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Roy Greenhilt

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FullStarFullStarFullStar Pathfinder Society GM. 5,088 posts (5,376 including aliases). 4 reviews. No lists. 1 wishlist. 16 Pathfinder Society characters.


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Silver Crusade

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Drejk wrote:
Now when the three directors were mentioned I recall that they didn't want the world to be destroyed... Will they make any move to that effect? Can they currently make any move that would prevent that?

I'm thinking they could take possession of V again, just long enough to deliver some information. ie Send the rest of the Order to back up Roy.

Silver Crusade

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Lord Fyre wrote:
Sebastian wrote:

I thought the wait for #1,000 was too much...

I NEED #1,001 RIGHT NOW!!!!

Life is pain.

Anyone who says differently is selling something.

Silver Crusade

Black Waters was a lot of fun. I should GM it again before doing this one.

Silver Crusade ***

I'm definitely still missing a session I played.

Silver Crusade

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Aniuś the Talewise wrote:
thejeff wrote:
Aniuś the Talewise wrote:

I still wonder why the gods have to vote via the priests, when the comic has shown the gods communicating with each other directly several times?

Is it so that the priests can bear direct witness to the gods' discussion and vote?

Because if they didn't the PCs couldn't get involved? :)

There may be an in-world reason too, but that's the real one.

Actually, has the comic shown the different pantheons communicating directly? In recent history, post flashbacks to world creation or the Snarl or some such.

I don't know about between different pantheons but there are definitely panels of different northern gods talking to each other.

Yeah, but not all in one place. It's usually just 2 or 3 at a time together. Maybe this is their way of holding a meeting without having to physically get together - make their followers do the work on getting together physically.

Silver Crusade

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Andostre wrote:

Dang, the new art style is worth it just for that last panel alone!

I also like the detail that many of the high priests who voted against destroying the world are smiling that Roy is jumping down to confront Durkon. They've figured out what he's doing immediately. Specifically, Thor, Freya, Loki, the representative from the Western pantheon, and... Hel.

Hel herself isn't smiling at Roy. The gods can't see him.

But I do like that Durkula is smiling. He looks like he wants this fight, and was planning for it all along.

And I completely forgot that Durkula made minions before coming into the room. They should be along any time now.

Silver Crusade

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So moving on to predictions about what comes next...

On paper, this looks like a one sided fight. Roy's still down levels from having died, casters are more powerful than martials when you reach these high levels, and Durkula has vampire powers on top of Durkon's cleric levels. So in theory, team evil should win this easily.

So here's my prediction of how Roy not only wins, but relatively easily. Of course, the key word there is "relatively" - this still needs to be an epic fight on some level.

I'm not familiar with 3.5 rules, but I'm assuming "Summon Proxy" is a spell invented for OOTS, so we don't know the exact details of the spell. But it's safe to assume that it's a high enough level spell that Durkula won't have prepared it more than once for the day. And it probably requires concentration to maintain. That means that to keep Hel present for the Godsmoot, Durkula can't take any standard actions - he has to use them all concentrating on maintaining the spell.

So that's how Roy wins. He doesn't have to actually kill Durkula to save the world. He doesn't even have to wound him. He just has to trick/annoy him into fighting back, so the proxy disappears. Of course, Roy probably doesn't know this going in, so he might get some advice along the way, possibly from Thor's representative.

That's my guess anyway. We'll see how far off I am. :)

Silver Crusade

3 people marked this as a favorite.

WOW!!!!!

This one lived up to the hype.

And from a plot perspective, the clues were there. Hel confessing her plan didn't tell us anything that wasn't mentioned earlier, but none of us guessed it, because we just didn't put it all together. That's a well built mystery.

I just love Roy's reaction. He might be smart for a fighter, but he's not smarter than a goddess with a well conceived plan and a very wise undead high priest.

I also loved the dwarven priestess of Thor recognizing Durkon's name, and Roy's comment of "And when did he learn to pronounce the word 'of' anyway?!?" I'm still not sure if Roy's put it all together, as far as Durkula not just being Durkon with a new evil attitude.

And that final panel... I just have to say WOW!!! again.

And am I remembering correctly that Roy has something special on his sword these days for use against undead? Or was that a temporary spell? Given that his life long quest is to take down a lich, being prepared for undead should help him in fighting a vampire.

Silver Crusade ***

Hmm... I really should do something with my extra boons. I picked up 3 at GenCon, and I think I already had at least 2 or 3 from before (probably including last GenCon) that I haven't used. I'll have to look through them when I have time and offer them up here.

Silver Crusade

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GM Holden wrote:

Don't get me wrong I'm not trying to be dismissive or insulting. I'm just searching for ideas to run these enemies in an intelligent and logical manner. My group has already questioned why none of the enemies they encounter ever raise any kind of alarm or respond to epic fights happening in adjacent rooms (examples include: Thistletop, the Graul homestead and Fort Rannick).

The meta game answer is because if the entire location becomes alert and the bad guys send everything in at the party (as they really should do), they would be dead. The group needs to face these challenges in isolation from one another. How to accomplish this without straining my groups already stretched suspension of belief is puzzling me.

My group didn't face these things in isolation. When they started their first fight inside Fort Rannick, on the ground floor (after sneaking in through the basement and using a Silence spell during the one fight there, so it didn't attract attention), all the other ogres inside the ground floor came running. It just took a few rounds to get there, so they were able to handle them a couple at a time pretty easily. This has happened in a few areas of the adventure path so far.

