1, 5, 2) = 8
chr: 3d6 ⇒ (2, 4, 1) = 7

Human kineticist

The Exchange

I love breath of life, it is awesome. I also am very fond of deathless, keeping the party alive since level 7.

The Exchange

Not talking about the OP, just the trait//retraining

If that clw wand kept the party alive and the game fun, what is the problem? A clw wand is probably the least game upsetting thing a spoiled child could buy, a mw item, some helpful gear? A few potions? Unless they pick up a murder zoo its not breaking the game. It is no where as broken as some magic traits.

As a gm use what the player did with it to set the cost. A few hp is nothing to worry about, especially if the party had no cleric which channel.

The Exchange

Because you are holding a reach weapon and they are to close?..err is kicking people ok?

Edit: the below answer is better than mine.

The Exchange

900+gp is significant at lvl 5. And i just noticed the gm can veto it.

Some of the options listed below involve retraining features of your character that are essentially permanent parts of your heritage, such as a sorcerer's bloodline. The cost of retraining these things presumably includes magical or alchemical alterations to your body. The GM might rule that these changes are unavailable in the campaign, are only available under rare circumstances, take longer, are temporary, require some sort of quest, or are more expensive than the listed cost.

The Exchange

The old traits just are not as big of an influence any more. his family doesn't need to get killed that is stupid.

Starting gold isn't a statistic that matters any more so I would also take all of that back as a gm in addition to the cost of retraining. (Fluffing it as someone in the family needs monetary help, like bail, or a wedding, or a weeping gift, legal fees, what ever.)

Retraining is not free it is 10gp x level x days. It is 5 days for a feat.

SwitchIng to magicial lineage is great for a shocking grasp based build. Once you get the meta magic feat to increase the dice cap...I hate that trait though.

The Exchange

The ability is only triggered after the attack hits. Sure a preemptive surge could help or just spending a point for an other attack. The attacker modifies everything first.

Block attacks
Once per round, when the creature is hit by a melee or ranged attack, it can attempt a melee attack using its highest attack bonus. If this result exceeds the result from the attack against it, the creature is unaffected by the attack (as if the attack had missed).

The Exchange

Looking at the FE entry for the lantern bearer prestige class, "This ability functions exactly like the ranger class ability of the same name, and Lantern Bearer levels stack with other class levels that grant the favored enemy ability." It seem appropriate to apply it here.

Just spouting ideas for an extra boon:
Favored terrain
Tracking
Ranger fighting style
A caster level for activating magic items
An animal companion
An ability to retrain his favored enemy at the start of each day
Bonus on stealth
Ignoring ACP for skills related to hunting
Bonus movement speed
Wild empathy
Woodland stride
A Combat maneuver to negate a monster ability for 3+ wisdom mod rounds per day(pounce, scent, one form of attack), make a specific list. You could make it tiered kinda like beast shape.

The Exchange

Gloves of dueling and now the weapon mastery bonuses (from the recent weapon master's handbook) make weapon training strong.

Most archetypes that replace weapon training give abilities at each improvement too. I was only seeing 4 tiers of flavored enemy having 5 is better, and having it at level 1 is nice..... ....maybe say levels in classes with favored enemy stack?

Studied monster is great and Hunter's defense is solid.

I'm sure others have opinions too.

Edit:
Archetypes that replace weapon training and give more at weapon training 2-4
archer
brawler
Aldori sword lord
cad
Ok, I'll stop.

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I buy PDFs, if the index / ToC linked to the locations I would use them more.

The Exchange

You need to give more for losing weapon training.

Favored enemy to replace Weapon training 1
Then give more at weapon training 2,3 and 4. Or let the fighter take these as normal.

With out instant enemy weapon training is a far superior ability.

Master monster hunter references ranger. It shouldn't unless this is copy/pasted from an other class option/archetype. You left out hunter from one sentence. I would make either this use int or study monster use wisdom, so they line up.

The Exchange

Cover looks great!

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If the guard is alone, it works fine. His friend just cast a spell to help out. ... Until it wears off.

The Exchange

Occult adventures has something like the with the undercasting rules.

Some classes can already retrain their spells every few levels(sorc). Prepared casters can just scribe, create, or choose it for free each level. So I do not see the big advantage, especially for prepared casters. It is just an unneeded buff.p to a strong class.

Meta magic covers this already but If you do this make it unique custom spells only.

Superfyre
Lv 0 ignite
Lv 1 burning hands
Lv 2 burning wave
Lv 3 bouncing wave
Level 4 multi bouncing wave
Level 5 hungry bouncing waves
Level 7 living hungry bouncing waves
Level 8 living hungrynhellfire bouncing waves
Level 9 swarming living hungry hellfire bouncing waves

Use spells (with similar effects) of that level as a basis. Really good effects will be much higher spell levels and have saves and attack rolls (enervation ray) or have other limitations (concentration, 1 round cast time, or some such).

Obviously there is little you can do with invisibility that has not already been done, you might want to stagger the advances to every other spell level. (1,3,5... Or 2,4,6...)

The Exchange

Adamantine armor does not protect from falling. There is a lot of differences between getting hit and falling.

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Halflings pay more for their strength too in point buy.

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Tobex wrote:

I think this book went to print too early. I expect a couple of hundred clarification/FAQ threads and errata on this.

It seems to me that this is a new toybox with no consideration for balancing the material with what's come before. It's a 'splatbook' in exactly the bad sense of the 3.0 splatbooks. Stuff in here - if incorporated into your game - so far overshadows core features that it becomes 'must have'; essentially >the< litmus test of broken.

