Fletch's page

Has anybody run the RPGA sequal to Mad God's Key? I haven't played an RPGA game in a while and didn't get a chance to play that yet. I'm interested in hearing how the sequal plays out premise-wise.

I've heard the Ebon Triad has a beefed up roll in Shackled City to go along with it's roll in Age of Worms. How does this pan out?

I ask because I intend to play the two APs in reverse order so as to introduce the city of Cauldron to my players well before setting a campaign there. Once the Ebon Triad is defeated in AoW, will the encounters in Flood Season still be feasible? Can I get away with just saying Triel leads a band of clever bandits as originally written or is there now more to it than that?

I just ran this encounter Friday. I created a "Hextor Clock" that showed who did what from Round 1. I think I determined that Room 11 would be assembled in about 7 or 8 rounds, which is little more than a minute.

I might be a little interested in seeing that Hextor Clock of yours...

Regarding dice honesty even though I have run for 20 years I never really bought into the "let the dice be as they fall".

But you can't let the players know you fudge the rolls, or else there's no thrill of victory or fear of defeat.

I intend to follow the Calendar of Harptos to a T, so every day that passes will count for some reason or another...

What's a Calendar of Harptos?

I just discovered the Age of Worms adventure path today and was considering running it. I'd appreciate some advice, however, on how to get my party involved believably.

If AoW can be adapted for any campaign world, I don't see why it couldn't be adapted for a different location on the same world. Diamond Lake could be a mining town in the foothills of the Yeomanry and all the adventures could take place around there. I don't have the Greyhawk knowhow to pull of a total conversion, but I don't think it'd take too much effort. The Wind Dukes could be ancestors to the Suel that came from across the mountains and the Plains of Pesh could be buried under the desert sands. Blackwall Keep and the lizardmen could be to the south, the arena could be in Niole Dra, capital of neighboring Keoland, etc. etc. By the time locations become important (the Great Rift and all), the party should have enough motivation to make the trip there.

I'd rather DM a game of Dungeons and Dragons rather than an episode of Law & Order.

Brilliant! Like Takasi, I'm not looking at too technical a solution to this. I'm just going to find what makes the better story and dream up the proper mix of justice, black mail, and paranoia that causes that to be.

I'd prefer to see one of the implacated managers getting arrested with the other one fleeing arrest out of the city to haunt the party later. I think it'll depend on which one the party hates more. If they come out despising Smenk, he'll be arrested and sentenced to hard labor, with Dourstone fleeing the town (just like he did in Greysmere) never to be seen again. Imagine the party's surprise when they return to Diamond Lake to find Smenk cleared of all charges, back in power, and despising the PCs...

What? Dragotha was mentioned first in White Plume Mountain? Zagyg founded Diamond Lake?

How much of the backstory to Age of Worms am I missing by not being a Greyhawk Guru? Can any of you more learned folk fill me in on some of the Easter Eggs lurking in the Adventure Path?

I fear my Greyhawk knowledge is a little rusty. At what points should Tenser or Bucknard's names be used? Are there NPCs that are obviously them renamed?

All reasonable solutions, but I'm uncomfortable including anything the PCs can never discover.

It's like playing WEG's 'Paranoia'. The game is riotously funny, but only to the gamemaster who's able to read the jokes. If only the DM is privvy to the way Land got into the cairn, then it's the same to the players as having no solution at all.

I can't find the original post, but someone earlier had pointed out the impossibility of Land reaching room 23 if the red lantern had been stolen and lost to room 19 30 years before he got there. Erik hinted that he'd had a clever solution to the problem, but couldn't think of it at the time of his posting.

So, did you think of it yet?

At the time, the solution was to change the timeline to have Land explore the cairn before the Seekers did. Barring Erik's clever solution, I'd like to offer an alternate idea.

I found it a little distressing that a 13-year-old would get that far into a deadly cairn (not to mention a little insulting to the PCs once they learn of it), so I'm thinking I could have Land killed by the Face trap in area 8. In fact, those are Alastor's bones at the bottom of the ledge in room 7. Because he died trying to get through the face trap, he chose not to pass into the afterlife, instead taking his spirit into room 23 to see what he'd died for. Having given up an afterlife, only a proper burial with his family will give him another chance.

Any thoughts?

Not really. The online supplements are intended to allow DM's to show bits of information to the players without giving away other info about the adventure. This way you don't have to awkwardly cover the rest of the magazine while showing a player an image, or worse, cut the image out of the magazine to leave it on the table.

Since the Diamond Lake map is already intended to be removed from the magazine and displayed on the table, there is no reason to include it in the download.

Point taken, but I thought it was really handy having an electronic version of the Cauldron map to mark up and email. I'd like to be able to do the same with the Diamond Lake map, but it's far too big for me to scan.

The online suppliments are way cool, but I really felt the absence of an online copy of the Diamond Lake map.

Are there any plans to generate something like that for download?