In some parts of the adventure, it specifically says that certain groups of baddies ignore disturbances outside their rooms for specific reasons. Other than that, you do have to remember that some of them live in noisy areas, so they might not recognize fighting noises for what they are, unless a bad guy intentionally raises an alarm. Think of it logically for each area, and don't be afraid to combine fights occasionally, but make sure it takes a couple of rounds of saying "What was that?" and deciding to come, along with traveling time, before the second group arrives to check things out.

Silver Crusade ***

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More often, the Grand Lodge is the "I don't want to bother with faction politics, so just put me in the default" faction. I know I have two PCs in the Grand Lodge for that reason. It's not loyalty to the Decemvirate so much as just wanting to be a Pathfinder and not bother with factions, which fits their personalities.

Silver Crusade ***

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I joined Shadow Lodge with my first PC because my first ever PFS game was playing First Steps 3, and Grandmaster Torch's speech about Pathfinders looking out for each other made sense to my barbarian. I had no idea about the back story behind the Shadow Lodge from the previous season. This was relatively early in season 3.

I think that's half the problem. The Shadow Lodge of the season 1 and 2 scenarios was completely different than how it was presented in seasons 3 and 4, so older PFS players viewed it completely differently than those of us who joined after it was already a faction.

Silver Crusade ***

UndeadMitch wrote:
I've played through level 8 with multiple characters, and hadn't realized that I hadn't applied the ability score increase until level nine.

I'm reminded of a friend of mine, who had a reputation as the rules lawyer of my old group. She knew the rules better than any of the rest of us. At one point, we were discussing our plans for leveling up our PCs, and she was talking about taking a feat at 6th level. I asked why she got a feat at that level, and she was very confused. It turns out this was one of those times that she got 3.5 and Pathfinder rules mixed up. She didn't know that in PF, you get feats every odd level instead of every 3rd, so she had never taken her 5th level feat on that PC.

Dhenn wrote:
I spent half a combat asleep before remembering I was an elf.

I had a friend who was notorious for trying to things to sleep that were immune, and he should have known better. Elves, undead, pretty much anything that's immune to sleep, he tried it. This was someone who knew better, and he'd just facepalm when his mistake was pointed out to him.

After a few of these, we were fighting a demon (I think) one time, and he actually stopped to ask "Are demons immune to sleep?" We tried knowledge checks, but nobody knew, and it's not something anyone knew off the top of our heads. He tried it, commenting "This is probably another wasted spell", but it actually worked, and let us finish off a very tough fight that we'd been losing up to that point.

Game Master wrote:
Blackbot wrote:

We were fighting with a bunch of chairs and I carelessly engaged in melee with my wizard. The chair grappled me and I tried escaping its grapple over multiple rounds - no use. I fell unconscious. I sigh and look down on my character sheet.

"MOTHERF***** - I forgot I can dimension door as a swift action!"

Afterwards we had to blow a lot of resources to sneak through a very busy area - although I even wrote down that I wanted to grab some uniforms from the wardrobe so we could disguise ourselves. Which I only remembered after we blew our scrolls and potions.

I LOVE that scenario. I GM'd it for a group that did not disguise themselves. Cue the summoner... carrying a massive, 7 foot-tall scythe... riding on the back of her medium-sized, armless centaur of an eidolon... striding through some curtains into the middle of a fancy dinner party.

We had to take a five-minute break for people to compose themselves before we could continue, after we pointed out how ridiculous she must have looked.

That's still one of my favorite scenarios. I GMed it a few times after playing it.

I once GMed that scenario with a druid who insisted on bringing her elephant companion with her. "It's just a baby", meaning it was medium sized. She decorated it with streamers and pretended to be part of the entertainment. I ruled that the elephant failed its check to fit in, but the rest of the group got a bonus from the distraction. I figure that's a good way to reward creativity.

Also, in the fight with the chairs, I once had a ranger joke, "Good thing I have favored enemy: furniture." LOL

Silver Crusade ***

I don't get the complaint of table tents taking up space on the table. If space is at a premium, I usually just put them on top of my character sheet, then shift them around as needed to get to the sheet.

Silver Crusade

I played this character over the weekend, and had fun overall.

Our first fight was outdoor in a large area, against several bad guys, so my spell selection was very useful. The best part was using Gusting Sphere to bull rush a gremlin off a rooftop, where it landed in the area of the Entangle spell I'd previously cast.

The down side was that after using my Entangle, Stone Call, and Gusting Sphere that early, I was already running low on offensive capability after just one fight. That's really the danger of being a pure caster at low levels.

In the easier fights, I used my wand of Cure Light on the front liners a lot, and didn't contribute much on offense. I did use Fog Cloud to force some archers to come closer where our melee guys could pound on them, so I helped that way. And I discovered the joy of summoning stirges with my remaining level 1 spells against the BBEG.

Also, we faced an enemy with Greater Invisibility, so I really wished I had more than one Faerie Fire scroll, and/or some way of knowing where to target it more reliably. Someone suggested that I should get a wand of that one, and I think I agree. I just haven't decided if it's worth the 750 gp to get immediately, when that's still a lot of money at my level.

