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Samy wrote:
Generic Villain wrote:
I'm confident that the Paizo employees are above such innocuous pedantry when it comes to designing flagship products like Adventure Paths. Or anything else really. To error is human.

Speaking of innocuous pedantry...it's "to err is human".

"error" is a noun, whereas you want the corresponding verb, which means "to make a mistake". As in "to make a mistake is human". That verb, which corresponds to the noun "error", is "to err".

Thank you, you may leave any tips to the animal protection charity of your choice.

I'm so happy to be in the company of such grammatical luminaries. Truly, I am humbled by your supreme and masterful understanding of the English language. But why are you wasting your time on a message board? Go! Go to the people and correct them, for certainly that must be your calling!

(Was that grammatically correct? Please, I must know. If not, I humbly beg you to correct me with your vast and immaculate linguistic skills)


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Steve Geddes wrote:


Paizo are sympathetic to this position. Several people "reserved" various Inner Sea nations and that has resulted in some much-loved campaign setting books. The downside to that approach though is that some areas have been left to languish. They appreciate that there comes a time when it really needs to happen, even if the original "champion" of a region has moved on or got bogged down in other things.

Erik Mona made a post about that recently (complete with educational acronym).

That's an awesome post, thanks. Good to see that the developers have the common sense to do away with a tradition that really is just stagnating the setting. Seriously, what has happened in Nex in the past decade?


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Gorbacz wrote:


If somebody didn't care to spell my name right, I wouldn't feel that much inclined to honour their requests to abandon my long-standing policies and grant their wishes. But that's just me.

I'm confident that the Paizo employees are above such innocuous pedantry when it comes to designing flagship products like Adventure Paths. Or anything else really. To error is human.

Pointless bickering aside, there are a number of nations that haven't been touched on: Molthune, Isger, Druma, Lastwall, Realm of the Mammoth Lords, Nidal, Brevoy, aforementioned Razmir, Hermea, Mediogalit Island, and Thuvia. Any and all of these nations are begging to be fleshed out. And that's not even counting the Darklands, other planets, and other planes. Quite looking forward to the final 1.0 AP going out with a bang.


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Gorbacz wrote:


First, it's been a decade and people still misspell Erik's name.

Second, Paizo's policy is let the nations who have their "custodians" wait until the custodian has time to do them right. They stick to it, so all you can do is wait.

First, I don't commit the spelling of every Paizo employee's name to my long-term memory.

Second, and more to the point, policies can and do change. All the time. This one has been rotting on the vine far too long. Time to get rid of it.


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Steve Geddes wrote:
Razmir is Jason Bulmahn’s pet nation, as I understand things. That probably doesn’t mean he has to be involved, but I’d be surprised if it were the last PF1 AP (it’s presumably being written now and something tells me he’s been kind of busy, of late).

This always bugs me. I know developers have their own pet nations they helped design (Eric Mona with Nex/Geb, Wesley Schneider with Ustalav, Jason Bulmahn with Razmir), but what's the point of having these nations if they're never developed? Luckily Mr. Schneider did an amazing job fleshing out his vision of Ustalav, but as of now, Nex, Geb, and Razmir are blank canvases. They might as well appear on maps with a big old censor bar over them that says "coming soon!" Paizo has plenty of highly capable writers who can easily bring these nations to life. It's been a decade. Time to hand the torch off.


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I hope it's something in Garund. Nex/Geb are begging for an AP and yet, since their conception, have received very little attention. Another cool option would be to reveal the rest of Garund's landmass, as was done with Tian-Xia.

A Razmiran AP would be quite welcome as well. Ole' man Razmir has 3 options at this point: die of old age, die because adventurers stabbed him, or discover immortality like a decent wizard.

I do hope it's not Galt, but Galt is another possibility. Only reason I'd say it's unlikely is because we have a very politics-heavy AP with War For the Crown, and unless the Galt AP (ugh) takes a much different approach, I just don't see it happening.


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According to Occult Mysteries, the Countdown Clocks might reach a special conjunction on 4718 AR - which corresponds to 2018 in real life. The last time such a conjunction happened was 4606 AR, when Aroden died. I know the developers have said no massive cataclysm will usher in 2nd edition (as has been the case with every iteration of, say, Forgotten Realms), but I'm definitely hoping for something special.

