Roy Greenhilt

Fromper's page

FullStarFullStarFullStarFullStar Pathfinder Society GM. 7,849 posts (9,501 including aliases). 4 reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 35 Organized Play characters. 5 aliases.


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The other possibility is that Hilgya is Durkon's permanent replacement as the team cleric. I've kinda been assuming that since she showed up, but I was also assuming Durkon's soul would actually be destroyed once Durkula was done with it, which never happened.

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Joe Bouchard wrote:

The last group actually ran into Ichok outside the apothecary, and that was because they took Timinic with them when they left the safe house (which I had to ad hoc the schedule at that point, but it was an obvious next step).

I think that was my group. Had a fun time with this at Gen Con, now prepping to run it locally.

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Take those types of questions to the GM discussion thread.

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So I didn't find the bit about what happens to the soul when a vampire takes over the body, but I think I finally understand Odin's prophecy that got Durkon banished from the dwarven lands:

Link 1
Link 2
Link 3

Because only Durkon could pull THIS off.

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Anyone want to find the old strip where it's explained what happens to his soul? I know it was mentioned once, but I want to be sure.

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Cry. Definitely cry.

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I had to look it up: Belkar getting the clasp from the gnome. I remembered he had it, but wondered why it didn't help earlier. I forgot that rubbing it was the activation, which Mr. Scruffy did.

Interestingly, Belkar is expressing his feelings, and the clasp isn't hurting him. His alignment just officially shifted - he's no longer evil!

As for Durkon's revelations, now I want to go back and read ALL of it, to see all the memories and how this was all set up. I'm not sure how I feel about this payoff, though - does this mean the vampire is no longer evil and no longer works for Hel? Shouldn't all vampires go through this when they're done absorbing all the memories of their hosts? I still don't quite get where that's all going.

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Jhaeman wrote:
Man, after so much build up, the big fight against Mokmurian turned into a big dud after he rolled a natural 1 on his save vs. feeblemind just a couple of rounds into the encounter. I knew that sort of thing was a risk going in, but it's still frustrating. Oh well, the players still had fun and enjoyed their victory, and I guess that's the most important thing.

I had something like that with Barl Breakbones. My group killed him way too easily. Mokmurian, on the other hand, caused the group's second PC death - that was actually a pretty epic fight.

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I don't know Michael Eshleman. From the way he's described here, he sounds like a good guy.

But I do know Paizo. I've been a PFS player and GM for 7 years. For the first year I was a player, the area where I lived had no venture officers. The first guy who applied for the V-C job got it, but he was a jerk who drove female players away, and he was quickly removed from the position. I've known several good venture officers who have never been removed by Paizo, though some have stepped down over the years, as life got in the way. So from what I've seen, Paizo does a pretty good job at deciding who needs to be removed from V-C positions when something goes wrong.

So who do you expect me to side with?

The point is we don't know the specifics of this situation. And if the details can't be posted here in this thread, so we can all find out what went down and judge for ourselves if it was fair, then this thread is pointless. You can't expect everyone on the Paizo forums to go wandering all over the internet looking for information on a situation that doesn't concern us.

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Secane wrote:

Sorry, but what is going on exactly?

All I am reading is that a well respected VC has been removed from his position?

Why was he removed and why does it require a petition to bring him back?

Agreed. Since the rest of us don't know why he was removed from the position, we have no basis to judge whether or not it was the right decision. So why would any of us support a petition? And what's the point of this thread?

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PaleDim wrote:
Where do folks get all of these race boons?

GMing at conventions.

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I remember playing Race for the Runecarved Key at the high tier (14-15?) with the same group of us who had gone through Eyes of the Ten together. There was one encounter where the GM flagged a "runner" over to the table to let them know we were done with an encounter, and they were like "already?".

At high levels, a well coordinated group can sometimes totally break encounters. Things like teleportation to get ahead of the enemies or Dismissal spells to remove summoned foes can really wreak havoc, even besides the uber-optimized damage dealers.

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That were ... intere'stin'.

Durkon seems to have more control over showing Durkula memories than I realized. I knew Durkon's mind could jump to something and show it, but this seems like they're talking about a greater level of control than that. And Durkula cares more about that than I would have expected.