I also realized that Stone Call has no saving throw and ignores SR, so it's one of the few offensive spells that's just as good as a scroll/wand. That might be my way to get more offense this early - just carry a couple of those scrolls, and save my level 2 spell slots for other things. The down side is the huge area of effect - it'll be hard to miss my allies, so this is pretty much only useful in very large battlefields.

I still need to look up some of the spells Taenia recommended. I don't even know what books they're in. I'll use the Archives of Nethys to figure it all out when I have some time.

Silver Crusade ***

FLite wrote:
Further it is a DC 10 linguistics check for a PC to recognize their own handwriting. (DC 20 to recognize your team mates handwriting.) And although linguistics usually needs to be trained, it can be used untrained to detect forgeries, and I would say identifying your own handwriting counts as detecting forgeries. So if anyone has linguistics in the group, they should figure it out pretty quick, and even if no one has linguistics, they should get it on a take ten if they didn't dump INT.

Our GM didn't bother with rolling for it, and just assumed that everyone would recognize their own handwriting. I think that makes sense, and the linguistics check should just be used if they want to examine it more closely to try and determine if they really wrote it and don't remember doing it, or if it's a forgery.

Silver Crusade ***

I have them for a couple of my PCs, and use them when I play those characters. But I haven't gotten around to making them for the other PCs.

Silver Crusade ***

Blazej wrote:


The answer is pretty clear to me, but I have read the adventure which makes it hard to not be biased. You can't say this wasn't tested with random strangers just because it is the nature of how many puzzles work. If your mind locks on the same train of thought it all goes well, but in many ways one can just get lost exploring other routes that don't lead to the answer. I do agree that based upon the comments, something with the puzzle doesn't work with a lot of groups.

As I said, our GM couldn't explain the puzzle to us. He read and GMed this adventure weeks ago for GenCon, then ran it again for us today, and he still doesn't understand the puzzle well enough to explain what we were missing. Even he thinks the only way to solve it is dumb luck.

And it's not even like that's the only jumbled mess in this adventure. Just look at all the posts in this thread about people not understanding the two hour limit to deal with the poison and traps in the early section.

Blazej wrote:
I'm curious about how the faerie dragon fight played out since the dragon is very set against using the wand and is prone to retreating even if you haven't done any damage to him depending on the status of the other fey on the field. While it could certainly kill a typical party with the wand, the tactics avoid that outcome.

Well, that explains how we survived. We all said afterwards we were lucky he didn't just blast us with scorching ray every round, or we'd have all died. We knew the dragon retreated once we killed/chased away all the gremlins, but that took a while. Two of them were easy, but two ended up on rooftops from the portals, and being level 3-4, no PCs could fly to get up there and chase them.

Besides, once the dragon knocked me from max HP to -3 in a single round, we treated him as the dominant threat and focused on trying to catch him, rather than pulling out bows to shoot at the gremlins that weren't an immediate threat. But he spent two rounds going invisible and used his breath weapon twice, so he only blasted us with scorching ray 3 or 4 times.

It was enough to make it a long, difficult battle. And the other table at our store, running the high sub-tier, finished that fight around the same time we did. So apparently, it's a pretty long fight at either sub-tier.

Blazej wrote:
I wouldn't tell you to run it, but I would suggest you don't absolutely refuse to GM it without having read it. I have been through horrific scenarios that I have hated, then read through them and understood how they came to play out and hated them less for that.

I've had similar situations. There are two adventures in particular I remember having awful experiences because of lousy GMs (actually, the same lousy GM twice), and when I checked here on the forums, I discovered the scenarios themselves got mostly rave reviews. Once I realized it wasn't the scenarios' fault, I was curious to learn more about what I missed from playing it in a bad situation.

That's why I came to this thread, to find out what I missed, and if the adventure might be better than my experience with it. But in this thread, I'm not seeing rave reviews or universal praise. I'm seeing universal complaints about the same parts of the adventure over and over, especially that puzzle.

Silver Crusade ***

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Linda Zayas-Palmer wrote:
Thank you for the feedback about the puzzle. John and I value your feedback, and will take it into account when making decisions in future scenarios.

I just played this. Our group mostly said that we like puzzles, if they're well done and solvable. Even after the session was over, we didn't understand the puzzle in this one. At all. I have no idea how anyone's supposed to solve this other than random guessing, and our GM couldn't explain it, either. The final clue is the only reason we knew to start on the second floor, but we still don't know how any of the previous clues were supposed to lead us to that.

I haven't read the scenario, as I was just a player, but this seems like an incredibly poorly designed puzzle. So don't take all the b%~&!ing here as a sign that players don't like puzzles. Take it to mean that the puzzles need to be well edited and proof read to make sure they make sense to random strangers who weren't involved in designing them, because that obviously didn't happen with this scenario.

As for the combats, the first one in town is absolutely brutal at the lower tier. I think parties with Glitterdust will be fine, but our group didn't have an arcane caster. That faerie dragon with greater invisibility and a level 7 scorching ray wand could have killed us all if I hadn't thrown out an obscuring mist for us to hide in. And the only reason I was able to cast that is because the cleric healed me up after I got scorching rayed down from full HP to -3 in a single round.

Our group had a good time with each other. We didn't enjoy the scenario. I'll go so far as to say that this is now only the 2nd PFS scenario I've ever played that I absolutely refuse to ever GM, and I've played around half of them overall.