Maybe kill off one of the less popular deities? I'm looking at you Alseta the Welcomer.


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So I might be in uncharted waters (for me). Gay guy here and my best friend is straight. We've known each other for many years. However, I've increasingly noticed some signals he's been sending. I'm fairly oblivious about this sort of thing so the fact that I'm noticing at all is indicative. Has anyone ever been in a similar situation? If so, what kind of "tells" are there that an otherwise-straight friend might be interested in becoming something more? Or is this something best quashed in the name of maintaining the friendship, which I value very highly?


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Hey all. So me and my buddy like to watch high-quality (in our opinions) television, and I'm in charge of finding shows. Live action only, and aimed at adults. High drama, deep plotlines, and fleshed out characters are what we're looking for. Does anyone have recommendations?

So far here are some of the best shows we've watched:

Stranger Things
Mr. Robot
Happy!
Preacher
Channel Zero

Thanks for any tips.


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I think it's interesting that Ochymua managed to...

:
pickpocket Auberon's phylactery right off him. Considering that veiled masters don't have any ranks in Sleight of Hand, I'm thinking Ochymua might be a rogue/arcane trickster.


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Mothman wrote:
Sounds very familiar. I thought it might be The Relic, but on second thought that didn't end with a helicopter escape (and was set in a museum not a factory).

Heh, I was thinking The Relic too actually. But there were a lot of horror movies made between the 70s-90s, so who knows.


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Alright, he says it's not Leviathan. Drawing a blank here.


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Thomas Seitz wrote:
You sure it wasn't Leviathan?

Good guess. No idea - I'll run it by him. Thanks.


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Hey all. A buddy of mine is trying to remember the title of a horror movie he saw as a kid. Here's the description he gave me:

"So there's a movie I remember I watched when I was little can't remember the full movie or it's name. It's a horror movie (somewhere between 70's-90's) I remember it in a factory kind of setting but I can't be too sure of that since I only saw it when I was younger. A group of people are trying to survive a closed setting with either a mutated human or some kind of demonic-like creature or just something along those lines. I remember the last scene they're escaping towards an active helicopter and they think they'e seen the last of it but it caught up to them. They end up kicking it off and it falls to the ground and dies, and you see it's hand with a little stream of blood coming out as the credits start rolling"

I'm a horror fan but his description didn't ring any bells. Does anyone have any ideas? Much obliged.


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If Rovagug escaped and destroyed the world, it wouldn't just be Golarion that vanished. It would be the entire solar system - and actually the galaxy, and probably the Material Plane as a whole. So that's not it. I think the "gap" is Starfinder's overarching mystery, comparable to Pathfinder's "what happened to Aroden." No answers.


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Just for fun, I've decided to try and categorize the nations of Golarion as being either low, medium, or high in magic concentration. This list is completely arbitrary and subject to dispute.

Spoiler:

Belkzen: low
Brevoy: low
Cheliax: high
The Darklands: varies heavily depending on region
Druma: high
Five Kings Mountains: medium
Galt: medium
Geb: high
Irrisen: high
Isger: medium
Jalmeray: high
Katapesh: high
Kyonin: high
Lastwall: medium
Linnorm Kings: low
Mammoth Lords: low
Mana Wastes: low
Mendev: medium
Molthune: medium
Mwangi Expanse: varies heavily depending on region
Nex: high
Nidal: high
Nirmathas: low
Numeria: high
Osirion: high
Qadira: high
Rahadoum: medium
Razmiran: medium
River Kingdoms: low
Sargava: low
The Shackles: medium
Sodden Lands: medium
Steaming Sea: high
Taldor: medium
Thuvia: medium
Ustalav: medium
Worldwound: high
Varisia: medium


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Pathfinder Journals are bits of fiction set in the world of Golarion. Although official, they tend to skew towards lower leveled adventures. I've only read about half of them, but I'd say main characters are roughly 5th to 8th level tops. That is why the magic they are using is very low level. These are the Golarion equivalent of "normal people" - or maybe a step above.

By contrast, characters that actually take part in adventures effectively exist in a different world. By the sixth installment of any given Adventure Path, the player characters are some of the strongest people in Golarion. They are also going up against some of the strongest people in Golarion. For these luminaries, even high-level magic is a disposable resource that is used freely.