Now I'm really curious where this latest memory is going.

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MadScientistWorking wrote:
Lau Bannenberg wrote:
MadScientistWorking wrote:
Hillis Mallory III wrote:

I find that over the grand scheme of things, what the character in the Scenario is specifically tends to not matter in the whole of the story that is told. It is nice to mention if a character asks, or it comes up in Role Play, but with Miss Feathers being the exception, the character has other things the characters need in interaction other than what they identify as or are.

I wonder how much of the fact that it doesn't come up in regards to NPCs is the fact that only until recently has Paizo been doing anything in regards to non binary cultures. Its weird to say that when canonically there are groups within Golarion that have no cultural understanding of gender that its not necessarily relevant.

I think it's more that the gender of NPCs tends not to play a major role in PFS stories to begin with. In the vast majority of scenarios, you could change the men into women and vice versa and the story wouldn't change a whole lot.

When players encounter an NPC, the first question on their mind isn't gender - it's whether the NPC is an enemy, ally or neutral. Is the NPC going to help them with the adventure, or will they have to be fought or maybe convinced to stand aside?

Ehhhh.... No. Your absolutely and completely wrong on that matter. If they could force the issue of sexuality of NPCs year after year after year after year then they can definitely make gender relevant. And I'm not saying that they're not but just to point out your whole argument is dumb.

I completely agree with Hillis and Lau on this one, and I really don't understand your reaction.

PFS isn't like a longer campaign, where players might want to take the time to get to know NPCs for their personalities. In PFS, the players are only focused on what they need from an NPC for the mission, and rarely care about the NPC's details unless the GM really plays it up. Half the time, the players don't even remember the NPC's name, let alone gender or anything else about them. I can't even count how many times I've heard "What's the name of the mayor we need to talk to?" or "Who's the other guy we were supposed to see?" (regardless of the gender of the "guy" in the latter)

And when it comes to enemies, it's even worse. Those are just minis on the map. Generic thugs are always assumed to be male. Unless the GM specifically says otherwise, in which case they're assumed to be important NPCs, not just generic thugs, because generic thugs are always male (and usually light skinned humans).

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Just chalk it up to the bad guys being arrogant and over-confident. They go for the direct approach, because they think they can get away with it.

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Shaudius wrote:
Fromper wrote:

False equivalence. Pathfinder is the flagship product of the company, and makes up a large majority of their business. Starfinder isn't.

With the move to 2 adventures a month and monthly ap and based on icv2 and website listings i don't know that you can make such a claim, i.e. large majority of their business, and this will certainly not be true in the upcoming year with the pf2 playtest ongoing.

It's pretty galling to see such disdain for one of a companies major products that you can't even handle one night of a con being exclusively dedicated to it when the other product gets 2 nights of the con exclusively dedicated to it, especially considering that the sfs special is selling equally well to the scenario on one of those nights.

I'd just like to point out that I was only pointing out the logical fallacy of your argument, but that doesn't mean I was taking sides.

I don't have a problem with the Paizo schedule the way it is. As Hillary said, the big specials are so noisy that they MUST use the entire Sagamore, because it would be challenging to play anything else in that room at the same time. Pathfinder gets two of them and Starfinder gets one, based on their relative popularity and importance to Paizo. It makes perfect sense.

And personally, I'll only be in the Sagamore for two sessions the entire weekend this year - the Friday night Pathfinder special and a regular Pathfinder game Thursday afternoon. I have other plans for much of the convention, though depending on how late I stay up Saturday night, I might consider wandering into the Sagamore Sunday morning with generic tickets to see what PFS game I can sneak into. And despite being a 4 star GM, I don't like spending my vacations "working", so I've never GMed more than 4 sessions at Gen Con. This year, I won't be GMing at all.

For those who are complaining that you don't have anything to do in the evening when a special is going on for the game you don't play, I highly recommend trying True Dungeon. It doesn't matter if you Starfinder fans aren't a fan of the medieval fantasy/Pathfinder/D&D genre - the experience is worth it, anyway. Those tickets are expensive though, so if you don't want to spend that much, I'll recommend Upper Deck's Marvel Legendary deck building game that I've gotten into lately. You can get into a beginner/intro game of that for only $4.