Maybe there's another way of seeing this. Perhaps Obi, seeing Anakin below him about to jump and attack, had a horrible flashback to his fight with Maul. Realizing that there's no defense against a leaping attack from 12 feet down, Obi calls out in fear for his life "Don't do it!"

We all know fear leads to the dark side, so Obi-Wan must've drawn on the dark side for the extra power he needed to defeat Anakin during the unstoppable leap.

How's that work for you?

This is actually really simple to justify. Basically, in RotS, Anakin failed his tumble check and Obi-Wan got an attack of opportunity. In Menace, however, Maul wasted his AoO on the lip of the pit...

A prequel is an interesting idea, but is there any reason the Paths can't be run in reverse order without the flashback? This is how I'd like to do it and I'm interested in hearing from the AP2 staff if there's anything in the upcoming storyline that would prevent that.

As cool as Shackled City was, starting a campaign in a dormant volcano city seems a bit of a jump. The Diamond Lake region is nestled nicely in the heart of the 'normalcy' which would make a stronger foundation to a campaign. I figured, with the promise of an AP2 adventure taking place in the Cauldron area, that would be the perfect time to introduce the concept of the region so it doesn't seem so jarring when I start another campaign there.

I know there are some loose threads from AP1, but the reason they're loose threads is because they actually don't matter to the story. If, during Age of Worms, the party learns the truth about Celeste such that the next group of heroes wouldn't trust her in Cauldron, I can just change her in AP1. Same with the Ebon Triad if they're all wiped out in AP2. Plus I now have a full year to sell enough plasma to afford the AP1 hardback before I run it.

My only concern is from a storytelling standpoint of, if Age of Worms concludes with the PCs preventing the end times, how anti-climactic will it be for the follow-up to "only" be the prevention of demon invasion? It seems the stakes would decrease if played in reverse order like that.

Anyhoo, my big question is what's to stop me from doing that? Without the need for details, are there any aspects of AP2 that will be lost if we don't do AP1 first, and will running AP2 first ruin any part of AP1?

Wait, you don't have to be an elf to join the Striders? I figured that was a given.

One of the fun little challenges is putting together a series of adventures from the magazine to make your own Adventure Path

I should say the real challenge is connecting them together. I see most of the adventures you've chosen take place on the coast, but what plot seed have you planted that will take your PCs to the Black Ice? Have you developed a story-line that leads from one adventure to the other?

It looks like all your issues are current, but I would like to point you in the direction of issue 109 featuring the campaign setting of Hardby. It's a well described location that loans itself well to many of the adventures you've listed (even Mad God's Key can be easily moved to Hardby).

Oh my goodness, I killed the thread with my greedy, penny-pinching ways.

Feel free to ignore me and get on with the discussion.

I can say with certainty that we aren't going to release a smaller version of the revised Shackled City Adventure Path that lists just the changes and additions that are going into the hardcover version of the book.

That makes sense to me. I didn't really think it was doable, I was just trying to think of a way I could support this project. Maybe I can think of some good fixes to the mods that somebody hasn't already suggested, but that's not really my strong suit either.

Ah well, keep up the good work and good luck.

Since I already have all the Shackled City issues of Dungeon (some of which I ordered back-issue), I wasn't originally going to get the hardcover version. However, hearing some of the changes James is planning on making to the series, and in general just because he's been so cool listening to the readers, I'm near changing my mind. Then I happened to take a gander at the preorder for the book on the Paizo store.

60-Bucks!! Dang! There's no way I can justify $60 bucks for an adventure I already own all the chapters to, no matter how much better it's going to be to the original. I still haven't bought the 3.5 ed rulebooks for the same reason.

For what it's worth, James, I really respect and appreciate the work you guys are doing for this collected release, but there's no way I can buy into that. Any chance of releasing a smaller version listing just the changes and additions for those of us that already own the series and are only interested in the changes and not the whole shebang. It wouldn't have to have any maps in it at all (although the headshot illustrations you mentioned would still be welcome). I could be conned into dropping $15 or so for a .pdf of all the updates...

One of the most useful sections of the entire Shackled City series was the 'who sent the assassins' section in Soul Pillars. The way the author listed all the options open to the party to investigate and what they'd find out thru that source was exactly the kind of stuff I look for in a published adventure (and doubt I could've come up with all that on my own). It really put the party on a proactive ("air quotes") footing.

I'd like to see that same kind of scenario used in the other investigation areas, rather than just having Jenya show up saying "Hey, Lord Vhalantru's really a beholder...".

A couple areas that *really* need an investigation section are how the PCs find Karan Kural in Soul Pillars and how in the world does anybody figure out Vhalantru is actually a villain in LoO. I'd also like to see the PCs come up with a location for the Tree of Shackled Souls rather than just being pointed there by Jenya.