That said, certain regions are more "magic rich" than others. Of the examples you gave, Absalom, Cheliax, and certain regions of the Darklands have very high concentrations of magic. There are several reasons, but the easiest explanation is that high-level magic users live in these places in great concentrations, and have for some time. By contrast, the Hold of Belkzen is home to feral bands of orcs. Not exactly the sort of place where your local high-level wizard decides to set up shop.


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Page 140. Second paragraph under the "Selling Treasure" heading.


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Marik Whiterose wrote:
Hopefully he stays buried.

Heh. If it were anyone else I'd call that disrespectful, but... yeah man, spot on. I just know the first time I saw Night, I fell in love. And then I played the Resident Evil games. Zombies became a feature of my young psyche in a big way. I would have dreams/nightmares about them on a weekly basis, and still do pretty frequently. I usually have a shotgun though, so that helps.


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George Romero, creator of Night of the Living Dead and father of the modern zombie movie, died today at 77. The man was a legend and a genius. If there's one thing I respect about him more than any other though, it was that, in 1968, he chose to cast Duane Jones as the male lead of his first and most iconic film. Jones was a black man, and in 1968 black men simply were not allowed to be lead actors. Romero had incredible courage to do what he did, and Jones paved the way for black actors of future generations to finally get their chance to shine.

Plus, Night of the Living Dead was a damn good movie. Thanks for all the memories Mr. Romero. I can honestly say I'm pretty emotional about this. Sigh.


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I think my buddy will be quite happy with his winter oracle. Again, I really appreciate the feedback.


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Ah okay found it! Thanks all! (I love these boards).


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Louise Bishop wrote:

Dragon- Cold

Winter

I'm sorry I don't follow. Do you mean there's a winter mystery in Blood of Dragons?


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Helping a buddy make a character in a few hours and he wants something ice-related. He's new to the game and we need a healer. Thus, is there any oracle mystery that's ice/winter/cold related? Thanks for any help!

*EDIT: If not I'll just suggest the waves mystery to him. I just could have sworn I saw a winter mystery at some point.


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I'm a little bummed we didn't get some more info on the gutaki/devilfish city of Achom (detailed in From Hells Heart). Seems like an absolutely killer place for an adventure of seven. I would have also liked to see one or two of the noted underwater communities get a formal stat writeup, but I understand that space was at a premium what with all the info, underwater rules, character options, and so forth.

Still though. Achom for the win baby.


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Steve Geddes wrote:
CrystalSeas wrote:
Generic Villain wrote:
CrystalSeas wrote:

Have you ever tried to use a dead vertebrate as a bridge? They're soft and floppy and bend any which way.

Are you speaking from experience? I mean far be it for me to judge...
Check your PMs.
What an intriguing exchange. :)

He was being respectful due to his profession. Nothing untoward or salacious, I assure you.


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Apologies for the link. In lieu of that, I did some research on the German Hessian mercenaries. Based on what I've found, the Hessians were disciplined military organization with structures and hierarchies comparable to proper state-organization militarizes. They were by no means a horde of all-for-one warriors out for personal glory. Were I to guess, the lawfully-inclined Blackjackets share a lot in common with them.

Hessians: The Best Armies Money Could Buy.


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My favorite Empyreal Lord is whichever one ends up gasping out his/her final breaths while impaled on Pazuzu's sword, or even better, hobbled and turned into Dispater's personal footstool for all eternity. Go evil!


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I actually think the best way to make a true god (if for whatever reason you needed to do so), would be to take a CR 30 outsider like Pazuzu, Baalzebul, or Charon, then modify their abilities accordingly. So if you wanted to stat Lamashtu, take Nocticula as your starting template. When you have your CR 30 version of Lamashtu (as she would be as a non-god Demon Lord), proceed to giver her 10 real mythic ranks and maybe a few extra HD. It would put her well outside the reach of pretty much any mortal, and make her head and shoulders above Demon Lords. But she'd still be "weak" enough that, if her archrival Pazuzu was very strategic, he could take her down. Just like Lamashtu took down Curchanus when he was a true god and she wasn't.


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CorvusMask wrote:


But yeah, other thing about it is that if its, former, it essentially makes all demon lords cr 30+ at their home turf. But again not sure if thats how its intended since picking 11 mythic abilities, feats & stat allocation sure is a lot of work .-.