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Shaudius wrote:
Akeela Valerian, the Wolf wrote:
Yeah, it'a a pretty big bummer to have ZERO offerings from the flagship game on the last night of the con. It's not very fun to be force fed Starfinder as the only Paizo offering that night. Especially two years in a row. My two cents.

It's a pretty big bummer to have ZERO offerings from one of the games on two nights of the con. It's not very fun to be force fed Pathfinder as the only Paizo offering that night. Especially two years in a row.

False equivalence. Pathfinder is the flagship product of the company, and makes up a large majority of their business. Starfinder isn't.

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Do you know about the new Concordance faction? We finally have a nature themed faction, so lots of nature themed PCs are switching over.

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I'll be playing the Friday night special, and the palindrome numbered PFS scenario (10-01) on Thursday afternoon. That's it for me in the Sagamore this year.

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That's unfortunate. I only played the adventure, so I never bought and downloaded it. I was hoping that information would be there.

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What's the name of the grippli tribe in this? I'm using this for the back story of my grippli ranger. He was away on a hunting trip and returned to find his tribe dead, and a group of Pathfinders cleaning up, so he went to Absalom with them.

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supervillan wrote:

Having played parts A and B now, I can't help but feel this would have been better as a module, or as two linked scenarios (Solstice Scar Part 1 and Part 2).

The story is shaping up nicely, but I'd rather that the multi-table specials be unique. I don't enjoy the repetition.

Agreed. I'm skipping this one at Gen Con this year, because I'm just not interested. I'll play the final version to see how it all ends, assuming I have the chance.

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Well, that's interesting. I'm finally seeing one of the sessions I played at Gen Con last year (of 4 total played and GMed) showing up on my list. Like Wallbanger, it's a session I played of 9-00, and the event says "Pathfinder Society at Gen Con 2016". My other 3 sessions are still missing.

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I'll be with some friends at Gen Con who used to play RPGs regularly years (decades) ago, but mostly just play 1 or 2 games per year at Gen Con these days. They've done Pathfinder with pregens at past Gen Cons and enjoyed it. From playing with them, I know that they just want to roll some dice and bash some monsters, so they're not overly concerned with skills or plot. Any recommendations for which scenarios they'd most enjoy at Gen Con this year?

I was thinking From the Tome of the Righteous Repose should be a good dungeon crawl for them, where we can go bash some beasties. I've played and GMed it already, but it's replayable, so we're good.

What else is on this year's Gen Con schedule that's relatively combat heavy? It doesn't have to necessarily avoid skills and a plot (Pathfinder adventures never do), but I know they'll want lots of combat.

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andreww wrote:
Events seem to be up now.

Haven't decided on anything for this year's schedule yet. But I was just looking through the events and noticed that Paizo raised the ticket price for the multi-player specials. Regular PFS/SFS adventures are still $6, but Solstice Scar is $10, and the new PFS and SFS multi-tables are $12.

I doubt if that will affect my decisions as to what to play, it's worth noting.

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And the Order's secret weapon is revealed. Durkula now knows that Hilgya's there, which could be interesting.

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What's the name of the grippli tribe? I'm using this as the back story of my grippli pc.

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Tusk the Half-Orc wrote:
And a side note to Fromper, please don't fade away from the boards entirely - I have been following 2 books behind you in the Rise of the Runelords GM threads for the last 3 years as I GM our home campaign. With Latrecis having finished book 6 last month, your group finishing soon, and a few other frequent and helpful ROTRL posters coming to the end of their campaigns, I feel like a high school junior watching all the seniors who showed him the ropes graduate.

Thanks for all the love, everyone. Actually, my Rise of the Runelords campaign ended a couple of months ago. The heroes won, but the final battle was long and bloody, with multiple PC deaths. Truly an epic fight.

That's part of the reason I'm GMing less. You'd think I'd take the time that I used to spend on Runelords prep and convert it to more PFS GMing, but I'm burned out enough that I'm rarely GMing anything any more. I could go on about the reasons I'm not playing as much, either, but I don't want to derail this thread.