Silver Crusade

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alexd1976 wrote:
If Leadership is used properly, with GM and Player sitting down together and DISCUSSING the desired results, it can add a needed role to a group that may have been missing it.

This goes back to my earlier point. Rather than just giving players a banned list, it's best to have a discussion about expectations among everyone when you start the campaign. We're all adults. We can discuss things maturely and agree on stuff, rather than having arbitrary GM declarations.

Silver Crusade

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Rather than having a specific list, I think the best is to have a conversation with the players when you're starting the campaign, and have everyone agree on what kind of game you want. This should happen even before the GM sets the tone on what kind of campaign it is, thematically. Heck, this should probably happen even before you decide who's going to be the GM.

Silver Crusade ***

Actually, that's not the thread I was thinking of. I've never read that thread. But it seems to say pretty much the same thing.

Silver Crusade ***

So if you're ok with multiple rerolls when it gets split into multiple sessions, then what do you do if you're playing a module by sitting for 8-10 hours at once? That's just a single session.

You seem to be granting a bonus to players for splitting up the gaming time into multiple sessions, instead of playing the entire adventure at once.

I always took the "once per scenario" as meaning "once per adventure", even when playing modules.

Silver Crusade ***

Kalindlara wrote:

Regarding summons and "priests": my personal preferred ruling is that any divine caster can be a priest. I'll abide by an official ruling, though.

Don't ask me to dig up a reference right now, but I could swear someone at Paizo has posted in the past saying that "priest" is just a general term for any official member of the clergy. There's no class requirement there - even a fighter can be a priest, if that person is part of the official worship hierarchy of their god.

And just looking at the major 20 deities, I can think of a few examples where non-divine types would make sense as priests. Arcane casters as priests of Nethys, monks as priests of Irori, any martial class as a priest of Gorum, etc.

The question is how you make such a role playing position official in PFS, if it's not something that mechanically affects the PC.

Silver Crusade

Yeah, I really need to reread the rest of book 4. I read it months ago, and re-read the beginning parts of Jorgenfist, but haven't finished re-reading as far as Mokmurian's stats and spells again. Our group is just so slow that I end up re-read everything at least twice before they get to it.

So I forgot he used Sending. So he would already know that the raid failed, and might be planning a backup raid, though it'll take a while to plan and send. And you're right that he'll probably try Sending on the Longtooth illusion, and realize it's fake pretty quickly. I just have to decide how he'd react to that.

I told my PCs that they saw the rocs wandering around the valley once in a while. But they've been using Invisibility Sphere whenever they fly anywhere, so they've had an easy time going unnoticed. They just don't get too close to any of the giant camps.

Silver Crusade

So my party is being WAY overly cautious in approaching Jorgenfist.

After creaming the giants and dragon in Sandpoint, they intentionally raced to Jorgenfist faster than the raiding party could have made it back had they succeeeded, hoping that Mokmurian wouldn't have gotten word of the defeat yet. Teleporting to Fort Rannick saved at least a week of travel time, so they probably succeeded. There were giants who survived the Sandpoint raid, but the PCs captured them and made them promise not to go back to Mokmurian, and I figure they'll probably stick to that out of fear of both the PCs and Mokmurian's wrath. So would M have any way of knowing that the raid failed before the PCs get there?

They cleared the wyvern cave and looted the dragon cave, but they're been reluctant to go through the bug cave. They scouted it from outside already using fly and invisibility, so they know it's full of bugs, and don't want to have to mess with it. Because the other two didn't lead to any secret passages that will get them in, I think they've kinda given up on the bug cave having any, which is ironic, since that's the one that actually does.

So they were debating plans of attack, and as I said, they're being overly cautious. Since they beat up one hunting party of giants on their way to Jorgenfist, they were considering hanging out where they could ambush small groups like that regularly, trying to take out the whole giant army a few at a time over a period of weeks. This is a longer term strategy that obviously won't work. I figure after a couple of days of hunting parties not returning, the giants will get more cautious. Also, I'm thinking another whole tribe of giants could arrive at Jorgenfist, replacing those who were lost and being too many for the PCs to fight at once.

They also thought about using fly, silence, and invisibility sphere to sneak over the wall and get into the main tower. They're totally focused on that tower - they've seen the pit from a distance, but they're assuming it's just for waste disposal, and don't realize the complex has underground layers. So flying in invisibly to raid the tower seems to be their plan B right now, while taking out the army a little at a time or exploring the bug cave are plans C and D.

Plan A, as we left it at the end of yesterday's session, was to use illusions to pretend the dragon had returned from the raid and headed directly to his cave without going to see Mokmurian. They've got Major Image, so they could make it look like the dragon flew into the valley (from the wrong direction, since the range of the spell doesn't cover the whole width of the valley) and went straight to his cave. They're hoping this will lure Mokmurian to come to the dragon cave (where they're currently squatting to watch the giants from a distance), so they can ambush him on their terms.

I have to decide how M would respond to this.

The cave is 450 feet up a vertical cliff face, and Mokmurian can fly, while most of his underlings can't. And barring another method of knowing about what happened in Sandpoint (I'll have to double check his spellbook for divination possibilities, among other things), he would be waiting for the dragon and Teraktinus to get back and check in with him. So this plan actually has potential.