Yeah, tacking 10 mythic ranks onto Deskari would make him CR 34. And until Pathfinder makes rules for statting/becoming/fighting full gods (which they've so far said will never happen), that just wouldn't make sense. Also remember that Deskari is fought on his home plane of the Rasping Rifts. If he really did go Super Saiyan, his CR 34 mythic version would have to be presented. And would likely beat the ever-loving crap out of the PCs unless they were super optimized.

The fact that mythic spell-like abilities weren't picked out like they were in Bestiary 4 is annoying though. If I had to guess, I'd say that any spell that has a mythic equivalent can be... uh, mythicized. I don't have the patience to check if this is accurate with Bestiary 4.


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I always found the description pretty awkward. The problem with granting them the full benefits of a rank 10 mythic creature, is that you'd need to rebuild each Demon Lord in a big way. Pick out mythic feats, decide where stat boosts are allocated, choose or custom craft a suite of mythic abilities, and so forth. The only argument against this possibility would be that we've seen a battle against a Demon Lord on its home plane in a published adventure. If Deskari gained this incredible power boost, his advanced stats would have to be presented. They aren't. Therefore I think the only logical answer is, as you said, treating a Demon Lord as an MR 10 creature (though only for the purposes of spells, magic items, and abilities) and granting it mythic surge. But that's it. A solid power boost, but nothing close to what would be granted from actually gaining 10 ranks of mythic power.

To put it another way, I would treat the boost of a Demon Lord on its home plane the same way as mythic simple templates; they technically have a mythic rank, but not the mythic subtype, and thus not the full benefits that would go along with it.


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CrystalSeas wrote:

Have you ever tried to use a dead vertebrate as a bridge? They're soft and floppy and bend any which way.

Are you speaking from experience? I mean far be it for me to judge...


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Samy wrote:
(I'm not sure I'd go as far as calling it 'dumb' -- that's IMO needlessly offensive and doesn't make anyone want to look for a solution for you)

Upon reflection, you are correct. Too late to edit the post though. Apologies.


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GeneticDrift wrote:

They can hold their breath while fighting for 14+ rounds, I don't see a problem. kill a number of humans and run off to come back later, where are the air breathers going to hide in the middle of the ocean...

Kinda works for coastal settlements too. Otherwise yeah, seems like an odd thing to do.

For a brief ship raid, sure. But for a coastal town of like 200+ people? They'd have to trudge from the beach up to the town itself. They would have ~1 minute and 40 seconds to bust in doors, battle resistance, pillage goods, slaughter innocents, then head back to the ocean. If the town had even a basic wooden wall, they'd be even more screwed. I'm fine that Paizo decided to make them an entirely aquatic threat (except for small groups with spellcaster backup) by removing their pseudo-amphibiousness, but they don't seem to stick to that. Anyway, as said it's an error. Errors happen and this one has a simple solution. Nothing more to say.


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Samy wrote:
Sure, removing the amphibious ability might be questionable (I'm not sure I'd go as far as calling it 'dumb' -- that's IMO needlessly offensive and doesn't make anyone want to look for a solution for you), but using them as land raiders most certainly isn't -- it's in keeping with how they've always been.

I'm not looking for help or solutions. I'm pointing out an error.


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Samy wrote:
I don't think there's anything dumb about the idea of them being land-raiders. If we were talking merfolk I'd agree with them flopping around on their fish tails, but with the legs and all, I don't see anything comical about sahuagin attacking land-dwellers. We've seen them emerging from the water as far back as the 1978 original Monster Manual illustration. It's always been an ingrained aspect of them that they keep coming out of the water.

So glad you brought that up! In 2nd-edition D&D, sahuagins were amphibious. In 3rd-edition, they had a specific ability called water dependent that allowed them to survive outside water for 1 hour per 2 Constitution before they started drowning. In Pathfinder, this crucial and iconic ability was removed - seemingly arbitrarily - and yet sahuagins are continued to be treated as if they possessed it. Still called land raiders, still encountered on the surface in past adventures. This? This is dumb.


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Samy wrote:
A level 5 caster gets to divide 10 hours (600 minutes) of duration. That could give 100 sahuagin 6 minutes of air activity. Easily enough to overwhelm a merchant vessel for example. And that's just with one spell slot. Could memorize multiple castings.