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Findeladlara may actually work. My character is joining the adventuring group specifically to seek out some rumored elven ruins. He'll stick around for other things, as the nature of the adventure changes, but that's his original interest.

Also, her writeup says that her followers and those of Shelyn have something of a rivalry. Not outright hatred or contempt, but just different ways of viewing art. My party will have a cleric of Shelyn, and possibly a bard who also follows Shelyn. That could provide for some fun rivalry between PCs.

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Hilary Moon Murphy wrote:

Okay. I know that for Gary, Fromper and myself none of our missing tables are the PFS Special or ACG. Jack did GM the PFS Special, but otherwise he did SFS, and half of his tables are missing too.

Actually, two of my missing tables are from playing the specials, but I didn't GM them. I'm also missing play and GM credit from regular PFS scenarios.

And I know someone who was missing GM credit from several regular SFS scenarios as recently as maybe a month ago, but I don't know if she still is. Maybe those were reported since the last time I talked to her about this.

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I'm making a new PC for a campaign (unlike all my PFS PCs), and I'm trying to figure out what deity he'd worship.

The character is an occultist, interested in objects of historical significance. He wants to go exploring ruins and seeking out such items. So basically, he's an archaeologist. Which deity would be most appropriate for that, given that it's very much his primary personality attribute. Also, he's an elf (probably from Kyonin) if it matters.

The best I can find is Desna, as the goddess of explorers. I couldn't find any that are focused in history or preserving old items, though I suppose that could fall under Shelyn's artistic area. But the items he's interested in aren't necessarily artistic - they could be anything from armor and weapons to everyday household goods.

Given the hundreds of Golarion Deities, you'd think there would be something related to history, but I can't find it.

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Bob, are you even aware of how big this problem is? Every single person I know who attended Gen Con last year has given up on ever seeing their sessions reported here on the site. No exceptions. Some of them have seen maybe half of their sessions reported, but many of us (myself included) haven't seen a single one get reported.

We haven't bothered sending emails to complain about it, because this thread told us not to. The last update here was that it was still being worked on. Nobody has ever officially said "OK, we're done with what we know about. Let us know if we missed anything." And since none of us have pictures of the reporting sheets with all the player and GM numbers, most probably won't bother complaining, anyway, since we know there's nothing you can do about it.

But it does effect things. In my case, due to this and another convention from last summer never being reported, it took a couple of extra months to officially get my 4th star. There are some adventures that require 4 stars to GM, which I've been looking forward to being able to running. But at this point, my annoyance at the delays has dampened my enthusiasm to the point where I don't even want to bother any more.

I know this isn't your fault, and there's really nothing you can do. But showing up here to tell us that everything's supposedly reported, when we ALL know that it isn't, can best be described as tone deaf. Most of us would probably be fine with an apology from Paizo along the lines of "We goofed - sorry we'll never be able to report those sessions, since we don't have all the data". These things happen. We get it. It's the lack of official response that's more annoying than anything.

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I've already given up. Not just on this. I've kinda given up on Paizo altogether recently.

This hobby has just about reached my limit on the number of minor annoyances I'm willing to put up with. Some of them aren't even Paizo's fault. This one definitely is, but it's also among the most minor.

But recently I'm playing less, GMing MUCH less, spending much less time here on the forums, and buying far fewer new products. I haven't reached the point of leaving the hobby or boycotting Paizo or anything like that, but I could see it happening if some other game grabbed my attention right now.

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BigNorseWolf wrote:
Iammars wrote:
3. If the scenario brings up their transness in a way that’s visible to the players, don’t skip it! – I’m mainly looking at 8-99 here. The way 8-99 brings up the fact that Medda Spiritbreaker is trans is natural and visible to the players

It is not. That section runs like the other guy is listing off noble titles and I have never heard a player ask about one of those unless they were into killing X and X slayer was one of their accomplishments. There are 10 possible questions there, all of them more plot relevant, and the clock ticks pretty fast and then the redacted happens.