As for Karan Kural, I've moved the Spellweaver lab to the Demonskar both to limit the number of forgotten civilizations under Cauldron and to reconnect it with the destroyed Spellweaver city. Left to my own devices, I might have letters found in the Wee Jas cathedral make a vague reference to the hags or fire giant craftsmen or something that will send a now-more powerful party back to the survivors of the Demonskar Legacy to intimidate them into revealing where Karan Kural is. In any case, I'd hope the party's past experience with Spellweaver ruins would be the key to helping them decipher the ruins to point to the new place. In a pinch, I'm thinking of letting the party continue to use the guiding lantern they got from Smoking Eye letting them re-cast locate the path or whatever on the thing to help them find the way.

I'm really stuck with the Vhalantru reveal in Oblivion, though. I'd especially like to see the party go to Oblivion not knowing Vhalantru was a beholder and somehow witnessing his transformation from elf to aberation. Hopefully we'll get that same oh-#)%*& value we got from his first appearance in Life's Bazaar. There've got to be some clues at Thrifirane's house that point to him, but I couldn't guess what that might be.

I'm a little vague as far as the spells work in Thirteen Cages that limit the PC's abilities to locate the lair thru magic. My back-up plan for leading the party to the tree is to have them realize that, if Vhalantru is the beholder, and the beholder took Terem in episode I, then maybe they could track Terem magically. Big shrug on this one, but it really lets the party use past experiences to solve current problems.

Any other thoughts for solving these mysteries? Any other areas you all think need more player involvement?

I would say the primary purpose of taxing the PCs in Shackled City is not so much to take their money, but to let them know that something's up with the taxes.

By that same token, the taxes would have to be levied often enough for them to notice a change. Since the pace of the Adeventure Path doesn't allow for "hey! Last year the Dwarf tax was only 6gp!!", I would think seasonal would be the best interval.

They may even just assume the taxes are increasing for metagame reasons to keep up with their new higher-valued treasure scores, but at least they won't be taken totally by surprise when there's a tax riot.

I've voted on this before in an earlier thread, but if this is where the votes are being tallied, let me add my name to the list.

I'd really like to see a map-making master class too. I'm in love with Christopher West's work (and am a little envious that his name is 'West' so he gets to so cleverly sign all his maps), so you should start with him.

Along the same idea, how about a place where we can download digital objects to use in our maps. For example, .jpgs of buildings or stone floors.

Here's an idea on inserting details:

Sarcem is in Sasserine at this point in the AP. You should definitely have the PC's meet up with him when they're there to have Kedoyn raised. If they're travelling with Ruphus, chances are pretty good they'll go to the temple of St. Cuthbert. You should probably work in a reason why Sarcem isn't raised after flood season, though.

That's actually a pretty cool idea. In that one trip they should get to see both Sarcem and the Lucky Monkey before they're destroyed. Maybe you could make a big deal about the Church using the last of its raise dead power (diamond, scroll, whatever) to raise the party member so that's why they can't raise Sarcem now. If they're at all thinking beings, they should feel a little guilty about that...

Another idea would be to identify the plot-critical elements and just export those into the character-building adventures you want to develop.

SPOILER SPACE

For example, I think it's a nice opening clue when the characters discover the first, half-formed Soul Cage in the Fire Giant's forge in the Demonskar. However, say you decided your story didn't need the Smoking Eye sideplot and have decided to replace those two adventures. I'd still try to find a place to have a fire giant constructing the Soul Cage, just so the players get the foreshadowing.

That being said, I think you could run the complete "Cagewrights trying to create a gate to Carceri" plot without the Adamarchus hook. You could skip Demonskar, Smoking Eye, and Abyss. Although I wouldn't, because those are some of my favorites.

Flood Season has the absolute least to do with Shackled City, only sharing a location (Cauldron) and a tenuous reference to a Soul Cage that the players will never actually see or hear about. I also personally plan on dropping Shatterhorn and just have the party confront Embril in Thirteen Cages.

One could also argue that Foundation of Flame can be reduced to a "there are some earthquakes and you need to stop them" hook at the start of Thirteen Cages. However, Foundation is a fun and unique adventure and worth running on its own merits.

The least expendable, I think, are Soul Pillars, Lords of Oblivion, and Thirteen Cages.

The way I read the adventure path, the gnomes are very much the original culture in the cauldron area.

What lead you to this? From what I've seen, the gnomes, don't have much more of a presence in Cauldron than anybody else. They have a significant place in the city's history because they were the architects who designed it, but the size of Jzadirune suggests there were never very many of them. I do like your suggestion that Surabar could've been a gnome, but I'd have a hard time incorporating the quarterstaff Alakast into that history since the small gnome could never use the large weapon.

a small group of Wee Jas's clergy was able to stave off the disease and keep it from completely decimating the population.

This works for me. I'd heard some talk a while back about how the Church of Wee Jas holds power in Cauldron because they inter the dead (sites for cemeteries being in very short supply on the mountain top). I was going to work that in, but I like your idea of a noble history to the church. A nice twist from the tradition goddess of death image.

I'm also intrigued by the environment-varied demi-humans. I've been in the market for an Unearthed Arcana, I guess this is just one more reason to keep looking.