Personally I think the water/air breathing spell should have a 1 hour minimum per creature, but that's just me. Taken as written, yes, air breathing could allow a large sahuagin band time on the surface. No matter how dumb the thought of a single caster touching 100 creatures with a single standard action is, or the fact that very few sahuagin would be able to cast the spell (to date, most sahuagin with class levels favor martial classes, not spellcasting ones). But that's my main annoyance with sahuagins: the idea of them being land-raiders is dumb. They should have just been given the amphibious quality. They already have a base land speed and legs, which certainly implies surface capabilities, and have repeatedly functioned as terrestrial threats in past Pathfinder works, yet... can't actually breathe air? Dumb.


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ErisAcolyte-Chaos jester wrote:


A monsters stats are a small slice of what they are. If you just took humans by basic stats, they don't win against over half the bestiary. And yet they have made empires and civilisations that have lasted many, many years. Sahagins can likewise form civilisations. They can develop class levels, amass power and knowledge. There have already been proofs of this.

Okay. I'll rephrase: the vast, overwhelming majority of sahuagins cannot breathe air. The vast, overwhelming majority of humans cannot breathe water. That's why humans don't raid sahuagin camps, and why sahuagins shouldn't raid human towns.

GeneticDrift wrote:
they do have a breath air spell. Paizo srd link, scroll down

It's a 3rd-level spell. Each casting can give a few sahuagin the ability to breathe air for an hour. Depending on the size of the raiding party, you would need a dozen or more castings (or even more expensive alternatives like wands, scrolls, or potions). In all, a very inefficient way to raid. As written, sahuagin would be much better off sticking to raiding fellow aquatic creatures. They have very little reason to waste so many resources for what is going to roughly be the same reward.


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While I really liked this book, one issue that annoys me is the continued misconception that sahuagin are amphibious. They aren't. Thus, despite what's written under the "Sahuagin Empire," it would be unrealistic for the shark people to raid coastal towns. It would be extremely tough for them to even climb aboard a ship and raid it, which is something they are also supposed to do. Good luck pulling off either feat while holding your breath the entire time.


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_Ozy_ wrote:
Generic Villain wrote:
If the question is whether or not negative energy would heal a wraith, the answer is yes. From undead traits, sixth bullet point down: "Negative energy (such as an inflict spell) can heal undead creatures."
Technically, the fact that negative energy 'can' heal, doesn't mean that it always does. It just means that it can heal under certain circumstances, like negative energy channeling that specifically chooses to.

That's like debating the meaning of "is." Negative energy can and does heal undead. I'm kind of amazed this is a question. When you play, do you rule that negative energy attacks cause hit point damage to undead creatures, and positive energy heals them? That's a personal choice obviously so I wouldn't criticize it. Just curious.


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Serum wrote:
I believe the "default" is that all damage removes hit point from creatures, and other rules create exceptions to this. I don't think that there is a general rule that states that negative energy typed damage does not remove hitpoints from undead creatures nor positive energy from living creatures, only specific rules that specific instances of positive/negative typed energy damage do something other than remove hit points.

You're overthinking it. There is indeed a general rule stating that negative energy heals rather than harms undead. Or to put it another way, undead have an ability that transforms the nature of damage from a specific source: to undead, negative energy is not harmful, and thus causes no damage. Positive energy - usually helpful - is instead transformed into something harmful. It's the same with golems. The clay golem has an ability that transforms acid damage from magical sources into healing. The trope of a creature healed by something that should otherwise harm it is a fairly old one.


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If the question is whether or not negative energy would heal a wraith, the answer is yes. From undead traits, sixth bullet point down: "Negative energy (such as an inflict spell) can heal undead creatures." Thus, if the rules state that a wraith's attack deals negative energy damage (it does), and negative energy heals undead (it does), no interpretation is needed. A wraith struck by a wraith's incoporeal touch attack is healed 1D6 damage.

The channel positive/negative energy ability of a cleric is a unique outlier, and is specifically called out as such in the rules. It's one of of the rare exceptions where it either heals or harms, but never both. If an effect (other than channel energy) causes an explosion of negative energy, living creatures will be healed while undead creatures are harmed. Vice versa.


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Saethori wrote:

Confusion and Terrible Remorse aren't the greatest examples at making something hit itself, as they use a wording that says they're dealing damage to itself, and a fixed amount, rather than simply making attacking themselves.