But I don't want to make it too easy for them by having M take the bait immediately. Maybe he'd assume if the dragon is back, then Teraktinus will be following shortly, so he's likely to wait a few hours or maybe even a full day, before sending someone to the dragon cave to see what's up. And he'd certainly send an underling instead of going himself. If the underling doesn't come back, then Mokmurian's smart enough to realize it's a trap, and the PCs could find themselves trapped in that cave with only one entrance/exit facing the giant army. But how would the giants reach them to attack en masse? Or would they just collapse the cave entrance by throwing boulders at it?

Lots of possibilities here. Any suggestions?

Silver Crusade ***

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Mazel Tov!

Silver Crusade ***

This reminds me of the old "Your alginment won't go to evil for doing an evil faction mission, but you may still fall as a paladin." Just because we can use [evil] spells without an alignment infraction, that doesn't make it ok for good PCs, especially paladins.

Edited to respond to Andrew's post, since he ninja'd me. While I agree that paladins shouldn't be doing it, I don't believe in insta-fall for anything but REALLY obvious evil (killing orphans, etc). A warning from their god and an Atonement would cover it.

Silver Crusade

I'll have to look those up. I've never even heard of a lot of them, so I'll have to figure out what books they're from. This is for PFS, so I have to own the book to use the spell. I have most of the earlier hard back books, and a few splat book, but I haven't bought many new books recently.

As I said, I've already got Gusting Sphere, along with Obscuring Mist and Fog Cloud as domain spells (Weather Domain).

I actually looked at the Liberation domain when I created the character, but I ruled it out. The movement abilities are great, but the domain spells are all very circumstancial. Given that I took a domain instead of an animal companion specifically to have more spells to cast per day, I really wanted spells that I'd be using constantly, rather than things that only come up in very specific situations. That domain just looks like it would be fantastic for a cleric who gets two domains, but it's not worth it as the only domain for a druid.

On the other hand, Weather isn't as good for a cleric. They'll frequently have other things to do regularly and not need the little first level blast, and other domains might have better spells for them. But for a casting focused druid who needed something to do every round at low levels without burning spells, that little blast is a pretty good filler ability. And the spells aren't half bad, especially for a sylph who can see through the cloud spells.

Silver Crusade

Situational buffs make great scrolls. Every caster I play has scrolls of Comprehend Languages. In this case, I've got low level stuff like Faerie Fire, Touch of the Sea, Air Bubble, etc as scrolls already. Don't have the PC in front of me, so I don't remember all of them off the top of my head.

I think your list of spell suggestions highlights my big problem right now. All your recommendations are level 3+ spells. I think the lower level druid control spells are more environment dependent, so there just aren't many that can be used in an urban setting.

I was kind of hoping that hitting level 3 meant that the character would start to become more useful, as pure casters tend to suck at low levels. But I may have to wait until level 5 for that to happen, or else stick to adventures that I know take place in outdoor settings.

Silver Crusade

My Self wrote:
I like your choice of OOTS avatar, by the way.

Thanks. I'm a huge OOTS fan. That's part of the reason I made my sylph character a female pacifist. Her name is Celia. She's not quite as dedicated a pacifist as Celia from OOTS, but she's at least partially modeled on that character.

Use Headbutt!! wrote:

aqueous orb is a personal favorite of mine (and if you fluff it as a giant raindrop I'd say it fits a sky druid) as far as non-lethal conjuration offensive spells go. Unfortunately you will not get it for another 2 levels.

maybe ray of sickening at early levels for at least something non-lethal?

Sorry to say, but I don't think you can go pure non-lethal on a non-combat oriented class this early on. Having produce flames as a back up ranged attack is going to be too helpful for you.

Summons sounds like your best bet if you personally don't want to get your hands dirty so I'd say so augment summons. Druids actually get enough conjuration spells to warrant it, such as snowball.

Yeah, I was already thinking Aqueous Orb will be great when I reach that level.

The spells don't have to be non-lethal, but I prefer to stick to that where possible. Like I mentioned earlier, Gusting Orb is pretty good for that, as is Entangle. But Entangle is location dependent. But stuff like Stone Call and Flaming Sphere seem like necessary backup plans for when I can't avoid doing lethal damage, along with having summoned critters who do real damage for me.

Taenia wrote:

Keep in mind that a low str does not preclue melee. With a good dex you can grab weapon finesse, piranha strike and an Agile AoMF and still do some damage, especially combined with spells like frostbite and produce flame.

If you want to have fun as a blaster grab spell pen, Sp Focus Evocation/Gr and use flaming spheres, call lightning, ball lightning, aggressive thundercloud and similar spells for consistent damage. Keep in mind that you can generally have two of these out in a turn, so its fun having a flaming sphere and aggressive thundercloud running around the board hitting for 3d6 each, each round.

This is definitely not a melee focused character. Partially due to the racial constitution penalty, I intentionally made the decision to dump strength, and go caster focused with this one to stay off the front line. Thus, the whole "hide in my clouds casting" approach.

I'll definitely do a little blasting later. After all, I get Call Lightning as a domain spell. And it fits as a priestess of Gozreh, God of Storms (among other things). But as I said, I don't want that to be my focus.

I'm more looking for battlefield control spells, like Entangle, Soften Earth and Stone, Expeditious Excavation, etc. But most of those are location dependent. I'm really hoping to find more stuff that I can do in any environment, but the down side of being a druid is that a lot of their stuff only works in natural settings, so I may have to stick to summoning and blasting in urban settings.