I've been waffling a bit on whether or not I was going to place Cauldron in the Amedio or some place more temperate. I prefer my fantasy Eurocentric and wasn't sold on all the jungles and baboons. Until recently, that is.

I've been reading a book on the history of spice (which is actually more interesting than it might sound) and as I read about the Portuguese 'traders' conquering the East Indies, it really connected with me about the whole 'Europeans in the Jungle' thing.

For mine own campaign, I think I'll have Sasserine be a colony of Keoland set up in the region for its spice trade. It's sort of a completely made-up version of colonial India where the Oeridian colonists lord it over the Olman natives.

That covers the human cultures, but I'm a little stuck on the others. I know there are dwarves in the area (from the Malachite Fortress), and there should be some local orcs (or even a half-orc tribe if they breed true) for Vhalantru to hire as town guards, but what of the rest? I see the gnomes as being intermediaries between the deep-living dwarves and the humans. Perhaps the gnomes lived on the surface of Mt. Cauldron and invited Surabar and his followers to take shelter there during the war with Nabthatoron. It's also not too hard to imagine a jungle version of the traditional forest elves. It might be fun to make them black, too.

Which leaves the halflings. Do they just follow the Keolanders there? I don't see them as being natives or really as adventuresome colonists, but I can picture them settling in the area once the Keolanders have 'tamed' it.

Any thoughts? Anybody have any details they'd like to add to any of these generalizations? Any thoughts as to why Wee Jas, a Suel God, is so popular here?

At the end of the day, what's an extra +1 to hit or damage to a 15th level PC? You could ditch ALL the magic tridents and I doubt there'd be a noticeable change in the challenge. Even if the character's surrounded by 8 orcs with +1 weapons, and every one of them hits, that's only an extra 8 points of damage.

It's mostly to avoid the mass-produced feel of magic items that I'll cut out a lot of the magic I find in published adventures. My rule of thumb is to ditch anything noticeably less powerful than what the party has. If Their fighter's running around with a +3 sword, a +1 trident is just going to wind up on the storeroom shelf. If they really need a +1 trident, their 15th level wizard can make one.

And for what it's worth, I like the use of orcs in this adventure. Just as I don't like a plethora of magic items around my campaign (and tell me, Hefe, what is a plethora?), I also don't like a flood of different races populating the local area. Any time one of the main evil races can be used to good effect like this, I'm for it.

That's some solid work, Slaad. It does make me want to question the frequently voiced complaint about the Ebon Triad's lack of connections to the rest of the series.

What's wrong with the ET being its own thing? Not every thing the party encounters has to tie into the grand conspiracy, especially if you're running any sidetreks. For mine own part, I'll even go the other direction and remove any mention of the cagewrights from Flood Season. There's no direct evidence of any soulcages, so why try to force it in there.

Since I've heard this complaint from a few people here, I'm wondering if maybe I'm just missing something.

Yeah, you guys bring up some really good points. I guess changing anything would alienate the people who are interested in seeing it come back in the first place. I'll just consider myself in the minority and move on.

My lunatic ravings aside, though, it's worth mentioning to the original post that almost any Dungeon adventure can be put in the Known World with little difficulty.

I'm not trying to stir up trouble, but, being a map-nut, are there any plans for the Mystara map or any others? By the way, the Greyhawk map is fantastic. Thanks for your hard work.

I, too, am a big fan of the Known World, but I think Mystara needs some serious re-imagining if it's going to work today. With the Gazetteers, the Wrath of the Immortals, and the Hollow World, the Known World was one of the best detailed gaming environments I've ever seen. On a small scale, it was unparalleled.

When you zoomed out, though, the jigsaw nature of the world became obvious. A Viking culture slapped between Mongol and Arabian cultures? A Caribbean pleasure Island just of the coast of the Slavic mainland? Meanwhile two empires fight over a continent larger than both of them and the entire Known World all put together? And where did the American Indians come from?

Before any maps are made, I think some reorganizing is due. Keep the countries the same; they're genius and so well developed it'd be a crime to change any of it. However, let's see if we can't shift some of them around on the map so they make a little more sense amongst their neighbors.

I think it's keen that the Known World map looks an awful lot like Earth, suggesting a distant, mythical history of our own planet, but I think we can make a reasonable layout within that design.

Who's with me?

Big big fan of Chris West's maps, both Maps of Mystery and those designed for the adventures themselves. I've read somewhere that he uses Photoshop to make them and I'd love to learn how he does it. Could we con him into hosting a monthly article (in mag or on-line, doesn't matter which) where he'll give instruction and tutorials on how he does some of the things he does? Depending on how complicated they are, maybe each article could specialize in something like "Making Lakes" or "Constructing Space-ships".

In addition (or in lieu if you can't do it), could you include some icon templates in your download section of some of his map tools like buildings and forests.

Would it help if I said "please"?

That last bit's a good question. However, since I suspect by the end of Shackled City the players will know as much about the story as the DM, that won't be an issue. Hopefully, the only unresolved issues from AP1 will be the unresolved issues. By which I mean if the players don't know it, it's because the DM didn't know it.