Its not remotely fair to blame or read into the DM's not bringing that to the forefront.

Completely agreed. When I played this at Gen Con, I didn't notice that the NPC was trans. Even when I read it in preparation to GM it, I glossed over it as one of those back story details that the players will never have any way of finding out in game, which are so common in PFS scenarios. But I may not have been concentrating as much as I should while prepping that one - I was dealing with the illness and eventual death of a pet at the time, so I was very distracted.

And responding to a comment from the other thread that spawned this one:

Amanda Plageman wrote:
Kalindlara wrote:
I can't speak for MadSci, but I know that I felt extremely uncomfortable at my store when they hosted The City of Strangers scenarios, both because of the scenario's content and the players' reactions.

I'm sorry that happened to you.

It's amazing how differently those scenarios are portrayed. When I was first exposed to Miss Feathers, I didn't interpret her as trans at all! Nor was there anything offensive or silly in how she was portrayed. I just assumed she was a female impersonator/performance artist- no different than Lady Chablis or RuPaul. I thought it was pretty great that Paizo had put in a character that was willing to do their thing without fear or censure. I viewed Miss Feathers as one of the earliest attempts by Paizo to be inclusive. I still do, in fact, regardless of people's online reactions.

Agreed with this, as well. When I first played City of Strangers and met Miss Feathers, our GM really played her as a stereotypical drag queen. We all (apparently, including the GM) thought she was supposed to be a RuPaul/"Priscilla, Queen of the Desert" type performer. We had no idea she was supposed to be transgender.

As a straight, white* cisgender male, I'm finding this whole conversation (and the start of it over in the other thread) to be educational and useful. Thank you to the LGBTQ folks who are speaking up to help the rest of us learn.

*Yes, I'm white. I chose this avatar because I'm a fan of the character, not because I have his skin tone. Funny story: I was actually surprised when I finally met Hmm in person at Gen Con last year, and she mentioned that she always thought I was black.

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I suspect the giraffes were summoned by Hilgya. Being chaotic would explain the odd colors. The critters riding them probably came from Roy's bag of tricks.

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GM PDK wrote:

@Fromper: You're kidding right? 'the only thing it did is ruin lore warden?' That has to be a bait statement? lol

This book has the complete rules on Hellknights, Red Mantis Assassins, Eagle Knights and so many others... so much stuff that I could play another 5 years of 1E and not go through all the options. My wish is to somehow see the 1E PFS RPG Guild evolve to include adventures for evil PCs so that I can try some of the less goody-goody options like the Gray Maidens, but even if PFS doesn't go there I could find stuff to keep me busy a long, long time.

I didn't say that's the only thing the book did. I said it's the only thing I've heard about it. As I said, I already felt overwhelmed by the rules bloat of too many books in this game, so I really haven't been paying much attention to the new releases, pretty much since Occult Adventures.

Weren't there already rules for Hellknights and Red Mantis? I have a friend who played the Hellknight prestige class in PFS back in 2012. I think that's the other thing I had previously heard about that book - lots of reprinted material. Again, nothing I heard made me the least bit interested in checking out the book.

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So as a typical white, nerdy gamer guy, maybe I'm not qualified to respond here. But as the stars next to my name indicate, I've GMed over 100 games of PFS, and played a lot more than that. So I'm probably closing in on 300 total PFS tables over 7 years, in 4 different states (including non-Gen Con related games in Indiana). And I've NEVER seen anything as bad as what was described in that blog post.

Don't get me wrong: I've seen bad behavior at a few tables. Not many, but it does happen. But as far as I've noticed, none of that has ever been based on gender. It's more likely to be experienced gamers being condescending to newbies, regardless of gender. But even that's pretty rare.

Actually, the one example I can think of where gender played a role is sort of a good/bad behavior thing. A woman showed up and asked for help learning to play, make a character, etc. Because of her good looks, she had a few too many guys lining up to help her out. But from what I could see (and I wasn't there the whole time watching, so I may have missed something), they were all polite about it. She seems like the type who's used to that type of attention from men, so I don't think she was offended. She ended up sticking around and becoming a regular, so I'd call that one a net positive. Some other women might not have been as comfortable with it, and that could have been off putting for them.