Silver Crusade ***

countchocula wrote:
I was hoping for 25 different types of cookies.. :(

There's only three types of cookies: lawful, neutral, and chaotic... but they're all evil.

Silver Crusade

I'll consider it, but it'll be a while. This archetype doesn't even get wildshape as early as most druids, so I don't think I qualify for the feat until level 7. So I'll probably stick to Spell Focus: Conjuration and Augment Summoning at 3 and 5.

It's too bad there are so few conjuration spells for druids to go with that.

Any other recommendations for offensive druid spells, though? Especially stuff that works indoors, since many require a more natural setting?

Silver Crusade

So I got a boon that lets me play a sylph in PFS, and I went with the Sky Druid archetype from the Advanced Race Guide, just because it would be something I couldn't do with any other race. I built her as a pure caster, with the Weather domain instead of an animal companion, and dumped strength, so no melee capability at all, but more spells than most druids.

I've only actually played this PC twice, but I also put some GM credits on her, so I'm up to advancing her to level 3. I'm hoping to play her again this weekend, and some more in the near future, so I'm looking for advice on feats and spells that would be good for this type of druid.

My first level feat was Cloud Gazer, the sylph specific feat that lets me see through non-magic clouds, and three times as far through magic clouds. The idea is that my domain gives me Obscuring Mist and Fog Cloud as my first two domain spells, so I can hide in my clouds and cast spells at the enemies without being targeted back. Of course, this only works in large, open battlefields - in closer combat, I'll just hide behind the front liners and skip the cloud spells, since they could mess up the rest of the party.

For other feats, I'm not sure what else would be useful for this type of druid. I'm thinking Spell Focus: Conjuration with Augment Summoning, to improve my Summon Nature's Ally spells. Beyond that, maybe Spell Penetration (and Greater) and Spell Focus (possibly with Greater) for the schools I use the most? Starting at level 5, my archetype will let me fly in combat most of the time without having to wild shape, so I won't wild shape as much as most druids, so I think I can skip the usual Natural Spell. I'd also consider Combat Casting, Toughness, or Lightning Reflexes. Reflex is my lowest save, and I figure the biggest threat to me when I'm hiding in my clouds would be an area of effect blast.

I'm also wondering what offensive spells I should be looking at. Due to the PC's pacifistic personality, I'm leaning towards non-lethal damage whenever possible, but she might do lethal damage with a spell as a last resort. This is another reason Weather domain works for her - the first level blast is non-lethal, but it has a little debuff to go with it, which is nice.

I'm also really liking that most of the sylph specific spells in the ARG are castable by druids. I've already used Windy Escape as a level 1 defensive spell, and now that I can get level 2 spells, Gusting Sphere is an offensive spell that goes with her theme (non-lethal, weather/wind based). Gusting Sphere isn't as good as Flaming Sphere for damage, but it's a little non-lethal damage with some battlefield control.

Like I said, I'll consider lethal damage if absolutely necessary, but I'm more inclined to look at battlefield control spells. In the past, I've prepped Entangle and Charm Animal for outdoor adventures. I was thinking Stone Call or Flaming Sphere now that I get level 2 spells. Soften Earth and Stone is another tempting one for outdoors, but it doesn't affect worked stone, so it won't work indoors. Similarly, Entangle and Charm Animal aren't good for dungeon crawls. What are some good spells to use instead?

And of course, I'm mostly looking at level 1 and 2 spells right now, since that's all I can cast so far, but I could use suggestions for higher level offensive spells, too.

Silver Crusade ***

Stiletto wrote:
If the party leaves at Section B6 do they lose the 2nd Prestige Point?

I don't have the scenario in front of me, so I don't remember the numbers of the rooms/encounters. But if you're talking about accepting the deal and using the key to leave, then yes.

Silver Crusade

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Try this.

Silver Crusade ***

I think the weirdest "Who are we again?" moment I ever had in a PFS game was with a friend of mine playing a Paladin/Hellknight from Cheliax. We were sent to infiltrate a group of Hellknights, and weren't supposed to let them know we're Pathfinders. But as a paladin, she can't lie.

That PC was so min-maxed that she started with int 7 and wis 7 to get her 20 charisma to start, and yes, she played up her character as a very dumb blonde. So the rest of the party just lied to her and told the PC we weren't Pathfinders. We were just some people going to visit some of her fellow Hellknights with her.

I don't know if that made her the worst Pathfinder ever, but I think it might qualify her as the worst Hellknight ever. And definitely the worst worshiper of Aroden ever (this was before paladins were required to have a legal deity in PFS, so she played up her very dumb paladin refusing to believe that Aroden's dead).

Silver Crusade ***

Stiletto wrote:

I like and enjoy putting work into preparing scenarios that I run. But I'm a bit put off that it seems like this adventure requires way more prep than most others. Yes, Pathfinder scenarios vary between "dungeon crawls" which are easy to prep and full on "role-playing" scenarios but this one seems especially onerous. The encounters are all different with a lot of background to study, the monsters are unique. I'm having a hard time getting into this one.

I'm glad that it sounds like players are having a good time, but I'm not, preparing for it.

If I hadn't played it before starting to prep to GM it, I'd probably agree with you. But I enjoyed playing it enough to feel the effort's worth it.