I do know that the Age of Worms will be in the same world as Cauldron but not in the city itself. There were some numbers thrown out a while back, but I think somebody calculated it'd be somewhere around the County of Urnst/Rift Canyon area. They also said there'd be a lot more travel, so I'm hoping there will be at least one occasion to visit Cauldron and see 'what's up' since the end of AP1.

Some good points, all. I'm probably going to overload the server with the length of this post, but I wanted to address some of the points you all made above.

Cagewrights were plotting to free Adimarchus and they figured that having someone they could manipulate with the Sign of the Smoking Eye would make it easier to free him. Thus, they set up Tercival to get it but when one of the PCs gets the Sign it throws a kink in their plans.

Good call. This is really a great way to tie the two plot elements together. I may follow the same premise, but that would depend on one of the PCs getting the smoking eye. If they don’t, I’ll be prepared to end it with the destruction of the Tree of Shackled Souls. If they do, then they can easily be drawn to Carceri for the showdown.

Life's Bazaar - My biggest complaint is that the only entrance to a very large underground enclave is under the stairs in a locksmith's shop, and the entrance doesn't even appear to have been sealed. It's not a big deal to fix, but this was annoying to me. There is also the matter of the kidnap victims that were never found. I'll likely have a party with all good-aligned characters, including two paladins. I really can't see my group just letting them go with a shrug and an "oh well, we tried." I'll probably have some working as slaves at Bhal-Hamatugn. Others will be found in a side trek (unpublished) I have in mind along with info that the remainder are dead.

I actually find it kind of fitting that the only entrance to the Gnome enclave was guarded by a locksmith. It suggests that the position of locksmith is almost a tradition rather than just an occupation. By the same token, one entrance is okay with me. There’s probably some history as to how they got the Splintershield Dwarves to guard them from the Underdark.

I will agree with you on the still-missing townsfolk. I hadn’t thought of this, so thanks for bringing it up. I can’t imagine any group of players with a list of names NOT seeing that as a checklist. I’ll have to have Coryston Pike or someone explain that they’re beyond rescue and play up the fact that no more people will go missing.

Zenith Trajectory - No major complaints, but it would be nice to have some explanation of who built the pit entrance to the underdark and put the hydra there.

I’m sure there’s an explanation, just ask Crazy Jared, he’ll tell you several. (heh) Maybe it wouldn’t be so obvious if it weren’t so out in the open. If the party had to actually search to find it, it wouldn’t be such an anomaly.

That does bring up another issue with ‘Zenith Trajectory’, though. Hookface and his/her kin is used poorly in every instance. Its arrival in ‘Foundation’ looks like nothing more than an ‘oh Jeez, we forgot Hookface’ effort to include her in the storyline. Gottrod appearing in ‘Zenith’ is out of nowhere and would seem to overshadow Dhorlot who actually has a pseudo-purpose in the campaign. I think I’ll be changing the red dragon in ‘Zenith’ into another creature (like a wyvern or something) that Jared can cover with illusion to make seem like Hookface herself (with a properly grand announcement, of course). What’s more, the Morkoth should be the grand finale of ‘Foundation’, not Hookface. I think I'll be using Hookface herself somewhere else.

the massive railroad that is the final battle and resulting death of Alek, no matter PC actions. Going off to find an NPC who happens to turn out to be a mad prophet turns me off this one too because the PCs just did that in Zenith Trajectory. Also, Alek's final prophecy states that the PCs must not return to Cauldron but instead seek the sign of the smoking eye, but there is nothing that happens in the next adventure that is critical to saving Cauldron.

I think if the party beats the odds and somehow keeps Alek alive, then they should be allowed to succeed. As I think about it, I can’t think of any reason NOT to let him live. On the off chance the party saves him, I’d be able to play down his contributions to ‘Smoking Eye’ by saying he’s too deep in the grips of the elixir. He’s weak of will and a broken man and not much help to the party who has to lug his admittedly super-strong body through Occipitus. Who knows, maybe they’d chuck him into the fire geyser and get the smoking eye…

Key to Alek, I think, is what others have suggested on these boards before: the party has to meet him before his fall so there’s some foreshadowing and attachment. Meet him once near the start of the campaign where he’s just out being paladin-y. If they meet him later, they can witness one of his feats of enhanced strength. Particularly astute players might even notice his weakened willpower. I don’t mind him dying, but I’m going to do my best to make his death noteworthy. Likewise with Terrem and Zenith whose desiccated corpses I’m going to place very prominently in the soul cages.

Along similar lines, there’ve been a few discussions on the list about how to deal with the invasion of Red Gorge since that plot point is dropped. The best suggestions I’ve heard include having the Storm Blades save the day (ooooh, wouldn’t that burn the players) or even letting Red Gorge fall. Show the party the results of their side-quest. When Red Gorge becomes a territory of Cauldron (and eventually Vhalantru), that can be where you station the half-orc mercenaries when they’re moved out of Cauldron after the fire in ‘Demonskar’.