Unfortunately, despite never having seen anything that bad myself, I'm not really surprised by that blog post, and I don't doubt that it's true. As a hobby, gaming used to be male dominated and some of the old grognards are resistant to change, unfortunately. But for the most part, PFS (and now SFS) have done a good job of being very inclusive and not putting up with that type of bigotry.

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Honestly, I was already complaining that Pathfinder had reached the point of rules bloat, before they announced 2e. I haven't had a chance to try all the classes from the Advanced Class Guide and Occult Adventures yet, and I probably won't ever bother buying Ultimate Intrigue or Ultimate Wilderness.

And believe it or not, I actually turned down a free copy of the Adventurer's Guide just yesterday. The only thing I've heard about that book is that it ruined the Lore Warden, which isn't exactly a selling point.

On the other hand, I hate having to learn new versions after I'm comfortable with a current version. And there really are things that I still want to try out from the ACG, Occult, and other older books. So that'll be my focus for the next year and a half, at least. Which probably means I'll skip the playtest.

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Hey, look! There's another star next to my name!

Which I earned months ago, but two different conventions where I GMed last summer were never reported *cough*GenCon*cough*

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Just GMed it at low tier. Luckily, they spotted the assassin vine, and killed it quickly. I only got one attack with it and rolled low, so I missed.

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Is it just me or is the assassin vine in low tier just plain mean to throw at a level 1-2 party?

Maybe I'm misunderstanding how constrict works, but I just checked the Bestiary, and it says that it does that damage on a grapple, on top of anything else (including damage while maintaining the grapple). So does the constrict damage kick in as soon as the person gets grappled? That would be 2d8+14 damage in just the first round of combat if it does, against level 1-2 PCs.

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Note for Paizo: The Concordance faction doesn't appear as one of the faction choices on the sign in sheet for this adventure. You'll want to get that fixed ASAP for all future scenarios.

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Played this on Sunday and had fun. Just here dotting the thread, since I'll be reading the adventure to GM in a week.

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Awww... Belkar cares about Durkon!

That's twice now Belkar has shown clearly non-evil sentiment. Definitely time for a GM alignment warning.

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This isn't the end. It's merely a transition from one era to the next. Those who understand and accept this pray to Alseta for a smooth transition.

I keep wanting to do an Alseta worshiping PC, since the deity seems interesting, but I haven't had a particularly good idea for what to do mechanically to go with her fluff.

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Yeah, I'm kinda wondering if my 4th star is ever going to show up, given that I've already GMed enough to earn it. Gen Con isn't even the only convention from last summer that has GM sessions that have never shown up for me. And since life is busy right now and I'm not GMing much any more, it'll probably be a month or two before I can run some more and get new credit to get me up to it.

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I once played with a "rock band" of bards at a convention. They were 4 bards, all built completely differently to complement each other in combat, who all had names that were puns of real world rock musicians. There was a girl named "The Bard Formerly Known as Princess", "Mean Simmons" was the melee guy, and a gnome (halfling? don't remember now, but it was a small race) named "Big Richard". I don't remember the 4th now.

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GeoffA wrote:

I run a monthly game for some of the youth in my church (and one super helpful dad, who helps me herd the cats). Since they are relatively young, and new to role-playing, they are usually good for a couple of good quotes, or humorous strategy that’s outside of what I expected. These are from The Frozen Fingers of Midnight, but the context is not super important:

“So, our goal is to kidnap this guy, and steal his stuff, but not look like criminals?”

While discussing a plan to sneak into a warehouse, one player turns to the player with the Harsk pregen. “Not you! You’re too short and fat for sneaking!”

Teenage boy, “Well, you’re a hottie.”
That player’s sister, “Please ignore him. He doesn’t speak for all of us.”

I don't know what it is about that adventure, but Frozen Fingers does seem to bring out the funniest lines from kids.

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Slyme wrote:

I very rarely see small sized martial characters. Don't see many small sized characters at all really, people around here seem to have something against Halflings, Gnomes, etc.

Very few of any of the occult classes other than the kineticist,

I've never seen anyone play a Wayang.