Silver Crusade ***

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Charlie Bell wrote:
Fromper wrote:
Charlie Bell wrote:

I found the official charges/consumables in a mindscape answer. It's on p. 237 of OA, under the Normal Magic trait:

OA p. 237 wrote:
In an immersive mindscape where magic behaves normally, characters and creatures can use spells, spell-like abilities, and magic items as they normally would. Spells are consumed and charges or consumables are spent.

In a twisted way, this actually sorta makes sense.

Think about how the VC in this adventure converts prepared spells to potions for the PCs in the mindscape. Well, it works both ways.

In the mindscape, PCs have access to use their magic items that they have on their physical bodies, and only the ones that are on their bodies. If they left a magic item at home, they wouldn't have it with them for either the physical or mindscape portions of the adventure. But within the mindscape, they can use those items that are on their bodies, and that magic can be expended.

So if they drink a potion in the mindscape, that liquid is still sitting their in a bottle on their physical body, but the magic has been drained out of it.

I follow your reasoning, because magic.

So here's what blows my mind: if you burn a smokestick, or eat a trail ration, or expend a use out of a healer's kit, in the mindscape--that smokestick, ration, or kit use is gone in the real world. No magic involved.

INCEPTION

There's still magic involved. The magic that transports them into the mindscape.

Because... magic.

Silver Crusade

He never said this was for PFS.

Personally, I've had fun with my "bad touch" pirate cleric. He's more of a debuffer than damage dealer on the front line, using the 1st level Trickery domain power as much as AC to avoid getting hit. Needless to say, stuff like Combat Casting, Focused Mind, and Uncanny Concentration to boost his ability to cast defensively are absolutely necessary, since he's pretty much casting on the front line every round.

Silver Crusade ***

You should put the name of the adventure in the title of the thread.

Silver Crusade ***

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Charlie Bell wrote:

I found the official charges/consumables in a mindscape answer. It's on p. 237 of OA, under the Normal Magic trait:

OA p. 237 wrote:
In an immersive mindscape where magic behaves normally, characters and creatures can use spells, spell-like abilities, and magic items as they normally would. Spells are consumed and charges or consumables are spent.

In a twisted way, this actually sorta makes sense.

Think about how the VC in this adventure converts prepared spells to potions for the PCs in the mindscape. Well, it works both ways.

In the mindscape, PCs have access to use their magic items that they have on their physical bodies, and only the ones that are on their bodies. If they left a magic item at home, they wouldn't have it with them for either the physical or mindscape portions of the adventure. But within the mindscape, they can use those items that are on their bodies, and that magic can be expended.

So if they drink a potion in the mindscape, that liquid is still sitting their in a bottle on their physical body, but the magic has been drained out of it.

Silver Crusade ***

Kevin Willis wrote:
Brett Carlos wrote:
Hillis Mallory III wrote:
** spoiler omitted **
Ah, fond memories. That spoiler was the first time I actually sung with joy at the PFS table. And at the request of my fellow players, it was the last. I caterwaul something awful. :-)

Clearly you haven't been woken up by Drandle Dreng at 3 AM nearly enough times.

After one too many, "This shouldn't be dangerous at all" comments from Drandle Dreng, back before the end of the Shadow Lodge, my Shadow Lodge barbarian actually said to Dreng, "You know this is why I trust Grandmaster Torch more than you, right?"

And for the record, Venture-Captain Mash (14th level barbarian) is still officially a member of the Shadow Lodge. He retired before the faction closed down, and I haven't played him since he hit level 14. My in story reasoning is that he's trying to restart the Lodge without Torch.

Silver Crusade ***

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Oddly, when I choose a race for power gaming reasons, it's usually human. That bonus feat is just too good to pass up for some builds.

As for people RPing their race, I've seen quite a bit of it. It really depends on the person. Some people get more into talking "in character" and really acting out their character's actions, while others don't. I don't think that has anything to do with race.

In my case, you can always tell when I'm playing a gnome (talk faster, squeekier voice). And my nagaji hisses a little. And my half orc introduces himself as Green Beard the Pirate, because what else would you call a half orc pirate? And my tiefling goes around biting people with his tusks in combat. So you can usually tell what non-human race I'm playing, even if you missed my character intro.

Silver Crusade ***

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Jayson MF Kip wrote:

Put me down as "seventeen unaffected characters."

Me too, unfortunately.

I wish the recent errata update had included notes on every new weapon introduced in the Advanced Race Guide to say what fighter weapon groups they're in, but it didn't. So I continue to have 16 PCs in PFS, and a 17th concept that will probably never be created, because the question I asked a year ago has never been answered by Paizo.

Silver Crusade ***

andreww wrote:

I ran this on Sunday and, while I enjoyed it, two things narked me about it.

Firstly using shadow conjurations is generally a bad idea. The shadow spells are some of the worst written spells in the game. Just how various abilities like DR work is very far from clear. It is also very easy to miss the reductions in AC and saves that these creatures take. When I made my first prep pass I totally overlooked it and my group was nearly fighting full AC enemies which would be normal for shadow conjuration. Really that sidebar needs to be written in letters of fire three feet high as they are far from standard for shadow conjuration. I would have much rather seen a proper stat block with perhaps one fewer fight. I don't think having the base hag, statue and air elemental stat blocks in the back helps in this case.