Reading the adventure, it seems kind of like the PCs aren't supposed to figure out V is a beholder until they actually encounter him below his manor. That doesn't really work for me.

Actually, I think I’d prefer it that way. In fact, I’m going to go the extra step and somehow show the party Vhalantru changing from elf form to beholder. I don’t know how yet, but I want to see their faces when they confront this effete elf and his head sprouts eyestalks and his body whithers away to reveal his true form. Ideally, they’d have confronted him in beholder form a couple times before then so they’ll recognize him then too. Since the oblivion doors seem nearly impenetrable, I may do away with them and not spoil the surprise with all the beholder symbology.

Speaking of which, did anybody catch the small print on the Shator creature template? Apparently when a shator-empowered creature dies, his soul is forever trapped on Carceri. I think that’s a far better location for a rematch with Vhalantru (during ‘Abyss’) than some conjured smoking eye tyrant.

We are told that they are artifact-level power, but there don't seem to be enough spellcasters capable of casting high level spells to craft them. For example, the Ebon Triad is supposed to have made one, but the highest level cleric was Tarkilar, at 7th before his transformation. I don't really

I’m going to try to map this one out too. The first thing I’m going to do is cut the Ebon Triad from the cagewright plot entirely. Their story works just fine as a stand-alone. The first hint of a soulcage I think should come at ‘Demonskar’ (I don’t remember an earlier mention than that) and the scrapped cage materials in what’s-his-name’s forge. Further information can be gleaned from the Cathedral of Wee-Jas and Karran-Kurral. Perhaps if I play up the Spellweaver-designed/fire giant-forged/Theurge-enchanted aspect, the artifact-level power will be easier to digest.

I dropped Gottrod and the dragon father from the adventures entirely.

I half agree with this sentiment. Dragons need to be played with menace, and having one just pop up chasing Crazy Jared (coincidentally right as the party approaches) isn’t the right use. Gotrrod’s gotta go. However, Given the right lead-in, Dhorlot’s got potential. I’m going to add some frescoes around Bhal-Hamatugn depicting the dragon breeding program (in suitable enigmatic, pseudo-religious style) to foreshadow his appearance. Plus it’ll make more sense if the players think of Dhorlot as a the dragon father for when Zarik Dhor makes his appearance in ‘Soul Pillars’

However, all this talk of dragons brings to mind another issue with Shackled City. There’s some repetition of premise, I guess I’d call it. Darren pointed it out with the matching circumstances of Zenith and Alek both being raving prophets the party was sent to rescue. Another mirror is the dragon guardian. Both Karran-Kural and the Fiery Sanctum are ‘guarded’ by a dragon of some sort that the evil inhabitants have made peace with. I don’t know how I’ll play the two prophets (although I may play it up even more and have them both repeat some of the same prophecies), but I’m thinking of changing the two dragon guardians, at least in appearance. The dracolich Vitriss Bale can stay the same stat-wise, but I’ll probably twist his appearance so he looks more alien and spellweaver-esque. Sort of a proto-dragon that’s been lurking in Karran-Kural since before man walked above. Moltenwing I’m thinking of changing into Hookface herself. The encounter can stay the same, but meeting such a legendary dragon would have some weight to it.

All told, I appreciate all the opinions and feedback. Keep 'em coming.

I fear this is going to be a long post, but there are some things about Shackled City that I wanted to clear up. So, I’m here looking for advice and opinions on the series as a whole. As a disclaimer, let me tell you all that I haven’t run any of the AP1 adventures yet. I’m moving out of state in a few months and didn’t want to start anything I couldn’t finish, but I figure I could still entertain myself by preparing for it when I find a new regular group to play with.

With that in mind, I’ve gone through the entire series and made some notes on how I would run the story line. What I realized is that I actually only like half of the Path as written. Coincidentally, that’s the entire first half. Everything up through ‘Soul Pillars’ is great. Each adventure expands on the world Cauldron is located in and does a great job building the foundation and expanding on the beginnings of a great campaign. Where it falls apart for me is after that. Starting with ‘Lords of Oblivion’, the PCs spend the last half of their careers going from room to room, fighting what appear to be random collections of powerful people. It seems to plateau at this level and, despite ever more powerful opponents; the adventure never seems to peak.

Like I said, this is a long post so please bear with me while I go into some specifics and talk about some things I don’t like, some things I’d like to have seen, and some ideas for changes. I’m here looking for input and feedback, so I invite everybody to chime in on what they agree or disagree with. Since I have no experience running the series, I’d especially like to hear from those of you that have to get some war stories on how it played out.

SPOILERS FOLLOW.