I think I am the only person locally who has tried to play an illusion focused character...who I retired after only a few adventures because so few GMs properly understand how illusion magic works.

I've only ever seen an alchemist played via the pre-gen.

I've got both of those first two in the same PC: a grippli medium with the fiend keeper archetype, who always channels the champion spirit to be a front liner with a sword.

I actually have a lot of small PCs: 3 gnomes, 3 halflings, 2 gripplies, and a ratfolk. No wayang, though (yet). One of my gnomes is actually an illusionist, though I don't focus exclusively on illusions, due to not being sure how GMs will react. So he's a useful wizard in other regards, too.

I'm surprised by the alchemist comment. They're not as popular as they used to be a few years ago, but they're still relatively common. Wayang used to be a lot more popular when they were a boon race, and people made them just because they were special. I haven't seen any new ones recently.

My weapon list:

1. Nodachi
2. Fireball/Holy Smite (cleric of Sarenrae with Fire domain)
3. Composite Longbow
4. The other PCs (luck domain buff focused cleric)
5. Glitterdust and the other PCs (controller sorcerer with Haste known)
6. Magic (blasting sorcerer)
7. Scimitar
8. Longsword
9. Composite Longbow
10. Glaive
11. Words (Debuff bard specializing in insulting the enemies)
12. Magic (debuff "bad touch" cleric)
13. Both ends of a Shillelagh Quarterstaff
14. Mostly lightning, but occasionally rocks (casting focused druid, usually controller, but uses Call Lightning or Stone Call for some damage)
15. Greatsword
16. Katana
17. Composite Longbow for now, magic at higher levels (core elven wizard impersonating an archer using his racial proficiency at low levels, will probably put away the bow for good around level 5 when he has enough spells per day not to need it)
18. Dwarven longhammer, dwarven boulder helmet (dwarven blacksmith/foehammer fighter who refuses to make (or use) any weapon that doesn't have the word "dwarven" or "hammer" in its name - throws light hammers as his only ranged weapons)
19. Repeating heavy crossbow
20. Daggers. Lots and lots of daggers.
21. Javelin thrower
22. Heavy flail, animal companion has bite, talon, talon
23. Magic (buff/heal witch with some debuffing, but not as much as most witches)
24. Illusions and other magic (gnome illusionist)
25. DOA
26. Enchantments and summoned critters (clone of #25 who died in her first adventure)
27. Elven curve blade (despite not being an elf)
28. Bombs
29. Composite Longbow, Poison
30. Whip

So my 12 melee PCs have 13 different primary melee weapons, with no repeats. I'd call that pretty good variety. And my magic based PCs have very little redundancy, as well, though there's a little bit here and there in the spell selection of obvious "best" spells (Bless, Glitterdust, etc).

The only real repetition is 4 composite longbows among my 6 primarily ranged martials, though two of those are PCs I got bored with early and almost never play, and one is a wizard who will stop using the bow once he has enough spells per day to just do magic full time. And because the wizard is core, I never have the chance to play him, anyway. So my three ranged martials that I actually like enough to want to play regularly actually do have three different primary weapons.

And looking at the latest compiled list, I'm the only one with javelins or poison on my list. So I'm proud to contribute two more entries to the list.

Silver Crusade

Yeah, being able to use Wish to heal all his HP damage will probably be his best use for those two spells. I'll probably have him do that if he gets down to less than half his HP. And with the Greater Quicken Metamagic rod, he can probably still throw something offensive at the party in the same round. Because they're arriving staggered, he's less likely to use the rod's three daily charges on AOE attacks in the first round or two.

Another stupid question that I can't seem to find in the book: How high's the ceiling in the Eye of Avarice? I'm figuring Karzoug will put up a Wall of Force in the first round or two to keep arrows and direct spells from hitting him in the throne area. He'll poke out from behind it to cast offensively, but then retreat behind it after casting. So every other round, he should be hidden behind it. I just have to figure out exactly where the borders will be, and I figure he's like to just fly up and cast over the top of it, which makes ceiling height relevant. Also, half my party will be trying to fly over the wall to get to him.

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