Quote:Lying may be the best approach for characters who are good liars, but when was the last time you saw a paladin with a decent bluff check? Even if the paladin was allowed to lie in this situation, he'd probably be lousy at it, and the beast wouldn't believe him anyway. All of these other methods of dealing with the situation are just as likely to save the kid's life.
There are, perhaps, other option. But because the character doesn't see them doesn't mean he broke his code and must fall. Your vision of these things is nefarious and if you got a similar vision in the real world I hope not to many people are like you. You don't make people fall because they are stupid, or lack imagination, or don't react well under stress. You make them fall if they are selfish, unforgiving, if they don't care for the well being of other. You make them fall if they'd rather follow the letter then the spirit, you make them fall if they find joy in destruction, if they purposefully go against the will of their god, you make them fall if they have no INTENT of doing good. You do not need a flipping atonement if you had every intent to do good and defend those that deserve it but had to do a little misinformation against something clearly evil.
There should be no discussion, I would encourage those that disagree with that to go read the ample literature the world as written about morality. I would encourage you to refrain from posting anymore on the subject, if this does not convince you I doubt that I can help you anymore.
Well, that was a serious over-reaction. Who said anything about a paladin falling?
In the hypothetical false dilemma we're talking about, the paladin has half a dozen other options (mentioned in quite a few previous posts, including the one your responded to) that are at least as good as lying. I've played with paladins at the table plenty of times, both as a GM, as another player, and even playing the paladin myself. None of those paladins has ever been even remotely tempted to lie about anything. There's always another way.
But in the hypothetical we're talking about, if the paladin did lie, and I was the GM, I might give them some hint that their deity disapproved, and have the PC pray for forgiveness or something. But a minor lie for the greater good isn't going to cause a fall, or even require an atonement spell. An atonement would require a much bigger transgression against their code. Falling and losing their powers would require a blatantly evil act, or at least 3 or 4 transgressions big enough to require atonements.
But again, in all the times I've played with paladins, not only have I never seen one lie, I've also never seen one punished (or even warned) by their deity for not living up to their code.
People keep saying that playing a paladin is difficult, and I disagree. It's pretty easy. I actually have a harder time playing chaotic characters, because I'm such a team player, and I know that truly chaotic behavior would screw up the rest of the group. I'd probably have a hard time playing an evil character for the same reason, but I've never tried that, so I wouldn't know.
But as long as I keep my character's personality in mind, and play them how they would logically behave, playing a paladin isn't even remotely more difficult than playing any other character with a well defined personality. Their paladin code is just a part of that personality, not any sort of limiting factor or difficult hurdle to overcome.