In another counter-example, I would like to bring up the salikotal devil, who needs a special ability in order to perform coup-de-grace attacks against itself. The wording generally implies that performing coup-de-grace attacks on yourself is not normally possible, even if you voluntarily make yourself helpless.

I'm not actually convinced the wraith can attack itself.

Do you think any creature can attack itself? Legit question, not being snarky. For example in older iterations of D&D (not sure about Pathfinder, can't find any rules*), creatures on the positive energy plane were constantly being healed. Those at max hp gain temporary hp instead, and if a creature's temp hp equals its max hp, they pop like balloons. Game over. So for such a creature, constantly suffering damage is a gruesome requirement for survival.

*EDIT: Found the rules. Pathfinder's Positive Energy Plane also works like this.


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Bhai wrote:
@genericvillain, you forget that he can stay in an object (incorporeal creature) and heal itself while players are sitting there, waiting for it to come out. Basically a starvation game.

Again, I wouldn't actually let a wraith do this in my game. But if I were to do so, I'd just count that tactic as part of the difficulty in the wraith itself. In other words, that challenge would be baked into the wraith's challenge rating.


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Lathiira wrote:
Now see, that's all we needed. Confusion might have sufficed too. Though it does make me wonder why the lich is worse at it....

As you said, the lich has a specific rule. Unless a negative-energy dealing creature has such a rule, I'd default to "it can attack itself."

As a GM I don't actually know if I'd let an undead heal itself with a negative-energy melee attack. That would be a personal call though. To be fair not a bunch of undead can actually accomplish this, and in the wraith's case, it would be healing itself 1D6 damage per round. In other words it could fully recharge in non-combat situations only - in an actual fight, spending a round to heal 1D6 damage would be a total waste.


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Lathiira wrote:

I think what you're missing is a rule saying you can attack yourself. What AC do you use? Are you flat-footed? Touch AC? It's incorporeal-does that have an effect? Resolve this series of issues and you might get an answer, but good luck with it.

You don't need to roll to attack yourself. If you want to attack yourself, you do. If you need a rule backing this up, it's the 4th-level spell terrible remorse (Ultimate Magic, page 243). But you don't need a rule for something this basic.


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I feel the same way. I've said as much on here in the past.


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Quark Blast wrote:
Generic Villain wrote:
Quark Blast wrote:

Short answer: Yes to your last question. No to your first one.

Longer answer: Excepting the CE alignment, a game could be pulled off and the PCs could even be heroes of a sort.

Tangent answer: IRL everyone acts evil and good. Less the former because of social conditioning and/or feelings of guilt.

We're in agreement on all three of your points. Which rocks for you b/c I'm super smart ;)
Well sure but I already knew that. ;P

Really? That would make you the first. Heh. But I think I've chewed up enough of this thread with my blabbering. Peace out ya'll.


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Quark Blast wrote:


Short answer: Yes to your last question. No to your first one.

Longer answer: Excepting the CE alignment, a game could be pulled off and the PCs could even be heroes of a sort.

Tangent answer: IRL everyone acts evil and good. Less the former because of social conditioning and/or feelings of guilt.

We're in agreement on all three of your points. Which rocks for you b/c I'm super smart ;)


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Quark Blast wrote:

You mean make it a farce?

I guess that could be fun. :/

Well, if the op wants to make a campaign exploring every awful crevice of what it means to be depraved, than by all means. But they asked how to make a satisfying story where the evil PCs never get redeemed nor face justice. It would certainly be possible to make that an entirely realistic and introspective journey, but it would be quite dark. Is tabletop gaming really the place to explore one's most monstrous impulses? Murder, rape, torture, genocide, human sacrifice, oppression, brutality, et al. Perhaps, but I have no idea how to make that fun. It's one thing to be a tortured antihero ala White Wolf. It's entirely another to be utterly lacking in redeeming qualities.

*Edit: I would also argue that most good campaigns are pretty farcical as well. In the real world, doing the right thing rarely involves grand and glorious displays of altruism. We're normal people with 9-5 jobs. Doing good for us means helping our friends and family, donating time to our community, etc. We can't just pick up a sword and go fight demons and trolls. By the same token, evil isn't very grandiose in the real world either. Therefore, wouldn't it stand to reason that a solid bad-guy campaign should be as over the top as its good counterpart?

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