‘Life’s Bazaar’ thru ‘Smoking Eye’ were great. Great mysteries, great opponents, great everything. It took me a while to come around, but I’ve even started appreciating the weird Fiend Folio critters that were used in the adventures. Still, because I’m never satisfied with anything, there are some things that I’d like to change from the start. For example, I like my D&D Eurocentric and I’m not a big fan of the jungle setting, so I have every intention of moving that. I have a personal fondness for the Duchy of Urnst, so I may go there, but since Underdark access is critical to a few of the stories, that may not fly. Most importantly, though, I don’t intend to put the city in a ‘dormant’ volcano. I spent most of the series hoping the placement was just to make a unique city and was really disappointed come ‘Foundations in Flame’ when they did the obvious and caused it to erupt. I’m sure I can make some lake-encircling valley-ridden city that doesn’t look like it’s a volcano so that when it does erupt there’s more of a surprise. I can even keep the lava tubes under the city so there’s some foreshadowing. Having moved the city out of the jungle, of course, will take some changes in a few of the encounters. Tongue Eater will probably become a were-rat or some other lycanthrope for example.

The biggest let-down from the first half of the series, though, is the reveal of Vhalantru. By which I mean there wasn’t one. I’d like to hear how other parties did it, but I’m not seeing any indication of how or where the party is supposed to figure out his real identity. To have such an impact at the end of ‘Bazaar’ and not be a major player at the end of the series was really a let-down. Somewhere before ‘Oblivion’ I’d like to have an adventure where the party meets the beholder on more even footing. Of course he’ll get away at the end (luck willing), but I think it’s important to keep him in the party’s mind up until he’s finally defeated in ‘Oblivion’. Does anybody have any suggestions for how I could work this? At what point would you guys throw that in there?

Speaking of ‘Lords of Oblivion’, I think that may be the last good adventure in the series (from a reader’s viewpoint). I’d like to compress the last few adventures into one grand yet simpler one. After ‘Soul Pillars’, I’d like the PCs to get drawn into the fight at Thrifrane’s before being led to Vhalantru’s as the big baddy of Cauldron. For him to be a major player, there needs to be fewer conspirators. With that in mind, I’ll probably eliminate most of the Cagewrights and play up Embril and Dyr’ryd. In fact, I’d like to skip ‘Shatterhorn’ all together. As I see it, the party would learn of the church of Wee Jas’ role in the city’s ills in ‘Soul Pillars’. That would lead them to uncover Vhalantru as really being the beholder. I may move the town leader meeting from ‘Foundation’ to an earlier point so Vhalantru’s death can lead directly into the eruption. Once that’s survived, the party can track down the tree of shackled souls below the city and find it guarded by Embril. Smack her down, stop the tree thing, and be done.

Where does that leave Adimarchus? Well, he’s an entirely un-related plot. Embril and Vhalantru weren’t working to free the demon lord, they were just in cahoots with the demodands to open up a gate. The showdown with Adimarchus will play as a continuation of the ‘Smoking Eye’ plot thread. If one of the PCs came away with the smoking eye template, bam! He’s drawn into Adimarchus’ insane machinations. If not, we move on to something else.

And that’s it. Did I miss anything? Did I eliminate any segment of the story that’s actually critical or just too cool to miss? How would you folks go about doing what I outlined here? More importantly, would you?

As always, thanks for reading.

Carl Baughman wrote:

what are the splat books?

Complete ... Warrior, Divine, Arcane, Adventurer for 3.5e

Sword and Fist, Defenders Of The Fauth, Tome And Blood, Song And Silence and masters Of The Wild for 3e

the class specific books.

Why are they called 'splat books'?

I like it! Just make sure that the players find out at some point that their hard-earned taxes went toward causing them pain (maybe they find a big ledger book in y-k-w's place, open to a page that highlights their "contribution" to the cause!).

I think it might be particularly fun to note that the players' money funded the construction of the last of 13 you-know-whats (particularly if you have one of the players end up inside that you-know-what!).

'Bones, that's genius. I'd already swiped von Spreckelsen's land-lease idea from an earlier post, but this is going in my sack too.

It occurred to me that having a campaign take place entirely (mostly) in one town gives the DM an opportunity he doesn't normaly get: collecting taxes from the PCs.

The rising taxes under you-know-who's rule could become a real attention grabber if the PCs are held to those same taxes. Aside from income taxes due on the treasure collected in the various dungeons surrounding Cauldron, what other taxes do you think would be inflicted? Seasonal taxes would make the increasing taxation even more noticeable.

I remember there being an excellent discussion of medieval taxes in the old 2nd ed. Castle Guide, but I no longer have that.

5. Working in a new prestige class(es) relevent to the path could help to make the adventure more personal to the player and gives the DM a hook to motivate & direct the PCs. Say like a unique Dragonslayer class or a wizard/sorcerer class available to the characters as taught by one of the major NPCs or NPC organizations. You could put the prestige class in Dragon magazine and make reference to it in Dungeon

I'm going to add my partial vote to Hank's suggestion here. Tying prestige classes into the campaign is really what prestige classes are supposed to be for. However, I'm not as interested in new p-classes as I am in campaign-related paths to the existing ones. The ones presented in the DMG are enough, but perhaps the campaign modification sidebars could address p-classes from those books. I don't think any player lept at the opportunity to join the Chisel's prestige class (nor were they even invited or knew that it was possible...) However, a character who's approached by another elf who explains that, for his assistance, he can initiate the character into the path of the mystic archer would be very inviting.