The "rule of cool" is one thing. But how about we keep a measure of balance in the game?

I think there is some good material in here, but in multiple places the execution is IMO lousy.
There is no visible attempt to keep it even in balance with itself, let alone core rules.

You may justifiably argue that martial classes need a boost, but e.g. cutting all missiles, boulders and attack-roll spells out of the air for a mere attack of opportunity isn't ever making it to my table.
Nor are gunslinger targeted shots with whatever weapon you like.
Nor indeed are multiple readied attacks in one round, or a saving throw penalty for hitting with an attack. And no, no Vorpal-equivalent ranged weapons.

The first rule of fight-club should be you do NOT mess with the action economy. The next should be 'saving throws and melee attacks are NOT equal'(ahem, Hindering Shot).

This could have been great. Now I have to rule stuff in or out on a case-by-case basis. Seriously disappointed.

Hindering shot is 5feats, a high BAB, a readied action, and a successful attack roll that must get through any concealment, mirror images, deflect arrows...Good for them If it ever does anything.

Casters have messed with action economy since core. Summons, animal companions, dominated/controlled enemies, quickened spells, familiars with wands, contingency, day long buffs from low spell slots....

The Exchange

nothing to be negative about here. It looks fine and is viewed from an odd angle.

The Exchange

Aelryinth wrote:
GeneticDrift wrote:
advanced weapon training helps all of my issues, it just takes a while to get them. Better saves, more skills, team work, and protecting others....if the armor master's handbook delivers the fighter will be very fun past low levels. Many classes take time to build up options so this shouldn't hurt to much.

IF some AWT options were available at level 2-4, I'd consider this valid. Having to wait until level 5 to actually take a cool feat-level ability from AWT just makes me shake my head. Shall we differ all rage, rage talents, smites,a nd favored enemies until level 5 to even the scale?

==Aelryinth

Yeah i agree with you that it is a long wait. Hopefully advanced armor training can happen at level 3...fighters are not outclassed at low levels so while less interesting they don't lag much. Archetypes help too as well as early feat selection. It is a decent year to play a fighter.

Edit: maybe a great year!

The Exchange

advanced weapon training helps all of my issues, it just takes a while to get them. Better saves, more skills, team work, and protecting others....if the armor master's handbook delivers the fighter will be very fun past low levels. Many classes take time to build up options so this shouldn't hurt to much.

The Exchange

I look forward to armor trick feats, finding out armor mastery options (do we specialize in one type of armor?), combat styles that focus on your armor, and more combat stamina tricks. And everything else...April is to far away.

The Exchange

I believe there is a new fighter archetype coming out in arcane anthologies. Check that thread for the specifics.

The Exchange

Just keep the cause for the greater good focused in the Paladin's mind. Bluff wanting to redeem. Work out of character with him on how your day to day routine goes, so there is a basis for the game to progress with out disruption.

The Exchange

It is just a dc 20 to notice that an invisible creature is near.

"A creature can generally notice the presence of an active invisible creature within 30 feet with a DC 20 Perception check. The observer gains a hunch that “something's there” but can't see it or target it accurately with an attack. "

Also invisible things that produce light still do so. Any glowing from casting makes you stand out...just a bit strangely.

The Exchange

Aelryinth wrote:
Secret Wizard wrote:

Remember you can pick AWT as a feat at levels 5, 10, 15 and 20.

A Fighter could have a total of 7 AWT options, 4 from feats, 3 from WT II, III and IV.

If you are using the Weapon Master fighter archetype, you can take AWT feats as FIghter Bonus Combat feats.

Which means you can start grabbing AWT feats at level 3, and at level 4 even retrain your level 1 feat to an AWT feat! And actually get a decent array of them before level 10, while they are actually desired and useful.

And you can end up with 16 of them (using General feats at level 5 and 15). You'd be limited in what you can grab with versatility, since you only have one weapon group ever, and only one weapon...but since most fighters only use one weapon, it shouldn't be a problem.

Spellcut is slightly better then normal saves + Magic in most cases, the +5 resistance cloak at 10th is a little extreme. Yes, it can also be used with reflex and fort saves that don't get an Armed Bravery bonus. However, the fact it works on two saves is balanced by the fact it only works against magic - saves against non-magical effects gain no benefit from the feat (such as Intimidate checks!). Note that even if your saves are PENALIZED, BAB replaces it. So you could dump a fighter's Will for build points, be cursed, and still get the full BAB to Will. Bonuses and penalties are BOTH not carried over.

==Aelryinth

The feat prevents picking it up at 3rd. But retraining at 4th for two still works.

Advanced Weapon Training (Combat):
You are specially trained to use your weapon skills in new ways. Prerequisites: Fighter level 5th, weapon training class feature. Benefit: Select one advanced weapon training option, applying it to one fighter weapon group you have already selected with the weapon training class feature. Special: This feat can be taken more than once, but at most once per 5 fighter levels. Special: Fighters that have the weapon masterAPG archetype can select this feat beginning at 4th level. The benefits of a weapon master's advanced weapon training options apply only to his selected weapon rather than all weapons in the same fighter weapon group, and he can't select the weapon specialist advanced weapon training option. A weapon master can select this feat as a bonus feat; if he does so, it doesn't count for the purpose of the requirement that it can be taken at most once per 5 fighter levels.

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