Secondly, the adjustments you make for the final eidolon are interesting but are lacking a rather crucial element. This scenario is highlighting, in part, the introduction of Occult Adventures with its use of a mind scape. However, it doesn't have any instructions on how the Eidolon changes in the presence of occult based characters. I had an Occultist in my group and was left a bit stumped as there was no Occult caster option so I picked full BaB as it was a Battle Host.

So I finally got around to reading this last night. This was just a "first pass" read, so I still need to draw maps and go through stat blocks in detail before I'm ready to run it on Sunday. But at least now I know enough to really jump into this thread with more than just a player's perspective.

Not really knowing the details of shadow conjurations, I read the sidebar and know that I'll need to adjust the stat blocks. This is annoying (the stat blocks in the back really should have these adjustments built in), but I can live with it. But I'm also assuming that everything I need to know is in that sidebar, and that knowing how shadow conjuration "normally" works isn't a requirement.

Your second question is more interesting, and highlights my biggest problem with PFS since returning. Due to other stuff going on in my life (including GMing a home campaign, but also lots of other life stuff not related to RPGs), I haven't been playing/GMing PFS nearly as much in the last year and a half, and I've gotten way behind on keeping up with all the new material that Paizo has published. This Sunday will be my first time GMing a PFS session since last November, I think. My home group is a lot more basic in what Pathfinder material we use (mostly just the Core Rulebook and Advanced Players Guide, with the very rare spell or item taken from elsewhere).

I haven't even looked at the Advanced Class Guide or Occult Adventures yet. Usually, that's not an issue, because I assume the players using one of those classes will know what they're doing, so I don't need to know the details, especially since I haven't been GMing. But that's harder for something like this, where the adventure assumes the GM will know quickly and easily whether the PCs are full BAB, divine casters, arcane casters, etc. Not only don't I know where occult PCs fall on that scale, but I don't even know about the ACG PCs. As an obvious example, I've played at tables with warpriests a few times, but I've never read up on the class, so I have no idea if they're full BAB with minimal casting like a paladin, or full casters with 3/4 BAB like clerics and oracles.

I'm also still hoping for someone from Paizo to jump in with an answer to Charlie Bell's question: How are consumables treated in the mindscape?

Silver Crusade

The reason I say Raging Vitality is mandatory is because of the Con bonus you get while raging. It increases your max HP, but then if you're knocked down to negative, you stop raging and lose that bonus to HP.

So for instance, a barbarian with 14 Con at level 5 without the feat, gets a max HP increase of 10 while raging. If something hits her hard enough to knock her to -6, she drops unconscious, stops raging, and loses those 10 extra HP. Thus, she automatically goes from -6 to -16 HP, which is DEAD.

If she had Raging Vitality, she'd have 15 extra HP while raging at level 5 (because of the extra +2 Con while raging that the feat provides), so that hit that put her at -6 would actually only drop her to -1. But then, the feat would let her keep raging, so she wouldn't drop those 15 extra HP, go down to -16, and die instantly. She'd have more than a dozen rounds to stabilize or get a heal from a party member before dying.

So it's worth it for every rager to start with a high enough Con score for Raging Vitality and pick it up at level 3 or 5.

Silver Crusade

claudekennilol wrote:
PRD, Combat wrote:

Deciding between an Attack or a Full Attack: After your first attack, you can decide to take a move action instead of making your remaining attacks, depending on how the first attack turns out and assuming you have not already taken a move action this round. If you've already taken a 5-foot step, you can't use your move action to move any distance, but you could still use a different kind of move action.

There is absolutely nothing in there that says "if you get some kind of bonus for a full attack that somehow makes your first attack in a full attack somehow better than an attack made with a standard action, then you can no longer downgrade your full attack into an attack."

So where exactly are you getting your stances on "you got a bonus so you can't downgrade" other than "I think it might be too powerful so I'm saying no"?

Well, I'm not Cerwin, but I'm leaning towards agreeing with him. I could be convinced otherwise, but I think I have a logical reason for agreeing with him, so let me explain it.

As I mentioned earlier, my basis is that you can retroactively change your first attack of a full attack to say it was a standard action attack, as long as what you did during that first attack could have been done as a standard action. Technically, taking a penalty to hit in order to set up your additional attacks isn't in the rules as something you can do in a standard action, but who would argue that you can't voluntarily penalize yourself?

On the other hand, getting the bonus from flurrying at high monk levels, or putting a second arrow on the string for manyshot, are things that can only be done as the first attack of a full attack, and can't be done as a standard action. So retroactively saying that those attacks were standard actions doesn't make sense - you couldn't have done that if you had taken a standard action, since it's something you're only allowed to do as part of a full attack.

Silver Crusade ***

Charlie Bell wrote:

Question: since the mindscape isn't real, do charges/consumables used in the mindscape stay gone when the PCs go back to reality?

I've checked Occult Adventures to see if the mindscape rules there have anything to say about that, but if they do, I can't find it.

That is an excellent question. I don't have Occult Adventures or anything, so I wouldn't even know where to begin to research that. Hopefully, someone can provide a definitive answer before I GM it this weekend.

Silver Crusade

On the top floor of Fort Rannick, it's very easy for the group to accidentally trigger all 3 encounters on that floor at once. They start one fight, and the other two join in because they heard the noise. That's how our group's cavalier died. No modification necessary to make it tough.

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