I like Shackled City and I like Spelljammer. Two great tastes, and all. I like how you've Spelljammerized some of the aspects of Shackled City, but I'm curious as to how you'll work in some of the more esoteric plot elements.

Is Carceri still another dimension or will you make it a slave planet somewhere? What about Occipitus? The ruler shaping the plane doesn't fly so well if Occipitus is just another planet. For that matter, the whole shard of Heaven trapped in Hell doesn't work in a space setting as well as I would like it to.

I'd also like to know if you're going to be working any of the other Spelljammer planets into your Shackled City story. Is Zenith Splintershield imprisoned on Moradin's Forge? Do the PCs have to travel to Verdana (I think is the name of the jungle planet) to find the Demonskar? All told, I think this is a very ambitious project and I'm really keen on seeing it played out.

I really liked the "Faces of Cauldron" 2-page spread that was done up in one of the issues, as well as the seperate pictures of various individuals in the modules.

I also appreciated the Faces of Cauldron. I had no problem scanning the faces and seperating them for handouts and I appreciated the glimpse of what a street in Cauldron looks like. The only complaint I have about it was the give-it-all-away clue to Vhalantru's identity in the form of his curiously-shaped shadow. Maybe that was just the artist being cute, but it made the image nearly unusable as is.

Another area I wanted to comment on is the apparent anti-climax of Shackled City as it winds to a close. I hope it's just a first reaction to reading them since we haven't gotten that far to play them, but after a series of adventures that covered the underdark, jungles, canyons and city streets. Taking the PCs from the lowest thugs to the highest class lounges. Involved them in political intrigues and long-standing mysteries, the last couple of adventures have just been a revisit to the walk down the hall and slay the monster adventures. Even the big political conference in 'Foundation of Flames' came off empty as the city is destroyed and anything the party achieved during the conference is pretty much nullified. I'd hoped the conclusion of the series (which, I admit, hasn't actually concluded yet) would take the PCs to places they hadn't been before and not just be more of the same with more powerful monsters.

If it's not too late to suggest for APII, I'd like to see the campaign progress to a grander (more epic?) scale. Let the players lead armies or take rulership of kingdoms or defeat the tarasque.

I also want to back Squid on everything he said. His thoughts mirror my own. I especially like the idea of good dragons that may have to work against the party. That's such a keen idea, I may just use it anyway whether it's in APII or not.

Again, thanks for listening.

The next Adventure Path will probably be about as "Setting Specific" as our "generic" adventures.

Which is fortunate because Shackled City was about as setting specific as you can get without actually having the benefit of a setting. As much as I love the series, it was really a strain trying to place a fantasy campaign in a volcano surrounded by baboon-filled jungle. The featured monsters (from the Skulks to the Spellweavers) were too alien and really seemed to be used just to market the Fiend Folio.

I'm glad to hear the next series will be a bit more generic and that will go a long way towards easing use. As for everything else, I'd say keep it exactly as it is now. I love the politicking of the various churches and factions. I love how there's noticeable evolution in the city between adventures (coming back from Occipitus and finding the Lord Mayor gone was quite a blow). I love the way later adventures leave free-reign to the players to call on previous contacts to solve mysteries. That's everything that should be in a campaign.

If you're still looking to add things, though, there are a couple areas that I'd like to see expanded on. A) If you could somehow provide player maps as beautiful as the DM maps, I could use those as hand-outs/battlemats. It seems a real waste to have such classy work be available to only one person at a table. 2) More time in-between adventures to go on side-treks. There've been some pretty decent adventures in your magazine that I would like to run in between Adventure Path episodes, but with one adventure per level, it sounds like it might be pushing it. I'd like to have little distractions that take the PCs places that don't actually have anything to do with the metaplot. Lastly) more noticeable change in seasons. If the party is going to rise all the way to 20th level, it shouldn't all happen in a year. Except for the winter rains during "Flood Season", I don't recall any mention at all of the years passing. Things like environmental factors or even the seasonal tax collector could be used to show the passage of time.

And finally, a question: Will Adventure Path 2 take place in the same "world" as Shackled City? For the reason I mentioned at the start of this post, I'd rather it not be, but it seems a waste to have the earlier party save a city and then not have it be around any more. Especially if somebody from that party manages to get appointed Lord Mayor or something.

Thanks for listening, sorry for the length.

Everytime I see some of the fantastic maps in Dungeon, I become sad. Why? Because I realize I'm the only one who will see them. I wish I could use them as handouts or enlarge them for use with miniatures, but they have all of those annoying numbers and secret door thingies on them.

Would it be possible for you, while you're preparing your maps for download on the website, to include another copy without such notations for the players use? I imagine there's a stage the maps go thru when they're created after they're all colored in but before the numbers are applied that could be used.

Would that be doable?